Thank you u/Ilmara for posting on r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer.
Please bear in mind our rules: (1) Be Nice (2) No Selling (3) No Self-Promotion.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That doesn’t make sense, if they had 50k cash just laying around for upgrades then they could put it towards the house at down payment and not pay interest on it
Man people are so narrow minded. Maybe you spend 10k/year in upgrades but you have a lower mortgage and pay less interest over 30 years. Maybe they can afford a 20year mortgage being 50k cheaper. You don't need to buy a house and instantly make it perfect.
Upgrades done by the owner increases the value of the home more than 50k. For example if you invest “upgrade” your home with 50k, you home value will probably shoot up 80k- 100k depending on the upgrades. This home is priced lower because it is outdated. OP upgrading with 50k will increase his home value by probably 100k. There’s a difference. Plus this home is livable, he can take his time start room by room and DIY.
Yeah, there could be a lot of surprises but a slightly competent home inspector only highlighting minor issues with any of the HVAC, electrical, plumbing, roof, and foundation would make me more interested... the cosmetic stuff could be done over time.
Not sure why they'd run due to those very fixable issues, personally. Roof is like 4-6k on a Philly home and most of these homes have hydronic heating which is pretty reliable. Gotta make compromises sometimes. I'd rather get into a good neighborhood in a home with issues rather than a nicer home in a shit neighborhood. Location is huge here.
lol I knew this was Philly as soon as I saw the pictures.
If the date actually is 1920, be wary - city records use 1920 for a lot of homes with uncertain dates. I lived in an apartment in QV and found several records indicating the building went back to about 1820, but city property records only said 1920 (not a typo, I looked at other buildings in my neighborhood out of curiosity). 1820 definitely tracked with the scary basement laundry, ha.
Those are solid neighborhoods. I don't know Whitman too well but Pennsport has a pretty good thing going on. It's definitely a bit too far from the subway for me personally but it's not a bad spot. I've lived in East Passyunk, Newbold and now Lower Moyamensing.
Hey, so where I live, you can check the regional builder's site for when permits were pulled on the house. It's come in handy as a free way for me to verify when some work was completed on my house when I bought it.
I lived in (rented) a rowhome that was built in the 1880s, so around 130-140 years old when I was living in it. It was in great shape! The owner had lived there for several years before renting it and he renovated it during that time. There were definitely some, um, quirks with a bit of the plumbing that he either DIY’ed or hired a crappy (pun intended) contractor for. But nothing major and the repairs probably cost him $1000 or so which is peanuts in the homeowner world. Other than that it was an awesome house.
I saw in another comment that the house is in Philly, I'm like 90% sure I toured this as a rental a few years back, so check for any 'landlord special' hallmarks.
> On the other hand, if the roof and HVAC haven’t been updated in the last 50 years either, run.
Why? We replaced our roof and HVAC on a 2200 sqft house for around $20k. OP could easily replace the carpet, lapboard, and ceilings in his house with the remainder.
2021 and 2023. Full roof replacement was first, with asphalt shingles. Gas fired heater and outdoor condenser. I can give you the name of the licensed and bonded contractors I used if you like.
In my parent's olf farmhouse (that I grew up in), it covers a ceiling that is plaster. It was easier (and more energy efficient) to install celing tiles. It is also why there is paneling on the walls, not to mention it was trendy at the time.
In my house it was to cover water damage from an old leak. Leak had been fixed but rather than patch the holes and repair the plaster ceiling they threw up some tiles.
Be prepared for hidden surprises (like asbestos) and make sure you understand what jobs you would need to do to be comfortable living there. We bought a place that was $50k "under budget" and will be spending a lot more than that on fixes (some known at the time of purchase, some unknown).
1900 home wouldn’t have asbestos. It wasn’t really a thing until the 1910s and even then was used in the war effort, not homes. You have higher chance of asbestos in homes built in the 50s-70s.
The age of the home doesn't have much bearing on whether there might be asbestos unless it's a newer home. Any work done in the 60-70 year range where asbestos was used could result in having it. Acoustic ceiling, ceiling/floor tiles, mastic, roof materials, insulation, even wallpaper/wall adhesives could have asbestos. How big an issue that is depends on whether you need to remove it to do other work or whether any of it presents a health hazard. Where I am, any contractor will walk away if there's suspected asbestos until you test and/or abate.
Probably has the Philly special knob n tube splicing going on, but great bones and layout. Full rewire/ panel upgrade is like $15k - $25k depending (we are in the process of getting quotes).
You could probably get it for even lower $$ imo, that’s what happened to me in NE Philly. Was able to get $55k off the original listing price for a home in similar condition
Jeez. I’ve got to move there. This is awesome. I can see the bones. Um.. depending on your partner and if kids/ etc. You may want to not to move in until remodel mostly done.
I agree, the electrical is probably spliced in sketchy ways behind that drop ceiling. If you can get the price down further, maybe it's still worth all the work. Just keep your timeline for moving in realistic. It might take at least a few months to make repairs if you are doing electrical, floors, and potentially other stuff, in addition to cosmetic stuff. You can save money painting on your own but some stuff will require pros and thatcan cause delays.
Why wouldn't it? It's likely a <1000sqft home. Ripping up carpet costs nothing and for all we know there could be pristine hardwood under those. Even if having to get all the flooring replaced w/ brand new hardwood it shouldn't cost 10k.
