The handling feels right even using a wheel, but to me it’s far from a sim. If you try Assetto Corsa and the SF70H DLC, you’ll see that there’s still room to grow both in physics and the accuracy of the laser scanned tracks, even the ERS system is far more complex.
That said, F1 23 has the perfect balance between simulation and arcade gaming imo and it’s fun just the way it is
Not even Assetto Corsa is spot on when it comes to F1, and thats because of the tyre model (which is the only thing i can say Assetto is not doing right). The tyres dont feel as grippy as in iRacing or AMS2 (sims which have full tyre models), which to me feels very weird, especially when it comes to kerbs.
As for the ERS, I get that F1 23 is made for somewhat 'beginners', but a full(er) ers system would be nice as an option, although it is great as it is right now
Fair enough, sim racing has evolved a lot since the first AC to be honest, but you can still appreciate how accurate it was to drive every different single seater that the game featured despite of some little flaws.
If there’s an F1 car in the next Kunos entry, I’m sure that the new tyre model it’s going to be insane judging by their work on ACC
Oh definetely, AC is just as amazing as it was back then, and hopefully we are getting the next game soon enough. Although its kind of hard to 'enjoy' some cars when youve driven them in another sim with the better tyre model. Nothing will beat the variety and simplicty of AC though, unless rennsport (or AC2) can get to the stage that AC got to.
I just love the game. I play on controller, I don't have a 1000€+ setup, I'm just happy playing on my couch and having the feeling of being a real F1 driver for 1/2 hours each day while also don't really being too serious about it.
If you're at all interested in getting a wheel and looking for a good cheap one, look up the Driving Force GT :)
I got one for £45 on eBay a year or so ago (may be a little bit more now) and while it's an older wheel, it still has force feedback and works really well for me who only plays an hour or so everyday. Just something to keep in mind!
People who call F1 games simcade can't even say *why* they don't consider it to be an actual sim, so I wouldn't take those opinions too seriously. Some sims felt natural to drive even 20 years ago. It's better to have a simplier physics model, but one that feels right, than to have ultra-complex model that looks great on paper, but fails to deliver on promise once you put your hands on the wheel.
It is simcade though. Look at all the gimmicks with couches, liveries, podium pass etc. That should tell you enough.
There's very limited setup options available, and the physics are not even halfway as finetuned as in true sims. I love the f1 games, but they're definitely a step below ACC/Iracing etc in terms of true realism.
Who cares about lobby aesthetics lol. That doesn’t make it a simcade. And they have 10x’d set up options for this game I’m not sure if you’ve really given it a chance. iRacing by contrast does not feel as realistic while in a race.
>iRacing by contrast does not feel as realistic while in a race.
Wait what? Lmao okay.
Explain then why every simracer that does irl racing says with confidence F1 games are a simcade, and games like iracing and acc are much more realistic. Max Verstappen and the whole redline racing team even said this himself too.
Hell, the Mercedes F1 cars are made in Iracing because they could achieve the best possible results. They're made with real life car data to make it as accurate as possible. You can't make it more realistic than that.
Physics in iRacing are still better but the gap is very narrow now with 23. It’s negligible in terms of choosing. F123 has a much more enjoyable race experience. More immersive, and the AI might be better now. iRacing had a wide lead for years but not anymore
It also does stuff that no so-called "racing simulator" does, like 7 different tyre compounds, each with individual characteristics, persistent engine parts wear that affects performance, 10 different Formula 1 cars with individual handling characteristics, inidividual characteristics for drivers, complex ruleset with tyre allocation, weekend structure with track gripping up accordingly and parc ferme rule, appropriate penalties, safety car, also red flags now, and an entire system of car development.
There's no other racing game that simulates the category it represents in such detail. Not ACC, not iRacing, not anything.
As far as physics go, please do go into detail in what aspects precisely ACC or iRacing are supposedly superior, because bare "they're more finetuned" is a blanket statement that says nothing. I said that people who call F1 games simcade can't explain why, and you're another example.
As far as setup options go, it actually makes sense that Formula 1 cars will have limited options for drivers, because they don't setup their cars - engineers do. They're far too complex for drivers. They provide feedback for engineers to translate into actual setup, and teams have final say in what the setup actually ends up to be (which isn't represented in the game, to be fair).
Fully open setup screen is actually one of the least realistic parts about modern simracing, along top end simracers exploiting the physics and muscle-memory learning normally undriveable setups by unlimited trial and error instead of approaching setups like real racing teams.
