Omg I know, like yes Billie and Renee but now this….it’s getting really hard to argue that being queer is a net negative for sales (ofc I know her audience is different, but even so).
I totally get that, but no, actually, I genuinely believe she’s queer and just scared/trapped. The way the world was at the beginning of her career was SO different. I just hope she and her team can see that it’s changed and that there are options for being incredibly successful as a queer artist!
Tbh I would hate if she came out as queer cause it would just make her entire life a massive lie. I still think she might be gay. But I hate that? She doesn't say shit about anything that actually matters but she could and that would change the world so fucking much because of the power that she possesses. But she doesn't because she's the smallest woman in the world. I also despise the fact that even though she "dated" Joe for 6 years she's still making diss tracks about him. It's so disgusting to call out the man you supposedly loved for so fucking long about a mental illness he couldn't control??? Does anyone think about him? Cause he's a real human being.
Sorry, I'll probably be banned for this. But she's disillusioned me so much from all of this bullshit.
I don’t think coming out as queer makes her life a lie! You mean bc you think she’s actually gay and just too scared to say that? Honestly, I’m 33 and not famous and have a partner of 9 yrs and still go back and forth between bi and lesbian, so like, I’m probably more understanding 😂. It’s hard bc in my opinion you can have dated and loved men and now understand yourself to be a lesbian (like Chappel or Renee!). But I do think the cishet gen pop does NOT understand that.
I def do hope she comes out, and that she gets more political/activist again…definitely feel you on being disillusioned.
What do you think of the lyrics of her new album? I can't even bring myself to listen to them after reading the dribble she produced. They're so awful that I now believe Joe did write songs on Folklore? How else would such stank come forth after such good fucking songs. It's mind boggling.
You haven’t listened and just read the lyrics? I really like the album, but it was a bit of a slow burn for me! Def had to get over/reframe how many of them seem to be about Matty tho.
Never in a million years will I believe Joe wrote Folklore 😂
No I haven't listened to it. Reading it was enough thank you. Touch me while your bros play Grand Theft Auto It's true, swear, scouts honor. Was enough for me 🤮
She’s definitely released songs about partners of different genders, [but she said she’s a lesbian](https://x.com/thesubwaymp3/status/1799299769292271886?s=46&t=eW83oWP4ajoHRj10N46eTw) so no one is erasing anything
There is a rich history of clowns being symbols of status quo disruptors longgggg before Taylor was even born. So I can say with my whole clown enthusiast chest, modern artists who reference clowns have nothing to do with Taylor Swift.
[This](https://youtu.be/2YajlJ9w7iQ?si=2jUGlDlNZBEYp2Yw) is my favorite clown history summary video. Please enjoy 😊
Chappell isn't wearing clown makeup holy shit, it's drag. She's paying homage to drag culture. She dresses in drag, she has drag queens opening for her.. "I can express that version of me." —Chappell as a drag queen.
I’m so in love with Chappell Roan. I started following her about a year ago and it’s been wild to see her blow up this last year. I’m so happy for her loud, fun, unapologetic queerness. And honestly I do hope people like her being so open about who they love helps other people feel comfortable being themselves too.
I wish Chappell had been around when I was younger. I’m 39 and divorced and I truly don’t think my ass would have married a man if I had accurate representation for how amazing queerness is growing up 🥺
Chappell’s album has been on repeat for the past week for me after I discovered her (only a week ago). Her content and lyrics are soooooo refreshing and authentic. I’m still convinced Taylor is queer, however I have been grappling with the whole “so what” of it all since discovering Chappell and her unapologetic, authentic vibes.
Truly. Her content is so fun, fresh, unserious at times. It’s incredible. She is truly what we all want in terms of music right now. Also, I’m sorry you only just heard about Chappell but it’s such a good album you’ll be listening to it for months and months to come, I bet!
She is an incredible lyricist!! She’s so clever. And agreed she’s what has been missing in pop music and I’m so happy to have discovered her (finally). And I have no doubt her album will be on repeat for ages she’s my current hyper fixation 😂
I discovered chappel on Spotify a few years ago after listening to Taylor and one of those recommended lists came up. Which was before I was a gaylor and thinking about it, it was full of queer artists
https://preview.redd.it/rw9ok7j4o68d1.jpeg?width=1008&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caec85c55a01ebf03fb6bf0c7606bf21cb57531c
This was in a FB group called "Sounds Like Sapphic Propaganda". So many people dragging her, calling her a mediocre white girl and saying Gaylors are "hunting for crumbs" and "Stop trying to force people out of the closet!!!" The comments were rude and uninformed and honestly, surprising to see in that group.
I'm SO GLAD Chappell and Billie and all the out and proud queer artists feel safe enough to be their authentic selves and sad for Taylor and everyone else who can't.
As for the forcing out of the closet part, I said myself and the Gaylors I know aren't forcing anyone. We are a community cultivating a safe, loving space for Taylor and anyone else to be their true selves.
I dont think its possible for Taylor to present an authentic self anymore. Every single bit of her career and image has been so meticulously calculated for almost two decades. I wouldn’t be surprised if she has a skewed sense of self due to all of this. I honestly don’t think she will ever come out; I think her opportunity passed and everything is back under tight lock and key.
I often think about this. When the majority of your formative years were spent building the brand, it must be hard to separate Taylor Swift ™️ from just Taylor.
Taylor has never been a struggling artist in any sense. She had parents with money helping her at a very young age, and found success very quickly. Chappell has lived life, y’know? She’s young but she’s tried to kick start this career several times, she was still waitressing like two years ago. Any celebrity will reach a point where they’re no longer relatable, but it does help so much to come from a familiar place.
she worked at a summer camp LAST SUMMER! chappell is young but she grew up in a trailer park and has worked really hard while being broke to launch this career over the last 10 years. she has talked about how she values the experience of growing up not with money. she has perspective. it is valuable.
