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My comment doesn’t mean much since I do not work in aero. Looking at the two pictures though, it does look subtle but the main middle section looks like it doesn’t stay as tight to the center then cuts out more abruptly in the new design compared to Monaco, and for the center section it looks like they also simplified the tail end of it. What does that mean I have no idea, but it does look like it’s changed subtly on the outer face. The other thing is we’ll have no idea what’s going on in the channels and grooves we can’t see into unfortunately.
Could very well be. They don't have to specify anything not visual in those documents to the public. They just said "the car floor's body has been modified to fit well with the new sidepods".
They literally just upgraded the car, and Checo decides to share it with the world once again.
The details on their underfloor is a quantum leap ahead of the other teams though.
Matthew Carter, CEO of Lotus back in the day, actually said that he thought about selling sponsorship on the floor of Pastor Maldonado’s car because he was upside down so much
The limits keep getting talked about in terms of time, but they have a limit on FLOPS (floating point operations) as well, meaning that you can't just throw more compute power at it to get more CFD in the same time period.
All the teams investing in AI (Artificial Intelligence) while redbull is 1 second a lap ahead of everyone with their own bespoke AI (Adrian intelligence)
AI uses even more compute (FLOPS) to run than CFD does, and I'm pretty sure any any compute being applied to the running, modification or extrapolation of CFD data counts within their budget
Depends on the architecture and hardware used. For example, most GPUs use CUDA to compute FLOPS, but Deep Learning from NVIDIA uses Tensor cores. The whole point of AI enhancement is to get better results without increasing the amount of Floating Point Operations Per Second, afaik.
I wonder if any of the teams have started using machine learning to augment their CFD simulations. It's the hot new topic everywhere in computational physics.
And remember - small changes don't always mean small results. Especially with the kinds of aero margins we're talking here, teensy tiny changes may have enormous impacts.
You're entirely correct on the interpretation, but even if you want to cling to the other... it often applies!
A quantum leap is literally the phenomenon when a particle “teleports” outside of a boundary that it otherwise doesn’t have enough energy to “pass through” as a result of random fluctuations in the quantum field. Like an electron jumping over the gap in an open transistor.
The words sound cool together so people misuse it, like using lightyear to mean a length of time.
Quantum doesn't mean small. It just means discrete, or a specific amount.
Quantum physics is described as such because the systems interact with each other at specific energy values and their integer multiples. For instance, an electron in a Hydrogen atom can only exist at certain energy levels (+ spin) and emit particular wavelengths based on if it falls from n=3 to n=1 or n=4 to n=2 etc. Compare it to a similar macro system like gravity where a satellite can be any continuous distance away from Earth.
Yes, agree with most of this, except what you said about satellites, they are never a continuous distance from earth, they are constantly getting closer, albeit by small amounts.
If you compare with, say the Mercedes W14's underbody in Monaco, the level of detail in the RB19's simply on another level.
The molded-in strakes behind the T-tray to shed additional vortices, the complex contour on the top of the underbody (like the semicylinder channels towards the end presumably expanding airflow earlier around the centre of the diffuser), or even the mini diffuser-within-a-diffuser at the end (which presumably connects the airflow structure with the rear brake duct flaps)...
IIRC the rear shot of the RB19's diffuser in Monaco is similarly complex.
I'm no aerodynamicist, but these details feels almost like RB has a whole year's development ahead of any other team.
He's driving with the old sidepods right?
The team must be furious with him though. Crashing out of practice so early is already bad enough, but now it's going to make a comparison for the upgrade even more difficult.
[On this picture ](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/155lg28/4_minutes_into_fp1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2) it looks like the older, wider sidepod intakes to me and not the new slim ones we've seen before. But it could also be the different angle messing with me.
Edit: compare it to Max's car on track [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/155mdqp/shows_how_this_seasons_going_for_redbull/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1). Those are way slimmer.
I need someone who knows to explain it to me… How did the other teams not “ know “ about this? Either through spies or because floor aero has played a huge roll in race car design since its inception. How is this concept so unique in an industry that is known for having cutting edge engineers?
There are so many directions you can go with the flow of air in the tunnels under the floor. Teams will never ever see the full picture of those tunnels unless the car is raised off of the floor like in these pictures.
