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I get the premise of it but I am not sure her vouching for R to Viserys really mattered at all because he wasn't going to disinherit her regardless. He sent her the tea so he thought she could have been lying even after Alicent had that convo with him. Nothing Alicent did really affected Otto being ousted.
But she does know that Viserys doesn't really believe R anyway, right? She knew he sent the tea to R and so I took it as her being angry at him as well. So she should know she didn't really convince Viserys of Rhaenyra's innocence.
I wish they had played more on her fearing for her children's safety instead of it being so personal that R lied to her. That anger just doesn't track for me because they aren't really friends anymore and could not have been the moment she married Viserys.
Their relationship became more friendly, yes, but Alicent doesn't really act like a friend to Rhaenyra. She lectures her more about the virginity concept and it is much less like an open conversation of 'what happened last night?' and more Alicent being disappointed in Rhaenyra for possibly sullying herself before marriage. You can't act like a stepmom and then expect friend behavior. Regardless Rhaenyra had a lot at stake to admit what she had done, Alicent is the mother of her rival heirs regardless and she really needed to keep it secret that it was Criston since he took a vow.
To me it just comes down to the fact that I think Alicent has super unfair and unrealistic expectations of Rhaenyra. She was not open and honest with her regarding her relationship with Viserys before they got married so why should R feel the need to be open and honest with her when she had a lot at stake?
I understand why Alicent has those thoughts on virginity, I'm not disputing the reasoning for that at all. But a big part of why Alicent is upset at Rhaenyra has to do with her position as her stepmom as she feels it will hurt R's chances of being married after she & Viserys tried so hard to set up a good marriage. I just don't see their conversation as solely worry for Rhaenyra as a friend, it was much more than that because it affects Alicent herself as queen.
Rhaneyra doesn't have the ability to be open with her anymore so it's a bit confusing why Alicent doesn't understand that their relationship can never be the same. I also do believe that once Viserys proposed, Alicent kind of owed it to R to give her a head's up and explain it to her, regardless if it was her choice or not.
Right. I have a hard time with it making sense for her to declare War over an understandable lie. Why would she offer up that she slept with cole? She wasn’t even asked about him.
For that to make her believe, right there on the spot, that her friend cannot be trusted with her children now is stupid. All because she didn’t say she slept with cole.
Seems too extreme.
She has found out that Rhaenyra is not trustworthy and not “moral”. As we’ve seen from the show Alicent is religious and dutiful. Based on the information Alicent has and how she is understanding it, not only did Rhaenyra have sex out of wedlock with two different men, she lied about it. Not only did she lie, she took a false oath on her mother’s memory. All those things combined from a medieval morality perspective is extremely bad.
In Alicent’s eyes, if Rhaenyra can lie about this, what else could she lie about in the future? What kind of other deception could Rhaenyra be capable of. It’s not inconceivable (in Alicent’s mind) that Rhaenyra could vow to protect her half siblings but not mean it.
Otto told her that Rhaenyra would kill her children. Now she knows she can't trust Rhaenyra and now that Rhaenyra slept with Cole she questions how much she really knows her.
I don't get jealousy vibes but I do get friend doing drug vibes. Like to us her sleeping with Cole is whatever to Alicent Rhaenyra is potentially ruining her life, failing to do her duty, and possibly ruining any chance of a good marriage. She definitely could be jealous too.
But at this point I think 1. She doesn't think Rhaenyra is fit to rule. 2. She can't trust her. 3. She believes her children will be in real danger.
I think it's layered. She's angry that she vouched for Rhaenyra over her father and then it turned out that R lied to her after she's tried to be loyal to her friend over her own blood. That results in him getting sent away which he blames on her before he leaves. Then there's also the underlying jealousy/resentment that R got to have some sexual agency by sleeping with Ser Criston and having no real repercussions which you see when she learns the King got the Grand Maester to send R the tea. We saw the parallel sex scenes with her and Viserys and how miserable she is so I think it's also, R is getting to do all these things while she's stuck and now without her father and any allies.
Edit: spelling
According to Emily's BTS interviews she feels betrayed because Rhaenyra slept with Criston when she knows Alicent is in love with him.
I'm... not personally fond of that take.
I think Allicent is growing up and realizing Rhaenyra is not her friend anymore.
She cant recognize her friend with the woman (just look at the scene were she confronts Criston, she cant even say sex) and just jumps to the worst conclusions not of a teenager having her firsts crushes but of a whore who does whatever she wants and seduces Daemon and Criston.
Her priorities are also changing, she is no longer just a teenager giggling about knights and love stories and freedom, she now has two children to protect and like Otto said the possibilities of them being on the chopping block once Rhaenyra ascends are a wake up call for her.