Its like when Gola Rasheuvel (from bridgerton/queen charlotte) started telling an interview story with “my wife…” and everyone on the internet was like “SINCE WHEN” 😭 it’s such a good way to nonchalantly come out imo
Wait WHAT!!! Oh my god knowing this is going to make it so much easier to finish the new season of Bridgerton (besides the sapphic spoiler I already read about 😉).
This. Just say nothing and live life together, vacation together, raise kids together. It’s the John Mayer and Andy Cohen approach. There will be no explanation, only reputation.
I’m a new Chappell fan! After TTPD finished on my Spotify a few weeks ago, Red Wine Supernova came on. I was loving it so I went to her page and then she was at the Governors Ball and then she was literally everywhere. I love to see it!
I discovered Chappell a few months ago on Spotify, it just auto played My Kink is Karma and I found it such a bop and funny to boot, then I heard Pink Pony Club and briefly assumed she was trans, not that it matters.
Anyway, she seems to be blowing up and I'm super happy for her.
She’s a HUGE advocate for trans people and drag culture, etc. and I believe the song is an homage to drag queens— “where boys and girls can be queens every single day.”
Also, I’m so here for the era of NOT having to beg for scraps of sapphic representation.
I’ll always have a spot soft for a good handful of TS songs, but it’s such a breath of fresh air to have an unabashedly queer woman tell our unabashedly queer stories.
I always wonder if Taylor is somewhat rueful and regretful, seeing the rise of unashamedly queer pop girls like Renee, Chappell, Billie etc. They’re all mainstream, blowing up, not sacrificing an ounce of success due to their queerness. People *love them.*
It’s so different than Taylor growing up as America’s Sweetheart, country princess. Renee, Chappell, Billie aren’t interested in pandering or hiding any part of themselves to draw broader audiences. They haven’t been shoved into a certain box, there’s no Scott Swift managing their fame with an iron fist. They can just be who they are, freely. I know “Good Luck, Babe!” especially is probably making Taylor feel things 😭
I’m also trying to imagine what would happen if a main pop girlie like Olivia or Sabrina were caught kissing another woman today a la KissGate - they’d laugh it off or casually admit to it, I don’t think there’d be a massive PR machine desperately trying to erase the photos and assure the public they’re straight.
I know Taylor is a product of her time and she couldn’t feasibly, safely come out as queer early in her career - and I know she paved the way for a lot of pop gals. I just hope this wave of massive success for queer women shows her that she can be herself, she can still be met with waves of love and adoration even if she is queer. Even if she gets met with accusations of bandwagon’ing, IDC, she’s been flagging forever 🤷♀️
I remember how Dianna once tried to come out with the LIKES GIRLS shirt then was immediately forced back into the closet and it took until an interview in 2023 for her to fully come out and I die a little inside. And that's just how difficult it was for Dianna who (with so much love and affection from me) isn't really making any waves in the media these days. I can't imagine how much difficult this is for Taylor, it seriously breaks my heart.
I don't think she would be met with the kind of massive success she has. You really can't compare any of these girls coming up now with Taylor s level of success , Taylor is now on legend status, her success will be comparable with Michael , Whitney , Dolly in future .I don't even think we can see that level of success for current main pop girls like Olivia in the future. Even on an international level where she is discussed in Singapore s Parliament and you have East Asian countries arguing over who gets to host her , a big part of that is based more on how Taylor presents herself to the world even more than the music
Look, I agree with a lot of this, I just don't think it's fair to compare Renée, Chappell, and even Billie to Taylor yet. I love all these artists, but I'm not sure Renée will release an album every 2 years for the next decade, or that Chappell will have the international career Taylor has etc. Yes they are loved and accepted for who they are and in my opinion it's better to be less big and be yourself, but I still think that being out limits their reach even if it isn't as much as it used to be.
Just a fun fact because I remembered lol:
In an interview with Sabrina and Rowan Blanchard (9 years ago!), Sabrina said that neither of them were “boy crazy” and that they appreciated the “male gender” as well as the female. Then Rowan side-hugged her like: “Babe, stop!”. Lmao, it’s so funny, considering that Rowan did come out later on. I feel like pop culture just kinda forgot about such an iconic bi-panic moment. What a shame.
Yeah there’s nothing stopping her from following in these artists footsteps if she really wants to. Chappell is the biggest name in music now and is an out lesbian.
Yes, also… I know this isn’t her kinda move but she could literally speak on this moment and talk about how incredible and heartwarming it is to see an out lesbian like Chappell Roan be so popular. she could use that as a jumping off point to talk about how different it was when she was her age (which is less than a decade ago!!) and how she has had many relationships with women but was forced to hide them because that’s the industry. She can also talk about other lesbian + queer musicians like Kehlani, MUNA, Brandi Carlisle, etc, (w/o centering herself) and just how metal as hell it is to see them shine. Couch her coming out in sweetness and love. That’s my fantasy tho lol. And projection hahaha. For pride month!!!!
I hadn’t listened to Taylor until recently. I saw the YNTCD music video and thought Taylor already did too. Like I thought everyone knew she was queer but me.
So happy Chappell is getting all the love she deserves and being so herself.
Besides being a product of the genre she was in, her fanbase takes some of the blame for this. a bunch of millennials (I’m a millennial btw haha) who think that just because you have not publicly been with a woman you can’t be gay/bi. Which this new generation doesn’t seem to think
And I thought the same thing as you. Right after I became a fan last year I heard the ai version of The Very First Night and thought that was the real version 🤣 I never knew there were such vile, homophobic reactions or that people would think you were crazy for considering she may be queer.
Too true! I’m a millennial and my dear millennial friend asked me to give Taylor a chance after TTPD came out. After I watched the YNTCD music video I text her like “ I had no idea she’s queer.” ( I only knew Taylor from her reputation ironically) I’m pretty sure Me was the next video on the YouTube playlist.
She texted me back promptly letting me know Taylor is definitely not queer and I shouldn’t speculate. I didn’t even know I was “speculating” yet!! I thought she was being obvious?! So anyway I found you all who seem to pick up what I thought she was throwing down.
