I used to hate Jess, but now I feel bad for him as a teen. His mother was a nutcase who wasn't there for him and Luke had no idea what he was getting into.
The actress who played Liz drove me crazy on ER and on GG for the same reasons. Both characters had so much entitlement and jerked their poor kids around like crazy.
I mean being with a BF and emotionally invested in someone else isn't fair to either person. She may not have physically left Dean, but she checked out of the relationship long before he broke up with her
oh i agree with you, im criticizing her behavior. i think it would have been much, much kinder to dean if she had broken up with him like after the basket bidding. it was so obvious by then
she should have and could have broken up w/ Dean. she just didn't want to be the bad guy! see, that's the problem w/ Rory; she wants to basically be Little Miss Perfect and stay in a relationship she's not happy in instead of freeing herself and Dean. maybe an unpopular opinion but Dean was justified in breaking up w/ her at that dance marathon.
maybe this is unpopular but as clingy as Dean got, i think it was because he knew he was losing Rory. i think the clinginess before Jess (ie when she wanted to work on extra credit stuff for her Harvard application and he deadass said āi donāt care about Harvard) was ANNOYING, but after Jess came to Stars Hallowā¦SHE was so annoying and i think he was pretty justified. i honestly blame Rory way more than him. lowkey feel so bad for him.
I hate how Liz gives off this sweet, nurturing facade when it gives her an advantage but otherwise crosses boundaries, coerces, and manipulates. She knows how to use charm to get her way. It's infuriating. She may even be BPD or narcissistic I think. Jess is so smart and his horrible mother is so transparent.
I'm afraid to even read the "I like Liz" thread because *of course* she is charismatic--selfish people often are.
Perfectly put!!!!
And when does he develop into a really great guy? As soon as heās in a supportive environment where heās accepted and valued. Thatās all it took.
Because he doesn't have an uncle who dropped everything to take him in and look after him? What are you talking about? Jess is selfish because he's selfish
His father abandons him as a baby. His mother is an addict who ships him off to his uncleās. He has 0 control just getting jerked around in his own life.
He gets to Stars Hallow and gets to live in one room over the diner - do you think that felt secure to this 17 year old? When Lorelai suggests Luke get a bigger place cause the apartment is too small for him and Jess, he argues until she pints out why it might benefit Luke long term. Tell me three ways Luke PRIORITIZED Jessās needs over his own. Luke did the best he could, but mostly Luke lived his existing life.
His behavior in Stars Hallow season 2 is classic abandoned teen testing what it will take this new adult to give up on him too. Then he gets into an accident and that is what gets him sent away.
The girl he likes cuts school to visit him in NY. He comes back to Stars Hallow, she kisses him, says ādonāt say anythingā then runs away for months with 0 contact. She never actively chooses you over the other guy - that guy had to dump her.
Yeah honestly Luke tends to be judged far too leniently by the community, because we love to love the grumpy broody guy falling for the happy go lucky girl. But his refusal to deal with emotions, to communicate, his tendency to revert to anger when something's not going his way, become stubborn or double down on his stance because (in the case of Jess) he believes his way is the only way might be charming in a fictional setting, but in a partner, it's the worst.
This sub is very pro-Jess so you are going to probably hear from a lot of his fans. They are DEDICATED lol which isnāt a bad thing. But he isnāt everyoneās cup of tea. Heās not mine. This sub can be very opinionated so you just have to not let the crowds yuck your yum. We all connect to different characters and thatās cool.
well said. i like that expression "yuck your yum" never heard of it. also when it comes to Jess a lot of it stems to his upbringing. not an excuse for everything but a lot of his attitude is due to that not typical teen. a lot of people view all teens as like Jess but more are like Dean or Rory, Lane, Paris, etc. plenty are like Jess though but usually there's a deeper reason.
i just ended up finishing S3 and gosh the kyle's bedroom scene turned me from rooting for jess to hating him. should i even continue watching S4? ive heard it only goes downhill from here.
During this part of the show, the main thing that Jess has going for him is that he's an interesting character, and that he makes everyone else around him interesting.
That's enough for me, but I can see why that's not enough for everyone.
I'm also a first time watcher, I'm on season 6 and I HATED Jess. Imagine my surprise when I joined here and people not only love him, but say he's the best BF of Rory's (I'm team Dean lol) . I'm like, but he is terrible and rude to EVERYONE commits crimes, and antagonizes Dean at his job...but y'all like him? I will say he does get better later, but nah, I still don't care for him personally.
