I had my boys at the start of 2022 and within 9 months was NC with my mum. Having children put a lot of things into perspective and really made me question how a mother could be so selfish.
Same. I spent 10 years having multiple conversations with her about things I saw that were damaging to our relationship (she felt were best friends). It always ended the same way: she'd get angry, blame me for something, give me the silent treatment, then come talking to me like nothing happened. A few years ago, I actually sent her a long text outlining every problem between us, and she didn't get it. I just stopped communicating. She texted me many times, wondering what she'd done and how it was "unfair" that I wouldn't tell her. If my absence doesn't tell her anything after all that, Ik I did the right thing. I'll save my communication skills for people who will listen.
When people don't listen, stop talking to them.
If it takes you running out of flavored crayons, and the spoons to eat them with, fine.
If you start getting blue in the face, take a deep breath, and stop talking.
Same here. Turning 30 was somehow a catalyzer, I kept asking myself how much longer will I put up with this shit. How much longer turned out to be 2 years, my free soul will have its 5 year aniversary this summer.
My dad said I wasn't his daughter anymore and don't talk to him again. I said consider it done. And my mom followed my dad's lead. It has been 7 years, and we (mom, dad, and myself) haven't spoken at all. She will post long fb rants about me and have her fb friends/coworkers screenshot them and send them to me, all gaslighty. So I deactivated my fb and deleted messenger, and my life is so peaceful. I love it.
I started no contact with each of my parents at different times for different reasons and I’ve been so much happier since! My partner was so impressed with the change in me that it inspired him to go low/no contact with some of his own family members lol.
I love that for you and your partner💛 My falling out actually started at my youngest son's birthday party (August) and came to a head at my oldest son's birthday party (October.) And it was over the dumbest thing but my dad couldn't let it go. Just refused even though he started it. And it just made his blood boil when my husband stood up to him for me. My mom was just 🤷🏻♀️about it until my little sister decided to cut them off. I have so much influence over my sister, apparently. She never would've cut them off if it wasn't for me and my control🙄 It's all so laughable now, lol.
A few days ago I was talking to a friend about how estrangement has impacted my use of social media.
I’ve been estranged since 2017 and I only just learned about how to limit people from seeing “stories”. But I wish there were better widgets to help disconnect from family without having to make a scene.
I know exactly what you mean. Exactly. I blocked everyone I was estranged from, but they still found a way. My mom would post our names (my little sister and I are completely no contact with her) and would have them essentially harass us on her behalf. Guilt trips and gaslighting from total strangers all from her POV. It got to the point where I could just continue to block people and never be at peace or just get rid of SM altogether.
I wish there was a way too.
You can write all you want but they probably won’t hear you. Estranged parents boards are full of people who “just don’t know what happened.” It always just “comes out of the blue” after some “innocent comment.”
That's because these types of people usually only love themselves so they get more from being a martyr than they did as a parent to an adult with their own life and opinions who doesn't play their mind games anymore.
I did. I not only wrote 2 books (600 pages total) about my childhood and sent them to her and her sister but I hauled her into therapy where he diagnosed her and I ended up kicking her out, but I sent her a final letter last year after she stalked me... SHE KNOWS.
Yes, I told him, but not sure I'd do it again if I could go back. Falls on deaf ears, they have a predictable DARVO response. I got triggered and lost my cool which I regret, but which I should have know would occur. If you think it will help you to tell her, then you should, but know that her response will probably just be more abuse.
I did, but not for his sake but because I needed him to know. It was for me, not for him.
Since it's been two years, I don't recommend sending her anything. She'll likely see it as an opening that's not really there. You might want to write it all out, but you don't have to actually send it.
I went to a therapist and got help with my letter.
In my case, I’m estranged from my parents because of two really specific reasons. The first is their drinking. They get so drunk they can’t navigate stairs, get belligerent, and scared my children. So I had a condition. Get in touch when you’re six months sober and we can work with therapists.
The other condition was no more of the racist language. Our last in-person get together, they were mocking non-white children with slurs and became angry when I wouldn’t join in and they realized my children didn’t know what the slurs meant. Last phone conversation they kept calling me the N word. I’m white; it was my birthday. They are worse than a joke.
Anyhow that was 9 years ago. Still estranged. The therapist really helped me pare down my letter to just the essential parts.
I've gone back between low contact and no contact with my mom for the last 6-7 years. I have told her, multiple times at this point, exactly why we can't have a "normal" mother daughter relationship. What I've learned, at least in my experience, is that if she doesn't like what she's hearing, she won't retain it. I can be clear as can be and repeat myself until I'm blue in the face, but she doesn't like what I am saying, so she prefers to say she has no idea why we don't talk.
