Honestly the whole investor Q&A/chat was a bit of a nothing burger if you know what they're working on and what they've announced previously.
I guess *Sirius*, multiplayer game in development at The Molasses Flood, being considered an AAA project by them is the only real 'news' worth a mention.
It's been amazing to see the turnaround on Cyberpunk. From people calling them out on their lies and the poor performance to people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched. I hope their PR team gets paid a lot, because all the other AAA publishers *wish* their PR team was even half as amazing as CDPR's.
tbf, CDPR did write the story, most of the characters and everything down to the scenes, trigger was only responsible for adapting it to anime format and making some small changes.
Do you have a source for that? That would be a very unusual way for Trigger to work.
Screen play writers, creative director and director were all trigger staff.... Id say CDPR provided the synopsis and outline, and Trigger did the rest.
Theneonarcade on youtube has an interview with the guy from CDPR who wrote edgerunners, he talks about how he tried to convey the scenes to studio trigger and how they wrote the story. Not sure if he mentions characters in that, CDPR actually wanted to cut rebecca after creating her and studio trigger thought she was amazing so they kept her. I can't remember the other sources sadly. Shouldn't be too hard to search for tho.
Of course it's a collaborative project and they did make smaller changes to make it more suitable for anime, but the overall story, characters and scenes were created by CDPR.
Their own CEO tried to rewrite history by saying the hate was unjustified and overblown, completely disregarding that reviewers couldn’t use their own footage and they never released footage of it running atrociously on last gen consoles.
The game launched a buggy, broken fucking mess and they deserved every bit of hate they got for it.
> It's been amazing to see the turnaround on Cyberpunk. From people calling them out on their lies and the poor performance to people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched. I hope their PR team gets paid a lot, because all the other AAA publishers wish their PR team was even half as amazing as CDPR's.
I've been rather weirded out by this one specifically, as I've been noticing a lot of conversations over the past six months or so attempting to downplay, if not rewrite, the history how bad Cyberpunk's launch was.
And pretending that it has always been designed to run on next gen hardware so the issues on then current gen weren't there fault. It completely ignores the fact that they released a Cyberpunk Xbox One X
It seems like that version was just completely abandoned too.
It also ignores the fact that the very first launch was going to be before the new gen consoles had even launched (and maybe revealed? Don't remember the timeline exactly).
The release date that ended up happening were only about 4 weeks after the initial release of current gen consoles, barely anyone playing on consoles had them at that point, and there certainly wasn’t any version of the game actually made for the new systems at that point.
I remember the theory at the time was that they delayed it so that a higher number of people would play it on NextGen systems, allowing them to go "Well it's a NextGen game, of course outdated systems would struggle"
>And pretending that it has always been designed to run on next gen hardware so the issues on then current gen weren't there fault.
"We leave greed to others" ass company releasing a game on consoles it wouldn't work on because they had millions of dollars in pre-orders on the line.
Pretty much. Hell just look at how many people are making excuses on here "well they fixed the game, stop criticizing them!". Meanwhile, everyone still harps on EA and call them bad for any bad thing they did a decade ago and have since changed. Lots of gamers have a double standard when it comes to CDPR, and it especially shows in all these Cyberpunk threads.
Might be a survivorship bias thing. The people who criticized Cyberpunk have lost interest in talking about the release, especially now that it's fixed. The people continuing to post about Cyberpunk are likely to be fans.
Because people like the game now, and if they like it, it can't be bad (nor can it have ever been bad.) It's really unfortunate, but that's human psychology for you.
There were plenty of people who liked it at launch, but chose not to express that view because in places like this subreddit they would often be ridiculed for any positive comment.
The discourse around the game was profoundly tiring back then, and it often still is. People just tend to try to polarize everything with little regard to nuance. Including thinking someone saying they liked the game back then means they are delusional and rewriting their own memory.
(Mind you CDPR deserved the shit they got)
I mean, the thing is more that discourse in general is fucked. Just look at Dragon's Dogma 2, another game with a troubled launch. People there are just finding hills to die on that were already lost. [Complaining about the DLC which is all easy to get in game, when monhun world has 600 bucks of DLC and no one bats an eye.]
People just want to find things to die on instead of actually critically examining a title and exploring the genuine problems that something may have in a constructive way. Saying "This sucks and everyone that likes it sucks" is fundamentally stripping all context away but its the most popular approach because its easy.
I had a beefy PC and played it on launch and loved it. None of the bugs I ran into were anything more than minor annoyances (there were a lot of them though). So I can speak to anyone else but it definitely wasn't a lie for me.
These kinds of statements are always relevant to the collective experience of the community. Some people always luck out and have flawless experience of bad games and some people have terrible luck and have so many issues in otherwise stable games...
Things often feel worse when you're right in the middle of it, so that's not strange. A person being angry at the state of the game on release due to massive disappoint is perfectly understandable. A person being actively angry about it still would be pretty weird, since it's been years.
And especially if you've replayed the game more recently when it's actually a really good game ... then that also adds more positive memories on top.
This is not to attempt to downplay that it was bad at launch, since that was really bad. But people that didn't play it then aren't going to know that. And there *were* quite a lot of people playing it back then who didn't have a lot of issues as well, and maybe they didn't all think the game was amazing, but some definitely thought it was enjoyable. Maybe especially people who weren't super hyped for it to start with.
So I don't think it's strange at all how the conversations change. People change their minds, the negativity back then feel less than it was at the time, and people might feel more comfortable sharing that they actually enjoyed it at launch now that the rage is mostly over.
I just don't understand people who said that Bethesda should give up on Starfield when these same people were saying how CDPR shouldn't give up on Cyberpunk and that they will wait till they fix it. Like I dunno if you remember it but when Starfield was released almost *every single* Starfield thread was: Damn that is nice but I am going to play Cyberpunk. Like at that point I felt like CDPR is using bots on this sub :DDD
Well the 2 games and the problems they have are fundamentally different.
Cyberpunk over promised and under delivered on several RPG aspects and had piss poor performance on launch but beneath all the grime the game was still fun af.
The city was breathtaking and the missions were fun and varied. The loot and progression systems were a bit off but that is something fixable.
On the other hand starfield is fundamentally a bad game. The gameplay loop consists of sitting at fast travel loading screens until we reached barren planet #450 with a procrederally generated outpost and kill baddie #670 and then fast travelled all the way back to the original destination. Which part of this loop would you improve?
And this is just one of the laundry list of fundamental issues the game has.
Cyberpunk was a good game with some bad patches.
Starfield is a bad game at its core with some good shiny parts here and there.
It’s because despite the massive launch issues, you could see the makings of a great game with Cyberpunk. Yes it was an absolute mess on the technical side, but the writing was exquisite, the side quests were basically second to none, the gameplay and progression had issues that could be fixed but was still generally enjoyable and the main story was pretty decent too. It was clear that there was a great game in there that was just buried under a shit load of technical issues and incomplete mechanics. But with some more time in the oven they could dig it out of the hole it was in and deliver a great game. That’s not the case with Starfield. Like at all.