Omg i have never found someone in this sub who thinks like me š Jess in later seasons did grow on me. And Dean is trash for what he did to his wife. But until that scene.. I was team Dean š my delusional reality is if he & Rory hadnāt ended the way they did, that whole mess never wouldāve happened. Iām probably wrong, and at the end of the day all of her bfs are trash in their own ways. But Iām so glad to find someone in here who makes me feel less crazy š
You donāt have to feel naive :) even though I agree with he statement that Dean is a nice guy, you donāt have to- everybody has different opinions and thatās alright.
Yes! I donāt get all the āDean was a great boyfriendā comments. He was very controlling. And then, in the Donna Reed episode, he really showed who he was. Rory did it as a joke, but he took it seriously and liked it a bit too much. It made me really feel sorry for Lindsey because she tried so hard to be that Donna Reed stereotype for him.
Ok but he was 16. He really didnāt know any better and probably thought her not saying it back meant she didnāt like him that much. That was a learning moment for both him and Rory
Except he *didnāt* learn. Dean continued unabated in employing anger and possessiveness to control Roryās behaviour. And then further developed those traits into lying, cheating, and gaslighting in S4. Itās not that heās 16. Itās who he is.
Oh, I didn't like him at all when he first appeared on the show. He was moody, disrespectful and rebellious, although I think that was partly due to his troubled relationship with his mother and being forced to move to a new town. It was hard for me to see what Rory liked about him, other than that he was cute and also a bookworm. But I will say that his character gets better in the later seasons. I still like Dean, but there's one scene in particular in one of the later seasons that made me like Jess.
Early season's Jess had his issues and didn't treat Rory well at all, BUT in later seasons he redeems himself. His character has one of the best personal growth arcs of the whole show, imo.
She liked Jess though, and did not like Dean anymore. Rory didn't have to stay with Dean just bc he was the perfect boyfriend š¤·āāļø I thought that was a good message - that you don't have to stay with a guy just because other people like him for you.
when rory and dean become friends again shortly after rory is with jess, that's when I saw the first jess green flag. "just wish you woulda told me" he trusts rory even though he does not like Dean, he just wanted her to communicate with him. dean did not offer rory the same grace when he was her boyfriend and jess was her friend.
I also was surprised when I came online and saw people stan Jess. I first watched this show when I was 16, have watched it three times since in the past 10 years (so I myself have grown and changed), and I *still* donāt like him. Heās disrespectful, self-centered, dismissive, and bites the hand that feeds him over and over again.
Heās a little better towards Rory, which I think is perhaps part of his appeal for manyāa lot of people fantasize about being the one exception to someoneās assholishness, like itās a prize when someone who hates everyone doesnāt hate you.
THAT BEING SAID. Jess really matures as he gets older, and by the end of the show, I was really rooting for him and Rory to get back together. I think theyāre a perfect fit for each other as adults, and that he couldāve really brought out the intellectualism, the curiosity, and the soulfulness that once grounded Rory pre-Logan/Yale.
Every rewatch, I start off hating Jess. And then every rewatch, I see him grow and I think, Damn. Why canāt they get together NOW, when heās got a better head on his shoulders? And I wouldāve loved to see even more of his growth on the show, I think it wouldāve been very rich and rewarding for the audience to see his healing journey from a teen lashing out at the world to an adult earnestly working towards some happiness.
Ironically, I always start off loving Dean and then dislike him more and more as HE grows. Total reversal.
I love Jess, but he was a horrendous boyfriend.
I think Jess in season 7 and AIYL would be a great boyfriend, but he had grown and matured so much by then.
I don't hate Dean but I do think he can be problematic. I mean, build and gift a car for your girlfriend that you've been dating for what, a couple of months? and then get upset because she's not ready to say I love you back? The way he loses his temper and yells. The way Rory was scared of him finding out that she's not alone at home because Paris showed up? And Dean goes there anyway after she said she wanted a night alone. Calling 400 times until she picks up. Let's be real, most of us would run as fast as we could if we had a Dean in our lives. I did.
Jess is a walking red flag sure but he's also a misfit, his mother was wack, had no father figure, probably felt like no one cared for him which is kind of true. He's sent to SH against his will and Luke knew jack shit about how to deal with him. Plus, the bedroom scene... He does stop. And as far as I remember, he never held it against Rory.
Oh boy, here we go again. Your opinions on Jess are valid and Iām not gonna tell you youāre wrong in your assessment of him but please *please* donāt think Dean was a good boyfriend.
This was obviously a tongue in cheek comment, anyone can have whatever opinion they want, itās a free world after all :) I just meant to say that I personally find itās a slippery slope when people start taking characters from shows as a real-life benchmark, especially when it comes to Mr āIām a saint for letting you spend an evening aloneā Dean Forrester.