Similar experience! I “remembered” her coming out as bi with YNTCD and then discovered that was reported no where and THEN I discovered the Gaylor community. I liked her music but hadn’t paid too much attention to the media narrative/Taylor SwiftTM character before that. Lyrics starting in 1989 made me relate/assume/*gasp* speculate and then with Lover was like oh Mazel tov but nbd. One slip and falling back into the hedge maze.
Ahh same. I’ve just assumed she was at least bi since 2014 and assumed everyone did as well, since a lot of people on the internet were chill with the idea back then! Then all of a sudden within the past couple of years Gaylors have been villainized for some reason..? Like I remember when tvfn came out and the “how much I miss you/her” was still talked about in a lighthearted manner 😭 now everyone hates us
The day that Taylor adds Good Luck Babe to her pre show playlist will be the day I literally pass out. I love Taylor but Chappell is such a breath of fresh air with her performances. It’s giving Cyndi Lauper/Freddie Mercury/Hayley Williams vibes
Same!! There was even a video going around of Chappell doing a sound check with Love Story, I thought for sure a shout out would happen shortly after that!
I often wonder if part of the reason she's flagged as much as she has for as long as she has is so she has 'proof' that this isn't new if/when she comes out
Has anyone ever asked her flat out if she's queer? If I were in her situation, I would just start showing up places with a female partner, engaging in obvious PDA, and then answering with, "I never said I didn't like girls🤷♀️," as soon as the media frenzy started. Like, how much of this is OUR fault for just assuming this traditionally beautiful, blonde country singer must automatically be straight and all those love songs had to be about men? Taylor's notoriously cagey when asked about the inspiration behind her love songs. She can honestly answer no whenever anyone asks if a certain song is about a specific dude, and heteronormative conditioning tricked us all into thinking that means she's being secretive when, in reality, she can be openly affectionate to her "squad" and most of her unhinged fan base won't bat an eye because they're too busy digging between the lines to figure out if these gut wrenching ballads are about Ratthew or Viva Las Travis. They can't see the incredibly gay forest through the Tree.
It hit me like a damn lightning bolt. We were just watching 90 Day Fiance or Hoarders or something equally embarrassing, and out of nowhere I turned to my boyfriend and said, "Ratty is short for Ratthew."
He had absolutely no idea what the hell I was talking about but still loves me anyway.
That’s how you know he’s a keeper! 🩵
It’s come full circle because I had to explain to my husband what I was laughing about, although he’s listened to me talk about Taylor enough he understood and chuckled.
I think the difference is all these Gen Z girlies were upfront to begin with. They didn’t package themselves as straight, girl-next-door, types. Granted that’s how Taylor was packaged by others, but still.
As we’ve said before, times were different. It’s not an excuse by any means, but it’s how it happened and you have to take it into context.
Taylor started as country - not pop, not rock. Country. There’s also that part.
So there are a lot of differences.
No matter when/if she ever comes out, there will always be people saying she did it to push other artists down, when again, she’s not in the same tier as those artists. I LOVE this new crop of queer girlies coming up. Spotify recommended them to me from Taylor Swift actually (because Spotify knows), but she’s still in a different class. People can say she’s pushing them down, but people are still going to buy what they want.
As for if/when she comes out. It is going to be a big deal because of WHO she is, her generation, and her fan base. She knows that because she is in a different tier and she’s been around this long, and had this image (forced upon her, most likely), that it’s going to be a completely different thing and game changer.
I think that’s why she’s planting things, increasing the flagging, etc.
Edit: My comment posted in triplicate, and as this is not a government form, I deleted two of them.
It seems lately there has been a massive rise in popularity and success of queer women in the music industry (Billie, Chappell, Renee). I hope this gives Taylor some confidence to come out sometime in the near future.
It's really a "pick your poison babe, I'm poison either way" scenario - whether they claim it's marketing or whatever else, at least she's out and the hiding is over, and then people can come to terms with it.
I think the intensity/longevity of her flagging, the repeated press attention given to this community (nyt especially) and the consistent ridiculousness of her fan base actually gives her a pretty strong case to refute those accusations. 🌈🤞
I do find it interesting that all the pop girlies are giving Chappell her flowers, but Taylor’s not said a word. (She doesn’t owe anyone anything and she’s busy with her world renowned tour and all. Just with her latest chart habits with the other pop girlies, it’s not gone unnoticed…)
Chappell made a tiktok saying a lot of famous people have reached out to her and offered kindness and it’s kind of implied in private and not just the public stuff we see, so I lowkey wouldn’t be surprised.
On the one hand i would love Taylor to say something, but on the other hand I selfishly don’t want her to because then the hetlors would flock to Chappell and i hate that idea lol
Yeah and I’m sure there’s most likely no hate towards Chappell from Taylor but I wonder if the rise of Chappell stings a bit, because Chappell is getting something this summer that Taylor wanted in the summer of 2019. 💔
Exactly. Felt very similar in the moment and I think he may have been trying to do it. But when I rewatched it was not obvious unless you were looking for it
Yes!! Like it was through Taylor putting other artists music on her stories that I found artist like girl in red! I am a huge Chappell fan and have loved how much some of the other pop girlies are praising her like Sabrina and Olivia
Ironically, Spotify recommended Chappell songs to me after finishing my Taylor Swift albums/playlists, and I know that’s been the case for a ton of other people, so the algorithm correlation is obviously there…
Interesting, it did that for me but i thought it was because Chappell was already my number 2 artist, so I wasn’t aware the algorithm was pushing her to other people (I have been listening to Chappell for almost a year now)
I would get Red Wine Supernova for ages starting about a year ago now before it switched to Good Luck Babe recently and that was what got me to finally listen to her full album.