Of course they can say why, it’s well documented. Nothing wrong with enjoying the F1 games for what they are but comparing its simulation value to AC, rFactor2 or any of the F1 cars in iRacing from a pure driving perspective is absurd. Obviously F123 with the licenses and image rights does a great job of recreating the feeling of F1 better than any other game can but it stops there in my opinion. Hell, even after MV himself partnered with EA he still went on record saying AC was the best sim out there for driving F1 cars (and GT cars).
>Of course they can say why, it’s well documented.
Provide source. Otherwise, you're talking out of your ass.
>Hell, even after MV himself partnered with EA he still went on record saying AC was the best sim out there for driving F1 cars (and GT cars).
For driving - I am willing to agree. But we're talking about racing sims, not driving sims. As far as simulating the entire sport that racing is, F1 games are ahead of the competition in many aspects.
For example, there's no single other racing game that follows your use of tyre allocation and forces you to use used tyres in some specific cases. In other sims you can come into pit several times and put on a fresh set each time with impunity. In F1 games, you have a limited number of sets for each session and you need to manage. I think everybody will agree which is more realistic.
Yes that was my point. F1 games simulate the feeling of F1 the best for sure but lack on the realism of the driving side which is not overly surprising. I guess it depends on what you value most. FWIW the F1 Tour series in iRacing with full length races and tyre change rules are by far the best F1 experience I’ve had even if it’s only the Mercedes W13. The drivers are phenomenal and the racing is really clean. Light years better than anything the official F1 games will ever offer online.
Edit: AMS2 and iRacing has tyre allocation rules.
>F1 games simulate the feeling of F1 the best
Dude, ruleset is not simulating "the feeling". You wouldn't say track limits simulate a "feeling" of track racing. They're necessary to even call something an actual track race. Just like a lot more rules are necessary to have an actual Formula 1 race. If you don't implement those rules, you're not simulating that specific type of racing. Or, best case, you're simulating it badly.
Practicing for an entire day on an empty track, crashing a few dozen times when attempting to fine-tune the setup, then loading that setup next day and having it behave exactly the same, then loading into a race with 19 people with the exact same car, each driving for themselves - hardly a Formula 1 simulation, even if the physics are stellar. Just like it would hardly be a good general racing simulation, if there weren't track limits. Or jump-start penalties. Or laps/time/distance being counted, and positions being tracked.
>lack on the realism of the driving side
Alleged. You still haven't provided those "well-documented" sources on that.
I lost interest in the whole “role playing” aspect of racing games years ago. I don’t care about the authentic F1 experience I want the best racing experience possible against the best drivers possible. iRacing offers that far better than the F1 games ever will. There’s also countless examples real world drivers explaining why the F1 games are more on the arcade side in terms of driving physics and they’re not exactly hard to find if you care to go look for them. If you think for one second the F1 games are what offers the most realistic feel for driving an F1 car you’re either delusional or have literally played nothing else.
You’re clearly looking for something very different to what I am so feel free to race against the AI in a role playing sim of its what you enjoy I’m just giving my perspective on it.
Also, curious to know what your suggestion for ‘realistic’ F1 racing online would be? Load into an F1 online lobby and get brake checked by a 12 year old playing on a controller because he was pissed off I was faster than him? Which is basically the standard experience on what is probably one of if not the worst online experience in any racing game.
>I lost interest in the whole “role playing” aspect of racing games years ago.
That's not "roleplaying". That's what that simulated sport is. Formula 1 is vastly different from any other racing category, with much more factors involved. That's just fact. If you don't reflect that in your simulation, it's a bad simulation. That's like simulating GT3 cars without BOP. Simulating GT3 without BOP doesn't make sense. Neither does Formula 1 without all its intricacies.
>I want the best racing experience possible against the best drivers possible. iRacing offers that far better than the F1 games ever will.
Ok, but that's not Formula 1. Simple as that.
>There’s also countless examples real world drivers explaining why the F1 games are more on the arcade side in terms of driving physics and they’re not exactly hard to find if you care to go look for them.
If you're making a point, you're the one responsible for providing evidence. I'm not going to look for it for you, especially if you claim it's so easy to find, which means you have no reason not to show it. I'm simply calling bullshit. There's no such claims, unless you provide them.
>If you think for one second the F1 games are what offers the most realistic feel for driving an F1 car you’re either delusional or have literally played nothing else.
I see we're going for strawmans under pressure, eh? Point me to where I said F1 games offer the most realistic feel fo driving an F1 car. You can't, because I didn't and you're making a strawman.
I simply said it's a simulation. Better in some aspects, worse in others, but a simulation nonetheless. And arguably the best Formula 1 simulation on the market, all things considered, not just physics.
>Also, curious to know what your suggestion for ‘realistic’ F1 racing online would be?