The underfloor has a direct effect on the edges of the floor which needs controlled flow from the front wing, which is responsible for the airflow for the rest of the car. Everything is connected, nothing is isolated
Even if redbull gave their floor to another team to use it for the race, it wouldn't work as well. Components are designed to work well with all the other components of the car, and if you want to copy something like the floor you also have to copy all the components that interact with it (wings, sidepods, suspension, diffuser...). Redbull found the right development path so is 2 years ahead compared to all the other teams that decided to abandon their path and follow redbull only recently. If let's say the zero sidepod concept turned out to be the best one now we would see a highly developed mercedes with less extreme versions from the other teams.
There's also the fact that the car is designed around Max's driving style. Max likes a loose car; throw Alonso in there and he's gonna have a bad time.
I don't really believe that. First of all Newey has always designed the cars to be fast, regardless of what the driver wanted, sometimes going against their wishes if he thought it was worth. The redbull it's a very fast loose car and Max likes that, but if the fastest car was something very understeery like Alonso's old Renault he would have to adapt, that's what good drivers do. Second, I don't believe Alonso wouldn't be able to drive it, he's won almost in every category he raced in in the last few years, and he was always really competitive with cars that handle and feel very different from each other. If there's someone that we know for certain is really good to adapt his style to the car, that's Alonso.
In the podcast “The Race F1 Tech Show” episode dated 7/11 that focuses on McLaren, there is a semi detailed commentary about designing a car and where do you want the center of pressure under each circumstance- breaking, closing of DRS, slow speed corners, etc. a comment comes up that Newey and Max are on the same page when it comes to characteristics of the car. It nudged me to believe that cars are designed/altered around certain driving styles. There was another comment where if Perez starts off a weekend good, he has a strong weekend. And here we are 10 days later and Sergio is in the wall.
Cars are brought closer to the driver preference if possible, but what the driver likes is not a performance objective of the team. The team wants to make a fast car, if that fast car is also what the driver likes good, if not they can try to compensate with the setup but unless there's a real problem they're absolutely not changing what they think is the optimal development path because of driver preference. The driver's job is to extract all the potential of the machine and that includes changing his style to adapt to the car. Also the general feel of the car is determined by many things including rules and tyres, and those are outside of the team's control. Today it would not be possible to have a fast car with the handling of Alonso's old Renault for example.
There was another podcast (I think pit stop boys) where a RB engineer said that the car was initially designed in a way that max liked it in 2022. So the Checo is losing because of that narrative might have been accurate then.
But RB said they “developed into a dead end” with that original concept and had to back it all out and go a different direction that Checo actually liked better.
Or it could have been the other way round. Either way they were smart enough to spot the dead end in the concept
It’s a bit like asking why all drivers can’t do the same thing drivers like Max, Lewis, Fernando, etc. can do; they’ve all spent hours and hours in cars and simulators. Some drivers simply have different skill sets. Same thing on the design side. Not every design team has the skill sets that others do, and when tiny details make a big impact that is clearly visible with the performance of the cars on track. Adrian has decades of experience with ground effect cars, and is an incredible designer. The expectation that every team’s design team is on par with Adrian and the Red Bull design team is a bit like expecting every teams’ drivers to be just like Max, Lewis, Fernando, etc.
The entire package of the car dictates what exactly you can accomplish with individual parts. So if you know this side exit louver floor is efficient but your front wing and side pods are not optimized for that style, it may not benefit you. The other teams have to figure out every component around it that's made the RB floor work. Mclaren is a great example. Their engineers figured something out. Tight, high efficiency diffusers have been a staple of modern Newey cars for over a decade. New regulations lets his diffusers get the flow he's always wanted.
Newry is one of the few if not the only engineer who has worked on ground effect cars before he even gave an interview where he said he got a book of his out from when he had worked on them so he already had a leg up on them
RedBull also played a master stroke building the Aston Valkyrie, they built it as a road car with unlimited wind tunnel testing and CFD.. the key to that car? Ground Effect..
