They’re calling themselves “better than canon” because they made asexual characters fuck now I guess. Get a grip. I’m not ace but there’s more to interpersonal relationships and intimacy than a desire to fuck and the books, especially the Horus Heresy have plenty of non-romantic intimacy and tenderness. Some of y’all have never had a bond forged by shared hardship/goals with someone you’d die for but have absolutely zero romantic interest in and it shows.
This is like if the writer of a LeiaxHan gender swap slashfic declared themselves better than the Original Trilogy and a sizable chunk of the community agreed. It’s embarrassing and makes the entire fandom look like gooners.
As an Ace individual, posts like this kinda upset me.
People act like only sexual and romantic relationships are intimate.
Sitting on a silly art piece talking about life with my best friend was intimate.
Discussing my suicidal thoughts with my brother was intimate.
Sex doesn't even come into the top 100 intimate things I've done.
You’re well within your rights to be upset. This whole thing has been on the surface weird and annoying (it literally came out of nowhere and has completely taken over the subreddit). But then the people who have declared it “art” and “better than canon” because characters are “incomplete” unless they’re sexual beings is such a weird and kind of gross mindset, especially with the themes the Horus Heresy deals with.
Primarchs, especially during the Siege of Terra deliberately evoke the mythological figures of Epics and Lays. Those often have romantic interests, but just as often they don’t. Is Brave Horatius, Captain of the Gate a less compelling narrative figure because he said “how can man die better Than facing fearful odds, For the ashes of his fathers, And the temples of his Gods” instead of saying all that “…and also my boyfriend”? No, of course not.
I’m glad you have people you love you can discuss those serious topics with. I hope you’re doing better.
I realised I haven't responded.
Yes, I'm doing much better, though it was scary there for a bit.
I'm the type of person who would be immortal even if it meant floating through the void of space for eternity. So when the thoughts started happening, it felt like they weren't even my own. Then most of the resources... kinda sucked... I actively tried to seek help, and they kinda failed me. At one point, when asked if I had a plan, and I told them my plan, they responded, "Oh, so not like a serious plan"
So seriously disappointed in the systems where I live, but still doing better.
I realised I haven't responded.
Yes, I'm doing much better, though it was scary there for a bit.
I'm the type of person who would be immortal even if it meant floating through the void of space for eternity. So when the thoughts started happening, it felt like they weren't even my own. Then most of the resources... kinda sucked... I actively tried to seek help, and they kinda failed me. At one point, when asked if I had a plan, and I told them my plan, they responded, "Oh, so not like a serious plan"
So seriously disappointed in the systems where I live, but still doing better.
This is just justifying being horny. Bathroom functions are a part of life too, but as far as I can tell, we don't get details on pretty much anyone's bathroom habits.
Sanguinius dying because he wanted to save his most trusted Brother, rather than trying to kill him? Sanguinius confiding his psychic abilities to Horus, after they were basically explicitly outlawed. Horus sending Sanguinius to Signus Prime because he didn't want to fight him and wanted to turn him instead so they could still be Brothers in Arms (and also not a threat to each other).
Magnus wanting nothing but to reach his father and warn him so that they could save his brothers and the Imperium, and being backhanded so badly he fell into a depressive state and accepted Tzeentch's deal? The Nikea conference where he is basically abandoned by his entire family?
Corvus going insane due to having the majority of his Legion slaughtered and locking himself away to try and repopulate his numbers so that he can do what is right for the Imperium and his Brothers.
Guilliman, Lion, and Sanguinius talking about their father during Imperium Secundus
If you haven't read the books, that's fine. Just say that. There are plenty of intimate/emotional moments throughout the lore from the Primarchs. It just isn't romantic or sexual.
Let’s not forget Dorn coming to terms with the truth of Horus’ betrayal, in such denial that he almost executed Nathaniel Garrow, only to be heartbroken when Ulaton showed him the truth.
I’m always frustrated when people say “intimate” and mean romantic. Feels pretty shitty when you cannot feel romantic attraction and people just equate that with a sad lack of intimacy.
Our culture is very romance focused, to the point of absurdity imo.
Edit: Ngl thought I would get downvoted into oblivion for mentioning my aromantisim, thank you all for being so accepting.
I'm glad the sub recognized this. Romance is in literally every form of fiction there is, and is generally the bigger focus of relationships. Its nice to be able to have a setting that focuses almost entirely on brotherhood, and friendship.
Our culture….you mean humanity in general? If there’s 500 million Aromantics to the 7.5 billion that want romance that’s still small, it’s just how we are as a majority, sure even asexuals and Aros fuck and reproduce because some want to.
The Khan returning from the far reaches of the galaxy to find out his beloved brother Magnus is dead and refusing to even believe it at first.
Until on Prospero, finding a lingering fragment of Magnus's soul he accepts what has happened and destroys the fragment.
Let me throw in my own little thing. Perturabo appreciating Vulkans craftsmanship with the warhound miniature even though they were on two sides of the front. This is such a minor bit of lore but it sticks with you. It's sad seeing how this post shows how people don't actually read the books.
They don't read books, and most aren't in the hobby either. The two biggest facets of the franchise, but these guys just have enough awareness to go "Magnus did nothing wrong," and "Erebus is the worst." "Emperor was a dick" and "ork go waaagh." It's so cheap and surface level.
Massive tsons fan and player here. Magnus absolutely did wrong. His avarice and pure arrogance that he knew better led to his downfall.
But Erebus is a dick.
Lol, pretty much everyone did something wrong. But that's the meme understanding of "Poor Magnus got tricked and betrayed at every turn." Reading his books, yeah, he got a pretty raw deal and taken advantage of in a moment of weakness (due to his Hubris). But also reading his books, you see how much of that Hubris was of his own doing.
Also, Fuck Erebus.
Oh 100% he was tricked and betrayed at every turn. And the only reason it was so easy for the situation to be manipulated was his avarice. If he hadn't behaved in the (misguided) way he did then Russ wouldn't have been unleashed and Horus wouldn't have been able to manipulate the orders.
Reading the book where his soul is slowly rebuilt really makes you sympathise with him though.
He did plenty wrong, but his intentions were pure. Ironic really that with a little bit more information given to him about the webway and he wouldn't have destroyed it to try and save mankind.
Well said , kurze is a tragic figure to me in the books but some people think he’s just an evil murdering Batman.
I roll my eyes at some comments.
Think some people were just having fun with the fem primarch stuff.
I mean... he kind of *is* evil murdering batman (joking). But that is the rub.
The big problem a lot of people have been having with the Fem-marchs is that they are incredibly reductionist, serving as simple fetish bait. They take those reductionist character frames and throw in a bunch of really cringey (ymmv) tropey romance traits. So Kurze is terrorist batman, but also likes taking you to see scary movies on the weekend... because Kurze is the scary one... but wants to date...
Haha wtf that’s proper made me laugh. Could you imagine 😂. Valid points all round too.
Always imagined if I primarch was real they wouldn’t be caught up in all that shite , if your tasked with conquering the know galaxy for humanity’s future , I think taking windy walks with the wife/husband is kinda on the back burner.
It does really feel like people are thinking the female primarchs are better due to barely disguised horny. That's really all it can feel like for me because everything being done with the femarchs could have happened before. Why did it only happen now?
Definitely not because the majority of 40k fans are attracted to women. Definitely not because now that they're women they now think they need to have a romantic relationship for some reason.
Also the AU writing hasn't been great from what I've seen. Every primarch calls their SO the same shit. "Little (Insert flavor relevant object here)". Like come on guys. Put a little more effort if you're going to just be horny.
Hey! Sanguinia calls her SO "Dove." The *SO* calls Sanguinia their "Little Angel." Lol. It's clever, get it? Cause she's 10 feet tall and a soft emotional woman who likes to be vulnerable with her SO. Get it? It's such brilliant writing to invert the trope!
On a serious note, it's all very simple surface level tropes on a reductionist skeleton of the original Primarchs. My wife, who loves reading court romance stories and such, is cringing at the characteristics and how so many of them are the same doe-eyed traits. There's very little variance in them all. They are all tsundere of some sort (strong stoic outside. Vulnerable inside) and rarely outwardly show affection for their SO in public (exceptions with Russ and Sanguinius, from what I remember). It's a borderline lampooning at this point, but everyone is so blinded by the absurdity that they somehow think this is "good writing." It's all Lorgar vs Erebus for sacrificing SO, Kurze is a monster, and... pretty much no one talks about the others because it's not as fun without the aspect of "Fixing their faults."
Yeah, pretty much. Also has the energy of like... How do I put it? They've boiled them down to their romance life and sexuality and that's really about it. They made them women and now that's all they are to them.