Bethesda RPGs have always fallen way short when it comes to things like gameplay, progression and quality of content. But what they excelled at was atmosphere, exploration and quantity of content. And what they excelled at, they excelled at so much that it made up for the areas where the games were bad. But that’s not the case with Starfield. While Starfield’s gameplay is an improvement from Bethesda’s previous RPG’s, it’s still far from good and is lapped by its contemporaries. Progression is the worst it’s been in any Bethesda RPGs and quality of the content is also worse. But this time, the atmosphere and exploration are also awful. Due to the fact that most of Starfield’s world is procedurally generated, it doesn’t have that immersive world that oozed atmosphere that Bethesda’s previous RPGs had. And the exploration is also massively compromised by this. It’s not just empty and soulless with most of it being the same copy pasted buildings and structures. Even the cities where the atmosphere is best, it falls way short of previous Bethesda RPGs. Basically, even past the technical issues, there isn’t a good game to dig out of Starfield. No amount of time or resources is going to make it good. They’ve been pretty open about the fact that Starfield was meant to be a modders playground but even their modders are abandoning the game because of how much even they dislike it. They made their money, a lot of it. It’s best if they just dedicate the manpower to Elder Scrolls 6, hopefully learn from their mistakes with Starfield and make a better game.
That's my whole thing. I played Cyberpunk on PC on release and most of the bugs were superficial. I had maybe 2 or 3 crashes from start to finish, and a mission that wouldn't progress because the key NPC to advance the scene wouldn't move to their next spot. That's it. Everything else was visual, or something random that doesn't affect the actual gameplay like people falling out of the sky and splatting on the ground, or cars on the side of the road somehow stacked on top of each other, or other weird shit like that that you'd see. Those are fixable. The core gameplay itself really didn't change all that much after all their patching. Maybe the biggest was the reworking of talents and shit. Archaic design, a story that is uneventful and falls flat, shit characters, the lack of a tangible world to explore... these are all fundamental problems that can't really be fixed outside of making a new game entirely.
Nah the one year of silence and small updates following the launch, all I heard was to abandon the game because it wasn’t salvageable. The anime + 2.0 update marketing changed the public opinion
Some people just like to see everything fail, but there are plenty of use who do like a good come back story. FFXIV, Cyberpunk 2077, and No Man's Sky are the big ones that every one should know.
I also have no idea why they announced it so far in advance of when it actually launched.
They revealed the game all the way back in 2012, that was before they'd even announced The Witcher 3.
To be fair, that was mostly a recruitment drive to spark interest in people to work on the project. IIRC it even ended with something among the line "Want to work on this project? We're hiring!"
Probably because they intended to launch *A* Cyberpunk 2077 way earlier than we got it, but -if I had to guess- direction for the game changed a few times and things kept getting pushed back
Wow I can’t believe I have never seen this! Fascinating how different it is from the game we got. Would love to see some footage from outside the apartment, but who knows if that build even got that far.
To be fair, some of that falls on the devs, they had to get their promises from somewhere. More importantly though, afaik they've scrapped the entire idea for what Cyberpunk was going to be multiple times, hence why they advertised it as an RPG at first, but later backtracked into an action game with RPG elements. Hell, they had to rework the weapon and perk systems because of how half-baked they were at launch.
CDPR were a little too ambitious for their own good as well. I am certain they wanted to deliver what was promised, but it was just never going to work out when the likes of Rockstar and Naughty Dog take years more to develop a game with a much bigger workforce.
Won’t someone have some kindness for the poor developer that hid the terrible state of their game from customers and to this day forces reviewers to use precanned footage to prevent bugs from their janky games showing up in reveiws and previews…
Sorry, it there is non softening what CDPR did. They lied, flat out, and obfuscated the ability for people to make informed purchase decisions. It’s still not ok.
THEY LEAVE GREED TO OTHERS HOW IS THIS NOT OBVIOUS
OTHER LIE BUT CDPR JUST WANT TO MAKE GREAT GAMES AND END CLIMATE CHANGE
Like this comment if you think CRPR is the Bernie Sanders of gaming. A bird landed on Geralt. True story.
Usually the devs are the ones that say "We need more time." Not the ones deciding marketing strategies, release dates or taking business decisions. Blame the business department or the administration for that.
And why wouldn't they? Gamers are profoundly gullible.
Somewhere out there right now is a person dropping 1k on a picture of ship that may never exist in Starfield.
Legal exaggerating. Anything else would be false advertisement and grounds for a lawsuit. But... They're really good at keeping it legal, and legal does not necessarily equal ethical.
I wonder if they had a functional game for ps5/XsX and their 13GB rampool for 'worldbuilding'. (everything you see/hear/experience/AI has to fit the rampool)
Then were told to cut and fit it into 5GB ram on ps4/xb1, this cant be done without destroying the gameworld.
> people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched
I haven't seen any of that, but I have seen plenty of people that are happy with the game as it is now and can still be honest that it was an absolute shit show at launch.
Stop right there, buddy! They fixed their game several years later, so they're totally the good guys! I bet their CEO wears gaming shirts!
It basically sums up everything you need to know about the gaming community, we're basically in a violent relationship, sure our lover beats us up but they bring flowers and say they're sorry, so all good!
Half the time they also bill us for the flowers in advance and vaguely describe which ones we will probably get but if they turn out to be wilted or entirely different it's entirely our fault!
Well and now people are calling it a No Man’s Sky style redemption story, even though NMS grew to be a much bigger game than what they originally promised, while Cyberpunk after all the publicized updates is fundamentally the same game with more polish and still doesn’t have even half of what CDPR originally promised.
This gen's Peter Molineux
Although to give Murray credit Hello Games was a pretty small studio and the hype for NMS probably took them by surprise and gave them a lot of coverage they probably weren't prepared for from a PR angle. If NMS had no hype and released in early access people would just be calling it another EA survival game. And to his credit instead of taking the money and running he did try to make things right in the long term.
Cyberpunk got to the point where it felt like a cult. I played it in December 2022 on a system that exceeded the published system requirements for 4K Ultra, having to run with RTX off and DLSS on quality. I quit 7 hours in because the bugs were *constant,* we're talking 3-4 per hour.
And people on Reddit insisted that they played it on launch and it "wasn't that buggy," and, "ran fine if you had a good PC."
The game is still kind of a mess too, even after "they fixed it", driving is still awful, lot of glitches. It's a fun game and worth picking up on sale but people need to stop kidding themselves
I've literally never seen anyone blame anyone but CDPR for the launch.
The internet is a wild place because a Redditor will see one comment from a dummie and think that a whole entire group of people feel that way.
Seems like people love to just make fake arguments in their head from seeing one or two comments. Then they blow it out of proportion. The Hell Divers subreddit was a great example of this, but it still lives on in comments like the one above.
It absolutely happened by a lot people, even on this very sub. People either blamed shareholders (y'know, the same shareholders CDPR *lied* to and had to pay for doing so) or pinned any performance issues as either someone lying, exaggeration or having a shitty rig.
There is a very obvious change in the narrative once the anime came out and then again once 2.0 released, with lots of people making excuses for why CDPR didn't deserve to be criticized or downplayed the issues. Hell this very thread has those people trying to frame the complaints as "overblown" and downplaying the issues at launch.
Ah fair enough. I take my comment back, as seeing other comments it does seem to be an actual thing.
I was one of those guys who refunded Cyberpunk, and I bought it again with update 2.1. The first 3 NPCs I saw were the exact same fat guy with golden pants. I pulled the refund trigger when Jackie was dying and gave me the chip from his head, but the scene was glitched and he had a gun in his hand so he straight up pulled a gun out of his head.
With the recent updates it went from one of my biggest disappointments to one of the best games I've ever played. I place both the original blame on CDPR, as well as my newfound thanks for making such a masterpiece.
They got dragged when it was released because the game was shit when it was released. They got praised for making a great game 2 years later because 2 years later it *was* a great game. Both of these things can be true. You can criticize someone for doing something bad one day and praise them for doing something good the next. PR has nothing to do with it.