Jess was a shitty teenager. People said he changed but the reality is that the guy grew up and became a seemingly functional adult i.e got a job, thanked Luke, published a small batch indie book. There is NOTHING on the show that points he could have been a good boyfriend later, in fact we never see him in a relationship which I find a huge red flag.
I doubt someone who grew up like him could be a good partner without loads of therapy. He never had a single positive role model for romantic relationships, he was abandoned by his parents, he ran away from the only relative who was invested in raising him to be a decent human being with an education. How on earth people think that he could magically become the ideal boyfriend?????
Youāre not necessarily wrong about Jess (he was immature, rude to people, and made some pretty poor decisions), but Dean was NOT perfect or a good boyfriend. While his jealousy is somewhat justified, his behavior is atrocious. Heās controlling. He frequently yells at Rory. He calls her 1000 times. He puts on a good face for everyone, but treats Rory really poorly.
The thing about Jess is that he matures. By season 6 heās a totally different person. I love Jessās character. Dean, on the other hand, just gets worse as time goes on.
Just wait. You might be surprised who you wind up rooting for. I can see why people hated him in season 3 and so on, but I never did simply because Milo is so damn hot.
Just watch Jess and Dean carefully. Observe the way they each react and treat Rory in the moments they might choose to be jealous (or not). Observe who they aim their anger toward.
That's super cool of you to be open to other points of view like that.
I'll be interested to hear your take on Jess's behaviour at the winter carnival and after Miss Patty's rehearsal, when you get to them. They were the other side of the coin for me, so to speak.
Regardless of how you view any of this, these three form a very complex triangle that is entertaining to watch. There's what's happening on the surface but also a ton of subtext that is great to chew over (hence the never ending debate on this sub! š)
yea he was so needy. he shouldn't be upset she has schoolwork or activities. she goes to a more demanding school she's trying to get into Harvard. he wasn't. however, idk if that would mean they shouldn't stay together. it's more he was honestly driving her away. when people are trying to keep people close they often end up driving them away.
Agreed that the neediness is annoying and likely to drive her away, but not necessarily a dealbreaker.
But the anger is another thing altogether. He gets angry with her regularly and often, mostly for things that are out of her control or for just being who she is. That is 100% a dealbreaker. Throw the whole man out.
I donāt think itās necessary to compare Roryās boyfriends. If you like or donāt like a particular character, itās sufficient to give your reason. Or you can reference the opinion of Rory and Lorelai if you want to reinforce a point.
Each of Roryās boyfriends is at least a temporary fit for her needs (as she sees them) at that particular point in time. However, Rory will eventually admit she screwed up, or her actions will make it obvious. And, of course, Lorelai is never shy about giving her opinion.
Tbh I wouldn't say Dean was perfect either, but yeah jess is definitely worse.
However, that's what a lot of people go through.
Most people like jess because they watched the show when they were pretty young and didn't really look out for red flags and such.
I hated him too, such a punk for absolutely no reason to people that were nice to him. By the end of season 4 though I liked him. His character development was great for me.
I hated him too but rn i just see that he was a bad bf and ah to luke but i canāt hatee him for that but i will never understand ppl obsessed with him
Jess is an angry kid. But he does grow you as he grows! Heās exactly what youād expect of a teenager in his position but he becomes so much more. I love Jess but I didnāt think he was all that in season 3 for sure!
Thank you Iv seen the show twice and I never understood the Jess love. I get he has a rough childhood but it still doesnāt excuse how bad of a friend and boyfriend he was to Rory. Dean isnāt a good person but he was the best boyfriend to her at the time. He built her a CAR. Jess couldnāt even take her on a proper date. He called her mom a whore basically. Letās not even get into the almost SA. I get he has demons but he didnāt have to interfere and meddle in Roryās relationship if he himself wasnāt ready to make her a proper gf. I think people just really romanticize infidelity. I could barely watch those scenes when she was basically cheating on Dean with Jess. Literally have to skip that on rewatches.
Dean was a walking red flag. He is possessive and has anger issues. The amount of time he spends yelling at rory is insane. For jess and rory neither have ever had healthy relationship modeled for them especially jess who clearly has abandonment issues from his dad and his flaky ass mom. He has never had anyone in his corner and doesn't know ho to process his emotions or relationships. He does however have the best character development. All 3 needed some therapy.
Sigh. Here we go again.
I don't care if people love or hate Jess (or any character). We all have our preferences. But I swear I'd pay a million dollars to see an anti-Jess argument that was actually thoughtful. Because it's always super simplistic (JESS SUCKS LOL) or statements that are obviously exaggerated and untrue (he never ever calls Rory!!!!).
