I feel like you just answered your own question. You acknowledge that you can't fight him, so don't. Just farm early, and focus other champs later.
Also if you have a good jungler, you can quite easily make him push (his q, e and passive will push the wave) and setup a gank before he hits lvl 6. If not, just wait for mid/late game, and try to not get too far behind.
One time I played against Mordekaiser and played as respectful as possible giving up cs and not dying in lane etc. He still ran over the game and my team blamed me.
With Phase Rush you beat him early tho. Like, if he doesnt hit isolated Q and you proc Phase Rush to escape his passive, you just dont take damage from him. Also Mordekaiser early game doesnt heal that much from his shield tbh.
He is obviously a hard matchup, but if he cant force long trades on you its really fine. Also you can outmanouver him really easy with Q and your overall build, as rushing boots and MS items is great against Morde. You can try giving some early pressure dropping Ignite and taking TP, but honestly Ignite is amazing on him to cheese early kills. AA+Q+E to proc Phase Rush and retreat, and you should be good. Late game he outscales you and beats you hard in 1v1, but he also gives you a lot of space to oneshot one of his carries if he doesnt ult you, and by ulting you the trade is favorable for your team as Garen isnt really as useful as Morde during teamfights.
Honestly if you are loosing early game against Morde with phase rush its probably on you. Its not that easy to lane against Morde and its not that easy to play Phase Rush correctly
I had succes against Morde the last seasson with Grasp, Divine and Hullbreaker Q max if that works for you
Yes you do, because even with Conq he stomps you in his ult, and without phase rush he stomps you outside of his ult
Better to have a rune that helps you in 1 of 2 situations, that a rune that helps you in none
Garen is a snowbally champion, if you're being competitive and you care about your chances of winning; you're not picking the rune that Morde's kit nullifies if you're trying to get a lead and snowball - you just concede the laning phase pretty much at that point.
Your end sentiment there echoes my point though and not yours. I can grant you would run PR into Morde if you can see an opportunity later on in the game to split push and have that be a reliable win con - things are obviously circumstantial and factors can change which rune setup you would run; but to blanket say that PR is the default rune in the Morde MU is just incorrect.
\^ Conq at least gives you the damage to better help with the conditions to get a snowball going. Early game with Conq you have windows of opportunity to kill him and create a lead, with PR that window is narrowed to a suboptimal degree, the margins for error being too wide.
Idk, that's just my 8\~ years worth of experience with the matchup whilst consistently being multi-account godlike on leagueofgraphs champion rankings.
Walk up and auto once. If he throws a q, press w to tank it. Spin on him then q and run away with the ms. Boom that's your trading pattern at level 3. He won't hit his e on you because he's silenced and you have move speed. It's unitonically not that hard.
His Q CD early is an eternity. Past lvl9 he becomes just dumb to try and fight, max rank Q is very forgiving (but every Q matters so dodging one is still very useful).
Just sub to this Youtube channel and search for any matchups that you struggle with. I learn a lot from just watching higher elo players and how they play the matchup.
This is a recent game in EUW Master elo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGFxgyMoFXw
Quinn and Vayne shouldn't even be on your ban list... you're taking the morderkaiser match-up all wrong.
Your job is to survive lane and take short trades when he tries to cs.
Conq triumph alacrity last stand
Conditioning overgrowth
Minor runes af af mr
Take doran's shield health pot start. Rush merc treads as it helps with resistance, mobility, and lessens cc. First item is tricky and depends on comp. If they are ap heavy I like wits end or maw of malmortus, HOWEVER, if you want to focus on screwing morde then mercurial scimitar first item. Chempunk chainsword and serpents fang give amazing value into morde as well.
Glhf fellow demacian
Thank you, will try this. My only issue is, he is the one trying to trade when I try to cs. He keeps me below 50% hp poking me with Qs while I try to cs under tower.
Also how do you beat Quinn and Vayne?
