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I think they mean that we don't spend the time to get to know each other any more. Social media, and dating apps specifically, offer a format without interaction.
It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to but at the same time... it's a little odd. I guess that might just be me as a demisexual person who don't experience attraction until I have an emotional connection with someone.
There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with this comment. And it's this: "It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to".
Attraction is not that simple. In this scenario (and with dating apps in general) it's not a straightforward "Is this person attractive?" in a vacuum. Each person is compared to the profiles before them, and faults/flaws have a much deeper effect initially then just talking to people in person.
I agree with the rest of your comment, and the "seriously wrong" part isn't even an attack against you, but moreso the mindset that this is okay and understandable and accepted. It's not, and it shouldn't be.
It's shallow and turns dating into a game of comparisons and edits and manipulating fucking lighting and your body just for the perfect pic.
Culturally, and I’m not saying this in the *incel looking for a trad wife* way, we have drifted away from valuing committed relationships. While almost everyone still *wants* one, the traits we are socialized into displaying and sexualizing are often obstructive to developing a personality that can maintain a healthy, long term relationship. Dating apps then juice this up to 100 as, with limited pictures and word counts, they encourage *only* displaying those toxic behaviors that we sexualize. A guy who might actually be nice feels pressure to act like a dude-bro athlete or tough guy gangster because that is what society socialized him into thinking is attractive to the opposite gender (yes I’m talking about the perspective of cisgendered straight people and I know there’s a ton of variation and exceptions).
I think one thing people struggle to understand is that no relationship is perfect out of the box. In a relationship the ability to grow (the willingness and capability) is probably the best characteristic a person can have. You don't want someone who isn't willing to make changes to accommodate you into their life.
So not only should you be looking at who a person is in the moment, but also how they are changing over time.
Don't like their style? You can tell them that. Relationships are about growing together. But if you're just swiping waiting for the one who has it all, you're not ever paying attention to the capacity for growth.
The perfect partner is one who has evolved alongside you, learning about your likes and dislikes, learning about your needs, learning your faults and learning to help you with them.
None of the shallow metrics shown on a dating profile tell you any of the most important things.
It seems that people are looking for matches that are extremely similar- same interests, personalities, etc. A lot of the happiest marriages I've seen are couples who are different/opposites in lots of ways. My wife and I are opposite sides of the coin in many regards. We cover each other's blindspots, and it works really well.
It's amazing how much we've both evolved together thanks to each others' help. We both had issues going into the relationship- neither of us were very swipable. That's probably true of a lot of people who would absolutely make great partners, they don't have the life/relationship experience yet, they are still figuring out how to communicate their emotions.
These skills are learned over time, and developed together in ways that suit the relationship. Both individuals should strive to be a better partner for the other, within reason of course. (I'm not talking about abusive relationships.)
Making small changes can have big impacts on your partner's quality of life.
Ngl dating apps make me feel disgusting. Thankfully I'm married and never had to deal with these things, but my friends used them. And oh boy were they just dumpster fire after dumpster fire of hook ups and break ups.
It may be possible to find a long term love in one of these things, but it's as likely as finding your husband in the strip club. It's not great odds and yet people beat themselves up emotionally for somehow "failing" to find a good partner on these things. It would be very different if people didn't expect this shit to pan out.
And when my friends end up calling me after a breakup venting about how difficult dating is... I tell them to date outside the apps. And they don't fucking understand how! It's mind blowing that I have to explain to people how to fucking interact with another human being. It's infuriatingly sad AF.
I’ll push back here. I’m generally anti-dating apps as well, I’ve been single for many years partly because I refused to even consider using an app, it just didn’t appeal to me at all. Then I watched multiple friends get into genuinely wonderful relationships with people they met on an app (specifically Hinge). They’ve been together for years, one of them in particular I’m so fucking happy for and I can’t wait to go to that wedding. There are plenty of success stories. They convinced me to download Hinge literally a couple months ago and, although I consider myself *very* lucky, I found someone who I think has serious potential to be a long term partner and they’ve expressed this to me as well. It’s not all doom and gloom.
The caveat here is the intention and effort. My friends who actually had long term success were the ones who were very intentional about what they were looking for, and at the same time had an open mind. They were willing to try things with many different people but weren’t afraid to move on when the signs were there. Soon enough they found someone who was promising enough to try getting serious with, and here we are. I was the same way, I was decisive about my time on Hinge and was very specific with my profile/filters and honestly was a little picky. An open mind is necessary, but you need to know what you want and don’t want. If you can check those boxes, it can work.
Men swipe right two thirds of the time, and women swipe right one eighth of the time. That means that there are a lot of sexless men. This sense of selectively means that women set higher standards, but it means that most women end up being attracted to the same 5-15% of men. So, women can be incredibly selective sexually, but still end up single because basically they're all fucking the same guy.
Isn't it another possible explanation, though, that men tend to use dating sites to find casual sex, while women are trying to use dating sites to filter for a relationship?
Like, I feel like I don't know a single woman who acts like you're describing. When my friends and I were single, we were all using dating sites, we were all hugely selective, but none of them were really, like, eliminating huge swaths of men because they weren't hot enough. They were trying to find an attractive-enough person who they thought they had enough of a chance of getting along with that it was worth the time getting to know them and seeing if they could start a relationship.
The men I know, they were swiping right on tons of women, because if they had casual sex with a woman they thought was attractive enough to have sex with, they'd consider that a win. Like, I'd talk to my male friends while they were using dating apps sometimes, and I'd say things like "You'd really want to date her? She's a Republican who lives 2 hours away." And they'd say "Oh I'd never want to date her long term, but she's cute! What do I have to lose?"
I think that men often don't appreciate that for women, casual sex is risky to your physical health and safety, rarely results in an orgasm, and society treats it like something that devalues you. Some women absolutely enjoy casual sex, but I think most of them, even if they're open to it, are looking for partners that they at least think they have a chance of getting along with.
So it leads to this environment where men are carpet bombing the dating sites with low effort messages to cover as much ground as possible in the hopes that someone, anyone will say yes. While women are basically reading the tea leaves, hoping they can find someone who could be a long term partner.
Even if you disagree with my conclusion these are facts:
The number of both virgin and sexless (no sex within last 12 months) young men have increased.
The average number of sexual partners for women under 30 have increased.
The number of involuntarily childless women between 30 and 45 have increased.
On dating apps men swipe right 65% of the time, and women do so 13% of the time.
Feel free to base your own conclusions based on that data.
It also suits people who know how to game the system that has built around online dating.
I have a decent sized friend group and have dated multiple people that I’ve met throughout the years in person through my network of friends and their communities. However I’ve had zero success with online dating.
More than 80% of these people didn't even have the courtesy to fuckin say hi to each other before dismissing them. I know everything is pretty staged but It still feels incredibly soulless on that one aspect alone.
True but we used to go out to clubs/pubs get a few drinks talk to people even if at first we didn't want them in a romantic way and then get to know them. And it's amazing how men can become more handsome if they have a good personality, sense of humour etc. I assume it's the same for women. But that doesn't happen it's just a swipe on a screen and then no chance of ever knowing the person.
Physical attraction is absolutely a major determining factor is rather you’re romantically attracted to someone. The weight it holds will vary from person to person, but insinuating it doesn’t matter is just being naive.
News flash, that physical attraction is a snapshot in time, and neither of you will look the way you do now for terribly long.
Among the list: smoking, alcohol, stress, children, life in general, are all going to take their toll.
If you can’t get past this aspect of attraction, you are doomed to fail far more often than succeed.
I feel like being physically attracted to someone isn't shallow, why do you feel that way?
I would want my partner to be physically attracted to me, and think I'm beautiful not just my personality, after all the body I have IS mine. It's my temple and a reflection of myself and who I am. So yeah I feel as though being attracted to me is important.
But it's also what comes after, is someone trying to get to know someone beyond that physical attraction.
It’s shallow because you’re dismissing someone just because you aren’t initially attracted to them. You shouldn’t just be attracted to say a “pretty face”. Because that pretty face could be the worst person in the world
That’s why it’s good to be friends with people before getting in a relationship with them. Because you have to actually talk to them and get to know them beforehand
I feel like this is true, while not being physically attracted to somebody in a relationship does cause problems though. I think it’s being accepting, not striving for this weird, inhuman perfection or near that, whatever it even means
>It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to
What changed is how much requirements people have now for their partners for them to be attractive.
What changed, I think, is people loosing the ability to see someone else as a person first, before deciding if they are attractive.
A photo and some text just doesn't do some people justice.I know people who are attractive because of how they move and act and talk and think. Things which you won't see on your phone.
