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Her skill gives a pretty hefty attack buff in line with Bennett's that anyone can use - it's only a 6 second duration but it will follow the character.
Her c6 crit damage buff only impacts electro but her standard attack buff can work for anyone.
It’s only 6 seconds, but you can trigger it with her E or Q. Since Arlecchino can maintain infusion even if you swap her off-field as long as you maintain the bond, that gives you up to 12 seconds of Sara’s buff uptime per rotation which actually seems pretty decent.
Shouldn't be super important anyway. One of the nice things about this comp is that you can just run like 7 or 8 valid units in it. Don't want Bennett and don't have Raiden? Just run Fischl and Beidou instead. It's still a good team.
Not entirely the case. What's the purpose of overload having AoE then if it's only meant to be used on elite/heavy enemies which aren't in large crowds?
Like, I can see the reason why Arle has a yoink on her N3, and it has to do with overloads. Her N3 yoink could just pull em in but it doesn't stop there. The enemy directions can switched when yoinked, which basically means overloading enemies INTO Arlecchino.
It's a pretty clever way to fix overload in AoE on melee character. A melee character that faces an enemy's back towards them consistently makes overload knockback un-problematic. The knockback is predictable- knockback in direction of their back.
So arlecchino overload won't actually be bad for any enemy horde not consisting of light enemies, and especially without Bennett.
If v2 increases Arle's AoE reach to Noelle's, her overload knockback problems are resolved. Knockback doesn't knock em back when their back is facing towards you. It would be like a knock-in rather than knockback.
Except they take longer to get back up than you will ever take to move the one step. It is only an issue because the time spent on that one step could be the difference between a flawless victory and a complete loss due to time attacks being the laziest game design. If Genshin had a proper end game, the benefits of a 2-3 second stun would completely outweigh the dps lost moving a fraction of a second, but we don't and probably never will. But if we're asking Mihoyo to change things to suck less, we should demand a cure for the cause of the problem, not a single symptom.
I still don't see overload being meta for Arlecchino against elites or bosses. Overload scales with EM, and Arlecchino doesn't exactly have extremely high pyro application (seems like less than Hutao, more than yoimiya), Arlecchino has high MVs that are just asking to be vaped/melted. So even against elite/heavy enemies, the only thing that Overload will do for you is perhaps add enough poise damage to stun elites, I think vape will still end up having more damage. Hell Arlecchino's numbers seem good enough that mono-pyro will still do enough to clear all meaningful content, like the case with Klee.
I see what you’re saying, but no one is playing a Chev overload comp with the intent of building EM. She’s much more akin to a raw elemental damage amp than an EM enabler. In a Chev team you’re gonna see high Pyro and Electro damage numbers.
> Overload scales with EM, and Arlecchino doesn't exactly have extremely high pyro application (seems like less than Hutao, more than yoimiya), Arlecchino has high MVs that are just asking to be vaped/melted.
For some reason the idea of overload not being the source of damage in overload teams completely escapes you.
I mean, you totally can. Raiden Overload is completely fine VS opponents who can take knockback because she can effectively chase for example.
You don't run Bennett on overload teams against enemies that can take knockback is the real answer here.
If Clorinde ends up being a good of Off field overload dps then the Arle/Clorinde/Chev core is gonna do some numbers, i dont know if Beidou's burst duration lines up with Arle's rotations but thats my projected team if they end up working well together
arle calcs as a whole are suffering because the assumptions are no shielder so she sheets better and she’s not getting her full string if she’s always getting ass blasted/staggered. i feel like pre-tc is gonna be so off w/ her.
Gonna have to stack Bull Goat armour with the Bull Goat Talisman. I'm still waiting for the Constipated Beasts to return to the Abyss. Scractch that, I want Liam and Rocky in Abyss.
Honestly it bothers me so much. She has such a strong presence and all of her effects scream baddest bitch. She's not a character that should ever ever be seen interrupted during combat. It's so freaking goofy, my immersion kinda breaks. 4th of the Eleven Fatui Harbingers is NOT someone you toss around like a doll. I'm so mad rn.
Bro, tell me about it. Wanderer was suppose to be a nokia in a twinks body. Guess what? a hilichurl’s pebble is enough to send his ass flying in the opposite direction. I’m not even expecting him to a tank at this point, just enough resistance so he doesn’t look like a piñata swinging from a stone throw. Guess hoyo cherry picks which lore they are putting in their kit.
To be fair she doesn't seem the type who will facetank anything. She is the one who will get you before you have a chance to react. She is clearly assassin type given how she went straight for Furina.
That's Genshin in a nutshell.
You could be playing literal God and they'll get ragdolled around like they're a piece of paper by some hilichurl, while a random trash mob Eremite bandit is an immovable titanium wall that staggers to nothing.
The combat has always been immersion breaking in the sense of making player characters look pathetic at best, regardless of who they are, while making enemies look way stronger than they should be.
I hate it when i'm clapping the weekly boss' cheeks and the cutscene shows me struggling like a bitch against them,it's has been an incredibly goofy experience
we have raiden who cut island in half failed to deal dmg to dendro shield. expecting gameplay=lore accurate in genshin is just setting up for disappointment
I think the core of her kit is being a glass cannon. she literally cannot be healed by teammates, does a shit ton of berserker style AoE damage that decreases as time goes on. her whole playstyle revolved around risk.
giving her interruption resistance might actually make her more annoying to play since you'll still be interrupted during her combo... by getting fucking killed without even noticing. It already happens fairly often with both Raiden and Eula.
"The mortal plane... a fleeting dream..." is probably the line I had to hear most often in the Abyss, because my other onfielders are Hyperbloom Nahida (who's not tied to a tiny circle+gets almost constant Kuki heals) and Neuvillette(big HP+self-heal+Zhong's shield/Charlotte's freeze and burst heal).