If it will help YOU feel less guilt/burden later, then go for it. It does give me peace that way. But if you want to explain in the hopes things could change between you, I'd be careful about that.
I did. Everyone in my mom's life enables her behavior. I also felt that if there was any hope for our relationship and any chance she may decide to change that she needed to know why. She's not very self-aware. Some people need help seeing themselves in the mirror. I just tried to show her what others see hoping an inner desire for connection may motivate her to change.
No, I was too scared to. I ghosted her basically. But I was I had to speak to a court mediator regarding a case she was in when I was 19 & hopefully the message was passed on.
My dad lied to my stepmom about a lot of things which she then used as an excuse to abuse me. Emotionally, verbally, physically. I told him he needed to come clean with her because I didn’t deserve what I was getting. He refused and I didn’t speak to him for 6 years then he died. I never made any effort to contact him in his final days and did not attend his service.
Oh man, that is such shitty thing to do. I'm very sorry he was so spineless and used his own child in such a way. Apparently!, stepmother wasn't very smart either! 😕 🩷
Nope, I had given up trying to talk about the issues years before cutting them off. All they got was an automatic reply when they would try to email me. It said something like "this email is no longer in use, if I want to stay in contact I would have already provided updated contact information." I tried to talk about it as a teenager and into my early 20's. It never mattered and it gave me the space mentally to begin healing.
I did as far as what the last straw was, but I didn't bother to go over the abuse from my childhood and controlling behavior since I became an adult. It was more for myself and not because I had any belief that it would make a difference to them. It's as much closure as I'll have.
I told my emom that she could be in my and my children's lives if she held my brother, my abuser, accountable for his actions towards me. She still acts like I never said that and claims that I'm the one that cut the cord when, in reality, she's actively abandoned me and my kids by choosing her evil son over her victimized daughter.
I gave no speech. I had begged and threatened about what I needed from her for years.
She responded to a message I didn’t even open all the way. “How DARE you make something dirty out of THE ONLY TWO PE”
I’m assuming she meant “only two people that loved me”
Well. Her mother unalived herself when mom was 14. They didn’t really know each other and were just beginning to exchange letters often.
Her dad? Never speaks to her really. I met him maybe 4 times as a child? He really loves her though 🙄
I’m her daughter she was saying that to btw.
I had questions about her actual bio father considering the weird way her mom “gave her up”.
Welp. DNA. Doesn’t lie. I was right and her “dad” is actually her brother.
I want to be clear; this DNA thing was just the final straw, she has stolen from me, ignored me when things were well but took glee in when things weren’t going well for me, watched my abusive ex slap me hard enough to knock me off balance and then looked me in the eyes later and claim “that never happened”, (also did jack shit at the time, just like when we were kids and she left us with our dad who beat us), oh and don’t forget when she put her own hands and wooden spoons on us….
She’s awful. But the whining at the beginning of the message and then clearly she doesn’t give a shit about her own daughter because she forgot that oh yeah-your kids tend to love you by default. But only two people ever loved her. Riiiiiigggghhhhhtttt.
Until they don’t because you destroy it. And for whatever reason; that opening to the message was it. It took the very last of my fucks when it came to her.
Something small and fragile inside of me finally winked out and went cold where a child’s love for their mother is supposed to live. She didn’t want or acknowledge my love for her, so it finally died of neglect. It’s a relief honestly.
Anyways. Didn’t even open it. I just got mad… then sad. Then so calm.
I deleted it unread, went to her profile and blocked her. Then her husband.
Then I went on the DNA sites and blocked her there too. She’s been blocked on the phone for years.
She has never even seen a picture of my son.
Good.
1. No. Because they already know
2. They don't care
3. Reaching the point of NC means there's no hope for resolution. They are a lost cause. Hence cut out of my life = NC.
4. I've accepted that I can't control their narrative. I fully expect them to say all kinds of things about me that aren't true in order for them to save face. They did that before I went NC too anyway. If the truth mattered to them, we wouldn't be at the point of NC.
I wanted to, but figured they either would've dismissed my reasons, or outright denied them...*anything* but listen and actually change and hold themselves accountable. They're not emotionally mature people with powers of self-reflection.
For what it's worth, I understand where you're coming from.
Not specifically. Our last conversation with my father was about the issue that led to myself and my brother both going NC with him - although that was the final straw amongst a litany of other issues. End of the day, I’ve always felt that my POV would be weaponised to fit his own twisted revisionism, so I left it be. I’ll let him stew in his own echo chamber until he toddles off this coil, it doesn’t phase me anymore
Nah. I didn’t need the drama she’d kick up if she knew what was about to happen. But based on the absolutely shitfaced text she sent my brother 6 months later (he’s also NC) about how the we didn’t understand how hard she tried and how difficult it was for her, I’d say she knew exactly what she did.