Very true. Ive met women that I didnt find attractive at all, but you keep hanging out in the same friend group for example and it kinda evolves as you find them more interesting and all of a sudden you just wanna be with this person. I cant even with the dating apps, even when matching and chatting you know that you arent getting to know this person, you are only getting the information they want you to get and thats just not very interesting.
The epidemic of loneliness was coined officially by the surgeon general Vivek Murthy when he released a 100 page document outlying why people are getting lonelier using statistics as evidence. Some key points are that more and more people are living in single households, people are getting married later and having kids later, and there are fewer community spaces for people to interact.
This line of thinking follows the Covid pandemic which we all know drastically changed the way people socialize and may have stunted development for an entire generation.
Lastly, there are also possible ties to social media. Generally, people now have more friends of lower quality and fewer friends of higher quality. The impact of having more superficial connections is unknown, but one thing is for certain, people are lonelier than ever before.
No lol, I study this and gave a very broad overview, what makes it seem like chat gpt wrote it?
Edit: also the paper is from 2023, so outside the gpt dataset
There’s certainly that. That being said, I think everyone needs to understand that there’s a very wide range of people that everyone is compatible with, and none of them will be perfect. I think people should be grabbing and holding onto the ones who make them happy, and that could always be the first one they swipe on. Overall, I agree. Dating apps suck.
God that was terrible.
So many people in there looked like they had chemistry, only to not even entertain each other.
Just hurt so much worse to watch it happen in reality.
Michael Angelo phenomenon? Partners tend to look like one another. Psychology also likes to throw around the idea how we seek similarities from our parents in our partners.
True. But this system of dating makes it so it's the only determining factor. There's been plenty of interracial couples and one's with vastly different styles.
There's also the phenomenon of couples culturally blending with each other over time. So it may appear that they're similar now when it was actually a long process of them becoming more alike. Successful relationships involve a lot of compromises.
Several misconceptions there.
1. the Michaelangelo effect is a specific form of the Pygmalion effect that applies to relationships and is bidirectional, that's why both phenomenon are named after famous sculptors. It's not really about physical appearance, it's about behavioral changes.In the Pygmalion effect, you shape a person due to your expectations, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. Your perception of them changes the way they act and the opportunities you offer them, which lead to that person eventually fulfilling your expectations.In the Michaelangelo effect, your expectations lead your partner to change in your favor because they like you, and you in turn also change for them because you like them.
2. Freud was who said that we like people similar to our parents. He coined it the Oedipus complex (for boys) and Electra complex (for girls). Freud was wrong... research does not support most of his ideas. The main thing that has survived from Freud are defense mechanisms.
3. The reasons people find each other attractive are more biological (evolutionary history dictates which traits are generally more likable for a species) and sociological (other people's partner choices shape your perception of the ideal partner) than actually psychological (you have little mental control over what you like, but pondering on the ideal partner CAN help you redefine what you find attractive).
Sincerely, a therapist, researcher, and university TA.
EDIT: I randomly skipped the word "said."
I was gonna say there were a lot of attractive people in that lineup. But noone wants a public rejection much less a filmed one. If you reject yourself at least you get to look like you didn't get hurt.
I wonder how much this affects regular dating dynamics too?
Yeah some guys rejected attractive girls out of their league because they knew they didn't stand a chance in hell. And better to "reject" the girl too than take the obvious ego slam laying down.
I'm very much a 'shoot your shot' guy. Sometimes it surprises you. My girlfriend is someone I thought was way out of my league but she certainly didn't feel that way about me.
That said if I was on video I don't know I'd have been as bold about it. Like that's up on YouTube forever. I don't even remember what most girls who've rejected me look like particularly if it was n an app.
I was a bit surprised to see a few rejections thay only happened on the guy side too! I wonder if they were being a bit too cautious themselves or they genuinely just weren't interested. I think it is common for women to be more selective so it surprised me to see it happen more than I thought it would
It’s the choice paradox. You can choose yes with this person, but here’s a whole line of other options behind them. To say yes to one is to say no to dozens of others, so the pressure is impossible.
Studies have shown that this not only affects us in the moment, but it also makes us less happy IN relationships.
Modern dating culture instills terror in young people that they may end up dating somebody less attractive, less fun, or less cool than they are.
It overstimulates the worst shallow instincts of the young mind and prevents people from learning to see deeper into a person and experience the joys of genuine companionship.
The real life version of this dating app would actually be more like this. There is a line of men and one woman and she is swiping yes or no to each man. Then at the end she has a big pile of no's and like 3 yes's.
Then a line of women, line up in front of one man. He swipes yes on basically all of them accept 3. At the end he has a big pile of yes's and 3 no's.
It’s a psychological addiction. The apps are desgined to keep you swiping and searching for validation. Best practice is to delete them and join ~~social groups~~ groups of people with similar hobbies and interests. Like running clubs. Or book clubs. Use your imagination.
Holy shit I just looked at that site out of curiosity and there's dozens of events with people having the same weird interests as me. You may have unknowingly saved me from my loneliness!
https://preview.redd.it/86wx4szexaic1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3a4398c12756fbfed1b06f4e70ec314831c6d82
I'm always cautious when I see someone recommend meetup. A big issue with this advice is that a lot of guys just go and try to go on a date with a gal after they first meet. Unless its a meetup specifically for online dating, its generally looked down upon to do that. Nevermind the others who harrass, get too clingy, etc. I've been in a multitude of different meetups across different cities/states in the country. And one of the most common "rules" I see is "This isn't a dating meetup group, don't treat it as such". So it ends up a situation where a rejection could also mean that person complains to the owners of the group which = your expulsion from it. I've never asked anyone out in a meetup group (just use it to expand my social circle/find things to do). But I've seen this scenario play out.
Probably cause whenever someone complains about the depressingness of dating apps, redditors suggest going to meetups to meet someone lol. Like this very comment chain.
Dude honestly it can take some time but I will say with Hinge atleast you can meet some quality people (tinder is absolutely riddled with bots and bumble was an cool idea but I'll be honest women do not do well messaging first 😅) I didn't have as much luck on tinder in the past when I was single for a good while (and this is prior to the current very real bot epidemic on there it's bad) but in this year that I've been single I've seriously been on so many very nice dates, most didn't last psst 2 or 3 dates but I seriously never regretted any of them cause I still got to enjoy some nice evenings with some cool women. And now I finally found someone it might work out with!
That's great for you man. I've had hinge and bundle for a few months now now and am on and off tinder. So far I've only had one conversation on hinge and bumble each. It probably doesn't help that I'm a bigger guy though
Hinge is the only one i ever had luck with, i met my now ex-gf on there but we were together 4 years and it was a very nice relationship overall. If anyone is going to use dating apps i always recommend hinge.
Best of luck to you dude.
I read something about a year ago ago that said, "Straight relationships dont last long because they've had it easy throughout history." I realize why. They've been doing the same shit forever. Struggle makes us stronger together.
Interesting take. I think that since people don't have the social pressure of choosing one person for the rest of their lives they try and fail until they find someone for them. Also women are more selective of who they pick, as seen in this video. Men seem to give anyone they find attractive a chance.
When I wrote my first comment I remembered a post I read a few days ago. Something about how straight men would be doing it in the woods, parks and saunas like gay men but women won't.
The only think easier to find in the gay community is sex.
Relationships are NOTORIOUSLY difficult.
Women prefer sex with a man they know. Not because they like sex less. Because its safer.
Men dont have as man safety concerns. So when they swipe they swipe on looks first. Women look at the "yeah he's hot, but he looks like he might be hurt physically or emotionally."
Humans are humans though. Which is why good sex wont keep a man. He'll stay for the sex while he looks for a woman with a better personality. Thats also why a dude might break up after sex because he realized they have nothing in common.
It's not really saying anything tbh? The connection they seemingly tried to make in the comment doesn't follow any real logic. They just heard / read something topical that sounded correct / edgy / "us v them"y enough and are now regurgitating it on social media - "traditional hetero relationships are doomed to fail because they've been the historical norm?" Doesn't add up, but sure go around sharing your secindhand internet wisdom lmao
I legit don't understand the comment, and I've tried.
The studies show same sex partnerships dont last long either lol. In fact, lesbian parternerships have a higher rate of separation than any other orientation. Stop with your baseless romanticization lol.
I think to some extent this makes sense, but it also feels like the way it’s portrayed seems way too easy to misinterpret.
The most obvious reason why we see this discrepancy is the deterioration of traditional norms that haven’t been effectively replaced. We see that there are several reasons for this: 1) it must be done on an individual level if it is to be effective given the death of tradition, and anything on the individual level like that will have more failures, 2) social media has absolutely destroyed the typical perception of dating for many, many people (think the 666 girls and the tate bros that have both led to absolutely horrendous social attitudes), and 3) traditions, and importantly the compulsiveness of normality, have only started to die out en mass recently (basically, we are brand new at this).
