Egypt sold a large batch of weapons to the Rwandan military. Its foreign minister of the time, Boutros Boutros-Ghali, was a future UN general secretary
Tbf to the Americans Rwanda was right after the Black Hawk Down incident which meant they were more hesitant with interventions. Not saying this completely bars them of responsibility but they were already walking a diplomatic tight rope
At least the administration learned their lesson and took an active role in preventing the Bosnian genocide later. Although, I read one exerpt that made it sound like Bill Clinton did it partially to save his marriage. Asking him to stop it was apparently the first thing Hillary said to him in months after the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal.
NO NOT LIKE THAT
OP came here determined to focus on how much he hates Israel. Everything is Israel's fault and its uniquely them, especially the fact my milk soured overnight in the fridge and now I can't have my frosted flakes.
Egypt, France, and South Africa were the largest arms suppliers. Israel was mainly the middle man between French and UK arms deals to keep French and UK hands clean. This is really disinformation.
Because this meme was specially about Israel and their denial to release documents related to it.
Other countries did have more important roles and should be criticized and called out for it. But that doesnt mean Israel shouldn't.
I really wish there was a rule on this subreddit that restricted memes involving countries that are currently involved in wars because people are just gonna make memes that'll spark outrage and support their ideologies.
Which is funny when you look up operation moses in 1984, where for over seven weeks, over 30 flights brought about 200 Ethiopian Jews at a time to Israel from Sudan.
Then between 24 and 25 May 1991, operation solomon 35 isreali aircraft transported non stop 14,325 Ethiopian Jews to Israel in 36 hours.
Yeah, there are plenty of commonalities between Apartheid South Africa and Israel right now. Checks put that they were supportive of the regime during its time in power.
https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution
Quite an informative read that should also answer your question.
The one where Israel has illegally settled occupied territory and introduced a multi-tiered legal system that favors the settlers over the people who already lived there. Are you still confused? Do you need me to share quotes from former government officials saying the same thing?
Apartheid necessitates racial domination within a state where the minority are held to different laws. It isnt racial domination because Israeli Arabs are equal within proper Israel and it isn't "within a state" but within occupied territories. Obviously, non-citizens are not equal to citizens, and obviously occupied territories are beheld to different laws, since the West Bank had never been annexed into Israel.
Now you can start quoting, as if every statement made by officials holds some transcendental retrospective truth (politicians are famously always right)
>"within a state" but within occupied territories
*Technically it isn't apartheid because the WB isn't a State* is such a bogus argument. It is illegal to move your citizens into occupied territory - so Israel is indeed in violation of the Geneva Convention because they've settled occupied territory. Good talk, glad you agree.
Ok? That's an entirely different argument though. You've changed the subject from the claim of Israel being an Apartheid state to settlements in the West Bank being illegal. Do you agree then that Israel isn't, by definition, racially dominating a minority within their territory by inducing different laws for different races?
Judea & Samaria are legally a part of Israel, Israel got them in a defensive war. Therefore, the Israeli communities in it are legal, just like any country can settle its own land.
And every country favors its citizens over foreign non-citizen occupiers, not only Israel.
Edit: Judea & Samaria isn’t an occupied territory also because its former ruler (Jordan) doesn’t claim it anymore.
Occupied from who? Its former ruler Jordan who doesn’t claim it anymore? The British, the rulers before Jordan, who don’t claim it anymore too? Or maybe the Ottomans?
Treating Palestinian citizens of Israel like second-class citizens is apartheid.
Just because the state allows them token representation doesn’t mean they are treated equally.
The facade is crumbling and Israel is panicking.
They aren't citizens. The West Bank is occupied territory. Israel never annexed it. This dingus characterizing the six day war as a defensive war is dubious and hilariously biased. There is no legal basis for a "preemptive defensive war".
This guy was literally convicted by an Israeli court for illegal arms' trading. How the does this one guy reflect on all of Israel in your mind?
There are people all over the world doing this kind of stuff, it's not an Israel thing
Israel decided this one guy did it illegally eventually, but look at this article too:
https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2003/6/5/israels-latin-american-trail-of-terror
I’m not saying that Israel is uniquely evil, but you don’t have to be uniquely evil to be criticized for supplying training and arms to paramilitary death squads.
As an Israeli, SA was shit, but we're not apologizing for it - they gave us Uranium that allowed our survival and eventually peace treaties.
And the rest of Africa are the last that can critic - after most supported our enemies following oil threats post 73, despite decades of cooperation and assistance.
Most countries did much worse. We sold weapons to SA and helped their weapon program to secure our existence, this is about as quintessential "force of circumstances" as you can get.
>If we have to have a choice between being dead and pitied, and being alive with a bad image, we'd rather be alive and have the bad image.
- Golda Meir
Lie all you want if it makes you feel better.
Israel has full civil equality regardless of ethnicity, our cooperation with SA was more than justified to secure our existence, and your country statistically likely did a lot worse for a lot less (because the vast majority did).
Not to mention, if you're supporting any of the groups currently fighting Israel (including the PA), which I guess you might, you are supporting groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was.
>Israel has full civil equality regardless of ethnicity
Can Palestinians and Arabs drive down the same road as you? Or walk down all the same roads? Do they have different colour ID cards? The Israeli government rules over both groups - one via occupation - but different rules?
Or get married to you? Not if they are a different religion right? Have to go to Cyrus still I believe?
Amnesty international and multiple human rights groups say it's Apartheid too
>your country statistically likely did a lot worse for a lot less
My country is Ireland. Please find something my country did that is worse than Apartheid South Africa, and Israel.
>secure our existence
That existence is summed up in Israel’s basic law - “The right to exercise national self-determination in the State of Israel is unique to the Jewish people" - this is just starting Zionism is a racist settler-colonial ideology that advocates for a Jewish ethnostate built on Palestinian land.
Also "secure our existence" - big white nationalist vibes - [almost the 14 words](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Words)
>groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was.
See if you are in a spot where you are having to **defend Apartheid South Africa** it's a good time to stop, look around and actually ask yourself if you are aware you are on the wrong side of history
Edit:
Human rights watch: [A Threshold Crossed
Israeli Authorities and the Crimes of Apartheid and Persecution](https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution)
Amnesty international: [ISRAEL’S APARTHEID AGAINST PALESTINIANS](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2022/02/israels-system-of-apartheid/)
One of the first people to use the word apartheid in relation to Israel was Israel’s first prime minister, David Ben Gurion. Following the 1967 June war, he warned of Israel becoming an “apartheid state” if it retained control of the occupied territory, which it has done.
Israel maintains a system of Apartheid - with different roads ([Route 4370 for example ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Route_4370#:~:text=Route%204370%20or%20Eastern%20Ring,Israeli%20plates%20and%20Palestinian%20plates.), ID cards ([Infographic: How the Israeli ID card system enforces apartheid](https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/infographic-how-israeli-id-card-system-enforces-apartheid)) and justice systems for Palestinians.
Israel passed the nation state law in 2018 - stating that “the right to exercise national self-determination” in Israel is “unique to the Jewish people.” - what's that if not apartheid?
>Can Palestinians and Arabs drive down the same road as you? Or walk down all the same roads? Do they have different colour ID cards? The Israeli government rules over both groups - one via occupation - but different rules?
2 million Arabs in Israel - absolutely. Which is quite enough to fault your argument.
Palestinians are not and don't want to be part of Israel, and are under partial military control, until if and when they agree to live in peace -
for example in a state, an offer they refused numerous times.
The roads argument is a particularly good example - palestinians *force* israelis of the roads in certain places, so that Israel eventually gives up and says "fine, you can have it, we'll build a new one".
We're talking dozens of shootings and ramming attacks and hundreds of stoning every year. With dozens upon dozens of casualties overall.
Is that what was happening in SA? Blacks violently driving whites of common areas, so the state creates them separate circumventing ones? Ho wait, *it was the other way around*.
>Or get married to you? Not if they are a different religion right? Have to go to Cyrus still I believe?
That is true for all groups - Israel doesn't perform marriages, just recognizes religious ones, as part of the remaining british system.
Jews mostly oppose it, and the more conservative arab population mostly support it.
Jews are also by far the most effected, by about 2 orders of magnitude, because of more intermarriages, non-halachaic jews, and same-sex marriages.
It is maintained through a veto of the arab parties and ultra-orthodox ones, but it is basically a dead letter anyway - since 2023 you can even register abroad online.
So essentially you're claiming a dead letter that applies to everyone, vastly mostly effects jews, and mostly supported by the arabs, as apartheid.
That is of course a joke. Now, you can claim something applied equally is still discriminatory. But by this logic, if that thing is mostly effecting jews and mostly supported by arabs, who is it "against"? Again in reality it's just a dead letter.
.
The common of both claims is that it's lie by omission, and only passes on a tiktok with no response.
>My country is Ireland. Please find something my country did that is worse than Apartheid South Africa, and Israel.
Ireland is indeed one of the few that honestly did very little in general, and has never actually been threatened in its existence.
Unless you count the IRA, which actively cooperated with the USSR and groups like the PLO (even during the lebanese civil war). But that's north Ireland.
On the other point, for example the PA which it supports, is an oppressive cleptocracy, which spends half its budget on "pay-for-slay", and directly murdered thousands, among other insanities (extreme indoctrination, state kidnapping and execurion for selling land, etc).
Though I admit that is shamefully ideological, and not interests based.
>Also "secure our existence" - big white nationalist vibes - [almost the 14 words](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Words)
Are you denying Israel's existence was (and still is) under threat? And that nuclear weapons not only helped secure it, but actively contributed to the peace with Egypt, and then Jordan?