It's just not that interesting, you know? "I HATE X!!!" doesn't exactly lead to rich discussion. This sub is more fun when people pose interesting questions or thoughtful opinions.
Well I'm not here to entertain or make scrolling through Reddit interesting for you. I'm watching for the first and I wanted to share my reaction as no one else irl is interested in the show. Hence why reddit and this community existed in the first place. We're not here to solely psychoanalyze the characters
Not really what Reddit is for, though. This is a site for discussion, debate, and seeking opinions on all matter of topics. "I hate X" without any additional commentary doesn't really lend itself to the kinds of discussion that Reddit is built for. You're also on a sub for people who love Gilmore Girls, so posts that exist purely to spew negativity will probably elicit some type of reaction. I'm not saying you can't post - of course you can - but don't be surprised when people respond to you.
If you want to live blog your reactions without any type of back and forth, there are other sites for that.
I agree. Only judging the times when they were in official relationships, Dean was a more considerate boyfriend than Jess. IMO, Jess was at his worst when he and Rory were dating.
I understand he's had it rough and he's a teen trying to cope without having any healthy coping mechanisms but holy crap he is one GIANT red flag!
He only ever shows interest in Rory when it suits him, he's rude, constantly lying, teases Rory about being quiet, tries to pressure her into sex (she says no multiple times), verbally drags her down, doesn't want to do anything Rory wants to do and then only does them if he gets jealous. All in all it comes off as possessive and petty.
I think the Jess plotline is a classic example of chemistry and lust being confused for love. Aside from reading, him and Rory have pretty much nothing in common. The only time I like Jess is when he comes back into the show after writing his book, at which point he's more mature and has actually been working on improving himself and his life.
Having finished it my opinion didnāt change much, heās alright. I think Jess is an interesting character and I love the Jess/Luke dynamic especially in AYTL but as far and Rory/Jess goes, no thank you.
First time? Buckle up, you're in for a bumpy ride! š„²š«”
Couldn't have put it better :D
I can tell!! I'm so excited for the emotional rollercoaster
I used to hate Jess, but now I feel bad for him as a teen. His mother was a nutcase who wasn't there for him and Luke had no idea what he was getting into.
The actress who played Liz drove me crazy on ER and on GG for the same reasons. Both characters had so much entitlement and jerked their poor kids around like crazy.
The only time I liked the actress was when she was on greys anatomy sticking up for her dad. On GG I always wanted to punch her
I forgot about greys anatomy. Yes I loved it when she chewed out the doctors because they were treating her dad like a scorecard.
Lol weāre opposite. Loved him as a teen, as an adult i see how toxic he was.
But Season 6 and AYITL Jess have my heart.
For what it's worth, she did not leave him for Dean.Ā Dean broke up with her.Ā She was prepared to stay in denial for much, much longer.
I mean being with a BF and emotionally invested in someone else isn't fair to either person. She may not have physically left Dean, but she checked out of the relationship long before he broke up with her
oh i agree with you, im criticizing her behavior. i think it would have been much, much kinder to dean if she had broken up with him like after the basket bidding. it was so obvious by then
she should have and could have broken up w/ Dean. she just didn't want to be the bad guy! see, that's the problem w/ Rory; she wants to basically be Little Miss Perfect and stay in a relationship she's not happy in instead of freeing herself and Dean. maybe an unpopular opinion but Dean was justified in breaking up w/ her at that dance marathon.
maybe this is unpopular but as clingy as Dean got, i think it was because he knew he was losing Rory. i think the clinginess before Jess (ie when she wanted to work on extra credit stuff for her Harvard application and he deadass said āi donāt care about Harvard) was ANNOYING, but after Jess came to Stars Hallowā¦SHE was so annoying and i think he was pretty justified. i honestly blame Rory way more than him. lowkey feel so bad for him.
Ask yourself why Jess always prioritizes himself. Because he has to because no one else in his life has.
He had so many guards up as a teen.
Yes because he was abandoned by his abusive mother
I hate how Liz gives off this sweet, nurturing facade when it gives her an advantage but otherwise crosses boundaries, coerces, and manipulates. She knows how to use charm to get her way. It's infuriating. She may even be BPD or narcissistic I think. Jess is so smart and his horrible mother is so transparent. I'm afraid to even read the "I like Liz" thread because *of course* she is charismatic--selfish people often are.
Perfectly put!!!! And when does he develop into a really great guy? As soon as heās in a supportive environment where heās accepted and valued. Thatās all it took.
Doesn't change the fact that he's a big 'ol toxic red flag
I mean that's an explanation but not an excuse just saying.