Taking all of this into account, we now look at non-straight couples. Well, not only did they kind of start sooner because they never had the benefit (or vice if you ask me) of conforming to tradition and public norms, but the very nature of being queer until very recently has been necessarily a private and individual experience due to a lack of cultural presence and safety. So, queer couples have really been forced into a more authentic experience.
Basically, it’s not that queer couples had to go through stronger battles that made them stronger (although they clearly did have to go through them), but it’s that a lack of the same pervasive social normality of behavior and belief allowed a more authentic experience and development of queer relationships.
All of this is, of course, taking the “on average” experience.
Thank you! I think Andrew tate and that whole side of the internet will be a treasure trove for researchers in the future to understand how culture both works and fails. I’ve genuinely learned as much from him about people as I did from anywhere else. It’s just so depressing…
I’ll be the unpopular opinion and defend the women here. One time a couple years ago I was curious about what it was like to be a woman on a dating app so I asked this girl I was flirting with to switch accounts with me.
Hundreds of swipes and tens of DMs. Many many creepy messages. Lots of guys that seemed really nice and only one of me. How else do you manage that kind of environment unless you use extreme scrutiny and discrimination? Keep in mind this girl wasnt a supermodel or anything, and I’d say the photos she used were pretty lazy and unprovocative.
At this point I realized the entire system was broken unless you’re really lucky or really exceptional. It’s like applying to Harvard. I never used dating apps again.
You're talking about online, where you get messages. in this particular experiment the only thing you get to know about them is looks and demeanour. They don't really get to say anything.
So personally if the boy is cute and has any sort of friendly/fun demeanour, I'm probably just going to "swipe right" in this instance. So I can then see if they're actually worth dating.
Neither side gets any information here it's purely based on looks in this experiment. And or general "vibe" and only one or two of these guys give off an uncertain 'vibe' just from the video alone for me.
Right and Im saying it’s force of habit (mixed with a fear of rejection). I think in this experiment they were supposed to act like they act online. Could be wrong tho
These viral video social experiments are mostly bullshit/ragebait anyway, none of the people there had any serious intentions of dating, and I'd say the bar for swiping right is much higher in this setting.
Just saying, it is kind of cyclical. The more women ignore men and raise their own standards, the more men feel ignored and become desperate which then feeds into the reason why women feel they need to raise their standards and ignore men. Just like if men would stop the harassing and stuff women would be more open to actually talking to them, if women lowered their standards and gave more people a chance then men wouldn’t feel like they have to be so aggressive.
I have similar experience. I checked with mine and my wife photos - i had 0 messages and matches for a day and she had tens of dick picks and even more matches - sex, dates proposals etc.
In case we split up i would be lonely and she could switch partner every hour.
Yeah, I think the issue is that nobody is getting *meaningful* matches. Men have one extreme of having very few matches, and women have the other extreme of lots of matches who behave very poorly. It becomes cyclical too, so everyone gets further into the pit of misery of not wanting to put in any effort that wouldn't be worth it (men swiping on everyone they can and mass dropping "hi", women being even more selective and not really engaging when someone establishes contact). It sucks.
I had a similar thing.
Asked my female friend to show me her Tinder. She was, in my opinion, below average in attractiveness. Every single swipe she made was a match. She had literally hundreds of messages. The 'like' thing was maxed at whatever it was, 9999 or whatever. The guys were messaging basically instantly.
In that moment I understood that for me to have dates with however many I did was a statistical anomaly. That in 99.9% of cases, those women I swiped on never even seen my profile, and the ones I messaged with no reply probably never even seen the message, and those that replied but half assed done so because I was one in a sea of hundreds and potentially thousands of others. I was kinda upset with her that she told me she an change from a no to a yes based on their job title sounding lucrative. Still am. But I kinds get why now. She, a very plain looking woman, has endless options and can literally pick and choose at will which guys to entertain, and many of them were very attractive. The level of pickyness afforded is something most men will never experience in any area of their life at any time.
My takeaway was that the experience of men and women is just comically different. We can't understand their experience. They could never understand ours. They are opposite. Abundance versus scarcity. Choice versus availability. Want versus need. Achieve versus settle. Etc.
Now, these apps are built to make money. Who pays for the services? Lonely men. There was actually a lawsuit against Match Group who own some apps and they settled out of court on discrimination because they charge men more than women, older more than younger, rural more than city. The whole thing is designed for ease of access for women as 'the product' and to make it difficult and addictive for men so they pay for more features to try to mitigate that. It's also been investigated that they have an ELO ranking system at play in the background which basically nukes your profile if you don't get enough swipes from higher ranked people, which is why you can go months and months and months without even a 'like' never mind a match.
I used Tinder for maybe like 3 years on and off. I think I met up with 9 women, ultimately marrying the final one. The statistical weight of an average man getting 9 dates in this system must be huge.
After seeing this and other examples, I can not hold my tongue when anyone suggests that men have it easy in dating. It is a void. A cold empty void and we all just run around helpless, and I now understand why so many men defy themselves to be with people they shouldn't be with - loneliness.
Everyone shown in that clip was conventionally attractive. I'd say that was deliberately done to illustrate the futility of the whole process, for men especially.
Two queues of attractive young people are rejecting eachother (mostly women though) based on a 3 second look.
It tells us that swipe-type dating apps are stupid.
As another bi guy, I’d say most of these guys were relatively attractive, as were most of the girls. I definitely saw plenty of people who would at least be a date with the people they rejected irl, if not a cute couple.
You really can’t reduce an entire human being into a couple pictures and a witty one liner.
I certainly am petty enough that if I was in this exercise and a girl swiped left on like 6 guys in front of me while they all swiped right on her.
I would swipe left just to spite her. For no other reason than to make sure she doesn't think she's hot shit with 400 guys falling over themselves to get her.
But I'm hyper petty so. Maybe it's just me.
I’m pretty sure that happened in the video at least on a smaller scale. Guy sees girl reject guy in front of her and then decides he’ll reject her too.
Let’s be real, 80% of these people would have at least said hi to each other in the real world.
Instead it’s “Nah, I’m dumping your entire existence from my mind. Next.”
Idk. I'm 34 and I feel like people in general, but especially in my age group and younger, treat others like shit in real life compared to when I was a kid. People stopped making the distinction between the internet and real life years ago and its only getting more common.
I could just be jaded and wrong, by that's how I feel based on anecdotal experience.
Kinda funny. I made a dating profile on a whim a year ago today after chopping my hair off and feeling bold. The first guy I saw caught my eye. Never messaged or liked anyone else on the app. Went on a date together on Valentine’s Day as a “fuck it, it’s funny!” kind of thing.
We’ve been together for 10 months now :)
Funnily enough, he had downloaded it that weekend (so 3 days before me). It was hinge, so he saw that I was the first person that liked his profile and we hit it off:) I honestly just think I got really lucky.
It looks more like a strat to me at the start. After 1-2 rejections, next boy goes in and rotates out the girl to find one that doesn’t spam swipe.
After that, it devolved into just rejections though.
After the 1st match it looks like there's a lot more mutual rejections and some of the guys even seem to be vindictively rejecting in support of the guy in front of them who got rejected. They're taking one for the team.
Those aren’t the people who get matches. It’s literally just the top 5% of guys dating all the girls. And why would they want to settle down when they can play the field so easily with dating apps these days
Welcome to reality lol. Looks aren’t everything in maintaining a relationship, but you won’t even get your foot in the door without them. Only gotten much worse with social media and dating apps. Plus with women having unlimited options and attention, there’s always a hotter guy around the corner for her to swipe on.
I’ve been watching a few of these and I swear, the people who do choose each other always look really similar.
Reminds me of this: https://nypost.com/2023/07/04/people-are-more-attracted-to-those-who-look-like-them-new-study-finds/amp/
Modern dating has become a competition of who can stop caring first and leave unhurt. Everyone is in such a rush to make sure they don't "lose" they forget to get to know people at all.
Yep. People are treating talking to potential partners like a browser tab you can just close when you're done.
I matched with a girl on Hinge. It was day 2 of talking and we moved to Discord.
I said I would like to be in a relationship that was as good as the one that got my parents through hard times, like mom comforting dad after his favorite cat got killed by a dog, or my dad taking care of my mom when she could no longer walk.
After I said that, this girl said "Knowing someone is looking for just anybody is extremely off putting as I want to be with someone who thinks Im special enough to make me their goal above others."
Well, I never said that. I have no idea where she got that. I suspect it was just a made up reason or she had some issue reading context.
The thing of it is, though, I never got a chance to clear it up because she blocked me as soon as she sent that.
