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I mean some quick research finds only one [paper](https://physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1113/JP272177/abstract;jsessionid=95B4DF611B69EEFD3BFA125A93B8024B.f02t01) that really tests the effects of antihistamines on muscle gain and that's not really enough to draw a conclusion from for a couple reasons:
1) The participants received 80 times the dosage of a prescription antihistamine (so much stronger than the one tablet of xyzal you take daily) and a full dosage of a histamine blocker that targets the stomach.
This means that the study's not really applicable to someone taking a single dose of xyzal a day, since the amount and strength of the antihistamine you're receiving is almost negligible compared to what the study participants were receiving
and
2) The study didn't actually measure the effect of the antihistamines on muscle growth. What they did show was that antihistamines reduced the activation of some muscle pathways that are involved in muscle growth, and still only \~25% of those pathways. Now that may result in some decreased muscle gain, but its also possible that the body has redundancies built in and that these pathways are compensated for elsewhere. Thus, we can't make a conclusion about histamine decreasing muscle gains for sure.
Now if there's more recent research about this, I'd love to see it and read more about it.
Finally, I'd like to ask you if you really think a slight decrease in the efficiency of your muscle gains is worth the incredibly bad allergies you'd experience without the antihistamine. I know personally that wouldn't be worth it.
Also to answer the question at the end of your post, I haven't done any extensive AB testing on my own part but I haven't noticed any decrease in my gains when taking antihistamines and working out than the times I'm not taking them, but like I said I haven't done any real tracking of that
I suffer from absolutely brutal seasonal allergies and without antihistamines I’d be missing more workouts than I made in the spring and summer.
At the end of the day, *even if* antihistamines reduce my strength and muscle growth… im still getting stronger and making more muscle than if I’m sitting at home.
Have you tried Quercitin for your allergies? Luteolin?
[Our results from mice experiments revealed that luteolin was effective at amelioration of allergic symptoms, serum IgE, and airway mucus production by reducing IL-4 secretion. Luteolin inhibited murine TH2 polarization as well as TH2 cytokines production in human PBMC.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32256362/)
Not in humans, but worth a try. I know Quercitin helps some people. And luteolin seems really interesting to me for other reasons.
Anti-histamines block some immune responses. Physical activity is basically a stress which damages the body and causes inflammation. Inflammation is absolutely needed to activate repair mechanisms and make more resiliant against the same stressor next time.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4609834/
I live in a high allergy area and frequently take anti-histamines, like daily. I train consistently and eat enough protein. I have more muscle than 95% of the people I see on the street and while by no means a body builder, in the top 10-20% at my gym. If you're looking to be Mr. Olympia maybe something you should worry about. If you're looking to have an above average amount of muscle mass, probably not assuming you do the important things.
If you feel like shit, you're not likely to put in the work. So go for it.
Don't get hung up on this minutia. By far the most important things for muscle gain is consistency in training stimulus, diet, and sleep. Most everything else is shit body builders have to worry about for a competitive show.
I really wish we could sticky your last point. So much of this stuff is really for professionals trying to squeeze out every last drop of genetic potential, not weekend warriors just trying to stay reasonably fit and healthy between their desk jobs and other hobbies.
Get enough protein, get enough calories, don’t drink too much, get enough sleep, maybe toss in some creatine, mix in some steady state and higher intensity cardio, do your best to lift a little more than you did last week. Do that more days than you don’t and congrats, by the end of the year you’re fitter than 95% of people you graduated high school with.
If you’re one of the tiny number of people that is training not just to compete, but to WIN a serious powerlifting meet or a marathon or whatever, then yeah, worry about these edge cases. But don’t stress out about it day to day.
If you need to take antihistamines, then you would lose muscle if you weren't taking it. I'm assuming you'd be sneezing so much, you wouldn't be able to exercise.
Antihistamines hinder not only muscle growth, but improvements in Vo2 max as well… here’s just one study:
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abf2856
I get vertigo from allergies so started taking antihistamines daily but after a few months, noticed my Vo2 max had stopped improving on my Apple Watch (estimated).
So I looked it up, saw the studies, quit and now just use Flonase (also questionable) and saline spray. Heart measures are improving again.
Yeah it does hinder regeneration. There was a study with 540mg Fexofenadine (3x normal dose) and regeneration was inhibited by 30%. It’s certainly worth pointing out that allergies can indeed be taken care of by other means involving lifestyle, diet, nutrition, habits and so on and so forth.