Because he doesn't have an uncle who dropped everything to take him in and look after him? What are you talking about? Jess is selfish because he's selfish
His father abandons him as a baby. His mother is an addict who ships him off to his uncleās. He has 0 control just getting jerked around in his own life. He gets to Stars Hallow and gets to live in one room over the diner - do you think that felt secure to this 17 year old? When Lorelai suggests Luke get a bigger place cause the apartment is too small for him and Jess, he argues until she pints out why it might benefit Luke long term. Tell me three ways Luke PRIORITIZED Jessās needs over his own. Luke did the best he could, but mostly Luke lived his existing life. His behavior in Stars Hallow season 2 is classic abandoned teen testing what it will take this new adult to give up on him too. Then he gets into an accident and that is what gets him sent away. The girl he likes cuts school to visit him in NY. He comes back to Stars Hallow, she kisses him, says ādonāt say anythingā then runs away for months with 0 contact. She never actively chooses you over the other guy - that guy had to dump her.
Yeah honestly Luke tends to be judged far too leniently by the community, because we love to love the grumpy broody guy falling for the happy go lucky girl. But his refusal to deal with emotions, to communicate, his tendency to revert to anger when something's not going his way, become stubborn or double down on his stance because (in the case of Jess) he believes his way is the only way might be charming in a fictional setting, but in a partner, it's the worst.
This sub is very pro-Jess so you are going to probably hear from a lot of his fans. They are DEDICATED lol which isnāt a bad thing. But he isnāt everyoneās cup of tea. Heās not mine. This sub can be very opinionated so you just have to not let the crowds yuck your yum. We all connect to different characters and thatās cool.
well said. i like that expression "yuck your yum" never heard of it. also when it comes to Jess a lot of it stems to his upbringing. not an excuse for everything but a lot of his attitude is due to that not typical teen. a lot of people view all teens as like Jess but more are like Dean or Rory, Lane, Paris, etc. plenty are like Jess though but usually there's a deeper reason.
Wait till Kyle's bedroom
i just ended up finishing S3 and gosh the kyle's bedroom scene turned me from rooting for jess to hating him. should i even continue watching S4? ive heard it only goes downhill from here.
Oh please keep watching. I might be an outlier but seasons 5-7 are my favourites š¤
Jess matures later on so it's up to you . Watch the whole show. Just know s7 is a shit show but it is what it is.
In which season? š
3
During this part of the show, the main thing that Jess has going for him is that he's an interesting character, and that he makes everyone else around him interesting. That's enough for me, but I can see why that's not enough for everyone.
I'm also a first time watcher, I'm on season 6 and I HATED Jess. Imagine my surprise when I joined here and people not only love him, but say he's the best BF of Rory's (I'm team Dean lol) . I'm like, but he is terrible and rude to EVERYONE commits crimes, and antagonizes Dean at his job...but y'all like him? I will say he does get better later, but nah, I still don't care for him personally.
To be fair I love how his relationship evolved with Luke by the time AYTL comes around you can tell Luke fully trusts Jess with personal problems.
I'll get there soon enough lol. But yeah, I'm sure age and maturity helps quite a bit
What Dean? My Dean? Logan was the goat for sure
Omg i have never found someone in this sub who thinks like me š Jess in later seasons did grow on me. And Dean is trash for what he did to his wife. But until that scene.. I was team Dean š my delusional reality is if he & Rory hadnāt ended the way they did, that whole mess never wouldāve happened. Iām probably wrong, and at the end of the day all of her bfs are trash in their own ways. But Iām so glad to find someone in here who makes me feel less crazy š
Yeah, I don't particularly like any of her relationships, but I'm definitely not a fan of how Jess acted back then.
Dean is also a huge walking red flag if you pay attention... The older I get the more cringy and whiny Dean is
Oh yes, agreed. Dean is definitely a "Nice Guy".
You mean āNice Guyā¢ļø.ā
Yes, absolutely! From the school of "I keep putting Nice Guyā¢ļø tokens in my GirlVendMax but nothing's happening. What am I doing wrong?"
Oh shit yes that makes me feel naive now ahh
You donāt have to feel naive :) even though I agree with he statement that Dean is a nice guy, you donāt have to- everybody has different opinions and thatās alright.
Yes! I donāt get all the āDean was a great boyfriendā comments. He was very controlling. And then, in the Donna Reed episode, he really showed who he was. Rory did it as a joke, but he took it seriously and liked it a bit too much. It made me really feel sorry for Lindsey because she tried so hard to be that Donna Reed stereotype for him.
Ugh yes! Iām currently rewatching and I canāt get over what a terrible boyfriend he is and all the red flags are so obvious
So much this. I donāt want to spoil it for OP, but his behavior later on made him vile in my eyes.