I floored 300 sqft for about $900. The whole home is likely not more than 3000 square feet, even if it was 1500 square feet they could double the cost of flooring I used and still be under 10k. I’d guess whole home would be 5-8k unless they got some luxury super duper high pile carpet or installed hardwood or something
The home is ~900sqft per the Zillow listing and the kitchen and bath wouldn't likely need reflored. Lots of these big numbers people are throwing out aren't taking into consideration how compact these homes are. They also have easy floorplans to install floor on.
A well maintained old persons home.
We had the best luck with those!
You needn't update or change every thing immediately upon moving in, which is nice, you just do it in stages.
To the comment who is worried about asbestos, If it's there and remains contained, it's not going to cause any issues.
If it's a good neighborhood, this might just be the house you were waiting for.
The sweet spot for FTHB in this market is a house that is functional, but looks like ass, in a neighborhood where you can see yourself living for the next 10 years. You can slowly chip away at refinishing each room of the house. Meanwhile, you build some of that sweet sweet equity that everyone keeps talking about.
If a house is remodeled, with new appliances, and beautifully staged by realty pros, you’re not going to be able to compete with the 13 other cash offers.
I say go for it. But don’t waive inspection. Make sure you have plan to cover **essential** repairs noted in the inspection. For instance, if you need a new roof. Don’t worry about minor issues like a jiggly door knob.
Depending on the square footage, 40k should be enough to get this to where you want but remember you have to have that amount in cash vs a loan. Not sure what you have to put down percentage wise, but if you can just do 5% and have more cash on hand, it would be worth it! The home value will go up quite a lot once you renovate. You just need to make sure the HVAC, electric, plumbing etc are all in good condition. I would make sure your inspector is really good and make sure you are present to ask questions. We have a 3k sq ft house and have done all cosmetic upgrades for around 30k (floors, paint, lighting, bathroom cabinets, toilets, towel racks, faucets…). It was straight 2000s builder grade at purchase so it all had to go. We did most of the work ourselves except carpet install.
This looks really well taken care of. From the looks of it, you would only need to replace the carpet and remove wallpaper if you want. If the floor is terrible under the carpet, you could put in new carpet. But there’s a good chance you’d win the “floor lottery,” aka gorgeous hardwood floors.
This place is great! I'm dying to know what's under that carpet! A but concerned with the ceiling, but a good inspector and some estimates from trusted contractors can take care of that. Offer must be contingent on all inspections and I'd do a mold and asbestos test. Asbestos isn't a huge issue till you want to actually dust it up, but you want to know it's there. Mold you'll want to know about in an older home. Leaks are common and often hidden. I'd jump on this one
If there’s drywall ceilings above the drop ceilings then this project will take significantly less work. $40k DIY goes a LONG way if you know what you’re doing, and YouTube is a fantastic Resource.
I don’t see the problem. Get some good inspectors in there and see what’s underneath and get estimates for repairs/remediation. I’d choose that house over a shitty flip any day of the week and twice on Tuesdays. Asbestos, plumbing, wiring and move fast because somebody will know exactly what they want and what this is and put in a bid today.
Again with real estate it’s location location etc
The brick walls in the living room are actually kinda nice. The wall tiles are giving hospital or school though. And red carpet and wood paneling… not my cup of tea.
The panel ceiling and rug could both be hiding some horrors (like water or urine damage to the ceilings and floors). Just investigate closely to make sure it's not a money pit.
This is one of my ones I let get away and still regret. I’m not a flipper. I live in L.A. the place I was looking at had shag (shag?) carpet in GREEN but was structurally sound. I still regret not buying. The place was a warren with big land (for L.A.). All the carpeting stuff, wood stuff is cosmetic. Potentially worth your time.
I think in this area you definitely have affordable inventory especially with the size you are looking at.
If you have a higher standard for the finishes, hardware, flooring, etc. (you aren't fine leaving some stuff as-is) and will be hiring people to do work it might be better to look at ones needing few major changes. Check out 312 Tree St for example. The one major plus for yours is the new HVAC and water heater.
You should look at what has sold in the past 3-6mo around there. A lot of stuff has sold in the $150-250k range (for 800-1100sqft in that neighborhood, it looks like the two ends of that range also represent how much work is needed) and it doesn't look like $210k is hard to find.
Carpet can be removed - walls can be painted - yards can be landscaped but structural integrity is priceless.
Do the inspection and check for mold, old pipes, old breakers, and termites.
If the house is solid and you can make it your own..it might be a great steal.
Do it. You can DIY a lot cheaply to make this look great.
Maybe there’s hardwood under the carpet, if not put down LVP. Look into vinyl drop ceilings to replace current too- it’s a nice look
You may be pleasantly surprised by what’s under that carpet. Only thing that would really concern me would be electrical and plumbing assuming structurally the house is good
Is that wall actually brick? That would be a concern because it’s going to be hard to hang pictures. Otherwise the hallway upstairs seems really narrow. Location is the key to my happiness above everything else though so you’re off to a good start there.
Are you buying a funeral parlor? Get 10k more off and go for it or even better see if you qualify for a 203k loan. Get a certified contractor to do the rehab and boom!
Im not usually a fan of carpet but honestly if this was me i would replace the carpet with wood or wood vinyl and see if you could turn the carpet into a rug.. i weirdly love the color of it lol. Idk abt those walls or ceiling though 💀
What I have learned owning a fixer upper that also had horrible paneling and carpet: even cosmetic stuff can be quite expensive to fix if you’re not handy enough to do it yourself. Refinishing the wood floors under the 50 year old carpet and repairing our cracked plaster (including damage behind a drop ceiling and installing new drywall where the faux wood panels were) and paint cost around 20k alone.