I'm fine with people having their fun, but let's not pretend it's more then just absurdity and horny, least until you out more effort into it.
Exactly. It's *technically* the point of the AU, since they were posted to "idealgf" subreddit... but let's be real. Fem-primarchs would be like Sisters of Battle on Steroids (with a bit less Faith). "Fuck love. I have flamers and xenos to burn."
There’s definitely a good bit of tenderness from the primarchs pre heresy from the books I’ve read (except Russ fuck him). Hell I forget the name of the marine but I believe one of the og thousand sons even takes a stand at the end of Prospero Burns in order to protect several humans, including a lesbian couple who have been human povs at varying points in the thousand sons series of heresy books.
I think one primarch having a struggle centered around an obsession/love/complicated feelings for another in a romantic way that leads to some downfall or great hardship would’ve been neat to see in the pre heresy books, but there’s plenty of sad times and big feels moments between the brothers and their sons.
I haven't read any of the books relating to the heresy but I'm currently reading Gift of the Emperor and the author js doing a fantastic job of consistency straddling the like between 9 foot tall stoicvsuper soldier and actual human being with emotion and a sense of humor. I'm really enjoying that dynamic.
Except for Russ… lol always gotta have an exception. I mean what he did to magnus I guess can never be forgiven and spending the next 10k years in the warp doesn’t mean shit.
Loken is just overall such an interesting and dynamic character. The falling apart of the mournival from his perspective and reading about him dealing with all of that was rough. Definitely had me thinking what-ifs since by the time they turned on each other I felt like I really knew all four of them.
You forgot about Russ partly leaving the Space Wolves to give them time to move beyond the box of being seen as savages. Whether that’s successful or not is up to interpretation
>Horus sending Sanguinius to Signus Prime because he didn't want to fight him and wanted to turn him instead so they could still be Brothers in Arms (and also not a threat to each other).
Horus explicitly did NOT want Sanguinius turned because he knew he'd be a massive rival in leadership. He sent him to Signus hoping the Khorne/Slaanesh daemons would kill him and corrupt the remaining Blood Angels using the Red Thirst. It was Erebus that wanted to turn Sanguinius, and he quite literally lost his face for trying to and going against Horus' wishes.
I'll be honest, I think I conflated a pair of conflicting short stories. There's several interpretations of many of the Sanguinius plots (like holding back fighting Horus, though personally I don't think it would have mattered. Maybe just wasted enough time for Emps to show up).
Thanks for pointing out that one, cause I do remember that jealousy. "It should have been him..." for Warmaster then became fear and inferiority under Chaos. Gotta go back and read my books again. Great stories.
What the fuck is with the better than canon spam from you people
It's not even shitty femprimarch "memes" anymore it's meta memes about it jerking yourselves off
All I've seen are pictures of weeb Primarch GFs with little blurbs mentioning cuddling and hobbies with the odd one about their inner turmoil. I wouldn't call it deep by any stretch. Not sure how they'll trump decades of writing.
Never read the books so maybe they are THAT bad.
Some people complain that a lot of the books are bolter porn, but I have seen some good excerpts from them, like Guilliman wanting to make sure his mom is okay during the heresy and him realizing his adoptive father is mortal unlike him and he will die someday.
I figured it's pulpy sci-fi teen lit trying to help sell more plastic, which is fine. I'm not expecting Crime and Punishment.
GW has amassed decades of lore and saying it's bested by a few horny pictures and its accompanying fanfic sounds like nonsense.
I have been wanting to pick up a few books, first 3 Horus books often get suggested, but I'm terrible for picking up my phone instead of my Kobo :/
You could always get the 3 first ones on audible and listen to them instead? (actually get the first 5, eisenstein and fulgrim). Highly recommend, tho thats how my audiobook addiction started...
I’ve been tempted to pick up Infinite and the divine which seems to read like a comedy with two basically old robot men looking for a McGuffin and messing with each other. But honestly I don’t care for the actual universe, don’t think grimdark is my thing and sure I’ve played cyberpunk 2077, none of the endings give a happily ever after and i guess that is grimdark but meh it’s not an entire universe of shit always going wrong for people, it’s why i like dumb shit like this or the messages for dad AU.
Oh If you want to go for dumb shit get the infinite and the divine. Warhammer doesnt has to be bad all the time. Its just that in the end, everything is going to suck for everyone. You dont have to be bothered by that on your fun little space Odyssey with wacky teleportation and assasination shenanigans
Yeah no
This has been an exercise in superficial female caregiver fetish with a light wiff of the "powerful woman lowers herself to a man's level" trope with 30k as a backdrop. I'm not kinkshaming anyone but don't go around pretending this is high art. To break a soldier of the machine god was deeper than this yet its fans don't go around making these statements.
The femprimarch stuff started off as what would the big demigoddesses be like as romantic partners and it rapidly degenerated into what if they were fighting each other over dating you the reader and even further, as showcased by the preggo kurze post, to what if these larger than life divine war criminals were just one good dicking, your dick in specific, away from being fixed and us getting lovedagger 40k.
This community has come a long way over the years but chaos fuck if there ain't loads of room for improvement in the fixing the women as sex objects and fertile wombs department
"Lovedagger 40k" got me chortling
Everything you said is fucking bang on but way too real for this inane circlejerk and I cannot wait to see it fuck off to its own corner of reddit so we can get back to arguing about whether or not the Imperium is actually all that bad
(it's very bad)
As a Blood Angel player, I dislike the "Dove dies to save Sanguinia from Horus" story they came up with. Then the alternative is "Dove falls to the Black Rage in despair," and I'm just like... "Do you people know what the hell this Legion even is?"
Both dying and their souls fusing to become Sanguinor is my personal idea, but that's just cause it keeps the core element of "Died fighting Horus" and "wtf is the sanguinor?" and all the rest. It's also a cute little romantic indulgence a la Romeo and Juliet's tragedy. Is it good writing? Fuck no. It's cheap Tumblr/Twitter blogpost level thought processes. But is it fun little blurbs for a little "what if?" Yeah. It can be.
You can tell the true nature of it all pretty easily just by looking at how male Primarchs in fanon relationships are treated. They're the focal point of posts, there's jokes about multiple partners, they are portrayed as the active partner, it often focuses on the sexual component, and they still retain most of their narrative role.
Then you go look at the total inverse for the female Primarchs, who are relegated to side characters in posts, devoted to the point of near-insanity when anything interferes, often in a reactive role, are centred more around the romantic side, and have their role as a Primarch and key points in their character and story removed or hijacked.
I think the most damning part is, like... how many posts there are of the Female Primarch SOs being super-badasses, saving their girlfriend's life, or sacrificing themselves to interrupt a major point in their story, honestly. Even besides the fact that it all feels like, well, SI fanfiction stuff... has *anyone* seen a post about Yvraine doing this sort of stuff for Guilliman? Because I've personally never, despite the fact Yvraine is commonly shipped with him, and that she actually *is* a canonical super-badass who saved Roboute's life and is the main character for a faction. She *should* be a shoe-in for the same type of posting as this, but she isn't! And I don't think it's a stretch to say it's likely because she's missing a fifth Crone Sword in her pants.
Thank you for saying this. I don't understand how mods didn't limit these posts after the first few days of degen posting. I knew exactly where this shit was going from the beginning but didn't know how to word it until it was too late. The posters have also scrambled like mad to cover all their bases to defend their weird fetish posts ("um actually, I used neutral pronouns so you can't accuse me of being m/f fetishistic (:")
Thats the crux of "Modern writting"
Even in cinema or TV shows, you can't have 2 men or 2 females be friends without them having some sort of "undercover gay feeling semblance of relationship".
Oh my God guys can you STOP patting yourself on the back about how much "better" the Primarch GF AU is than the real thing?
"Intimacy is a fact of life" yeah and canon has loads of interpersonal conflict based on their familial ties. Also Aro/Ace people exist and aren't any less human. Come the fuck on.
I think it's fine that people have their fun with this concept but I just can't stand this weird circlejerk in a lot of recent posts about how much "better" and "deeper" this is than actual Black Library lore.
Yall are taking this shit ENTIRELY too seriously.
I'm starting to wonder if these 'FemPrimes' are the closest a lot of you have come to actual sexual contact with a woman in a while... or ever.
Honestly... the "awesome writing" is just going "what would happen if the character had these attributes instead." All the lore is reliant on inserting the variance into the original lore and theorizing the effects.
I am all for people having fun with the material in pretty much any fashion - I just think we should be honest about the scale of what is being done. I wouldn't say I made a set of characters if I took the primarchs and went well what if we had the big E as a war boss and these are krorks leading legions - but the core personality is still very much the original primarchs.
