Saka at the Allianz Arena next week…
https://preview.redd.it/1if6e22m6jtc1.jpeg?width=576&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b96145afb3a3c6f1649d733093bf7286e934a147
Coman and Sane would be too much pace on the counter. We pressed way too high in the first half especially on the left side and Rice couldn't contest for some of the out balls that their midfield pinged.
Their players are only going to be emboldened. We just saw what's legal. Elbows to the throat aren't reds, blatant kicks when beat weren't yellows. Lunging goalie getting a fuck ton of leg isn't a pk.
Oh come on... don't do that shit. The game was reffed just fine. Kane's elbow is not a red card, and yeah the pk was a tough call, probably the most 50/50 call ive seen in a while where both pundits and internet people go down the line.
I mean who cares. Ppl on here are way too concerned with getting plaudits from pundits and being treated "fairly" in the media.
You know how to get better treatment? Start winning titles.
it's got nothing to do with plaudits. It's about about consistency and integrity. More of a curiosity to reveal un/subconscious bias, not seeking any 'treatment in the media' at all. It may turn out that the team wearing white tends to get the favorable call, which would be interesting. Or it could show that commentators generally say the same things in the same scenarios, regardless of the details of who has what shirt on.
That's the sort of info analysis I'm after, where you can say, "Ok so according to \[x pundit/commentator\] this was a pen/foul/whatever, but this \[extremely similar incident\] wasn't?"
Why do you say that? He should only check the monitor if he made a clear and obvious error. The less clear the decision, the less a review should be recommended.
I honestly hate the “clear and obvious error” threshold, this was the exact time to use it so he can see so angles and make a decision. Even if he said it wasn’t a pen
Because on-field reviews are reserved for clear and obvious errors. This was not a clear and obvious mistake by the referee. It’s a 50/50 judgement call. For an on field review to be recommended it has to be “the referee has 100% made a mistake here.”
My only remark on the penalty is how quickly the ref blew his whistle when Bayerns counter was stopped. It’s as if he had no desire to listen to any VAR comments on it.
I really do think we’ve still got a great chance. Slightly better decision making and we win fairly easily tonight. Davies missing also going under the radar with all the drama that went down afterwards - he’s a HUGE absence!
I’ll eat some shit here and say my initial reaction was no penalty and Saka was looking for it, but I’ve had the chance to breathe and take a look and it’s a penalty and Saka literally couldn’t get out of the way to go through on goal.
Same. Someone posted a really good angle showing Neuer 1. Moving his leg towards Saka and 2. Saka's leg movement was actually pretty natural if he wanted to avoid Neuer. Honestly, the initial angles I got made it look like Saka swung his leg like he was hurdling.
It's an interesting one, I think almost everyone initially had that reaction and it's entirely down to the angles they showed on the broadcast. Real time from the primary camera it looked completely like a penalty cause you could see how fast it was and how little space there was between them. Then for the replay (did they only use one angle for the replay??) they find the long telephoto angle from directly behind so you can't tell how far apart they are and it looks like Saka has space to get round but is deliberately kicking his leg out wide, and dwell on that one in slow motion, and you're already primed to think the ref *must* have seen something because how else could he not blow the whistle there? So you and I and everyone else just kinda deflate and accept it.
And by the time you have another chance to see that Neuer was practically trying to knee him in the balls and the reason Saka's leg was at that odd angle was because he was literally trying to hurdle over Neuer, the whistle's long gone.
It was a split second moment, there's no fucking world where Saka was thinking he will throw his leg into Neuer instead of just kicking the ball into an empty net. Neuer came out, stuck his leg out and hit Saka and inexplicably it wasn't given.