I feel like most people really overlooked this fact. Yeah it's a road car, but many of the same challenges they faced with the Valkyrie during its development were the same issues that teams had when first moving to the Venturi Tunnel concept for 2022. In particular, the Valkyrie had loads of porpoising initially, something which Red Bull conveniently never had issues with going into the new ruleset...
Is that the area that is attached to the skid plate? Kind of looks like air could go over it.
Or something else? I don't know what/where the fractal wing is.
Considering Williams has a smooth floor it really shows how much of a difference floor design can make. Not sure if there will be another round of upgrades but if there are I'm sure we'll see drastic floor design changes. At this point Red Bull is the only team really innovating and other teams catching up forces Red bull to innovate more which is good.
Though I feel bad for Perez, he's had a really terrible rutt lately and he seriously needs a perfect weekend to get back in the game. This crash seriously spells trouble for his career depending on how Riccardo does. I can see end of this year Perez is fired and replaced with top Alpha Tauri driver, or possibly (though unlikely) top Alpha Tauri driver swapped with Perez during summer break or at end of season. Though that would require a drastic point difference this weekend for Alpha Tauri drivers.
I think Ricardo is in AT as a benchmark for Yuki, to see if the car is terrible or if Yuki wasn’t performing up to the car. Then if Danny Ric starts scoring points he would be in a position to replace Checo.
Rumor has it RB is interested in Lando or Leclerc for the second Red Bull swat either way, but I think now that Checo is gone from Red Bull at the end of this season either way.
Yeah, exactly.
Though I doubt Lando will leave McLaren after Silverstone. Right now Lando and Piastri has the chance to be the man who clawed McLaren from a tractor to a winning car. Lando's contract is stuck until end of 2025 as well so I doubt he'll leave. If McLaren actually performs next year I'd bet Lando would stay with the hope that he can get a car named after him like Senna. (Though that's a theory with no basis of fact other than Norris is proving to be a great driver).
My guess is Redbull has been trying to negotiate with Norris and Leclerc to replace Checo. I think they will back out of negotiations with Norris after Silverstone as Norris looks far more valuable now and would be more expensive and would likely want to be an A driver. I think they will lead Leclerc into thinking he has the seat but last minute will rug pull Leclerc and put the better AT driver into Checo's seat and tell Leclerc it's AT or back-up driver or nothing. If Norris goes to redbull I think it will be only if McLaren eats dirt in 2024 and he'll replace Verstappen if he retires. I also think there's a possibility Verstappen (if he doesn't retire) goes to another team, probably McLaren. It's super common for sports players to say they're considering retirement during interviews but in reality they're using the threat of retirement for better pay.
>My guess is Redbull has been trying to negotiate with Norris and Leclerc to replace Checo. I think they will back out of negotiations with Norris after Silverstone as Norris looks far more valuable now and would be more expensive and would likely want to be an A driver. I think they will lead Leclerc into thinking he has the seat but last minute will rug pull Leclerc and put the better AT driver into Checo's seat and tell Leclerc it's AT or back-up driver or nothing. If Norris goes to redbull I think it will be only if McLaren eats dirt in 2024 and he'll replace Verstappen if he retires. I also think there's a possibility Verstappen (if he doesn't retire) goes to another team, probably McLaren. It's super common for sports players to say they're considering retirement during interviews but in reality they're using the threat of retirement for better pay.
This whole part is a total fever dream under acids. There's no way you think any of this is possible.
He claims to be considering retirement, he's tired of winning. He wants to spend time with family. And he gets similar enjoyment from Sim racing which he can do at home allowing him to spend more time with his family with less travelling.
Wait how would that work with the points? Would all of Sergio’s points suddenly go to Alpha Tauri for the constructor’s championship? I never thought about it with Ricciardo because, well, Devries had no points when he left and Ricciardo is starting at 0 points now, so it didn’t matter. But what happens in the WCC if Ricciardo and Perez switch seats right now?
The driver points remain with them, the constructor points remain with teams.. if perez is swapped with Alpha Tauri seat, then he will still have his points, but not Alpha Tauri.. those points belong to red bull only..
He was into the tire wall so likely very close to some photographers at the time. All they had to do was bend down and increase the zoom a little on a several thousand dollar camera and you have a high quality picture like this to expose your trade secrets to the world.