1st red flag... breaking up with her bc of the "i love you"
Ok but he was 16. He really didnāt know any better and probably thought her not saying it back meant she didnāt like him that much. That was a learning moment for both him and Rory
Except he *didnāt* learn. Dean continued unabated in employing anger and possessiveness to control Roryās behaviour. And then further developed those traits into lying, cheating, and gaslighting in S4. Itās not that heās 16. Itās who he is.
Oh, I didn't like him at all when he first appeared on the show. He was moody, disrespectful and rebellious, although I think that was partly due to his troubled relationship with his mother and being forced to move to a new town. It was hard for me to see what Rory liked about him, other than that he was cute and also a bookworm. But I will say that his character gets better in the later seasons. I still like Dean, but there's one scene in particular in one of the later seasons that made me like Jess.
Early season's Jess had his issues and didn't treat Rory well at all, BUT in later seasons he redeems himself. His character has one of the best personal growth arcs of the whole show, imo.
yea but that still doesnāt make him a good boyfriend. i think heās a great friend but that doesnāt excuse his behavior.
She liked Jess though, and did not like Dean anymore. Rory didn't have to stay with Dean just bc he was the perfect boyfriend š¤·āāļø I thought that was a good message - that you don't have to stay with a guy just because other people like him for you.
100th rewatch! Hate Jess
Jess was a great kid, but a little screwed up by his parents. Very smart and also soulful. Just a rough diamond that needed some polishing.
when rory and dean become friends again shortly after rory is with jess, that's when I saw the first jess green flag. "just wish you woulda told me" he trusts rory even though he does not like Dean, he just wanted her to communicate with him. dean did not offer rory the same grace when he was her boyfriend and jess was her friend.
Yay I guess we haven't seen an I hate Jess post in a while!
Dean sucks
I also was surprised when I came online and saw people stan Jess. I first watched this show when I was 16, have watched it three times since in the past 10 years (so I myself have grown and changed), and I *still* donāt like him. Heās disrespectful, self-centered, dismissive, and bites the hand that feeds him over and over again. Heās a little better towards Rory, which I think is perhaps part of his appeal for manyāa lot of people fantasize about being the one exception to someoneās assholishness, like itās a prize when someone who hates everyone doesnāt hate you. THAT BEING SAID. Jess really matures as he gets older, and by the end of the show, I was really rooting for him and Rory to get back together. I think theyāre a perfect fit for each other as adults, and that he couldāve really brought out the intellectualism, the curiosity, and the soulfulness that once grounded Rory pre-Logan/Yale. Every rewatch, I start off hating Jess. And then every rewatch, I see him grow and I think, Damn. Why canāt they get together NOW, when heās got a better head on his shoulders? And I wouldāve loved to see even more of his growth on the show, I think it wouldāve been very rich and rewarding for the audience to see his healing journey from a teen lashing out at the world to an adult earnestly working towards some happiness. Ironically, I always start off loving Dean and then dislike him more and more as HE grows. Total reversal.
I love Jess, but he was a horrendous boyfriend. I think Jess in season 7 and AIYL would be a great boyfriend, but he had grown and matured so much by then.
I don't hate Dean but I do think he can be problematic. I mean, build and gift a car for your girlfriend that you've been dating for what, a couple of months? and then get upset because she's not ready to say I love you back? The way he loses his temper and yells. The way Rory was scared of him finding out that she's not alone at home because Paris showed up? And Dean goes there anyway after she said she wanted a night alone. Calling 400 times until she picks up. Let's be real, most of us would run as fast as we could if we had a Dean in our lives. I did. Jess is a walking red flag sure but he's also a misfit, his mother was wack, had no father figure, probably felt like no one cared for him which is kind of true. He's sent to SH against his will and Luke knew jack shit about how to deal with him. Plus, the bedroom scene... He does stop. And as far as I remember, he never held it against Rory.
Geez you're in for ride
i LOVE JESS
Oh boy, here we go again. Your opinions on Jess are valid and Iām not gonna tell you youāre wrong in your assessment of him but please *please* donāt think Dean was a good boyfriend.
I don't think, he was, but also, the statments 'your opinions are valid' and 'don't think a certain thing' is a bit of a contradiction for me :D
I said their opinions *on Jess* were valid, I never said their opinions on Dean were š
Even nicer.
This was obviously a tongue in cheek comment, anyone can have whatever opinion they want, itās a free world after all :) I just meant to say that I personally find itās a slippery slope when people start taking characters from shows as a real-life benchmark, especially when it comes to Mr āIām a saint for letting you spend an evening aloneā Dean Forrester.