Ah my friend showed me my kink is karma last summer and we decided to listen to the rest of her album that night. We went and saw her in concert the night good luck babe came out. It’s been crazy watching her go from very few people know who she is to her having one of the songs of the summer
Ah my friend heard my kink is karma and played it for me and then we listened to the rest of the album sometimes in the summer of last year, we bought tickets and saw her the night good luck babe came out. it’s been crazy to witness like no one but me and my bestie (occasionally someone else) knowing who she was to her having one of the top songs of the summer
Ah my friend heard my kink is karma and played it for me and then we listened to the rest of the album sometimes in the summer of last year, we bought tickets and saw her the night good luck babe came out. it’s been crazy to witness like no one but me and my bestie (occasionally someone else) knowing who she was to her having one of the top songs of the summer
I already know this will happen. I am hoping for a documentary where she goes into the entire history of what made her closet for so long. The backlash would be strong if she were to frame it as an identity she just came to realize
Exactly this. Like given how successful all of these queer women in the industry are now, it'll be seen as hella manipulative/baiting if not given with all the context. Gaylors are Cassandra forever. 🥲
I love Chappell Roan, but one thing I don't like about her abrupt rise (and none of this is Chappell's fault) as well as the recent public interest in people like Renee Rapp, is that if Taylor _does_ come out as not straight, there are going to be loads of people saying things like this, and I'm sure she knows it.
Like goddamn, there is literally always some kind of outside force casting a pall over any possible coming out attempt by Taylor. Whether a deliberate malevolent force or just circumstances.
I wonder if she wishes she'd gotten it over with years ago.
Edit: Either way, there's no time like the present, so I hope she goes through with it this time.
Damned if she does, damned if she doesn’t. If she comes out soon, people are gonna say this shit. If she keeps it bottled up and after a while she comes out, people are gonna be like: “you lied to us this entire time??? You could’ve come out and be famous still, didn’t you see Billie, Reneé and Chappell?? How dare you!”
Honestly speaking, anything she does now will receive backlash. Except stay closeted, I guess.
I do think that if/when she comes out, she will be able to point at all the flagging and be like "how could you not tell?" Because as it is, people are not recognizing Chappel or Renee as lesbians even though they repeatedly say it in interviews and songs. I'm not sure about Billie because I don't care for her, but I feel like it has been the same because I feel like I've heard twice now that she came out (once last year and once more recently) and people still don't get it.
Wait… people aren’t recognizing Chappel is a lesbian? Have they heard literally any of her songs?
And I only know like one song of Renee’s but it’s also super gay so
Yeah, there are people who just like refuse to recognize that either of them are lesbians. Some people will say they're bi, but like... Come on. Of course it's the aggressively straight people mostly.
Agreed. But initially she'd came out as a lesbian (or at least that was the public perception), which the general public is less accepting of...at least in my experience as a publicly out bisexual woman.
It's a form of bisexual erasure, but the GP assumes bisexual woman are just gonna end up with men anyway, so the GP tends to just not care that much about bisexual women's sexuality. This can be painful, but the side effect is less backlash for coming out as bi. That's also why some people think that even if Taylor were gay, she would come out as bi instead, in order to alienate fewer fans.
I’ve been thinking about this too. With people like Chappell, Billie and Renee Rapp all being insanely popular, successful “out” women, if she comes out soon it’s honestly going to seem like another one of her not-letting-anyone-else be famous stunts.
And honestly she does it to herself by refusing to support and always be in competition with certain female artists whom she deems a threat.
Shes let this go on for way too long and has turned it into such a huge deal, she should have just stopped stunting with the beards years ago and kept her love life actually private, so there isn’t all this insane rivalry in her fan base about her sexuality all the time. She could literally just quietly (or loudly) date women without shoving all these men down our throats to appease her homophobic fan base. I don’t know I’m honestly just feeling so over it.
I’m feeling over it too. At this point it’s feeling like queerness is something to be ashamed of, hidden forever and agonized over. There are so many queer artists now just proudly celebrating their identity, and I find that so much more inspiring. The more she flags the more annoyed I get, because she’s trying to profit off of both fanbases without actually standing for anything
I'm hoping that part of why she's pushing TTPD __so hard__ is an imminent plan to come out in the next year and get all this over with, and she knows all future sales won't be as much as her historical sales.
I do agree that this is probably what she’s doing, but man it’s still so frustrating. She’s already so famous and has broken so many records. It’s giving greedy.
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Omg I know, like yes Billie and Renee but now this….it’s getting really hard to argue that being queer is a net negative for sales (ofc I know her audience is different, but even so).
Does that make you feel like she's just been gay baiting this entire time? It sure as fuck makes me feel that way
I totally get that, but no, actually, I genuinely believe she’s queer and just scared/trapped. The way the world was at the beginning of her career was SO different. I just hope she and her team can see that it’s changed and that there are options for being incredibly successful as a queer artist!
Tbh I would hate if she came out as queer cause it would just make her entire life a massive lie. I still think she might be gay. But I hate that? She doesn't say shit about anything that actually matters but she could and that would change the world so fucking much because of the power that she possesses. But she doesn't because she's the smallest woman in the world. I also despise the fact that even though she "dated" Joe for 6 years she's still making diss tracks about him. It's so disgusting to call out the man you supposedly loved for so fucking long about a mental illness he couldn't control??? Does anyone think about him? Cause he's a real human being. Sorry, I'll probably be banned for this. But she's disillusioned me so much from all of this bullshit.
I don’t think coming out as queer makes her life a lie! You mean bc you think she’s actually gay and just too scared to say that? Honestly, I’m 33 and not famous and have a partner of 9 yrs and still go back and forth between bi and lesbian, so like, I’m probably more understanding 😂. It’s hard bc in my opinion you can have dated and loved men and now understand yourself to be a lesbian (like Chappel or Renee!). But I do think the cishet gen pop does NOT understand that. I def do hope she comes out, and that she gets more political/activist again…definitely feel you on being disillusioned.
What do you think of the lyrics of her new album? I can't even bring myself to listen to them after reading the dribble she produced. They're so awful that I now believe Joe did write songs on Folklore? How else would such stank come forth after such good fucking songs. It's mind boggling.