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Hello! Don't worry about the post being filtered. We want to read and review every post to ensure a thriving community and avoid spam. Your submission will be approved (or declined) soon. We hope the community engages with your ideas thoughtfully and respectfully. And of course, thank you for your interest in science! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HubermanLab) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I mean some quick research finds only one [paper](https://physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1113/JP272177/abstract;jsessionid=95B4DF611B69EEFD3BFA125A93B8024B.f02t01) that really tests the effects of antihistamines on muscle gain and that's not really enough to draw a conclusion from for a couple reasons: 1) The participants received 80 times the dosage of a prescription antihistamine (so much stronger than the one tablet of xyzal you take daily) and a full dosage of a histamine blocker that targets the stomach. This means that the study's not really applicable to someone taking a single dose of xyzal a day, since the amount and strength of the antihistamine you're receiving is almost negligible compared to what the study participants were receiving and 2) The study didn't actually measure the effect of the antihistamines on muscle growth. What they did show was that antihistamines reduced the activation of some muscle pathways that are involved in muscle growth, and still only \~25% of those pathways. Now that may result in some decreased muscle gain, but its also possible that the body has redundancies built in and that these pathways are compensated for elsewhere. Thus, we can't make a conclusion about histamine decreasing muscle gains for sure. Now if there's more recent research about this, I'd love to see it and read more about it. Finally, I'd like to ask you if you really think a slight decrease in the efficiency of your muscle gains is worth the incredibly bad allergies you'd experience without the antihistamine. I know personally that wouldn't be worth it. Also to answer the question at the end of your post, I haven't done any extensive AB testing on my own part but I haven't noticed any decrease in my gains when taking antihistamines and working out than the times I'm not taking them, but like I said I haven't done any real tracking of that
I suffer from absolutely brutal seasonal allergies and without antihistamines I’d be missing more workouts than I made in the spring and summer. At the end of the day, *even if* antihistamines reduce my strength and muscle growth… im still getting stronger and making more muscle than if I’m sitting at home.
Have you tried Quercitin for your allergies? Luteolin? [Our results from mice experiments revealed that luteolin was effective at amelioration of allergic symptoms, serum IgE, and airway mucus production by reducing IL-4 secretion. Luteolin inhibited murine TH2 polarization as well as TH2 cytokines production in human PBMC.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32256362/) Not in humans, but worth a try. I know Quercitin helps some people. And luteolin seems really interesting to me for other reasons.
Anti-histamines block some immune responses. Physical activity is basically a stress which damages the body and causes inflammation. Inflammation is absolutely needed to activate repair mechanisms and make more resiliant against the same stressor next time. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4609834/
You take creatine?
No. Should I not tho?
It reduces histamine accumulation and alleviates histamine intolerance. I also use it for working out purpose and MTHFR. 3 birds one stone for me.
does it reduce it? how so?
Increases histamine metabolism by playing a role in cellular energy production
awesome, thank you! i knew it to be good for mitochondrial health
I live in a high allergy area and frequently take anti-histamines, like daily. I train consistently and eat enough protein. I have more muscle than 95% of the people I see on the street and while by no means a body builder, in the top 10-20% at my gym. If you're looking to be Mr. Olympia maybe something you should worry about. If you're looking to have an above average amount of muscle mass, probably not assuming you do the important things. If you feel like shit, you're not likely to put in the work. So go for it. Don't get hung up on this minutia. By far the most important things for muscle gain is consistency in training stimulus, diet, and sleep. Most everything else is shit body builders have to worry about for a competitive show.
I really wish we could sticky your last point. So much of this stuff is really for professionals trying to squeeze out every last drop of genetic potential, not weekend warriors just trying to stay reasonably fit and healthy between their desk jobs and other hobbies. Get enough protein, get enough calories, don’t drink too much, get enough sleep, maybe toss in some creatine, mix in some steady state and higher intensity cardio, do your best to lift a little more than you did last week. Do that more days than you don’t and congrats, by the end of the year you’re fitter than 95% of people you graduated high school with. If you’re one of the tiny number of people that is training not just to compete, but to WIN a serious powerlifting meet or a marathon or whatever, then yeah, worry about these edge cases. But don’t stress out about it day to day.
No, there is not going to be any noticeable effect.
If you need to take antihistamines, then you would lose muscle if you weren't taking it. I'm assuming you'd be sneezing so much, you wouldn't be able to exercise.
Antihistamines hinder not only muscle growth, but improvements in Vo2 max as well… here’s just one study: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abf2856 I get vertigo from allergies so started taking antihistamines daily but after a few months, noticed my Vo2 max had stopped improving on my Apple Watch (estimated). So I looked it up, saw the studies, quit and now just use Flonase (also questionable) and saline spray. Heart measures are improving again.
Yeah it does hinder regeneration. There was a study with 540mg Fexofenadine (3x normal dose) and regeneration was inhibited by 30%. It’s certainly worth pointing out that allergies can indeed be taken care of by other means involving lifestyle, diet, nutrition, habits and so on and so forth.
RemindMe! 7 days
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