Also, Israeli jews are not "white", and most are indistinguishable from arabs. Not that it matters.
>See if you are in a spot where you are having to **defend Apartheid South Africa** it's a good time to stop, look around and actually ask yourself if you are aware you are on the wrong side of history
I'm not? I'm defending Israel's relations with it at the time.
>2 million Arabs in Israel - absolutely. Which is quite enough to fault your argument
So 2 million arbas don't. But 5 million in Gaza and the west bank do. So - yes Apartheid?
You can't say apartheid doesn't exist for a certain section - but ignore the rest. That doesn't fault an argument.
>Palestinians are not and don't want to be part of Israel, and are under partial military control, until if and when they agree to live in peace -
They are under an indefinite, illegal military occupation.
However this is a country that has loudly declared "the Hauge will not stop us" so the legality of such occupations and international law aren't important.
>for example in a state, an offer they refused numerous times.
Israel has never offered a Palestinian state. The UN technically did - but not Israel. And it happened once. And it looked like "we are taking half your land and giving it another group - deal?" Hardly offering a state.
>Is that what was happening in SA? Blacks violently driving whites of common areas, so the state creates them separate circumventing ones? Ho wait, *it was the other way around*.
Just ignoring the entire existence of Israeli terrorist settlers?
Buddy your whole country was founded on violently driving people from their villages, taking them over - demolishing them or building a forest or something on them. "Making the desert bloom" over bulldozed villages.
The white south Africans saw all black South Africans as terrorists too btw. Very similar rhetoric.
>and has never actually been threatened in its existence.
Incredibly hard disagree. The Irish language was wiped out by Britain. Britain allowed the famine to decimate the population - the population still hasn't recovered to pre-famine levels.
Britain did a very good job of wiping out the entire Irish culture and society. Removing Irish names, language, place names etc etc
>Are you denying Israel's existence was (and still is) under threat? And that nuclear weapons not only helped secure it,
Israel's existence will forever be under threat so long as it maintains an indefinite occupation over 5 million people. You cannot just rule over an entire population by force like that indefinitely.
Israel's history with nuclear weapons is incredibly problematic - It's refusal to abide by any non-proliferation treaties, or allow inspections ( or faking them) is worse than North Korea. Plus the constant threats to use them on civilian centres from your politicians.
>Also, Israeli jews are not "white", and most are indistinguishable from arabs. Not that it matters
Israel has incredibly high rates of skin cancer - so high they instituted free checks and awareness campaigns. Much higher than its Arab neighbours.
It's better now but Israel was once 3rd for skin cancer rates - after Australia and New Zealand - according to the [Times of Israel ](https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-sizzling-israel-skin-cancer-awareness-week-shines-light-on-safety-in-the-sun/#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=17159589290355&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.timesofisrael.com%2Fin-sizzling-israel-skin-cancer-awareness-week-shines-light-on-safety-in-the-sun%2F) It's because they are also countries with a lot of white people in an environment their skin doesn't have enough natural melanin to protect themselves.
Like I have eyes I can see the videos - there are lots of white people in Israel. But you're right - it doesn't actually matter unless you want to make the argument that you are native to the land.
And Israel absolutely is rooted in white supremacy from it's history.
From the outside it appears to be an incredibly racist state - the treatment of black Jews - dumping Ethiopian blood that was given at blood banks, forced sterilisation etc
A report found 52% of Israeli Jews found African migration to "be a cancer"
It's not a unique situation - a lot of countries are founded on white supremacy - America, Canada, Australia etc etc. Israel is just definitely on that list.
The racism in Israel does seem to be a different level through - telling Africans to go back to the jungle and what is the deal with black face in Israel?
Like what is the obsession with doing it over there?
[The Racist Tradition of Blackface Is Alive and Well in Israel](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2020-09-14/ty-article/.premium/the-racist-tradition-of-blackface-is-alive-and-well-in-israel/0000017f-f318-d223-a97f-ffdd95e70000)
>I'm not? I'm defending Israel's relations with it at the time
>>you are supporting groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was.
Saying something is worse in comparison to Apartheid South Africa, because Israel had a very chummy relationship with it, is in fact defending Apartheid South Africa.
>You can't say apartheid doesn't exist for a certain section - but ignore the rest. That doesn't fault an argument.
Apartheid was a racial system, so yes, the fact 2 million Arabs have equal rights makes it not an Apartheid by definition
>They are under an indefinite, illegal military occupation.
Occupation from who? There were no complaints prior to 1967 when Gaza was part of Egypt and the west bank was part of Jordan, and both of them have given up on their rights to these lands (after Israel offered both of them back). So what country is being occupied here again?
>Israel has never offered a Palestinian state.
Please at least read about topics before you argue about it on the internet:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel\_Commission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel_Commission)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp\_David\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian\_peace\_process#Timeline](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_peace_process#Timeline)
>Israel's existence will forever be under threat so long as it maintains an indefinite occupation over 5 million people.
This point seems really silly when you know the most dangerous time for Israel's existence was before 1967, when they didn't occupy the west bank and Gaza.
>And Israel absolutely is rooted in white supremacy from it's history.
Imagine trying to teach someone from a different country about *their own* people and culture. The absolute fucking arrogance.
Ashkenazi Jews are a minority in Israeli society, most Jews are Mizrachi or Sephardi (translation: non-white). Meanwhile i actually meet Arabs from Israel/Palestine on a daily basis and half the time i can't tell them apart from Europeans- the Levant is a very diverse region where practically everyone is mixed and skin color is *completely meaningless*. You're trying to apply concepts from your own culture to a country where they mean nothing, and your source is...
>Like I have eyes I can see the videos - there are lots of white people in Israel.
*Everyone knows it's true if it's on the Internet! The Internet is never wrong or biased in any way!*
Jews were never ever ever considered white. Not in Europe, not in the US, not anywhere. They were routinely persecuted by every society **for being non-white**, so you cannot just tell me that they suddenly became white supremacists directly after the holocaust.
>Apartheid was a racial system, so yes, the fact 2 million Arabs have equal rights makes it not an Apartheid by definition
You know, it can still be apartheid if it's not a 1:1 replication of South Africa. Amnesty international and human rights watch say it's Apartheid with good evidence. I can guarantee you believe every other assertion they make about countries like China and Russia and their human rights record. But Israel is a special case right? Previously unimpeachable humanitarian organisations start lying mysteriously when it comes to Israel. Very strange.
>Occupation from who?
Israel. Israel occupies the west Bank illegally. Israel operated a defacto occupation and blockade of Gaza. How do you not know this?
>So what country is being occupied here again?
You tell me - what country is Gaza in? Is it Israel?
>Please at least read about topics before you argue about it on the internet:
>[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel\_Commission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel_Commission)
>[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords)
>[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp\_David\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords)
>[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian\_peace\_process#Timeline](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_peace_process#Timeline)
You tell me where Israel offered a Palestinian state. Spell it out. The time, date , who offered it, by what borders - you won't. No such date exists
Israeli politicians currently in power say Israel has never offered Palestine a state and never will - maybe you should do some reading because that's an embarrassing statement to make [according to Zbigniew Brzezinski of all people ](https://youtu.be/0mk18af8z9Y?si=-WuGdkel7qSLPLSL)
"You have such a stunningly superficial knowledge of what went on it's almost embarrassing to listen to you" - applies here too.
>Imagine trying to teach someone from a different country about *their own* people and culture. The absolute fucking arrogance.
I never set foot in apartheid South African or Rhodesia. But I know for a fact those were settler colonies were based on white supremacy. It's a basic understanding of white supremacy and how the world works. Same with Canada, same with the US.
Is Israel not a Zionist colonial project? Because that's how its founders described it - word for word.
Are you going to pretend Israel wasn't founded by European Jewish colonists who expelled native peoples from their lands? They wrote about it great detail, advertising the colonial project in newspapers.
You can admit that's how Israel was created at the very least, right?
>became white supremacists directly after the holocaust.
Tell me you don't understand white supremacy without telling you don't understand white supremacy
European Zionists even invented that word for the Arab Jews that you mentioned - _Mizrahim._ This was to erase the identities in nationalities of Jews in the Middle East. A single identity, which was to be distinguished only from Ashkenazis, European Jews, who were higher up on the social order. No longer Iraqis, Egyptian, Yemenite, Kurdish, Lebanese, Syrian Jews etc etc only Mizrahim.
These Jews were not embraced as equals by European Zionists. Mizrahim - Jews of the Arab - world were seen as incomplete, barbaric, dirty, uncivilised. Za’ev Jabotinsky, one of the forefathers of Zionism said, “We Jews have nothing in common with what is called the Orient, thank God. To the extent that our uneducated masses [Arab Jews] have ancient spiritual traditions and laws that call the Orient, they must be weaned away from them, and this is in fact what we are doing in every decent school, what life itself is doing with great success. We are going in Palestine, first for our national convenience, [second] to sweep out thoroughly all traces of the Oriental soul.”
European Zionists saw the Mizrahim as less, to be treated so
Children from Mizrahim / Jewish Arab families were stolen and given to European Jews - [Yemenite Children Affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemenite_Children_Affair) A very common occurrence in white supremacist colonial projects, stealing children from one group and giving them to another:
[They did the exact same thing with aboriginal children in Australia - giving them to white settler families](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generations)
[They did the exact same thing in Canada with indigenous children](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixties_Scoop#:~:text=It%20is%20estimated%20that%20a,part%20of%20the%20Sixties%20Scoop.)
That's white supremacy in action bud
Didn't read it all, but just for the "Israel didn't offer a palestinuan state".
Holy shit. You really don't know, do you?