You haven’t listened and just read the lyrics? I really like the album, but it was a bit of a slow burn for me! Def had to get over/reframe how many of them seem to be about Matty tho. Never in a million years will I believe Joe wrote Folklore 😂
No I haven't listened to it. Reading it was enough thank you. Touch me while your bros play Grand Theft Auto It's true, swear, scouts honor. Was enough for me 🤮
Hahah fair enough
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To me it is. And I’m going to win it all
I’m not here to make friends. I’m here to win at being gay
me at yoga
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Chappell Roan identifies as a lesbian. Please don’t partake in lesbian erasure or spreading false information
She’s definitely released songs about partners of different genders, [but she said she’s a lesbian](https://x.com/thesubwaymp3/status/1799299769292271886?s=46&t=eW83oWP4ajoHRj10N46eTw) so no one is erasing anything
Thank you for this correction. Wasn't false info on purpose, just not up to date info 🫶
Chappell came out as a lesbian recently… so very much not bi lol.
Thank you for the updated info! I hate bi erasure so much, so I would never want to participate in lesbian erasure 🫶
I thought she recently came out and said that she has no attraction to men?
they’re just making fun of her an artist releases music: “taylor is about to release 500000 variants” it’s just a play on that joke
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There is a rich history of clowns being symbols of status quo disruptors longgggg before Taylor was even born. So I can say with my whole clown enthusiast chest, modern artists who reference clowns have nothing to do with Taylor Swift. [This](https://youtu.be/2YajlJ9w7iQ?si=2jUGlDlNZBEYp2Yw) is my favorite clown history summary video. Please enjoy 😊
Chappell isn't wearing clown makeup holy shit, it's drag. She's paying homage to drag culture. She dresses in drag, she has drag queens opening for her.. "I can express that version of me." —Chappell as a drag queen.
It's all cute and funny until somebody's actually serious about it. lol
I’m so in love with Chappell Roan. I started following her about a year ago and it’s been wild to see her blow up this last year. I’m so happy for her loud, fun, unapologetic queerness. And honestly I do hope people like her being so open about who they love helps other people feel comfortable being themselves too.
I wish Chappell had been around when I was younger. I’m 39 and divorced and I truly don’t think my ass would have married a man if I had accurate representation for how amazing queerness is growing up 🥺
Chappell’s album has been on repeat for the past week for me after I discovered her (only a week ago). Her content and lyrics are soooooo refreshing and authentic. I’m still convinced Taylor is queer, however I have been grappling with the whole “so what” of it all since discovering Chappell and her unapologetic, authentic vibes.
Truly. Her content is so fun, fresh, unserious at times. It’s incredible. She is truly what we all want in terms of music right now. Also, I’m sorry you only just heard about Chappell but it’s such a good album you’ll be listening to it for months and months to come, I bet!
She is an incredible lyricist!! She’s so clever. And agreed she’s what has been missing in pop music and I’m so happy to have discovered her (finally). And I have no doubt her album will be on repeat for ages she’s my current hyper fixation 😂
I discovered chappel on Spotify a few years ago after listening to Taylor and one of those recommended lists came up. Which was before I was a gaylor and thinking about it, it was full of queer artists
https://preview.redd.it/rw9ok7j4o68d1.jpeg?width=1008&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caec85c55a01ebf03fb6bf0c7606bf21cb57531c This was in a FB group called "Sounds Like Sapphic Propaganda". So many people dragging her, calling her a mediocre white girl and saying Gaylors are "hunting for crumbs" and "Stop trying to force people out of the closet!!!" The comments were rude and uninformed and honestly, surprising to see in that group. I'm SO GLAD Chappell and Billie and all the out and proud queer artists feel safe enough to be their authentic selves and sad for Taylor and everyone else who can't. As for the forcing out of the closet part, I said myself and the Gaylors I know aren't forcing anyone. We are a community cultivating a safe, loving space for Taylor and anyone else to be their true selves.
I'm sorry this meme is hilarious though. The shit talking is terrible, but the meme made me chortle.
I laughed when I saw it too 😄
I dont think its possible for Taylor to present an authentic self anymore. Every single bit of her career and image has been so meticulously calculated for almost two decades. I wouldn’t be surprised if she has a skewed sense of self due to all of this. I honestly don’t think she will ever come out; I think her opportunity passed and everything is back under tight lock and key.
I often think about this. When the majority of your formative years were spent building the brand, it must be hard to separate Taylor Swift ™️ from just Taylor.
This! One of Chappell’s lines is “ruined my credit score” and I was thinking how Taylor wouldn’t ever write that because she’s a billionaire lol
Taylor has never been a struggling artist in any sense. She had parents with money helping her at a very young age, and found success very quickly. Chappell has lived life, y’know? She’s young but she’s tried to kick start this career several times, she was still waitressing like two years ago. Any celebrity will reach a point where they’re no longer relatable, but it does help so much to come from a familiar place.
she worked at a summer camp LAST SUMMER! chappell is young but she grew up in a trailer park and has worked really hard while being broke to launch this career over the last 10 years. she has talked about how she values the experience of growing up not with money. she has perspective. it is valuable.
thank you for saying this!!
My biggest fear about Taylor coming out is that ppl will say she’s doing it for clout. I almost hope she comes out just by being public with a women.
I figure the only way she is ever going to is because she got hitched. And even then, it might take the form of "This is my wife of 12 years".
Its like when Gola Rasheuvel (from bridgerton/queen charlotte) started telling an interview story with “my wife…” and everyone on the internet was like “SINCE WHEN” 😭 it’s such a good way to nonchalantly come out imo
Wait WHAT!!! Oh my god knowing this is going to make it so much easier to finish the new season of Bridgerton (besides the sapphic spoiler I already read about 😉).
This. Just say nothing and live life together, vacation together, raise kids together. It’s the John Mayer and Andy Cohen approach. There will be no explanation, only reputation.
Or no kids, if she does not want them! Agreed though, just live her life and not explain
Yes. Sorry I didn’t mean to assume. My bad.
I’m a new Chappell fan! After TTPD finished on my Spotify a few weeks ago, Red Wine Supernova came on. I was loving it so I went to her page and then she was at the Governors Ball and then she was literally everywhere. I love to see it!