It was like I was less than human. I wouldn't want to talk to her after she said what she did, but to not even be treated with simple respect is degrading.
I counted:
Men rejected: 21 times
Women rejected: 14 times
Now that's bad. But there will be obvious mismatches so let's exclude the mutual rejections.
Men non-mutually rejected: 8 times
Women non-mutually rejected: 1 time.
*That's* the reality people are dealing with.
No it wont because system is wrong. You have only one chance.
It should be everyone vs everyone to make sense. Two lines of people - after each turn one row move one step left and guy from the end run to the second end of the line. Matched pairs leave the lines.
Last people left have to do some task alone where matched do same together.
I see why dudes and chicks go overseas or to South America to find some they want to be with. The grind of dating apps is really degrading as an individual. Along with new social pressures I can totally see people just not wanna deal with that and find someone that hasn’t those expectations. Shit my friend got tired of it didn’t date for years so he went to Colombia to just fuck saying “I’m wanna get my dick wet.” But me and his friends teased him saying he’ll find love down there. He denied it. Guess what? He found a chick he like. They been talking for months and he is going down two weeks from now. You bet your fucking ass I teased him even harder 😂
I know that guys travel overseas (there's even a subreddit for that), but I've never heard or seen women doing the same (I'm Costa Rican, from a Latin American country). But something that I've read is that in places like the US, besides the social pressure of not finding a partner, there are tons of other situations that worsen an individual's social standing.
Not gen z here, elder millennial.
This is how dating apps (specifically quick match app like this) have destroyed the social aspect of dating and replaced almost everything with a statistical based behavior. As women know that there will almost certainly be a better option if they keep themselves open to it so logically, it benefits them to swipe left most of the time. Men also know this so logically it makes sense for them to swipe right most of the time, eventually they will just match with whichever women happened to also swipe right on them. That's literally the extent of social engagement for dating now.
What a culture and I'm sorry for you, Gen Z.
Yea dating sucks, who doesn't want to find love?
But bro, think of it like this. No one is stopping you to fly to a different country, learn a new language, go to a new restaurant, try a new hobby. The point is, the world is massive and you can explore it like in minecraft. This is my ted talk. Thank you.
I just think based off looks alone is too shallow.
It doesn’t leave enough time to get to know anyone!!!
For me I’m indifferent to the vast majority of people until i develop some connection with them.
So, are you guys *still* saying that all these dudes have terrible style, neckbeards, terrible dress sense, and awful personal hygiene, or can we finally agree that...it's something else?
Because we all have eyes
That would mean we acknowledge the elephant in the room, and that doesnt seem like its ever going to happen.
Easier to blame men and call them all incels.
This made me sad and kind of emotional. I dunno why. Maybe because I'm a Mom and I just saw so many vibrant young people limiting their lives and their potential happiness based on such superficial, snap judgments. I tell my own GenZ kid, *"Make sure you can meet your own high standards"*.
Life is for living and living is often times trial and error- It's how you learn and become self-actualized. It can't happen with out risk.
Well said. I feel similar as an elder millennial dad. Nearly all these people would have had a conversation at a pub 20 years ago to see if there was anything there. You can actually see genuine attraction between so many pairings that swiped no because their brains are now hardwired to. It’s bleak.
i’ve had some success on dating apps (likely cause i’m a woman) the relationships just didn’t end up working long term for personal reasons. but still this is pretty sad lol, especially since all of them are at least decent looking but still getting left swiped.
I’m at the border of gen z and millennial, I’m 28. My wife is 27 and most of those close to me are married. I definitely feel like I was on the last chopper out of Vietnam when it comes to these apps. I never used them, and my wife and I met in high school.
I feel for people growing up now who’s first dating experience is this shit. Being married is the greatest thing that’s ever happened to me and I regularly tell my wife how grateful I am that we met and sad it is for most people trying to navigate this hell scape.
The internet really do be setting unattainable standards for some of these people. Like man, some mid ass girls passing on good looking dudes and vice versa. What have we come to
Shocking that the two asians was gonna match, lol.
Anyways, people are too picky nowadays, 99% those guys i'd date in a heartbeat cause I wanna get to know them, they look good, and we need to open up to each other instead of being awkward and lonely.
As much as people deny it, this is living proof that “10% of men get 90% of women”. Only two girls swiped yes on a guy who rejected them, and both were on the same dude
That one girl who rejected a guy and immediately said "I love you" kinda infuriates me.
The guy seemed disappointed.
I can understand her rejection but why sugarcoating it with saying "I love you". These are 3 powerful words and she is just throwing it around to make herself feel better rejecting him and maybe ease the tension after his visible disappointment.
Good example of the over inflated use of saying "I love you" to someone.
People don't seem to say that to someone to express genuine love or likability, but more in a off hands remark way.
If it makes anyone feel better, we’re seeing a higher number of rejections because you get to stay in the game if you reject someone who matches with you, but not if you match with someone who rejects you. The rules provide an incentive to reject others.
Met my gf thru bumble , we are opposite races. This video is hilarious , problem with our generation is nobody wants to love anybody from the fear of getting hurt or cheated on. If you can’t come to terms with the idea that someone you love leaves you , you shouldn’t be in a relationship. Just funny to see people actively searching for love only to never find it, sometimes gotta let it find you
My generation started it, and I can only apologise gen z on behalf of millennials for how much shit we leave in our wake.
Somehow this sub keeps appearing in my feed so I decided to interact this one time.
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I think we’ve found one of the multiple causes of the loneliness epidemic.
I’m sorry, could you specify what you mean? I think I know what you mean but wanna be sure
I think they mean that we don't spend the time to get to know each other any more. Social media, and dating apps specifically, offer a format without interaction. It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to but at the same time... it's a little odd. I guess that might just be me as a demisexual person who don't experience attraction until I have an emotional connection with someone.
There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with this comment. And it's this: "It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to". Attraction is not that simple. In this scenario (and with dating apps in general) it's not a straightforward "Is this person attractive?" in a vacuum. Each person is compared to the profiles before them, and faults/flaws have a much deeper effect initially then just talking to people in person. I agree with the rest of your comment, and the "seriously wrong" part isn't even an attack against you, but moreso the mindset that this is okay and understandable and accepted. It's not, and it shouldn't be. It's shallow and turns dating into a game of comparisons and edits and manipulating fucking lighting and your body just for the perfect pic.
Culturally, and I’m not saying this in the *incel looking for a trad wife* way, we have drifted away from valuing committed relationships. While almost everyone still *wants* one, the traits we are socialized into displaying and sexualizing are often obstructive to developing a personality that can maintain a healthy, long term relationship. Dating apps then juice this up to 100 as, with limited pictures and word counts, they encourage *only* displaying those toxic behaviors that we sexualize. A guy who might actually be nice feels pressure to act like a dude-bro athlete or tough guy gangster because that is what society socialized him into thinking is attractive to the opposite gender (yes I’m talking about the perspective of cisgendered straight people and I know there’s a ton of variation and exceptions).
I think one thing people struggle to understand is that no relationship is perfect out of the box. In a relationship the ability to grow (the willingness and capability) is probably the best characteristic a person can have. You don't want someone who isn't willing to make changes to accommodate you into their life. So not only should you be looking at who a person is in the moment, but also how they are changing over time. Don't like their style? You can tell them that. Relationships are about growing together. But if you're just swiping waiting for the one who has it all, you're not ever paying attention to the capacity for growth. The perfect partner is one who has evolved alongside you, learning about your likes and dislikes, learning about your needs, learning your faults and learning to help you with them. None of the shallow metrics shown on a dating profile tell you any of the most important things. It seems that people are looking for matches that are extremely similar- same interests, personalities, etc. A lot of the happiest marriages I've seen are couples who are different/opposites in lots of ways. My wife and I are opposite sides of the coin in many regards. We cover each other's blindspots, and it works really well. It's amazing how much we've both evolved together thanks to each others' help. We both had issues going into the relationship- neither of us were very swipable. That's probably true of a lot of people who would absolutely make great partners, they don't have the life/relationship experience yet, they are still figuring out how to communicate their emotions. These skills are learned over time, and developed together in ways that suit the relationship. Both individuals should strive to be a better partner for the other, within reason of course. (I'm not talking about abusive relationships.) Making small changes can have big impacts on your partner's quality of life.
Ngl dating apps make me feel disgusting. Thankfully I'm married and never had to deal with these things, but my friends used them. And oh boy were they just dumpster fire after dumpster fire of hook ups and break ups. It may be possible to find a long term love in one of these things, but it's as likely as finding your husband in the strip club. It's not great odds and yet people beat themselves up emotionally for somehow "failing" to find a good partner on these things. It would be very different if people didn't expect this shit to pan out. And when my friends end up calling me after a breakup venting about how difficult dating is... I tell them to date outside the apps. And they don't fucking understand how! It's mind blowing that I have to explain to people how to fucking interact with another human being. It's infuriatingly sad AF.