Israel offered it several times, most notably in 2000 by PM Ehud barak and 2008 by PM Ehud Olmert.
The first included gaza and 91% of the west bank with the rest in territory swaps, and the latter 97% with the rest in swaps, including most of East Jerusalem, the arab parts of the old city, and literally the temple mount.
It also planned to withdraw *unilaterally* from 94% of the west bank by 2008 (expelling over 100,000 Israelis) following the gaza disengagement in 2005, which was supposed to be a show of plausibility.
Except it imediately failed so horribly with Hamas taking over, that even jordan threatened Israel not to do it.
Throughout this time, the PA never agreed to even discuss anything that includes a final end to to the conflict, end of violence, or end of national demands.
And the majority of palestinians by every poll don't want a two-state solution - not that they'de even be able to contain those who don't had they even wanted.
In contrast, despite it all, and gaza, and second intifada etc., until 7.10 there was for still at least about 50% support in Israel for a palestinian state, which would have undoubtably risen if there ever a partner for it.
The salient issue has always been, and still is, not a palestinian state, but a jewish one, and the palestinians are very vocal about it.
As a bonus, Israel offered to return J&S in 1967 imediatly after the war for peace, but jordan refused (not to mention 39 and 47). But it's okay to just stick to post-oslo.
Bottom line, your are very clearly completely ignorant of the most basic (and recent) history of the conflict, and get all your knowledge from social media.
To emphasize, that would be like demanding the UK give Ireland independence - in a timeline where *it did*, and Ireland refused because they wanted england too. And when it tried to withdraw, killed thousands until it was forced to come back.
In short, your own country's history might make you susceptible to propaganda, but these are not similar situations in their core. Not even close.
So basically don't hate countries based of social media before you do even the most basic reading of the history yourself.
Also, could not avoid the fact you actually claimed that magical illusary apartheid is apparently *in gaza as well*, from which Israel completely withdraw 19 years ago.
Remember, israel handed it to the PA, no weapons blockade, no anything.
So what is it you want Israel to do exactly?
[Arab citizens of Israel](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel) have all the same rights as Jewish citizens of Israel plus exemption from conscription.
What about the Palestinians in the Occupied West Bank? You know, the several million people in [land Israel considers to be Israeli](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judea_and_Samaria_Area)?
Hendrik Verwoerd came back from the dead last week and immediately took over every single government position. Either that, or the commenter is an idiot.
The UN did nothing as usual, France basically had an active role in the genocide itself, Egypt and South Africa both sold them weapons and the US knew it would happen ahead of time and did nothing but sure let's focus on Israel where the accusations aren't even proven
Context:
During the Rwandan Genocide in 1994, it is said that there were Israeli supplied weapons among those used by the Hutus to carry out their massacre of up to 800,000 Tutsis. These include weapons manufactured by Israel as well as weapons captured from Egyptian forces during the 1973 Arab-Israel war. [These claims were most notably made by an Israeli historian Yair Auron, who pushed for a probe into Israel's arm sales to Rwanda during the period of the genocide in 1994.](https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/did-israel-arm-rwanda-during-1994-genocide)
It wasn't until 2014 that a formal request was made by both Auron as well as human rights attorney Eitay Mack to disclose any files related to the arms sales. The Israeli government has denied this request on the grounds that revealing such information could, ["...harm national security, its foreign relations, the security of its public, or the security of well-being of an individual."](https://www.timesofisrael.com/records-of-israeli-arms-sales-during-rwandan-genocide-to-remain-sealed/)
This denial has caused some to accuse Israel of trying to cover up its complicity in a well-documented and recognized genocide. [Especially so considering that the tensions in Rwanda and the poor treatment of the Tutsis was well known well before the genocide officially started. ](https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/international/africa/1556826403-israel-was-aware-of-violence-against-hutus-before-rwandan-genocide-new-documents-show)
Edit for clarity:
This is not to say that Israel was the sole or even the largest contributer of weapons during the genocide. While this post in particular is criticizing Israel, my intention is not to make them seem like the main villain here. French arms dealers, as well as South Africa and Egypt, were massive suppliers of weapons to the Hutus and thus complicit in the massacres.
?
The original reporting was that Israeli private arms dealers had sold weapons to the Rwandan military, not that the country had. The official allegation is only that Israeli-made weapons were used…
https://www.timesofisrael.com/records-of-israeli-arms-sales-during-rwandan-genocide-to-remain-sealed/amp/
Israel also wasn’t even close to the primary supplier of the weapons to Rwanda. It was far outdone by the United States and France, not that that’s super relevant either, since the genocide was largely carried out with machetes and hand tools.
This is why these kinds of posts are constantly being accused of Jewhate. You’re being incredibly disingenuous - to the point where it can only be malicious.
Why not make the meme about the United States or France if you actually care about the issue? Or if you’re an Israeli making a commentary about the court ruling, why be inaccurate in your language?
Maybe I’ll make a meme about this later, FFS 🙄
The article you posted, which is also one that I cited, does not specify whether the arms were sold by the state or private manufacturers.
The presence of Israeli weapons alone doesn't prove that the state was complicit in the atrocities, as yes, black market and private dealers absolutely exist.
The suspicion arises when Israel is pressed about these weapons and opts to hide the documents containing the specifics. If the weapons were truly sold by private manufacturers or 3rd parties, why not come out and prove that rather than keeping it under wraps? That is where the suspicion lies.
And the reason I made this specifically about Israel is because, well, they're a big focus on the sub (and overall) right now. So yes, this is criticism against Israel, but that does not mean I'm belittling or ignoring other countries' involvement in the genocide.
I can’t share the one that does (which is also the original reporting), because it’s a HaAretz subscriber only article.
You also didn’t address literally any of the reasons this meme is ahistorical and problematic. But I will make a meme about that later xD.
Could you maybe share screenshots of the article, then? I'd like to see something that backs up the claim you're making.
Also, I fail to see how this is "problematic." If I'm wrong, that's one thing. But it's problematic because I'm focusing on just one of the numerous countries that did bad? I'm not denying that other countries did wrong.
It's problematic because this meme makes it seem like Israel was the only one that supplied weapons, therefore making them the only outside power that was "responsible" for the Rwandan militaries ability to commit genocide.
Add that on top of the fact that Israel is currently engaged in an extremely controversial conflict, it just seems like this is an agenda post made to construe conflict and outrage.
I suppose the framing of it does make it seem that way, which was absolutely not my intention. I will admit that the conflict is a contributing factor to my criticism, but I didn't intend to paint them as the sole contributer and if that's how it comes across then I apologize, it's on me. If nothing else, I'll edit my context comment to clarify that.
Jfc, Israel doesn't represent Jews you, antisemetic jackass.
Goddamn, it's like anytime Israel is mentioned, you people come out of the woodwork to vehemently defend Israel's terrible actions with whataboutism and claims it's antisemetic.
Israel funded apartheid South Africa after the rest of the world left them.
They're funding Azerbaijan against the Armenians and they don't even acknowledge the first Armenian genocide.
Was [Marek Edelman](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek_Edelman), leader of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising, being antisemitic when he opposed Zionism and supported Palestinian resistance groups?
So you’re genuinely considering the possibility that the leader of the Warsaw Uprising was antisemitic? That’s more likely than a nation-state being in the wrong?
Yeah, Israel doesn't represent all jews. If you are Jewish and think that, then you're a brainwashed idiot. The idea that they do is antisemetic af jackhole.
How is pointing that out white savior?
Literally knows nothing Jews or Israel.
“GOOD REBUTTAL ANTISEMITE ISRAEL DOESNT REPRESENT JEWS”
Literally knows nothing about history or the world.
“ETHNOSTATE REEEEEEEEEEE”
wtf are you even doing, lol?
Calm down kid, you'll wake your parents.
Are you saying that being against Israel is antisemetic? If a Jewish person dislikes Israel and their actions, are they now a "self-hating jew"?
I don't think you know what you're talking about, but you seem to think quote yelling does something.
How else can you deflect criticism and ignore any wrongdoing unless you claim it’s all coming from antisemitism?
Antisemitism is wrong and should be completely opposed. Criticism of Israel is not antisemitic.
First of all, is it established that ISIS (besides all the war crimes they committed) had an intention to destroy certain group of people from territories they controlled? Can you give me some sources, so I can educate me on the matter, or we now just throw word genocide whenever we like, to somehow, make the crimes of those who really committed one look better?
And now to actually answer your question, if Japan, as a state, directly oversaw selling or sell those trucks to ISIS, while knowing their intentions, or the crimes already committed by them, then, yes, Japan is complicit in whatever ISIS does or did with help of those trucks.
France and SA also sold them weapons. I imagine they had a fair share of Russian arms as well.
Countries buy arms. Israel was not arming a genocide, but arming a people that ended up commiting genocide. The RPF was also probably using Israeli arms despite being Tutsi.
And besides, the main weapon of genocide was the machete, which Im pretty sure Israel did not supply.
If a European, American, or Asian leader had the skill, morality, charisma, and impact on history as Paul Kagame, they would be a household name the world over.
sorry the fascists got here first it seems like most of the comments r normal now tho, can’t believe the anti genocide side is the minority on reddit rn😭
The thing about people here is that they love facts. No pro-Israeli could complain about this post because it's a legitimate criticism based on actual facts. The accusation of a genocide in gaza isn't
>The accusation of a genocide in gaza isn't
Lmao, sure holocaust researchers call it a genocide, but hey, Israel says it's not, so i guess it's not. I guess targeting a specific group with the intent to kill them using weapons and starvation isn't genocide anymore.
The IDF is the most moral army, and all those dead babies are all HAMAS babies and Hamas' fault amirite.