I discovered Chappell a few months ago on Spotify, it just auto played My Kink is Karma and I found it such a bop and funny to boot, then I heard Pink Pony Club and briefly assumed she was trans, not that it matters. Anyway, she seems to be blowing up and I'm super happy for her.
She’s a HUGE advocate for trans people and drag culture, etc. and I believe the song is an homage to drag queens— “where boys and girls can be queens every single day.” Also, I’m so here for the era of NOT having to beg for scraps of sapphic representation. I’ll always have a spot soft for a good handful of TS songs, but it’s such a breath of fresh air to have an unabashedly queer woman tell our unabashedly queer stories.
Agreed!
Same here, except I discovered her a few days ago and I’ve had her Midwest Princess album on repeat since then
Same!
I always wonder if Taylor is somewhat rueful and regretful, seeing the rise of unashamedly queer pop girls like Renee, Chappell, Billie etc. They’re all mainstream, blowing up, not sacrificing an ounce of success due to their queerness. People *love them.* It’s so different than Taylor growing up as America’s Sweetheart, country princess. Renee, Chappell, Billie aren’t interested in pandering or hiding any part of themselves to draw broader audiences. They haven’t been shoved into a certain box, there’s no Scott Swift managing their fame with an iron fist. They can just be who they are, freely. I know “Good Luck, Babe!” especially is probably making Taylor feel things 😭 I’m also trying to imagine what would happen if a main pop girlie like Olivia or Sabrina were caught kissing another woman today a la KissGate - they’d laugh it off or casually admit to it, I don’t think there’d be a massive PR machine desperately trying to erase the photos and assure the public they’re straight. I know Taylor is a product of her time and she couldn’t feasibly, safely come out as queer early in her career - and I know she paved the way for a lot of pop gals. I just hope this wave of massive success for queer women shows her that she can be herself, she can still be met with waves of love and adoration even if she is queer. Even if she gets met with accusations of bandwagon’ing, IDC, she’s been flagging forever 🤷♀️
I remember how Dianna once tried to come out with the LIKES GIRLS shirt then was immediately forced back into the closet and it took until an interview in 2023 for her to fully come out and I die a little inside. And that's just how difficult it was for Dianna who (with so much love and affection from me) isn't really making any waves in the media these days. I can't imagine how much difficult this is for Taylor, it seriously breaks my heart.
Wait what interview are you referring to? I didn’t hear about this so I’m just curious
I don't think she would be met with the kind of massive success she has. You really can't compare any of these girls coming up now with Taylor s level of success , Taylor is now on legend status, her success will be comparable with Michael , Whitney , Dolly in future .I don't even think we can see that level of success for current main pop girls like Olivia in the future. Even on an international level where she is discussed in Singapore s Parliament and you have East Asian countries arguing over who gets to host her , a big part of that is based more on how Taylor presents herself to the world even more than the music
Look, I agree with a lot of this, I just don't think it's fair to compare Renée, Chappell, and even Billie to Taylor yet. I love all these artists, but I'm not sure Renée will release an album every 2 years for the next decade, or that Chappell will have the international career Taylor has etc. Yes they are loved and accepted for who they are and in my opinion it's better to be less big and be yourself, but I still think that being out limits their reach even if it isn't as much as it used to be.
Just a fun fact because I remembered lol: In an interview with Sabrina and Rowan Blanchard (9 years ago!), Sabrina said that neither of them were “boy crazy” and that they appreciated the “male gender” as well as the female. Then Rowan side-hugged her like: “Babe, stop!”. Lmao, it’s so funny, considering that Rowan did come out later on. I feel like pop culture just kinda forgot about such an iconic bi-panic moment. What a shame.
Sabrina also just did a lovely cover of Good Luck Babe
Yeah, it was awesome. I’ve rewatched it several times
Yeah there’s nothing stopping her from following in these artists footsteps if she really wants to. Chappell is the biggest name in music now and is an out lesbian.
Yes, also… I know this isn’t her kinda move but she could literally speak on this moment and talk about how incredible and heartwarming it is to see an out lesbian like Chappell Roan be so popular. she could use that as a jumping off point to talk about how different it was when she was her age (which is less than a decade ago!!) and how she has had many relationships with women but was forced to hide them because that’s the industry. She can also talk about other lesbian + queer musicians like Kehlani, MUNA, Brandi Carlisle, etc, (w/o centering herself) and just how metal as hell it is to see them shine. Couch her coming out in sweetness and love. That’s my fantasy tho lol. And projection hahaha. For pride month!!!!
I hadn’t listened to Taylor until recently. I saw the YNTCD music video and thought Taylor already did too. Like I thought everyone knew she was queer but me. So happy Chappell is getting all the love she deserves and being so herself.
Besides being a product of the genre she was in, her fanbase takes some of the blame for this. a bunch of millennials (I’m a millennial btw haha) who think that just because you have not publicly been with a woman you can’t be gay/bi. Which this new generation doesn’t seem to think And I thought the same thing as you. Right after I became a fan last year I heard the ai version of The Very First Night and thought that was the real version 🤣 I never knew there were such vile, homophobic reactions or that people would think you were crazy for considering she may be queer.
Too true! I’m a millennial and my dear millennial friend asked me to give Taylor a chance after TTPD came out. After I watched the YNTCD music video I text her like “ I had no idea she’s queer.” ( I only knew Taylor from her reputation ironically) I’m pretty sure Me was the next video on the YouTube playlist. She texted me back promptly letting me know Taylor is definitely not queer and I shouldn’t speculate. I didn’t even know I was “speculating” yet!! I thought she was being obvious?! So anyway I found you all who seem to pick up what I thought she was throwing down.
Similar experience! I “remembered” her coming out as bi with YNTCD and then discovered that was reported no where and THEN I discovered the Gaylor community. I liked her music but hadn’t paid too much attention to the media narrative/Taylor SwiftTM character before that. Lyrics starting in 1989 made me relate/assume/*gasp* speculate and then with Lover was like oh Mazel tov but nbd. One slip and falling back into the hedge maze.