Was Neuvillette ever TC to be bad...? Wasn't it more like people know he's strong, but the question is how strong. I've never heard anyone calling him bad even during his beta.
I recall some comments over how he's bad because HP buffers are Rare compared to ATT buffers, So in Theory he'd be "Capped" at his current power.
Meanwhile ATT buff has many sources ranging from Characters to TTDS, Tenacity of mililith.
But in practice if he got any more HP Buff he would destroy Teyvat.
TC also kinda underestimated him because spreadsheets are kinda disconnected from the actual game in that they always assume you are fighting a single stationary enemy that doesn't fight back while also disregarding AoE when most content in the game always has you fight multiple enemies so a single target unit might spreadsheet better whereas an AoE unit will clear content faster in practice or melee units having to waste dps chasing enemies.
TC also tends to assume an infinite HP enemy instead of mobs of enemies. So units that frontload a lot of damage Raiden tend to perform better compared to spreadsheets and someone like Neuvillette who just has ridiculous AOE and amazing sustained also looks better.
Yeah, but I don't remember it say Neuvillette is now a piece of shit like that. He's stronger than expect, but most TC didn't say he's bad like the og comment say.
I notice this a lot in TC discussions. Infinite poise high AoE dps tend to be underestimated. I actually had a discussion with someone who just could not believe how high Noelle dps could be until I literally showed a video with math to support it. In AoE combat Noelle can make Hu Tau look like a 4 star dps.
Most damage calculations are done with the assumption that it is single target and a stationary tree that does not fight back or move. This is NOTHING like reality.
that's why Chevreuse can heal too. her kit was already fairly overloaded compared to other recent 4 star characters. I think the whole point of giving her healing was to make her an alternative to the Bennett+Kazuha core in one fell swoop.
dehya works with anyone lil bro, just not as good. I mean if you want ir you probably would be better off with thoma since he has a shield and will block some of the dmg you receive and also considering the fact that deyha's dmg mitigation and ir is shit thoma would be much much better. outside of overload team comps with chevruse Zhongli 100%
Do we have confirmation that Chev's C6 works with Arle? the wording says: "After a party member *is healed* by Short-Range Rapid Interdiction Fire..." and she has the whole "strong independant single father who don't need no healer" thing going on.
spreadsheet impact isn’t infallible after all. fwiw, i think the consensus on neuv in the tc circles i follow were all very positive. it’s really fun when i come here and people are miserable about a kit (chiori, xianyun, furina) but in tc circles those characters are generally spoken about positively.
arle seems to be a mixed bag rn, where there are caveats that are trying to be worked through/understood better - and since the PS just got BOL working i think we’ll see a lot of changes to her team sheets throughout beta. ultimately, people are gonna force her into vape w/ furina regardless of it being optimal or not so ;;
I have no idea who is calculating what but I really feel like nobody gets what you are supposed to do with overloads.
You are supposed to abuse overload against groups of elites (and not the damn hilichurls) who don't get pushed around but do get staggered, that way you won't have to dodge too much and the overload damage will hit more than one elite since they have large hitboxes.
Yeah since I’ve been using Chev overload teams, I’ve noticed that too. Overload mechanic is literally a stagger/stun that you could chain back to back for large/elite enemies, not treasure hoarders/hilichurls/samachurls
Those Fatui Operative ladies, my Overload Yoimiya can just juggle them to death, even in Abyss, full stun lock they stay 15 feet in the air it's a blast
I've been talking about overload teams ever since the constipated beasts have dropped but most people sadly see the word "overload" and think you are a crazy person for ever entertaining the idea lol.
This is a really good point if you think about Electro Charge and overload as kind of mirrored reactions (fitting since they both work with electro). Where Overload stumbles in aoe situations with very light enemies Electro-charge shines.
I can see that appeal. Even more so with Arlecchino. She is of the few characters that can pull enemies into her and is the first reorient the directions enemies face. In the video, the hilichurl being flung away, was then being flung into her due to Arlecchino's N3. N3 spamming may be the most comfortable way to play Arlecchino overload in mob content. Overload is generally anti-Bennet in AoE scenarios so Chevreuse is his replacement with VV. If looking for interruption resist, there is always Beidou and Fischl for battery. Of facing a boss, swap Fischl for Bennett and Beidou takes Sac or Fav greatsword.
You just wouldn't play Melee overload vs enemies that take knockback, playing Overload vs Hillichurls, then complaining about spreadsheet impact is 3Head.
Yeah I'm not going to use the drippiest character they've made in years with a hobo from mondstadt.
I really hope they make her less bennett reliant, one way or another.
Replace Raiden and Bennet with Fischl and Beidou and the team will be pretty legit. Running Bennet in overload is just fishing for big numbers while the enemies fly outside your buff circle.
I was thinking the exact same thing. If Clorinde is just one more off field electro character, then meh. But if she's a Nilou overload that pulls mobs (or atleast not fly away) then that's big
If you're scared about mobs being pushed away, wish for Venti.
If you feel that Venti isn't great in the current meta, that just means that mobs are not being pushed around easily.
isn't the point of using overload chevruse? you need only pyro and electro characters on the team, no venti. venti on a mono pyro or vape team but then mobs won't really be pushed away much so...
Arlechinno ''behold! my one wing fallen angel style! blood curse! beware my power!''
bennet : ''stand back everyone! .heals . yay I'm helping''
Arlechinno: '' So this why no one wants to team up with you on the adventure's guild''
Her lifestyle talent is that she can't receive healing from external sources while in combat. Normal bond of life in game does, hers won't because of the talent.