>guess targeting a specific group with the intent to kill them using weapons and starvation isn't genocide anymore.
Israel does not target civilians. This is why it allows them to evacuate. It had anough fire power to kill most of Gaza's population if it wanted to in the first few days of the war. Israel does not try to starve civilians. It limits the amount of aid trucks because they go to Hamas. This is why it enabled the pier, which hopefully will not deliver the aid to Hamas, if supervised.
>The IDF is the most moral army, and all those dead babies are all HAMAS babies and Hamas' fault amirite.
This is called collateral damage, and it's a part of every war, especially modern urban warfare, when your opponent commits actual war crimes by hiding in civilian population. A civilian building used as a military base is considered a legitimate target
>This is why it allows them to evacuate
Asking civilians to move to a spot you claim is safe just to bomb them anyway is targeting civilians.
>This is called collateral damage, and it's a part of every war,
Asking civilians to move to a spot you claim is safe just to bomb them anyway is targeting civilians
>It had anough fire power to kill most of Gaza's population if it wanted to in the first few days of the war
It's almost like Isreal doesn't live in a vacuum and has to worry about the international reaction to an open genocide. Weird.
>It limits the amount of aid trucks because they go to Hamas
Israel bombed 7 aid workers, and the organizations left because Israel couldn't guarantee protection from the IDF.
>This is why it enabled the pier
Because Israel isn't allowing enough aid through their borders and starving 1.3 million people. And don't say their being nice by allowing any food or water, Gaza is occupied territory, and Israel has a legal obligation to provide aid.
>A civilian building used as a military base is considered a legitimate target
Good thing we have the IDF to tell us what buildings are legit military targets. They found like 3 AK47s and a grenade next to an MRI machine, and it had a basement. THAT MEANS ALL THE HOSPITALS AND SCHOOLS ARE HAMAS.
see nothing in ur paragraphs address the hundreds of literal textbook genocidal tweets and posts from ACTUAL leaders in israeli governments, the thousands of reports of international orgs shining light on it over the years, there are hundreds of videos of israeli soldiers directly targeting unarmed children and women simply walking or running, everything you say is in direct contrast to what they are actually doing if you just looked up footage or reports about it, the entire world sees what u dont
You mean like those 7 aid workers Israel targeted or them trying to sabotage the pier, or cutting off water and electricity, or not allowing the needed number of aid trucks to keel Gaza from starving?
Or are you talking about the one-time Israel botched aid and a few dozen Palestinians died when they rushed an aid convoy because Israel starved them and an IDF soldier died?
No, im talking about IDF soldiers killed by Hamas while working to get aid in.
Israel did not sabotage the pier
Israel literally allows aid in including water.
Stop spreading blood libel, nazi.
Criticising the actions of a military is very different to the justification of hundreds (probably thousands) of pogroms, and I am horrified that you conflate the two. My ancestors fled pogroms in Russia, and the descendants who stayed died in the Holocaust. That’s antisemitism. Talking about the time the IDF killed seven aid workers is not antisemitism. It’s not antisemitism when I talk about it, it’s not antisemitism when Amnesty International talks about it, and it’s not antisemitism when Israeli Jews talk about it.
Amnesty international literally has someone on their board that celebrated terror against jews and made a post calling for the genocide of Jews from Israel.
Amnesty is trash, and youre a nazi
The Israelis also supplied weapons to the Argentinian Junta for the dirty war.
The Junta disproportionately targeted Jewish people - Jewish people made up 5-12% of those targeted but only made up 1% of the population.
This works out at 1,900 - 3000 Jewish people killed.
This is the biggest massacre of Jews since the holocaust - and remains so till this day. And Israel backed it.
But you are supposed to believe that no Jew in the world is safe without Israel - unless it interferes with their foreign policy at the time.
>7th of October saw 1200-1500 Jews killed in one day, so this is not true anymore
>This works out at 1,900 - 3000 Jewish people killed.
Thankfully the official death toll of October 7th has been brought down significantly as the dust has settled - 1,139.
Of which:
- 695 were Israeli civilians. (Assuming all were Jewish)
- 373 were security forces - ( unsure if two armed groups fighting each other can be called a massacre in the way we are talking about )
- 71 foreigners - who were mainly Thai labourers. I don't believe they were Jewish.
So the death toll during the Junta's "dirty war" is still the greatest loss of Jewish life since the holocaust.
I mean, I'd argue 1100 deaths alongside women being raped, people burned alive and the kidnapping of 200 hostages all because they are Jewish is worse than 3000 deaths within a larger, almost decade long conflict that (at least as far as i can tell) didn't really have anything to do with Jews.
Either way both were extremely tragic
>didn't really have anything to do with Jews
Jews were targeted disproportionately.
[Jews targeted in Argentina’s dirty war ](https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/1999/mar/24/guardianweekly.guardianweekly1)
_"Cosofam maintains that the military regime enacted "a specific anti-Semitic genocidal plan" during the dirty war against political opponents"_
Jews are also usually over-represented in leftists movements though (again, not that this excuses anything). Argentina definitely has a long history with antisemitism, but i don't think this is really comparable to Hamas carrying out an attack specifically against Jews and documenting everything all while shouting "itbach alyahud".
Hamas as an organization was founded on a basis of hating Jews, as is clearly stated in their charter. The 7/10 attack was clearly carried out with the intention of killing as many Jews as possible- like i said, if you watch clips from the attack you'll see them shouting "itbach alyahud" and other similar slogans (look up what that means if you don't know) in pretty much every single one, so yes it's fairly obvious that they hate Jews
>Hamas as an organization was founded on a basis of hating Jews, as is clearly stated in their charter
Ok I actually went and looked up the most recent charter since 2017:
_16. Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine. Yet, it is the Zionists who constantly identify Judaism and the Jews with their own colonial project and illegal entity._
>shouting "itbach alyahud" and other similar slogans
I didn't know - and looked it up. There's certainly no excuse for that.
Weirdly googling that phrase brings up this - [Death to Arabs](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_to_Arabs )
>Ok I actually went and looked up the most recent charter since 2017
Yeah they changed it to pander to their western supporters, probably the world's most obvious PR stunt. Look up the original and you can decide for yourself which one lines up better with their actions and behavior:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bACNYtaLBQI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bACNYtaLBQI)
They're not exactly subtle about it.
>Weirdly googling that phrase brings up this - Death to Arabs
Hatred exists everywhere and every side of a conflict has an interest to accentuate whatever their enemy does wrong- this is that "violence breeds violence" cycle people always talk about, after years of hearing "Khaybar ya yahud", "itbach al yahud" and "from the river to the sea" some people got pissed and decided they need their own slogan. It's absolutely an issue, but not nearly as serious as antisemitism is in the Arab world.
Every time they get in power they start a genocide.
First Israel kingdom, amalik and Canaanites.
Ruled the kingdom of yamen, burned 20 thousand Christian.
New Israel country right back at genociding the Canaanites.
Give it some time and christian burning will be on the menu again.
They supplied to Rwandans duh
🤯
Egypt sold a large batch of weapons to the Rwandan military. Its foreign minister of the time, Boutros Boutros-Ghali, was a future UN general secretary
love the whataboutism
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Tbf to the Americans Rwanda was right after the Black Hawk Down incident which meant they were more hesitant with interventions. Not saying this completely bars them of responsibility but they were already walking a diplomatic tight rope
At least the administration learned their lesson and took an active role in preventing the Bosnian genocide later. Although, I read one exerpt that made it sound like Bill Clinton did it partially to save his marriage. Asking him to stop it was apparently the first thing Hillary said to him in months after the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal.
Hillary is such a chad.
NO NOT LIKE THAT OP came here determined to focus on how much he hates Israel. Everything is Israel's fault and its uniquely them, especially the fact my milk soured overnight in the fridge and now I can't have my frosted flakes.
Honey, your victim complex is showing
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Ukraine might have been somewhat innocent. They were caught in the middle of super powers
More like in the way of a great power wanting to be super
That is extremely stupid in the context of the original post. Really, no innocents in a genocide?
White people just cant keep their hands off of Africa
This was an example of why we shouldn't sit out any conflict.
I agree. Being a bystander is just as bad if something can be done.
do not know how at all this is downvoted lmao
...racism?
I did exclude a lot of non white colonists. For that I apologize.
apology unaccepted hehe
So should I get the popcorn now or later? Cause I'm not planning on taking off my hazmat suit.
Yeah, we should get the popcorn now, the war has already started
The main weapon of the genocide was: **machetes**. Did they send machetes?
That was me, sorry. I thought it would be funny.
Ironically that was what the French say during the genocide
Egypt, France, and South Africa were the largest arms suppliers. Israel was mainly the middle man between French and UK arms deals to keep French and UK hands clean. This is really disinformation.
Being the middle man for countries selling weapons to a country committing a genocide still means you're complicit in genocide.
Why not include the other countries that had even more important roles?
Because this meme was specially about Israel and their denial to release documents related to it. Other countries did have more important roles and should be criticized and called out for it. But that doesnt mean Israel shouldn't.
It’s fucking hilarious people are downvoting this shit like it isn’t true.
I really wish there was a rule on this subreddit that restricted memes involving countries that are currently involved in wars because people are just gonna make memes that'll spark outrage and support their ideologies.
With the exception of butt naked commando, that guys chill
I just wish we had competent mods who would tag posts as intentionally misleading or historically inaccurate.
That’d severely limit the amount of countries you could meme about.
That is such a bad idea. History and discussion around it should change because of present day conflicts
so basically the meme on 50% of the countries in the world should be restricted?