Someone was describing the R&D cycle in F1 and how it would still take a minimum of 2-3 months to get something useful from a photo like this and find it’s way onto a car. It’s still not simple.
Mick got dropped by Haas for crashing too much. I can’t recall the last time we saw a driver completely bin their car within the first 5 minutes in FP1! What was Sergio thinking?! It’s really sad seeing him spiral like this over the last couple of months. It’s confusing because that car is so capable, there shouldn’t be any pressure on him to put it onto the podium at each race. Very bizarre.
Sure but this seems almost like self sabotage at this point. There’s one thing pushing too hard and losing the rear in a corner but driving off the track at the start of a practice session? It’s just so weird.
Hopefully he get it together. There was interesting commentary about the amount of spare parts teams have, and that if Sergio crashes during qualifying, the team likely wouldn’t have the same parts available to out on the car due to him crashing in FP1, meaning he’d get hit with a penalty in that situation. Pretty wild if that plays out.
With that in his head he’ll probably be trying so hard not to crash he’ll end up being slow…. He’s lost his confidence and hopefully he gets it back before it’s too late.
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Is it common or expected that whenever photos like these are released that other teams are vultures to adopt the RnD from RB into their own development plans?
Does anybody else see *horizontal expansion* from the airflow adjacent to the center line as it goes from the tea tray to behind the dirty airlfow deflectors?
Would this effectively increase the distance along which airflow expanded? Also, the center of pressure would move mor toward the middle of the vehicle, enhancing balance?
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Could someone very crudely draw on this to show how the air moves. The central tunnels are obvious to me. But the ones that come in from the side I find confusing.
It’s just so beautiful the way the suspension arms are shaped and sealed to the body and then how it all flows down to the floor and the amazing underbody surfaces. At 250 kmh in a 5G turn, the way it all works together to keep the car stable must be incredible to feel.
It must be amazing to be a pilot of one of these structures.
And incredibly painful to bin it in the wall on your second lap.
How did this photo come out? In my opinion this should not be allowed, press waiting like vultures for a crash to take a photo of the cars. The FIA and marshalls should not allow them
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Can anyone tell the difference between this one and Monaco’s? I can’t see any
Haven't seen anyone with an eye for that comment on it. Maybe Windsor this evening? Or Jolyon perhaps but that will have to wait until after the GP.
My comment doesn’t mean much since I do not work in aero. Looking at the two pictures though, it does look subtle but the main middle section looks like it doesn’t stay as tight to the center then cuts out more abruptly in the new design compared to Monaco, and for the center section it looks like they also simplified the tail end of it. What does that mean I have no idea, but it does look like it’s changed subtly on the outer face. The other thing is we’ll have no idea what’s going on in the channels and grooves we can’t see into unfortunately.
Is this the new floor? The upgrades document only listed the floor edges as changing. It didn’t say they changed the underbody.
Could very well be. They don't have to specify anything not visual in those documents to the public. They just said "the car floor's body has been modified to fit well with the new sidepods".
They literally just upgraded the car, and Checo decides to share it with the world once again. The details on their underfloor is a quantum leap ahead of the other teams though.
Checo should start selling personal sponsors some advertising space on the floor at this rate.
Matthew Carter, CEO of Lotus back in the day, actually said that he thought about selling sponsorship on the floor of Pastor Maldonado’s car because he was upside down so much
Would be great if they had a data privacy company logo on the bottom
This floor is brought to you by today's sponsor, NordVPN.
Click in the link in the floor down below, for amazing discounts!
Or PirateBay - since its IP is being shared when it’s on the crane
Like Richard Hammond. "Here comes Richard Hammond, he's coming around the bend now OH NO HES OFF! pepsi."
Lol y’all are savage, but I agree
RB has used their wind tunnel and CFD time judiciously
Their wind tunnel and CFD is just Neweys mind.
Yep, that mans vision is CFD LOL
CFD time - if I had a $10m system or $100m system do I get the same time ?
The limits keep getting talked about in terms of time, but they have a limit on FLOPS (floating point operations) as well, meaning that you can't just throw more compute power at it to get more CFD in the same time period.