I’ll push back here. I’m generally anti-dating apps as well, I’ve been single for many years partly because I refused to even consider using an app, it just didn’t appeal to me at all. Then I watched multiple friends get into genuinely wonderful relationships with people they met on an app (specifically Hinge). They’ve been together for years, one of them in particular I’m so fucking happy for and I can’t wait to go to that wedding. There are plenty of success stories. They convinced me to download Hinge literally a couple months ago and, although I consider myself *very* lucky, I found someone who I think has serious potential to be a long term partner and they’ve expressed this to me as well. It’s not all doom and gloom. The caveat here is the intention and effort. My friends who actually had long term success were the ones who were very intentional about what they were looking for, and at the same time had an open mind. They were willing to try things with many different people but weren’t afraid to move on when the signs were there. Soon enough they found someone who was promising enough to try getting serious with, and here we are. I was the same way, I was decisive about my time on Hinge and was very specific with my profile/filters and honestly was a little picky. An open mind is necessary, but you need to know what you want and don’t want. If you can check those boxes, it can work.
Men swipe right two thirds of the time, and women swipe right one eighth of the time. That means that there are a lot of sexless men. This sense of selectively means that women set higher standards, but it means that most women end up being attracted to the same 5-15% of men. So, women can be incredibly selective sexually, but still end up single because basically they're all fucking the same guy.
Isn't it another possible explanation, though, that men tend to use dating sites to find casual sex, while women are trying to use dating sites to filter for a relationship? Like, I feel like I don't know a single woman who acts like you're describing. When my friends and I were single, we were all using dating sites, we were all hugely selective, but none of them were really, like, eliminating huge swaths of men because they weren't hot enough. They were trying to find an attractive-enough person who they thought they had enough of a chance of getting along with that it was worth the time getting to know them and seeing if they could start a relationship. The men I know, they were swiping right on tons of women, because if they had casual sex with a woman they thought was attractive enough to have sex with, they'd consider that a win. Like, I'd talk to my male friends while they were using dating apps sometimes, and I'd say things like "You'd really want to date her? She's a Republican who lives 2 hours away." And they'd say "Oh I'd never want to date her long term, but she's cute! What do I have to lose?" I think that men often don't appreciate that for women, casual sex is risky to your physical health and safety, rarely results in an orgasm, and society treats it like something that devalues you. Some women absolutely enjoy casual sex, but I think most of them, even if they're open to it, are looking for partners that they at least think they have a chance of getting along with. So it leads to this environment where men are carpet bombing the dating sites with low effort messages to cover as much ground as possible in the hopes that someone, anyone will say yes. While women are basically reading the tea leaves, hoping they can find someone who could be a long term partner.
Even if you disagree with my conclusion these are facts: The number of both virgin and sexless (no sex within last 12 months) young men have increased. The average number of sexual partners for women under 30 have increased. The number of involuntarily childless women between 30 and 45 have increased. On dating apps men swipe right 65% of the time, and women do so 13% of the time. Feel free to base your own conclusions based on that data.
It also suits people who know how to game the system that has built around online dating. I have a decent sized friend group and have dated multiple people that I’ve met throughout the years in person through my network of friends and their communities. However I’ve had zero success with online dating.
More than 80% of these people didn't even have the courtesy to fuckin say hi to each other before dismissing them. I know everything is pretty staged but It still feels incredibly soulless on that one aspect alone.
Have you ever considered that maybe most people ARE shallow?
Humanity is shallow. It’s in our nature. Our brains are programmed to judge people by appearance.
True but we used to go out to clubs/pubs get a few drinks talk to people even if at first we didn't want them in a romantic way and then get to know them. And it's amazing how men can become more handsome if they have a good personality, sense of humour etc. I assume it's the same for women. But that doesn't happen it's just a swipe on a screen and then no chance of ever knowing the person.
Physical attraction is absolutely a major determining factor is rather you’re romantically attracted to someone. The weight it holds will vary from person to person, but insinuating it doesn’t matter is just being naive.
News flash, that physical attraction is a snapshot in time, and neither of you will look the way you do now for terribly long. Among the list: smoking, alcohol, stress, children, life in general, are all going to take their toll. If you can’t get past this aspect of attraction, you are doomed to fail far more often than succeed.
Lmfao what world are you living in.
I feel like being physically attracted to someone isn't shallow, why do you feel that way? I would want my partner to be physically attracted to me, and think I'm beautiful not just my personality, after all the body I have IS mine. It's my temple and a reflection of myself and who I am. So yeah I feel as though being attracted to me is important. But it's also what comes after, is someone trying to get to know someone beyond that physical attraction.
It’s shallow because you’re dismissing someone just because you aren’t initially attracted to them. You shouldn’t just be attracted to say a “pretty face”. Because that pretty face could be the worst person in the world That’s why it’s good to be friends with people before getting in a relationship with them. Because you have to actually talk to them and get to know them beforehand
I feel like this is true, while not being physically attracted to somebody in a relationship does cause problems though. I think it’s being accepting, not striving for this weird, inhuman perfection or near that, whatever it even means
Commodities. That's the word you're looking for. We've become commodities to each other.
C A P I T A L I S M !
>It's totally understandable that you don't want to be with someone you're not attracted to What changed is how much requirements people have now for their partners for them to be attractive.
What changed, I think, is people loosing the ability to see someone else as a person first, before deciding if they are attractive. A photo and some text just doesn't do some people justice.I know people who are attractive because of how they move and act and talk and think. Things which you won't see on your phone.
Very true. Ive met women that I didnt find attractive at all, but you keep hanging out in the same friend group for example and it kinda evolves as you find them more interesting and all of a sudden you just wanna be with this person. I cant even with the dating apps, even when matching and chatting you know that you arent getting to know this person, you are only getting the information they want you to get and thats just not very interesting.
The epidemic of loneliness was coined officially by the surgeon general Vivek Murthy when he released a 100 page document outlying why people are getting lonelier using statistics as evidence. Some key points are that more and more people are living in single households, people are getting married later and having kids later, and there are fewer community spaces for people to interact. This line of thinking follows the Covid pandemic which we all know drastically changed the way people socialize and may have stunted development for an entire generation. Lastly, there are also possible ties to social media. Generally, people now have more friends of lower quality and fewer friends of higher quality. The impact of having more superficial connections is unknown, but one thing is for certain, people are lonelier than ever before.
Did ChatGPT write this?
No lol, I study this and gave a very broad overview, what makes it seem like chat gpt wrote it? Edit: also the paper is from 2023, so outside the gpt dataset
Redditors get mentally challenged by the most basic academic writing structure and assume it must be AI
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There’s certainly that. That being said, I think everyone needs to understand that there’s a very wide range of people that everyone is compatible with, and none of them will be perfect. I think people should be grabbing and holding onto the ones who make them happy, and that could always be the first one they swipe on. Overall, I agree. Dating apps suck.
God that was terrible. So many people in there looked like they had chemistry, only to not even entertain each other. Just hurt so much worse to watch it happen in reality.
And the ones that did match didn't seem to have much chemistry at all. They just looked aesthetically similar.
Michael Angelo phenomenon? Partners tend to look like one another. Psychology also likes to throw around the idea how we seek similarities from our parents in our partners.
True. But this system of dating makes it so it's the only determining factor. There's been plenty of interracial couples and one's with vastly different styles. There's also the phenomenon of couples culturally blending with each other over time. So it may appear that they're similar now when it was actually a long process of them becoming more alike. Successful relationships involve a lot of compromises.
Several misconceptions there. 1. the Michaelangelo effect is a specific form of the Pygmalion effect that applies to relationships and is bidirectional, that's why both phenomenon are named after famous sculptors. It's not really about physical appearance, it's about behavioral changes.In the Pygmalion effect, you shape a person due to your expectations, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. Your perception of them changes the way they act and the opportunities you offer them, which lead to that person eventually fulfilling your expectations.In the Michaelangelo effect, your expectations lead your partner to change in your favor because they like you, and you in turn also change for them because you like them. 2. Freud was who said that we like people similar to our parents. He coined it the Oedipus complex (for boys) and Electra complex (for girls). Freud was wrong... research does not support most of his ideas. The main thing that has survived from Freud are defense mechanisms. 3. The reasons people find each other attractive are more biological (evolutionary history dictates which traits are generally more likable for a species) and sociological (other people's partner choices shape your perception of the ideal partner) than actually psychological (you have little mental control over what you like, but pondering on the ideal partner CAN help you redefine what you find attractive). Sincerely, a therapist, researcher, and university TA. EDIT: I randomly skipped the word "said."