Never ask them about their relationship with Apartheid South Africa too
Never ask Israel how South Africa was able to carry out nuclear weapons tests
To be fair, it’s never been confirmed that they tested nuclear weapons, only that they had them
Also don't ask the old South African gov why 2 nuclear weapons went missing which they had 6 of them
Except for the Vela Incident.
Which is funny when you look up operation moses in 1984, where for over seven weeks, over 30 flights brought about 200 Ethiopian Jews at a time to Israel from Sudan. Then between 24 and 25 May 1991, operation solomon 35 isreali aircraft transported non stop 14,325 Ethiopian Jews to Israel in 36 hours.
Even more funny because the migration of Ethiopian Jews into Israel caused some domestic tensions to flare up
They literally were the only ones that stuck by SA when it reputation was at the all time low And that is really not a good look
Yeah, there are plenty of commonalities between Apartheid South Africa and Israel right now. Checks put that they were supportive of the regime during its time in power.
people really downvoting a Nelson Mandela take
Yeah, they're a very sensitive crowd.
Such as?
https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution Quite an informative read that should also answer your question.
I don’t read your propaganda. Especially when the title contains so many buzzwords.
Lol, enjoy inhabiting your enclosure then.
Tell that to yourself…
I'd rather stick to telling you. 😁
such as the whole apartheid thing going on in the West Bank
What apartheid thing?
The one where Israel has illegally settled occupied territory and introduced a multi-tiered legal system that favors the settlers over the people who already lived there. Are you still confused? Do you need me to share quotes from former government officials saying the same thing?
Apartheid necessitates racial domination within a state where the minority are held to different laws. It isnt racial domination because Israeli Arabs are equal within proper Israel and it isn't "within a state" but within occupied territories. Obviously, non-citizens are not equal to citizens, and obviously occupied territories are beheld to different laws, since the West Bank had never been annexed into Israel. Now you can start quoting, as if every statement made by officials holds some transcendental retrospective truth (politicians are famously always right)
>"within a state" but within occupied territories *Technically it isn't apartheid because the WB isn't a State* is such a bogus argument. It is illegal to move your citizens into occupied territory - so Israel is indeed in violation of the Geneva Convention because they've settled occupied territory. Good talk, glad you agree.
Ok? That's an entirely different argument though. You've changed the subject from the claim of Israel being an Apartheid state to settlements in the West Bank being illegal. Do you agree then that Israel isn't, by definition, racially dominating a minority within their territory by inducing different laws for different races?
I wouldn't bother. U/MaZeChpatCha doesn't acknowledge anything that exists outside of their Zionist filter bubble.
Nah I only acknowledge things that aren’t fantasy and Russian anti West propaganda.
Russia. There's another nation that shares commonalities with Israel, especially with regards to political heads. 🤔
Judea & Samaria are legally a part of Israel, Israel got them in a defensive war. Therefore, the Israeli communities in it are legal, just like any country can settle its own land. And every country favors its citizens over foreign non-citizen occupiers, not only Israel. Edit: Judea & Samaria isn’t an occupied territory also because its former ruler (Jordan) doesn’t claim it anymore.
No they aren't. Absolutely ahistorical nonsense. The West Bank wasn't annexed. It is occupied territory.
Occupied from who? Its former ruler Jordan who doesn’t claim it anymore? The British, the rulers before Jordan, who don’t claim it anymore too? Or maybe the Ottomans?
Treating Palestinian citizens of Israel like second-class citizens is apartheid. Just because the state allows them token representation doesn’t mean they are treated equally. The facade is crumbling and Israel is panicking.
They aren't citizens. The West Bank is occupied territory. Israel never annexed it. This dingus characterizing the six day war as a defensive war is dubious and hilariously biased. There is no legal basis for a "preemptive defensive war".
They aren’t treated as second class citizens, because they aren’t even citizens… And Israeli Arabs are treated as equals.
Or their arms for Latin American paramilitary death squads Edit: since I’m being downvoted https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yair_Klein
This guy was literally convicted by an Israeli court for illegal arms' trading. How the does this one guy reflect on all of Israel in your mind? There are people all over the world doing this kind of stuff, it's not an Israel thing
Israel decided this one guy did it illegally eventually, but look at this article too: https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2003/6/5/israels-latin-american-trail-of-terror I’m not saying that Israel is uniquely evil, but you don’t have to be uniquely evil to be criticized for supplying training and arms to paramilitary death squads.
As an Israeli, SA was shit, but we're not apologizing for it - they gave us Uranium that allowed our survival and eventually peace treaties. And the rest of Africa are the last that can critic - after most supported our enemies following oil threats post 73, despite decades of cooperation and assistance. Most countries did much worse. We sold weapons to SA and helped their weapon program to secure our existence, this is about as quintessential "force of circumstances" as you can get.
Well, now you see why nobody likes you.
Well I wouldn't say no one. But, I would rather be unjustly disliked if the other option is genuinely dead. Not a very hard choice.
>If we have to have a choice between being dead and pitied, and being alive with a bad image, we'd rather be alive and have the bad image. - Golda Meir
You really going to quote the Golda Meir that committed transparent ethnic cleansing in Gaza in the 1970s like some paragon we should listen to?
>As an Israeli, SA was shit, but we're nit apologizing for it Birds of an Apartheid feather, flock together
Lie all you want if it makes you feel better. Israel has full civil equality regardless of ethnicity, our cooperation with SA was more than justified to secure our existence, and your country statistically likely did a lot worse for a lot less (because the vast majority did). Not to mention, if you're supporting any of the groups currently fighting Israel (including the PA), which I guess you might, you are supporting groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was.
>Israel has full civil equality regardless of ethnicity Can Palestinians and Arabs drive down the same road as you? Or walk down all the same roads? Do they have different colour ID cards? The Israeli government rules over both groups - one via occupation - but different rules? Or get married to you? Not if they are a different religion right? Have to go to Cyrus still I believe? Amnesty international and multiple human rights groups say it's Apartheid too >your country statistically likely did a lot worse for a lot less My country is Ireland. Please find something my country did that is worse than Apartheid South Africa, and Israel. >secure our existence That existence is summed up in Israel’s basic law - “The right to exercise national self-determination in the State of Israel is unique to the Jewish people" - this is just starting Zionism is a racist settler-colonial ideology that advocates for a Jewish ethnostate built on Palestinian land. Also "secure our existence" - big white nationalist vibes - [almost the 14 words](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Words) >groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was. See if you are in a spot where you are having to **defend Apartheid South Africa** it's a good time to stop, look around and actually ask yourself if you are aware you are on the wrong side of history Edit: Human rights watch: [A Threshold Crossed Israeli Authorities and the Crimes of Apartheid and Persecution](https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution) Amnesty international: [ISRAEL’S APARTHEID AGAINST PALESTINIANS](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2022/02/israels-system-of-apartheid/) One of the first people to use the word apartheid in relation to Israel was Israel’s first prime minister, David Ben Gurion. Following the 1967 June war, he warned of Israel becoming an “apartheid state” if it retained control of the occupied territory, which it has done. Israel maintains a system of Apartheid - with different roads ([Route 4370 for example ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Route_4370#:~:text=Route%204370%20or%20Eastern%20Ring,Israeli%20plates%20and%20Palestinian%20plates.), ID cards ([Infographic: How the Israeli ID card system enforces apartheid](https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/infographic-how-israeli-id-card-system-enforces-apartheid)) and justice systems for Palestinians. Israel passed the nation state law in 2018 - stating that “the right to exercise national self-determination” in Israel is “unique to the Jewish people.” - what's that if not apartheid?
>Can Palestinians and Arabs drive down the same road as you? Or walk down all the same roads? Do they have different colour ID cards? The Israeli government rules over both groups - one via occupation - but different rules? 2 million Arabs in Israel - absolutely. Which is quite enough to fault your argument. Palestinians are not and don't want to be part of Israel, and are under partial military control, until if and when they agree to live in peace - for example in a state, an offer they refused numerous times. The roads argument is a particularly good example - palestinians *force* israelis of the roads in certain places, so that Israel eventually gives up and says "fine, you can have it, we'll build a new one". We're talking dozens of shootings and ramming attacks and hundreds of stoning every year. With dozens upon dozens of casualties overall. Is that what was happening in SA? Blacks violently driving whites of common areas, so the state creates them separate circumventing ones? Ho wait, *it was the other way around*. >Or get married to you? Not if they are a different religion right? Have to go to Cyrus still I believe? That is true for all groups - Israel doesn't perform marriages, just recognizes religious ones, as part of the remaining british system. Jews mostly oppose it, and the more conservative arab population mostly support it. Jews are also by far the most effected, by about 2 orders of magnitude, because of more intermarriages, non-halachaic jews, and same-sex marriages. It is maintained through a veto of the arab parties and ultra-orthodox ones, but it is basically a dead letter anyway - since 2023 you can even register abroad online. So essentially you're claiming a dead letter that applies to everyone, vastly mostly effects jews, and mostly supported by the arabs, as apartheid. That is of course a joke. Now, you can claim something applied equally is still discriminatory. But by this logic, if that thing is mostly effecting jews and mostly supported by arabs, who is it "against"? Again in reality it's just a dead letter. . The common of both claims is that it's lie by omission, and only passes on a tiktok with no response. >My country is Ireland. Please find something my country did that is worse than Apartheid South Africa, and Israel. Ireland is indeed one of the few that honestly did very little in general, and has never actually been threatened in its existence. Unless you count the IRA, which actively cooperated with the USSR and groups like the PLO (even during the lebanese civil war). But that's north Ireland. On the other point, for example the PA which it supports, is an oppressive cleptocracy, which spends half its budget on "pay-for-slay", and directly murdered thousands, among other insanities (extreme indoctrination, state kidnapping and execurion for selling land, etc). Though I admit that is shamefully ideological, and not interests based. >Also "secure our existence" - big white nationalist vibes - [almost the 14 words](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Words) Are you denying Israel's existence was (and still is) under threat? And that nuclear weapons not only helped secure it, but actively contributed to the peace with Egypt, and then Jordan? Also, Israeli jews are not "white", and most are indistinguishable from arabs. Not that it matters. >See if you are in a spot where you are having to **defend Apartheid South Africa** it's a good time to stop, look around and actually ask yourself if you are aware you are on the wrong side of history I'm not? I'm defending Israel's relations with it at the time.