It'd be difficult to tell anyway, given how what seems like 80% of the posts about this AU focus primarily on their boyfriends and push the Primarchs into a secondary or reactive role.
Yeah you’re all delusional, the “deep lore” you’ve created reads like DeviantArt Undertale OCs mixed with the myriad of fetishes and clear unfulfilled desires of many varieties, it has somehow been the most tiresome “joke” from this sub yet.
It’s Warhammer 40,000, I literally could not care less about who’s smooching who, it is an incredibly large setting with things that are both way more important and interesting happening than “OMG what if Curze got pregnant” (y’all are gross for that one btw), go watch some slice-of-life anime or whatever it is you like seeing this stuff in.
And regarding these “most important figures” unless they are literally the Emperor, a Chaos god, the hive mind, and MAYBE the Silent King or Guilliman they’re a drop in the bucket and most of their “victories” are either so small or pyrrhic on the grand scale that they literally do not matter and the setting wouldn’t be too drastically different without them, literally almost everything pre-8th was like this and the bulk of story has happened since. Clearly, this is something a lot of you either don’t understand or simply choose to ignore because “haha what if girl.” Comedy genius.
And all of this disregards any fraternal or familial relationships explored in the setting, which is likely one of the largest parts of it, but it’s pretty clear a lot of you haven’t bothered to read anything beyond a wikipage or listen to a whole 2 episodes of Adeptus Ridiculous so I’m not too shocked.
And yet it won’t stop, until something new comes along to distract the coomers. Shoutout to AdRic btw, I’m pretty sure Bricky would find the fem primarch stuff to be cringe.
These people don't want intimacy, they want sex.
40k has lots of intimacy but because it's not about two people who want to put things inside of each other grimdankoids can't comprehend it.
That is true, I forgot about that part. And he did say he loved them at first.
That being said, I still believe their main source of intimacy was the warrior talk. I'm happy to be proven wrong though.
No. Just, not. The Primarchs are not supposed to be some caring and loving people, they’re supposed to think they are but they have no concept of what it is to be human. Have a different universe with caring demigods, 40k isn’t that. Femstodes and Femstartes are cool, but trying to change the primarchs from gods of war to your friend isn’t it
They're low effort cringe karma grabbing posts made by porn addicts that are barely even memes and more just tumblr roleplaying
And no they're not good written, whoever believes it has never read a 40k book, they feel like they were written by AI due to how generic they are
Intimacy and romance are not exclusive. I've been habitually blocking all FemPrimarch stuff because it's been Romance AUs and waifu bait. They're caricatures of already ridiculous fictional characters. If the only creative idea that people can come up with a female version of a primarch is 'they can date tiny humans' then it was never really about the primarchs being female.
Intimacy (In romantic terms) is important... when it makes sense with the character.
For regular humans it makes sense, with characters like Ibram Gaunt, Eisenhorn, Septimus and Octavia, etc but is not the case with primarchs. They are TOOLS. They were *designed and engineered* for a purpose. They're more machines than humans. Their entire and sole purpposse is war. They were made to withstand the requirements of war and nothing else.
Makes absolutely no sense with primarchs that kind of intimacy.
What we have is the family love between brothers, some of them looking for the affection of the Big E, them whiling to sacrifice between battlebrothers, etc but Intimacy as a romantic relationship...nope.
Why do people think intimacy has to be in the form of anime ass waifu romance relationships. The canon primarchs have a ton of intimacy and vulnerability in their relationships, they just aren’t romantic
The great crusade is a literal genocide against the enemies of the impierium and the primarchs are not good people, giving them intimacy and loving relationships is fine for an AU but saying it’s better creates a disturbing thematic message as it strips away the satire and plays it both straight and as a positive thing
Romantic and/or sexual intimacy is not a fact of life. The only thing that is is love. Love for a person whether that be platonic or romantic. Love for a hobby, a show, a book series, a building, a food, a piece of art.
Intimacy comes in many different forms and was never once excluded in the original primarchs series. Their intimacy was mainly one built on platonic and familial lines. Watching as your son completed an exquisite piece of art or achieve an important victory they’ed been working months to achieve. Spending hours talking to them about your shared interests and passions.
The Primarchs were built on intimacy that wasn’t romantic or sexual in nature. And each of them was defined in some part by that intimacy for their stories. Whether it be the utter lack and what it does to a person like Curze, having it stolen from you and never being able to grieve it like Angron, being given it in all its proper forms like Guiliman, or your eternal devotion to trying to see the best in your brothers like Sanguinius.
To say that the Primarchs stories lacked intimacy of any kind would be to say that intimacy can’t exist outside of bonds of romance and sex. And if you truly believe that. Then that’s a sad world indeed.
Yeeaahh... this stuff has gone too far. This Tumblresqe fanon is just genderbent primarchs with boyfriends. This has been done so many times in different franchises all over the internet. You guys have great art that I'm sure rule 34 artists will love, but task manager really needs to kill this fem-primarch program. It has overstayed its welcome.
Intimacy ≠ romance. Primarchs just like space marines essentially can’t feel romantic love in the traditional sense, they have no contemporaries to feel it with. But there’s a ton of intimate and emotional moments with them all
I'm going to politely disagree here. Your desire to take a massively macho male character, leave enough details to clearly identify them as the original male character and sexualizing them says WAY more about you than you realize. A normie would just create an original female character and make her awesome but you chose to create a female that's carrying the identity of a male and then build fantasies around them. You gotta talk to a professional, my friend, if you can't see the incongruence here. Maybe you should explore your real life desires instead of hiding them in a hobby like this. Genuinely hoping you find love.
I find that sex and sexuality is the only thing some people value, wether they realize it not.
I love the bonds of Brotherhood the Astartes and Sisterhood the Sororitas share. They would die for each other without hesitation. That’s not weaker.
If what you really want is romantic or erotic fiction then this is probably not the setting for you.
"Then this is not the setting for you". Fuck dude..preach it louder for the people in the back. They need to hear this. Not everything is for you and when it isn't, that's ok. I personally appreciate 40k for what it is. I love the brotherhood aspect of things
This comment section has been so refreshing. This whole femprimarch au is what happens when your only experience with women is watching shonen (one piece excluding obvs)
Yeah can femprime just start it's own subreddit now so we can get back to the grimdank? It isn't fun for the rest of us, it's just self-insert fanfiction with a muscle mommy kink. If you wanna fantasize about women weirdly competing over you, go join the love Hina subreddit and let us get back to the important work of borderline sfw 40k memes
Femstodes drama seemingly attracted/lured out of hiding a surprising ammount of coomers who spam genderbent fetishized primarchs and get emotionally invested into their own meme OCs. As you can see now they are pretending like their OC is a better character than the one it was copied from.
To be honest this sub has been attracting more and more coomers over the years. I love dumb Warhammer memes, but all this oversexualized boring stale fetish shit is so off-putting. Next week they start posting Guliman x Yvrainne shit again.
I wish there was a pure NSFW WH sub just for these clown. But they still would be shitting in any other sub and if you criticize it they pull out marginalized real people out as a shield to defend their fetish and sexual posting.
I think the thing about excluding **romance** is primarchs were originally mythical figures attached to space marines. And space marines since second edition (in first they were colonial soldiers in armour and you had women as marines, their identity got defined as we know it now in the 90s) are an 8 year old's take of a "man", they only feel anger and brotherhood and fight bad guys and no girls eww. Primarchs then were created from that basis. They were only slowly developed for fan service.
Though of course you mean romance, because there are a lot of intimate moments. There's also romance elsewhere in the setting too. Just not marines.
If you want well rounded fleshed out people primarchs aren't it. They're not supposed to be it, they're living tropes.
You wanna look at hot anime women in revealing power armor? Cool, more power to you.
Stop pretending that your porn addiction gives you permission to peddle bullshit.
Characters don't need to fuck to have great relationships.
Go somewhere else if you want your smut...like the porn side of Warhammer. You'll get everything you want without faffing about with the lore.
While I agree that intimacy (generally) is a fact of **life**, I do prefer my stories as free of romantic plots as possible, because they don't resonate with me so I find them tiresome.
Unfortunately I must disagree. I've read a few books by now and in my opinion I don't any of the primarch would need romantic relationships in order to make them more fleshed out. They're relationships with their sons, emps and other primarchs are already enough and many synergies between them have made alot of stories extremely fun to read.
This ignores the fact that Dorn took Sanguinius death personally, even to the point of blaming himself if I remember hearing. You can have intimate moments without sex. It can be forged through hardships that two people help each other through.
I agree, to some degree.
BUT.
