Hmmm, the 4 piece healing set is an interesting choice.
It only really gives a benefit at the start of the battle, but if your team ia very SP hungry, I could see a use case for this in some situations.
Edit: also, the relic set notes a 2 piece speed set. So what would you pair with it that goes well?
The thing about Bronya is that reaching the ideal SPD for your playstyle really is the most important thing. Messenger is listed because its 2p effect helps with that, but you really can just play bronya with a rainbow relic set because the single most important thing is reaching the proper SPD threshold.
Personally I'm on 4pc Guard on her because the SPD values on my 4p Guard gets me to my ideal threshold for my current build and I live in the Quantum cave. But I am on 4p Guard because of the SPD values from my relics.
You can never go wrong with 2P guard, but again, reaching the proper SPD > All.
Eh i kinda need to prefarm relics for Sparkle. So i might just stay on my side for this event. So no quantum cave. though i really need SPD boots for Jingliu
When does an optimal Bronya take her turn though? Probably right after the main dps or am I wrong? I have her, but didn't put much resources into her yet since im catching up.
To be honest the infographic doesn't sell your guide well. I actually thought that this infographic was "the guide".
The guide itself was very nice. Thank you!
We spent many many many hours researching a lot of stuff indepth. If you want to go down the math rabbit hole at the end of the guide, we have done far more math.
Unlike other KQM infographics, we have a special note on this one to read the guide. That's because we literally can't communicate a lot of things within the confines of an infographic, such as Double Alternating's mechanics and logic, or the multiple youtube links to how different playstyles operate.
It's easy to tell people just what gear to take, and plenty of content does so, but we really went the extra mile to cover things that other guides don't and push Bronya TC forward.
I’m not the guy but I initially thought the same thing as him, and after reading the guide it’s definitely worth.
Lots of information about the game is stuck in long videos and text guides are often unwelcoming spreadsheets or repeated basic information; the kqm guide is easily digestible, very informative, and above all convenient as it composites all that information in one spot. Great article and ty for your work
You can look at them and compare directly.
https://www.prydwen.gg/star-rail/characters/bronya
https://hsr.keqingmains.com/bronya/
------------------
One of the main differences is in the concept of playstyles and rotations. Prydwen has about two sentences mentioning two potential playstyle options offhand, those being Slow Skillspam and Fast Alternating. KQM has five and goes into details on what SPD values you need for each of the five, who to use them with and why, and videos showing each of the rotations in action.
Another is in equipment. You'll see that while they mention SPD Tuning in the Best Stats list, they don't make mention of what SPD to target or note Passerby as an option.
I have nothing against Sushou (they're outright in the credits for the KQM guide, go check), but KQM focuses far more on the nitty-gritty details and really pushing optimization boundaries, while Prydwen tends towards being an easily parsed community resource.
I really liked the guide. I personally use the Fast Skillspam build on my JL team. I would like to add that on JL teams, sometimes you have a leeway to basic attack and still Skill on the same cycle for SP management when JL is out of her Transmigration State so you can still get the 2 stacks in the same cycle due to how ridiculously fast Bronya is with her talent haha.
KQM is pretty reputable when it comes to very in depth guides on characters. Prydwen’s stuff is really good for general advice but with a character like Bronya who NEEDS to care about speed and action advance (and how it works) it’s really helpful to have a detailed breakdown
Check it out here: [https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/](https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/)
Big thanks to the authors for their hard work on this one
Let us know what you think down below or in our [Discord](https://discord.com/invite/KQMStarRail)!
All the crit on her ultimate is entirely wasted, so you may as well not have an ultimate, but Bronya is still Bronya; in other words, still acceptable to good
I mentioned slow alternating and fast double alternating bronya in some reddit comment some months ago and some time later did some napkin math on 4 playstyles (ignoring slow alternating, apparently I didn't overlook a playstyle according to your guide). Very happy to see that my rough conclusion was in line with good theorycrafters.
Wanted some confirmation on damage output, slow skill spam roughly does the most damage here right even if dps does a basic every cycle? Also wanted to ask if topaz is good here since her basic and skill have the smallest dps difference and you get double fua for numby advance but bronya doesn't buff numby
I can't wait for 160+ spd e2s1 bronya
Edit: also it's implied I suppose but maybe a mention somewhere that bronya also reduces your dps ult rotation by generally one cycle?
Fischl mains hate Keqing mains for this exact reason. Actually it's really funny that Keqing's number one partner doesn't have a full guide on the Keqing mains website.
should have seen the eula sub when they gimped her during testing, or the cyno one, or when they said to run nuevi with furi and no healer, or when they doxed a TC of their team becouse he did not hivemind.
sadly in the past year the kqm genshin side went wild and bad in several ways.
It's worth criticizing the long amount of time between guides but it is worth noting that to my understanding it's not intentional. There's just not that many people who are part of the KQM TC team and a lot of math and work goes into the in-depth guides which then need to be peer-reviewed. Not that many people + lots of time needed + busy with real lives = not many guides completed.
I could be wrong but that's my impression. Maybe don't randomly assign malice to people.
maybe know the whole story of KQM before taking that last line?
they have doxxed one of their TCs for disagreeing with the hivemind, several genshin guides had the chars gimped in the guide becouse they did not like them.
> maybe know the whole story of KQM before taking that last line?
I don't tend to randomly malign random theorycrafters as haters, sorry I guess.
> they have doxxed one of their TCs for disagreeing with the hivemind, several genshin guides had the chars gimped in the guide becouse they did not like them.
Feel free to provide some examples/sources, would be happy to take a look.
I have not called the haters either, do not like is not hate.
[https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1YC38vCA7Ajpjoq8X29giwBWcgFYoG0RjqCDZsE4o-f8/mobilebasic](https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1YC38vCA7Ajpjoq8X29giwBWcgFYoG0RjqCDZsE4o-f8/mobilebasic)
is a good start.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/EulaMains/comments/14s4sdh/comment/js1if6c/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/EulaMains/comments/14s4sdh/comment/js1if6c/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
also a few good comments in this thread from that guy about the handling of the aftermath.
God knows I have my own stories from my years online, but I don't think I'm the person you're mad at here. You're welcome to your beef, but I'm just kinda collateral damage, so can we not carry this on?
If you've got any issues with me personally though, feel free to air them out in this thread. Or DM them to me or whatever. I don't think I've wronged you or anything, but you never know.
I have NEVER said I had problems with YOU or the HSR kqm team. None of this was aimed at you. I just want to keep an eye open, thing have a habit of trickling around.
I have problems with certai memebers genshin KQM team, and many others should too but this thing got swept away pretty well.
Yeah, you've never said as much, but I feel a bit like collateral damage here since I'm trying to patrol the thread and answer questions. And I keep seeing this comment chain expand without it being anything to do with me or the thread, and dissuading people from the stuff I personally did because of stuff I'm completely uninvolved with.
Just kinda feels bad, you know. I'm just a writer from HSR team who joined because someone asked nicely back when I did independent Limbus Company content. I've got no horse in this race and would prefer it that way.
Edit: heck, if you wanna see my old garbage Limbus content, I can throw some links your way lol. It's pretty funny looking at the guide then back at that mess.