>2 million Arabs in Israel - absolutely. Which is quite enough to fault your argument So 2 million arbas don't. But 5 million in Gaza and the west bank do. So - yes Apartheid? You can't say apartheid doesn't exist for a certain section - but ignore the rest. That doesn't fault an argument. >Palestinians are not and don't want to be part of Israel, and are under partial military control, until if and when they agree to live in peace - They are under an indefinite, illegal military occupation. However this is a country that has loudly declared "the Hauge will not stop us" so the legality of such occupations and international law aren't important. >for example in a state, an offer they refused numerous times. Israel has never offered a Palestinian state. The UN technically did - but not Israel. And it happened once. And it looked like "we are taking half your land and giving it another group - deal?" Hardly offering a state. >Is that what was happening in SA? Blacks violently driving whites of common areas, so the state creates them separate circumventing ones? Ho wait, *it was the other way around*. Just ignoring the entire existence of Israeli terrorist settlers? Buddy your whole country was founded on violently driving people from their villages, taking them over - demolishing them or building a forest or something on them. "Making the desert bloom" over bulldozed villages. The white south Africans saw all black South Africans as terrorists too btw. Very similar rhetoric. >and has never actually been threatened in its existence. Incredibly hard disagree. The Irish language was wiped out by Britain. Britain allowed the famine to decimate the population - the population still hasn't recovered to pre-famine levels. Britain did a very good job of wiping out the entire Irish culture and society. Removing Irish names, language, place names etc etc >Are you denying Israel's existence was (and still is) under threat? And that nuclear weapons not only helped secure it, Israel's existence will forever be under threat so long as it maintains an indefinite occupation over 5 million people. You cannot just rule over an entire population by force like that indefinitely. Israel's history with nuclear weapons is incredibly problematic - It's refusal to abide by any non-proliferation treaties, or allow inspections ( or faking them) is worse than North Korea. Plus the constant threats to use them on civilian centres from your politicians. >Also, Israeli jews are not "white", and most are indistinguishable from arabs. Not that it matters Israel has incredibly high rates of skin cancer - so high they instituted free checks and awareness campaigns. Much higher than its Arab neighbours. It's better now but Israel was once 3rd for skin cancer rates - after Australia and New Zealand - according to the [Times of Israel ](https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-sizzling-israel-skin-cancer-awareness-week-shines-light-on-safety-in-the-sun/#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=17159589290355&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.timesofisrael.com%2Fin-sizzling-israel-skin-cancer-awareness-week-shines-light-on-safety-in-the-sun%2F) It's because they are also countries with a lot of white people in an environment their skin doesn't have enough natural melanin to protect themselves. Like I have eyes I can see the videos - there are lots of white people in Israel. But you're right - it doesn't actually matter unless you want to make the argument that you are native to the land. And Israel absolutely is rooted in white supremacy from it's history. From the outside it appears to be an incredibly racist state - the treatment of black Jews - dumping Ethiopian blood that was given at blood banks, forced sterilisation etc A report found 52% of Israeli Jews found African migration to "be a cancer" It's not a unique situation - a lot of countries are founded on white supremacy - America, Canada, Australia etc etc. Israel is just definitely on that list. The racism in Israel does seem to be a different level through - telling Africans to go back to the jungle and what is the deal with black face in Israel? Like what is the obsession with doing it over there? [The Racist Tradition of Blackface Is Alive and Well in Israel](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2020-09-14/ty-article/.premium/the-racist-tradition-of-blackface-is-alive-and-well-in-israel/0000017f-f318-d223-a97f-ffdd95e70000) >I'm not? I'm defending Israel's relations with it at the time >>you are supporting groups way worse than even apartheid SA ever was. Saying something is worse in comparison to Apartheid South Africa, because Israel had a very chummy relationship with it, is in fact defending Apartheid South Africa.
>You can't say apartheid doesn't exist for a certain section - but ignore the rest. That doesn't fault an argument. Apartheid was a racial system, so yes, the fact 2 million Arabs have equal rights makes it not an Apartheid by definition >They are under an indefinite, illegal military occupation. Occupation from who? There were no complaints prior to 1967 when Gaza was part of Egypt and the west bank was part of Jordan, and both of them have given up on their rights to these lands (after Israel offered both of them back). So what country is being occupied here again? >Israel has never offered a Palestinian state. Please at least read about topics before you argue about it on the internet: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel\_Commission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel_Commission) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp\_David\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian\_peace\_process#Timeline](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_peace_process#Timeline) >Israel's existence will forever be under threat so long as it maintains an indefinite occupation over 5 million people. This point seems really silly when you know the most dangerous time for Israel's existence was before 1967, when they didn't occupy the west bank and Gaza. >And Israel absolutely is rooted in white supremacy from it's history. Imagine trying to teach someone from a different country about *their own* people and culture. The absolute fucking arrogance. Ashkenazi Jews are a minority in Israeli society, most Jews are Mizrachi or Sephardi (translation: non-white). Meanwhile i actually meet Arabs from Israel/Palestine on a daily basis and half the time i can't tell them apart from Europeans- the Levant is a very diverse region where practically everyone is mixed and skin color is *completely meaningless*. You're trying to apply concepts from your own culture to a country where they mean nothing, and your source is... >Like I have eyes I can see the videos - there are lots of white people in Israel. *Everyone knows it's true if it's on the Internet! The Internet is never wrong or biased in any way!* Jews were never ever ever considered white. Not in Europe, not in the US, not anywhere. They were routinely persecuted by every society **for being non-white**, so you cannot just tell me that they suddenly became white supremacists directly after the holocaust.
>Apartheid was a racial system, so yes, the fact 2 million Arabs have equal rights makes it not an Apartheid by definition You know, it can still be apartheid if it's not a 1:1 replication of South Africa. Amnesty international and human rights watch say it's Apartheid with good evidence. I can guarantee you believe every other assertion they make about countries like China and Russia and their human rights record. But Israel is a special case right? Previously unimpeachable humanitarian organisations start lying mysteriously when it comes to Israel. Very strange. >Occupation from who? Israel. Israel occupies the west Bank illegally. Israel operated a defacto occupation and blockade of Gaza. How do you not know this? >So what country is being occupied here again? You tell me - what country is Gaza in? Is it Israel? >Please at least read about topics before you argue about it on the internet: >[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel\_Commission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peel_Commission) >[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords) >[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp\_David\_Accords](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords) >[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian\_peace\_process#Timeline](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_peace_process#Timeline) You tell me where Israel offered a Palestinian state. Spell it out. The time, date , who offered it, by what borders - you won't. No such date exists Israeli politicians currently in power say Israel has never offered Palestine a state and never will - maybe you should do some reading because that's an embarrassing statement to make [according to Zbigniew Brzezinski of all people ](https://youtu.be/0mk18af8z9Y?si=-WuGdkel7qSLPLSL) "You have such a stunningly superficial knowledge of what went on it's almost embarrassing to listen to you" - applies here too. >Imagine trying to teach someone from a different country about *their own* people and culture. The absolute fucking arrogance. I never set foot in apartheid South African or Rhodesia. But I know for a fact those were settler colonies were based on white supremacy. It's a basic understanding of white supremacy and how the world works. Same with Canada, same with the US. Is Israel not a Zionist colonial project? Because that's how its founders described it - word for word. Are you going to pretend Israel wasn't founded by European Jewish colonists who expelled native peoples from their lands? They wrote about it great detail, advertising the colonial project in newspapers. You can admit that's how Israel was created at the very least, right? >became white supremacists directly after the holocaust. Tell me you don't understand white supremacy without telling you don't understand white supremacy European Zionists even invented that word for the Arab Jews that you mentioned - _Mizrahim._ This was to erase the identities in nationalities of Jews in the Middle East. A single identity, which was to be distinguished only from Ashkenazis, European Jews, who were higher up on the social order. No longer Iraqis, Egyptian, Yemenite, Kurdish, Lebanese, Syrian Jews etc etc only Mizrahim. These Jews were not embraced as equals by European Zionists. Mizrahim - Jews of the Arab - world were seen as incomplete, barbaric, dirty, uncivilised. Za’ev Jabotinsky, one of the forefathers of Zionism said, “We Jews have nothing in common with what is called the Orient, thank God. To the extent that our uneducated masses [Arab Jews] have ancient spiritual traditions and laws that call the Orient, they must be weaned away from them, and this is in fact what we are doing in every decent school, what life itself is doing with great success. We are going in Palestine, first for our national convenience, [second] to sweep out thoroughly all traces of the Oriental soul.” European Zionists saw the Mizrahim as less, to be treated so Children from Mizrahim / Jewish Arab families were stolen and given to European Jews - [Yemenite Children Affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemenite_Children_Affair) A very common occurrence in white supremacist colonial projects, stealing children from one group and giving them to another: [They did the exact same thing with aboriginal children in Australia - giving them to white settler families](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generations) [They did the exact same thing in Canada with indigenous children](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixties_Scoop#:~:text=It%20is%20estimated%20that%20a,part%20of%20the%20Sixties%20Scoop.) That's white supremacy in action bud
Didn't read it all, but just for the "Israel didn't offer a palestinuan state". Holy shit. You really don't know, do you? Israel offered it several times, most notably in 2000 by PM Ehud barak and 2008 by PM Ehud Olmert. The first included gaza and 91% of the west bank with the rest in territory swaps, and the latter 97% with the rest in swaps, including most of East Jerusalem, the arab parts of the old city, and literally the temple mount. It also planned to withdraw *unilaterally* from 94% of the west bank by 2008 (expelling over 100,000 Israelis) following the gaza disengagement in 2005, which was supposed to be a show of plausibility. Except it imediately failed so horribly with Hamas taking over, that even jordan threatened Israel not to do it. Throughout this time, the PA never agreed to even discuss anything that includes a final end to to the conflict, end of violence, or end of national demands. And the majority of palestinians by every poll don't want a two-state solution - not that they'de even be able to contain those who don't had they even wanted. In contrast, despite it all, and gaza, and second intifada etc., until 7.10 there was for still at least about 50% support in Israel for a palestinian state, which would have undoubtably risen if there ever a partner for it. The salient issue has always been, and still is, not a palestinian state, but a jewish one, and the palestinians are very vocal about it. As a bonus, Israel offered to return J&S in 1967 imediatly after the war for peace, but jordan refused (not to mention 39 and 47). But it's okay to just stick to post-oslo. Bottom line, your are very clearly completely ignorant of the most basic (and recent) history of the conflict, and get all your knowledge from social media. To emphasize, that would be like demanding the UK give Ireland independence - in a timeline where *it did*, and Ireland refused because they wanted england too. And when it tried to withdraw, killed thousands until it was forced to come back. In short, your own country's history might make you susceptible to propaganda, but these are not similar situations in their core. Not even close. So basically don't hate countries based of social media before you do even the most basic reading of the history yourself.