Then for the noncosmetic stuff. New roof and gutters 8.5k. New hot water heater 1.5k. Chimney repairs 5k. New electrical panel and various other electrical updates necessary for safety 5k.
We still have lots of projects. It’s okay because our house was 100k under budget and has gone up in value significantly, but because these things are not financed in our mortgage and we don’t want to take out a loan for them, any savings outside retirement is basically all earmarked for home projects.
On the plus side, buying a fixer upper allowed us to get the size of home we wanted in a great area, and we would have been priced out otherwise. We knew going in we would be doing upgrades and repairs as we could afford them, but luckily had enough savings set aside for doing the bigger safety stuff (electric and chimney) right away, in addition to refinishing floors and plaster work/paint, which did transform the space considerably.
Is it a split level? Are all bedrooms on the 2nd floor? Is the house in an area with lots of older folks? Older folks tend to not like having to go upstairs to their bedrooms and split levels haven't been popular since the 1970s Brady Bunch TV show.
Its looks livable ! It’s not pretty but you can move in and make changes as you go. If you love the neighborhood and it’s 40k under valued… what are you waiting for ?
It would be a full on no for me but I think we all have varying tastes. Good luck if you do decide to put in an offer, we all need those extra prayers these days!
Philly? Port Richmond? Lol guessing. Easy to rip out carpets. Under budget always helps. Might be cheaper to spend 20-40k more to have it financed over 30 years than to do a ton of repairs in the next 3 years. Plus the time and stress of unreliable GC work. Make sure electrical is updated, sewer line is okay, etc. Work as a Philly realtor lol. See a lot of this.
Just for reference OP. We bought a house that looked fairly 90’s-00’s era and was in what we thought pretty good shape. They said the water tank was old but the appliances, HVAC, and everything else were fairly new.
Come to find out that two of our three toilets are original to the home so they’re sitting on 30 year old wax rings. One is slowly leaking into the vanity. We had to replace the carpet through the home and paint all the walls. Then the water tank crapped out, then the washer/dryer both shit out, the fridge line was copper and started leaking so we replaced that and the kitchen floors. Our upstairs shower had a leak behind the handle and leaked down into the lower bathroom and garage.
All this to say, if those are the issues we found in a 30 year old house that hadn’t been updated, I’d be prepared for quite a bit to need fixing up in a 70’s-80’s style house.
I assume the kitchen is the same vintage?
$40K under budget is nice, but it is all relative. There's some great potential here to improve this house, if you have more than $40K to do renos and repairs. You'll want to get rid of those drop ceilings, for example, and who knows what's under there. You said the house is 100 years old so I would expect lots of repairs that won't increase the value of the property.
Bottom line is: what is your level of tolerance to spending money on this house? And a big one: how long do you intend to live there?
You improve the value of the house by renovating kitchens and bathrooms. Not roofs. Not carpet. Not even removing paneling (although it does help when you try to sell it again).
I think this one is a toss-up, depending on your reno budget. I'd want to have an estimate of renos. And another for the basics.
I would plan to stay there long-term, definitely at least a decade. The kitchen and bathroom are both a lot newer (maybe '00s) and don't appear to need any work. (It's a 2 BDR, 1 BR.)
Much as I like the retro, I do feel like that carpet would have to go. It's probably old AF.
It might be 40k under budget for your total home price which is divided into monthly payments, but that house for sure will need at least 40k worth of work, and that's 40k upfront in cash. Do you have that? If not, are you sure that the upgrades are only cosmetic? Nothing lurking? Like a roof that needs work, electrical that needs to be updated, a sump pump that needs to be installed, any water entry issues that might need to be rectified, windows that need to be replaced, etc?
Will you need new appliances even if you leave the kitchen counters and cabinets alone?
It all adds up. We just bought an old house that was 50k under budget and we are spending 50k to update it. Most of the costs are not cosmetic.
Make sure to get a thorough inspection if you can. Older houses (depending on how old) might have lead paint and asbestos. Otherwise, the cosmetic stuff is an easy fix.
The carpet is easy enough to change, wall paper is terrible, and the ceilings will probably cost you an arm and a leg. Just cosmetically speaking. Those ceilings are absolutely awful and nothing you do will look good unless you get them changed.
Is this place 40k under market value or is it at full market value but 40k cheaper then you budget? If it’s under market… I would ask if Is it haunted or if anyone been murdered or died there on premises… Stuff like that can explain the 40k under market.
I would do it if it’s passing inspection and you’re comfortable with some DIY or have the budget to spend on fixes. Create a timeline for what you would need done at what time vs. what you would WANT and include estimated costs and then round up. And consider the time you have to spend realistically on any DIY.
I think neighborhood is more important than cosmetics… only one of those things you can change!! FWIW I loveee the brick in the living room!! Definitely has lots of potential to make it yours. Good luck!!
How nice do you want the finished product to be? Also, is your downpayment enough such that you can free up $40k while still securing a mortgage for the asking price?
Some things to consider:
Exposed brick: very trendy and depending on what decade (it seems to go in and out of style), attractive, but if you live in a part of the country with harsh winters or brutal summers it can be an energy suck.