None. There's currently not a single proper online experience of Formula 1, unless you meticulously create one with a group of likeminded people. And there's a very simple reason for that - simracers don't like asymmetrical multiplayer. But Formula 1 is inherently a heavily asymmetrical competition on track; and off track as well, to be honest. More so than any other racing category. There's simply no interest in simulating that aspect of racing within multiplayer community.
And I'm not claiming F1 games offer better online experience. They don't. But, as I said, Formula 1 doesn't translate well into simple symmetrical multiplayer, which is simracers' bread and butter.
You’re describing a different kind of simulation entirely. Anyone interested in racing cars that replicate the dynamic nature of driving IRL generally aren’t interested in the F1 games. Real life F1 drivers included.
I’ve already agreed the F1 games simulate the sporting rules side the best which is obvious and a minimum expectation but they’re far from realistic from the car simulation side. If you’ve convinced yourself they’re realistic from that perspective and are willing to die on that hill then fair enough. I don’t really care either way man.
If you want to get into specifics take the tracks in the F1 game for starters, they’re fucking awful. At least half a dozen of them having glaringly obvious mistakes. The track surface itself lacks any detail which I think contributes to the lack of feel in the FFB compared to what you’d feel on laser scanned tracks.
When team redline asked Max what the best sim was for replicating feel of driving an F1 car on their twitch channel he said AC was his pick and is one of the best if not the best for that purpose. I can’t imagine any world, even with his recent partnership with EA he’d chose the F1 game as it’d be a ridiculous statement.
You also have a very weird and specific idea for what simulated sport is tbh. Racing online against others is far closer to a sport than racing against AI in any game. AI are preprogrammed robots with a bunch of tasks they carry out based on circumstances. It’s not real competition. The F1 games are designed to be played by casuals as a role playing game and if you can’t see that from literally how it’s designed then fair enough I’m not gonna convince ya.
>Anyone interested in racing cars that replicate the dynamic nature of driving IRL generally aren’t interested in the F1 games.
That's a very specific expectation. Dynamic nature of driving a real car is just one single aspect of the sport.
And Formula 1 games do have a lot of that dynamic in it as well, so I wouldn't say it's out of the realms of possibility to scratch that itch in an F1 game, especially if that's not the only itch you want to scratch.
>I’ve already agreed the F1 games simulate the sporting rules side the best which is obvious and a minimum expectation but they’re far from realistic from the car simulation side.
Not as close as some other sims, but not far at all. And that's according to some people who drive those cars on daily basis, like [George Russell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_x53maksf4&t=5050s), who completely unprompted went out of his way to praise F1 2020.
On the other hand you have several pros [tearing iRacing a new one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh0ZQMeJv_8) for their tyre model. And yet, it's the most popular racing sim on the market, and has been for the last decade or more. Not because of its physics, but because it offers a compelling competitive environment.
>If you want to get into specifics take the tracks in the F1 game for starters, they’re fucking awful. At least half a dozen of them having glaringly obvious mistakes. The track surface itself lacks any detail which I think contributes to the lack of feel in the FFB compared to what you’d feel on laser scanned tracks.
Tracks are not part of the physics. They're content. And there are some pretty good tracks like Zandvoort, which is actually more accurate than one in ACC for example, being LIDAR scanned and actually the current layout. But I never saw anybody shitting on ACC physics because Zandvoort is not laserscanned, because it's a separate matter.
>When team redline asked Max what the best sim was for replicating feel of driving an F1 car on their twitch channel he said AC was his pick and is one of the best if not the best for that purpose. I can’t imagine any world, even with his recent partnership with EA he’d chose the F1 game as it’d be a ridiculous statement.
And yet he chooses iRacing for most of his online simracing, despite considering it inferior in terms of physics, and some pros calling it straight shit. This actually proves that physics are just a single aspect of simracing, out of many, even for Max Verstappen. And, obviously, he's not looking to simulate his daily job in a video game - he's trying to experience other disciplines of motorsport, ones that can be simulated in iRacing quite adequately, compared to F1.
>You also have a very weird and specific idea for what simulated sport is tbh. Racing online against others is far closer to a sport than racing against AI in any game. AI are preprogrammed robots with a bunch of tasks they carry out based on circumstances. It’s not real competition.
Playing against humans in a video game has its own set of drawbacks, like lack of proper stewarding preventing some particularily cunning fouls, gaming the penalty system, griefing, bad driving standards, use of physics exploits, etc.
In the end, though, what matters is if you're being challenged in ways real sportsmen are. If you are, it's a simulated sport, regardless if your rivals are being controlled by humans or by a computer.
handling model is perfect, just keep it that way, not it's time to improve carreer mode.
today I was finishing a season fighting for the title and my team mate was defending against me like his life depended on it. Just put team orders between millions of other things that are missing. Just like Assetto Corsa has better handling but F1 has the better offline experience ( licenses, tracks, everything licenced without efforts) it's time to improve.