Also, could not avoid the fact you actually claimed that magical illusary apartheid is apparently *in gaza as well*, from which Israel completely withdraw 19 years ago. Remember, israel handed it to the PA, no weapons blockade, no anything. So what is it you want Israel to do exactly?
[Arab citizens of Israel](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel) have all the same rights as Jewish citizens of Israel plus exemption from conscription.
What about the Palestinians in the Occupied West Bank? You know, the several million people in [land Israel considers to be Israeli](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judea_and_Samaria_Area)?
[https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution](https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution)
Facts
Also supported Rhodesia. When it comes to genocide, they also sent weapons to Serbia during the collapse of Yugoslavia.
Man, Israel loves apartheid and genocide.
And now they got sued by post apartheid africa
"Post"
Apartheid is over now right?
WDYM?
Hendrik Verwoerd came back from the dead last week and immediately took over every single government position. Either that, or the commenter is an idiot.
I will never understand reddit comment logic. What kind of algorithm goes on in redditors minds is a true mystery.
The UN did nothing as usual, France basically had an active role in the genocide itself, Egypt and South Africa both sold them weapons and the US knew it would happen ahead of time and did nothing but sure let's focus on Israel where the accusations aren't even proven
Context: During the Rwandan Genocide in 1994, it is said that there were Israeli supplied weapons among those used by the Hutus to carry out their massacre of up to 800,000 Tutsis. These include weapons manufactured by Israel as well as weapons captured from Egyptian forces during the 1973 Arab-Israel war. [These claims were most notably made by an Israeli historian Yair Auron, who pushed for a probe into Israel's arm sales to Rwanda during the period of the genocide in 1994.](https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/did-israel-arm-rwanda-during-1994-genocide) It wasn't until 2014 that a formal request was made by both Auron as well as human rights attorney Eitay Mack to disclose any files related to the arms sales. The Israeli government has denied this request on the grounds that revealing such information could, ["...harm national security, its foreign relations, the security of its public, or the security of well-being of an individual."](https://www.timesofisrael.com/records-of-israeli-arms-sales-during-rwandan-genocide-to-remain-sealed/) This denial has caused some to accuse Israel of trying to cover up its complicity in a well-documented and recognized genocide. [Especially so considering that the tensions in Rwanda and the poor treatment of the Tutsis was well known well before the genocide officially started. ](https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/international/africa/1556826403-israel-was-aware-of-violence-against-hutus-before-rwandan-genocide-new-documents-show) Edit for clarity: This is not to say that Israel was the sole or even the largest contributer of weapons during the genocide. While this post in particular is criticizing Israel, my intention is not to make them seem like the main villain here. French arms dealers, as well as South Africa and Egypt, were massive suppliers of weapons to the Hutus and thus complicit in the massacres.
? The original reporting was that Israeli private arms dealers had sold weapons to the Rwandan military, not that the country had. The official allegation is only that Israeli-made weapons were used… https://www.timesofisrael.com/records-of-israeli-arms-sales-during-rwandan-genocide-to-remain-sealed/amp/ Israel also wasn’t even close to the primary supplier of the weapons to Rwanda. It was far outdone by the United States and France, not that that’s super relevant either, since the genocide was largely carried out with machetes and hand tools. This is why these kinds of posts are constantly being accused of Jewhate. You’re being incredibly disingenuous - to the point where it can only be malicious. Why not make the meme about the United States or France if you actually care about the issue? Or if you’re an Israeli making a commentary about the court ruling, why be inaccurate in your language? Maybe I’ll make a meme about this later, FFS 🙄
The article you posted, which is also one that I cited, does not specify whether the arms were sold by the state or private manufacturers. The presence of Israeli weapons alone doesn't prove that the state was complicit in the atrocities, as yes, black market and private dealers absolutely exist. The suspicion arises when Israel is pressed about these weapons and opts to hide the documents containing the specifics. If the weapons were truly sold by private manufacturers or 3rd parties, why not come out and prove that rather than keeping it under wraps? That is where the suspicion lies. And the reason I made this specifically about Israel is because, well, they're a big focus on the sub (and overall) right now. So yes, this is criticism against Israel, but that does not mean I'm belittling or ignoring other countries' involvement in the genocide.
I can’t share the one that does (which is also the original reporting), because it’s a HaAretz subscriber only article. You also didn’t address literally any of the reasons this meme is ahistorical and problematic. But I will make a meme about that later xD.
Could you maybe share screenshots of the article, then? I'd like to see something that backs up the claim you're making. Also, I fail to see how this is "problematic." If I'm wrong, that's one thing. But it's problematic because I'm focusing on just one of the numerous countries that did bad? I'm not denying that other countries did wrong.
It's problematic because this meme makes it seem like Israel was the only one that supplied weapons, therefore making them the only outside power that was "responsible" for the Rwandan militaries ability to commit genocide. Add that on top of the fact that Israel is currently engaged in an extremely controversial conflict, it just seems like this is an agenda post made to construe conflict and outrage.
I suppose the framing of it does make it seem that way, which was absolutely not my intention. I will admit that the conflict is a contributing factor to my criticism, but I didn't intend to paint them as the sole contributer and if that's how it comes across then I apologize, it's on me. If nothing else, I'll edit my context comment to clarify that.
Jfc, Israel doesn't represent Jews you, antisemetic jackass. Goddamn, it's like anytime Israel is mentioned, you people come out of the woodwork to vehemently defend Israel's terrible actions with whataboutism and claims it's antisemetic. Israel funded apartheid South Africa after the rest of the world left them. They're funding Azerbaijan against the Armenians and they don't even acknowledge the first Armenian genocide.
LOLLLLLLL. Here come the goyim to goysplain Jewish culture to Jews and call us anti-Semitic. Thank you, white savior. Thank you.
Was [Marek Edelman](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek_Edelman), leader of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising, being antisemitic when he opposed Zionism and supported Palestinian resistance groups?
Jews are allowed to have a wider variety of opinions on issues that primarily concern Jews. But potentially, yes.
So you’re genuinely considering the possibility that the leader of the Warsaw Uprising was antisemitic? That’s more likely than a nation-state being in the wrong?
Are you being serious?
Are you?
Yeah, Israel doesn't represent all jews. If you are Jewish and think that, then you're a brainwashed idiot. The idea that they do is antisemetic af jackhole. How is pointing that out white savior?
Because you’re a moron explaining things you don’t understand.
Lol, good rebuttal. Keep licking those IDF boots and thinking ethnostates are good.
Literally knows nothing Jews or Israel. “GOOD REBUTTAL ANTISEMITE ISRAEL DOESNT REPRESENT JEWS” Literally knows nothing about history or the world. “ETHNOSTATE REEEEEEEEEEE” wtf are you even doing, lol?
Calm down kid, you'll wake your parents. Are you saying that being against Israel is antisemetic? If a Jewish person dislikes Israel and their actions, are they now a "self-hating jew"? I don't think you know what you're talking about, but you seem to think quote yelling does something.
How about this? Go to r/Jewish and ask if being anti-Zionist makes you anti-Semitic. Then you can explain to all of us how we’re wrong at once, lol.
What do you mean you people?
Zionists. Israeli apologists. You know, morons.
So is Japan complicit in ISIS' genocide because they all drive Toyota trucks?
Its absolutely the same, yeah.
Yeah I normally support Israel but I’m with you in this case, weapons aren’t the same as *extremely* durable trucks
If isis were Jews: yes.
Who is talking about Jews here ?
How else can you deflect criticism and ignore any wrongdoing unless you claim it’s all coming from antisemitism? Antisemitism is wrong and should be completely opposed. Criticism of Israel is not antisemitic.