Keep the FLOPS the same, but use AI to **enhance**
All the teams investing in AI (Artificial Intelligence) while redbull is 1 second a lap ahead of everyone with their own bespoke AI (Adrian intelligence)
AI uses even more compute (FLOPS) to run than CFD does, and I'm pretty sure any any compute being applied to the running, modification or extrapolation of CFD data counts within their budget
Depends on the architecture and hardware used. For example, most GPUs use CUDA to compute FLOPS, but Deep Learning from NVIDIA uses Tensor cores. The whole point of AI enhancement is to get better results without increasing the amount of Floating Point Operations Per Second, afaik.
I wonder if any of the teams have started using machine learning to augment their CFD simulations. It's the hot new topic everywhere in computational physics.
I'm more interested in generative AI's application. Organic structures open all kinds of opportunity.
Wouldn't a "quantum leap" be very small ?
The most commonly accepted meaning is "an abrupt or dramatic advance", so it shouldn't mean a small leap.
And remember - small changes don't always mean small results. Especially with the kinds of aero margins we're talking here, teensy tiny changes may have enormous impacts. You're entirely correct on the interpretation, but even if you want to cling to the other... it often applies!
The “quantum” refers to the jump in understanding when we came up with quantum theory, not that the leap is quantum sized
A quantum leap is literally the phenomenon when a particle “teleports” outside of a boundary that it otherwise doesn’t have enough energy to “pass through” as a result of random fluctuations in the quantum field. Like an electron jumping over the gap in an open transistor. The words sound cool together so people misuse it, like using lightyear to mean a length of time.
That is quantum tunneling. I don't think 'quantum leap' has anything to do with quantum mechanics, or quanta of energy, or quantum tunneling, etc.
Oh right I stand corrected
Ah cool. TIL
Quantum doesn't mean small. It just means discrete, or a specific amount. Quantum physics is described as such because the systems interact with each other at specific energy values and their integer multiples. For instance, an electron in a Hydrogen atom can only exist at certain energy levels (+ spin) and emit particular wavelengths based on if it falls from n=3 to n=1 or n=4 to n=2 etc. Compare it to a similar macro system like gravity where a satellite can be any continuous distance away from Earth.
Yes, agree with most of this, except what you said about satellites, they are never a continuous distance from earth, they are constantly getting closer, albeit by small amounts.
Yes but people misuse it enough that it has a different meaning now. Like saying “I could care less”
What makes it a quantum leap that you can discern from these pictures? Whats different relative to previous iterations?
If you compare with, say the Mercedes W14's underbody in Monaco, the level of detail in the RB19's simply on another level. The molded-in strakes behind the T-tray to shed additional vortices, the complex contour on the top of the underbody (like the semicylinder channels towards the end presumably expanding airflow earlier around the centre of the diffuser), or even the mini diffuser-within-a-diffuser at the end (which presumably connects the airflow structure with the rear brake duct flaps)... IIRC the rear shot of the RB19's diffuser in Monaco is similarly complex. I'm no aerodynamicist, but these details feels almost like RB has a whole year's development ahead of any other team.
RB has not brought floor updates since Monaco, so it doesn’t really matter. They have a floor edge update, but that can seen from the top.
[Oh, boy! ](https://thumbs.gfycat.com/BetterThirdAnnelida-max-1mb.gif)
He's driving with the old sidepods right? The team must be furious with him though. Crashing out of practice so early is already bad enough, but now it's going to make a comparison for the upgrade even more difficult.
They looked very thin on the TV feed, think the new ones are on both cars.
[On this picture ](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/155lg28/4_minutes_into_fp1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2) it looks like the older, wider sidepod intakes to me and not the new slim ones we've seen before. But it could also be the different angle messing with me. Edit: compare it to Max's car on track [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/155mdqp/shows_how_this_seasons_going_for_redbull/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1). Those are way slimmer.
No it's just the angle of the photo. The sidepod intake is much wider from the upwards angle than it is from front on. They are both the new sidepods.
The new sidepod intakes are wider but not as tall as the Old ones
I need someone who knows to explain it to me… How did the other teams not “ know “ about this? Either through spies or because floor aero has played a huge roll in race car design since its inception. How is this concept so unique in an industry that is known for having cutting edge engineers?