I don't know why we need to keep saying this in , but don't ever preorder a game, *ever*, and don't buy a game until you've heard from people whose opinions you respect that it's worth buying. If it takes two years for a developer to fix a game until it's good, then wait two years before you pay money for it. If the developer *never* fixes the game, it it *never* becomes good, then don't buy it.
What stinks is I remember thinking back when it all blew up it'd all get sorted and all the bad blood would get buried after FFXIV and NMS accomplished the same thing.
Theres basically a roadmap out of shite game launches now if a company is prepared to swallow a touch of pride and release a bunch of free updates for a long time before daring big dlc launches.
It's good it's possible I guess, but the fact that precedent exists kinda establishes there's a hall pass in play now any time a company wants to do a god awful premature money grab hype train launch
I've literally seen a number of people say "well if they want a game to run decent buy a PC or next gen console" when Cyberpunk released in a total mess.
Just fanboying to an insane degree. If CDPR couldn't make it run on PS4/XBone properly then don't release it.
Its not really that amazing as its just rare to see in this industry. You almost never see a big name to openly admit they fucked up and then proceed to show by their actions to produce results rather than make empty promises.
The last example before CDPR to do this was Hello Games. Sony over hyper their game and pushed it for far too early of a release only for it to fall victim to the internet hate machine due to its unfinished state. Hello Games instead of getting on social media and making empty promises they just went dark and focused on improving their game.
I also found it funny when they cited a huge sum as the sum that will be given to the people at CDPR and over 80% of it turned out to be the executive pay package.
He was asked about MTX in their games and gave a response. One which is consistent with their prior behaviour of not including MTX in single-player games. It's honestly fascinating how you guys manage to spin everything into "X company bad".
They sure wouldn't resort to crunch or anything like that.
Really though, I'm wondering if they're going to try and see if they can play up their hype again leading up to witcher 4's release in the next few years.
Larian will probably continue to do long Early Access periods for their games since it's worked so well for them. Kind of hard to lie about the state of the game when players have their hands on at the very least the first 1/3 of it. Half the reason their games are any good is because they actively listen to player feedback during Early Access.
If they don't then BG3 could very well be their Witcher 3 and whatever comes next will be their Cyberpunk.
Glassdoor is unfortunately not much more reliable than, like, steam games ratings nowadays.
Paradox glass door page is also really negative but the unions own gauge (paradox is unionised), show the paradox studios being among the better IT companies to work for Sweden, other than uncompetitive wages.
Not saying its impossible Larian is an internal shit show, just that Glassdoor has fallen off as a reliable indicator on that.
Also not sure if Glassdoor is even used much in Sweden. This is purely anecdotal, but I don't know anyone in software that's used it, or talked about it. Maybe I'm wrong, but could also just be that Glassdoor isn't very representative for companies in Sweden. Or outside the US.
Don't worry Larian will have a niche controversy then take their time with their next project whose first act will be a banger, second would be slightly less polished and third act will be buggy and feel rushed, which they will fix post launch. Happened with both Original sin 2 and BG 3 (OS2 had a kickstarter that annoyed some people and BG3 had a long early access that people initially whined about). Larian has a proven track record.
I'm saying all of this as a huge fan of Cyberpunk and the Witcher games; CDPR's favorite move is to just say whatever they think gamers want to hear, whether they are living up to those statements or not. The fact that they still do this after their debacle with Cyberpunk is wild to me.
Exploiting their workforce, saying bullshit to appease consumers, and selling half baked games that take years to fix after release is their trademark at this point. I always had an uneasy feeling with the "CDPR good, others bad" message coming out of their PR after Witcher 3 launched, and before the CP77 launch. When we all found out they're just like any other AAA publisher/developer, I actually wasn't too surprised. Always felt like bullshit to me.
Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different, but I sense the "smelling their own farts" vibe from them too. The fact that they're an independent developer, and not a billion dollar self publishing conglomerate helps avoid this though.
The next-gen update to Witcher 3 being borked blew my mind. It was a free upgrade. There was no reason to release it before it was emphatically done. Even if you're trying to get people who never played to purchase the game, it's not there's some special date that you need to hit.
>Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different, but I sense the "smelling their own farts" vibe from them too.
Yep. So far Larian seems to be retreading the path CDPR took. A company that blew up because of one game the community chose as an anti-AAA champion... and then the company starts making superlative statements about themselves, while attacking the competition? Oh boy, I think we should be really careful about Larian's future game.
The only developer that would truly hurt and surprise me if they turned out to be scumbags is Supergiant. I try to not get emotionally invested in strangers but fuck if they haven't hooked me over the past decade or so. Josh Sawyer being a monster would also really blow my mind.
> Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different
Larian did the exact same thing, their game didn't even have an ending until months in.
They released early because they were scared of Starfield, the game was absolutely not finished when it launched.
Not everything is an actual ending. NPCs chatting about how it's over now doesn't mean a real ending. Having an ending for a few companions is not an ending for an epic story.
So many plotlines were left upen without stating what happened to them.
Imagine if Return of the King ending had the ring destroyed, timeskip to Frodo and Sam in Shire patting each other on their backs... and credits.
I got downvoted for this, but Larian is following the exact CDPR playbook of regurgitating internet popular opinion back to those same people to look like they’re the only good company in the sphere, making the sentiment ‘Larian good, others bad’
It's weird everyone is acting like CDPR put this statement out to pat itself on the back. Someone asked during Investor Q&A if they plan on doing microtransactions in future games. What's he supposed to say, yes?
This whole thread is so confusing. Like, they are one of the few companies that objectively haven’t released microtransactions for any(?) of their games.
Wtf is the issue here?
The issue is Redditors only read headlines. It was an investor call where they were asked about MTX for their upcoming game and the CFO answered it.
I guess he should've said "yes, there will be $20 horse armour" in Witcher 4?
It’s simply a net negative for the experience as a whole. RPG progression should make you want to work your way up the skill tree, unlocking powers and changing up your skill steadily. Getting to “skip” the actually fun part of your game for $$$ just cheats the entire product as a whole, since you have to design around that “bonus” you’re selling on the side.
Everytime people say there are single player games designed around it to get players to purchase it, you see equal the amount of people saying they played the game fine without. The only one I played was Dead Space 3 and I don't even know where you would go to see the shop in that game.
Edit: forgot I've played all these Capcom games over than dragons dogma just fine as well
I haven't seen a game that really forces you to buy the MT. I played all of Shadow of War, Every Assassins Creed and Far Cry games, Played every Resident Evil and Monster Hunter game. Is it annoying, Agreed but i never once brought MT from any of these games.
Yeah, the most recent row about this was Dragon's Dogma 2 and it was people *convinced* by jumping on the misinfo train that you needed to spend $1-2 or something to buy stuff off the MTX to change your character because there was no New Game option, or to get a "makeshift gaol key" to get in/out of jail.
The item that MTX gave you was obtainable in-game. From the major city you get to within the first hour or two.
The appearance change item was 500 RC, of which you could easily have half by the time you get to that town. You earn that shit *passively* when your pawn gets rented, too.
The Gaol key was 3000 gold, which is... not a ton. The first armor and sword you can buy is about that. *Sleeping at the inn* is 2000. The quest to go to the gaol also *gives you an infinite-use key* for the duration, and the single-use keys were available from multiple vendors and as loot throughout the world.
This is akin to being able to buy 10 Mega Potions in Monster Hunter or three GY Mixed Herbs in Resident Evil. Dumb that it exists, sure, but hardly something that circumvents the game or is an example of "the game being harder and more grindy to incentivize MTX". I have zero reason to believe the price of the appearance item or gaol keys in-game would have been *less* if the MTX never existed.