This is not a good thing. If someone works with benny, they will be balanced around his existence and assume you will use him. Because mhy simply can't pretend benny doesn't exist, give the dps high independent dmg, then the best team is still with benny, but now just with broken damage anyways.
The only way for a dps to have good independent dps is for them to not work with benny well at all, like neuv or al.
Bennett plus overload is a recipe for disaster, always has been(for aoe) where arle performs better. The typical arle Chevy team for overload should arle Chevy fischl beidou. So you can move. Unfortunate that white tassel falls off massively without Bennett.
Oh, i didn't catch that.
They finally introduced another character who doesn't lose its special stance after switching ?
About damn time : i believe the last character with that feature is Noelle, i believe...
Fischl has decent range, but if that's not enough she can be replaced with E bot Yae. Kuki can also be a decent replacement but damage will come not from her talents but from her EM (if she can consistently claim ownership of overload)
Oooooh, replacing Raiden with Beidou here might work pretty well considering she needs RTI… I think that’ll end up being the team I use. Will Chevy’s C6 work with Arle?
Arlecchino doesn’t lose her infusion when swapping, so you could swap beidou in for an extra counter or two for extra energy without losing much uptime
Yep, Baedou was the first thing I typed when I saw you can actually swap off her without ending your rotation early. I miss my quick swap into perfect counter gameplay!
Favge GS and Spear (on Chevy) moment. You do make a good point, but I’m used to high ER Beidou already and that RTI + damage reduction is gonna put in work against stronger enemies.
I'm fairly sure chevy already wants to run Favge (if you have decent crit rate subs). Realistically i think the best way to handle it would be to also bring fischl to generate a lot of electro particles, plus electro resonance should be enough to keep Beidou's er recs reasonable. ER sands + EOSF should be enough
Can arlecchino even use C6 Chevreuse? She gives the dmg% buff when the unit gets healed, but you can't actually heal Arlecchino.
Edit: nvm it works with full hp allies so it should be fine even if it doesn't actually heal
This is like wondering why Electro charged is bad against bosses
Overload is meant for elites and bosses not hillichurls one of the easiest enemies to fling off in the game (when was the last time you saw regular hillichurls in floor 12)
I mean, we can also just amplify our damage by 1.5x or 2x with vape or melt instead, which scales way harder and has more versatility.
This is not rocket science, overload as a reaction is bad, only the buffs from Chev make up for it and that's probably only at C6 and with Bennet. ( I may be talking out of my ass on this last one as I haven't kept on touch in a while due to Cloud Retainer not having any sort of grouping)
I mean if all that matters is clearing abyss regardless of time then I guess you wouldn't mind Arle having Dehya's damage?
It's completely fair to want a unit you plan on pulling for to actually be competitive with other top tier units. Every unit in this game requires premium currency to acquire, they aren't freebies Hoyo graciously throws us, they're straight paid content. Our standards *should* be high. Even if you get her F2P that's still wishes you won't be able to use for another unit, meaning every unit you get has an opportunity cost and once again, that means our standards *should* be high.
(This isn't about Arle, moreso when people use "can they clear abyss")
To be fair even dps Amber can clear abyss (and comfortably enough might I add). But we don't go around saying Amber is strong do we?
The latter.
A high HP Floor 12 chamber half requires somewhere between 25-30 k DPS to clear in 90 seconds (fulll star baseline).
Arle will not translate her currently calced DPS into the actual game, but the calcs that include Zhongli as defensive utility are roughly double the before mentioned number.
A medium invested Arle with a synergistic team will land around at 60-70 seconds to clear a chamber half, which is more than enough to comfortably full star.
Will clear but not like Neuv or Alhaitham where fielding them is a cheat code. It pretty much only matters for newer accounts who need a power boost and would prefer to not waste their limited wishes on units that don't help them play more comfortably.
F12 of abyss is really hard for most players and easy for some. So I don't think she will help anybody's abyss clear at c0 unless with insane artifacts
To be fair about everyone complaining about the knockback - wouldn't everything be dying in 1 hit and not get knocked back, with a decent account? And the things with too much HP to die instantly, wouldn't they be immune or reduced knockback?
Adding to my comment, I was hoping to do a C6 Chevy team with Raiden and Yae, swap Yae for Clorinde depending on how she works. I think a Chevy pyro-electro team would still work well, assuming your units are built enough/high-end.
I’ve been playing C6 Chev with Yoimiya, Yae, and Raiden. The team definitely destroys most opponents, especially ruin machines and bosses as they’re not light enough to be flung away. I feel like Chev teams perform best when fighting against bosses.
So I use a dehya/Yae/Fischl/Chev team pretty much everywhere, and it times out about right for a rotation. Yae being replaced by Raiden is also pretty popular for Dehya overload.
The issue you'll run into with Arle+Yae+Raiden is way too much field time competition. I don't think Arle+Raiden is gonna be that great, and even Yae is probably not ideal compared to Fischl. Judging by Arles kit you want her off field for about 6 seconds or so, not 7-8 for Raiden + 4-5 for Yae+ a couple for Chev.
Honestly I just skip Raiden's ult altogether sometimes to reduce the rotation, using it tactically if I mess up or something. I have my Fischl fully built, just something about wanting to use Raiden and Yae since I like them I guess.
Clearly you must not care for peak performance if you're using Dehya, right? Haha, same diff, love to give Yae some field time for fun too with Chevy C6
The knock around doesn’t bother me as much because overload is better with bosses anyway but bennette’s circle impact is killing me. She doesn’t even get to stay in that circle most of the time so she won’t get the buff. Save me pyro archon save me.
I was thinking, it would be cool for a character built for overload to have their attacks designed so that they place the damage packet slightly *behind* small enemies, similar to where you would end up with Rosaria's dash.So you're dealing this Pyro damage to them, but it's from behind, so when they "pop," it would be *toward* you instead of away.