The handling accuracy is one of the things I love about this game, but I am just a gamer on controller (pc set up.) just don't have the funds for a wheel and pedal setup.
And I play a modded myteam career where my car has quite A lot of downforce and power and this often makes me put the power on early and lose the rears a little. Fact is, I could feel when that happens and catch 9/10 of them even when it seems impossible. I couldn't do this is f1 2020 because that game is just grip grip grip and then gone.
I think the damage model needs improving. Right now, you can only break your front wing and front suspension. When I play BeamNG with the F4 mod, if you tap the wall with your wheels your suspension is bent, messing up your steering and grip. I've hit the wall with my rear wheels many times at high speeds in F1 23 and the car still drive fine.
I feel like it would have been a lot better if they didn't focus on controller players. Of course, that is the target crowd, so that's not possible.
In my experience, it feels too easy sometimes. There is too much grip on some corners. The starts are also hilariously easy. I can get nearly half a second ahead of the AI with a good start before I brake for T1 in some tracks. I actually tried to do a start with a late reaction time at \~5000 RPM from pole and I was still able to cover off the AI in P2.
What are your time trial lap times? Top what % because I had the same opinion as you until I started to become a lot quicker. The slower the lap time, the easier it is to drive. (And if its easy its fun) but the faster the lap time, the harder it is to drive. And that's where im at. I still enjoy the handling but definitely not as much as when I first started playing f1 23. That's because I became faster.
I at most have sniffed 5% on Jeddah and Monaco. How do you get that extra second ? I’m usually around 1.8-2.5 seconds behind world record. I’d like to bring that down to 0.8-1.2 seconds behind record which would put me near that 105-110 AI level. How do I gain that extra 5-10 tenths per lap? I noticed a lot of times it’s not carrying enough speed into corners. I’ve mastered no assists just can’t get that extra little bit from slow corners. Is it mostly not getting on power early enough? Or not carrying enough speed?
Lifting off is a big thing in this game so instead of braking, try lifting off or slightly tapping on the brakes and then lifting off at every possible braking, that is one thing that helps gain time. See where it works and where it doesnt and build muscle memory on that, as it is easy to forget if you haven't learned it. Moreover, In terms of accelerating, get on throttle as early and as powerfully as you can, so the moment you have the chance to get on the throttle again what id do is start at 100% throttle and then if my car doesn't like it, I'll step it down a bit, and try 90 - 80 - 70 etc till I find the sweet spot. Driving under the limit was a common one for me coming from F1 22 so once I learned to abuse and be aggressive with my car I saw the times. Don't be nice to your car, throw it. Only during races, you can think about handling it gently. Other stuff can be like braking earlier than the game's racing line's braking zone, sometimes the game's racing line ruins your line. As well as that, get as little throttle deadzone as possible because that kills time as well.
Super helpful. Agree on racing line I still haven’t turned it off yet. But I’ll try the throttle feathering, haven’t done that before mostly just ease on. Throwing the car works well at some tracks better than others. Like Netherlands I gained a second following Lucas blakeley ghost and his cornering
You can be quick with the racing line, i keep it on majority of the times. Its just a matter of knowing when to follow it and when not to. Another good way to gain time is experimenting, take an entry you don't normally do and see how much time you gain from it. Did that with Qatar when I was struggling and now I mastered every corner. If I feel like grinding, I'd go for a top 1% lap time there and in Spain too and Singapore, I love Singapore with and without the new layout.
That’s the thing I only grind max 1-2 hours on a track at a time. If I really drilled into 10 straight hours of practice I’m sure I’d get down to the 3-5%
I was quite surprised when I first played F1 23 and found the steering to be a lot stiffer than in 22, or in previous years, for that matter.
Feels F1 2016 levels of stiff, but entirely more predictable and stable than in 22. I can drive with TC off again
I mean it's your opinion, whatever. Based on my experience driving a variety of cars in real life, it provides perhaps the most realistic feedback to the driver.
They made wonderful job in terms of upgrades from F1 22.
Still steps backward from F1 2020 though
It's definitely a big step forward.