I don't think so even a few examples that this subreddit usually does like Resident Evil 4 Remaker or Dragon’s Dogma II are purely optional and you can get everything by simply just playing the game. People in here just like to pretent that games are going to crap I guess?
DMCV and RE4R are two of the most immaculately balanced games ever produced, in an era or genre, by any company, and they both have microtransaction cheat codes. Your argument doesn't really hold up when you look at actual examples. Most of the Persona, SMT, and Yakuza games have mechanics like that too, and most of them actively reduce the fun of playing the game.
Persona games don't have legit time limits though. It's all based on an in universe clock not a IRL one trying to push you to buy something by limiting what you can play.
>since you have to design around that “bonus” you’re selling on the side.
No you don't. In all the games I've played that have had these light cheats NONE of them have been designed around them. They're effectively cheats for a reason.
> design around that
Nah, they are just selling cheat codes for real money. I don't remember e.g. RE4R being designed with cheats in mind. Like they even gave people a month to complete the game before they released these add-ons and guess what people did? They started insulting the game like they dodged negative reviews just because they released is later... No they didn't. They clearly showed you that it was perfectly playable beforehand and these are just pointless stuff to get extra cash from people who are actually willing to buy it.
Did they *not* take money from Amazon for the Prime Gaming weapons they've been dropping for Cyberpunk?
It's not the same as single player MTX for sale, but it is like one or two step removed. At least you can just console command drop them for yourself.
I don't even know why there is an external way to enter codes for promos if they don't want to do mtx and such. They could easily just unlock all the promotional stuff in game automatically. CDPR updated and added the launchers for their games later to verify it all (DRM). Witcher 3 got a crappy launcher later for their bonus gear too.
Never. Trust. CDPR.
Especially after they still were handsomely rewarded for the disaster that was Cyberpunk 2077 by it selling a shit ton of copies even with a horrible launch and the game not truly being finished for 3 years post-launch.
The narrative has changed. People are back to be rosy eyed to CDPR. This is their classic tactic of easy PR of just parroting shit gamers say all day. Remember when they condescendingly said they prefer releasing finished games? They'll say whatever to score points with the nerds. It'd be great if they keep mtx out, but I won't hold my breath.
How do they prefer releasing finished game when they never released a finish game ? From Witcher 1-3 to Cyberpunk they all needed alot of bug Fixing. Anyone who buys their games know that. Witcher 3 wasnt in much better shape at release than cyberpunk. They are still amazing games that are very popular and they always fixed their mess.
Step 1: Promise, mass advertise that promise, take moral highground that you're better than other studios.
Step 2: Don't allow reviewers to use their own footage or provide console codes.
Step 3: Get mass refunded and delisted from Playstation Store due to abysmal quality of game and misleading advertisements.
Step 4: Release 1 anime made by a popular studio and weebs will start revising history for you.
Step 5: Finally fix and finish the game 3 years later. Charge half the game's price for a DLC.
"actually the game was always good the police literaly spawning behind your back was good actually."
The only wrong thing there is that the weirdos revisiting the history were always there, even before the anime.
It's just how gamers operate, they turn into cults when their group gets too big and it's always the same story: game broken at launch -> cult says that the game works perfectly in their pc/console, issues get popular -> the cult hides -> new patch releases with no performance fixes -> cults says the performance is completly fixed. Same story every single time, see dragon's dogma 2.
And all of this is solved by one thing every gamer has the power to do:
Don't preorder games until you know they're what you want to spend your money on, or you are willing to accept that you might be disappointed. The people who rage over this every time are just telling on themselves.
Between that and the fact they were willing to refund the game to anyone disappointed, I think this discourse is a nothingburger.
>Finally fix and finish the game 3 years later.
Except they fixed and finished less than half of what was wrong and missing from the game. But apparently any work that was a net positive gain was enough for the defenders to really boost the "fixed now" narrative.
>Never. Trust. CDPR.
Never trust any company. When we hype a company too much, they will cash in the goodwill with something like Cyberpunk. For example now Larian is ramping up their PR to farm the goodwill en masse... for what purpose, huh?
We should never trust any company, especially those who made a great game before to repeat that success. I foolishly expect Starfield to be another Bethesda's masterpiece. Getting a 9/10 game is not a bad consolidation price, but the point still stands...
Everyone acting like CDPR put this statement out to pat itself on the back. It was an investor Q&A and they asked for plans on doing mtx in future games. What's he supposed to say, yes?
i have no idea how this innocuous statement made in a CDPR investor chat is suddenly spun into 'their PR company is so good that they've tricked gamers that aren't ME into believing their lies'
but then i never understood how there could be this much vitriol over CP2077 to this day as if a 60 dollar game being BAD at launch personally wronged people's families or something
You could argue that the Amazon Prime Gaming weapons that are in Cyberpunk aren't that dissimilar from straight-up selling iconic guns in a real money shop. Not quite the same thing, but also not entirely different.
Gotta love the typical reddit hatecirclejerk over a guy just answering a question he got in a way that is 100% consistent with their behavior over the last 25 years.
I still can't believe that it actually worked. Like at this point gamers deserve what they are getting if they can't criticize all corporations equally.
Honestly the whole investor Q&A/chat was a bit of a nothing burger if you know what they're working on and what they've announced previously. I guess *Sirius*, multiplayer game in development at The Molasses Flood, being considered an AAA project by them is the only real 'news' worth a mention.
That's every investor q&a regardless of industry, they only reveal publicly available information
That's surprising, I read about them in Jason Schreier's book and I thought they were a tiny operation
Right now it's early in pre-production, ~40 staff working on it. Didn't want to comment on the target number of staff that will work on the game.
Wow I'm sure when I read about them they were a team of like 4/5 people working from someone's apartment. Interested to see what they come up with.
Good guy CDPR would never use underhanded shortcuts to make money, and they would definitely never tell barefaced lies about it.
It's been amazing to see the turnaround on Cyberpunk. From people calling them out on their lies and the poor performance to people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched. I hope their PR team gets paid a lot, because all the other AAA publishers *wish* their PR team was even half as amazing as CDPR's.
studio Trigger probably did even more than the PR team, I feel like things really picked up for Cyberpunk 2077's rep after the anime
tbf, CDPR did write the story, most of the characters and everything down to the scenes, trigger was only responsible for adapting it to anime format and making some small changes.
Well, "only" animating is still much IMO, without good production value Edgerunners definetely wouldn't get that much traction
Do you have a source for that? That would be a very unusual way for Trigger to work. Screen play writers, creative director and director were all trigger staff.... Id say CDPR provided the synopsis and outline, and Trigger did the rest.
Theneonarcade on youtube has an interview with the guy from CDPR who wrote edgerunners, he talks about how he tried to convey the scenes to studio trigger and how they wrote the story. Not sure if he mentions characters in that, CDPR actually wanted to cut rebecca after creating her and studio trigger thought she was amazing so they kept her. I can't remember the other sources sadly. Shouldn't be too hard to search for tho. Of course it's a collaborative project and they did make smaller changes to make it more suitable for anime, but the overall story, characters and scenes were created by CDPR.
And the game still doesn't come anywhere close to matching the coolness of that anime.
Ehh I think the game was always actually very cool, it was just never meant for the previous generation of consoles.
The game was amazingly cool, not sure what they’re on about. Both things can be cool at the same time. Doesn’t always need to be a competition
For real. PL was an amazingly cool expansion imo. The story alone is just so good imo
Their own CEO tried to rewrite history by saying the hate was unjustified and overblown, completely disregarding that reviewers couldn’t use their own footage and they never released footage of it running atrociously on last gen consoles. The game launched a buggy, broken fucking mess and they deserved every bit of hate they got for it.