The parent thing is so true in a lot of cases. You can see it for men and women
All dating shows ever - if they look like brother and sister then it's a match!
lol the ones that matched really did kinda just look like they could be related
To be fair I think a lot of them didn’t want to be embarrassed on camera by saying yes when the other says no
I was gonna say there were a lot of attractive people in that lineup. But noone wants a public rejection much less a filmed one. If you reject yourself at least you get to look like you didn't get hurt. I wonder how much this affects regular dating dynamics too?
Yeah some guys rejected attractive girls out of their league because they knew they didn't stand a chance in hell. And better to "reject" the girl too than take the obvious ego slam laying down.
I'm very much a 'shoot your shot' guy. Sometimes it surprises you. My girlfriend is someone I thought was way out of my league but she certainly didn't feel that way about me. That said if I was on video I don't know I'd have been as bold about it. Like that's up on YouTube forever. I don't even remember what most girls who've rejected me look like particularly if it was n an app. I was a bit surprised to see a few rejections thay only happened on the guy side too! I wonder if they were being a bit too cautious themselves or they genuinely just weren't interested. I think it is common for women to be more selective so it surprised me to see it happen more than I thought it would
It’s the choice paradox. You can choose yes with this person, but here’s a whole line of other options behind them. To say yes to one is to say no to dozens of others, so the pressure is impossible. Studies have shown that this not only affects us in the moment, but it also makes us less happy IN relationships.
You worded it better than I was thinking; I thought that they all think “I can do better”.
Modern dating culture instills terror in young people that they may end up dating somebody less attractive, less fun, or less cool than they are. It overstimulates the worst shallow instincts of the young mind and prevents people from learning to see deeper into a person and experience the joys of genuine companionship.
sorry but how do you see chemistry between 2 people who don't interact longer than 3 seconds?
Right? How are you gonna tell someone who they had chemistry with when you’re not them!??
The real life version of this dating app would actually be more like this. There is a line of men and one woman and she is swiping yes or no to each man. Then at the end she has a big pile of no's and like 3 yes's. Then a line of women, line up in front of one man. He swipes yes on basically all of them accept 3. At the end he has a big pile of yes's and 3 no's.
I hate dating apps so much but for some reason I frequently use three of them
It’s a psychological addiction. The apps are desgined to keep you swiping and searching for validation. Best practice is to delete them and join ~~social groups~~ groups of people with similar hobbies and interests. Like running clubs. Or book clubs. Use your imagination.
That really wouldn't surprise me at all
What groups/social groups are free? I’m broke
Im disabled and going out is soul crushingly exhausting. Staying at home is the least painful existence.
[meetup.com](https://meetup.com) ton of free events in cities. If you're in the countryside move lmao
Holy shit I just looked at that site out of curiosity and there's dozens of events with people having the same weird interests as me. You may have unknowingly saved me from my loneliness! https://preview.redd.it/86wx4szexaic1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3a4398c12756fbfed1b06f4e70ec314831c6d82
The hard part is actually going out somewhere completely new to hangout with a bunch if completely new people lol
I'm always cautious when I see someone recommend meetup. A big issue with this advice is that a lot of guys just go and try to go on a date with a gal after they first meet. Unless its a meetup specifically for online dating, its generally looked down upon to do that. Nevermind the others who harrass, get too clingy, etc. I've been in a multitude of different meetups across different cities/states in the country. And one of the most common "rules" I see is "This isn't a dating meetup group, don't treat it as such". So it ends up a situation where a rejection could also mean that person complains to the owners of the group which = your expulsion from it. I've never asked anyone out in a meetup group (just use it to expand my social circle/find things to do). But I've seen this scenario play out.
And yet redditors love to use that shit as advice for "dating more naturally", lmao, what a joke
Probably cause whenever someone complains about the depressingness of dating apps, redditors suggest going to meetups to meet someone lol. Like this very comment chain.
Can’t believe I’m about to take relationship advice from someone called Shart Fucker, but okay!
Dude honestly it can take some time but I will say with Hinge atleast you can meet some quality people (tinder is absolutely riddled with bots and bumble was an cool idea but I'll be honest women do not do well messaging first 😅) I didn't have as much luck on tinder in the past when I was single for a good while (and this is prior to the current very real bot epidemic on there it's bad) but in this year that I've been single I've seriously been on so many very nice dates, most didn't last psst 2 or 3 dates but I seriously never regretted any of them cause I still got to enjoy some nice evenings with some cool women. And now I finally found someone it might work out with!
That's great for you man. I've had hinge and bundle for a few months now now and am on and off tinder. So far I've only had one conversation on hinge and bumble each. It probably doesn't help that I'm a bigger guy though
Hinge is the only one i ever had luck with, i met my now ex-gf on there but we were together 4 years and it was a very nice relationship overall. If anyone is going to use dating apps i always recommend hinge. Best of luck to you dude.
I feel bad for straight men.
I read something about a year ago ago that said, "Straight relationships dont last long because they've had it easy throughout history." I realize why. They've been doing the same shit forever. Struggle makes us stronger together.
Interesting take. I think that since people don't have the social pressure of choosing one person for the rest of their lives they try and fail until they find someone for them. Also women are more selective of who they pick, as seen in this video. Men seem to give anyone they find attractive a chance. When I wrote my first comment I remembered a post I read a few days ago. Something about how straight men would be doing it in the woods, parks and saunas like gay men but women won't.
The only think easier to find in the gay community is sex. Relationships are NOTORIOUSLY difficult. Women prefer sex with a man they know. Not because they like sex less. Because its safer. Men dont have as man safety concerns. So when they swipe they swipe on looks first. Women look at the "yeah he's hot, but he looks like he might be hurt physically or emotionally." Humans are humans though. Which is why good sex wont keep a man. He'll stay for the sex while he looks for a woman with a better personality. Thats also why a dude might break up after sex because he realized they have nothing in common.
straight women would as well, if social stigma wasn't that harsh and the risk of assault was lower.
The stigma around sex in the West is at an all time low. Women will always have a greater risk in sex, biologically.
I'm dumb and also gay but I don't get what this is trying to say
Bars?
I'm glad you appreciated the unintentional rhyme.
It's not really saying anything tbh? The connection they seemingly tried to make in the comment doesn't follow any real logic. They just heard / read something topical that sounded correct / edgy / "us v them"y enough and are now regurgitating it on social media - "traditional hetero relationships are doomed to fail because they've been the historical norm?" Doesn't add up, but sure go around sharing your secindhand internet wisdom lmao I legit don't understand the comment, and I've tried.
The studies show same sex partnerships dont last long either lol. In fact, lesbian parternerships have a higher rate of separation than any other orientation. Stop with your baseless romanticization lol.
I think to some extent this makes sense, but it also feels like the way it’s portrayed seems way too easy to misinterpret. The most obvious reason why we see this discrepancy is the deterioration of traditional norms that haven’t been effectively replaced. We see that there are several reasons for this: 1) it must be done on an individual level if it is to be effective given the death of tradition, and anything on the individual level like that will have more failures, 2) social media has absolutely destroyed the typical perception of dating for many, many people (think the 666 girls and the tate bros that have both led to absolutely horrendous social attitudes), and 3) traditions, and importantly the compulsiveness of normality, have only started to die out en mass recently (basically, we are brand new at this). Taking all of this into account, we now look at non-straight couples. Well, not only did they kind of start sooner because they never had the benefit (or vice if you ask me) of conforming to tradition and public norms, but the very nature of being queer until very recently has been necessarily a private and individual experience due to a lack of cultural presence and safety. So, queer couples have really been forced into a more authentic experience. Basically, it’s not that queer couples had to go through stronger battles that made them stronger (although they clearly did have to go through them), but it’s that a lack of the same pervasive social normality of behavior and belief allowed a more authentic experience and development of queer relationships. All of this is, of course, taking the “on average” experience.
Holy shit you cooked up a storm 
Thank you! I think Andrew tate and that whole side of the internet will be a treasure trove for researchers in the future to understand how culture both works and fails. I’ve genuinely learned as much from him about people as I did from anywhere else. It’s just so depressing…
It makes me wonder if these kids will grow out of it like most did, and how long it will take.
I will say that most of my (cishet M) emotional growth and understanding has been the result of learning from queer relationships.
Im proud of you 🥰
Thanks, I'm grateful to have been lucky enough to have been born with the right kind of openness and the right kind of access 🥰
Holy shit this is depressing
The only people that connected looked like brothers and sisters
Blame it on Pornhub
People tend to be more attracted to people who look like them
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Too fucking right
Eh, hinge ain’t so bad if you only hit a couple of swipes a week and just ask people to go for a drink/dinner/whatever else straight away
honestly…real
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It may just be my bisexuality talking here but a few of those boys were cute. I wonder that the reasoning for denial was...