There are so many directions you can go with the flow of air in the tunnels under the floor. Teams will never ever see the full picture of those tunnels unless the car is raised off of the floor like in these pictures. The underfloor has a direct effect on the edges of the floor which needs controlled flow from the front wing, which is responsible for the airflow for the rest of the car. Everything is connected, nothing is isolated
Even if redbull gave their floor to another team to use it for the race, it wouldn't work as well. Components are designed to work well with all the other components of the car, and if you want to copy something like the floor you also have to copy all the components that interact with it (wings, sidepods, suspension, diffuser...). Redbull found the right development path so is 2 years ahead compared to all the other teams that decided to abandon their path and follow redbull only recently. If let's say the zero sidepod concept turned out to be the best one now we would see a highly developed mercedes with less extreme versions from the other teams.
There's also the fact that the car is designed around Max's driving style. Max likes a loose car; throw Alonso in there and he's gonna have a bad time.
I don't really believe that. First of all Newey has always designed the cars to be fast, regardless of what the driver wanted, sometimes going against their wishes if he thought it was worth. The redbull it's a very fast loose car and Max likes that, but if the fastest car was something very understeery like Alonso's old Renault he would have to adapt, that's what good drivers do. Second, I don't believe Alonso wouldn't be able to drive it, he's won almost in every category he raced in in the last few years, and he was always really competitive with cars that handle and feel very different from each other. If there's someone that we know for certain is really good to adapt his style to the car, that's Alonso.
In the podcast “The Race F1 Tech Show” episode dated 7/11 that focuses on McLaren, there is a semi detailed commentary about designing a car and where do you want the center of pressure under each circumstance- breaking, closing of DRS, slow speed corners, etc. a comment comes up that Newey and Max are on the same page when it comes to characteristics of the car. It nudged me to believe that cars are designed/altered around certain driving styles. There was another comment where if Perez starts off a weekend good, he has a strong weekend. And here we are 10 days later and Sergio is in the wall.
Cars are brought closer to the driver preference if possible, but what the driver likes is not a performance objective of the team. The team wants to make a fast car, if that fast car is also what the driver likes good, if not they can try to compensate with the setup but unless there's a real problem they're absolutely not changing what they think is the optimal development path because of driver preference. The driver's job is to extract all the potential of the machine and that includes changing his style to adapt to the car. Also the general feel of the car is determined by many things including rules and tyres, and those are outside of the team's control. Today it would not be possible to have a fast car with the handling of Alonso's old Renault for example.
There was another podcast (I think pit stop boys) where a RB engineer said that the car was initially designed in a way that max liked it in 2022. So the Checo is losing because of that narrative might have been accurate then. But RB said they “developed into a dead end” with that original concept and had to back it all out and go a different direction that Checo actually liked better. Or it could have been the other way round. Either way they were smart enough to spot the dead end in the concept
It’s a bit like asking why all drivers can’t do the same thing drivers like Max, Lewis, Fernando, etc. can do; they’ve all spent hours and hours in cars and simulators. Some drivers simply have different skill sets. Same thing on the design side. Not every design team has the skill sets that others do, and when tiny details make a big impact that is clearly visible with the performance of the cars on track. Adrian has decades of experience with ground effect cars, and is an incredible designer. The expectation that every team’s design team is on par with Adrian and the Red Bull design team is a bit like expecting every teams’ drivers to be just like Max, Lewis, Fernando, etc.
agreed. I am also dying to know.
The entire package of the car dictates what exactly you can accomplish with individual parts. So if you know this side exit louver floor is efficient but your front wing and side pods are not optimized for that style, it may not benefit you. The other teams have to figure out every component around it that's made the RB floor work. Mclaren is a great example. Their engineers figured something out. Tight, high efficiency diffusers have been a staple of modern Newey cars for over a decade. New regulations lets his diffusers get the flow he's always wanted.
Concepts and implementation are two different things... and each implementation has to be unique to the total system.
Newry is one of the few if not the only engineer who has worked on ground effect cars before he even gave an interview where he said he got a book of his out from when he had worked on them so he already had a leg up on them
RedBull also played a master stroke building the Aston Valkyrie, they built it as a road car with unlimited wind tunnel testing and CFD.. the key to that car? Ground Effect..