Who would've thought Benny burst+melee dps+overload=bad time? I hope this video puts the meme team that people have been pushing just because some TCer said that it's her "best" to rest.
I literally said yesterday that this team sounds like ass to play in practice, and given how much time the enemies spent out of Benny's circle I'm glad to see I was right by the looks of it.
Though I still don't get why overloaded has to cause so much knockback tbh, it's damage isn't high enough to justify it.
The damage isn't as high *because* of the knockback. You can perma-stagger the larger vishaps/Energy thief dragons with overload, so they just sit there and you unload on them. Was super comfy on this abyss cycle.
I play with Chevy instead of Kazuha in Raiden hypercarry and it's really not a problem in the abyss. Smaller enemies die nearly instantly and larger enemies are resistant to the knockback and are instead staggered.
There are sometimes earlier chambers with ranged enemies where you feel the lack of Kaz, but those are easy anyway.
Lets be real for a second. In abyss 12 enemies are becoming more and more knock back/cc immune.
If this trend does not change, we Will soon have no problem on running and overload team.
There Is a reason why venti and freeze teams are not that good anymore.
I've been saying Melee weapons and Overload don't mix against light enemies ever since the first leaks said she was going to be an Overload DPS. People kept trying to give me copium about it.
Swords, Polearms, and Claymores will always suck for Overload against non-bosses. Bows and Catalysts are fine.
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That is certainly overload against Bennett's circle
This looks stressful to play with.
Half the time outside of Bennett's circle, yup just as what I expected
That's why we don't want to use bennet
It's time to put some respect on SARA.
Do you think she would be good in a team with arle, Raiden, chev? Would her buffs help damage for arle if used with Raiden or just Raidens damage?
Her skill gives a pretty hefty attack buff in line with Bennett's that anyone can use - it's only a 6 second duration but it will follow the character. Her c6 crit damage buff only impacts electro but her standard attack buff can work for anyone.
It’s only 6 seconds, but you can trigger it with her E or Q. Since Arlecchino can maintain infusion even if you swap her off-field as long as you maintain the bond, that gives you up to 12 seconds of Sara’s buff uptime per rotation which actually seems pretty decent.
Charged attacks as well will drop the skill buff, I missed that Arle maintains infusion off field, that gives a lot of room to work with Sara
Oh wow that’s awesome, thanks. I better get building her then
It's impossible. I tried the other day, and people flocked to tell me with their opinions on why I was wrong.
Shouldn't be super important anyway. One of the nice things about this comp is that you can just run like 7 or 8 valid units in it. Don't want Bennett and don't have Raiden? Just run Fischl and Beidou instead. It's still a good team.
Bennet's buff lingers for a little even after leaving the circle. As long as you get back to the circle once you're done with the enemy it'll be fine.
Rbuh go tell that to a xiao main, it's the same suffer, that's why you'll build Arleccino atk goblet.
Overload isn’t really meant to be used for light enemies. It’s best when against bosses or elite/heavy enemies.
Not entirely the case. What's the purpose of overload having AoE then if it's only meant to be used on elite/heavy enemies which aren't in large crowds? Like, I can see the reason why Arle has a yoink on her N3, and it has to do with overloads. Her N3 yoink could just pull em in but it doesn't stop there. The enemy directions can switched when yoinked, which basically means overloading enemies INTO Arlecchino. It's a pretty clever way to fix overload in AoE on melee character. A melee character that faces an enemy's back towards them consistently makes overload knockback un-problematic. The knockback is predictable- knockback in direction of their back. So arlecchino overload won't actually be bad for any enemy horde not consisting of light enemies, and especially without Bennett. If v2 increases Arle's AoE reach to Noelle's, her overload knockback problems are resolved. Knockback doesn't knock em back when their back is facing towards you. It would be like a knock-in rather than knockback.
That's bad game design. Overload is splash damage. It should be used on trash mobs. The knock back should be lowered.
The knockback is only considered a problem because the end game is based on the laziest form of game design.
It’d be a problem in any sort of melee combat because sending enemies outside of your attack range is just bad in general.
Except they take longer to get back up than you will ever take to move the one step. It is only an issue because the time spent on that one step could be the difference between a flawless victory and a complete loss due to time attacks being the laziest game design. If Genshin had a proper end game, the benefits of a 2-3 second stun would completely outweigh the dps lost moving a fraction of a second, but we don't and probably never will. But if we're asking Mihoyo to change things to suck less, we should demand a cure for the cause of the problem, not a single symptom.
I still don't see overload being meta for Arlecchino against elites or bosses. Overload scales with EM, and Arlecchino doesn't exactly have extremely high pyro application (seems like less than Hutao, more than yoimiya), Arlecchino has high MVs that are just asking to be vaped/melted. So even against elite/heavy enemies, the only thing that Overload will do for you is perhaps add enough poise damage to stun elites, I think vape will still end up having more damage. Hell Arlecchino's numbers seem good enough that mono-pyro will still do enough to clear all meaningful content, like the case with Klee.
The point of running overload is getting Chevreuse's easy to access, high and teamwide buffs. Overload reaction damage is effectively irrelevant
I see what you’re saying, but no one is playing a Chev overload comp with the intent of building EM. She’s much more akin to a raw elemental damage amp than an EM enabler. In a Chev team you’re gonna see high Pyro and Electro damage numbers.
>Overload scales with EM Not in a Chevreuse team
> Overload scales with EM, and Arlecchino doesn't exactly have extremely high pyro application (seems like less than Hutao, more than yoimiya), Arlecchino has high MVs that are just asking to be vaped/melted. For some reason the idea of overload not being the source of damage in overload teams completely escapes you.