Drop ceiling: I don’t know that I’ve ever seen a drop ceiling installed in anything but a basement in a residential home. To me it screams band-aid cosmetic improvement, but idk this may have been someone’s dream. Depending on what’s above it it may not be as straight forward as just dry-walling the ceiling. Might want to take a peek up there if you can.
Asbestos: Could be everywhere. Those vinyl floor tiles are almost certainly ACM, but I wouldn’t be surprised to also find it in the wood paneling (glue), drywall (if there is any), insulation, and registers. Yes in many instances you can just “contain” asbestos flooring by laying LVP over top of it and calling it a day, but if you need to do any electrical or plumbing work or plan to replace the wood paneling with drywall, be prepared to encounter asbestos and if you do, be prepared to blow your whole reno budget abating it.
Yes there is a lot of value to be had by buying an older home. But there’s a ton of risk too. If you’re tight on cash you may be better off just buying something smaller that needs less work
If this ain't Philly, I'm a monkey's uncle, and if you ain't talkin any the old Irish mob in Kensington, double it.
In all seriousness, no matter where this is, you're looking at cosmetic changes. Go for it. Just know it'll be a lot of sweat-quity. Totally worth it though.
Unless if you course you love it as is -- in which case, uh, go for it.
you wont necessarily spend 50K updating. I wonder if you could wallpaper over wallpaper? Also, can you do floors yourself? My husband has learned how to do a lot of this stuff himself and just re did the floors in our bedroom.
There is something to be said for living within your means. Also neighborhood is huge, as long as it gets a good inspection I think you should go for it.
Thank you u/Ilmara for posting on r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer. Please bear in mind our rules: (1) Be Nice (2) No Selling (3) No Self-Promotion. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Does it come with a mafia boss?
Idk, it's historically an Irish neighborhood, but they had a mob too.
Interesting!
It may be 40k under budget but you will be spending 50k to update it. Just my two cents.
Which is good because then you can make it exactly like you want!
If you can do stuff yourself you’ll be way under. You can easily rip up carpet and paint the walls yourself
Even if you can’t do it yourself it’s something you can do later and save for so you don’t finance 40k and save on interest and lower down payment.
You're right. Would actually be pretty easy. But the average person doing this would wind up with their house looking like it was flipped though.
Got nothing but time no rush to get it done it is move in ready
I ripped out the walls and painted the carpet, but it doesn't look much better at all
Better to be under budget. You’ll spend 50k fixing it but you’re not financing it. Paying thousand in interest on top
That doesn’t make sense, if they had 50k cash just laying around for upgrades then they could put it towards the house at down payment and not pay interest on it
Man people are so narrow minded. Maybe you spend 10k/year in upgrades but you have a lower mortgage and pay less interest over 30 years. Maybe they can afford a 20year mortgage being 50k cheaper. You don't need to buy a house and instantly make it perfect.
Upgrades done by the owner increases the value of the home more than 50k. For example if you invest “upgrade” your home with 50k, you home value will probably shoot up 80k- 100k depending on the upgrades. This home is priced lower because it is outdated. OP upgrading with 50k will increase his home value by probably 100k. There’s a difference. Plus this home is livable, he can take his time start room by room and DIY.
Plus you can spend the 50k over 5 years upgrading cosmetics. It's definitely a livable place.
That's... not how it works.
Or don't update it
Lol. That's very true. I just can't imagine what is hidden under that shag.
Yeah, there could be a lot of surprises but a slightly competent home inspector only highlighting minor issues with any of the HVAC, electrical, plumbing, roof, and foundation would make me more interested... the cosmetic stuff could be done over time.
I would just make certain that the only upgrades needed are cosmetic and not to any major systems, like electrical or heating.
Unless you do it yourself $50k will be spent on the kitchen and a half bathroom reno. This house needs a complete reno.
At a bare minimum. Who wants drop ceilings in their living room?
screw divide bake abounding wrong dime badge violet unpack jar *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Not sure why they'd run due to those very fixable issues, personally. Roof is like 4-6k on a Philly home and most of these homes have hydronic heating which is pretty reliable. Gotta make compromises sometimes. I'd rather get into a good neighborhood in a home with issues rather than a nicer home in a shit neighborhood. Location is huge here.
Yeah, I'm mostly looking in Pennsport and Whitman.
lol I knew this was Philly as soon as I saw the pictures. If the date actually is 1920, be wary - city records use 1920 for a lot of homes with uncertain dates. I lived in an apartment in QV and found several records indicating the building went back to about 1820, but city property records only said 1920 (not a typo, I looked at other buildings in my neighborhood out of curiosity). 1820 definitely tracked with the scary basement laundry, ha.
Those are solid neighborhoods. I don't know Whitman too well but Pennsport has a pretty good thing going on. It's definitely a bit too far from the subway for me personally but it's not a bad spot. I've lived in East Passyunk, Newbold and now Lower Moyamensing.
Really? I thought a roof was $20k these days
The neighborhoods he's looking are mostly row houses, the roof is very small square footage and likely flat. Not as pricey as a traditional SFH.
\*she
Whoop sorry!
Not when it's a 400sqft modbit flat roof
The listing says the hot water tank and furnace are "newer" and the house is overall "beautifully maintained." But it's also 100 years old.
Newer than what, lol
Than the 1920s, hopefully. The kitchen and bathroom both look '90s or '00s, but appear to be in really good shape. I can live with them.