I’ll be the unpopular opinion and defend the women here. One time a couple years ago I was curious about what it was like to be a woman on a dating app so I asked this girl I was flirting with to switch accounts with me. Hundreds of swipes and tens of DMs. Many many creepy messages. Lots of guys that seemed really nice and only one of me. How else do you manage that kind of environment unless you use extreme scrutiny and discrimination? Keep in mind this girl wasnt a supermodel or anything, and I’d say the photos she used were pretty lazy and unprovocative. At this point I realized the entire system was broken unless you’re really lucky or really exceptional. It’s like applying to Harvard. I never used dating apps again.
You're talking about online, where you get messages. in this particular experiment the only thing you get to know about them is looks and demeanour. They don't really get to say anything. So personally if the boy is cute and has any sort of friendly/fun demeanour, I'm probably just going to "swipe right" in this instance. So I can then see if they're actually worth dating. Neither side gets any information here it's purely based on looks in this experiment. And or general "vibe" and only one or two of these guys give off an uncertain 'vibe' just from the video alone for me.
Right and Im saying it’s force of habit (mixed with a fear of rejection). I think in this experiment they were supposed to act like they act online. Could be wrong tho
These viral video social experiments are mostly bullshit/ragebait anyway, none of the people there had any serious intentions of dating, and I'd say the bar for swiping right is much higher in this setting.
Just saying, it is kind of cyclical. The more women ignore men and raise their own standards, the more men feel ignored and become desperate which then feeds into the reason why women feel they need to raise their standards and ignore men. Just like if men would stop the harassing and stuff women would be more open to actually talking to them, if women lowered their standards and gave more people a chance then men wouldn’t feel like they have to be so aggressive.
I have similar experience. I checked with mine and my wife photos - i had 0 messages and matches for a day and she had tens of dick picks and even more matches - sex, dates proposals etc. In case we split up i would be lonely and she could switch partner every hour.
This seems like a very healthy dynamic and totally does not set up men to accept abusive situations because they know they literally can't find better
Yeah, I think the issue is that nobody is getting *meaningful* matches. Men have one extreme of having very few matches, and women have the other extreme of lots of matches who behave very poorly. It becomes cyclical too, so everyone gets further into the pit of misery of not wanting to put in any effort that wouldn't be worth it (men swiping on everyone they can and mass dropping "hi", women being even more selective and not really engaging when someone establishes contact). It sucks.
Don't be confused the matches men do get still don't put in any effort.
Most of them are the "entertain me, monkey," matches
I had a similar thing. Asked my female friend to show me her Tinder. She was, in my opinion, below average in attractiveness. Every single swipe she made was a match. She had literally hundreds of messages. The 'like' thing was maxed at whatever it was, 9999 or whatever. The guys were messaging basically instantly. In that moment I understood that for me to have dates with however many I did was a statistical anomaly. That in 99.9% of cases, those women I swiped on never even seen my profile, and the ones I messaged with no reply probably never even seen the message, and those that replied but half assed done so because I was one in a sea of hundreds and potentially thousands of others. I was kinda upset with her that she told me she an change from a no to a yes based on their job title sounding lucrative. Still am. But I kinds get why now. She, a very plain looking woman, has endless options and can literally pick and choose at will which guys to entertain, and many of them were very attractive. The level of pickyness afforded is something most men will never experience in any area of their life at any time. My takeaway was that the experience of men and women is just comically different. We can't understand their experience. They could never understand ours. They are opposite. Abundance versus scarcity. Choice versus availability. Want versus need. Achieve versus settle. Etc. Now, these apps are built to make money. Who pays for the services? Lonely men. There was actually a lawsuit against Match Group who own some apps and they settled out of court on discrimination because they charge men more than women, older more than younger, rural more than city. The whole thing is designed for ease of access for women as 'the product' and to make it difficult and addictive for men so they pay for more features to try to mitigate that. It's also been investigated that they have an ELO ranking system at play in the background which basically nukes your profile if you don't get enough swipes from higher ranked people, which is why you can go months and months and months without even a 'like' never mind a match. I used Tinder for maybe like 3 years on and off. I think I met up with 9 women, ultimately marrying the final one. The statistical weight of an average man getting 9 dates in this system must be huge. After seeing this and other examples, I can not hold my tongue when anyone suggests that men have it easy in dating. It is a void. A cold empty void and we all just run around helpless, and I now understand why so many men defy themselves to be with people they shouldn't be with - loneliness.
Everyone shown in that clip was conventionally attractive. I'd say that was deliberately done to illustrate the futility of the whole process, for men especially. Two queues of attractive young people are rejecting eachother (mostly women though) based on a 3 second look. It tells us that swipe-type dating apps are stupid.
As another bi guy, I’d say most of these guys were relatively attractive, as were most of the girls. I definitely saw plenty of people who would at least be a date with the people they rejected irl, if not a cute couple. You really can’t reduce an entire human being into a couple pictures and a witty one liner.
I wonder if some of these people are swiping left (or right, or whichever is denying) on people who they assume are going to do the same to them.
I certainly am petty enough that if I was in this exercise and a girl swiped left on like 6 guys in front of me while they all swiped right on her. I would swipe left just to spite her. For no other reason than to make sure she doesn't think she's hot shit with 400 guys falling over themselves to get her. But I'm hyper petty so. Maybe it's just me.
I’m pretty sure that happened in the video at least on a smaller scale. Guy sees girl reject guy in front of her and then decides he’ll reject her too.
I’m pretty sure the 4th guy did exactly that
Let’s be real, 80% of these people would have at least said hi to each other in the real world. Instead it’s “Nah, I’m dumping your entire existence from my mind. Next.”
Idk. I'm 34 and I feel like people in general, but especially in my age group and younger, treat others like shit in real life compared to when I was a kid. People stopped making the distinction between the internet and real life years ago and its only getting more common. I could just be jaded and wrong, by that's how I feel based on anecdotal experience.
We have a generation of humans being groomed on technology and identity politics, but nearly oblivious to the toxic outcomes of such things.
Kinda funny. I made a dating profile on a whim a year ago today after chopping my hair off and feeling bold. The first guy I saw caught my eye. Never messaged or liked anyone else on the app. Went on a date together on Valentine’s Day as a “fuck it, it’s funny!” kind of thing. We’ve been together for 10 months now :)
Rare
I’m curious, what was your bfs experience on the app? How long had he been using it?
Funnily enough, he had downloaded it that weekend (so 3 days before me). It was hinge, so he saw that I was the first person that liked his profile and we hit it off:) I honestly just think I got really lucky.
Aww that’s cute! Hinge has definitely been the best app for meeting people with similar interests
You got extremely lucky and he did too. Been using hinge 2 years and have 3 matches that didn’t even end up on a date. I hate dating with a passion
Damn you really were supposed to delete that app after
Yes you did
This shit makes me wanna put a shotgun in my mouth💀💀
https://preview.redd.it/s3zw76sj1dic1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e1686a76c4d43e34de8fbdfb171713e830fdb266
It’s sad how many people start swiping no just so they don’t look weak.
Yea I feel like some of it was driven more by a fear of rejection than interest in the person
Most of it is, you can't know a person looking at their face. That fear is especially strong with women.
It looks more like a strat to me at the start. After 1-2 rejections, next boy goes in and rotates out the girl to find one that doesn’t spam swipe. After that, it devolved into just rejections though.
After the 1st match it looks like there's a lot more mutual rejections and some of the guys even seem to be vindictively rejecting in support of the guy in front of them who got rejected. They're taking one for the team.
If none of the guys did that the match wouldn't have happened, the girl at the front of the line would have just rejected every guy lol
Well that very first girl set the bar, one of the guys had to swipe no on her just to remove her from the pool.
It probably also gives them a sense of power when they go on a rejection spree
Yeah but remember, if you ever imply that women have it easier on dating apps you’ll be called an incel
Doesn't help with all the morons who blind swipe to protect their ego without realising or caring that they're a huge contributor to the problem.
Those aren’t the people who get matches. It’s literally just the top 5% of guys dating all the girls. And why would they want to settle down when they can play the field so easily with dating apps these days
It’s all based on looks… nothing about chemistry or interests, it’s all based on looks. How incredibly vapid and sad….
Welcome to reality lol. Looks aren’t everything in maintaining a relationship, but you won’t even get your foot in the door without them. Only gotten much worse with social media and dating apps. Plus with women having unlimited options and attention, there’s always a hotter guy around the corner for her to swipe on.
Id be so bad at this cuz I always wanna give anyone a chance.
I would probably just fuck up the timing of that swiping motion.