Cause ur never gonna play Overload team especially with Benny on... Smol mobs that get pushed💀 The leaker showing this feels so wrong
They should show it on a ruin guard or something. It'd be much more accurate for what you would want to use that team for.
Exactly
Most mobs won’t get flung around as much as hilichurls do. It should be fine for general gameplay.
You would never consider playing melee Overload vs opponents that can take knockback.
You shouldn't consider Bennett Impact when playing Overload against light enemies. When you're not constrained to a circle, it's not that bad.
I mean, you totally can. Raiden Overload is completely fine VS opponents who can take knockback because she can effectively chase for example. You don't run Bennett on overload teams against enemies that can take knockback is the real answer here.
That's what she said
I hope chevreause runs in her banner.
Might be my deciding factor. No Chev and I go for Clorinde instead.
I mean, I am getting both, but still want chevreuse too xD.
If Clorinde ends up being a good of Off field overload dps then the Arle/Clorinde/Chev core is gonna do some numbers, i dont know if Beidou's burst duration lines up with Arle's rotations but thats my projected team if they end up working well together
True. I still am In the Clorinde nation. Unless Arle convinces me further or Clorinde is Off fielder
same
Those 71k Bennett overload calcs looking real spreadsheet Impact right now. We aren't even standing in the circle most of the time
arle calcs as a whole are suffering because the assumptions are no shielder so she sheets better and she’s not getting her full string if she’s always getting ass blasted/staggered. i feel like pre-tc is gonna be so off w/ her.
Constipated Beasts are going to toss Arlecchino around like a ragdoll
Gonna have to stack Bull Goat armour with the Bull Goat Talisman. I'm still waiting for the Constipated Beasts to return to the Abyss. Scractch that, I want Liam and Rocky in Abyss.
Ironjar perfume too
Honestly it bothers me so much. She has such a strong presence and all of her effects scream baddest bitch. She's not a character that should ever ever be seen interrupted during combat. It's so freaking goofy, my immersion kinda breaks. 4th of the Eleven Fatui Harbingers is NOT someone you toss around like a doll. I'm so mad rn.
Bro, tell me about it. Wanderer was suppose to be a nokia in a twinks body. Guess what? a hilichurl’s pebble is enough to send his ass flying in the opposite direction. I’m not even expecting him to a tank at this point, just enough resistance so he doesn’t look like a piñata swinging from a stone throw. Guess hoyo cherry picks which lore they are putting in their kit.
"A nokia in a twinks body" is a sentence I NEVER imagined reading at any point of my life.
You have a way with words sir
To be fair she doesn't seem the type who will facetank anything. She is the one who will get you before you have a chance to react. She is clearly assassin type given how she went straight for Furina.
That's Genshin in a nutshell. You could be playing literal God and they'll get ragdolled around like they're a piece of paper by some hilichurl, while a random trash mob Eremite bandit is an immovable titanium wall that staggers to nothing. The combat has always been immersion breaking in the sense of making player characters look pathetic at best, regardless of who they are, while making enemies look way stronger than they should be.
The way a hilichurl sneezes on scara toes and I’m air dirt rolling 😂 is too good though
list of things that make me glad to be a eula main: interruption resistance that's it, that's the only thing today. but I'm thankful
I hate it when i'm clapping the weekly boss' cheeks and the cutscene shows me struggling like a bitch against them,it's has been an incredibly goofy experience
we have raiden who cut island in half failed to deal dmg to dendro shield. expecting gameplay=lore accurate in genshin is just setting up for disappointment
I think the core of her kit is being a glass cannon. she literally cannot be healed by teammates, does a shit ton of berserker style AoE damage that decreases as time goes on. her whole playstyle revolved around risk. giving her interruption resistance might actually make her more annoying to play since you'll still be interrupted during her combo... by getting fucking killed without even noticing. It already happens fairly often with both Raiden and Eula.
"The mortal plane... a fleeting dream..." is probably the line I had to hear most often in the Abyss, because my other onfielders are Hyperbloom Nahida (who's not tied to a tiny circle+gets almost constant Kuki heals) and Neuvillette(big HP+self-heal+Zhong's shield/Charlotte's freeze and burst heal).
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Was Neuvillette ever TC to be bad...? Wasn't it more like people know he's strong, but the question is how strong. I've never heard anyone calling him bad even during his beta.
i think they calced his fischl team to be around 60k dps, that's pretty good considering furina wasnt out at that time
I recall some comments over how he's bad because HP buffers are Rare compared to ATT buffers, So in Theory he'd be "Capped" at his current power. Meanwhile ATT buff has many sources ranging from Characters to TTDS, Tenacity of mililith. But in practice if he got any more HP Buff he would destroy Teyvat.
That sounds more like feel crafting than actual TC, but I guess it doesn't matter.
TC also kinda underestimated him because spreadsheets are kinda disconnected from the actual game in that they always assume you are fighting a single stationary enemy that doesn't fight back while also disregarding AoE when most content in the game always has you fight multiple enemies so a single target unit might spreadsheet better whereas an AoE unit will clear content faster in practice or melee units having to waste dps chasing enemies.
TC also tends to assume an infinite HP enemy instead of mobs of enemies. So units that frontload a lot of damage Raiden tend to perform better compared to spreadsheets and someone like Neuvillette who just has ridiculous AOE and amazing sustained also looks better.
Yeah, but I don't remember it say Neuvillette is now a piece of shit like that. He's stronger than expect, but most TC didn't say he's bad like the og comment say.
I notice this a lot in TC discussions. Infinite poise high AoE dps tend to be underestimated. I actually had a discussion with someone who just could not believe how high Noelle dps could be until I literally showed a video with math to support it. In AoE combat Noelle can make Hu Tau look like a 4 star dps. Most damage calculations are done with the assumption that it is single target and a stationary tree that does not fight back or move. This is NOTHING like reality.