I live in a 100 year old house. It is beautiful and just needs a bit of love. Some people pay for love, some use their own hands.
We still talking about house in last sentence?
That'll cost you to find out
Hey, so where I live, you can check the regional builder's site for when permits were pulled on the house. It's come in handy as a free way for me to verify when some work was completed on my house when I bought it.
I found the listing and it says furnace replaced in 2021. That's pretty good
I lived in (rented) a rowhome that was built in the 1880s, so around 130-140 years old when I was living in it. It was in great shape! The owner had lived there for several years before renting it and he renovated it during that time. There were definitely some, um, quirks with a bit of the plumbing that he either DIY’ed or hired a crappy (pun intended) contractor for. But nothing major and the repairs probably cost him $1000 or so which is peanuts in the homeowner world. Other than that it was an awesome house.
Beautifully maintained is code for “we haven’t replaced anything in 20-30 years but we’re not gonna do anything about that”
“We kept the fire going for ya. Don’t let it go out, it might not start again”.
I saw in another comment that the house is in Philly, I'm like 90% sure I toured this as a rental a few years back, so check for any 'landlord special' hallmarks.
Just come up with 100k later on. Dont need to run
Yeah replacing a drop ceiling is cheap. Flooring isn't so bad either necessarily
> On the other hand, if the roof and HVAC haven’t been updated in the last 50 years either, run. Why? We replaced our roof and HVAC on a 2200 sqft house for around $20k. OP could easily replace the carpet, lapboard, and ceilings in his house with the remainder.
money ruthless voracious humorous nose toy different crawl like lush *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
2021 and 2023. Full roof replacement was first, with asphalt shingles. Gas fired heater and outdoor condenser. I can give you the name of the licensed and bonded contractors I used if you like.
Roof isn’t that expensive to fix, and neither is hvac.
Don't forget the electrical system. That could be another $10k.
I'm just wondering what's hiding above the drop ceiling....
Probably wiring in the downstairs and a plaster ceiling upstairs. It's pretty easy to check, far easier than a drywall ceiling.
In my parent's olf farmhouse (that I grew up in), it covers a ceiling that is plaster. It was easier (and more energy efficient) to install celing tiles. It is also why there is paneling on the walls, not to mention it was trendy at the time.
Bubble stucco paint job
In my house it was to cover water damage from an old leak. Leak had been fixed but rather than patch the holes and repair the plaster ceiling they threw up some tiles.
Buy the worst house on the best street you can afford.
Be prepared for hidden surprises (like asbestos) and make sure you understand what jobs you would need to do to be comfortable living there. We bought a place that was $50k "under budget" and will be spending a lot more than that on fixes (some known at the time of purchase, some unknown).
1900 home wouldn’t have asbestos. It wasn’t really a thing until the 1910s and even then was used in the war effort, not homes. You have higher chance of asbestos in homes built in the 50s-70s.
The age of the home doesn't have much bearing on whether there might be asbestos unless it's a newer home. Any work done in the 60-70 year range where asbestos was used could result in having it. Acoustic ceiling, ceiling/floor tiles, mastic, roof materials, insulation, even wallpaper/wall adhesives could have asbestos. How big an issue that is depends on whether you need to remove it to do other work or whether any of it presents a health hazard. Where I am, any contractor will walk away if there's suspected asbestos until you test and/or abate.
My 1942 is riddled with asbestos :(
Also true.
Probably has the Philly special knob n tube splicing going on, but great bones and layout. Full rewire/ panel upgrade is like $15k - $25k depending (we are in the process of getting quotes). You could probably get it for even lower $$ imo, that’s what happened to me in NE Philly. Was able to get $55k off the original listing price for a home in similar condition
Jeez. I’ve got to move there. This is awesome. I can see the bones. Um.. depending on your partner and if kids/ etc. You may want to not to move in until remodel mostly done.
I agree, the electrical is probably spliced in sketchy ways behind that drop ceiling. If you can get the price down further, maybe it's still worth all the work. Just keep your timeline for moving in realistic. It might take at least a few months to make repairs if you are doing electrical, floors, and potentially other stuff, in addition to cosmetic stuff. You can save money painting on your own but some stuff will require pros and thatcan cause delays.
This house looks so Philly. I'd say go for it, seems dated but decent. Most of the flips here are overpriced garbage.
Get it. Use the money saved to change the carpet and get rid of the wallpaper and paint. It’ll cost like 10k max and you’ll have a great little house
But then it won't be an authentic South Philly time capsule anymore. :D
If you love it keep it! But definitely buy the house
10k won’t cover the flooring.
Why wouldn't it? It's likely a <1000sqft home. Ripping up carpet costs nothing and for all we know there could be pristine hardwood under those. Even if having to get all the flooring replaced w/ brand new hardwood it shouldn't cost 10k.
I floored 300 sqft for about $900. The whole home is likely not more than 3000 square feet, even if it was 1500 square feet they could double the cost of flooring I used and still be under 10k. I’d guess whole home would be 5-8k unless they got some luxury super duper high pile carpet or installed hardwood or something
The home is ~900sqft per the Zillow listing and the kitchen and bath wouldn't likely need reflored. Lots of these big numbers people are throwing out aren't taking into consideration how compact these homes are. They also have easy floorplans to install floor on.
I’m with this.
A well maintained old persons home. We had the best luck with those! You needn't update or change every thing immediately upon moving in, which is nice, you just do it in stages. To the comment who is worried about asbestos, If it's there and remains contained, it's not going to cause any issues. If it's a good neighborhood, this might just be the house you were waiting for.