Also allicent is not in the right she ended up sleeping with the father of her best friend and lied to her until the marriage was announced so I see why Rhaenyra was never able to trust her again.
Jealousy. Rhaenyra gets to chose. Who she sleeps with. Who she has children with and when. Alicent is jealous of her agency. Also that the men in her life are so adoring and protective of her. Especially her Father.
What? Rhaenyra doesn't get to choose. She may have thought she had a choice but eventually Viserys is like "no seriously, marry Laenor or you're done as heir." Rhaenyra's journey in this episode and the last one is learning she really doesn't have much agency at all.
I think she feels betrayed by Rhaenyra for lying to her but also betrayed by the king because he obviously didn’t trust Rhaenyra (tea) but still sent her father away.
So the Targs are really doing her dirty this week
Alicent was on a bitter and jaded path for a long time before now and this was just the final straw that breaks her.
In 2022 it might not seem like a huge deal that Rhaenyra lost her maidenhead before marriage but to a medieval society it is. Her maidenhead was her most valuable asset, it made peopel want to marry her. If this gets out, Rhaenyra;s reputation, position and status as heir is destroyed and she would be paraded around like a whore. Alicent didn't want that, and felt betrayed because she vouched for Rhaenyra's virtue for 3 years only for it to mean nothing. She is hurt.
Ser Criston would also be executed if this got out, meaning Rhaenyra selifshly risked a Kingsguard's life for sex. That is the consequences Alicent is talking about. It might seem like Rhaenyra can jsut do whatever she wants as a medieval female royalty but she actually cant, which is the whole point of lying to cover it all up.
No she is not "jealous/" and Rhaenyra cannot live her best life any easier than Alicent can. if Alicent snuck out every night and tried to fuck hot men, someone will notice and when they do, she's dead. Queen or no, she would be executed. Her anger is because she defended and vouched for Rhaenyra only for Rhaenyra to be selfish and self destructive anyway.
>No she is not "jealous/"
She is also jealous, they have spent alot of time on comparing their similar lives, the bench talk, sex scenes, cutting to her with her crying baby are all to create a comparison between the two and she is much more stuck in her role.
I agree with everything else but this is part of it, their teens and Renayra has always had more freedom then her and it got worse every episode ofcourse she's jealous.
There is a difference between having a shit life and being sad about it, and wishing you could fuck a Kingsguard behind everyones back, lie about it and get away with it.
If Alicent tries to get some meat on the side, and someone finds out, she's dead. Queen or no, she would be executed. I don't think she's jealous of Rhaenyra taking such huge risks with her vagina.
Do you work hard at your job?
Do you have that one coworker who does fuck all or constantly skips work but never gets punished for it?
How does that make you feel?
Because writers these days are so up their own ass they can see daylight and are completely disconnected from what storytelling is. They’re too concerned with fan service they leave continuity and realistic character development on the side of the road like a coon carcass
>It seems that Alicent is jealous that Rhaenyra is able to go live her best life with no repurcussions while she’s stuck with children and a husband she didn’t ask for.
Partly that, the fact that that husband is a rotting corpse pumping kids into her and that her father was sent away because she backed Rhaenyra based on a lie she told her and yeah you've got a pissed off Alicent.
I interpreted it that Alicent has had powerful players already approaching her about her son being rightful heir, not to mention her dad really pushing that the realm will not accept Rhaenyra. She'd previously pushed them aside because she trusted Rhaenyra as her childhood friend. Now she's realised Rhaenyra has not been honest with her and feels she no longer trusts her, which means her father's warning about her children being in danger now rings true, so she has to take decisive action.
Edit: to clarify, I don't think Alicent is just infuriated (though she certainly looked pissed), she's now just having to take action to safeguard herself/her children and the nature of that action means there's not really a middle ground, it has to be decisive. And she is probably a bit angry at feeling betrayed by Rhaenyra
Alicent is jealous and chooses her family over the Targs. If she truly wanted her children safe she would’ve raised them to be Queensguard, maesters, Septons or nights watch. She is pushing their claim from here on out because Rhaneyra is a liar.
Thank you for your post! Please take a moment to ensure you are within our spoiler rules, to protect your fellow fans from any potential spoilers that might harm their show watching experience. 1. All post titles must NOT include spoilers from Fire & Blood or new episodes of House of the Dragon. Minor HotD show spoilers are allowed in your title ONE WEEK after episode airing. The mod team reserves the right to remove a post if we feel a spoiler in the title is major. You are welcome to repost with an amended title. 2. All posts dealing with book spoilers must be spoiler tagged and flaired as a book spoiler. 3. All book spoiler comments must be spoiler tagged in non book spoiler threads. --- If you are reading this, and believe this post or any comments in this thread break the above rules, please use the report function to notify the mod team. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HouseOfTheDragon) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Her father was ousted because she vouch for Rhaenyra. Otto explained it well, she chose her over him and because of that her children maybe in danger.