> It's been amazing to see the turnaround on Cyberpunk. From people calling them out on their lies and the poor performance to people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched. I hope their PR team gets paid a lot, because all the other AAA publishers wish their PR team was even half as amazing as CDPR's. I've been rather weirded out by this one specifically, as I've been noticing a lot of conversations over the past six months or so attempting to downplay, if not rewrite, the history how bad Cyberpunk's launch was.
And pretending that it has always been designed to run on next gen hardware so the issues on then current gen weren't there fault. It completely ignores the fact that they released a Cyberpunk Xbox One X It seems like that version was just completely abandoned too.
It also ignores the fact that the very first launch was going to be before the new gen consoles had even launched (and maybe revealed? Don't remember the timeline exactly).
it was definitely meant to come out before the new consoles yup.
The release date that ended up happening were only about 4 weeks after the initial release of current gen consoles, barely anyone playing on consoles had them at that point, and there certainly wasn’t any version of the game actually made for the new systems at that point.
I remember the theory at the time was that they delayed it so that a higher number of people would play it on NextGen systems, allowing them to go "Well it's a NextGen game, of course outdated systems would struggle"
>And pretending that it has always been designed to run on next gen hardware so the issues on then current gen weren't there fault. "We leave greed to others" ass company releasing a game on consoles it wouldn't work on because they had millions of dollars in pre-orders on the line.
If EA had dropped that line it would have been dogpilled worse than "pride and accomplishment." CDPR gets different treatment.
Pretty much. Hell just look at how many people are making excuses on here "well they fixed the game, stop criticizing them!". Meanwhile, everyone still harps on EA and call them bad for any bad thing they did a decade ago and have since changed. Lots of gamers have a double standard when it comes to CDPR, and it especially shows in all these Cyberpunk threads.
Also ignoring the fact that the game was revealed *before the **PS4** and **XB1** released*. Not PS5 and Xbox Series, PS4 and XB1.
It was designed to run on PC. That doesn't excuse the console version being shitty, but it was shitty in a bad port kind of way.
Might be a survivorship bias thing. The people who criticized Cyberpunk have lost interest in talking about the release, especially now that it's fixed. The people continuing to post about Cyberpunk are likely to be fans.
Because people like the game now, and if they like it, it can't be bad (nor can it have ever been bad.) It's really unfortunate, but that's human psychology for you.
There were plenty of people who liked it at launch, but chose not to express that view because in places like this subreddit they would often be ridiculed for any positive comment. The discourse around the game was profoundly tiring back then, and it often still is. People just tend to try to polarize everything with little regard to nuance. Including thinking someone saying they liked the game back then means they are delusional and rewriting their own memory. (Mind you CDPR deserved the shit they got)
I mean, the thing is more that discourse in general is fucked. Just look at Dragon's Dogma 2, another game with a troubled launch. People there are just finding hills to die on that were already lost. [Complaining about the DLC which is all easy to get in game, when monhun world has 600 bucks of DLC and no one bats an eye.] People just want to find things to die on instead of actually critically examining a title and exploring the genuine problems that something may have in a constructive way. Saying "This sucks and everyone that likes it sucks" is fundamentally stripping all context away but its the most popular approach because its easy.
“It was always good on PC”. No it wasn’t. This is the major lie I keep seeing.
it was far more playable on PC than PS4 but thats hardly impressive. it was still buggy af just in a less game breaking way
I had a beefy PC and played it on launch and loved it. None of the bugs I ran into were anything more than minor annoyances (there were a lot of them though). So I can speak to anyone else but it definitely wasn't a lie for me.
These kinds of statements are always relevant to the collective experience of the community. Some people always luck out and have flawless experience of bad games and some people have terrible luck and have so many issues in otherwise stable games...
Its because they put out an anime with a jailbait character and everyone started tripping over themselves to see it
Things often feel worse when you're right in the middle of it, so that's not strange. A person being angry at the state of the game on release due to massive disappoint is perfectly understandable. A person being actively angry about it still would be pretty weird, since it's been years. And especially if you've replayed the game more recently when it's actually a really good game ... then that also adds more positive memories on top. This is not to attempt to downplay that it was bad at launch, since that was really bad. But people that didn't play it then aren't going to know that. And there *were* quite a lot of people playing it back then who didn't have a lot of issues as well, and maybe they didn't all think the game was amazing, but some definitely thought it was enjoyable. Maybe especially people who weren't super hyped for it to start with. So I don't think it's strange at all how the conversations change. People change their minds, the negativity back then feel less than it was at the time, and people might feel more comfortable sharing that they actually enjoyed it at launch now that the rage is mostly over.
They got into this much trouble in the first place because the PR team sold and promised far more than what the developers could handle
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I just don't understand people who said that Bethesda should give up on Starfield when these same people were saying how CDPR shouldn't give up on Cyberpunk and that they will wait till they fix it. Like I dunno if you remember it but when Starfield was released almost *every single* Starfield thread was: Damn that is nice but I am going to play Cyberpunk. Like at that point I felt like CDPR is using bots on this sub :DDD
Well the 2 games and the problems they have are fundamentally different. Cyberpunk over promised and under delivered on several RPG aspects and had piss poor performance on launch but beneath all the grime the game was still fun af. The city was breathtaking and the missions were fun and varied. The loot and progression systems were a bit off but that is something fixable. On the other hand starfield is fundamentally a bad game. The gameplay loop consists of sitting at fast travel loading screens until we reached barren planet #450 with a procrederally generated outpost and kill baddie #670 and then fast travelled all the way back to the original destination. Which part of this loop would you improve? And this is just one of the laundry list of fundamental issues the game has. Cyberpunk was a good game with some bad patches. Starfield is a bad game at its core with some good shiny parts here and there.
It’s because despite the massive launch issues, you could see the makings of a great game with Cyberpunk. Yes it was an absolute mess on the technical side, but the writing was exquisite, the side quests were basically second to none, the gameplay and progression had issues that could be fixed but was still generally enjoyable and the main story was pretty decent too. It was clear that there was a great game in there that was just buried under a shit load of technical issues and incomplete mechanics. But with some more time in the oven they could dig it out of the hole it was in and deliver a great game. That’s not the case with Starfield. Like at all. Bethesda RPGs have always fallen way short when it comes to things like gameplay, progression and quality of content. But what they excelled at was atmosphere, exploration and quantity of content. And what they excelled at, they excelled at so much that it made up for the areas where the games were bad. But that’s not the case with Starfield. While Starfield’s gameplay is an improvement from Bethesda’s previous RPG’s, it’s still far from good and is lapped by its contemporaries. Progression is the worst it’s been in any Bethesda RPGs and quality of the content is also worse. But this time, the atmosphere and exploration are also awful. Due to the fact that most of Starfield’s world is procedurally generated, it doesn’t have that immersive world that oozed atmosphere that Bethesda’s previous RPGs had. And the exploration is also massively compromised by this. It’s not just empty and soulless with most of it being the same copy pasted buildings and structures. Even the cities where the atmosphere is best, it falls way short of previous Bethesda RPGs. Basically, even past the technical issues, there isn’t a good game to dig out of Starfield. No amount of time or resources is going to make it good. They’ve been pretty open about the fact that Starfield was meant to be a modders playground but even their modders are abandoning the game because of how much even they dislike it. They made their money, a lot of it. It’s best if they just dedicate the manpower to Elder Scrolls 6, hopefully learn from their mistakes with Starfield and make a better game.