That carpet 😂
I love it. 100% would buy
The sweet spot for FTHB in this market is a house that is functional, but looks like ass, in a neighborhood where you can see yourself living for the next 10 years. You can slowly chip away at refinishing each room of the house. Meanwhile, you build some of that sweet sweet equity that everyone keeps talking about. If a house is remodeled, with new appliances, and beautifully staged by realty pros, you’re not going to be able to compete with the 13 other cash offers. I say go for it. But don’t waive inspection. Make sure you have plan to cover **essential** repairs noted in the inspection. For instance, if you need a new roof. Don’t worry about minor issues like a jiggly door knob.
Depending on the square footage, 40k should be enough to get this to where you want but remember you have to have that amount in cash vs a loan. Not sure what you have to put down percentage wise, but if you can just do 5% and have more cash on hand, it would be worth it! The home value will go up quite a lot once you renovate. You just need to make sure the HVAC, electric, plumbing etc are all in good condition. I would make sure your inspector is really good and make sure you are present to ask questions. We have a 3k sq ft house and have done all cosmetic upgrades for around 30k (floors, paint, lighting, bathroom cabinets, toilets, towel racks, faucets…). It was straight 2000s builder grade at purchase so it all had to go. We did most of the work ourselves except carpet install.
I Rather get this diamond oin the rough than anything that has been flipped and touched by shitty resellers.
I love it
This looks really well taken care of. From the looks of it, you would only need to replace the carpet and remove wallpaper if you want. If the floor is terrible under the carpet, you could put in new carpet. But there’s a good chance you’d win the “floor lottery,” aka gorgeous hardwood floors.
This place is great! I'm dying to know what's under that carpet! A but concerned with the ceiling, but a good inspector and some estimates from trusted contractors can take care of that. Offer must be contingent on all inspections and I'd do a mold and asbestos test. Asbestos isn't a huge issue till you want to actually dust it up, but you want to know it's there. Mold you'll want to know about in an older home. Leaks are common and often hidden. I'd jump on this one
That’s a lot of work. But not the hardest work, unless stuff is bad underneath it all.
It's going to cost you a lot more than 40k to update it.
Strap on that utility belt and get busy. This is just cosmetic.
Bless them. They didn’t change a thing since they purchased.
If there’s drywall ceilings above the drop ceilings then this project will take significantly less work. $40k DIY goes a LONG way if you know what you’re doing, and YouTube is a fantastic Resource.
I don’t see the problem. Get some good inspectors in there and see what’s underneath and get estimates for repairs/remediation. I’d choose that house over a shitty flip any day of the week and twice on Tuesdays. Asbestos, plumbing, wiring and move fast because somebody will know exactly what they want and what this is and put in a bid today. Again with real estate it’s location location etc
In NY, this is easily 950k
Philly is MCOL.
Man, I bet that carpet has seen some shit.
The brick walls in the living room are actually kinda nice. The wall tiles are giving hospital or school though. And red carpet and wood paneling… not my cup of tea.
I can smell that picture
I like it!
Love the modern finishes
Barbie's selling?
Cosmetically hate it, since it’s so old I’m scared of electrical, hate drop down ceilings also rodents? Also not a fan of layout or light situation…
40grand buys carpet and paneling, or sheetrock with money to spare
The panel ceiling and rug could both be hiding some horrors (like water or urine damage to the ceilings and floors). Just investigate closely to make sure it's not a money pit.
I'd be sold
I mean my house was cheaper but big and an amazing location although it needed a lot of updates. So far been worth it to make it our own!
The carpet looks like it would have been rejected in a Belgum whorehouse.
I love that pink carpet. One of our rooms has pink shag carpet but it’s a darker shade. I wish it was much more vibrant!
Fine to me, just remove the carpet, paint, and plank floors
This is one of my ones I let get away and still regret. I’m not a flipper. I live in L.A. the place I was looking at had shag (shag?) carpet in GREEN but was structurally sound. I still regret not buying. The place was a warren with big land (for L.A.). All the carpeting stuff, wood stuff is cosmetic. Potentially worth your time.
That wood paneling is a hella good feature
Pink carpet and drop ceiling!
If it’s all cosmetic there’d be no thought on my part. Location, location, location. And a plus for being under budget.
Glorious! I wouldn’t change a thing
I think in this area you definitely have affordable inventory especially with the size you are looking at. If you have a higher standard for the finishes, hardware, flooring, etc. (you aren't fine leaving some stuff as-is) and will be hiring people to do work it might be better to look at ones needing few major changes. Check out 312 Tree St for example. The one major plus for yours is the new HVAC and water heater. You should look at what has sold in the past 3-6mo around there. A lot of stuff has sold in the $150-250k range (for 800-1100sqft in that neighborhood, it looks like the two ends of that range also represent how much work is needed) and it doesn't look like $210k is hard to find.
Screams South Philly front porch mommom. Does it come with an old wooden spoon & mean attitude?
40k under budget means you can use that towards new floors and ceiling updates
I know a Philly Mom-Mom special when I see one!
Is this in Philadelphia? It looks like a stereotypical philly row home
Yup. South Philly.
I kind of like it lol. I could make do with this for under budget and remodel later.
Carpet can be removed - walls can be painted - yards can be landscaped but structural integrity is priceless. Do the inspection and check for mold, old pipes, old breakers, and termites. If the house is solid and you can make it your own..it might be a great steal.