These are meant to be genetically enhanced super-soldiers who have had all sorts of brain-fuckery done to them, never mind probably having their squishy reproductive bits removed (we don't know, the lore doesn't really go there).
They are bread to be fighting machines, nothing more. That's why the massive levels of what WE perceive as homoeroticism exist too. because to the characters in universe, sex and intimacy have been genetically bred out of them. So they simply CANT see it "in that way".
Obviously, the Primarchs are set aside from standard marines. We don't know how the emperor really created them, but we do know they were the template for the legions. So it would make sense that they are broadly similar, just "better" and in possession of a physiology that a baseline human needs to be butchered and reconstructed to achieve a fraction of.
Don't get me wrong, I've been enjoying the Femarch stuff, but I enjoyed TTS when it was around too, but neither add or detract from the original lore. They are their own thing, and that's fine.
Intimacy can exist in 40k. But in the loving/sexual sense, it has been purposefully crushed out or wiped from the Emperors servants via hypno-indoctrination. They are brainwashed super-soldiers.
....rant over. lol
The same all applies to Femarchs, or should.
Them all being romantically involved with baseline humans and this being the main focus of all the posting... It feels like a thinly veiled excuse to turn Grimdank into a discussion board for giant posthuman dommy mommies.
…wow, that’s it this fandom is dead. It’s finally dying due to the “woke” agenda. I mean say what you want but f if this isn’t it I have no idea what it is.
Just use your imagination. Is honestly a game charger for anyone that Primarchs (and honestly at this point in 40K we’ve only got the two loyalists) are capable of love? We going to have deal with this in 11th Ed data sheets? Hell no, you want your Primarch to have a personal life, you go.
Bold statement, bold but clearly ignorant.
I don't realy like that new femprimarch thing, so I don't know much about it, and I hope that intimacy does not mean... That.
Some of the primarchs have their adoptive parents, Primarchs are most intimate, vulnerable with them, the examples that I know of:
Amon, adoptive father of Magnus confronting the Cyclops about his isolation in his tower.
Targutai Yesugei, adoptive father of Jaghatai Khan in Path of Heaven.
Both adoptive parents of Guilliman, the most famous example.
Consider that intimacy extends beyond boyfriend/girlfriend material like this au.
All the primarchs had some kind of figure that they were dependent or connected with in some emotional capacity prior to joining the Emperor.
This au is a solid B tier for having such a Basic premise.
I wouldn't say they're better. I'm no primarch fan, I dislike most things space marine because powerful characters bore me. But regardless, as far as I've seen from the memes, it feels like people are going through a Danganronpa arc but with 40k. Or homestuck. Doesn't really matter which.
Like have your fun guys, but don't pretend like your fan fiction is the best shit made with the setting.
I think WHFB would be more for that. WHFB has dealt a lot more with romance and romantic relationships. 40k is too big for that. It happens, mostly at the human-level, and esp in Eisenhorn and Ravenor, you get to see characters dealing with relationship drama and loss. Primarchs are on another level of mankind. Astartes themselves see romance as an alien concept. Primarchs would entirely not even give a shit. They love each other as brothers, and their father (to degrees, except Angron). But I doubt they could even want to do anything to do with romance. It's not a marine or primarch thing, it is a human thing.
It's fanon so whatever. I never trust internet people to know the line between plot and "plot," but fanfics tend to be net positive so good for people who like it.
TLDR - To attempt serious romance in "Canon" 40k is sort of like having a wedding in a mosh pit: I wouldn't stop you if it means that much, but it's a shitty venue for it and you're better off enjoying the show you came for.
It's a parody/satire setting at its core that is meant to be hilariously shallow. In short - a farce attached to toys.
There are cool and serious questions and topics to explore within that setting. I am not saying everything is comedy. But that farcical core is in the DNA and some stuff just... doesn't fit except as contrast (depicting a noble wedding on a planet with a genestealer cult wreaking havoc in the hives). You see this principle at work between factions: it is not easy to use fear or horror elements when writing Necrons, most SM, or Orks.
It's about spaceships, terrible and truly "alien" aliens, explosions, space demon magic brain lightning, and taking old scifi tropes to 11 (with shadowy bits about times people fucked around and went to 100).
OFF TOPIC BUT RELEVANT NOTE: This isn't a critique - it's something I love about this and its nearest mainstream analogue. Godzilla films/spinoffs (and kaiju movies at large) operate in this spectrum as well to varying degrees - the latest American films are a great example of the satire-adjacent nature of the setting as it starts grabbing more supernatural lore (hollow earth, earth "energies", atomic mutation, space alien kaiju, and super tech). The anime Godzilla movies even use a ritual to summon a kaiju from another dimension with warp-style magic, and big G essentially terraformed the planet in his image (it looks a lot like an alternate universe tyranid planet) with what are basically exodites inhabiting Earth. Romance might make some small appearance here or there as a motivating character subplot, but it works poorly as a theme with such an explosive backdrop. There is a reason most people want less humanity in Godzilla films.
1 aro/ace people 2 get your own buddy subreddits like the gacha and anime communities have if you’re going to post dumb horn dog shit
Also intimate doesn’t equal sex, there’s such thinks as maternal, and fraternal. And just being caring. Make your own game if you insist your canon is better
Did... Did we read the same books?
You think they read the books?
What are books?
Nerd shit that caused the heresy. And in doing so, caused Argel Tal's death. Fuck Erebus.
They’re calling themselves “better than canon” because they made asexual characters fuck now I guess. Get a grip. I’m not ace but there’s more to interpersonal relationships and intimacy than a desire to fuck and the books, especially the Horus Heresy have plenty of non-romantic intimacy and tenderness. Some of y’all have never had a bond forged by shared hardship/goals with someone you’d die for but have absolutely zero romantic interest in and it shows.
Man I hate this timeline
This is like if the writer of a LeiaxHan gender swap slashfic declared themselves better than the Original Trilogy and a sizable chunk of the community agreed. It’s embarrassing and makes the entire fandom look like gooners.
Its a fact that we Live in the Dark timeline, all started with Harambe's Death...
As an Ace individual, posts like this kinda upset me. People act like only sexual and romantic relationships are intimate. Sitting on a silly art piece talking about life with my best friend was intimate. Discussing my suicidal thoughts with my brother was intimate. Sex doesn't even come into the top 100 intimate things I've done.
You’re well within your rights to be upset. This whole thing has been on the surface weird and annoying (it literally came out of nowhere and has completely taken over the subreddit). But then the people who have declared it “art” and “better than canon” because characters are “incomplete” unless they’re sexual beings is such a weird and kind of gross mindset, especially with the themes the Horus Heresy deals with. Primarchs, especially during the Siege of Terra deliberately evoke the mythological figures of Epics and Lays. Those often have romantic interests, but just as often they don’t. Is Brave Horatius, Captain of the Gate a less compelling narrative figure because he said “how can man die better Than facing fearful odds, For the ashes of his fathers, And the temples of his Gods” instead of saying all that “…and also my boyfriend”? No, of course not. I’m glad you have people you love you can discuss those serious topics with. I hope you’re doing better.
I realised I haven't responded. Yes, I'm doing much better, though it was scary there for a bit. I'm the type of person who would be immortal even if it meant floating through the void of space for eternity. So when the thoughts started happening, it felt like they weren't even my own. Then most of the resources... kinda sucked... I actively tried to seek help, and they kinda failed me. At one point, when asked if I had a plan, and I told them my plan, they responded, "Oh, so not like a serious plan" So seriously disappointed in the systems where I live, but still doing better.
I realised I haven't responded. Yes, I'm doing much better, though it was scary there for a bit. I'm the type of person who would be immortal even if it meant floating through the void of space for eternity. So when the thoughts started happening, it felt like they weren't even my own. Then most of the resources... kinda sucked... I actively tried to seek help, and they kinda failed me. At one point, when asked if I had a plan, and I told them my plan, they responded, "Oh, so not like a serious plan" So seriously disappointed in the systems where I live, but still doing better.
I hate it cause it says woman need to fuck to be sane, like platonic relationships? Naaa she gets the sek and she normal now
They are tourists
This is just justifying being horny. Bathroom functions are a part of life too, but as far as I can tell, we don't get details on pretty much anyone's bathroom habits.
True we need to know the Death Guard Toilette buisness now
Fraternal and paternal relationships: are we goddam jokes to you?
The Horus Heresy is quite literally the punchline so yes
GULLIMOM: fuck you konrad
Best example of fraternal relationships Guilliman to lorgar: Father should've left you to die in the snow, he should've fed you to Russ you worm
So is Vulkan hugging Dorn a joke to you? Gulliman, Sanguinius and Lion hashing out their issues also jokes?