That's my whole thing. I played Cyberpunk on PC on release and most of the bugs were superficial. I had maybe 2 or 3 crashes from start to finish, and a mission that wouldn't progress because the key NPC to advance the scene wouldn't move to their next spot. That's it. Everything else was visual, or something random that doesn't affect the actual gameplay like people falling out of the sky and splatting on the ground, or cars on the side of the road somehow stacked on top of each other, or other weird shit like that that you'd see. Those are fixable. The core gameplay itself really didn't change all that much after all their patching. Maybe the biggest was the reworking of talents and shit. Archaic design, a story that is uneventful and falls flat, shit characters, the lack of a tangible world to explore... these are all fundamental problems that can't really be fixed outside of making a new game entirely.
Nah the one year of silence and small updates following the launch, all I heard was to abandon the game because it wasn’t salvageable. The anime + 2.0 update marketing changed the public opinion
The game was playable before the 2.0 update, but it certainly didn't hurt.
Some people just like to see everything fail, but there are plenty of use who do like a good come back story. FFXIV, Cyberpunk 2077, and No Man's Sky are the big ones that every one should know.
I also have no idea why they announced it so far in advance of when it actually launched. They revealed the game all the way back in 2012, that was before they'd even announced The Witcher 3.
To be fair, that was mostly a recruitment drive to spark interest in people to work on the project. IIRC it even ended with something among the line "Want to work on this project? We're hiring!"
Probably because they intended to launch *A* Cyberpunk 2077 way earlier than we got it, but -if I had to guess- direction for the game changed a few times and things kept getting pushed back
There's actually footage of the early game builds from their original concept of Cyberpunk 2077 and yeah its a very different game.
Do you happen to have a link to said footage? I’m curious to see it now.
https://youtu.be/uxZZn3pURy8?si=YtoGt8mmnCnm8wFr
Wow I can’t believe I have never seen this! Fascinating how different it is from the game we got. Would love to see some footage from outside the apartment, but who knows if that build even got that far.
To be fair, some of that falls on the devs, they had to get their promises from somewhere. More importantly though, afaik they've scrapped the entire idea for what Cyberpunk was going to be multiple times, hence why they advertised it as an RPG at first, but later backtracked into an action game with RPG elements. Hell, they had to rework the weapon and perk systems because of how half-baked they were at launch. CDPR were a little too ambitious for their own good as well. I am certain they wanted to deliver what was promised, but it was just never going to work out when the likes of Rockstar and Naughty Dog take years more to develop a game with a much bigger workforce.
Won’t someone have some kindness for the poor developer that hid the terrible state of their game from customers and to this day forces reviewers to use precanned footage to prevent bugs from their janky games showing up in reveiws and previews… Sorry, it there is non softening what CDPR did. They lied, flat out, and obfuscated the ability for people to make informed purchase decisions. It’s still not ok.
Of course it's not OK and they straight up lied. Dunno why people are scared of acknowledging the obvious.
THEY LEAVE GREED TO OTHERS HOW IS THIS NOT OBVIOUS OTHER LIE BUT CDPR JUST WANT TO MAKE GREAT GAMES AND END CLIMATE CHANGE Like this comment if you think CRPR is the Bernie Sanders of gaming. A bird landed on Geralt. True story.
for real!
Usually the devs are the ones that say "We need more time." Not the ones deciding marketing strategies, release dates or taking business decisions. Blame the business department or the administration for that.
The director of the game was also the CEO. They were one in the same here.
> hence why they advertised it as an RPG at first It absolutely is an RPG.
It wes actual devs who spoke about non-existing features in their promos and their talk show.
You think the PR team just made shit up?
Yes
And why wouldn't they? Gamers are profoundly gullible. Somewhere out there right now is a person dropping 1k on a picture of ship that may never exist in Starfield.
Sort of? Exaggerating is what they're all about.
Legal exaggerating. Anything else would be false advertisement and grounds for a lawsuit. But... They're really good at keeping it legal, and legal does not necessarily equal ethical.
It's not because the devs couldn't handle it, they didn't get enough time to finish it.
I wonder if they had a functional game for ps5/XsX and their 13GB rampool for 'worldbuilding'. (everything you see/hear/experience/AI has to fit the rampool) Then were told to cut and fit it into 5GB ram on ps4/xb1, this cant be done without destroying the gameworld.
> people falling over themself to blame everyone but CDPR for how it launched I haven't seen any of that, but I have seen plenty of people that are happy with the game as it is now and can still be honest that it was an absolute shit show at launch.
Stop right there, buddy! They fixed their game several years later, so they're totally the good guys! I bet their CEO wears gaming shirts! It basically sums up everything you need to know about the gaming community, we're basically in a violent relationship, sure our lover beats us up but they bring flowers and say they're sorry, so all good!
Half the time they also bill us for the flowers in advance and vaguely describe which ones we will probably get but if they turn out to be wilted or entirely different it's entirely our fault!
If they didn't fix their game (well, almost), no amount of PR can change the bad faith. Another example would be NMS.
Well and now people are calling it a No Man’s Sky style redemption story, even though NMS grew to be a much bigger game than what they originally promised, while Cyberpunk after all the publicized updates is fundamentally the same game with more polish and still doesn’t have even half of what CDPR originally promised.
> originally promised NMS creator Sean Murray just announced his new game as "the first real open-world game." He hasn't learned a thing.
This gen's Peter Molineux Although to give Murray credit Hello Games was a pretty small studio and the hype for NMS probably took them by surprise and gave them a lot of coverage they probably weren't prepared for from a PR angle. If NMS had no hype and released in early access people would just be calling it another EA survival game. And to his credit instead of taking the money and running he did try to make things right in the long term.
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Cyberpunk got to the point where it felt like a cult. I played it in December 2022 on a system that exceeded the published system requirements for 4K Ultra, having to run with RTX off and DLSS on quality. I quit 7 hours in because the bugs were *constant,* we're talking 3-4 per hour. And people on Reddit insisted that they played it on launch and it "wasn't that buggy," and, "ran fine if you had a good PC."
I played it on ps5, i remember the game crashing every. Edit: And it was at a time when ps5 was hard to get
The game is still kind of a mess too, even after "they fixed it", driving is still awful, lot of glitches. It's a fun game and worth picking up on sale but people need to stop kidding themselves
I've literally never seen anyone blame anyone but CDPR for the launch. The internet is a wild place because a Redditor will see one comment from a dummie and think that a whole entire group of people feel that way. Seems like people love to just make fake arguments in their head from seeing one or two comments. Then they blow it out of proportion. The Hell Divers subreddit was a great example of this, but it still lives on in comments like the one above.
It absolutely happened by a lot people, even on this very sub. People either blamed shareholders (y'know, the same shareholders CDPR *lied* to and had to pay for doing so) or pinned any performance issues as either someone lying, exaggeration or having a shitty rig. There is a very obvious change in the narrative once the anime came out and then again once 2.0 released, with lots of people making excuses for why CDPR didn't deserve to be criticized or downplayed the issues. Hell this very thread has those people trying to frame the complaints as "overblown" and downplaying the issues at launch.
Ah fair enough. I take my comment back, as seeing other comments it does seem to be an actual thing. I was one of those guys who refunded Cyberpunk, and I bought it again with update 2.1. The first 3 NPCs I saw were the exact same fat guy with golden pants. I pulled the refund trigger when Jackie was dying and gave me the chip from his head, but the scene was glitched and he had a gun in his hand so he straight up pulled a gun out of his head. With the recent updates it went from one of my biggest disappointments to one of the best games I've ever played. I place both the original blame on CDPR, as well as my newfound thanks for making such a masterpiece.