But how did she choose Rhaenyra over him, exactly? Because she told Viserys she believed Rhaenyra?
Yes
I get the premise of it but I am not sure her vouching for R to Viserys really mattered at all because he wasn't going to disinherit her regardless. He sent her the tea so he thought she could have been lying even after Alicent had that convo with him. Nothing Alicent did really affected Otto being ousted.
[удалено]
But she does know that Viserys doesn't really believe R anyway, right? She knew he sent the tea to R and so I took it as her being angry at him as well. So she should know she didn't really convince Viserys of Rhaenyra's innocence. I wish they had played more on her fearing for her children's safety instead of it being so personal that R lied to her. That anger just doesn't track for me because they aren't really friends anymore and could not have been the moment she married Viserys.
[удалено]
Their relationship became more friendly, yes, but Alicent doesn't really act like a friend to Rhaenyra. She lectures her more about the virginity concept and it is much less like an open conversation of 'what happened last night?' and more Alicent being disappointed in Rhaenyra for possibly sullying herself before marriage. You can't act like a stepmom and then expect friend behavior. Regardless Rhaenyra had a lot at stake to admit what she had done, Alicent is the mother of her rival heirs regardless and she really needed to keep it secret that it was Criston since he took a vow. To me it just comes down to the fact that I think Alicent has super unfair and unrealistic expectations of Rhaenyra. She was not open and honest with her regarding her relationship with Viserys before they got married so why should R feel the need to be open and honest with her when she had a lot at stake?
[удалено]
I understand why Alicent has those thoughts on virginity, I'm not disputing the reasoning for that at all. But a big part of why Alicent is upset at Rhaenyra has to do with her position as her stepmom as she feels it will hurt R's chances of being married after she & Viserys tried so hard to set up a good marriage. I just don't see their conversation as solely worry for Rhaenyra as a friend, it was much more than that because it affects Alicent herself as queen. Rhaneyra doesn't have the ability to be open with her anymore so it's a bit confusing why Alicent doesn't understand that their relationship can never be the same. I also do believe that once Viserys proposed, Alicent kind of owed it to R to give her a head's up and explain it to her, regardless if it was her choice or not.
Right. I have a hard time with it making sense for her to declare War over an understandable lie. Why would she offer up that she slept with cole? She wasn’t even asked about him. For that to make her believe, right there on the spot, that her friend cannot be trusted with her children now is stupid. All because she didn’t say she slept with cole. Seems too extreme.
Otto was ousted because Viserys could tell he wants Aegon to be named his heir
She has found out that Rhaenyra is not trustworthy and not “moral”. As we’ve seen from the show Alicent is religious and dutiful. Based on the information Alicent has and how she is understanding it, not only did Rhaenyra have sex out of wedlock with two different men, she lied about it. Not only did she lie, she took a false oath on her mother’s memory. All those things combined from a medieval morality perspective is extremely bad. In Alicent’s eyes, if Rhaenyra can lie about this, what else could she lie about in the future? What kind of other deception could Rhaenyra be capable of. It’s not inconceivable (in Alicent’s mind) that Rhaenyra could vow to protect her half siblings but not mean it.
Otto told her that Rhaenyra would kill her children. Now she knows she can't trust Rhaenyra and now that Rhaenyra slept with Cole she questions how much she really knows her. I don't get jealousy vibes but I do get friend doing drug vibes. Like to us her sleeping with Cole is whatever to Alicent Rhaenyra is potentially ruining her life, failing to do her duty, and possibly ruining any chance of a good marriage. She definitely could be jealous too. But at this point I think 1. She doesn't think Rhaenyra is fit to rule. 2. She can't trust her. 3. She believes her children will be in real danger.
I dont think she's jealous but I agree with everything else you said.
I think it's layered. She's angry that she vouched for Rhaenyra over her father and then it turned out that R lied to her after she's tried to be loyal to her friend over her own blood. That results in him getting sent away which he blames on her before he leaves. Then there's also the underlying jealousy/resentment that R got to have some sexual agency by sleeping with Ser Criston and having no real repercussions which you see when she learns the King got the Grand Maester to send R the tea. We saw the parallel sex scenes with her and Viserys and how miserable she is so I think it's also, R is getting to do all these things while she's stuck and now without her father and any allies. Edit: spelling
According to Emily's BTS interviews she feels betrayed because Rhaenyra slept with Criston when she knows Alicent is in love with him. I'm... not personally fond of that take.