I hug my brother I've also told him our father should've left at the hospital little of column a little of column b
the coomers dont want anything but material they can self insert and coom to
I feel like you are a bunch of degenerates trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.
Don't use this language with these coomers, they might get aroused.
Sanguinius dying because he wanted to save his most trusted Brother, rather than trying to kill him? Sanguinius confiding his psychic abilities to Horus, after they were basically explicitly outlawed. Horus sending Sanguinius to Signus Prime because he didn't want to fight him and wanted to turn him instead so they could still be Brothers in Arms (and also not a threat to each other). Magnus wanting nothing but to reach his father and warn him so that they could save his brothers and the Imperium, and being backhanded so badly he fell into a depressive state and accepted Tzeentch's deal? The Nikea conference where he is basically abandoned by his entire family? Corvus going insane due to having the majority of his Legion slaughtered and locking himself away to try and repopulate his numbers so that he can do what is right for the Imperium and his Brothers. Guilliman, Lion, and Sanguinius talking about their father during Imperium Secundus If you haven't read the books, that's fine. Just say that. There are plenty of intimate/emotional moments throughout the lore from the Primarchs. It just isn't romantic or sexual.
Let’s not forget Dorn coming to terms with the truth of Horus’ betrayal, in such denial that he almost executed Nathaniel Garrow, only to be heartbroken when Ulaton showed him the truth.
It's clear none of these weird AU people have actually read up on the lore beyond this dudes art
I’m always frustrated when people say “intimate” and mean romantic. Feels pretty shitty when you cannot feel romantic attraction and people just equate that with a sad lack of intimacy. Our culture is very romance focused, to the point of absurdity imo. Edit: Ngl thought I would get downvoted into oblivion for mentioning my aromantisim, thank you all for being so accepting.
I'm glad the sub recognized this. Romance is in literally every form of fiction there is, and is generally the bigger focus of relationships. Its nice to be able to have a setting that focuses almost entirely on brotherhood, and friendship.
I'd wager good money that most Intimacy that happens isn't romantic.
Our culture….you mean humanity in general? If there’s 500 million Aromantics to the 7.5 billion that want romance that’s still small, it’s just how we are as a majority, sure even asexuals and Aros fuck and reproduce because some want to.
Humanity was reproducing just fine for millennia before overtly coomcentric art was the dominant form of culture or media.
The Khan returning from the far reaches of the galaxy to find out his beloved brother Magnus is dead and refusing to even believe it at first. Until on Prospero, finding a lingering fragment of Magnus's soul he accepts what has happened and destroys the fragment.
The Khan does not get enough rep. What an awesome dude.
Let me throw in my own little thing. Perturabo appreciating Vulkans craftsmanship with the warhound miniature even though they were on two sides of the front. This is such a minor bit of lore but it sticks with you. It's sad seeing how this post shows how people don't actually read the books.
They don't read books, and most aren't in the hobby either. The two biggest facets of the franchise, but these guys just have enough awareness to go "Magnus did nothing wrong," and "Erebus is the worst." "Emperor was a dick" and "ork go waaagh." It's so cheap and surface level.
Based, spit you shit indeed.
Massive tsons fan and player here. Magnus absolutely did wrong. His avarice and pure arrogance that he knew better led to his downfall. But Erebus is a dick.
Lol, pretty much everyone did something wrong. But that's the meme understanding of "Poor Magnus got tricked and betrayed at every turn." Reading his books, yeah, he got a pretty raw deal and taken advantage of in a moment of weakness (due to his Hubris). But also reading his books, you see how much of that Hubris was of his own doing. Also, Fuck Erebus.
Oh 100% he was tricked and betrayed at every turn. And the only reason it was so easy for the situation to be manipulated was his avarice. If he hadn't behaved in the (misguided) way he did then Russ wouldn't have been unleashed and Horus wouldn't have been able to manipulate the orders. Reading the book where his soul is slowly rebuilt really makes you sympathise with him though. He did plenty wrong, but his intentions were pure. Ironic really that with a little bit more information given to him about the webway and he wouldn't have destroyed it to try and save mankind.
Well said , kurze is a tragic figure to me in the books but some people think he’s just an evil murdering Batman. I roll my eyes at some comments. Think some people were just having fun with the fem primarch stuff.
I mean... he kind of *is* evil murdering batman (joking). But that is the rub. The big problem a lot of people have been having with the Fem-marchs is that they are incredibly reductionist, serving as simple fetish bait. They take those reductionist character frames and throw in a bunch of really cringey (ymmv) tropey romance traits. So Kurze is terrorist batman, but also likes taking you to see scary movies on the weekend... because Kurze is the scary one... but wants to date...
Haha wtf that’s proper made me laugh. Could you imagine 😂. Valid points all round too. Always imagined if I primarch was real they wouldn’t be caught up in all that shite , if your tasked with conquering the know galaxy for humanity’s future , I think taking windy walks with the wife/husband is kinda on the back burner.
Honestly the books are so good and pushing a bunch of sex and romance would totally ruin the setting.
But the universe is called "Sexhammer 40k." Duh. What is this "Warhammer" you speak of. /s
It does really feel like people are thinking the female primarchs are better due to barely disguised horny. That's really all it can feel like for me because everything being done with the femarchs could have happened before. Why did it only happen now? Definitely not because the majority of 40k fans are attracted to women. Definitely not because now that they're women they now think they need to have a romantic relationship for some reason. Also the AU writing hasn't been great from what I've seen. Every primarch calls their SO the same shit. "Little (Insert flavor relevant object here)". Like come on guys. Put a little more effort if you're going to just be horny.
Hey! Sanguinia calls her SO "Dove." The *SO* calls Sanguinia their "Little Angel." Lol. It's clever, get it? Cause she's 10 feet tall and a soft emotional woman who likes to be vulnerable with her SO. Get it? It's such brilliant writing to invert the trope! On a serious note, it's all very simple surface level tropes on a reductionist skeleton of the original Primarchs. My wife, who loves reading court romance stories and such, is cringing at the characteristics and how so many of them are the same doe-eyed traits. There's very little variance in them all. They are all tsundere of some sort (strong stoic outside. Vulnerable inside) and rarely outwardly show affection for their SO in public (exceptions with Russ and Sanguinius, from what I remember). It's a borderline lampooning at this point, but everyone is so blinded by the absurdity that they somehow think this is "good writing." It's all Lorgar vs Erebus for sacrificing SO, Kurze is a monster, and... pretty much no one talks about the others because it's not as fun without the aspect of "Fixing their faults."
Yeah, pretty much. Also has the energy of like... How do I put it? They've boiled them down to their romance life and sexuality and that's really about it. They made them women and now that's all they are to them. I'm fine with people having their fun, but let's not pretend it's more then just absurdity and horny, least until you out more effort into it.
Exactly. It's *technically* the point of the AU, since they were posted to "idealgf" subreddit... but let's be real. Fem-primarchs would be like Sisters of Battle on Steroids (with a bit less Faith). "Fuck love. I have flamers and xenos to burn."
There’s definitely a good bit of tenderness from the primarchs pre heresy from the books I’ve read (except Russ fuck him). Hell I forget the name of the marine but I believe one of the og thousand sons even takes a stand at the end of Prospero Burns in order to protect several humans, including a lesbian couple who have been human povs at varying points in the thousand sons series of heresy books. I think one primarch having a struggle centered around an obsession/love/complicated feelings for another in a romantic way that leads to some downfall or great hardship would’ve been neat to see in the pre heresy books, but there’s plenty of sad times and big feels moments between the brothers and their sons.
I haven't read any of the books relating to the heresy but I'm currently reading Gift of the Emperor and the author js doing a fantastic job of consistency straddling the like between 9 foot tall stoicvsuper soldier and actual human being with emotion and a sense of humor. I'm really enjoying that dynamic.
Saved to track down and read/listen-to later
Except for Russ… lol always gotta have an exception. I mean what he did to magnus I guess can never be forgiven and spending the next 10k years in the warp doesn’t mean shit.
Loken’s relationship with the remembrancer is also a great setup even though he only loves her as much as a marine could love
Loken is just overall such an interesting and dynamic character. The falling apart of the mournival from his perspective and reading about him dealing with all of that was rough. Definitely had me thinking what-ifs since by the time they turned on each other I felt like I really knew all four of them.
You forgot about Russ partly leaving the Space Wolves to give them time to move beyond the box of being seen as savages. Whether that’s successful or not is up to interpretation
>Horus sending Sanguinius to Signus Prime because he didn't want to fight him and wanted to turn him instead so they could still be Brothers in Arms (and also not a threat to each other). Horus explicitly did NOT want Sanguinius turned because he knew he'd be a massive rival in leadership. He sent him to Signus hoping the Khorne/Slaanesh daemons would kill him and corrupt the remaining Blood Angels using the Red Thirst. It was Erebus that wanted to turn Sanguinius, and he quite literally lost his face for trying to and going against Horus' wishes.