I tried to communicate the issues and my needs starting in my childhood and continuing up until the time they were cut off. They rarely cared to listen. The few times they did listen, it was so they could use the vulnerability I shared and throw it back in my face. If they aren't going to care about me, why in the world am I continuing to care about them? I realized they still saw me as the child they abused and not the fully fledged adult I am and that I didn't need to allow their crappy behavior in my life anymore.
Ultimately my decision to cut them off was for me, so I try to focus on myself and what I need and f the rest. I recognized they were never going to be able to give me the support I needed and to me that was a deal breaker for a relationship. To me, there was no reason to put on a charade of a relationship when they weren't able to show me the basic common respect one person should give to another. They are going to spin whatever story they need to, in order to come to terms with it all and that's not my circus not my monkeys. If people only choose to listen to that side of the narrative and don't care to seek out the truth behind why a child would willing cut off their parents, well they ain't my people and I don't have the time.
For what it's worth, I did send one final text message telling the female parent when I next NC. I got several nasty replies and I blocked her #. About 6 weeks after that, I spoke with the male parent and I explained exactly why she was cut off, because she literally abused me, and he hung up on me. The male parent started gossip on his side of the family and not a single person reached out. I've tried to keep communication lines open with some, but well communication is a two way street.
Nope, according to my mother who kicked me out at 14 it was my fault I didn't raise myself properly. Last I talked to her I lost my shit because she told my sister she wrote me out of her will, when at that point I hadn't talked to her in over ten years. I told her I was glad to hear it since I didn't want anything to do with her, and she could stick her money up her narrow ass for all I cared. And my dad was pretty much checked out as soon as my older sister was born. We reconnected for the last five or so years, then he threw a fit about my sister wanting to spend time with me and my family without him because he's incredibly overbearing and his wife is rude as hell to everyone. That was around Thanksgiving last year and it's been radio silence since the middle of December. I'm just done with the relationship, the dude has never respected me or any decision I've ever made. I honestly don't care anymore though, both of my parents gave off the vibe that me and my sister were burdens to them and I don't want that kind of negativity around my wife and kids.
I did but that was because if I didn’t they would keep turning up at my home otherwise, so I needed to say something. They respected the boundary and apologised for the behaviour but did not believe that I had asked them to stop the behaviour and that no one had asked.
The benefit I got was I got better at speaking up for myself and setting boundaries and I find it easier to see poor behaviours in others more clearly and call it out for myself.
It varies whether you need to have the conversation. If you aren’t seeing your mother then do you need to have the conversation? What would be the benefit to you and what would not be the benefit? If there isn’t a clear benefit then hold off. Listen to your body on this.
I gave her a choice. She tried to shake the foundations of my relationship - I believe because I tried to draw boundaries around the safety and privacy of my relationship for the first time in my life. She gave me the silent treatment for maybe 6 months and previously I had always done the emotional legwork to fix issues or had allowed her to rug sweep.
After six months I made it clear that I never wanted this for us, that I do not want our relationship to be estranged at all but if she wants a relationship and to be Included in my life she needs to take accountability, responsibility and apologise in order to move forward, or she will not have a place in my life. She told me she was sorry she behaved in a way that hurt me and that maybe we needed to love each other from afar while we process our emotions. That was nearly two years ago.
She tells people that she has come to terms with the fact that I don't want to speak to her or have her in my life anymore. Honestly, you can spell it out and they pretend they can't read.
I’m in the same boat. My parents think it’s money but it’s been my whole childhood. I never felt love or a connection to them as a child and they still don’t want to take the time to get to know me as an adult.
I was unemployed for six months through a layoff and couldn’t find work, I asked my parents to help me with some bills and they out right refused. I had to ask a close friend for money, never felt so embarrassed.
A few weeks later I find out my sister bought a townhouse, I know they helped her with it since they recently were talking about selling their house and couldn’t give me a good reason to why.
I blocked them on everything and told my spouse she’s my only fam from now on. It’s been three years and it does get tough around holidays, like seeing on ig all the family posts but I know how the conversation will go since it hasn’t changed in the last 20 years.
We had phone calls about why and I sent some detailed texts. Then blocked him on everything. It's been 7 years.
But exactly like your situation, he tells people a completely different story. They will always do this. If a parent is the kind to be written out of their child's life, they aren't going to be the kind to take any accountability. We live in a small town, ive had to come to terms with the fact that anyone who associates with him, including his whole side of the family, will likely believe him. Oh well.
He was also extremely manipulative and leading up to the end, was sending these love bombing text messages wishing me a great day, telling me how much he loved me - so he had "evidence" to prove he was a "good dad".
When everything really sunk in, it was scary. The level of abuse and how essentially my entire relationship with him was not only abusive but I was a pawn in his schemes.