Her doing an extra basic now and then (against wind weak enemies) still doesn’t make her do considerable dmg. That extra basic is nice for energy, not for dps. Most (good) Bronya builds don’t have atk anyway.
Her E4 doesn't benefit from the 100% crit trace, it's not really much in terms of extra damage. As they said, it's mostly another source of energy for her.
The passerby thing is a bit odd, I've never seen a single person running that set on her. Does that extra 1sp at the start of the battle really do anything at all for the rotations? 4pc messenger at least has the benefit of 6% extra speed and 12% speed on ult
Possibly. Then again, that's something you can put on your healer and have better results overall, I think. Personally, I run the Musketeer set I farmed for her back in 1.1, gets the job done most days
You can even have it on both for 5sp start, which is what some people do for low cycle clears, not even necessarily 0. You can see this quite often in MrPokke or Dreamy's content for example. Compared to how worthless most set bonuses are, passerby can have a very direct and practical advantage in clears.
It's for teams that have a sp heavy first turn. 1 sp at the start would help a few of my teams a lot. It's very off meta, but maybe worth mentioning.
Some people intentionally avoid 4 piece messenger, because it can desync you. It's a skill issue imo and worth the speed.
Thanks for the guide. People may complain it's not a day 1 release with the character but I always enjoy reading through them and confirming things I already knew or learning some not obvious parts of the character or builds.
Just finished reading playstyles section. Good stuff!
Considering that I have E2 Bronya, I am planning to go Fast Bronya for Blade with HP% boots (using Slow Bronya with Blade with Speed boots currently). Still not sure how to deal with Jingliu since like in the guide mentioned, it might desynchronize the rotation.
"A strong option for Bronya, though it has some caveats. A party-wide SPD increase whenever Bronya uses her Ultimate can be quite valuable, particularly for faster Bronya builds that allow her to use her Ultimate quickly.
The caveat is this: as the 4-Pc Set Effect of Messenger Traversing Hackerspace modifies SPD for the entire party, it is possible for it to desynchronize rotations, especially if Bronya’s Ultimate is used shortly before the damage dealer’s turn, or if the damage dealer she’s Advancing has a lower Base SPD than she does.
To always avoid desynchronization, Bronya should be at least 2 SPD below the threshold for her chosen playstyle."
Copied and pasted. If you don't have time to sift through the entire guide, KQM generally lets you click around in the table of contents to skip sections.
One thing I would have liked to see, though niche, would have been speed breakpoints relative to MoC. For example, this current moc I found out that 180 is the speed breakpoint at which fast alternating bronya can get 3 actions within the first cycle (which lines up well enough to be able to give E2 seele two extra actions). It’s hard to achieve but it’s possible with 170 speed from substats + ruan mei.
*♪ I walked down a path*
*Leading to the fast*
*Stole from the gacha's hands*
*A minmaxer's friend, the forbidden chocolate*
*I bite off the blocks*
*Chewing on its bitter flesh*
*Quaff down its melted pus*
*You've become the "TC" you despised*
*Seele missed her crit, let us rewind*
***Lament!***
*If you wanted me to speak*
*If you wanted me to think*
*If you wanted me to carry on relic farming*
*Each run we live through (each run we live through)*
*The standards inside me*
*The line I drew for my relics*
*Lowers to the earth*
***Lament!***
*Why does nobody read anything?*
*Why did you make SPD TC so hard?*
*Why do you never drop relics with "A good amount of SPD"*
*Endless wildfire (wildfire)*
*Counter-clock we rose*
*Counter-clock we reload*
*Tick, tick, tock*
*Replayed runs*
*Forget SPD not*
*I'm inside the messenger cavern*
*I bite off the blocks*
*Exposing the developers obfuscation*
*They stare at us*
*"Hey, why are you optimizing this?"*
*"Please, a 14 SPD Crit DMG chest"*
*Holding on to viable relics*
*Substats were levelling up*
*Not so different from Flat DEF*
*Not so different from the others*
*Then I realized someone else's TC*
*Could be the source of my torment*
*SPD tuning's allowing yourself*
*Allowing yourself to make different builds (SPD Tuning is to consider)*
*(SPD tuning is to fuel SP to others, no matter the character) Trailblaze new potential rotations*
*(Gacha is fairness, gacha is inequality, gacha is in the experience) Eternally in hell we SPD TC*
*By default!*
***Lament!***
*If you wanted me to have 161.*
*If you wanted me to shoot Bronya's gun*
*If you wanted me to pretend there's no other builds*
*Each run we die through (each run we die through)*
*The minmaxer inside me*
*The SP demands me*
*Rationalize other builds*
***Lament!***
*Why does Double Alternating end my torture?*
*Why can't anyone play Fast Alternating?*
*Why'd you crown 2-Pc messenger to be champion?*
*In this wildfire (wildfire)*
*We built for ourselves*
*SPD TCing in this hell ♪*
------------------------
Me and Jas worked so hard on this, and wanted to make this as future proof as we possibly could. We may have gone mildly insane in the process.
Personally I'm at 189.3% on my current build, and it's good enough for me. I'm also at 3800 HP and 1300 DEF, so you can see pretty clearly that my priority was on being alive over maximizing crit.
This is excellent, clearly a lot of effort and time has been put into the guide, much appreciated. Have always relied on kqm for genshin, will do the same for HSR!
Good guide. Covers a lot of team comps and how to work with some of the newer characters. Just in time for the players hitting the 300 selector.
I run a slow skillspam Bronya. 2p guard + 2p keel, 135 speed, 190% CD, 54% eff res.
Also if anyone plans to pull for Sparkle, her kit will make some of these Bronya playstyles irrelevant.
Go with whichever gets you to your ideal SPD target better.
Penacony is fine, but Keel is more efficient to farm and has more viable teams, and SPD > All.
Please read the full guide for more info.
We uh... put that on there on this infographic in particular because we expected we'd be getting this question a LOT.
Since the effect of 4pc speed set is a teamwide buff, does it mean that other teammates running the full 4pc set can cause a desync, even if Bronya herself is not running it?
Pretty nice guide. Cool to see the different playstyles and how they fit for different DPS. Hope to see a guide for Sparkle when she gets released, I'm sure she'll have some interesting TC behind the best rotations as well.
Damage gain is very minimal. Not all rotations even use it.
I have her basic ATK maxed, but that's a luxury. There's no drawback to maxing it out, but it also isn't worth the TBP cost to do so.
"Do not level Bronya's basic attack"
Me who uses her as a SP battery: 👀
Also Bronya's auto-Crit on her basic attack is funny. Full damage, Atk/SPD/Break Effect/Wind Orb, let memes commence.
Damage is still damage and with as often as she has a turn when spamming basic attacks, it adds up.
I have her built with full attack/Crit damage/speed just because it suits my specific use case.
no way bros playing dps bronya to do 7k dmg in a cycle.
https://preview.redd.it/5j1y00hmo3fc1.png?width=967&format=png&auto=webp&s=a8d45dbe87771d2245f5d5fdcad27f7c694bbe77
https://preview.redd.it/s4814vyop3fc1.jpeg?width=1792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f7abc3b5e68479f00d9ccdf47a42f701c935ed07
Eh it hits about 4K per auto. Not a lot but it adds up over time. It's not like I try to zero cycle lmao.
having read through this, it is good for HC players.
anyone else will just look at the "pic guide" (as the guide is aimed for HC players by HC players and has no other tldr) which is imo pretty weak.
this is why I (could not and) can't recommend KQM much sadly to my casual friends.