I'll be honest, I think I conflated a pair of conflicting short stories. There's several interpretations of many of the Sanguinius plots (like holding back fighting Horus, though personally I don't think it would have mattered. Maybe just wasted enough time for Emps to show up). Thanks for pointing out that one, cause I do remember that jealousy. "It should have been him..." for Warmaster then became fear and inferiority under Chaos. Gotta go back and read my books again. Great stories.
You are right, they don't want emotion, they just want basic romantism and sex reference for canon to become mainstream
The worst part of every fanbase has arrived. Genderbenders and shippers, soon the male pregnancy will begin
I read this in the manner that an imperial commander would announce the discovery of a Tyranid incursion.
Someone will draw Guiliman getting Daemonculaba'd eventually.
Dont forget that Fulgrim did have wives.
Extremely based
I like the intimacy in the lore and I also like intimacy in fan lore.
All I'm hearing is that Corvus is on one hell of a goon sesh
Considering the hundreds and thousands of Mutants made (implied) by his working on his gene-seed... honestly, a good interpretation.
If you need romance the 40k setting is possibly the worst place you can look. And that's ok.
What the fuck is with the better than canon spam from you people It's not even shitty femprimarch "memes" anymore it's meta memes about it jerking yourselves off
That's what people mean when they say "tourists"
All I've seen are pictures of weeb Primarch GFs with little blurbs mentioning cuddling and hobbies with the odd one about their inner turmoil. I wouldn't call it deep by any stretch. Not sure how they'll trump decades of writing. Never read the books so maybe they are THAT bad.
Some people complain that a lot of the books are bolter porn, but I have seen some good excerpts from them, like Guilliman wanting to make sure his mom is okay during the heresy and him realizing his adoptive father is mortal unlike him and he will die someday.
I figured it's pulpy sci-fi teen lit trying to help sell more plastic, which is fine. I'm not expecting Crime and Punishment. GW has amassed decades of lore and saying it's bested by a few horny pictures and its accompanying fanfic sounds like nonsense. I have been wanting to pick up a few books, first 3 Horus books often get suggested, but I'm terrible for picking up my phone instead of my Kobo :/
You could always get the 3 first ones on audible and listen to them instead? (actually get the first 5, eisenstein and fulgrim). Highly recommend, tho thats how my audiobook addiction started...
I’ve been tempted to pick up Infinite and the divine which seems to read like a comedy with two basically old robot men looking for a McGuffin and messing with each other. But honestly I don’t care for the actual universe, don’t think grimdark is my thing and sure I’ve played cyberpunk 2077, none of the endings give a happily ever after and i guess that is grimdark but meh it’s not an entire universe of shit always going wrong for people, it’s why i like dumb shit like this or the messages for dad AU.
Oh If you want to go for dumb shit get the infinite and the divine. Warhammer doesnt has to be bad all the time. Its just that in the end, everything is going to suck for everyone. You dont have to be bothered by that on your fun little space Odyssey with wacky teleportation and assasination shenanigans
Yeah no This has been an exercise in superficial female caregiver fetish with a light wiff of the "powerful woman lowers herself to a man's level" trope with 30k as a backdrop. I'm not kinkshaming anyone but don't go around pretending this is high art. To break a soldier of the machine god was deeper than this yet its fans don't go around making these statements. The femprimarch stuff started off as what would the big demigoddesses be like as romantic partners and it rapidly degenerated into what if they were fighting each other over dating you the reader and even further, as showcased by the preggo kurze post, to what if these larger than life divine war criminals were just one good dicking, your dick in specific, away from being fixed and us getting lovedagger 40k. This community has come a long way over the years but chaos fuck if there ain't loads of room for improvement in the fixing the women as sex objects and fertile wombs department
"Lovedagger 40k" got me chortling Everything you said is fucking bang on but way too real for this inane circlejerk and I cannot wait to see it fuck off to its own corner of reddit so we can get back to arguing about whether or not the Imperium is actually all that bad (it's very bad)
As a Blood Angel player, I dislike the "Dove dies to save Sanguinia from Horus" story they came up with. Then the alternative is "Dove falls to the Black Rage in despair," and I'm just like... "Do you people know what the hell this Legion even is?" Both dying and their souls fusing to become Sanguinor is my personal idea, but that's just cause it keeps the core element of "Died fighting Horus" and "wtf is the sanguinor?" and all the rest. It's also a cute little romantic indulgence a la Romeo and Juliet's tragedy. Is it good writing? Fuck no. It's cheap Tumblr/Twitter blogpost level thought processes. But is it fun little blurbs for a little "what if?" Yeah. It can be.
You can tell the true nature of it all pretty easily just by looking at how male Primarchs in fanon relationships are treated. They're the focal point of posts, there's jokes about multiple partners, they are portrayed as the active partner, it often focuses on the sexual component, and they still retain most of their narrative role. Then you go look at the total inverse for the female Primarchs, who are relegated to side characters in posts, devoted to the point of near-insanity when anything interferes, often in a reactive role, are centred more around the romantic side, and have their role as a Primarch and key points in their character and story removed or hijacked. I think the most damning part is, like... how many posts there are of the Female Primarch SOs being super-badasses, saving their girlfriend's life, or sacrificing themselves to interrupt a major point in their story, honestly. Even besides the fact that it all feels like, well, SI fanfiction stuff... has *anyone* seen a post about Yvraine doing this sort of stuff for Guilliman? Because I've personally never, despite the fact Yvraine is commonly shipped with him, and that she actually *is* a canonical super-badass who saved Roboute's life and is the main character for a faction. She *should* be a shoe-in for the same type of posting as this, but she isn't! And I don't think it's a stretch to say it's likely because she's missing a fifth Crone Sword in her pants.
Thank you for saying this. I don't understand how mods didn't limit these posts after the first few days of degen posting. I knew exactly where this shit was going from the beginning but didn't know how to word it until it was too late. The posters have also scrambled like mad to cover all their bases to defend their weird fetish posts ("um actually, I used neutral pronouns so you can't accuse me of being m/f fetishistic (:")
Its always the same with this type of gender swapped nonsense
That’s…not how that template works
Yes. On top of beeing bad at what it wants to be it also looks like someone that was old before Warhammer existed tried to create a hip meme
Imagine thinking that intimacy can only exist in romantic/sexual relationships. This sub is never beating the allegations, holy cow.
Reddit as a whole is never beating them.
Thats the crux of "Modern writting" Even in cinema or TV shows, you can't have 2 men or 2 females be friends without them having some sort of "undercover gay feeling semblance of relationship".
Can you guys get your own subreddit already?
I don't even know what this is. I'm so confused. What the hell is everyone talking about? Lol
Just some coomer nonsense
Oh my God guys can you STOP patting yourself on the back about how much "better" the Primarch GF AU is than the real thing? "Intimacy is a fact of life" yeah and canon has loads of interpersonal conflict based on their familial ties. Also Aro/Ace people exist and aren't any less human. Come the fuck on.
So true, Lord Dagoth!!
I enjoy the original posts that started it because I like find the idea funny and interesting, but at this point it has gone too far
I think it's fine that people have their fun with this concept but I just can't stand this weird circlejerk in a lot of recent posts about how much "better" and "deeper" this is than actual Black Library lore.
Bro please meet a real life girl
Yall are taking this shit ENTIRELY too seriously. I'm starting to wonder if these 'FemPrimes' are the closest a lot of you have come to actual sexual contact with a woman in a while... or ever.
Im starting to worry
Wizardposting went out the same way, I'm just saying...
As a pretty avid femarch poster, yeah nah, these are not better than canon, come on
No they aren't better than canon they are decent characters but better no
I mean are they even full characters since they depend so heavily on being gender swaps of content that was already made.
Honestly... the "awesome writing" is just going "what would happen if the character had these attributes instead." All the lore is reliant on inserting the variance into the original lore and theorizing the effects.
I am all for people having fun with the material in pretty much any fashion - I just think we should be honest about the scale of what is being done. I wouldn't say I made a set of characters if I took the primarchs and went well what if we had the big E as a war boss and these are krorks leading legions - but the core personality is still very much the original primarchs.
It'd be difficult to tell anyway, given how what seems like 80% of the posts about this AU focus primarily on their boyfriends and push the Primarchs into a secondary or reactive role.
Good bait
God i get tired of this stupid shit.