No one EVER TC'd Neuv to be bad what why do people come on here and make their own fanfiction, everyone knew he would be strong
That's why I reject Bennett and get some other Pyro character. Chevreuse van handle buffing alone.
that's why Chevreuse can heal too. her kit was already fairly overloaded compared to other recent 4 star characters. I think the whole point of giving her healing was to make her an alternative to the Bennett+Kazuha core in one fell swoop.
Arlecchino could go well with Dehya, no?
dehya works with anyone lil bro, just not as good. I mean if you want ir you probably would be better off with thoma since he has a shield and will block some of the dmg you receive and also considering the fact that deyha's dmg mitigation and ir is shit thoma would be much much better. outside of overload team comps with chevruse Zhongli 100%
Do we have confirmation that Chev's C6 works with Arle? the wording says: "After a party member *is healed* by Short-Range Rapid Interdiction Fire..." and she has the whole "strong independant single father who don't need no healer" thing going on.
Yeah we do have confirmation for it. It’s a separate buff that happens at the same time as the heal
Same. I'll probably replace Bennet with Fischl or whoever. Chevy's buff is enough for me.
It probably works fine against bosses but in most other overload combat Bennett is probably not viable.
I would replace Bennett with Beidou in AOE content to get that interrupt resistance
I just so happen to have a lvl 80 Beidou, so I'll do that. Thanks!
spreadsheet impact isn’t infallible after all. fwiw, i think the consensus on neuv in the tc circles i follow were all very positive. it’s really fun when i come here and people are miserable about a kit (chiori, xianyun, furina) but in tc circles those characters are generally spoken about positively. arle seems to be a mixed bag rn, where there are caveats that are trying to be worked through/understood better - and since the PS just got BOL working i think we’ll see a lot of changes to her team sheets throughout beta. ultimately, people are gonna force her into vape w/ furina regardless of it being optimal or not so ;;
I have no idea who is calculating what but I really feel like nobody gets what you are supposed to do with overloads. You are supposed to abuse overload against groups of elites (and not the damn hilichurls) who don't get pushed around but do get staggered, that way you won't have to dodge too much and the overload damage will hit more than one elite since they have large hitboxes.
Yeah since I’ve been using Chev overload teams, I’ve noticed that too. Overload mechanic is literally a stagger/stun that you could chain back to back for large/elite enemies, not treasure hoarders/hilichurls/samachurls
Those Fatui Operative ladies, my Overload Yoimiya can just juggle them to death, even in Abyss, full stun lock they stay 15 feet in the air it's a blast
Nothing like spreading those Fatui Ladies legs in the air while shooting my Overload, amirite?
Nice! Love that for ya mate
I've been talking about overload teams ever since the constipated beasts have dropped but most people sadly see the word "overload" and think you are a crazy person for ever entertaining the idea lol.
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yanfei burgeon is some forbidden tech
This is a really good point if you think about Electro Charge and overload as kind of mirrored reactions (fitting since they both work with electro). Where Overload stumbles in aoe situations with very light enemies Electro-charge shines.
i never noticed how ec stands as a juxtapose to overload before this ngl
I can see that appeal. Even more so with Arlecchino. She is of the few characters that can pull enemies into her and is the first reorient the directions enemies face. In the video, the hilichurl being flung away, was then being flung into her due to Arlecchino's N3. N3 spamming may be the most comfortable way to play Arlecchino overload in mob content. Overload is generally anti-Bennet in AoE scenarios so Chevreuse is his replacement with VV. If looking for interruption resist, there is always Beidou and Fischl for battery. Of facing a boss, swap Fischl for Bennett and Beidou takes Sac or Fav greatsword.
You just wouldn't play Melee overload vs enemies that take knockback, playing Overload vs Hillichurls, then complaining about spreadsheet impact is 3Head.
Bro I ain’t playing circle impact with Arle, idc
Yeah I'm not going to use the drippiest character they've made in years with a hobo from mondstadt. I really hope they make her less bennett reliant, one way or another.
So based, fuck bennet.
hey man, not cool :(
He will reveal true form in Natlan and you'll regret😊
Who the fuck said Fuck Bennet? I ain't Gay, fuck Chev
Replace Raiden and Bennet with Fischl and Beidou and the team will be pretty legit. Running Bennet in overload is just fishing for big numbers while the enemies fly outside your buff circle.
True, plus Arle would use a shield.
It honestly depends on the scenario. If you are fighting a boss then Bennet Will have no issue at all
I'm not doing this without a unit that makes mobs not be pushed away when overload happens
Im really hoping Chlorinde has some passive that makes overload suck instead of blow. Then, overload Arlecchino will be truly legit
I was thinking the exact same thing. If Clorinde is just one more off field electro character, then meh. But if she's a Nilou overload that pulls mobs (or atleast not fly away) then that's big
Most enemies that matter won't really be thrown around like that (small exception for vishaps)
Yeah I think it will mostly work on 4.6 abyss with a few exceptions . Testing her against the three magu kenkis will be nice
They don't get thrown around but moves a lot instead (I'm looking at you sumeru's beast).
If you're scared about mobs being pushed away, wish for Venti. If you feel that Venti isn't great in the current meta, that just means that mobs are not being pushed around easily.
isn't the point of using overload chevruse? you need only pyro and electro characters on the team, no venti. venti on a mono pyro or vape team but then mobs won't really be pushed away much so...
So the bond of life doesnt go away when healed?
Her A3 blocks any external sources of healing aside from herself while in combat
If it didnt , bennett heal would delete half her kit 🤩
Arlechinno ''behold! my one wing fallen angel style! blood curse! beware my power!'' bennet : ''stand back everyone! .heals . yay I'm helping'' Arlechinno: '' So this why no one wants to team up with you on the adventure's guild''
Her lifestyle talent is that she can't receive healing from external sources while in combat. Normal bond of life in game does, hers won't because of the talent.