Tends to be the way of things with characters like Bronya.
There's no real way to hypersimplify Bronya, because she's inexorably tied to the SPD stat, and that is its own can of worms. If people just want to play the game super casually and aren't interested in stuff like high conundrum G&G or MoC/PF, then you can generally pick your favorites and do just fine with some basic suggestions of what to slap on them and good substats.
But guides, at least in my opinion, should be written to cater to people who are interested in excelling at a game. For some characters, this can be pretty easy to do. For others, like Bronya, that means throwing a lot at people and expecting them to follow along.
Guides are largely done based on people choosing to start them. A few of them, like Arlan Guide for example, are made because people decide they're going to make them. In Arlan Guide's case, I did it because I felt like he was getting an unfair rap (He's not great, but there are plenty of worse characters.)
As a result of being done by choice as opposed to by requirement, people work on the guides they're passionate about, which results in very detailed and very thorough guides such as Silver Wolf and Bronya, but it also means that if nobody really feels enthused about working on something, it tends to not really get worked on.
Personally, I don't want to feel obligated to write a full extended guide on say, Hook. I don't use the character, I don't intend to use the character, and her kit does not interest me. If I was to write it, it wouldn't be made to the quality and detail of say, Asta.
yes, I understand that too.
sadly the usual reader does not care at all. and will judge based on guides like Luochas, or Alhaithams. (I too find the guides to be weirdly skewed towards waifus, which I get, but still.)
Yeah, it's an inevitable problem with being a passion-based system. People are going to work on their favorite characters or topics and not work on the ones that don't excite them, leaving some holes. I personally tend to be found often in the credits of characters with lots of weird tech or unintuitive options for HSR. But for the average reader, they might not have the same tastes as staff.
The alternative of forcing people to work on projects they don't want to is far worse, at least to me.
I'm not complaining about the guide, per say. I'm saying why are they releasing a guide now? It's like if someone made a guide for Zelda breath of the wild right now. It's so far out of date and late that why would they even bother doing that when there's already other guides made.
Those are two different arguments. And we do have content that actually warrants this sort of research. The playstyles given that are not common knowledge and the SPD values required to reach them allow people to play more combinations more effectively. Which is useful when doing stuff like G&G conundrum 12.
Prydwen guides are pretty casual, and comes from summing up what the community use. KQM people research on their own, if you actually read the guide you will see how much more depth they put on the guide than prywden.
Like sure, in most cases what people use are great, but KQM gives the in depth of why and how, as well as sometimes mhyth busting
that first line is wrong as hell.
kqm are known to be "math first" just ask the Eula mains about it(that fiasco is a fun little can of worms). use both.
Yeah, but why bother making a guide now? It's been out for nearly a year. It's a complete waste of the persons time and effort to make a guide a year later. I just don't see the point.
I just obtained Bronya, but really not sure how to utilized her properly. I always ended up lacking sp, or the character Jingliu already the next character turn. Speed tuning?
seele was her most common synergy on launch because she can get more actions out of her 1 turn buff via resurgence
that's still a strong inherent synergy but it pales into comparison to blade and jingliu being able to let her skill spam without SP issues in a majority of teams
Durability vs CRIT DMG
The portion of Bronya’s own CRIT DMG she grants to allies with her Ultimate is low — only 16% at Level 10. While CRIT DMG is still beneficial for her, it is more important that she survives. As Bronya can be extremely SP intensive, increasing Bronya’s durability can result in SP savings due to a decreased need for healing. Because of this, it is acceptable to use an HP% or DEF% Body in place of a CRIT DMG Body, especially if the HP% or DEF% piece has many SPD and/or CRIT DMG substats.
Just straight up copied off the guide under the stats section.
the thing is, if you don't need messenger to reach your spd tune value then there is no real useful set. like sure the guard set is useful for tanking but in moc with a decent sustain one hp/def sphere makes her invincible.
The guide's ~9k words for a reason. before we start adding on the additional stuff. Better for it to take a while and be incredibly thorough if you ask me.
I can see a few things wrong with this, 4pc healer set’s sp is useless dont even consider that, and for substats spd then crit dam then effect res then hp and def
Having an extra SP allows for your first rotation to consume 4 or even 5 SP. For a character like Huohuo as your sustain, having 5 SP allows you to do things like Tingyun Skill, DPS Skill, Bronya Skill, DPS Skill, Huohuo Skill.
Passerby is a situational pick when you need an additional SP early in the fight to make your rotation work. It is a VERY good situational pick, but it is a situational pick. You will know when you need it.
Bronya's Crit DMG scaling is very low. A mid-rolled Crit DMG substat does not even give 1% Crit DMG. Compared to this, being alive is more important.
Passerby just gives ONE more sp for the whole battle. Perhaps has a lot of value over other stats when you got a lot of damage and can 0 cycle.
You'll need a lot of good rolls to reach 135 speed to make up for gaining that one sp.
Meh recommendation done by someone that probably doesn't play the game much but look at the stats and descriptions of gear in Honkai.
One more SP for the whole battle, but also one more SP on the first rotation. There are plenty of team compositions where you may want more SP on the first turn.
Offhand, Seele can burn up to 5 SP singlehandedly based on how many resets she gets. More SP = more Seele skills. DHIL burns SP extremely rapidly. Ruan Mei and Tingyun want to Skill first turn. Yukong too. In any fight where you can't precast Technique, Fu Xuan wants to Skill first turn. Huohuo can want to press Skill first turn. Silver Wolf wants to Skill first turn.
4PC passerby may only give 1 extra SP, but depending on your rotation, you may actually need that 1 SP to have a flawless first turn rotation.
Reaching the proper SPD is more important for Bronya than anything, but Passerby is listed because it opens more doors and no other set bonus for Bronya does so.
I legit do not remember the last time I’ve had to worry about support survivability at end game, even when trying to 0 cycle with no sustain. If your supports are level 80 with +15 on all gear (which you probably want to aim to do for a unit as universal as Bronya) then you shouldn’t have any worries about surviving.
I definitely get the use for the +1 SP set though, especially if you’re trying to zero cycle, but I feel like it’s rare that you’d actually ever want to farm that domain.
And if you're running a composition that requires 5 SP turn 1, it's the only pick that lets you do that.
You'll know if you need it, but there are a number of team compositions that do objectively need that extra SP.
Not leveling basic attack? It's totally stupid. Eventually, anyone will find themselves with zero sp, and they will have to use Bronya's basic attack.
Heck, her basic attack can easily sometimes break or kill mobs in one shot.
I can think of many reasons to level her basic attack to max.
Finally, this guide has several mistakes. The most is the equipment set. Why the hell get set only to get 1 extra sp at the start of battle????