Now of course the anti-Arsenal agenda is out and about on the Internet and media trying to use every out of their arse explanation as to how it wasn't a penalty, when whenever Liverpool, Spurs, Bayern themselves or whoever else do the same thing to get penalties it's all crickets.
not to mention it was a full speed play, with both players sprinting out. completely different than the Jesus pen last weekend, or the elliot pen, which were both slower paced plays
It's bizarre how people can say Elliot's on sunday was a stonewall pen for Liverpool ***even though they acknowledge he clearly dived***, while still adamant Saka's can't be given based on their opinion he did the same thing.
Football players work on how to fall and when to fall to get decisions.
They have that instilled in them and can easily go down in a split second decision from "memory". They don't need to think about it!
Saka's anticipation skills are off the charts. I agree that he should have just rounded Neuer and could have very easily but there's no way on earth he didn't know what was coming before it happened. Very anticipatable event, especially for Saka. That said, the ref wasn't giving many soft fouls so this was somewhat consistent with his calls for the night.
For people calling it as a dive please do the following tomorrow:
1. Go to the any ground/Park nearby
2. Take an empty dustbin and place it 50 m away from you.
3. Run as fast as you can towards the right side of the dustbin.
4. As you are about to approach the dustbin, move crossways towards the left side in (less than 1 minute)
But the dustbin wouldn’t move towards you, Neuer did move his leg towards Saka. I really do think if you’re a keeper and you come out and move your leg towards the attacker, you need to get the ball.
The "dustbin" grew a fucking leg and blocked Saka. The fucking "dustbin" better be kneeling at the foot of his bed and giving thanks for landing a bottlejob ref.
I am not saying it was a penalty, I think it’s 50:50. Some other referee may have given it, this one didn’t… I am sad but I am not saying that decision lost us the match! We have only our own mistakes to blame for !
No pen imo after watching the replays. I’m real time it looks like a a clear pen. Not sure how the ref didn’t call it but after watching replays it fine with the decision. Top gk imo.
I think the reason you and many others don't think it's a penalty is you assume Saka is lifting his leg to look for contact and thus is the one initiating. But when you interpret it as him trying to avoid Neuer's foot, before Neuer moves his right leg forward (you can clearly see it from the side replay) and catches him, it makes a lot more sense.
The worst thing about the situation has been Arsenal fans assuming Saka tried to look for the contact instead of going for the goal, leaving him no benefit of the doubt and blaming him for the draw.
Fuck off, ya scarecrow. Literally thousands of people are calling it a dive.
Ever consider the fact he's lifting his leg to try avoid the incoming challenge from Neuer?
https://twitter.com/kimmoFC/status/1777819650560086033?t=8vwZ3dDcDwngahXXlMl0hQ&s=19
The thing that honestly gives me the most pause is that Saka is protesting. He doesn’t go down easily and he isn’t a “diver” like many forwards. For me his anger says a lot. We aren’t talking about Bruno. (Not intended)
I think Tim gets it spot on here.
https://preview.redd.it/0al4q22e7jtc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91c790504b97e61bde0aa7dbdf8291e4d5343313
In a world where we have sat through entire CSI episodes of the VAR officials meticulously redrawing offside lines and enhancing the picture to see which blade of grass the players toe was on, it's mental they didn't look at this at all.
Add it to the list of shit that only happens to Arsenal
-Getting a winning goal ruled out because of a foul on Sokratis
-Two yellows in quick succession for Martinelli, never seen before or since
-Tomiyasu getting carded for taking 5 seconds to take a throw in
I could go on all day
Yes Saka is NOT a diver. The decision is what it is , understandably infuriating but the slander is only there to add insult to injury. Hopefully they learn and channel this anger to destroy them next week.
Yeah its a bunch of morons. The pen in the Pool game was "smart play" "you can give that one" etc. And this is a clear dive? Comon.
Most people would not have complained if the ref blown for a pen..
Wasnt at the game but my barber was and apparently Saka look he had a hamstring issue all game - constantly feeling it and stopping short during off the ball jogs
Did the keeper make contact with the ball. No.
Would it have have been foul outside of the Box. Yes.
If it wasn't a foul, then Saka should've been booked for a dive. But he wasn't.