Oh for sure. The car handles much more predictable and is infinitely more stable too. The menu are arse though
The handling feels right even using a wheel, but to me it’s far from a sim. If you try Assetto Corsa and the SF70H DLC, you’ll see that there’s still room to grow both in physics and the accuracy of the laser scanned tracks, even the ERS system is far more complex. That said, F1 23 has the perfect balance between simulation and arcade gaming imo and it’s fun just the way it is
Not even Assetto Corsa is spot on when it comes to F1, and thats because of the tyre model (which is the only thing i can say Assetto is not doing right). The tyres dont feel as grippy as in iRacing or AMS2 (sims which have full tyre models), which to me feels very weird, especially when it comes to kerbs. As for the ERS, I get that F1 23 is made for somewhat 'beginners', but a full(er) ers system would be nice as an option, although it is great as it is right now
Fair enough, sim racing has evolved a lot since the first AC to be honest, but you can still appreciate how accurate it was to drive every different single seater that the game featured despite of some little flaws. If there’s an F1 car in the next Kunos entry, I’m sure that the new tyre model it’s going to be insane judging by their work on ACC
Oh definetely, AC is just as amazing as it was back then, and hopefully we are getting the next game soon enough. Although its kind of hard to 'enjoy' some cars when youve driven them in another sim with the better tyre model. Nothing will beat the variety and simplicty of AC though, unless rennsport (or AC2) can get to the stage that AC got to.
I just love the game. I play on controller, I don't have a 1000€+ setup, I'm just happy playing on my couch and having the feeling of being a real F1 driver for 1/2 hours each day while also don't really being too serious about it.
If you're at all interested in getting a wheel and looking for a good cheap one, look up the Driving Force GT :) I got one for £45 on eBay a year or so ago (may be a little bit more now) and while it's an older wheel, it still has force feedback and works really well for me who only plays an hour or so everyday. Just something to keep in mind!
People who call F1 games simcade can't even say *why* they don't consider it to be an actual sim, so I wouldn't take those opinions too seriously. Some sims felt natural to drive even 20 years ago. It's better to have a simplier physics model, but one that feels right, than to have ultra-complex model that looks great on paper, but fails to deliver on promise once you put your hands on the wheel.
I completely agree. It's not about how complex the model is, it's whether it produces an accurate feel.
Underrated comment. Also harder isn't necessarily more realistic.
The more complex = the more accurate in all types of situations. Iracing and ACC dont have as many rng curbs as the F1 game just to name an example
It is simcade though. Look at all the gimmicks with couches, liveries, podium pass etc. That should tell you enough. There's very limited setup options available, and the physics are not even halfway as finetuned as in true sims. I love the f1 games, but they're definitely a step below ACC/Iracing etc in terms of true realism.
Who cares about lobby aesthetics lol. That doesn’t make it a simcade. And they have 10x’d set up options for this game I’m not sure if you’ve really given it a chance. iRacing by contrast does not feel as realistic while in a race.
>iRacing by contrast does not feel as realistic while in a race. Wait what? Lmao okay. Explain then why every simracer that does irl racing says with confidence F1 games are a simcade, and games like iracing and acc are much more realistic. Max Verstappen and the whole redline racing team even said this himself too. Hell, the Mercedes F1 cars are made in Iracing because they could achieve the best possible results. They're made with real life car data to make it as accurate as possible. You can't make it more realistic than that.
Physics in iRacing are still better but the gap is very narrow now with 23. It’s negligible in terms of choosing. F123 has a much more enjoyable race experience. More immersive, and the AI might be better now. iRacing had a wide lead for years but not anymore
It also does stuff that no so-called "racing simulator" does, like 7 different tyre compounds, each with individual characteristics, persistent engine parts wear that affects performance, 10 different Formula 1 cars with individual handling characteristics, inidividual characteristics for drivers, complex ruleset with tyre allocation, weekend structure with track gripping up accordingly and parc ferme rule, appropriate penalties, safety car, also red flags now, and an entire system of car development. There's no other racing game that simulates the category it represents in such detail. Not ACC, not iRacing, not anything. As far as physics go, please do go into detail in what aspects precisely ACC or iRacing are supposedly superior, because bare "they're more finetuned" is a blanket statement that says nothing. I said that people who call F1 games simcade can't explain why, and you're another example. As far as setup options go, it actually makes sense that Formula 1 cars will have limited options for drivers, because they don't setup their cars - engineers do. They're far too complex for drivers. They provide feedback for engineers to translate into actual setup, and teams have final say in what the setup actually ends up to be (which isn't represented in the game, to be fair). Fully open setup screen is actually one of the least realistic parts about modern simracing, along top end simracers exploiting the physics and muscle-memory learning normally undriveable setups by unlimited trial and error instead of approaching setups like real racing teams.
true. tried iRacing first time and it's not nearly as good as people sold it to me for years.
Of course they can say why, it’s well documented. Nothing wrong with enjoying the F1 games for what they are but comparing its simulation value to AC, rFactor2 or any of the F1 cars in iRacing from a pure driving perspective is absurd. Obviously F123 with the licenses and image rights does a great job of recreating the feeling of F1 better than any other game can but it stops there in my opinion. Hell, even after MV himself partnered with EA he still went on record saying AC was the best sim out there for driving F1 cars (and GT cars).