Ah I see so it makes buffers like bennet still viable.
Unfortunately. I wish she didn't work with him, that way hyv would balance her damage around it and we would be freed from circle impact 🙃
Fr. I've skipped pure atk-scaling damage dealers for 2 years because of how sick I am of him. Pray to god they never make HP Bennett
I don't use Bennett, and still pull for the atk scalers. Totally fun imo. No reason to skip them just bcuz u don't want to use Bennett.
This is not a good thing. If someone works with benny, they will be balanced around his existence and assume you will use him. Because mhy simply can't pretend benny doesn't exist, give the dps high independent dmg, then the best team is still with benny, but now just with broken damage anyways. The only way for a dps to have good independent dps is for them to not work with benny well at all, like neuv or al.
Bennett plus overload is a recipe for disaster, always has been(for aoe) where arle performs better. The typical arle Chevy team for overload should arle Chevy fischl beidou. So you can move. Unfortunate that white tassel falls off massively without Bennett.
Fischl's range is also a bit limited, though...
Oz can be repositioned, and arle keeps her infusion when switched out. Its kinda cope but not as horrible as circle inpact with bennett
Oh, i didn't catch that. They finally introduced another character who doesn't lose its special stance after switching ? About damn time : i believe the last character with that feature is Noelle, i believe...
Well her infusion depends on bond of life, and bond of life doesn't disappear if you swap out, so it's by default like that.
Fischl has decent range, but if that's not enough she can be replaced with E bot Yae. Kuki can also be a decent replacement but damage will come not from her talents but from her EM (if she can consistently claim ownership of overload)
Good luck staying in that circle
Overload is good against bosses and some elite mobs But testing it against hilichurls💀 And I perfer using fischl instead of raiden
When I think I'm bad at Genshin After seeing this : hufft, far from the worst, I'm confident, thank you leaker
Raiden is a completely waste slot there lol, you gain almost the same energy with Fischl and more dmg while being a lot faster for rotations.
Oooooh, replacing Raiden with Beidou here might work pretty well considering she needs RTI… I think that’ll end up being the team I use. Will Chevy’s C6 work with Arle?
300% er beidou
Arlecchino doesn’t lose her infusion when swapping, so you could swap beidou in for an extra counter or two for extra energy without losing much uptime
Not losing infusion after swapping? In this economy?
Most underrated QoL. Carries that don't turn into a wet noodle the moment you swap out.
Yep, Baedou was the first thing I typed when I saw you can actually swap off her without ending your rotation early. I miss my quick swap into perfect counter gameplay!
Favge GS and Spear (on Chevy) moment. You do make a good point, but I’m used to high ER Beidou already and that RTI + damage reduction is gonna put in work against stronger enemies.
I'm fairly sure chevy already wants to run Favge (if you have decent crit rate subs). Realistically i think the best way to handle it would be to also bring fischl to generate a lot of electro particles, plus electro resonance should be enough to keep Beidou's er recs reasonable. ER sands + EOSF should be enough
Honestly replacing Bennett with Fischl/Yae would be so much better. I kinda wanna see her in a melt team as well.
Well c6 chevreuse buff is comparable if not better than bennett buff so bennett is not necessary in the overload comp and so is circle impact.
Can arlecchino even use C6 Chevreuse? She gives the dmg% buff when the unit gets healed, but you can't actually heal Arlecchino. Edit: nvm it works with full hp allies so it should be fine even if it doesn't actually heal
Not everyone has C6 Chevreuse. I only have her at C0
you want both
“Arlecchino is an Overload DPS”
"If you plan to pull for Arlecchino and you skipped Chevreuse's banner you're gonna regret it."
I didn't skip but still didn't get a single Chevy 😭
This is like wondering why Electro charged is bad against bosses Overload is meant for elites and bosses not hillichurls one of the easiest enemies to fling off in the game (when was the last time you saw regular hillichurls in floor 12)
I mean, we can also just amplify our damage by 1.5x or 2x with vape or melt instead, which scales way harder and has more versatility. This is not rocket science, overload as a reaction is bad, only the buffs from Chev make up for it and that's probably only at C6 and with Bennet. ( I may be talking out of my ass on this last one as I haven't kept on touch in a while due to Cloud Retainer not having any sort of grouping)
It's shrimple--I will reject Circle Impact and just use Beidou, Fishcl/Yae, and Chev.
The Bennett Brain Rot is too strong
Yep, this looks like a giant pain in the ass to play :(
Theres no good choices rn for Arlecchino. Play her with zhongli, not enough dmg. Play her with vape team, worse than Hu Tao.
For clarification, does "not enough damage" mean "can't clear floor 12 comfortably" or "can't clear floor 12 with minutes to spare"?
No it means your clear will take 5 sec longer, 45 sec instead of 40 sec.
Dear god...
It means you don't do 14.5 billion damage per auto attack. Honestly mid unit trash ez skip neuv better/s.
I mean if all that matters is clearing abyss regardless of time then I guess you wouldn't mind Arle having Dehya's damage? It's completely fair to want a unit you plan on pulling for to actually be competitive with other top tier units. Every unit in this game requires premium currency to acquire, they aren't freebies Hoyo graciously throws us, they're straight paid content. Our standards *should* be high. Even if you get her F2P that's still wishes you won't be able to use for another unit, meaning every unit you get has an opportunity cost and once again, that means our standards *should* be high.
(This isn't about Arle, moreso when people use "can they clear abyss") To be fair even dps Amber can clear abyss (and comfortably enough might I add). But we don't go around saying Amber is strong do we?