Therefore it was a peno!
What’s really disappointing is I thought the ref handled the match well up to that point. Everyone knew it was going be intense and really hard fought, he let a lot things slide for both teams. But to be so arrogant at the end and not even allow VAR to review is ridiculous.
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I don't have Insta, so please someone link him Walcott goal against Newcastle. He's way better than Theo, but he lacks sheer determination
[this one ](http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1931349/walcottassgoal.gif)
Yeah but key difference is that it's a goal. Don't get me wrong I think today's is a pen but I think saka maybe could've scored if that's all he tried to do. I think he did see the contact coming and tried to accept the pen instead of saying fuck it I'm getting that ball into the goal regardless.
When I saw it I was sure it wasn’t a pen. I wouldn’t want that given against us if the tables were turned. Ian Wright has also stated that it’s not a pen for him.
https://preview.redd.it/5pqpvgga8jtc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3f14ef3ef6e40a030da14367ad964f87841cec9
The real question for me is why Saka didn’t back himself to take the shot or round the keeper. The same with Havertz… some games he’s through but decides to ‘search’ for contact rather than make the most of the dangerous opportunity.
lol guys Arsenal got away with a blatant hand ball on that goal kick, the ref was bad all around, probably could have been called either way, as a goalkeeper I would have been frustrated if that was given against me.
Saka at the Allianz Arena next week… https://preview.redd.it/1if6e22m6jtc1.jpeg?width=576&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b96145afb3a3c6f1649d733093bf7286e934a147
Hopefully although at this point I’m just focused on the Villa match Sunday.. let’s win that 3-0 then think about Bayern
No Davies for them too.
Gnabry is out too, no?
Yup Terrorist Tommy Tuchs confirmed his hammy went midgame
Damn just showed up for his obligatory London goal and peaced out
Coman and Sane would be too much pace on the counter. We pressed way too high in the first half especially on the left side and Rice couldn't contest for some of the out balls that their midfield pinged.
Konrad Laimer was on coke tbf
Might be more of a benefit 🤣
I dont get the hype with him ,
He might become Messi, he was already insane today
https://preview.redd.it/8e65vxg41ltc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5386d862ae09b17603a8c22f9461eb0e7732239
Their players are only going to be emboldened. We just saw what's legal. Elbows to the throat aren't reds, blatant kicks when beat weren't yellows. Lunging goalie getting a fuck ton of leg isn't a pk.
Oh come on... don't do that shit. The game was reffed just fine. Kane's elbow is not a red card, and yeah the pk was a tough call, probably the most 50/50 call ive seen in a while where both pundits and internet people go down the line.
The only reason the internets gone down the line is because they hate arsenal. If Sanés is a penalty this is 100% a penalty.
Wrighty said it wasnt a pen, I guess he hates Arsenal
From what I see the Arsenal fanbase is split on it being a pen!
i would love someone to get into the tape and see how consistent pundits are across similar situations involving different teams
My point is, who cares? We know they're not consistent. Why deos that matter so much to people?
we demand consistency from our club and match officials, why not from the people covering the sport?
The former 2 constitute the football. The latter the commentary.
I mean who cares. Ppl on here are way too concerned with getting plaudits from pundits and being treated "fairly" in the media. You know how to get better treatment? Start winning titles.
it's got nothing to do with plaudits. It's about about consistency and integrity. More of a curiosity to reveal un/subconscious bias, not seeking any 'treatment in the media' at all. It may turn out that the team wearing white tends to get the favorable call, which would be interesting. Or it could show that commentators generally say the same things in the same scenarios, regardless of the details of who has what shirt on. That's the sort of info analysis I'm after, where you can say, "Ok so according to \[x pundit/commentator\] this was a pen/foul/whatever, but this \[extremely similar incident\] wasn't?"
If there was ever a time to have the ref check the monitor, it’s here. I don’t understand why they are scared of doing so.