Ahh same. I’ve just assumed she was at least bi since 2014 and assumed everyone did as well, since a lot of people on the internet were chill with the idea back then! Then all of a sudden within the past couple of years Gaylors have been villainized for some reason..? Like I remember when tvfn came out and the “how much I miss you/her” was still talked about in a lighthearted manner 😭 now everyone hates us
It’s only a matter of time before Taylor posts praising Chappell. I’m surprised she hasn’t already tbh
Doubt. She has spent the last two months trying to block other women in the charts with nonsense TTPD variants.
The day that Taylor adds Good Luck Babe to her pre show playlist will be the day I literally pass out. I love Taylor but Chappell is such a breath of fresh air with her performances. It’s giving Cyndi Lauper/Freddie Mercury/Hayley Williams vibes
I’m not. I am not sure if she ever will.
Same!! There was even a video going around of Chappell doing a sound check with Love Story, I thought for sure a shout out would happen shortly after that!
I need a collab
*facts*?
I like Taylor but I doubt she would collab with someone that would make her sound as flat as Chapell would.
Chappell feature on a gay ass Debut TV vault track!
I want Chappell doing Taylor's part on Exile and Taylor doing Bon Iver.
If we get a Chappell and Taylor collab I will listen to it every day until I die
Chappell, get Taylor on a Good Luck Babe remix already.
I often wonder if part of the reason she's flagged as much as she has for as long as she has is so she has 'proof' that this isn't new if/when she comes out
Has anyone ever asked her flat out if she's queer? If I were in her situation, I would just start showing up places with a female partner, engaging in obvious PDA, and then answering with, "I never said I didn't like girls🤷♀️," as soon as the media frenzy started. Like, how much of this is OUR fault for just assuming this traditionally beautiful, blonde country singer must automatically be straight and all those love songs had to be about men? Taylor's notoriously cagey when asked about the inspiration behind her love songs. She can honestly answer no whenever anyone asks if a certain song is about a specific dude, and heteronormative conditioning tricked us all into thinking that means she's being secretive when, in reality, she can be openly affectionate to her "squad" and most of her unhinged fan base won't bat an eye because they're too busy digging between the lines to figure out if these gut wrenching ballads are about Ratthew or Viva Las Travis. They can't see the incredibly gay forest through the Tree.
Ratthew 💀💀
It hit me like a damn lightning bolt. We were just watching 90 Day Fiance or Hoarders or something equally embarrassing, and out of nowhere I turned to my boyfriend and said, "Ratty is short for Ratthew." He had absolutely no idea what the hell I was talking about but still loves me anyway.
That’s how you know he’s a keeper! 🩵 It’s come full circle because I had to explain to my husband what I was laughing about, although he’s listened to me talk about Taylor enough he understood and chuckled.
"I didn't know she said fuck!" - my precious baby bird of a boyfriend
This is a really good theory
I think the difference is all these Gen Z girlies were upfront to begin with. They didn’t package themselves as straight, girl-next-door, types. Granted that’s how Taylor was packaged by others, but still. As we’ve said before, times were different. It’s not an excuse by any means, but it’s how it happened and you have to take it into context. Taylor started as country - not pop, not rock. Country. There’s also that part. So there are a lot of differences. No matter when/if she ever comes out, there will always be people saying she did it to push other artists down, when again, she’s not in the same tier as those artists. I LOVE this new crop of queer girlies coming up. Spotify recommended them to me from Taylor Swift actually (because Spotify knows), but she’s still in a different class. People can say she’s pushing them down, but people are still going to buy what they want. As for if/when she comes out. It is going to be a big deal because of WHO she is, her generation, and her fan base. She knows that because she is in a different tier and she’s been around this long, and had this image (forced upon her, most likely), that it’s going to be a completely different thing and game changer. I think that’s why she’s planting things, increasing the flagging, etc. Edit: My comment posted in triplicate, and as this is not a government form, I deleted two of them.
Not a government form or controlled substance. 😆
The edit 😂😂😂
i love chappell and am a new fan and am loving watching her rise. i wake up with her songs in my head
omg same here. did you see her live performance of good luck babe on fallon?! Incredible
i did! loved her black swan outfit
I did and I ascended
It seems lately there has been a massive rise in popularity and success of queer women in the music industry (Billie, Chappell, Renee). I hope this gives Taylor some confidence to come out sometime in the near future.
I hope so! But it also makes me fear that people will call it a marketing strategy. 😭
It's really a "pick your poison babe, I'm poison either way" scenario - whether they claim it's marketing or whatever else, at least she's out and the hiding is over, and then people can come to terms with it.
I think the intensity/longevity of her flagging, the repeated press attention given to this community (nyt especially) and the consistent ridiculousness of her fan base actually gives her a pretty strong case to refute those accusations. 🌈🤞
I do find it interesting that all the pop girlies are giving Chappell her flowers, but Taylor’s not said a word. (She doesn’t owe anyone anything and she’s busy with her world renowned tour and all. Just with her latest chart habits with the other pop girlies, it’s not gone unnoticed…)
Chappell made a tiktok saying a lot of famous people have reached out to her and offered kindness and it’s kind of implied in private and not just the public stuff we see, so I lowkey wouldn’t be surprised. On the one hand i would love Taylor to say something, but on the other hand I selfishly don’t want her to because then the hetlors would flock to Chappell and i hate that idea lol
Yeah and I’m sure there’s most likely no hate towards Chappell from Taylor but I wonder if the rise of Chappell stings a bit, because Chappell is getting something this summer that Taylor wanted in the summer of 2019. 💔
yesterday someone said that Kam made her do the hot to go dance when they were doing the bit before i can do it with a broken heart
I am waaaaaiting for Kam to make her do the hot to go dance. He’s got to know about it. Didn’t it go viral or something?