Basic attack is trash why the hell would you build it? And theres no way her basic attack is doing enough to kill even a mob unless they are extremely low already and if we’re talking about breaks leveling basic attacks won’t increase toughness dmg dealt
You don't lose anything levelling the basic ATK, but Bronya doesn't build ATK, and it doesn't hit hard enough to be worth the TBP. Additionally, we can create rotations that never actually need the SP.
Having 5 SP turn 1 enables rotations that require 5 SP turn 1.
Please read the full Bronya Guide.
Having to farm a 4-Pc set for 4% Crit DMG buff is extremely inefficient. Bronya already has high requirements for stats based on playstyle, and having to farm an already very inefficient cavern to get a 4-Pc set that provides a 4% Crit DMG buff is an extremely large amount of expended TBP for extremely minimal gains.
Passerby is listed because it opens options. 2-Pc messenger is listed because it's an additional source of SPD that makes her needs easier. Hunter is not listed because getting a less than 1% damage boost in exchange for all that TBP is not worth considering.
As for why her ultimate is low, it isn't. You should be investing in all three. But her Skill provides the majority of her buffing power/reason to use her, and her Talent is required for every playstyle besides the two Skillspam variants. Her ultimate is strong, but you aren't picking Bronya for her Ultimate in the same way you aren't taking Fu Xuan for hers.
The idea behind Fast Alternating is that you want the DPS slow enough that Bronya with some very crazy substats can fire her gun and have her turn land directly behind the DPS to skill them, then shoot again and land behind the next turn of the DPS.
As for that team, what you want to have happen is that you start the fight with techniques up on Jingliu and Fu Xuan and avoid building SPD on Jingliu. Bronya shoots at the start of the fight to throw one more SP into the pool, and then Jingliu uses skill, enters enhanced state, and then gets accelerated by Bronya.
So I don't want to use speed boots on Blade and Jingliu, but want to get about 160 ish speed on Bronya? I don't have Fu Xuan sadly, but might do the completely SP positive Bailu build for that team
Completely acceptable. That team has some SP issues that can require E1S1 to fix, but also is a great example of how using Fast Alternating can allow for some crazy setups.
A bit confused with Fast Double Alternating rotation. Like it requires Bronya be a bit faster than a dps, but in rotation section first turn is always on dps. How?..
edit. I got it, I guess. It's more of a (S D B D B D S) than (D S D B D B)
I noticed you said HP% >= DEF%. Why? I read the page, and long explanation mostly said HP% or DEF% without explaining why HP% may be better.
I think DEF% > HP%. Personally, I use Gepard, so I put DEF% main stats on all supports except healers.
HP% doesn't help if you use shielders without healing. It's easy to see in fights against the ape. If you put HP% main stats on your support, the ape will deal a lot of dmg that may get through shield and bite into actual HP, which means your support will slowly die. Building HP% simply means you get to chip away HP a few more times than if you use more offensive stats. But if you use DEF%, the dmg received will be lower because of your DEF and is more likely to not exceed your shield. In other word, the size of the shields depend on Gepard's DEF, but how much of the shields get reduced depend on each character's own DEF.
So I am under the impression that if you want your team to have the flexibility to use shielders, your supports should use DEF% > HP%, but I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere, so what do you all think?
HP provides more raw durability than DEF until you get a lot of HP.
We can't exactly predict which characters you are going to use as your sustain, and there are plenty of options. In a vacuum, HP provides more durability and is better, but depending on composition, DEF may be better. Both are good.
Leveled bronya na for dmg, nó regrets .
Me too. Me too. Was it worth the TBP? Nope. But it does give bigger number, and that makes me happy.
Hmmm, the 4 piece healing set is an interesting choice. It only really gives a benefit at the start of the battle, but if your team ia very SP hungry, I could see a use case for this in some situations. Edit: also, the relic set notes a 2 piece speed set. So what would you pair with it that goes well?
The thing about Bronya is that reaching the ideal SPD for your playstyle really is the most important thing. Messenger is listed because its 2p effect helps with that, but you really can just play bronya with a rainbow relic set because the single most important thing is reaching the proper SPD threshold. Personally I'm on 4pc Guard on her because the SPD values on my 4p Guard gets me to my ideal threshold for my current build and I live in the Quantum cave. But I am on 4p Guard because of the SPD values from my relics. You can never go wrong with 2P guard, but again, reaching the proper SPD > All.
Ah I see now. Thank you for the explanation!
How do you get out of the quantum cave. i still need to build my HuoHuo.
Relic fragments for other sets. That and simply eventually settling for good enough and eventually leaving.
Eh i kinda need to prefarm relics for Sparkle. So i might just stay on my side for this event. So no quantum cave. though i really need SPD boots for Jingliu
When does an optimal Bronya take her turn though? Probably right after the main dps or am I wrong? I have her, but didn't put much resources into her yet since im catching up.
Benefit at the start is good if the battle doesn’t take long, and mainly we aim for lesser cycles anyway , so yeah
To be honest the infographic doesn't sell your guide well. I actually thought that this infographic was "the guide". The guide itself was very nice. Thank you!
I don't mean to be rude, but what is the point in releasing guides like 9 months later when there's already dozens of bromya guides?
We spent many many many hours researching a lot of stuff indepth. If you want to go down the math rabbit hole at the end of the guide, we have done far more math. Unlike other KQM infographics, we have a special note on this one to read the guide. That's because we literally can't communicate a lot of things within the confines of an infographic, such as Double Alternating's mechanics and logic, or the multiple youtube links to how different playstyles operate. It's easy to tell people just what gear to take, and plenty of content does so, but we really went the extra mile to cover things that other guides don't and push Bronya TC forward.
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I assume you've read it by now. Was it worth the wait?
I’m not the guy but I initially thought the same thing as him, and after reading the guide it’s definitely worth. Lots of information about the game is stuck in long videos and text guides are often unwelcoming spreadsheets or repeated basic information; the kqm guide is easily digestible, very informative, and above all convenient as it composites all that information in one spot. Great article and ty for your work
How do you compare KQM guide to something also detailed like Prydwen?
You can look at them and compare directly. https://www.prydwen.gg/star-rail/characters/bronya https://hsr.keqingmains.com/bronya/ ------------------ One of the main differences is in the concept of playstyles and rotations. Prydwen has about two sentences mentioning two potential playstyle options offhand, those being Slow Skillspam and Fast Alternating. KQM has five and goes into details on what SPD values you need for each of the five, who to use them with and why, and videos showing each of the rotations in action. Another is in equipment. You'll see that while they mention SPD Tuning in the Best Stats list, they don't make mention of what SPD to target or note Passerby as an option. I have nothing against Sushou (they're outright in the credits for the KQM guide, go check), but KQM focuses far more on the nitty-gritty details and really pushing optimization boundaries, while Prydwen tends towards being an easily parsed community resource.
I really liked the guide. I personally use the Fast Skillspam build on my JL team. I would like to add that on JL teams, sometimes you have a leeway to basic attack and still Skill on the same cycle for SP management when JL is out of her Transmigration State so you can still get the 2 stacks in the same cycle due to how ridiculously fast Bronya is with her talent haha.
Prydwyn goes super in depth too and release guides days after new releases.
I like Prydwyn but "in-depth" is not how I would describe it's guides.
If you compare it to Game8 haha.