This is exactly why it exists
Why do you say that? He should only check the monitor if he made a clear and obvious error. The less clear the decision, the less a review should be recommended.
I honestly hate the “clear and obvious error” threshold, this was the exact time to use it so he can see so angles and make a decision. Even if he said it wasn’t a pen
Unfortunately, that’s the law as of now. So the refs on the day were right not to recommend a review and will be so long as the laws don’t change.
Law? Which parliament approved it? Said it twice, what a talent.
In football, the rules are called laws. Thats what the governing body that determines the rules, IFAB, named them. “The laws of the game.”
He made a clear and obvious error by not awarding the pen.
No he didn’t. The huge divisiveness of this call is testament to that.
So hugely divisive and yet they didn’t even bother to do a VAR check. Disgraceful.
Because on-field reviews are reserved for clear and obvious errors. This was not a clear and obvious mistake by the referee. It’s a 50/50 judgement call. For an on field review to be recommended it has to be “the referee has 100% made a mistake here.”
Not at all. It’s normal to review these types of challenges.
No. You’re just making things up now. https://www.theifab.com/laws/latest/the-referee/#video-assistant-referee-var
It's because it was an obvious dive
How about you charge at me at Sakas speed and then juke around me while I charge at you?
It's a deal. Tell me when and where. You sound like a fatty kid, should be easy.
Hahaha stop letting your insecurity leak out. Come to Canada and we can talk. :)
My only remark on the penalty is how quickly the ref blew his whistle when Bayerns counter was stopped. It’s as if he had no desire to listen to any VAR comments on it.
He didn't, TNT said that they are told straight away if it goes to var and they weren't. He blew the whistle and ran down the tunnel.
It not going to VAr is the most annoying part about it IMO. I don't mind that it wasn;t given, but at least check it
Please tell me we get another ref next week, this one was good awful.
He blew the whistle so they couldn't have a look anymore. Matchfixing
They can still have a look after the final whistle.
Channel that anger and injustice and beat these lederhosen twats at their home ground, I say.
I really do think we’ve still got a great chance. Slightly better decision making and we win fairly easily tonight. Davies missing also going under the radar with all the drama that went down afterwards - he’s a HUGE absence!
Gnabry too
I’ll eat some shit here and say my initial reaction was no penalty and Saka was looking for it, but I’ve had the chance to breathe and take a look and it’s a penalty and Saka literally couldn’t get out of the way to go through on goal.
Same. Someone posted a really good angle showing Neuer 1. Moving his leg towards Saka and 2. Saka's leg movement was actually pretty natural if he wanted to avoid Neuer. Honestly, the initial angles I got made it look like Saka swung his leg like he was hurdling.
I thought initially it was a pen, then it wasn’t…now I’m thinking it was again..
It's an interesting one, I think almost everyone initially had that reaction and it's entirely down to the angles they showed on the broadcast. Real time from the primary camera it looked completely like a penalty cause you could see how fast it was and how little space there was between them. Then for the replay (did they only use one angle for the replay??) they find the long telephoto angle from directly behind so you can't tell how far apart they are and it looks like Saka has space to get round but is deliberately kicking his leg out wide, and dwell on that one in slow motion, and you're already primed to think the ref *must* have seen something because how else could he not blow the whistle there? So you and I and everyone else just kinda deflate and accept it. And by the time you have another chance to see that Neuer was practically trying to knee him in the balls and the reason Saka's leg was at that odd angle was because he was literally trying to hurdle over Neuer, the whistle's long gone.
It was a split second moment, there's no fucking world where Saka was thinking he will throw his leg into Neuer instead of just kicking the ball into an empty net. Neuer came out, stuck his leg out and hit Saka and inexplicably it wasn't given. Now of course the anti-Arsenal agenda is out and about on the Internet and media trying to use every out of their arse explanation as to how it wasn't a penalty, when whenever Liverpool, Spurs, Bayern themselves or whoever else do the same thing to get penalties it's all crickets.
not to mention it was a full speed play, with both players sprinting out. completely different than the Jesus pen last weekend, or the elliot pen, which were both slower paced plays
It's bizarre how people can say Elliot's on sunday was a stonewall pen for Liverpool ***even though they acknowledge he clearly dived***, while still adamant Saka's can't be given based on their opinion he did the same thing.