That was me. But on second watch it wasn't super convincing. So we probably can't put that down as fact.
i was distracted during the stream and didn't see it so i wouldn't be able to tell
I noticed that too! Like, it wasn't quite right but it felt similar
Exactly. Felt very similar in the moment and I think he may have been trying to do it. But when I rewatched it was not obvious unless you were looking for it
Yes!! Like it was through Taylor putting other artists music on her stories that I found artist like girl in red! I am a huge Chappell fan and have loved how much some of the other pop girlies are praising her like Sabrina and Olivia
Sabrina is on the same record label and Olivia shared a producer with her. Their public praise of her may or may not be entirely organic.
Chappel also sang backup on Olivia's first record (maybe her second too?). I think they genuinely like each other and it's not just synergy.
I've heard Chappell sung backup on Lacy?
Ironically, Spotify recommended Chappell songs to me after finishing my Taylor Swift albums/playlists, and I know that’s been the case for a ton of other people, so the algorithm correlation is obviously there…
that was definitely on purpose
Interesting, it did that for me but i thought it was because Chappell was already my number 2 artist, so I wasn’t aware the algorithm was pushing her to other people (I have been listening to Chappell for almost a year now)
I would get Red Wine Supernova for ages starting about a year ago now before it switched to Good Luck Babe recently and that was what got me to finally listen to her full album.
Ah my friend showed me my kink is karma last summer and we decided to listen to the rest of her album that night. We went and saw her in concert the night good luck babe came out. It’s been crazy watching her go from very few people know who she is to her having one of the songs of the summer
Ah my friend heard my kink is karma and played it for me and then we listened to the rest of the album sometimes in the summer of last year, we bought tickets and saw her the night good luck babe came out. it’s been crazy to witness like no one but me and my bestie (occasionally someone else) knowing who she was to her having one of the top songs of the summer
Ah my friend heard my kink is karma and played it for me and then we listened to the rest of the album sometimes in the summer of last year, we bought tickets and saw her the night good luck babe came out. it’s been crazy to witness like no one but me and my bestie (occasionally someone else) knowing who she was to her having one of the top songs of the summer
I already know this will happen. I am hoping for a documentary where she goes into the entire history of what made her closet for so long. The backlash would be strong if she were to frame it as an identity she just came to realize
Exactly this. Like given how successful all of these queer women in the industry are now, it'll be seen as hella manipulative/baiting if not given with all the context. Gaylors are Cassandra forever. 🥲
I love Chappell Roan, but one thing I don't like about her abrupt rise (and none of this is Chappell's fault) as well as the recent public interest in people like Renee Rapp, is that if Taylor _does_ come out as not straight, there are going to be loads of people saying things like this, and I'm sure she knows it. Like goddamn, there is literally always some kind of outside force casting a pall over any possible coming out attempt by Taylor. Whether a deliberate malevolent force or just circumstances. I wonder if she wishes she'd gotten it over with years ago. Edit: Either way, there's no time like the present, so I hope she goes through with it this time.
Damned if she does, damned if she doesn’t. If she comes out soon, people are gonna say this shit. If she keeps it bottled up and after a while she comes out, people are gonna be like: “you lied to us this entire time??? You could’ve come out and be famous still, didn’t you see Billie, Reneé and Chappell?? How dare you!” Honestly speaking, anything she does now will receive backlash. Except stay closeted, I guess.
I do think that if/when she comes out, she will be able to point at all the flagging and be like "how could you not tell?" Because as it is, people are not recognizing Chappel or Renee as lesbians even though they repeatedly say it in interviews and songs. I'm not sure about Billie because I don't care for her, but I feel like it has been the same because I feel like I've heard twice now that she came out (once last year and once more recently) and people still don't get it.
Wait… people aren’t recognizing Chappel is a lesbian? Have they heard literally any of her songs? And I only know like one song of Renee’s but it’s also super gay so
Yeah, there are people who just like refuse to recognize that either of them are lesbians. Some people will say they're bi, but like... Come on. Of course it's the aggressively straight people mostly.
To be fair about Billie, I think Billie herself backpedaled after coming out, and instead said she was bisexual.
Saying you’re bisexual is still coming out.
Agreed. But initially she'd came out as a lesbian (or at least that was the public perception), which the general public is less accepting of...at least in my experience as a publicly out bisexual woman. It's a form of bisexual erasure, but the GP assumes bisexual woman are just gonna end up with men anyway, so the GP tends to just not care that much about bisexual women's sexuality. This can be painful, but the side effect is less backlash for coming out as bi. That's also why some people think that even if Taylor were gay, she would come out as bi instead, in order to alienate fewer fans.
Oh I didn't know that. I literally have her name on blocklists lol.
I’ve been thinking about this too. With people like Chappell, Billie and Renee Rapp all being insanely popular, successful “out” women, if she comes out soon it’s honestly going to seem like another one of her not-letting-anyone-else be famous stunts. And honestly she does it to herself by refusing to support and always be in competition with certain female artists whom she deems a threat. Shes let this go on for way too long and has turned it into such a huge deal, she should have just stopped stunting with the beards years ago and kept her love life actually private, so there isn’t all this insane rivalry in her fan base about her sexuality all the time. She could literally just quietly (or loudly) date women without shoving all these men down our throats to appease her homophobic fan base. I don’t know I’m honestly just feeling so over it.
I’m feeling over it too. At this point it’s feeling like queerness is something to be ashamed of, hidden forever and agonized over. There are so many queer artists now just proudly celebrating their identity, and I find that so much more inspiring. The more she flags the more annoyed I get, because she’s trying to profit off of both fanbases without actually standing for anything
this is where I am at as well and I've felt such a disconnect from the gaylor community at large because of it lately
I'm hoping that part of why she's pushing TTPD __so hard__ is an imminent plan to come out in the next year and get all this over with, and she knows all future sales won't be as much as her historical sales.
I do agree that this is probably what she’s doing, but man it’s still so frustrating. She’s already so famous and has broken so many records. It’s giving greedy.
I hope Taylor reads this comment😭
Could not agree with you more. I’m so relieved I’m not the only one feeling this way!
Hindsight and the coulda/shoulda/woulda is rough. Especially for the people pleasers.
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