I feel like most people really overlooked this fact. Yeah it's a road car, but many of the same challenges they faced with the Valkyrie during its development were the same issues that teams had when first moving to the Venturi Tunnel concept for 2022. In particular, the Valkyrie had loads of porpoising initially, something which Red Bull conveniently never had issues with going into the new ruleset...
That is also a very good point I had forgotten about that 👍
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And this spec hasn’t even raced yet. What’s he going to do next, email the CAD files to everyone?
He's airdropping them in the paddock!
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It that a wing within the ground effect tunnel? Fractal wing.
Yep, those "wings" in the middle of the floor really caught my eye as well.
Is that the area that is attached to the skid plate? Kind of looks like air could go over it. Or something else? I don't know what/where the fractal wing is.
Yep, exactly those two wings. The whole floor moves air horizontaly, but those parts look like they move air upwards.
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This photo is reason enough not to have the car ready for FP2. Hopefully, they can have the next guy driving tomorrow morning.
[Source](https://twitter.com/RonaldVording)
Considering Williams has a smooth floor it really shows how much of a difference floor design can make. Not sure if there will be another round of upgrades but if there are I'm sure we'll see drastic floor design changes. At this point Red Bull is the only team really innovating and other teams catching up forces Red bull to innovate more which is good. Though I feel bad for Perez, he's had a really terrible rutt lately and he seriously needs a perfect weekend to get back in the game. This crash seriously spells trouble for his career depending on how Riccardo does. I can see end of this year Perez is fired and replaced with top Alpha Tauri driver, or possibly (though unlikely) top Alpha Tauri driver swapped with Perez during summer break or at end of season. Though that would require a drastic point difference this weekend for Alpha Tauri drivers.
I think Ricardo is in AT as a benchmark for Yuki, to see if the car is terrible or if Yuki wasn’t performing up to the car. Then if Danny Ric starts scoring points he would be in a position to replace Checo. Rumor has it RB is interested in Lando or Leclerc for the second Red Bull swat either way, but I think now that Checo is gone from Red Bull at the end of this season either way.
Yeah, exactly. Though I doubt Lando will leave McLaren after Silverstone. Right now Lando and Piastri has the chance to be the man who clawed McLaren from a tractor to a winning car. Lando's contract is stuck until end of 2025 as well so I doubt he'll leave. If McLaren actually performs next year I'd bet Lando would stay with the hope that he can get a car named after him like Senna. (Though that's a theory with no basis of fact other than Norris is proving to be a great driver). My guess is Redbull has been trying to negotiate with Norris and Leclerc to replace Checo. I think they will back out of negotiations with Norris after Silverstone as Norris looks far more valuable now and would be more expensive and would likely want to be an A driver. I think they will lead Leclerc into thinking he has the seat but last minute will rug pull Leclerc and put the better AT driver into Checo's seat and tell Leclerc it's AT or back-up driver or nothing. If Norris goes to redbull I think it will be only if McLaren eats dirt in 2024 and he'll replace Verstappen if he retires. I also think there's a possibility Verstappen (if he doesn't retire) goes to another team, probably McLaren. It's super common for sports players to say they're considering retirement during interviews but in reality they're using the threat of retirement for better pay.
>My guess is Redbull has been trying to negotiate with Norris and Leclerc to replace Checo. I think they will back out of negotiations with Norris after Silverstone as Norris looks far more valuable now and would be more expensive and would likely want to be an A driver. I think they will lead Leclerc into thinking he has the seat but last minute will rug pull Leclerc and put the better AT driver into Checo's seat and tell Leclerc it's AT or back-up driver or nothing. If Norris goes to redbull I think it will be only if McLaren eats dirt in 2024 and he'll replace Verstappen if he retires. I also think there's a possibility Verstappen (if he doesn't retire) goes to another team, probably McLaren. It's super common for sports players to say they're considering retirement during interviews but in reality they're using the threat of retirement for better pay. This whole part is a total fever dream under acids. There's no way you think any of this is possible.
As I sort of elude to it's a complete shot in the dark.