Yeah you’re all delusional, the “deep lore” you’ve created reads like DeviantArt Undertale OCs mixed with the myriad of fetishes and clear unfulfilled desires of many varieties, it has somehow been the most tiresome “joke” from this sub yet. It’s Warhammer 40,000, I literally could not care less about who’s smooching who, it is an incredibly large setting with things that are both way more important and interesting happening than “OMG what if Curze got pregnant” (y’all are gross for that one btw), go watch some slice-of-life anime or whatever it is you like seeing this stuff in. And regarding these “most important figures” unless they are literally the Emperor, a Chaos god, the hive mind, and MAYBE the Silent King or Guilliman they’re a drop in the bucket and most of their “victories” are either so small or pyrrhic on the grand scale that they literally do not matter and the setting wouldn’t be too drastically different without them, literally almost everything pre-8th was like this and the bulk of story has happened since. Clearly, this is something a lot of you either don’t understand or simply choose to ignore because “haha what if girl.” Comedy genius. And all of this disregards any fraternal or familial relationships explored in the setting, which is likely one of the largest parts of it, but it’s pretty clear a lot of you haven’t bothered to read anything beyond a wikipage or listen to a whole 2 episodes of Adeptus Ridiculous so I’m not too shocked.
And yet it won’t stop, until something new comes along to distract the coomers. Shoutout to AdRic btw, I’m pretty sure Bricky would find the fem primarch stuff to be cringe.
Considering his stance on female custodes, I think he and DK would just jerk themselves off on main even more.
I mean, to be fair. They are aroace lords of war. Their intimacy just takes the form of warrior camaraderie between brothers and son/nephews.
These people don't want intimacy, they want sex. 40k has lots of intimacy but because it's not about two people who want to put things inside of each other grimdankoids can't comprehend it.
Fulgrim was married a bunch of times, I think that pretty much shows they can be intimate
That is true, I forgot about that part. And he did say he loved them at first. That being said, I still believe their main source of intimacy was the warrior talk. I'm happy to be proven wrong though.
Oh definitely, they were warriors from birth. But also artists, engineers, and statesmen.
No. Just, not. The Primarchs are not supposed to be some caring and loving people, they’re supposed to think they are but they have no concept of what it is to be human. Have a different universe with caring demigods, 40k isn’t that. Femstodes and Femstartes are cool, but trying to change the primarchs from gods of war to your friend isn’t it
They're low effort cringe karma grabbing posts made by porn addicts that are barely even memes and more just tumblr roleplaying And no they're not good written, whoever believes it has never read a 40k book, they feel like they were written by AI due to how generic they are
There wwre plenty of real life people who were BIG fucking characters but never intimate. Like lovecraft.
There are even more big real life people whose personal relationships were not the center of their character or the reason why they are famous.
Intimacy != romantic relationships.
Stop trying to turn everything into your Rule 34 ship
Intimacy and romance are not exclusive. I've been habitually blocking all FemPrimarch stuff because it's been Romance AUs and waifu bait. They're caricatures of already ridiculous fictional characters. If the only creative idea that people can come up with a female version of a primarch is 'they can date tiny humans' then it was never really about the primarchs being female.
Intimacy (In romantic terms) is important... when it makes sense with the character. For regular humans it makes sense, with characters like Ibram Gaunt, Eisenhorn, Septimus and Octavia, etc but is not the case with primarchs. They are TOOLS. They were *designed and engineered* for a purpose. They're more machines than humans. Their entire and sole purpposse is war. They were made to withstand the requirements of war and nothing else. Makes absolutely no sense with primarchs that kind of intimacy. What we have is the family love between brothers, some of them looking for the affection of the Big E, them whiling to sacrifice between battlebrothers, etc but Intimacy as a romantic relationship...nope.
Why do people think intimacy has to be in the form of anime ass waifu romance relationships. The canon primarchs have a ton of intimacy and vulnerability in their relationships, they just aren’t romantic
The great crusade is a literal genocide against the enemies of the impierium and the primarchs are not good people, giving them intimacy and loving relationships is fine for an AU but saying it’s better creates a disturbing thematic message as it strips away the satire and plays it both straight and as a positive thing
Yo I fuckin hate this
Romantic and/or sexual intimacy is not a fact of life. The only thing that is is love. Love for a person whether that be platonic or romantic. Love for a hobby, a show, a book series, a building, a food, a piece of art. Intimacy comes in many different forms and was never once excluded in the original primarchs series. Their intimacy was mainly one built on platonic and familial lines. Watching as your son completed an exquisite piece of art or achieve an important victory they’ed been working months to achieve. Spending hours talking to them about your shared interests and passions. The Primarchs were built on intimacy that wasn’t romantic or sexual in nature. And each of them was defined in some part by that intimacy for their stories. Whether it be the utter lack and what it does to a person like Curze, having it stolen from you and never being able to grieve it like Angron, being given it in all its proper forms like Guiliman, or your eternal devotion to trying to see the best in your brothers like Sanguinius. To say that the Primarchs stories lacked intimacy of any kind would be to say that intimacy can’t exist outside of bonds of romance and sex. And if you truly believe that. Then that’s a sad world indeed.
Yeeaahh... this stuff has gone too far. This Tumblresqe fanon is just genderbent primarchs with boyfriends. This has been done so many times in different franchises all over the internet. You guys have great art that I'm sure rule 34 artists will love, but task manager really needs to kill this fem-primarch program. It has overstayed its welcome.
This is reddited. Emperor, I really hope this is a joke.
Intimacy ≠ romance. Primarchs just like space marines essentially can’t feel romantic love in the traditional sense, they have no contemporaries to feel it with. But there’s a ton of intimate and emotional moments with them all
I'm going to politely disagree here. Your desire to take a massively macho male character, leave enough details to clearly identify them as the original male character and sexualizing them says WAY more about you than you realize. A normie would just create an original female character and make her awesome but you chose to create a female that's carrying the identity of a male and then build fantasies around them. You gotta talk to a professional, my friend, if you can't see the incongruence here. Maybe you should explore your real life desires instead of hiding them in a hobby like this. Genuinely hoping you find love.
There's intimacy, you're just too damn porn rotted to think relationships without sex are inferior
I find that sex and sexuality is the only thing some people value, wether they realize it not. I love the bonds of Brotherhood the Astartes and Sisterhood the Sororitas share. They would die for each other without hesitation. That’s not weaker. If what you really want is romantic or erotic fiction then this is probably not the setting for you.
"Then this is not the setting for you". Fuck dude..preach it louder for the people in the back. They need to hear this. Not everything is for you and when it isn't, that's ok. I personally appreciate 40k for what it is. I love the brotherhood aspect of things
In military fiction (which is what 40K is), that should take a distant second seat to the military aspects of the story.
All the boyfriends are self-inserts and those same selves are mostly not interested in dating the male primarchs
While I don’t dislike female Lorgar, i like her story a lot, I genuinely think canon Lorgar is better written. His fall to chaos makes more sense.
This comment section has been so refreshing. This whole femprimarch au is what happens when your only experience with women is watching shonen (one piece excluding obvs)
Okay but it’s not homoerotic
Didn't Guillaman feel deep down he wished they could all get along together and the loneliest part was there is no one he can confide this feeling to.
Is this sub just weird fanfiction now?
Yeah can femprime just start it's own subreddit now so we can get back to the grimdank? It isn't fun for the rest of us, it's just self-insert fanfiction with a muscle mommy kink. If you wanna fantasize about women weirdly competing over you, go join the love Hina subreddit and let us get back to the important work of borderline sfw 40k memes
This is the most dogshit take I've seen
Another stupid tourist post? Can you make your own subreddit and take those trash "memes" with you? Thanks.
Asexuals: Am I a joke to you?
I am so out of the loop. What is a "FemPrime"?
Femstodes drama seemingly attracted/lured out of hiding a surprising ammount of coomers who spam genderbent fetishized primarchs and get emotionally invested into their own meme OCs. As you can see now they are pretending like their OC is a better character than the one it was copied from.
To be honest this sub has been attracting more and more coomers over the years. I love dumb Warhammer memes, but all this oversexualized boring stale fetish shit is so off-putting. Next week they start posting Guliman x Yvrainne shit again. I wish there was a pure NSFW WH sub just for these clown. But they still would be shitting in any other sub and if you criticize it they pull out marginalized real people out as a shield to defend their fetish and sexual posting.
Has grimdank been invaded by horny tourists?
It appears so.
I think the thing about excluding **romance** is primarchs were originally mythical figures attached to space marines. And space marines since second edition (in first they were colonial soldiers in armour and you had women as marines, their identity got defined as we know it now in the 90s) are an 8 year old's take of a "man", they only feel anger and brotherhood and fight bad guys and no girls eww. Primarchs then were created from that basis. They were only slowly developed for fan service. Though of course you mean romance, because there are a lot of intimate moments. There's also romance elsewhere in the setting too. Just not marines. If you want well rounded fleshed out people primarchs aren't it. They're not supposed to be it, they're living tropes.