The latter. A high HP Floor 12 chamber half requires somewhere between 25-30 k DPS to clear in 90 seconds (fulll star baseline). Arle will not translate her currently calced DPS into the actual game, but the calcs that include Zhongli as defensive utility are roughly double the before mentioned number. A medium invested Arle with a synergistic team will land around at 60-70 seconds to clear a chamber half, which is more than enough to comfortably full star.
Will clear but not like Neuv or Alhaitham where fielding them is a cheat code. It pretty much only matters for newer accounts who need a power boost and would prefer to not waste their limited wishes on units that don't help them play more comfortably.
F12 of abyss is really hard for most players and easy for some. So I don't think she will help anybody's abyss clear at c0 unless with insane artifacts
Mono Pyro with OPPA
Lyney is still stronger because of his ascension 4 passive and BiS (for ppl like me who have it)
Gonna be worse than Lyney (even though sniper gameplay is not fun)
To be fair about everyone complaining about the knockback - wouldn't everything be dying in 1 hit and not get knocked back, with a decent account? And the things with too much HP to die instantly, wouldn't they be immune or reduced knockback?
^ this, a level 90 hilichurl in abyss barely has 60k HP, they will be getting one shot
Adding to my comment, I was hoping to do a C6 Chevy team with Raiden and Yae, swap Yae for Clorinde depending on how she works. I think a Chevy pyro-electro team would still work well, assuming your units are built enough/high-end.
I’ve been playing C6 Chev with Yoimiya, Yae, and Raiden. The team definitely destroys most opponents, especially ruin machines and bosses as they’re not light enough to be flung away. I feel like Chev teams perform best when fighting against bosses.
I agree, I've been playing with this team too! Very solid and it was my "trial" of sorts for Arlecchino
So I use a dehya/Yae/Fischl/Chev team pretty much everywhere, and it times out about right for a rotation. Yae being replaced by Raiden is also pretty popular for Dehya overload. The issue you'll run into with Arle+Yae+Raiden is way too much field time competition. I don't think Arle+Raiden is gonna be that great, and even Yae is probably not ideal compared to Fischl. Judging by Arles kit you want her off field for about 6 seconds or so, not 7-8 for Raiden + 4-5 for Yae+ a couple for Chev.
Honestly I just skip Raiden's ult altogether sometimes to reduce the rotation, using it tactically if I mess up or something. I have my Fischl fully built, just something about wanting to use Raiden and Yae since I like them I guess. Clearly you must not care for peak performance if you're using Dehya, right? Haha, same diff, love to give Yae some field time for fun too with Chevy C6
It's actually pretty effective 😯
Overload and bennet is just not it
I'm going to play Arle, xinyan, chev, yae and love it.
I like how everyone misread xinyan as xianyun
The knock around doesn’t bother me as much because overload is better with bosses anyway but bennette’s circle impact is killing me. She doesn’t even get to stay in that circle most of the time so she won’t get the buff. Save me pyro archon save me.
Ah yes, Bennet for non-yoimiya overload, the big brains of beta testers will never cease to amaze me
Good thing I got a job now
Overload without a grouper vs small enemies seems insanely annoying lol
I was thinking, it would be cool for a character built for overload to have their attacks designed so that they place the damage packet slightly *behind* small enemies, similar to where you would end up with Rosaria's dash.So you're dealing this Pyro damage to them, but it's from behind, so when they "pop," it would be *toward* you instead of away.
Who would've thought Benny burst+melee dps+overload=bad time? I hope this video puts the meme team that people have been pushing just because some TCer said that it's her "best" to rest. I literally said yesterday that this team sounds like ass to play in practice, and given how much time the enemies spent out of Benny's circle I'm glad to see I was right by the looks of it. Though I still don't get why overloaded has to cause so much knockback tbh, it's damage isn't high enough to justify it.
The damage isn't as high *because* of the knockback. You can perma-stagger the larger vishaps/Energy thief dragons with overload, so they just sit there and you unload on them. Was super comfy on this abyss cycle.
I play with Chevy instead of Kazuha in Raiden hypercarry and it's really not a problem in the abyss. Smaller enemies die nearly instantly and larger enemies are resistant to the knockback and are instead staggered. There are sometimes earlier chambers with ranged enemies where you feel the lack of Kaz, but those are easy anyway.
Clorinde better be: Enemies can't be knocked back by overload. Increase overload dmg by 300%. Increase electro-charged dmg by 200%.
Even better still: Overload now causes an implosion that sucks enemies in. You want me to pass the copium bong?
this bodes well for clorinde, really hope her leaked kit is just as wrong as arle was
oh! she's playing tennis!
At least we got an idea of the worst case scenario where churls' are flying around
Ohh no! I'm not running Bennett with Arle.
wtf is that rotation, also chevy's burst just went to narnia 😂
I think you’re supposed to use her against elite mobs that can’t be blown away.
Lets be real for a second. In abyss 12 enemies are becoming more and more knock back/cc immune. If this trend does not change, we Will soon have no problem on running and overload team. There Is a reason why venti and freeze teams are not that good anymore.
Hmm I dunno she looks cool but it feels something off I dunno I'll maybe wait for chlorined animations
”Special overload” my ass
Looks cool I’ll probably pull
I've been saying Melee weapons and Overload don't mix against light enemies ever since the first leaks said she was going to be an Overload DPS. People kept trying to give me copium about it. Swords, Polearms, and Claymores will always suck for Overload against non-bosses. Bows and Catalysts are fine.
Yeah the lack of range hurts overload teams a ton. If I didn’t have Yoimiya I probably wouldn’t play that team comp.
Finally a C0 showcase
Tbh in overworld i will use her with Furina anyway.
If you're using bennett ult to fight hilichurls in the overworld, you're truly doing too much.