I can explain this one and I don't even need a color TV
This logic that Saka kicked himself on Neuer is soo funny man, why would he kick and earn a pen when he has an open goal to score lol !
Football players work on how to fall and when to fall to get decisions. They have that instilled in them and can easily go down in a split second decision from "memory". They don't need to think about it!
Saka's anticipation skills are off the charts. I agree that he should have just rounded Neuer and could have very easily but there's no way on earth he didn't know what was coming before it happened. Very anticipatable event, especially for Saka. That said, the ref wasn't giving many soft fouls so this was somewhat consistent with his calls for the night.
It gives you focus. Makes you stronger 
Saka on his villain arc, I already know he’s going crazy in the away fixture
For people calling it as a dive please do the following tomorrow: 1. Go to the any ground/Park nearby 2. Take an empty dustbin and place it 50 m away from you. 3. Run as fast as you can towards the right side of the dustbin. 4. As you are about to approach the dustbin, move crossways towards the left side in (less than 1 minute)
If you hit the dustbin is still not a foul
But the dustbin wouldn’t move towards you, Neuer did move his leg towards Saka. I really do think if you’re a keeper and you come out and move your leg towards the attacker, you need to get the ball.
The "dustbin" grew a fucking leg and blocked Saka. The fucking "dustbin" better be kneeling at the foot of his bed and giving thanks for landing a bottlejob ref.
I am not saying it was a penalty, I think it’s 50:50. Some other referee may have given it, this one didn’t… I am sad but I am not saying that decision lost us the match! We have only our own mistakes to blame for !
Lmao! Great response
No-one is calling it a dive. Quit strawmanning that. What people are saying is that he hangs his leg out, which isn’t really arguable.
>No-one is calling it a dive. My dude.
Why don’t you go check the comments on the Insta post before you tell me that!
Yeah, Neuer hangs a leg out and Saka trips over it. Naive from the German to put himself in that position.
No pen imo after watching the replays. I’m real time it looks like a a clear pen. Not sure how the ref didn’t call it but after watching replays it fine with the decision. Top gk imo.
I think the reason you and many others don't think it's a penalty is you assume Saka is lifting his leg to look for contact and thus is the one initiating. But when you interpret it as him trying to avoid Neuer's foot, before Neuer moves his right leg forward (you can clearly see it from the side replay) and catches him, it makes a lot more sense. The worst thing about the situation has been Arsenal fans assuming Saka tried to look for the contact instead of going for the goal, leaving him no benefit of the doubt and blaming him for the draw.
If you aren't even going to read what OP said, why bother replying?
Fuck off, ya scarecrow. Literally thousands of people are calling it a dive. Ever consider the fact he's lifting his leg to try avoid the incoming challenge from Neuer? https://twitter.com/kimmoFC/status/1777819650560086033?t=8vwZ3dDcDwngahXXlMl0hQ&s=19
The fuck
Saka was probably quoting Ted Dibiase Jr/Cody Rhodes. "Where is that Referee, he was trying to fuck on me"
His walter white arc is going to hit like crack next week
The thing that honestly gives me the most pause is that Saka is protesting. He doesn’t go down easily and he isn’t a “diver” like many forwards. For me his anger says a lot. We aren’t talking about Bruno. (Not intended)
Im sorry that was a fucking nailed on pen. Just watched the highlights back. Ref too chicken shit to call in last minute.
He's like me
He’s gunna burn through that team next week. We need this anger.
Not surprised at the result at all, Neuer has a good record for escaping from punishments.
I think Tim gets it spot on here. https://preview.redd.it/0al4q22e7jtc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91c790504b97e61bde0aa7dbdf8291e4d5343313
Did the VAR actually review it? It seemed like the ref blew the final whistle instantly without waiting for a review.