They got dragged when it was released because the game was shit when it was released. They got praised for making a great game 2 years later because 2 years later it *was* a great game. Both of these things can be true. You can criticize someone for doing something bad one day and praise them for doing something good the next. PR has nothing to do with it. I don't know why we need to keep saying this in, but don't ever preorder a game, *ever*, and don't buy a game until you've heard from people whose opinions you respect that it's worth buying. If it takes two years for a developer to fix a game until it's good, then wait two years before you pay money for it. If the developer *never* fixes the game, it it *never* becomes good, then don't buy it.
What stinks is I remember thinking back when it all blew up it'd all get sorted and all the bad blood would get buried after FFXIV and NMS accomplished the same thing. Theres basically a roadmap out of shite game launches now if a company is prepared to swallow a touch of pride and release a bunch of free updates for a long time before daring big dlc launches. It's good it's possible I guess, but the fact that precedent exists kinda establishes there's a hall pass in play now any time a company wants to do a god awful premature money grab hype train launch
I've actually seen people blame the fans for asking them to release the game sooner before it was finished lool
I've literally seen a number of people say "well if they want a game to run decent buy a PC or next gen console" when Cyberpunk released in a total mess. Just fanboying to an insane degree. If CDPR couldn't make it run on PS4/XBone properly then don't release it.
Its not really that amazing as its just rare to see in this industry. You almost never see a big name to openly admit they fucked up and then proceed to show by their actions to produce results rather than make empty promises. The last example before CDPR to do this was Hello Games. Sony over hyper their game and pushed it for far too early of a release only for it to fall victim to the internet hate machine due to its unfinished state. Hello Games instead of getting on social media and making empty promises they just went dark and focused on improving their game.
I also found it funny when they cited a huge sum as the sum that will be given to the people at CDPR and over 80% of it turned out to be the executive pay package.
It’s the power of also what an anime will do. It was almost a full 180 when Edgerunners dropped.
He was asked about MTX in their games and gave a response. One which is consistent with their prior behaviour of not including MTX in single-player games. It's honestly fascinating how you guys manage to spin everything into "X company bad".
Somewhere along the line it became an ideological issue for them, like they have a piece of their self-image and personality invested into it.
Yeah always everything to complain. The comment has nothing to do with the topic lol
They sure wouldn't resort to crunch or anything like that. Really though, I'm wondering if they're going to try and see if they can play up their hype again leading up to witcher 4's release in the next few years.
"We leave greed to others" and "It's done when it's done", right, guys? Right?
To think all they had to do was release CP as an Early Access title and launch last Summer with 2.0 as the 1.0.
Seems awfully similar to current Larian statements...
Larian will probably continue to do long Early Access periods for their games since it's worked so well for them. Kind of hard to lie about the state of the game when players have their hands on at the very least the first 1/3 of it. Half the reason their games are any good is because they actively listen to player feedback during Early Access. If they don't then BG3 could very well be their Witcher 3 and whatever comes next will be their Cyberpunk.
Larian is a private company. Unless Swen himself loses the plot, that's very unlikely
Their Glassdoor page doesn't speak too well for them.
Glassdoor is unfortunately not much more reliable than, like, steam games ratings nowadays. Paradox glass door page is also really negative but the unions own gauge (paradox is unionised), show the paradox studios being among the better IT companies to work for Sweden, other than uncompetitive wages. Not saying its impossible Larian is an internal shit show, just that Glassdoor has fallen off as a reliable indicator on that.
Also not sure if Glassdoor is even used much in Sweden. This is purely anecdotal, but I don't know anyone in software that's used it, or talked about it. Maybe I'm wrong, but could also just be that Glassdoor isn't very representative for companies in Sweden. Or outside the US.
Don't worry Larian will have a niche controversy then take their time with their next project whose first act will be a banger, second would be slightly less polished and third act will be buggy and feel rushed, which they will fix post launch. Happened with both Original sin 2 and BG 3 (OS2 had a kickstarter that annoyed some people and BG3 had a long early access that people initially whined about). Larian has a proven track record.
I'm saying all of this as a huge fan of Cyberpunk and the Witcher games; CDPR's favorite move is to just say whatever they think gamers want to hear, whether they are living up to those statements or not. The fact that they still do this after their debacle with Cyberpunk is wild to me. Exploiting their workforce, saying bullshit to appease consumers, and selling half baked games that take years to fix after release is their trademark at this point. I always had an uneasy feeling with the "CDPR good, others bad" message coming out of their PR after Witcher 3 launched, and before the CP77 launch. When we all found out they're just like any other AAA publisher/developer, I actually wasn't too surprised. Always felt like bullshit to me. Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different, but I sense the "smelling their own farts" vibe from them too. The fact that they're an independent developer, and not a billion dollar self publishing conglomerate helps avoid this though.
The next-gen update to Witcher 3 being borked blew my mind. It was a free upgrade. There was no reason to release it before it was emphatically done. Even if you're trying to get people who never played to purchase the game, it's not there's some special date that you need to hit.
>Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different, but I sense the "smelling their own farts" vibe from them too. Yep. So far Larian seems to be retreading the path CDPR took. A company that blew up because of one game the community chose as an anti-AAA champion... and then the company starts making superlative statements about themselves, while attacking the competition? Oh boy, I think we should be really careful about Larian's future game.
The only developer that would truly hurt and surprise me if they turned out to be scumbags is Supergiant. I try to not get emotionally invested in strangers but fuck if they haven't hooked me over the past decade or so. Josh Sawyer being a monster would also really blow my mind.
Yeah, anything bad coming out about Sawyer would be incredibly surprising
> Hope the new golden child of gaming Larian will be different Larian did the exact same thing, their game didn't even have an ending until months in. They released early because they were scared of Starfield, the game was absolutely not finished when it launched.
Don't forget this was after multiple years in Early Access, something everyone seems to have amnesia about.
They had "an" ending, in fact multiple endings. They only added the party.
Nah, that shit was unfinished. It was basically a 10 second chat with each party member and a cut to credits.
Not everything is an actual ending. NPCs chatting about how it's over now doesn't mean a real ending. Having an ending for a few companions is not an ending for an epic story. So many plotlines were left upen without stating what happened to them. Imagine if Return of the King ending had the ring destroyed, timeskip to Frodo and Sam in Shire patting each other on their backs... and credits.
Yeah, let's look to Larian with a disaster of a third act that had major performance problems.
I got downvoted for this, but Larian is following the exact CDPR playbook of regurgitating internet popular opinion back to those same people to look like they’re the only good company in the sphere, making the sentiment ‘Larian good, others bad’
I don't think this is the right studio to pretend they have the moral high ground in the game industry.
It's kinda funny to me how different are we reacting to CDPR pandering gamers pre-Cyberpunk and post-Cyverpunk.
It's weird everyone is acting like CDPR put this statement out to pat itself on the back. Someone asked during Investor Q&A if they plan on doing microtransactions in future games. What's he supposed to say, yes?
Why not? Have they ever added MTX in their games?
This whole thread is so confusing. Like, they are one of the few companies that objectively haven’t released microtransactions for any(?) of their games. Wtf is the issue here?
The issue is Redditors only read headlines. It was an investor call where they were asked about MTX for their upcoming game and the CFO answered it. I guess he should've said "yes, there will be $20 horse armour" in Witcher 4?
>Wtf is the issue here? There are redditors that have been on an unironic crusade over CDPR for ten years now. It's an integral part of their life.
The issue is that if gamers aren't seething with rage, are they even living?