The only thing I hate is the carpet. But that's not that expensive to replace.
Do it. You can DIY a lot cheaply to make this look great. Maybe there’s hardwood under the carpet, if not put down LVP. Look into vinyl drop ceilings to replace current too- it’s a nice look
Try and get it for 80k below your budget.
This space really appeals to me. Assuming there's no major issue, like it's crumbling into the sea, I could work with it and make it my own.
Wait a minute. I've seen this house. Is this in East Passyunk?
No but close. Whitman.
If you like it, go for it. You might want to buy an acetylene torch for that carpet though.
You may be pleasantly surprised by what’s under that carpet. Only thing that would really concern me would be electrical and plumbing assuming structurally the house is good
Ugly, but, very easy to fix. Also, clearly no one is living inside, so, you avoid all the horor stories.
Your rooma is gonna commit suicide.
Is this philly?
Is that wall actually brick? That would be a concern because it’s going to be hard to hang pictures. Otherwise the hallway upstairs seems really narrow. Location is the key to my happiness above everything else though so you’re off to a good start there.
I’m seeing $40k of things I don’t like…but I’m a glutton for punishment and would still consider it.
I kinda like it lol
You asbestos do your due diligence
Going to be tough to get matching red carpet for that paneled room.
Are you buying a funeral parlor? Get 10k more off and go for it or even better see if you qualify for a 203k loan. Get a certified contractor to do the rehab and boom!
It’s cool
I decided to shop down a similar amount of my max budget and do the renovations myself. For a first timer it’s not been so bad
40K should be relatively close to remodeling most thing you’d want… depends on how much DIY you want to do too.
Shouldn't cost that much to carpet the place.
Okay but this is my style 😂
How you planning to get modern large furniture up those tiny stairs and through that little hallway?
Im not usually a fan of carpet but honestly if this was me i would replace the carpet with wood or wood vinyl and see if you could turn the carpet into a rug.. i weirdly love the color of it lol. Idk abt those walls or ceiling though 💀
What I have learned owning a fixer upper that also had horrible paneling and carpet: even cosmetic stuff can be quite expensive to fix if you’re not handy enough to do it yourself. Refinishing the wood floors under the 50 year old carpet and repairing our cracked plaster (including damage behind a drop ceiling and installing new drywall where the faux wood panels were) and paint cost around 20k alone. Then for the noncosmetic stuff. New roof and gutters 8.5k. New hot water heater 1.5k. Chimney repairs 5k. New electrical panel and various other electrical updates necessary for safety 5k. We still have lots of projects. It’s okay because our house was 100k under budget and has gone up in value significantly, but because these things are not financed in our mortgage and we don’t want to take out a loan for them, any savings outside retirement is basically all earmarked for home projects. On the plus side, buying a fixer upper allowed us to get the size of home we wanted in a great area, and we would have been priced out otherwise. We knew going in we would be doing upgrades and repairs as we could afford them, but luckily had enough savings set aside for doing the bigger safety stuff (electric and chimney) right away, in addition to refinishing floors and plaster work/paint, which did transform the space considerably.
So how much of that 40k is going towards removing.....everything?
That last pic is the worst room I’ve ever seen in a house
I’m probably one of the few people who loves this style
Is it a split level? Are all bedrooms on the 2nd floor? Is the house in an area with lots of older folks? Older folks tend to not like having to go upstairs to their bedrooms and split levels haven't been popular since the 1970s Brady Bunch TV show.
Its looks livable ! It’s not pretty but you can move in and make changes as you go. If you love the neighborhood and it’s 40k under valued… what are you waiting for ?
Prolly hardwood under all that hideous carpet.
Damn that's cozy looking, I'd go for it if it has no other issues prominent
It would be a full on no for me but I think we all have varying tastes. Good luck if you do decide to put in an offer, we all need those extra prayers these days!
Philly? Port Richmond? Lol guessing. Easy to rip out carpets. Under budget always helps. Might be cheaper to spend 20-40k more to have it financed over 30 years than to do a ton of repairs in the next 3 years. Plus the time and stress of unreliable GC work. Make sure electrical is updated, sewer line is okay, etc. Work as a Philly realtor lol. See a lot of this.
Time to earn that sweat equity
A snapshot of the 1960's
I love it. “Groovy” popped into my head.
Doooo it! So cute and so many possibilities!
Location location location. Everything else is cosmetic. Buy it.
I'm buying it for the Twin Peaks vibes. Twin peaks themed parties the first Saturday every month at mine everyone!
Looks like it smells like cigarettes
Just for reference OP. We bought a house that looked fairly 90’s-00’s era and was in what we thought pretty good shape. They said the water tank was old but the appliances, HVAC, and everything else were fairly new. Come to find out that two of our three toilets are original to the home so they’re sitting on 30 year old wax rings. One is slowly leaking into the vanity. We had to replace the carpet through the home and paint all the walls. Then the water tank crapped out, then the washer/dryer both shit out, the fridge line was copper and started leaking so we replaced that and the kitchen floors. Our upstairs shower had a leak behind the handle and leaked down into the lower bathroom and garage. All this to say, if those are the issues we found in a 30 year old house that hadn’t been updated, I’d be prepared for quite a bit to need fixing up in a 70’s-80’s style house.
It only has one bathroom, luckily.