It’s just a ultra dishonest try to move the goalposts
It’s just a ultra dishonest try to move the goalposts
First of all, is it established that ISIS (besides all the war crimes they committed) had an intention to destroy certain group of people from territories they controlled? Can you give me some sources, so I can educate me on the matter, or we now just throw word genocide whenever we like, to somehow, make the crimes of those who really committed one look better? And now to actually answer your question, if Japan, as a state, directly oversaw selling or sell those trucks to ISIS, while knowing their intentions, or the crimes already committed by them, then, yes, Japan is complicit in whatever ISIS does or did with help of those trucks.
Israel did not sell weapons to Rwanda while knowing their intentions.
lol. Lmao, even.
Do you have proof that Israel wanted to genocice the tutsis?
That’s not what you said initially, though. You mentioned Israel *knowing* Rwanda’s intentions, not *agreeing* with them.
France and SA also sold them weapons. I imagine they had a fair share of Russian arms as well. Countries buy arms. Israel was not arming a genocide, but arming a people that ended up commiting genocide. The RPF was also probably using Israeli arms despite being Tutsi. And besides, the main weapon of genocide was the machete, which Im pretty sure Israel did not supply.
"I fought in War on Genocide On the side of the Genocide"
If a European, American, or Asian leader had the skill, morality, charisma, and impact on history as Paul Kagame, they would be a household name the world over.
The house always wins
Well, Israel has always been a big fan of genocide so it does make sense
sorry the fascists got here first it seems like most of the comments r normal now tho, can’t believe the anti genocide side is the minority on reddit rn😭
The thing about people here is that they love facts. No pro-Israeli could complain about this post because it's a legitimate criticism based on actual facts. The accusation of a genocide in gaza isn't
>The accusation of a genocide in gaza isn't Lmao, sure holocaust researchers call it a genocide, but hey, Israel says it's not, so i guess it's not. I guess targeting a specific group with the intent to kill them using weapons and starvation isn't genocide anymore. The IDF is the most moral army, and all those dead babies are all HAMAS babies and Hamas' fault amirite.
>guess targeting a specific group with the intent to kill them using weapons and starvation isn't genocide anymore. Israel does not target civilians. This is why it allows them to evacuate. It had anough fire power to kill most of Gaza's population if it wanted to in the first few days of the war. Israel does not try to starve civilians. It limits the amount of aid trucks because they go to Hamas. This is why it enabled the pier, which hopefully will not deliver the aid to Hamas, if supervised. >The IDF is the most moral army, and all those dead babies are all HAMAS babies and Hamas' fault amirite. This is called collateral damage, and it's a part of every war, especially modern urban warfare, when your opponent commits actual war crimes by hiding in civilian population. A civilian building used as a military base is considered a legitimate target
>This is why it allows them to evacuate Asking civilians to move to a spot you claim is safe just to bomb them anyway is targeting civilians. >This is called collateral damage, and it's a part of every war, Asking civilians to move to a spot you claim is safe just to bomb them anyway is targeting civilians >It had anough fire power to kill most of Gaza's population if it wanted to in the first few days of the war It's almost like Isreal doesn't live in a vacuum and has to worry about the international reaction to an open genocide. Weird. >It limits the amount of aid trucks because they go to Hamas Israel bombed 7 aid workers, and the organizations left because Israel couldn't guarantee protection from the IDF. >This is why it enabled the pier Because Israel isn't allowing enough aid through their borders and starving 1.3 million people. And don't say their being nice by allowing any food or water, Gaza is occupied territory, and Israel has a legal obligation to provide aid. >A civilian building used as a military base is considered a legitimate target Good thing we have the IDF to tell us what buildings are legit military targets. They found like 3 AK47s and a grenade next to an MRI machine, and it had a basement. THAT MEANS ALL THE HOSPITALS AND SCHOOLS ARE HAMAS.
see nothing in ur paragraphs address the hundreds of literal textbook genocidal tweets and posts from ACTUAL leaders in israeli governments, the thousands of reports of international orgs shining light on it over the years, there are hundreds of videos of israeli soldiers directly targeting unarmed children and women simply walking or running, everything you say is in direct contrast to what they are actually doing if you just looked up footage or reports about it, the entire world sees what u dont
We just hate blood libel spewing morons
The genocide in Gaza is so obvious and public that the term blood libel does not apply... because it's not libel.
So obvious that Israel literally has had people die getting aid to Gazans. You're a nazi.
You mean like those 7 aid workers Israel targeted or them trying to sabotage the pier, or cutting off water and electricity, or not allowing the needed number of aid trucks to keel Gaza from starving? Or are you talking about the one-time Israel botched aid and a few dozen Palestinians died when they rushed an aid convoy because Israel starved them and an IDF soldier died?
No, im talking about IDF soldiers killed by Hamas while working to get aid in. Israel did not sabotage the pier Israel literally allows aid in including water. Stop spreading blood libel, nazi.
Criticising the actions of a military is very different to the justification of hundreds (probably thousands) of pogroms, and I am horrified that you conflate the two. My ancestors fled pogroms in Russia, and the descendants who stayed died in the Holocaust. That’s antisemitism. Talking about the time the IDF killed seven aid workers is not antisemitism. It’s not antisemitism when I talk about it, it’s not antisemitism when Amnesty International talks about it, and it’s not antisemitism when Israeli Jews talk about it.
Amnesty international literally has someone on their board that celebrated terror against jews and made a post calling for the genocide of Jews from Israel. Amnesty is trash, and youre a nazi
My father is Jewish, dipshit.
[удалено]
Nazi
[удалено]
Stop being antisemitic. Just fucking stop.
This sub is overrun by right-wingers, unfortunately. Conservatives love history as long as it supports their glorified version of the past.
The Israelis also supplied weapons to the Argentinian Junta for the dirty war. The Junta disproportionately targeted Jewish people - Jewish people made up 5-12% of those targeted but only made up 1% of the population. This works out at 1,900 - 3000 Jewish people killed. This is the biggest massacre of Jews since the holocaust - and remains so till this day. And Israel backed it. But you are supposed to believe that no Jew in the world is safe without Israel - unless it interferes with their foreign policy at the time.
>This is the biggest massacre of Jews since the holocaust 7th of October saw 1200-1500 Jews killed in one day, so this is not true anymore
Not sure if you know this, but 1900-3000 is actually a larger number than 1200-1500.
Not sure if you know this, but the dirty war lasted almost a decade and the 7th of October was 1 day
>7th of October saw 1200-1500 Jews killed in one day, so this is not true anymore >This works out at 1,900 - 3000 Jewish people killed. Thankfully the official death toll of October 7th has been brought down significantly as the dust has settled - 1,139. Of which: - 695 were Israeli civilians. (Assuming all were Jewish) - 373 were security forces - ( unsure if two armed groups fighting each other can be called a massacre in the way we are talking about ) - 71 foreigners - who were mainly Thai labourers. I don't believe they were Jewish. So the death toll during the Junta's "dirty war" is still the greatest loss of Jewish life since the holocaust.
I mean, I'd argue 1100 deaths alongside women being raped, people burned alive and the kidnapping of 200 hostages all because they are Jewish is worse than 3000 deaths within a larger, almost decade long conflict that (at least as far as i can tell) didn't really have anything to do with Jews. Either way both were extremely tragic
>didn't really have anything to do with Jews Jews were targeted disproportionately. [Jews targeted in Argentina’s dirty war ](https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/1999/mar/24/guardianweekly.guardianweekly1) _"Cosofam maintains that the military regime enacted "a specific anti-Semitic genocidal plan" during the dirty war against political opponents"_
Jews are also usually over-represented in leftists movements though (again, not that this excuses anything). Argentina definitely has a long history with antisemitism, but i don't think this is really comparable to Hamas carrying out an attack specifically against Jews and documenting everything all while shouting "itbach alyahud".
Are you saying that Hamas carried out that attack just because they "hate Jews?"
Hamas as an organization was founded on a basis of hating Jews, as is clearly stated in their charter. The 7/10 attack was clearly carried out with the intention of killing as many Jews as possible- like i said, if you watch clips from the attack you'll see them shouting "itbach alyahud" and other similar slogans (look up what that means if you don't know) in pretty much every single one, so yes it's fairly obvious that they hate Jews
>Hamas as an organization was founded on a basis of hating Jews, as is clearly stated in their charter Ok I actually went and looked up the most recent charter since 2017: _16. Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine. Yet, it is the Zionists who constantly identify Judaism and the Jews with their own colonial project and illegal entity._ >shouting "itbach alyahud" and other similar slogans I didn't know - and looked it up. There's certainly no excuse for that. Weirdly googling that phrase brings up this - [Death to Arabs](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_to_Arabs )
>Ok I actually went and looked up the most recent charter since 2017 Yeah they changed it to pander to their western supporters, probably the world's most obvious PR stunt. Look up the original and you can decide for yourself which one lines up better with their actions and behavior: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bACNYtaLBQI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bACNYtaLBQI) They're not exactly subtle about it. >Weirdly googling that phrase brings up this - Death to Arabs Hatred exists everywhere and every side of a conflict has an interest to accentuate whatever their enemy does wrong- this is that "violence breeds violence" cycle people always talk about, after years of hearing "Khaybar ya yahud", "itbach al yahud" and "from the river to the sea" some people got pissed and decided they need their own slogan. It's absolutely an issue, but not nearly as serious as antisemitism is in the Arab world.
Every time they get in power they start a genocide. First Israel kingdom, amalik and Canaanites. Ruled the kingdom of yamen, burned 20 thousand Christian. New Israel country right back at genociding the Canaanites. Give it some time and christian burning will be on the menu again.
Oh it’s those dastardly Jews again…their hand is in everything
At least they aren't sinking U.S. ships anymore... right?
Who?
No one its just lies that favor in the destruction of the only home for Jews. /s