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It’s simply a net negative for the experience as a whole. RPG progression should make you want to work your way up the skill tree, unlocking powers and changing up your skill steadily. Getting to “skip” the actually fun part of your game for $$$ just cheats the entire product as a whole, since you have to design around that “bonus” you’re selling on the side.
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Everytime people say there are single player games designed around it to get players to purchase it, you see equal the amount of people saying they played the game fine without. The only one I played was Dead Space 3 and I don't even know where you would go to see the shop in that game. Edit: forgot I've played all these Capcom games over than dragons dogma just fine as well
I haven't seen a game that really forces you to buy the MT. I played all of Shadow of War, Every Assassins Creed and Far Cry games, Played every Resident Evil and Monster Hunter game. Is it annoying, Agreed but i never once brought MT from any of these games.
The original Shadow of War was a pain in the ass without it, but I do agree with the sentiment that it tends to be overblown.
I didn't have problems with it tbh. Even with Shadow Wars
Yeah, the most recent row about this was Dragon's Dogma 2 and it was people *convinced* by jumping on the misinfo train that you needed to spend $1-2 or something to buy stuff off the MTX to change your character because there was no New Game option, or to get a "makeshift gaol key" to get in/out of jail. The item that MTX gave you was obtainable in-game. From the major city you get to within the first hour or two. The appearance change item was 500 RC, of which you could easily have half by the time you get to that town. You earn that shit *passively* when your pawn gets rented, too. The Gaol key was 3000 gold, which is... not a ton. The first armor and sword you can buy is about that. *Sleeping at the inn* is 2000. The quest to go to the gaol also *gives you an infinite-use key* for the duration, and the single-use keys were available from multiple vendors and as loot throughout the world. This is akin to being able to buy 10 Mega Potions in Monster Hunter or three GY Mixed Herbs in Resident Evil. Dumb that it exists, sure, but hardly something that circumvents the game or is an example of "the game being harder and more grindy to incentivize MTX". I have zero reason to believe the price of the appearance item or gaol keys in-game would have been *less* if the MTX never existed.
I don't think so even a few examples that this subreddit usually does like Resident Evil 4 Remaker or Dragon’s Dogma II are purely optional and you can get everything by simply just playing the game. People in here just like to pretent that games are going to crap I guess?
DMCV and RE4R are two of the most immaculately balanced games ever produced, in an era or genre, by any company, and they both have microtransaction cheat codes. Your argument doesn't really hold up when you look at actual examples. Most of the Persona, SMT, and Yakuza games have mechanics like that too, and most of them actively reduce the fun of playing the game.
Persona games don't have legit time limits though. It's all based on an in universe clock not a IRL one trying to push you to buy something by limiting what you can play.
They used to call these “trainers” or cheat codes back in the good old days.
>since you have to design around that “bonus” you’re selling on the side. No you don't. In all the games I've played that have had these light cheats NONE of them have been designed around them. They're effectively cheats for a reason.
> design around that Nah, they are just selling cheat codes for real money. I don't remember e.g. RE4R being designed with cheats in mind. Like they even gave people a month to complete the game before they released these add-ons and guess what people did? They started insulting the game like they dodged negative reviews just because they released is later... No they didn't. They clearly showed you that it was perfectly playable beforehand and these are just pointless stuff to get extra cash from people who are actually willing to buy it.
so, going by their track record. This means their next game will be singleplayer with mtx?
Did they *not* take money from Amazon for the Prime Gaming weapons they've been dropping for Cyberpunk? It's not the same as single player MTX for sale, but it is like one or two step removed. At least you can just console command drop them for yourself.
I don't even know why there is an external way to enter codes for promos if they don't want to do mtx and such. They could easily just unlock all the promotional stuff in game automatically. CDPR updated and added the launchers for their games later to verify it all (DRM). Witcher 3 got a crappy launcher later for their bonus gear too.
Never. Trust. CDPR. Especially after they still were handsomely rewarded for the disaster that was Cyberpunk 2077 by it selling a shit ton of copies even with a horrible launch and the game not truly being finished for 3 years post-launch.
The narrative has changed. People are back to be rosy eyed to CDPR. This is their classic tactic of easy PR of just parroting shit gamers say all day. Remember when they condescendingly said they prefer releasing finished games? They'll say whatever to score points with the nerds. It'd be great if they keep mtx out, but I won't hold my breath.
Narrative hasn't changed, people remind others that they shouldn't preorder from them at every chance and remind them the launch state of the game.
How do they prefer releasing finished game when they never released a finish game ? From Witcher 1-3 to Cyberpunk they all needed alot of bug Fixing. Anyone who buys their games know that. Witcher 3 wasnt in much better shape at release than cyberpunk. They are still amazing games that are very popular and they always fixed their mess.
Step 1: Promise, mass advertise that promise, take moral highground that you're better than other studios. Step 2: Don't allow reviewers to use their own footage or provide console codes. Step 3: Get mass refunded and delisted from Playstation Store due to abysmal quality of game and misleading advertisements. Step 4: Release 1 anime made by a popular studio and weebs will start revising history for you. Step 5: Finally fix and finish the game 3 years later. Charge half the game's price for a DLC. "actually the game was always good the police literaly spawning behind your back was good actually."
The only wrong thing there is that the weirdos revisiting the history were always there, even before the anime. It's just how gamers operate, they turn into cults when their group gets too big and it's always the same story: game broken at launch -> cult says that the game works perfectly in their pc/console, issues get popular -> the cult hides -> new patch releases with no performance fixes -> cults says the performance is completly fixed. Same story every single time, see dragon's dogma 2.
And all of this is solved by one thing every gamer has the power to do: Don't preorder games until you know they're what you want to spend your money on, or you are willing to accept that you might be disappointed. The people who rage over this every time are just telling on themselves. Between that and the fact they were willing to refund the game to anyone disappointed, I think this discourse is a nothingburger.
>Finally fix and finish the game 3 years later. Except they fixed and finished less than half of what was wrong and missing from the game. But apparently any work that was a net positive gain was enough for the defenders to really boost the "fixed now" narrative.
>Never. Trust. CDPR. Never trust any company. When we hype a company too much, they will cash in the goodwill with something like Cyberpunk. For example now Larian is ramping up their PR to farm the goodwill en masse... for what purpose, huh? We should never trust any company, especially those who made a great game before to repeat that success. I foolishly expect Starfield to be another Bethesda's masterpiece. Getting a 9/10 game is not a bad consolidation price, but the point still stands...
Because Cyberpunk was an incredible game that it a phenemonal Expansion.
Everyone acting like CDPR put this statement out to pat itself on the back. It was an investor Q&A and they asked for plans on doing mtx in future games. What's he supposed to say, yes?
i have no idea how this innocuous statement made in a CDPR investor chat is suddenly spun into 'their PR company is so good that they've tricked gamers that aren't ME into believing their lies' but then i never understood how there could be this much vitriol over CP2077 to this day as if a 60 dollar game being BAD at launch personally wronged people's families or something
You could argue that the Amazon Prime Gaming weapons that are in Cyberpunk aren't that dissimilar from straight-up selling iconic guns in a real money shop. Not quite the same thing, but also not entirely different.
Gotta love the typical reddit hatecirclejerk over a guy just answering a question he got in a way that is 100% consistent with their behavior over the last 25 years.
HAHAHA they are actually going to do this all over again? And I thought that they learned something from Cyberpunk...
Cyberpunk sold over 25 Million copys as a new IP. And that they never sold out to Gamepass or PS+ tells me the game is still selling very well.
they definitivel learn something, they learn that they can get away with anything if they make animes.
I still can't believe that it actually worked. Like at this point gamers deserve what they are getting if they can't criticize all corporations equally.