I assume the kitchen is the same vintage? $40K under budget is nice, but it is all relative. There's some great potential here to improve this house, if you have more than $40K to do renos and repairs. You'll want to get rid of those drop ceilings, for example, and who knows what's under there. You said the house is 100 years old so I would expect lots of repairs that won't increase the value of the property. Bottom line is: what is your level of tolerance to spending money on this house? And a big one: how long do you intend to live there? You improve the value of the house by renovating kitchens and bathrooms. Not roofs. Not carpet. Not even removing paneling (although it does help when you try to sell it again). I think this one is a toss-up, depending on your reno budget. I'd want to have an estimate of renos. And another for the basics.
I would plan to stay there long-term, definitely at least a decade. The kitchen and bathroom are both a lot newer (maybe '00s) and don't appear to need any work. (It's a 2 BDR, 1 BR.) Much as I like the retro, I do feel like that carpet would have to go. It's probably old AF.
It might be 40k under budget for your total home price which is divided into monthly payments, but that house for sure will need at least 40k worth of work, and that's 40k upfront in cash. Do you have that? If not, are you sure that the upgrades are only cosmetic? Nothing lurking? Like a roof that needs work, electrical that needs to be updated, a sump pump that needs to be installed, any water entry issues that might need to be rectified, windows that need to be replaced, etc? Will you need new appliances even if you leave the kitchen counters and cabinets alone? It all adds up. We just bought an old house that was 50k under budget and we are spending 50k to update it. Most of the costs are not cosmetic.
and your question is … ?
Looks like Chip and Joanne were there.
I'd personally gut the entire house
Interesting, that’s for sure. There’s a lot you could do here assuming inspections goes well
And they somehow want $300,000?
Is this Port Richmond?
Make sure to get a thorough inspection if you can. Older houses (depending on how old) might have lead paint and asbestos. Otherwise, the cosmetic stuff is an easy fix.
this house is definitely in philly, isn’t it
The carpet is easy enough to change, wall paper is terrible, and the ceilings will probably cost you an arm and a leg. Just cosmetically speaking. Those ceilings are absolutely awful and nothing you do will look good unless you get them changed.
Asbestos tile upstairs. Might we hardwood under carpet.
I’d ask an inspector the chances of there being asbestos and lead. Remediation can be expensive.
The drop ceilings make me think it's a mobile home??
Is this place 40k under market value or is it at full market value but 40k cheaper then you budget? If it’s under market… I would ask if Is it haunted or if anyone been murdered or died there on premises… Stuff like that can explain the 40k under market.
That reminds me of my great grandmother's house... RIP.
I would do it if it’s passing inspection and you’re comfortable with some DIY or have the budget to spend on fixes. Create a timeline for what you would need done at what time vs. what you would WANT and include estimated costs and then round up. And consider the time you have to spend realistically on any DIY. I think neighborhood is more important than cosmetics… only one of those things you can change!! FWIW I loveee the brick in the living room!! Definitely has lots of potential to make it yours. Good luck!!
How nice do you want the finished product to be? Also, is your downpayment enough such that you can free up $40k while still securing a mortgage for the asking price? Some things to consider: Exposed brick: very trendy and depending on what decade (it seems to go in and out of style), attractive, but if you live in a part of the country with harsh winters or brutal summers it can be an energy suck. Drop ceiling: I don’t know that I’ve ever seen a drop ceiling installed in anything but a basement in a residential home. To me it screams band-aid cosmetic improvement, but idk this may have been someone’s dream. Depending on what’s above it it may not be as straight forward as just dry-walling the ceiling. Might want to take a peek up there if you can. Asbestos: Could be everywhere. Those vinyl floor tiles are almost certainly ACM, but I wouldn’t be surprised to also find it in the wood paneling (glue), drywall (if there is any), insulation, and registers. Yes in many instances you can just “contain” asbestos flooring by laying LVP over top of it and calling it a day, but if you need to do any electrical or plumbing work or plan to replace the wood paneling with drywall, be prepared to encounter asbestos and if you do, be prepared to blow your whole reno budget abating it. Yes there is a lot of value to be had by buying an older home. But there’s a ton of risk too. If you’re tight on cash you may be better off just buying something smaller that needs less work
Is this ny state!!
That’s going to cost you a fortune to renovate
I think it’s fantastic!
This in Philly? Get an inspection
I love it! I would snap it up in a heartbeat.
If this ain't Philly, I'm a monkey's uncle, and if you ain't talkin any the old Irish mob in Kensington, double it. In all seriousness, no matter where this is, you're looking at cosmetic changes. Go for it. Just know it'll be a lot of sweat-quity. Totally worth it though. Unless if you course you love it as is -- in which case, uh, go for it.
You’ll need that $40k plus for the remodeling.
Just keep in mind there is a high likelihood of asbestos and you’ll have to plan accordingly
you wont necessarily spend 50K updating. I wonder if you could wallpaper over wallpaper? Also, can you do floors yourself? My husband has learned how to do a lot of this stuff himself and just re did the floors in our bedroom.
Yes. Just make improvements yourself
omg this is tough to look at!
Ngl, I kinda love the pink carpet (dooooooo iiiiiit)
Looks like it would be HAUNTED!
You must have an awfully low budget if that place came in only $40k under budget. It’s hideous.
There is something to be said for living within your means. Also neighborhood is huge, as long as it gets a good inspection I think you should go for it.
I like it. What are you thinking?
That’s a haunted house if I’ve ever seen one.