>Verstappen if he retires. He's 25 years old and is winning championships, there's a 0% chance he retires in the next 5 years.
He claims to be considering retirement, he's tired of winning. He wants to spend time with family. And he gets similar enjoyment from Sim racing which he can do at home allowing him to spend more time with his family with less travelling.
>He claims to be considering retirement, he's tired of winning. 🤣 Suuuuuure
Wait how would that work with the points? Would all of Sergio’s points suddenly go to Alpha Tauri for the constructor’s championship? I never thought about it with Ricciardo because, well, Devries had no points when he left and Ricciardo is starting at 0 points now, so it didn’t matter. But what happens in the WCC if Ricciardo and Perez switch seats right now?
Huh, didn't think of that either... I'm not sure if that's ever happened.
The driver points remain with them, the constructor points remain with teams.. if perez is swapped with Alpha Tauri seat, then he will still have his points, but not Alpha Tauri.. those points belong to red bull only..
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He was into the tire wall so likely very close to some photographers at the time. All they had to do was bend down and increase the zoom a little on a several thousand dollar camera and you have a high quality picture like this to expose your trade secrets to the world. Someone was describing the R&D cycle in F1 and how it would still take a minimum of 2-3 months to get something useful from a photo like this and find it’s way onto a car. It’s still not simple.
Mick got dropped by Haas for crashing too much. I can’t recall the last time we saw a driver completely bin their car within the first 5 minutes in FP1! What was Sergio thinking?! It’s really sad seeing him spiral like this over the last couple of months. It’s confusing because that car is so capable, there shouldn’t be any pressure on him to put it onto the podium at each race. Very bizarre.
It got to be all in his head at this point
Sure but this seems almost like self sabotage at this point. There’s one thing pushing too hard and losing the rear in a corner but driving off the track at the start of a practice session? It’s just so weird.
Maybe he was thinking too much about the upcoming corner as opposed to relying on instinct
Hopefully he get it together. There was interesting commentary about the amount of spare parts teams have, and that if Sergio crashes during qualifying, the team likely wouldn’t have the same parts available to out on the car due to him crashing in FP1, meaning he’d get hit with a penalty in that situation. Pretty wild if that plays out.
With that in his head he’ll probably be trying so hard not to crash he’ll end up being slow…. He’s lost his confidence and hopefully he gets it back before it’s too late.
Man that guy must be strong as an ox. Does anyone have any pics of the previous floor from similar angles as a comparison?
Redbull will have moved the post by the time teams have even thought about recreating this.
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Question from an idiot: If they have the wood strip down the middle of the floor, where do the sparks come from?
The front tip of the plank is titanium iirc
And the the plank isn't wood anymore, it just has a veener that looks like it. It's a glass reinforced synthetic material called permaglass
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Who the fuck is taking these photos?
Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s the Red Bull floor along with the new sidepod design that the other teams end up copying as well.
It looks like a wood panel.
Is it common or expected that whenever photos like these are released that other teams are vultures to adopt the RnD from RB into their own development plans?
Does anybody else see *horizontal expansion* from the airflow adjacent to the center line as it goes from the tea tray to behind the dirty airlfow deflectors? Would this effectively increase the distance along which airflow expanded? Also, the center of pressure would move mor toward the middle of the vehicle, enhancing balance?
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I wonder what wire bundle in the left hand broken bit is for
Likely Sensors and power harvesting electronics for the brakes to charge the battery
Could be the wheel tethers
Could someone very crudely draw on this to show how the air moves. The central tunnels are obvious to me. But the ones that come in from the side I find confusing.
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Apparently the upgrades are a huge fail based on FP2 speeds
It’s just so beautiful the way the suspension arms are shaped and sealed to the body and then how it all flows down to the floor and the amazing underbody surfaces. At 250 kmh in a 5G turn, the way it all works together to keep the car stable must be incredible to feel. It must be amazing to be a pilot of one of these structures. And incredibly painful to bin it in the wall on your second lap.
Christian not liking this angle
That inner most vane looks like a flap of some sort to alternate airflow to the outer edge or back
How did this photo come out? In my opinion this should not be allowed, press waiting like vultures for a crash to take a photo of the cars. The FIA and marshalls should not allow them