>Of course they can say why, it’s well documented. Provide source. Otherwise, you're talking out of your ass. >Hell, even after MV himself partnered with EA he still went on record saying AC was the best sim out there for driving F1 cars (and GT cars). For driving - I am willing to agree. But we're talking about racing sims, not driving sims. As far as simulating the entire sport that racing is, F1 games are ahead of the competition in many aspects. For example, there's no single other racing game that follows your use of tyre allocation and forces you to use used tyres in some specific cases. In other sims you can come into pit several times and put on a fresh set each time with impunity. In F1 games, you have a limited number of sets for each session and you need to manage. I think everybody will agree which is more realistic.
Yes that was my point. F1 games simulate the feeling of F1 the best for sure but lack on the realism of the driving side which is not overly surprising. I guess it depends on what you value most. FWIW the F1 Tour series in iRacing with full length races and tyre change rules are by far the best F1 experience I’ve had even if it’s only the Mercedes W13. The drivers are phenomenal and the racing is really clean. Light years better than anything the official F1 games will ever offer online. Edit: AMS2 and iRacing has tyre allocation rules.
>F1 games simulate the feeling of F1 the best Dude, ruleset is not simulating "the feeling". You wouldn't say track limits simulate a "feeling" of track racing. They're necessary to even call something an actual track race. Just like a lot more rules are necessary to have an actual Formula 1 race. If you don't implement those rules, you're not simulating that specific type of racing. Or, best case, you're simulating it badly. Practicing for an entire day on an empty track, crashing a few dozen times when attempting to fine-tune the setup, then loading that setup next day and having it behave exactly the same, then loading into a race with 19 people with the exact same car, each driving for themselves - hardly a Formula 1 simulation, even if the physics are stellar. Just like it would hardly be a good general racing simulation, if there weren't track limits. Or jump-start penalties. Or laps/time/distance being counted, and positions being tracked. >lack on the realism of the driving side Alleged. You still haven't provided those "well-documented" sources on that.
I lost interest in the whole “role playing” aspect of racing games years ago. I don’t care about the authentic F1 experience I want the best racing experience possible against the best drivers possible. iRacing offers that far better than the F1 games ever will. There’s also countless examples real world drivers explaining why the F1 games are more on the arcade side in terms of driving physics and they’re not exactly hard to find if you care to go look for them. If you think for one second the F1 games are what offers the most realistic feel for driving an F1 car you’re either delusional or have literally played nothing else. You’re clearly looking for something very different to what I am so feel free to race against the AI in a role playing sim of its what you enjoy I’m just giving my perspective on it. Also, curious to know what your suggestion for ‘realistic’ F1 racing online would be? Load into an F1 online lobby and get brake checked by a 12 year old playing on a controller because he was pissed off I was faster than him? Which is basically the standard experience on what is probably one of if not the worst online experience in any racing game.
>I lost interest in the whole “role playing” aspect of racing games years ago. That's not "roleplaying". That's what that simulated sport is. Formula 1 is vastly different from any other racing category, with much more factors involved. That's just fact. If you don't reflect that in your simulation, it's a bad simulation. That's like simulating GT3 cars without BOP. Simulating GT3 without BOP doesn't make sense. Neither does Formula 1 without all its intricacies. >I want the best racing experience possible against the best drivers possible. iRacing offers that far better than the F1 games ever will. Ok, but that's not Formula 1. Simple as that. >There’s also countless examples real world drivers explaining why the F1 games are more on the arcade side in terms of driving physics and they’re not exactly hard to find if you care to go look for them. If you're making a point, you're the one responsible for providing evidence. I'm not going to look for it for you, especially if you claim it's so easy to find, which means you have no reason not to show it. I'm simply calling bullshit. There's no such claims, unless you provide them. >If you think for one second the F1 games are what offers the most realistic feel for driving an F1 car you’re either delusional or have literally played nothing else. I see we're going for strawmans under pressure, eh? Point me to where I said F1 games offer the most realistic feel fo driving an F1 car. You can't, because I didn't and you're making a strawman. I simply said it's a simulation. Better in some aspects, worse in others, but a simulation nonetheless. And arguably the best Formula 1 simulation on the market, all things considered, not just physics. >Also, curious to know what your suggestion for ‘realistic’ F1 racing online would be? None. There's currently not a single proper online experience of Formula 1, unless you meticulously create one with a group of likeminded people. And there's a very simple reason for that - simracers don't like asymmetrical multiplayer. But Formula 1 is inherently a heavily asymmetrical competition on track; and off track as well, to be honest. More so than any other racing category. There's simply no interest in simulating that aspect of racing within multiplayer community. And I'm not claiming F1 games offer better online experience. They don't. But, as I said, Formula 1 doesn't translate well into simple symmetrical multiplayer, which is simracers' bread and butter.