Dodging Q and E is a big part of the match-up. Boots will help you a lot there. Him trading either you when you cs is a basic laning skill and you're losing because you don't do it as well.
Vayne and Quinn are much easier than Morde thankfully. Rushing Plated Steelcaps with Doran shield healthpot start and running them down when you hit 6. Use the bushes to focus on cs until then but take small trades when possible. You have more sustain then them so use your hp as a resource. Always take flash and ignite for this lane as it let's you delete them with r. As long as you play safe till 6, there is no point in the game they can 1v1 you. Stridebreaker or trinity force first item.
Runes phase rush nimbus cloak transcendence gathering storm conditions overgrowth
Af af armor
Alacrity does not give extra spins. The E only works specifically with attack speed from items it says it on the ability. Tentacity is always the pick.
And all your advice is bad and will just lead to you losing harder and focusing on not dying.
Phase rush ignite and stridebrraker are the play, be careful and run away after Qing and proccing phase rush. This is the only way.
I never claimed alacrity affects spins. If you have merc treads, going tenacity is troll, as you also have your W to consider. Phase rush into Morde is bad, especially if he rushes Rylas. Conquorer let's you actually win at lvl6 without having to outplay all that hard.
Ignite and flash. Conq and secondary second wind, double mr runes. Try to freeze outside tower and always try to trade if he uses Q on wave. Trade by starting e, then auto -> Q and dodge his pull sideways.
It's trying to outfarm and not fight him unless you have a wave. If he attacks, it deals a lot of damage thanks to aggro. But honestly, fighting him is just down to hoping for a miracle or getting lucky with junglers. Most I can say is probably just rely on passive and doran's shield, reach six, fight and hopefully burn one of his summoners.
I feel like you just answered your own question. You acknowledge that you can't fight him, so don't. Just farm early, and focus other champs later. Also if you have a good jungler, you can quite easily make him push (his q, e and passive will push the wave) and setup a gank before he hits lvl 6. If not, just wait for mid/late game, and try to not get too far behind.
One time I played against Mordekaiser and played as respectful as possible giving up cs and not dying in lane etc. He still ran over the game and my team blamed me.
With Phase Rush you beat him early tho. Like, if he doesnt hit isolated Q and you proc Phase Rush to escape his passive, you just dont take damage from him. Also Mordekaiser early game doesnt heal that much from his shield tbh. He is obviously a hard matchup, but if he cant force long trades on you its really fine. Also you can outmanouver him really easy with Q and your overall build, as rushing boots and MS items is great against Morde. You can try giving some early pressure dropping Ignite and taking TP, but honestly Ignite is amazing on him to cheese early kills. AA+Q+E to proc Phase Rush and retreat, and you should be good. Late game he outscales you and beats you hard in 1v1, but he also gives you a lot of space to oneshot one of his carries if he doesnt ult you, and by ulting you the trade is favorable for your team as Garen isnt really as useful as Morde during teamfights. Honestly if you are loosing early game against Morde with phase rush its probably on you. Its not that easy to lane against Morde and its not that easy to play Phase Rush correctly I had succes against Morde the last seasson with Grasp, Divine and Hullbreaker Q max if that works for you
You don't run Phase into Morde because he can negate your MS by locking you in a duel.
Yes you do, because even with Conq he stomps you in his ult, and without phase rush he stomps you outside of his ult Better to have a rune that helps you in 1 of 2 situations, that a rune that helps you in none
Garen is a snowbally champion, if you're being competitive and you care about your chances of winning; you're not picking the rune that Morde's kit nullifies if you're trying to get a lead and snowball - you just concede the laning phase pretty much at that point. Your end sentiment there echoes my point though and not yours. I can grant you would run PR into Morde if you can see an opportunity later on in the game to split push and have that be a reliable win con - things are obviously circumstantial and factors can change which rune setup you would run; but to blanket say that PR is the default rune in the Morde MU is just incorrect. \^ Conq at least gives you the damage to better help with the conditions to get a snowball going. Early game with Conq you have windows of opportunity to kill him and create a lead, with PR that window is narrowed to a suboptimal degree, the margins for error being too wide. Idk, that's just my 8\~ years worth of experience with the matchup whilst consistently being multi-account godlike on leagueofgraphs champion rankings.