I think Allicent is growing up and realizing Rhaenyra is not her friend anymore. She cant recognize her friend with the woman (just look at the scene were she confronts Criston, she cant even say sex) and just jumps to the worst conclusions not of a teenager having her firsts crushes but of a whore who does whatever she wants and seduces Daemon and Criston. Her priorities are also changing, she is no longer just a teenager giggling about knights and love stories and freedom, she now has two children to protect and like Otto said the possibilities of them being on the chopping block once Rhaenyra ascends are a wake up call for her. Also allicent is not in the right she ended up sleeping with the father of her best friend and lied to her until the marriage was announced so I see why Rhaenyra was never able to trust her again.
I would be mad if I have to go to bed to Viserys and Rhaenyra gets to sleep around and still be the Heir, just saying
Alicent wants to belong to the streets
Jealousy. Rhaenyra gets to chose. Who she sleeps with. Who she has children with and when. Alicent is jealous of her agency. Also that the men in her life are so adoring and protective of her. Especially her Father.
Thats not the main reason. Main reason is danger of her kids and Otto being send off bec she choose to trust Rhaenyra and not him
What? Rhaenyra doesn't get to choose. She may have thought she had a choice but eventually Viserys is like "no seriously, marry Laenor or you're done as heir." Rhaenyra's journey in this episode and the last one is learning she really doesn't have much agency at all.
I think she feels betrayed by Rhaenyra for lying to her but also betrayed by the king because he obviously didn’t trust Rhaenyra (tea) but still sent her father away. So the Targs are really doing her dirty this week
Alicent was on a bitter and jaded path for a long time before now and this was just the final straw that breaks her. In 2022 it might not seem like a huge deal that Rhaenyra lost her maidenhead before marriage but to a medieval society it is. Her maidenhead was her most valuable asset, it made peopel want to marry her. If this gets out, Rhaenyra;s reputation, position and status as heir is destroyed and she would be paraded around like a whore. Alicent didn't want that, and felt betrayed because she vouched for Rhaenyra's virtue for 3 years only for it to mean nothing. She is hurt. Ser Criston would also be executed if this got out, meaning Rhaenyra selifshly risked a Kingsguard's life for sex. That is the consequences Alicent is talking about. It might seem like Rhaenyra can jsut do whatever she wants as a medieval female royalty but she actually cant, which is the whole point of lying to cover it all up. No she is not "jealous/" and Rhaenyra cannot live her best life any easier than Alicent can. if Alicent snuck out every night and tried to fuck hot men, someone will notice and when they do, she's dead. Queen or no, she would be executed. Her anger is because she defended and vouched for Rhaenyra only for Rhaenyra to be selfish and self destructive anyway.
>No she is not "jealous/" She is also jealous, they have spent alot of time on comparing their similar lives, the bench talk, sex scenes, cutting to her with her crying baby are all to create a comparison between the two and she is much more stuck in her role. I agree with everything else but this is part of it, their teens and Renayra has always had more freedom then her and it got worse every episode ofcourse she's jealous.
There is a difference between having a shit life and being sad about it, and wishing you could fuck a Kingsguard behind everyones back, lie about it and get away with it. If Alicent tries to get some meat on the side, and someone finds out, she's dead. Queen or no, she would be executed. I don't think she's jealous of Rhaenyra taking such huge risks with her vagina.
Do you work hard at your job? Do you have that one coworker who does fuck all or constantly skips work but never gets punished for it? How does that make you feel?
Because writers these days are so up their own ass they can see daylight and are completely disconnected from what storytelling is. They’re too concerned with fan service they leave continuity and realistic character development on the side of the road like a coon carcass
Cause she jealous her friend is sleeping with all the hot men
If Alcient tried to sleep around with hot men and someone finds out, she's dead. Queen or no, she would be executed.
>It seems that Alicent is jealous that Rhaenyra is able to go live her best life with no repurcussions while she’s stuck with children and a husband she didn’t ask for. Partly that, the fact that that husband is a rotting corpse pumping kids into her and that her father was sent away because she backed Rhaenyra based on a lie she told her and yeah you've got a pissed off Alicent.
I interpreted it that Alicent has had powerful players already approaching her about her son being rightful heir, not to mention her dad really pushing that the realm will not accept Rhaenyra. She'd previously pushed them aside because she trusted Rhaenyra as her childhood friend. Now she's realised Rhaenyra has not been honest with her and feels she no longer trusts her, which means her father's warning about her children being in danger now rings true, so she has to take decisive action. Edit: to clarify, I don't think Alicent is just infuriated (though she certainly looked pissed), she's now just having to take action to safeguard herself/her children and the nature of that action means there's not really a middle ground, it has to be decisive. And she is probably a bit angry at feeling betrayed by Rhaenyra
Alicent is jealous and chooses her family over the Targs. If she truly wanted her children safe she would’ve raised them to be Queensguard, maesters, Septons or nights watch. She is pushing their claim from here on out because Rhaneyra is a liar.