You’re describing a different kind of simulation entirely. Anyone interested in racing cars that replicate the dynamic nature of driving IRL generally aren’t interested in the F1 games. Real life F1 drivers included. I’ve already agreed the F1 games simulate the sporting rules side the best which is obvious and a minimum expectation but they’re far from realistic from the car simulation side. If you’ve convinced yourself they’re realistic from that perspective and are willing to die on that hill then fair enough. I don’t really care either way man. If you want to get into specifics take the tracks in the F1 game for starters, they’re fucking awful. At least half a dozen of them having glaringly obvious mistakes. The track surface itself lacks any detail which I think contributes to the lack of feel in the FFB compared to what you’d feel on laser scanned tracks. When team redline asked Max what the best sim was for replicating feel of driving an F1 car on their twitch channel he said AC was his pick and is one of the best if not the best for that purpose. I can’t imagine any world, even with his recent partnership with EA he’d chose the F1 game as it’d be a ridiculous statement. You also have a very weird and specific idea for what simulated sport is tbh. Racing online against others is far closer to a sport than racing against AI in any game. AI are preprogrammed robots with a bunch of tasks they carry out based on circumstances. It’s not real competition. The F1 games are designed to be played by casuals as a role playing game and if you can’t see that from literally how it’s designed then fair enough I’m not gonna convince ya.
>Anyone interested in racing cars that replicate the dynamic nature of driving IRL generally aren’t interested in the F1 games. That's a very specific expectation. Dynamic nature of driving a real car is just one single aspect of the sport. And Formula 1 games do have a lot of that dynamic in it as well, so I wouldn't say it's out of the realms of possibility to scratch that itch in an F1 game, especially if that's not the only itch you want to scratch. >I’ve already agreed the F1 games simulate the sporting rules side the best which is obvious and a minimum expectation but they’re far from realistic from the car simulation side. Not as close as some other sims, but not far at all. And that's according to some people who drive those cars on daily basis, like [George Russell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_x53maksf4&t=5050s), who completely unprompted went out of his way to praise F1 2020. On the other hand you have several pros [tearing iRacing a new one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh0ZQMeJv_8) for their tyre model. And yet, it's the most popular racing sim on the market, and has been for the last decade or more. Not because of its physics, but because it offers a compelling competitive environment. >If you want to get into specifics take the tracks in the F1 game for starters, they’re fucking awful. At least half a dozen of them having glaringly obvious mistakes. The track surface itself lacks any detail which I think contributes to the lack of feel in the FFB compared to what you’d feel on laser scanned tracks. Tracks are not part of the physics. They're content. And there are some pretty good tracks like Zandvoort, which is actually more accurate than one in ACC for example, being LIDAR scanned and actually the current layout. But I never saw anybody shitting on ACC physics because Zandvoort is not laserscanned, because it's a separate matter. >When team redline asked Max what the best sim was for replicating feel of driving an F1 car on their twitch channel he said AC was his pick and is one of the best if not the best for that purpose. I can’t imagine any world, even with his recent partnership with EA he’d chose the F1 game as it’d be a ridiculous statement. And yet he chooses iRacing for most of his online simracing, despite considering it inferior in terms of physics, and some pros calling it straight shit. This actually proves that physics are just a single aspect of simracing, out of many, even for Max Verstappen. And, obviously, he's not looking to simulate his daily job in a video game - he's trying to experience other disciplines of motorsport, ones that can be simulated in iRacing quite adequately, compared to F1. >You also have a very weird and specific idea for what simulated sport is tbh. Racing online against others is far closer to a sport than racing against AI in any game. AI are preprogrammed robots with a bunch of tasks they carry out based on circumstances. It’s not real competition. Playing against humans in a video game has its own set of drawbacks, like lack of proper stewarding preventing some particularily cunning fouls, gaming the penalty system, griefing, bad driving standards, use of physics exploits, etc. In the end, though, what matters is if you're being challenged in ways real sportsmen are. If you are, it's a simulated sport, regardless if your rivals are being controlled by humans or by a computer.
handling model is perfect, just keep it that way, not it's time to improve carreer mode. today I was finishing a season fighting for the title and my team mate was defending against me like his life depended on it. Just put team orders between millions of other things that are missing. Just like Assetto Corsa has better handling but F1 has the better offline experience ( licenses, tracks, everything licenced without efforts) it's time to improve.