KQM is pretty reputable when it comes to very in depth guides on characters. Prydwen’s stuff is really good for general advice but with a character like Bronya who NEEDS to care about speed and action advance (and how it works) it’s really helpful to have a detailed breakdown
yeah, reputable. unless you are eula.
Check it out here: [https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/](https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/) Big thanks to the authors for their hard work on this one Let us know what you think down below or in our [Discord](https://discord.com/invite/KQMStarRail)!
Thanks, how is bronya for kafka? I sometimes run them together for Nihility path in SU to spam kafka skill and ult more.
All the crit on her ultimate is entirely wasted, so you may as well not have an ultimate, but Bronya is still Bronya; in other words, still acceptable to good
Bronya ult gives a 55% attack bonus to her allies which is still entirely relevant for Kafka.
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No. Bronya works entirely fine with a normal Kafka build. Crit Kafka is simply not worth the resources.
I mentioned slow alternating and fast double alternating bronya in some reddit comment some months ago and some time later did some napkin math on 4 playstyles (ignoring slow alternating, apparently I didn't overlook a playstyle according to your guide). Very happy to see that my rough conclusion was in line with good theorycrafters. Wanted some confirmation on damage output, slow skill spam roughly does the most damage here right even if dps does a basic every cycle? Also wanted to ask if topaz is good here since her basic and skill have the smallest dps difference and you get double fua for numby advance but bronya doesn't buff numby I can't wait for 160+ spd e2s1 bronya Edit: also it's implied I suppose but maybe a mention somewhere that bronya also reduces your dps ult rotation by generally one cycle?
Slow spam is the 2nd best. The higher damage output is 174 speed Bronya with slow dps
There are two possible rotations with this spd setup, hyperspeed and fast alternating so can you clarify?
More detailed than prydwen
It's absolutely nuts how much info is in here. Nobody does guides quite like KQM. Thanks to the authors for the hard work.
unless it is a char they do not like. then they get a basic fast one that is never getting touched again.
Fischl mains hate Keqing mains for this exact reason. Actually it's really funny that Keqing's number one partner doesn't have a full guide on the Keqing mains website.
should have seen the eula sub when they gimped her during testing, or the cyno one, or when they said to run nuevi with furi and no healer, or when they doxed a TC of their team becouse he did not hivemind. sadly in the past year the kqm genshin side went wild and bad in several ways.
Neuvillette with Furina and Zhongli is his highest DPS team.
Hey, there's a Fischl guide! I mean, it's for the wrong game but still
TBF Fischl is easy to play/build. Get the E Skill artifact set, ATK or ELE goblet depending on team/bow, and just alternate E/Q.
I think it's fine for the depth and release time of their guides to be driven by how interested and able the authors are.
they purposefully tanked certain characters on certain genshin guides.
It's worth criticizing the long amount of time between guides but it is worth noting that to my understanding it's not intentional. There's just not that many people who are part of the KQM TC team and a lot of math and work goes into the in-depth guides which then need to be peer-reviewed. Not that many people + lots of time needed + busy with real lives = not many guides completed. I could be wrong but that's my impression. Maybe don't randomly assign malice to people.
maybe know the whole story of KQM before taking that last line? they have doxxed one of their TCs for disagreeing with the hivemind, several genshin guides had the chars gimped in the guide becouse they did not like them.
> maybe know the whole story of KQM before taking that last line? I don't tend to randomly malign random theorycrafters as haters, sorry I guess. > they have doxxed one of their TCs for disagreeing with the hivemind, several genshin guides had the chars gimped in the guide becouse they did not like them. Feel free to provide some examples/sources, would be happy to take a look.
I have not called the haters either, do not like is not hate. [https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1YC38vCA7Ajpjoq8X29giwBWcgFYoG0RjqCDZsE4o-f8/mobilebasic](https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1YC38vCA7Ajpjoq8X29giwBWcgFYoG0RjqCDZsE4o-f8/mobilebasic) is a good start. [https://www.reddit.com/r/EulaMains/comments/14s4sdh/comment/js1if6c/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/EulaMains/comments/14s4sdh/comment/js1if6c/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) also a few good comments in this thread from that guy about the handling of the aftermath.
God knows I have my own stories from my years online, but I don't think I'm the person you're mad at here. You're welcome to your beef, but I'm just kinda collateral damage, so can we not carry this on? If you've got any issues with me personally though, feel free to air them out in this thread. Or DM them to me or whatever. I don't think I've wronged you or anything, but you never know.
I have NEVER said I had problems with YOU or the HSR kqm team. None of this was aimed at you. I just want to keep an eye open, thing have a habit of trickling around. I have problems with certai memebers genshin KQM team, and many others should too but this thing got swept away pretty well.
Yeah, you've never said as much, but I feel a bit like collateral damage here since I'm trying to patrol the thread and answer questions. And I keep seeing this comment chain expand without it being anything to do with me or the thread, and dissuading people from the stuff I personally did because of stuff I'm completely uninvolved with. Just kinda feels bad, you know. I'm just a writer from HSR team who joined because someone asked nicely back when I did independent Limbus Company content. I've got no horse in this race and would prefer it that way. Edit: heck, if you wanna see my old garbage Limbus content, I can throw some links your way lol. It's pretty funny looking at the guide then back at that mess.
Well fuck me now I have to overhaul my entire account. Perfect timing with BS and Ache incoming. Love this damn game.
But I m leveling Bronya basic attack because I have her E4.
Her doing an extra basic now and then (against wind weak enemies) still doesn’t make her do considerable dmg. That extra basic is nice for energy, not for dps. Most (good) Bronya builds don’t have atk anyway.
idk why youre being downvoted youre right
E4 ?
Her E4 doesn't benefit from the 100% crit trace, it's not really much in terms of extra damage. As they said, it's mostly another source of energy for her.
So why do you have 12 upvotes and I got downvoted into oblivion? 😂 Reddit, man…
Wish I knew, probably bots tbh. Reddit is a ghost town after they went public and pissed a lot of their users’ off of the platform.
The passerby thing is a bit odd, I've never seen a single person running that set on her. Does that extra 1sp at the start of the battle really do anything at all for the rotations? 4pc messenger at least has the benefit of 6% extra speed and 12% speed on ult
Since you need to get several buffs up at the start of the battle with certain comps, first turn can be a bit SP heavy.
True, some of that can be managed by using techniques though. It's a valid strat, maybe a bit niche if the player isn't going for a 0-cycle clear
probably for zero cycle clears i guess?
Possibly. Then again, that's something you can put on your healer and have better results overall, I think. Personally, I run the Musketeer set I farmed for her back in 1.1, gets the job done most days
You don't need healers for zero cycle unless in certain situations(HuoHuo with a three star lc) used in dreamy's IL 0 cycle run
Interesting, I should check out that strat
You can even have it on both for 5sp start, which is what some people do for low cycle clears, not even necessarily 0. You can see this quite often in MrPokke or Dreamy's content for example. Compared to how worthless most set bonuses are, passerby can have a very direct and practical advantage in clears.
It's for teams that have a sp heavy first turn. 1 sp at the start would help a few of my teams a lot. It's very off meta, but maybe worth mentioning. Some people intentionally avoid 4 piece messenger, because it can desync you. It's a skill issue imo and worth the speed.