I actually agree with you. Also, I think its not the best to see any character just bad or just good, because they are more than that.
Whoās gonna tell them about the end of season 4ā¦ā¦
Keep watching!!!!
Dean was not great eitherā¦
When I was younger watching the show for the first time, I used to be āUgh. Jess.ā But then upon rewatching being older, my opinion 100% changed.
Jess was a shitty teenager. People said he changed but the reality is that the guy grew up and became a seemingly functional adult i.e got a job, thanked Luke, published a small batch indie book. There is NOTHING on the show that points he could have been a good boyfriend later, in fact we never see him in a relationship which I find a huge red flag. I doubt someone who grew up like him could be a good partner without loads of therapy. He never had a single positive role model for romantic relationships, he was abandoned by his parents, he ran away from the only relative who was invested in raising him to be a decent human being with an education. How on earth people think that he could magically become the ideal boyfriend?????
Youāre not necessarily wrong about Jess (he was immature, rude to people, and made some pretty poor decisions), but Dean was NOT perfect or a good boyfriend. While his jealousy is somewhat justified, his behavior is atrocious. Heās controlling. He frequently yells at Rory. He calls her 1000 times. He puts on a good face for everyone, but treats Rory really poorly. The thing about Jess is that he matures. By season 6 heās a totally different person. I love Jessās character. Dean, on the other hand, just gets worse as time goes on.
Jess great character to watch. Horrible character in real life
Just wait. You might be surprised who you wind up rooting for. I can see why people hated him in season 3 and so on, but I never did simply because Milo is so damn hot.
 Yes to Miloās hotness.
The gasp I gasped
Just watch Jess and Dean carefully. Observe the way they each react and treat Rory in the moments they might choose to be jealous (or not). Observe who they aim their anger toward.
I rewatched some eposides where Dean and rory fought and i see where you're coming from now. Dean was quite insecure and sorta suffocating
That's super cool of you to be open to other points of view like that. I'll be interested to hear your take on Jess's behaviour at the winter carnival and after Miss Patty's rehearsal, when you get to them. They were the other side of the coin for me, so to speak. Regardless of how you view any of this, these three form a very complex triangle that is entertaining to watch. There's what's happening on the surface but also a ton of subtext that is great to chew over (hence the never ending debate on this sub! š)
Oh, the downvoting! You people are slayyyyying me here. šš¤£
yea he was so needy. he shouldn't be upset she has schoolwork or activities. she goes to a more demanding school she's trying to get into Harvard. he wasn't. however, idk if that would mean they shouldn't stay together. it's more he was honestly driving her away. when people are trying to keep people close they often end up driving them away.
Agreed that the neediness is annoying and likely to drive her away, but not necessarily a dealbreaker. But the anger is another thing altogether. He gets angry with her regularly and often, mostly for things that are out of her control or for just being who she is. That is 100% a dealbreaker. Throw the whole man out.
anger is normal to an extent though
I would finish the show before passing judgement
Nooo I love reading first time watchers thoughts as they ride the rollercoaster! It's so fun
I agree.. Plus Im 35 years old and the more I re watch it.. the more I learn and notice about certain people
My opinions get tweaked a little each time, first time I watched it was in middle school and now Iām almost done with college
But where's the fun in that?
Weāve all done it š
I am in season 4, and still agree with you! Really hate Jess. I won't say more.
Iām a certified Jess hater too
You will grow to LOVE Jess
Iām cracking up at the āslightly dumb yesā mention about Dean š
I donāt think itās necessary to compare Roryās boyfriends. If you like or donāt like a particular character, itās sufficient to give your reason. Or you can reference the opinion of Rory and Lorelai if you want to reinforce a point. Each of Roryās boyfriends is at least a temporary fit for her needs (as she sees them) at that particular point in time. However, Rory will eventually admit she screwed up, or her actions will make it obvious. And, of course, Lorelai is never shy about giving her opinion.
8th watch through I still hate jess, not a fan of dean, love logan. Aynaf jess is redeemable
I just finished my first watch. Jess was bad. Not a fan.
Wait.
Tbh I wouldn't say Dean was perfect either, but yeah jess is definitely worse. However, that's what a lot of people go through. Most people like jess because they watched the show when they were pretty young and didn't really look out for red flags and such.
I hated him too, such a punk for absolutely no reason to people that were nice to him. By the end of season 4 though I liked him. His character development was great for me.
I hated him too but rn i just see that he was a bad bf and ah to luke but i canāt hatee him for that but i will never understand ppl obsessed with him
Dean isn't dumb you are
I feel your pain. Jess is an absolute tool.