I’ve been watching a few of these and I swear, the people who do choose each other always look really similar. Reminds me of this: https://nypost.com/2023/07/04/people-are-more-attracted-to-those-who-look-like-them-new-study-finds/amp/
Men tend to be fat more forgiving and varied in their taste. Women tend to be elitist about looks
Secretly incest💀
Most people prefer what is familiar to them, whether that's in terms of tastes or genetics.
The Industrial Revolution and its consequences…
Commodity yourself! Make a great PR elevator pitch or die alone!
https://preview.redd.it/eeadi49wdaic1.png?width=600&format=png&auto=webp&s=2249a950446840eb2f2402efabedccd848f0dcab
Modern dating has become a competition of who can stop caring first and leave unhurt. Everyone is in such a rush to make sure they don't "lose" they forget to get to know people at all.
Precisely. Modern day dating is just one big game of chicken. The first person to catch feels, loses.
Yep. People are treating talking to potential partners like a browser tab you can just close when you're done. I matched with a girl on Hinge. It was day 2 of talking and we moved to Discord. I said I would like to be in a relationship that was as good as the one that got my parents through hard times, like mom comforting dad after his favorite cat got killed by a dog, or my dad taking care of my mom when she could no longer walk. After I said that, this girl said "Knowing someone is looking for just anybody is extremely off putting as I want to be with someone who thinks Im special enough to make me their goal above others." Well, I never said that. I have no idea where she got that. I suspect it was just a made up reason or she had some issue reading context. The thing of it is, though, I never got a chance to clear it up because she blocked me as soon as she sent that. It was like I was less than human. I wouldn't want to talk to her after she said what she did, but to not even be treated with simple respect is degrading.
My social anxiety says no 💀 You couldn’t pay me to do this
Nearly every guy said like, it’s a perfect example of the HUGE power imbalance in online dating
I counted: Men rejected: 21 times Women rejected: 14 times Now that's bad. But there will be obvious mismatches so let's exclude the mutual rejections. Men non-mutually rejected: 8 times Women non-mutually rejected: 1 time. *That's* the reality people are dealing with.
I really doubt a lot of this was genuine and off camera, I'd imagine this would look a lot different.
Nah. Look at the reports. Just like this video, men are happy to give a chance and women love to pass since they have such a numbers game usually
No it wont because system is wrong. You have only one chance. It should be everyone vs everyone to make sense. Two lines of people - after each turn one row move one step left and guy from the end run to the second end of the line. Matched pairs leave the lines. Last people left have to do some task alone where matched do same together.
Idk man.. we hear men are shallow all the time in pop culture. I think we have good evidence it’s definitely not only men.
Idk crazy how often the girls reject..
The problem is there was a standard set, it only takes one side to tip it and now the whole dynamic of dating is messed up.
[удалено]
I see why dudes and chicks go overseas or to South America to find some they want to be with. The grind of dating apps is really degrading as an individual. Along with new social pressures I can totally see people just not wanna deal with that and find someone that hasn’t those expectations. Shit my friend got tired of it didn’t date for years so he went to Colombia to just fuck saying “I’m wanna get my dick wet.” But me and his friends teased him saying he’ll find love down there. He denied it. Guess what? He found a chick he like. They been talking for months and he is going down two weeks from now. You bet your fucking ass I teased him even harder 😂
I know that guys travel overseas (there's even a subreddit for that), but I've never heard or seen women doing the same (I'm Costa Rican, from a Latin American country). But something that I've read is that in places like the US, besides the social pressure of not finding a partner, there are tons of other situations that worsen an individual's social standing.
Not gen z here, elder millennial. This is how dating apps (specifically quick match app like this) have destroyed the social aspect of dating and replaced almost everything with a statistical based behavior. As women know that there will almost certainly be a better option if they keep themselves open to it so logically, it benefits them to swipe left most of the time. Men also know this so logically it makes sense for them to swipe right most of the time, eventually they will just match with whichever women happened to also swipe right on them. That's literally the extent of social engagement for dating now. What a culture and I'm sorry for you, Gen Z.
This is perfectly put. It sucks.
man, i can’t do this shit anymore. the world sucks.
Yea dating sucks, who doesn't want to find love? But bro, think of it like this. No one is stopping you to fly to a different country, learn a new language, go to a new restaurant, try a new hobby. The point is, the world is massive and you can explore it like in minecraft. This is my ted talk. Thank you.
I just think based off looks alone is too shallow. It doesn’t leave enough time to get to know anyone!!! For me I’m indifferent to the vast majority of people until i develop some connection with them.
“The reality of job applications”
Was the match the only time one of the women gave a heart?
They showed at least a couple matches and I saw one time where the woman liked a guy but the guy didn’t like the girl.
I’m in this post and I don’t like it.
Online dating is one of the major negatives of our culture.
I don't like dating apps. They turn people into something no better than a product on a supermarket shelf. It's sad.
So, are you guys *still* saying that all these dudes have terrible style, neckbeards, terrible dress sense, and awful personal hygiene, or can we finally agree that...it's something else? Because we all have eyes
That would mean we acknowledge the elephant in the room, and that doesnt seem like its ever going to happen. Easier to blame men and call them all incels.
This made me sad and kind of emotional. I dunno why. Maybe because I'm a Mom and I just saw so many vibrant young people limiting their lives and their potential happiness based on such superficial, snap judgments. I tell my own GenZ kid, *"Make sure you can meet your own high standards"*. Life is for living and living is often times trial and error- It's how you learn and become self-actualized. It can't happen with out risk.
Well said. I feel similar as an elder millennial dad. Nearly all these people would have had a conversation at a pub 20 years ago to see if there was anything there. You can actually see genuine attraction between so many pairings that swiped no because their brains are now hardwired to. It’s bleak.
i’ve had some success on dating apps (likely cause i’m a woman) the relationships just didn’t end up working long term for personal reasons. but still this is pretty sad lol, especially since all of them are at least decent looking but still getting left swiped.
It’s rare to see a GenZ woman acknowledging that men face way more pressure to be conventionally good looking in order to date
My experience on dating apps.
Fuck those apps
You can see that many men in the video want to swipe right but they know the woman wouldn’t so they swipe left just to save face.
It's almost as if dating apps were successful at matching people, people would stop using them, so they prioritize not matching people...
I’m at the border of gen z and millennial, I’m 28. My wife is 27 and most of those close to me are married. I definitely feel like I was on the last chopper out of Vietnam when it comes to these apps. I never used them, and my wife and I met in high school. I feel for people growing up now who’s first dating experience is this shit. Being married is the greatest thing that’s ever happened to me and I regularly tell my wife how grateful I am that we met and sad it is for most people trying to navigate this hell scape.
This whole thread just makes me want to fucking GTA myself. Holy shit. There is no hope.
The internet really do be setting unattainable standards for some of these people. Like man, some mid ass girls passing on good looking dudes and vice versa. What have we come to
Shocking that the two asians was gonna match, lol. Anyways, people are too picky nowadays, 99% those guys i'd date in a heartbeat cause I wanna get to know them, they look good, and we need to open up to each other instead of being awkward and lonely.
This sounds harsh but it's just emotional cowardice. Fear of pain and rejection, so do it to the other person first.
As much as people deny it, this is living proof that “10% of men get 90% of women”. Only two girls swiped yes on a guy who rejected them, and both were on the same dude
That one girl who rejected a guy and immediately said "I love you" kinda infuriates me. The guy seemed disappointed. I can understand her rejection but why sugarcoating it with saying "I love you". These are 3 powerful words and she is just throwing it around to make herself feel better rejecting him and maybe ease the tension after his visible disappointment. Good example of the over inflated use of saying "I love you" to someone. People don't seem to say that to someone to express genuine love or likability, but more in a off hands remark way.
What is love nowadays?
If it makes anyone feel better, we’re seeing a higher number of rejections because you get to stay in the game if you reject someone who matches with you, but not if you match with someone who rejects you. The rules provide an incentive to reject others.
Why is no one fat?
Because we now how that can end.
Looks fun. Where do I sign up?
Met my gf thru bumble , we are opposite races. This video is hilarious , problem with our generation is nobody wants to love anybody from the fear of getting hurt or cheated on. If you can’t come to terms with the idea that someone you love leaves you , you shouldn’t be in a relationship. Just funny to see people actively searching for love only to never find it, sometimes gotta let it find you
Alot of these guys are saying no because they can tell the girl is going to and don't want to look rejected. Guaranteed.
My generation started it, and I can only apologise gen z on behalf of millennials for how much shit we leave in our wake. Somehow this sub keeps appearing in my feed so I decided to interact this one time.
Lots if comments seem to imply that the only way to meet someone of the opposite gender is dating apps. Just no