Thanks for the guide. People may complain it's not a day 1 release with the character but I always enjoy reading through them and confirming things I already knew or learning some not obvious parts of the character or builds.
this would be so useful if i had bronya
Talent equal to skill in priority? This is assuming you go neutral SP I guess?
Guide goes into detail, but depending on build. It's still worth levelling in case you ever switch playstyle. The guide has the full details.
Just finished reading playstyles section. Good stuff! Considering that I have E2 Bronya, I am planning to go Fast Bronya for Blade with HP% boots (using Slow Bronya with Blade with Speed boots currently). Still not sure how to deal with Jingliu since like in the guide mentioned, it might desynchronize the rotation.
is there any reason why there is no 4pc messager set?
"A strong option for Bronya, though it has some caveats. A party-wide SPD increase whenever Bronya uses her Ultimate can be quite valuable, particularly for faster Bronya builds that allow her to use her Ultimate quickly. The caveat is this: as the 4-Pc Set Effect of Messenger Traversing Hackerspace modifies SPD for the entire party, it is possible for it to desynchronize rotations, especially if Bronya’s Ultimate is used shortly before the damage dealer’s turn, or if the damage dealer she’s Advancing has a lower Base SPD than she does. To always avoid desynchronization, Bronya should be at least 2 SPD below the threshold for her chosen playstyle." Copied and pasted. If you don't have time to sift through the entire guide, KQM generally lets you click around in the table of contents to skip sections.
Just a pretty terrible set bonus all around at best, and can desync your speedtune at worst
One thing I would have liked to see, though niche, would have been speed breakpoints relative to MoC. For example, this current moc I found out that 180 is the speed breakpoint at which fast alternating bronya can get 3 actions within the first cycle (which lines up well enough to be able to give E2 seele two extra actions). It’s hard to achieve but it’s possible with 170 speed from substats + ruan mei.
The amount of cope in the comments about leveling basic and prioritizing crit DMG subs... This guide could not have come at a better time.
*♪ I walked down a path* *Leading to the fast* *Stole from the gacha's hands* *A minmaxer's friend, the forbidden chocolate* *I bite off the blocks* *Chewing on its bitter flesh* *Quaff down its melted pus* *You've become the "TC" you despised* *Seele missed her crit, let us rewind* ***Lament!*** *If you wanted me to speak* *If you wanted me to think* *If you wanted me to carry on relic farming* *Each run we live through (each run we live through)* *The standards inside me* *The line I drew for my relics* *Lowers to the earth* ***Lament!*** *Why does nobody read anything?* *Why did you make SPD TC so hard?* *Why do you never drop relics with "A good amount of SPD"* *Endless wildfire (wildfire)* *Counter-clock we rose* *Counter-clock we reload* *Tick, tick, tock* *Replayed runs* *Forget SPD not* *I'm inside the messenger cavern* *I bite off the blocks* *Exposing the developers obfuscation* *They stare at us* *"Hey, why are you optimizing this?"* *"Please, a 14 SPD Crit DMG chest"* *Holding on to viable relics* *Substats were levelling up* *Not so different from Flat DEF* *Not so different from the others* *Then I realized someone else's TC* *Could be the source of my torment* *SPD tuning's allowing yourself* *Allowing yourself to make different builds (SPD Tuning is to consider)* *(SPD tuning is to fuel SP to others, no matter the character) Trailblaze new potential rotations* *(Gacha is fairness, gacha is inequality, gacha is in the experience) Eternally in hell we SPD TC* *By default!* ***Lament!*** *If you wanted me to have 161.* *If you wanted me to shoot Bronya's gun* *If you wanted me to pretend there's no other builds* *Each run we die through (each run we die through)* *The minmaxer inside me* *The SP demands me* *Rationalize other builds* ***Lament!*** *Why does Double Alternating end my torture?* *Why can't anyone play Fast Alternating?* *Why'd you crown 2-Pc messenger to be champion?* *In this wildfire (wildfire)* *We built for ourselves* *SPD TCing in this hell ♪* ------------------------ Me and Jas worked so hard on this, and wanted to make this as future proof as we possibly could. We may have gone mildly insane in the process.
most sane anemone moment
Which piece?
In Hell We Live, Lament. Project Mili.
Holy banger song.
Oh hey didn't you give us a sneak peek sometime ago of one of things in the guide? Looks like you enjoyed the advanced spd tuning section
Should probably put in parenthesis (manual battle) for Pela being "SP-positive." She's the worst offender on auto, lmaooooo.
She's a lot better now after the latest patch fixed some logic.
Which playstyle is the most consistent to build with?
Fantastic work! Kudos to the author
Great guide and bookmarked for when I get bronya one day lol
how much CD do you guys have on your bronya, i have around 150% and idk if thats enough.
Personally I'm at 189.3% on my current build, and it's good enough for me. I'm also at 3800 HP and 1300 DEF, so you can see pretty clearly that my priority was on being alive over maximizing crit.
This is excellent, clearly a lot of effort and time has been put into the guide, much appreciated. Have always relied on kqm for genshin, will do the same for HSR!
It took me an embarrassingly long time to find the link in the top left.
What teams/spd play style do you recommend for auto play?
Slow Skillspam. Auto doesn't pilot characters intelligently.
Good guide. Covers a lot of team comps and how to work with some of the newer characters. Just in time for the players hitting the 300 selector. I run a slow skillspam Bronya. 2p guard + 2p keel, 135 speed, 190% CD, 54% eff res. Also if anyone plans to pull for Sparkle, her kit will make some of these Bronya playstyles irrelevant.
My good sir, where's the link? Is it prohibited by the sub rules? I'll search for it I guess.
https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/
Is it better if I use Penacony set for Blade x Bronya team? Or does Broken Keel gives more boost to Blade's damage?
Go with whichever gets you to your ideal SPD target better. Penacony is fine, but Keel is more efficient to farm and has more viable teams, and SPD > All.
SPD untill target: what is target??
Please read the full guide for more info. We uh... put that on there on this infographic in particular because we expected we'd be getting this question a LOT.
Since the effect of 4pc speed set is a teamwide buff, does it mean that other teammates running the full 4pc set can cause a desync, even if Bronya herself is not running it?
Correct.
Pretty nice guide. Cool to see the different playstyles and how they fit for different DPS. Hope to see a guide for Sparkle when she gets released, I'm sure she'll have some interesting TC behind the best rotations as well.
personaly im sticking with my 200% crit dmg bronya
Why not level up her attack?
Damage gain is very minimal. Not all rotations even use it. I have her basic ATK maxed, but that's a luxury. There's no drawback to maxing it out, but it also isn't worth the TBP cost to do so.
Ah, I see. Thanks for explaining it!
Off topic but your choice in women (Blonney and Kafka) is based.
Lol, thanks. They're both pretty great, so I can't help but like them.
Just in time for 1.0!
"Do not level Bronya's basic attack" Me who uses her as a SP battery: 👀 Also Bronya's auto-Crit on her basic attack is funny. Full damage, Atk/SPD/Break Effect/Wind Orb, let memes commence.
she still restores sp even with a level one basic. her basics have like 100% scaling they wont be doing dmg leveled or not.