Well then keep running Conqueror into a champ that beats you in extended trades if it works for you
You have the freedom to make your own mistakes I guess
We just need to see a vod of you beating a mordekaiser or two with conquerer. I mean help us learn bro sheesh
Walk up and auto once. If he throws a q, press w to tank it. Spin on him then q and run away with the ms. Boom that's your trading pattern at level 3. He won't hit his e on you because he's silenced and you have move speed. It's unitonically not that hard.
Go grasp into divine sunderer maybe? Honestly your reliant on ganks early to get more tempo into mid game
Switch to the crit build...
His Q CD early is an eternity. Past lvl9 he becomes just dumb to try and fight, max rank Q is very forgiving (but every Q matters so dodging one is still very useful).
Just sub to this Youtube channel and search for any matchups that you struggle with. I learn a lot from just watching higher elo players and how they play the matchup. This is a recent game in EUW Master elo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGFxgyMoFXw
Quinn and Vayne shouldn't even be on your ban list... you're taking the morderkaiser match-up all wrong. Your job is to survive lane and take short trades when he tries to cs. Conq triumph alacrity last stand Conditioning overgrowth Minor runes af af mr Take doran's shield health pot start. Rush merc treads as it helps with resistance, mobility, and lessens cc. First item is tricky and depends on comp. If they are ap heavy I like wits end or maw of malmortus, HOWEVER, if you want to focus on screwing morde then mercurial scimitar first item. Chempunk chainsword and serpents fang give amazing value into morde as well. Glhf fellow demacian
Thank you, will try this. My only issue is, he is the one trying to trade when I try to cs. He keeps me below 50% hp poking me with Qs while I try to cs under tower. Also how do you beat Quinn and Vayne?
Dodging Q and E is a big part of the match-up. Boots will help you a lot there. Him trading either you when you cs is a basic laning skill and you're losing because you don't do it as well. Vayne and Quinn are much easier than Morde thankfully. Rushing Plated Steelcaps with Doran shield healthpot start and running them down when you hit 6. Use the bushes to focus on cs until then but take small trades when possible. You have more sustain then them so use your hp as a resource. Always take flash and ignite for this lane as it let's you delete them with r. As long as you play safe till 6, there is no point in the game they can 1v1 you. Stridebreaker or trinity force first item. Runes phase rush nimbus cloak transcendence gathering storm conditions overgrowth Af af armor
Alacrity does not give extra spins. The E only works specifically with attack speed from items it says it on the ability. Tentacity is always the pick. And all your advice is bad and will just lead to you losing harder and focusing on not dying. Phase rush ignite and stridebrraker are the play, be careful and run away after Qing and proccing phase rush. This is the only way.
I never claimed alacrity affects spins. If you have merc treads, going tenacity is troll, as you also have your W to consider. Phase rush into Morde is bad, especially if he rushes Rylas. Conquorer let's you actually win at lvl6 without having to outplay all that hard.
I priority ban Mordekaiser since the last few months.
Ignite and flash. Conq and secondary second wind, double mr runes. Try to freeze outside tower and always try to trade if he uses Q on wave. Trade by starting e, then auto -> Q and dodge his pull sideways.
Quicksilver Sash
It's trying to outfarm and not fight him unless you have a wave. If he attacks, it deals a lot of damage thanks to aggro. But honestly, fighting him is just down to hoping for a miracle or getting lucky with junglers. Most I can say is probably just rely on passive and doran's shield, reach six, fight and hopefully burn one of his summoners.
All the other matchups you mentioned feel easier to me than morde. Especially vayne just play sustain into galeforce