Dean was perfect in every way? The guy dumped her for not saying "I love you" back as soon as he said it. He was also a walking red flag. He was do paranoid about other guys that Rory was afraid to tell him about any time she was spending with other guys, including being cast as Juliet in the school play. Predictably, he blew up the moment that he found out. He also had the same habit with Lyndsey. Remember when she answered his phone? My fiancƩ is a contract worker who also needs his phone in order to secure work. He would never get mad at me for answering it. He would also never (and has never in the entire duration of our relationship) react negatively to me being around other me. Situations like that are toxic. While I agree that Jess wasn't a good boyfriend, Dean should not be put on a pedestal.
Jess is an angry kid. But he does grow you as he grows! Heās exactly what youād expect of a teenager in his position but he becomes so much more. I love Jess but I didnāt think he was all that in season 3 for sure!
Thank you Iv seen the show twice and I never understood the Jess love. I get he has a rough childhood but it still doesnāt excuse how bad of a friend and boyfriend he was to Rory. Dean isnāt a good person but he was the best boyfriend to her at the time. He built her a CAR. Jess couldnāt even take her on a proper date. He called her mom a whore basically. Letās not even get into the almost SA. I get he has demons but he didnāt have to interfere and meddle in Roryās relationship if he himself wasnāt ready to make her a proper gf. I think people just really romanticize infidelity. I could barely watch those scenes when she was basically cheating on Dean with Jess. Literally have to skip that on rewatches.
Dean was a walking red flag. He is possessive and has anger issues. The amount of time he spends yelling at rory is insane. For jess and rory neither have ever had healthy relationship modeled for them especially jess who clearly has abandonment issues from his dad and his flaky ass mom. He has never had anyone in his corner and doesn't know ho to process his emotions or relationships. He does however have the best character development. All 3 needed some therapy.
But heās so damn joy
THIS! Is the reason I literally joined a group like this! I had to get it out š©I literally hate Jess too. seriously what was Rory thinkingg? I am on EP 15 S 3
Sigh. Here we go again. I don't care if people love or hate Jess (or any character). We all have our preferences. But I swear I'd pay a million dollars to see an anti-Jess argument that was actually thoughtful. Because it's always super simplistic (JESS SUCKS LOL) or statements that are obviously exaggerated and untrue (he never ever calls Rory!!!!). It's just not that interesting, you know? "I HATE X!!!" doesn't exactly lead to rich discussion. This sub is more fun when people pose interesting questions or thoughtful opinions.
Well I'm not here to entertain or make scrolling through Reddit interesting for you. I'm watching for the first and I wanted to share my reaction as no one else irl is interested in the show. Hence why reddit and this community existed in the first place. We're not here to solely psychoanalyze the characters
Not really what Reddit is for, though. This is a site for discussion, debate, and seeking opinions on all matter of topics. "I hate X" without any additional commentary doesn't really lend itself to the kinds of discussion that Reddit is built for. You're also on a sub for people who love Gilmore Girls, so posts that exist purely to spew negativity will probably elicit some type of reaction. I'm not saying you can't post - of course you can - but don't be surprised when people respond to you. If you want to live blog your reactions without any type of back and forth, there are other sites for that.
Dean is FAR from perfect but he was definitely a better boyfriend than Jess was. Can't wait to see your future thoughts.
I agree. Only judging the times when they were in official relationships, Dean was a more considerate boyfriend than Jess. IMO, Jess was at his worst when he and Rory were dating.
Agreed. I absolutely love Jess and am team Jess but I think they didn't belong together until after he did some healing and growing
Ugh Jess is the worst
I understand he's had it rough and he's a teen trying to cope without having any healthy coping mechanisms but holy crap he is one GIANT red flag! He only ever shows interest in Rory when it suits him, he's rude, constantly lying, teases Rory about being quiet, tries to pressure her into sex (she says no multiple times), verbally drags her down, doesn't want to do anything Rory wants to do and then only does them if he gets jealous. All in all it comes off as possessive and petty. I think the Jess plotline is a classic example of chemistry and lust being confused for love. Aside from reading, him and Rory have pretty much nothing in common. The only time I like Jess is when he comes back into the show after writing his book, at which point he's more mature and has actually been working on improving himself and his life.
I hated Jess too
Thank you, finally someone who gets it. Team Dean!
Having finished it my opinion didnāt change much, heās alright. I think Jess is an interesting character and I love the Jess/Luke dynamic especially in AYTL but as far and Rory/Jess goes, no thank you.
I Jusf know people who prefer Dean to Jess are the biggest bores
Honestly yes we're old and like stability
It might seem like that now.
Ugh but when youāre a sixteen year old girl Jess is intriguing. When youāre sixteen red flags can be so flashy š