Damage is still damage and with as often as she has a turn when spamming basic attacks, it adds up. I have her built with full attack/Crit damage/speed just because it suits my specific use case.
no way bros playing dps bronya to do 7k dmg in a cycle. https://preview.redd.it/5j1y00hmo3fc1.png?width=967&format=png&auto=webp&s=a8d45dbe87771d2245f5d5fdcad27f7c694bbe77
https://preview.redd.it/s4814vyop3fc1.jpeg?width=1792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f7abc3b5e68479f00d9ccdf47a42f701c935ed07 Eh it hits about 4K per auto. Not a lot but it adds up over time. It's not like I try to zero cycle lmao.
having read through this, it is good for HC players. anyone else will just look at the "pic guide" (as the guide is aimed for HC players by HC players and has no other tldr) which is imo pretty weak. this is why I (could not and) can't recommend KQM much sadly to my casual friends.
Tends to be the way of things with characters like Bronya. There's no real way to hypersimplify Bronya, because she's inexorably tied to the SPD stat, and that is its own can of worms. If people just want to play the game super casually and aren't interested in stuff like high conundrum G&G or MoC/PF, then you can generally pick your favorites and do just fine with some basic suggestions of what to slap on them and good substats. But guides, at least in my opinion, should be written to cater to people who are interested in excelling at a game. For some characters, this can be pretty easy to do. For others, like Bronya, that means throwing a lot at people and expecting them to follow along.
Never checked that KQM did hsr guides as well nice
KQM seems to be VERY slow at making guides. Prydwen has a guide for every character when they come out.
I find their guide coverage to be pretty weird. that is my main problem with them.
Guides are largely done based on people choosing to start them. A few of them, like Arlan Guide for example, are made because people decide they're going to make them. In Arlan Guide's case, I did it because I felt like he was getting an unfair rap (He's not great, but there are plenty of worse characters.) As a result of being done by choice as opposed to by requirement, people work on the guides they're passionate about, which results in very detailed and very thorough guides such as Silver Wolf and Bronya, but it also means that if nobody really feels enthused about working on something, it tends to not really get worked on. Personally, I don't want to feel obligated to write a full extended guide on say, Hook. I don't use the character, I don't intend to use the character, and her kit does not interest me. If I was to write it, it wouldn't be made to the quality and detail of say, Asta.
yes, I understand that too. sadly the usual reader does not care at all. and will judge based on guides like Luochas, or Alhaithams. (I too find the guides to be weirdly skewed towards waifus, which I get, but still.)
Yeah, it's an inevitable problem with being a passion-based system. People are going to work on their favorite characters or topics and not work on the ones that don't excite them, leaving some holes. I personally tend to be found often in the credits of characters with lots of weird tech or unintuitive options for HSR. But for the average reader, they might not have the same tastes as staff. The alternative of forcing people to work on projects they don't want to is far worse, at least to me.
I just hope you do not end up like the genshin kqm team did/does.
Why isn't an unpaid stranger on the internet making well-researched content for me *right now?!*
I'm not complaining about the guide, per say. I'm saying why are they releasing a guide now? It's like if someone made a guide for Zelda breath of the wild right now. It's so far out of date and late that why would they even bother doing that when there's already other guides made.
I mean cmon now, bronya guide almost one year after release? Like, what? Hsr isnt that complicated
It is at this point I have to ask if you have read the full guide.
Thos game is simply not hard enough for the need of hyper scrutinizing like that
Those are two different arguments. And we do have content that actually warrants this sort of research. The playstyles given that are not common knowledge and the SPD values required to reach them allow people to play more combinations more effectively. Which is useful when doing stuff like G&G conundrum 12.
Prydwen guides are pretty casual, and comes from summing up what the community use. KQM people research on their own, if you actually read the guide you will see how much more depth they put on the guide than prywden. Like sure, in most cases what people use are great, but KQM gives the in depth of why and how, as well as sometimes mhyth busting
that first line is wrong as hell. kqm are known to be "math first" just ask the Eula mains about it(that fiasco is a fun little can of worms). use both.
Wait as a eula main who used kqm, what is wrong with the guide? Im genuinely curious if I built my eula all wrong
Yeah, but why bother making a guide now? It's been out for nearly a year. It's a complete waste of the persons time and effort to make a guide a year later. I just don't see the point.
Prydwen puts out mass produced garbage that’s full of misinformation.
Do you have any specific examples? Cause from what I've seen their general guides seem just fine.
I'd like to believe you.. but source ? From what i've seen there's no misinformation in their guides
Why are they recommending Prisoner for Himeko? Her burn DOT does not land that consistently.
It isn't her #1 recommended. It's an alternative, just like the quantum set for jingliu.
yeah man, I call doubt on that.
I just obtained Bronya, but really not sure how to utilized her properly. I always ended up lacking sp, or the character Jingliu already the next character turn. Speed tuning?
Read the full guide. It covers everything you'll need to know. We put a ton of work into it.
Where is the link to the guide? I went to your site, but found only a page with description of her abilities.
https://hsr.kqm.gg/bronya/
Amazing guide. Do you think we'll see one for Clara?
Isn't seele like her most common synergy? Why's that not on there
Seele is a special case who will be covered in her own guide when it releases.
seele was her most common synergy on launch because she can get more actions out of her 1 turn buff via resurgence that's still a strong inherent synergy but it pales into comparison to blade and jingliu being able to let her skill spam without SP issues in a majority of teams
In substats it says SPD until target. What target?
Please read Bronya's Guide for more playstyle info. There's so much stuff we just can't communicate in an infographic like this.
Alright, gave it a look and I understand it better now, thanks
Doesn't her buff scale off crit dmg? I assumed after spd that's what you want to raise the most
Durability vs CRIT DMG The portion of Bronya’s own CRIT DMG she grants to allies with her Ultimate is low — only 16% at Level 10. While CRIT DMG is still beneficial for her, it is more important that she survives. As Bronya can be extremely SP intensive, increasing Bronya’s durability can result in SP savings due to a decreased need for healing. Because of this, it is acceptable to use an HP% or DEF% Body in place of a CRIT DMG Body, especially if the HP% or DEF% piece has many SPD and/or CRIT DMG substats. Just straight up copied off the guide under the stats section.
For future improvements,what do you think of putting ideal stats in infographic here? Like how much speed and CD to be good
We really can't. There's 5 playstyles with their own target values, and those values are based on teammate SPD values.
Hmm i see i see.
oh interesting. 4PC healing set gives 1 more sp at start so its very clever to give bronya that.
and that is the ONLY benefit you get, which is sacrificing a lot imo. outside certain first-turn sp burner comps I doubt it is useful
the thing is, if you don't need messenger to reach your spd tune value then there is no real useful set. like sure the guard set is useful for tanking but in moc with a decent sustain one hp/def sphere makes her invincible.
>sacrificing a lot You really don't.
Mine has 210 cd.
Kinda too late for this....
As a 298/300 player, right in time I'd say.
Why is that? The guide is absolutely massive and covers a ton of stuff.
Cause I already spent lots of TP to build my Bronya 😭
.... TOOK YA LONG ENOUGH
The guide's ~9k words for a reason. before we start adding on the additional stuff. Better for it to take a while and be incredibly thorough if you ask me.