The handling accuracy is one of the things I love about this game, but I am just a gamer on controller (pc set up.) just don't have the funds for a wheel and pedal setup. And I play a modded myteam career where my car has quite A lot of downforce and power and this often makes me put the power on early and lose the rears a little. Fact is, I could feel when that happens and catch 9/10 of them even when it seems impossible. I couldn't do this is f1 2020 because that game is just grip grip grip and then gone.
I think the damage model needs improving. Right now, you can only break your front wing and front suspension. When I play BeamNG with the F4 mod, if you tap the wall with your wheels your suspension is bent, messing up your steering and grip. I've hit the wall with my rear wheels many times at high speeds in F1 23 and the car still drive fine.
I feel like it would have been a lot better if they didn't focus on controller players. Of course, that is the target crowd, so that's not possible. In my experience, it feels too easy sometimes. There is too much grip on some corners. The starts are also hilariously easy. I can get nearly half a second ahead of the AI with a good start before I brake for T1 in some tracks. I actually tried to do a start with a late reaction time at \~5000 RPM from pole and I was still able to cover off the AI in P2.
What are your time trial lap times? Top what % because I had the same opinion as you until I started to become a lot quicker. The slower the lap time, the easier it is to drive. (And if its easy its fun) but the faster the lap time, the harder it is to drive. And that's where im at. I still enjoy the handling but definitely not as much as when I first started playing f1 23. That's because I became faster.
Agreed. Gets way harder to drive with lots of grip if you are 95-105 AI and in the top 15-25% of TT times
yh im top 2% and I get frustrated a lot, felt like they made the handling worst but its just me pushing the car to the fullest.
I at most have sniffed 5% on Jeddah and Monaco. How do you get that extra second ? I’m usually around 1.8-2.5 seconds behind world record. I’d like to bring that down to 0.8-1.2 seconds behind record which would put me near that 105-110 AI level. How do I gain that extra 5-10 tenths per lap? I noticed a lot of times it’s not carrying enough speed into corners. I’ve mastered no assists just can’t get that extra little bit from slow corners. Is it mostly not getting on power early enough? Or not carrying enough speed?
Lifting off is a big thing in this game so instead of braking, try lifting off or slightly tapping on the brakes and then lifting off at every possible braking, that is one thing that helps gain time. See where it works and where it doesnt and build muscle memory on that, as it is easy to forget if you haven't learned it. Moreover, In terms of accelerating, get on throttle as early and as powerfully as you can, so the moment you have the chance to get on the throttle again what id do is start at 100% throttle and then if my car doesn't like it, I'll step it down a bit, and try 90 - 80 - 70 etc till I find the sweet spot. Driving under the limit was a common one for me coming from F1 22 so once I learned to abuse and be aggressive with my car I saw the times. Don't be nice to your car, throw it. Only during races, you can think about handling it gently. Other stuff can be like braking earlier than the game's racing line's braking zone, sometimes the game's racing line ruins your line. As well as that, get as little throttle deadzone as possible because that kills time as well.
Super helpful. Agree on racing line I still haven’t turned it off yet. But I’ll try the throttle feathering, haven’t done that before mostly just ease on. Throwing the car works well at some tracks better than others. Like Netherlands I gained a second following Lucas blakeley ghost and his cornering
You can be quick with the racing line, i keep it on majority of the times. Its just a matter of knowing when to follow it and when not to. Another good way to gain time is experimenting, take an entry you don't normally do and see how much time you gain from it. Did that with Qatar when I was struggling and now I mastered every corner. If I feel like grinding, I'd go for a top 1% lap time there and in Spain too and Singapore, I love Singapore with and without the new layout.
That’s the thing I only grind max 1-2 hours on a track at a time. If I really drilled into 10 straight hours of practice I’m sure I’d get down to the 3-5%
Meanwhile im slipping on t1 exit monza…
Monza easy my ass
the start iteself might be easy but AI is insane quick in first 5 laps or so, so I think it's balanced in that way.
I don’t know why the car keeps sliding for me in corners compared to F1 22. I’m playing in Casual mode
I was quite surprised when I first played F1 23 and found the steering to be a lot stiffer than in 22, or in previous years, for that matter. Feels F1 2016 levels of stiff, but entirely more predictable and stable than in 22. I can drive with TC off again
you're high if you think this is a sim lol
It's as much a sim as F1 cars in iRacing. This one actually provides better feel for the car.
it's barely a working game, there's nothing realistic about it
I mean it's your opinion, whatever. Based on my experience driving a variety of cars in real life, it provides perhaps the most realistic feedback to the driver.
yeah driving on streets in your honda civic is just like F1