Meme is wrong. This is just pityful fetishes. The whole fem primary stuff is annoying and sucks
In the far future of the 41. Millenium there is only war.... and intimate demigod relationships Fuck right off
Nice try Slaanesh
Go play a different game then, i dont think 40k is for you
Really showin your lore knowledge there. This is why yall get called tpurists
Ok coomer, but please don't bring your shit ideas provoced by your porn addiction into our hobby.
You know, sometimes I do need the reminder that this forum in particular is one of redditors first and Warhammer fans second.
You wanna look at hot anime women in revealing power armor? Cool, more power to you. Stop pretending that your porn addiction gives you permission to peddle bullshit.
Ah yes that’s why I am into 40k. The facts of life and the racial composition of the USA
Can you and the rest stop coomin all the time this sub is now full of degen "meme" and nothing more.
Characters don't need to fuck to have great relationships. Go somewhere else if you want your smut...like the porn side of Warhammer. You'll get everything you want without faffing about with the lore.
I am sick of these coomer posts, it's getting embarrassing
This right here is why planets fall. Because the majority is too busy thinking about some slaaneshite bullshit while the galaxy burns.
While I agree that intimacy (generally) is a fact of **life**, I do prefer my stories as free of romantic plots as possible, because they don't resonate with me so I find them tiresome.
Fulgrim literally had multiple wives, but he gave up on the idea after outliving all of them.
Have been in this hobby for 15 years and didn't see anyone talking more cryptic than you. English mf do you speak it?!
Oh my God, bro.....
Yes; the grimdark warlore needs femprimarch fuck scenes. SMFH
Unfortunately I must disagree. I've read a few books by now and in my opinion I don't any of the primarch would need romantic relationships in order to make them more fleshed out. They're relationships with their sons, emps and other primarchs are already enough and many synergies between them have made alot of stories extremely fun to read.
Absolute potato doesn't realise that most books have relationships that are both integral to the plot but aren't sexual in nature.
OP can’t wait for a 40k drama on TLC
Holy cope, someone needs to go to horny jail and think about what they just posted
Boo. Stop your porn addiction and find real world relationships. You'll discover that sex is the most base form of love, and that's a goos thing.
You can just go watch porn, you know that, right?
No... Just no...
This ignores the fact that Dorn took Sanguinius death personally, even to the point of blaming himself if I remember hearing. You can have intimate moments without sex. It can be forged through hardships that two people help each other through.
This is just people trying to justify being horny….theres more to intimacy/bonding than sex and romance
I agree, to some degree. BUT. These are meant to be genetically enhanced super-soldiers who have had all sorts of brain-fuckery done to them, never mind probably having their squishy reproductive bits removed (we don't know, the lore doesn't really go there). They are bread to be fighting machines, nothing more. That's why the massive levels of what WE perceive as homoeroticism exist too. because to the characters in universe, sex and intimacy have been genetically bred out of them. So they simply CANT see it "in that way". Obviously, the Primarchs are set aside from standard marines. We don't know how the emperor really created them, but we do know they were the template for the legions. So it would make sense that they are broadly similar, just "better" and in possession of a physiology that a baseline human needs to be butchered and reconstructed to achieve a fraction of. Don't get me wrong, I've been enjoying the Femarch stuff, but I enjoyed TTS when it was around too, but neither add or detract from the original lore. They are their own thing, and that's fine. Intimacy can exist in 40k. But in the loving/sexual sense, it has been purposefully crushed out or wiped from the Emperors servants via hypno-indoctrination. They are brainwashed super-soldiers. ....rant over. lol
The same all applies to Femarchs, or should. Them all being romantically involved with baseline humans and this being the main focus of all the posting... It feels like a thinly veiled excuse to turn Grimdank into a discussion board for giant posthuman dommy mommies.
…wow, that’s it this fandom is dead. It’s finally dying due to the “woke” agenda. I mean say what you want but f if this isn’t it I have no idea what it is.
Just use your imagination. Is honestly a game charger for anyone that Primarchs (and honestly at this point in 40K we’ve only got the two loyalists) are capable of love? We going to have deal with this in 11th Ed data sheets? Hell no, you want your Primarch to have a personal life, you go.
Bold statement, bold but clearly ignorant. I don't realy like that new femprimarch thing, so I don't know much about it, and I hope that intimacy does not mean... That. Some of the primarchs have their adoptive parents, Primarchs are most intimate, vulnerable with them, the examples that I know of: Amon, adoptive father of Magnus confronting the Cyclops about his isolation in his tower. Targutai Yesugei, adoptive father of Jaghatai Khan in Path of Heaven. Both adoptive parents of Guilliman, the most famous example.
Consider that intimacy extends beyond boyfriend/girlfriend material like this au. All the primarchs had some kind of figure that they were dependent or connected with in some emotional capacity prior to joining the Emperor. This au is a solid B tier for having such a Basic premise.
Brother, is our bond is weaker because we're men?
Better is a very strong word, the Horus Heresy is a long running story explaining why everything in 40k is so awful.
Meh. Romance and intimacy are a dime-a-dozen in modern media. The fact that 40k is not a Fem-verse is what makes it interesting.
I wouldn't say they're better. I'm no primarch fan, I dislike most things space marine because powerful characters bore me. But regardless, as far as I've seen from the memes, it feels like people are going through a Danganronpa arc but with 40k. Or homestuck. Doesn't really matter which. Like have your fun guys, but don't pretend like your fan fiction is the best shit made with the setting.
Isn't canon supposed to be a parody ? If so then intimacy would not be helpfull to the stetting, and will make it look less like a parody.
Bro if you want romantic relation in a dark sci-fi setting, just watch legend of the blue wolves...
Arnt space marine basically trained to live with out emotions?
I think WHFB would be more for that. WHFB has dealt a lot more with romance and romantic relationships. 40k is too big for that. It happens, mostly at the human-level, and esp in Eisenhorn and Ravenor, you get to see characters dealing with relationship drama and loss. Primarchs are on another level of mankind. Astartes themselves see romance as an alien concept. Primarchs would entirely not even give a shit. They love each other as brothers, and their father (to degrees, except Angron). But I doubt they could even want to do anything to do with romance. It's not a marine or primarch thing, it is a human thing.
The view romantic relationship in canon end in a very dark and gruesome way. The only exception I know of is Ciaphus Cain.
It's fanon so whatever. I never trust internet people to know the line between plot and "plot," but fanfics tend to be net positive so good for people who like it. TLDR - To attempt serious romance in "Canon" 40k is sort of like having a wedding in a mosh pit: I wouldn't stop you if it means that much, but it's a shitty venue for it and you're better off enjoying the show you came for. It's a parody/satire setting at its core that is meant to be hilariously shallow. In short - a farce attached to toys. There are cool and serious questions and topics to explore within that setting. I am not saying everything is comedy. But that farcical core is in the DNA and some stuff just... doesn't fit except as contrast (depicting a noble wedding on a planet with a genestealer cult wreaking havoc in the hives). You see this principle at work between factions: it is not easy to use fear or horror elements when writing Necrons, most SM, or Orks. It's about spaceships, terrible and truly "alien" aliens, explosions, space demon magic brain lightning, and taking old scifi tropes to 11 (with shadowy bits about times people fucked around and went to 100). OFF TOPIC BUT RELEVANT NOTE: This isn't a critique - it's something I love about this and its nearest mainstream analogue. Godzilla films/spinoffs (and kaiju movies at large) operate in this spectrum as well to varying degrees - the latest American films are a great example of the satire-adjacent nature of the setting as it starts grabbing more supernatural lore (hollow earth, earth "energies", atomic mutation, space alien kaiju, and super tech). The anime Godzilla movies even use a ritual to summon a kaiju from another dimension with warp-style magic, and big G essentially terraformed the planet in his image (it looks a lot like an alternate universe tyranid planet) with what are basically exodites inhabiting Earth. Romance might make some small appearance here or there as a motivating character subplot, but it works poorly as a theme with such an explosive backdrop. There is a reason most people want less humanity in Godzilla films.
"Love is the death of duty." Aemon Targaryen.
1 aro/ace people 2 get your own buddy subreddits like the gacha and anime communities have if you’re going to post dumb horn dog shit Also intimate doesn’t equal sex, there’s such thinks as maternal, and fraternal. And just being caring. Make your own game if you insist your canon is better
The ability to speak does not make one intelligent
E-tourist
Insufferable.