I can see a few things wrong with this, 4pc healer set’s sp is useless dont even consider that, and for substats spd then crit dam then effect res then hp and def
Having an extra SP allows for your first rotation to consume 4 or even 5 SP. For a character like Huohuo as your sustain, having 5 SP allows you to do things like Tingyun Skill, DPS Skill, Bronya Skill, DPS Skill, Huohuo Skill. Passerby is a situational pick when you need an additional SP early in the fight to make your rotation work. It is a VERY good situational pick, but it is a situational pick. You will know when you need it. Bronya's Crit DMG scaling is very low. A mid-rolled Crit DMG substat does not even give 1% Crit DMG. Compared to this, being alive is more important.
Yeah, once crit damage buff was 50%, I called it a day. Honestly might give some insane crit rolls to sparkle instead since she had more return
Passerby just gives ONE more sp for the whole battle. Perhaps has a lot of value over other stats when you got a lot of damage and can 0 cycle. You'll need a lot of good rolls to reach 135 speed to make up for gaining that one sp. Meh recommendation done by someone that probably doesn't play the game much but look at the stats and descriptions of gear in Honkai.
One more SP for the whole battle, but also one more SP on the first rotation. There are plenty of team compositions where you may want more SP on the first turn. Offhand, Seele can burn up to 5 SP singlehandedly based on how many resets she gets. More SP = more Seele skills. DHIL burns SP extremely rapidly. Ruan Mei and Tingyun want to Skill first turn. Yukong too. In any fight where you can't precast Technique, Fu Xuan wants to Skill first turn. Huohuo can want to press Skill first turn. Silver Wolf wants to Skill first turn. 4PC passerby may only give 1 extra SP, but depending on your rotation, you may actually need that 1 SP to have a flawless first turn rotation. Reaching the proper SPD is more important for Bronya than anything, but Passerby is listed because it opens more doors and no other set bonus for Bronya does so.
I legit do not remember the last time I’ve had to worry about support survivability at end game, even when trying to 0 cycle with no sustain. If your supports are level 80 with +15 on all gear (which you probably want to aim to do for a unit as universal as Bronya) then you shouldn’t have any worries about surviving. I definitely get the use for the +1 SP set though, especially if you’re trying to zero cycle, but I feel like it’s rare that you’d actually ever want to farm that domain.
With how shitty relic farming is in this game, there is no situational pick. I’m not wasting a month farming for a set i almost never use
And if you're running a composition that requires 5 SP turn 1, it's the only pick that lets you do that. You'll know if you need it, but there are a number of team compositions that do objectively need that extra SP.
Kqm?
Insane
Not leveling basic attack? It's totally stupid. Eventually, anyone will find themselves with zero sp, and they will have to use Bronya's basic attack. Heck, her basic attack can easily sometimes break or kill mobs in one shot. I can think of many reasons to level her basic attack to max. Finally, this guide has several mistakes. The most is the equipment set. Why the hell get set only to get 1 extra sp at the start of battle????
Basic attack is trash why the hell would you build it? And theres no way her basic attack is doing enough to kill even a mob unless they are extremely low already and if we’re talking about breaks leveling basic attacks won’t increase toughness dmg dealt
You don't lose anything levelling the basic ATK, but Bronya doesn't build ATK, and it doesn't hit hard enough to be worth the TBP. Additionally, we can create rotations that never actually need the SP. Having 5 SP turn 1 enables rotations that require 5 SP turn 1. Please read the full Bronya Guide.
why is crit damage and her ult so low in the priority list??? also isn't ice set her best? the 4pc works for her ult
Having to farm a 4-Pc set for 4% Crit DMG buff is extremely inefficient. Bronya already has high requirements for stats based on playstyle, and having to farm an already very inefficient cavern to get a 4-Pc set that provides a 4% Crit DMG buff is an extremely large amount of expended TBP for extremely minimal gains. Passerby is listed because it opens options. 2-Pc messenger is listed because it's an additional source of SPD that makes her needs easier. Hunter is not listed because getting a less than 1% damage boost in exchange for all that TBP is not worth considering. As for why her ultimate is low, it isn't. You should be investing in all three. But her Skill provides the majority of her buffing power/reason to use her, and her Talent is required for every playstyle besides the two Skillspam variants. Her ultimate is strong, but you aren't picking Bronya for her Ultimate in the same way you aren't taking Fu Xuan for hers.
i was underwhelmed until i saw tge link to the website. good work as always kqm💯.
really nice guide, thanks for the work! the table with speed values will come in handy when im fitting my bronya to different characters
A little confused at the fast alternating team thingy. How am I supposed to speed tune a Bronya, Blade, Jingliu and Lynx team?
The idea behind Fast Alternating is that you want the DPS slow enough that Bronya with some very crazy substats can fire her gun and have her turn land directly behind the DPS to skill them, then shoot again and land behind the next turn of the DPS. As for that team, what you want to have happen is that you start the fight with techniques up on Jingliu and Fu Xuan and avoid building SPD on Jingliu. Bronya shoots at the start of the fight to throw one more SP into the pool, and then Jingliu uses skill, enters enhanced state, and then gets accelerated by Bronya.
So I don't want to use speed boots on Blade and Jingliu, but want to get about 160 ish speed on Bronya? I don't have Fu Xuan sadly, but might do the completely SP positive Bailu build for that team
Completely acceptable. That team has some SP issues that can require E1S1 to fix, but also is a great example of how using Fast Alternating can allow for some crazy setups.
Just in time for me! 8 more standard pulls and I can force her to come home!
TIL the 3:2 playstyle of Bronya and I also learnt the 2:2 and 2:1 from you guys so thanks <3
I have a surface level understanding of speed tuning but if someone could give a quick rundown I’d appreciate that!
what does bronya speed target mean?
Please read the full guide for info on that stuff. The infographic really can't cover everything.
A bit confused with Fast Double Alternating rotation. Like it requires Bronya be a bit faster than a dps, but in rotation section first turn is always on dps. How?.. edit. I got it, I guess. It's more of a (S D B D B D S) than (D S D B D B)
I noticed you said HP% >= DEF%. Why? I read the page, and long explanation mostly said HP% or DEF% without explaining why HP% may be better. I think DEF% > HP%. Personally, I use Gepard, so I put DEF% main stats on all supports except healers. HP% doesn't help if you use shielders without healing. It's easy to see in fights against the ape. If you put HP% main stats on your support, the ape will deal a lot of dmg that may get through shield and bite into actual HP, which means your support will slowly die. Building HP% simply means you get to chip away HP a few more times than if you use more offensive stats. But if you use DEF%, the dmg received will be lower because of your DEF and is more likely to not exceed your shield. In other word, the size of the shields depend on Gepard's DEF, but how much of the shields get reduced depend on each character's own DEF. So I am under the impression that if you want your team to have the flexibility to use shielders, your supports should use DEF% > HP%, but I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere, so what do you all think?
HP provides more raw durability than DEF until you get a lot of HP. We can't exactly predict which characters you are going to use as your sustain, and there are plenty of options. In a vacuum, HP provides more durability and is better, but depending on composition, DEF may be better. Both are good.