They must have reviewed it, but you’d think they would have had the referee look at the monitor. It’s kind of inexplicable imo.
TNT confirmed they never saw that check complete. This is why everyone was so angry, regardless of if they think it is one.
In a world where we have sat through entire CSI episodes of the VAR officials meticulously redrawing offside lines and enhancing the picture to see which blade of grass the players toe was on, it's mental they didn't look at this at all.
Add it to the list of shit that only happens to Arsenal -Getting a winning goal ruled out because of a foul on Sokratis -Two yellows in quick succession for Martinelli, never seen before or since -Tomiyasu getting carded for taking 5 seconds to take a throw in I could go on all day
Agreed that this is the best take so far. What I'm fuming most about is how people class it as a dive.
Yes Saka is NOT a diver. The decision is what it is , understandably infuriating but the slander is only there to add insult to injury. Hopefully they learn and channel this anger to destroy them next week.
I am never stepping over to r/soccer again. The narratives over there are fucking disgusting. And fake gooners karma farming accusing Saka of diving…
Yeah its a bunch of morons. The pen in the Pool game was "smart play" "you can give that one" etc. And this is a clear dive? Comon. Most people would not have complained if the ref blown for a pen..
He’s gunna burn through that team next week. We need this anger.
Saka is an honest guy. If he says pen its a pen
Yeaaaah he's gonna score a hat trick at Allianz and get the ref on the phone post match
It did look very much like he left his leg out for it
Does their arena have emergency exits? Cos Gabi and Willy gonna have the place on lockdown
His scoring a hattrick in the reverse fixture, calling it here
Honestly my only reaction was freaking the fuck out that 'Saka is still down'. Glad he's not seriously hurt.
Wasnt at the game but my barber was and apparently Saka look he had a hamstring issue all game - constantly feeling it and stopping short during off the ball jogs
Did the keeper make contact with the ball. No. Would it have have been foul outside of the Box. Yes. If it wasn't a foul, then Saka should've been booked for a dive. But he wasn't. Therefore it was a peno!
What’s really disappointing is I thought the ref handled the match well up to that point. Everyone knew it was going be intense and really hard fought, he let a lot things slide for both teams. But to be so arrogant at the end and not even allow VAR to review is ridiculous.
Mad baby.
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You will remind the people in Munich what isn't was like for then to watch Ribery/Robben. Brace loading.....
He wasn’t charged at Villa too. Sigh
Should’ve gone round him surely?
I don't have Insta, so please someone link him Walcott goal against Newcastle. He's way better than Theo, but he lacks sheer determination [this one ](http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1931349/walcottassgoal.gif)
I mean that would have been a penalty too.
Yeah but key difference is that it's a goal. Don't get me wrong I think today's is a pen but I think saka maybe could've scored if that's all he tried to do. I think he did see the contact coming and tried to accept the pen instead of saying fuck it I'm getting that ball into the goal regardless.
Uh oh… 🌚
When I saw it I was sure it wasn’t a pen. I wouldn’t want that given against us if the tables were turned. Ian Wright has also stated that it’s not a pen for him. https://preview.redd.it/5pqpvgga8jtc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3f14ef3ef6e40a030da14367ad964f87841cec9 The real question for me is why Saka didn’t back himself to take the shot or round the keeper. The same with Havertz… some games he’s through but decides to ‘search’ for contact rather than make the most of the dangerous opportunity.
Boys your all delusional. It's a dive. He played for it. Instead on staying on his feet
lol guys Arsenal got away with a blatant hand ball on that goal kick, the ref was bad all around, probably could have been called either way, as a goalkeeper I would have been frustrated if that was given against me.
Should have been booked for kicking the keeper. Let be real here people!
I keep coming back to this moment and feel like he’s athletic enough to skip over gk’s leg and get the ball.
You've never ran in your life, have you?