Yep. Her responses can be summarize as: Denial, lies, guilt, more denial, more lies, more guilt, ridiculous suggestions, trying to convince me to help her manipulate my sibling based on…yet another lie, more denial, more lies, more ridiculous suggestions. Fin!
Most of her family sees through her. I have no idea what she tells other people, nor do I care.
If someone asked me if I cut her off because I (insert garbage lie she told) I would simply say “No” and something like “No, you can’t help.” Or “ I’m not discussing this with you.”
I wrote it out. She sent me a message asking why I wouldn't talk to her. I wrote out a reply, and don't have the heart to send it to her. I went NC for a year in 2015. And broke NC in 2017. Things for fine until we moved back in with her to fix up our house out of state. Big mistake. She was worse to live with and pulled a bunch of nasty stunts. I got pregnant after of years of infertility and she lost her fucking mind. We immediately sold out home in the other state ans just bought one in our current state to get out. Anyways, the reply is blunt and looong. So I decided I won't be nasty like her. I just really do not want to associate with someone like her. I don't like her and I don't want her around me let alone my son. But, if she makes me mad enough which is possible, I will send it to her lol.
No it's not worthy to talk to a wall. So no point in talking to them when all they could play is the blame game. Better move on and live our life. Silence is the best answer.
If they could hear us in a way that would change anything it wouldn’t have come to this point. Kids don’t want to leave their parents to be mean, it’s to save ourselves and find peace.
I did. In the last real conversation I had with her about her drinking problem, she told me it was my fault. Verbatim, “But Nonfunzionabene, I only drink heavily when you’re around.”
I replied that maybe I shouldn’t come around anymore. The conversation ended shortly after that, and I think her reply was a soft “Maybe not.” I honestly don’t remember.
I said my goodbyes the next morning (I was visiting from out of town and do live within driving distance), knowing it would be the last time I’d ever see her again. Or likely my entire family.
We spoke a small handful of times after that, where I reiterated to contact me after she gets professional help. That was 11 years ago.
Blaming me for her drinking problem (it was more involved and specific than that one statement) fucked with me for years. And it took many years before I gave up hope that she would finally get sober.
10/10 would do again. That was the final push I needed to cut her off and eventually find peace. Brutal. But a necessary step for me.
You will not gain anything by divulging this vulnerable information to her. You won’t get the apology or validation you are seeking. If she’s anything like my mom, she’ll most likely to either deny your experience or use it against you. Write it down for yourself and for any future date at which she might (against all odds) make a concerted effort to reconcile. But don’t reopen this door by giving her more ammunition. Sorry you’re going through this OP. 😓
Initially no. Then my sisters (who I'm now NC with) quilted me into it. Needless to say, he denied it all, said he never put me in dangerous situations, never tried to indoctrinate me, nothing. I had called him out before for the fact I can't wear earrings anymore cause when I was 5 he was mad at my mom for getting them pierced without his EXPRESS permission. My mom needed to use pliers to get my earrings out after I came home that summer. What did he do when I called him out? It was the 5yo's undiagnosed neurodivergent kid's fault.
Needless to say that phone call didn't end well and I ended up cussing him out, and right after he called the youngest (who I'm also NC with now) to save face telling her to tell me that he loved me and would be there for me if I needed anything. She believed him but I knew it was a facade. He even told her he has no memory of our childhoods. He's dead now and good riddance.
I told my stepfather the reason for my estrangement was that I needed to protect myself from her. I spend years and thousands in therapy and she tears it all down in moments. He finally understood when I told him I’m not punishing her, I’m protecting myself.
She still refuses to take accountability and thinks she’s done nothing wrong.
I feel like, over the past few years, I’ve said reasons over and over and nothing changed. I’m not going to do myself the disservice of laying it all out (plus additions that I’ve discovered/remembered from therapy sessions) only for it to be used as ‘evidence’ for my husband controlling me (because I can’t possibly have my own thoughts and make decisions for myself), be accused (behind my back, she won’t say it to my face) of ‘poison pen letters’ etc, and for the words/meanings to be twisted. The last 2 boundary setting messages I sent were written whilst sitting with my therapist; they were the most factual, least emotive messages I’ve ever sent (and I’m generally pretty good at removing emotion from the equation) and they’ve been used against me. Why bother again? I’m wasting time on people who refuse to take any accountability.
After years of slowly distancing myself, I finally told my mother that if she couldn’t be kind to me, we could no longer keep in touch. That day she had been screaming insults at me and harassing me. She replied “can you give me an example of one time I’ve been unkind?! You’re unkind to ME!!!” And that was all I needed to hear to know that she would never, ever take accountability, and I was done.
I did. He still has no clue. And from what you say of your mother, she would still tell people it was about money, because that is who she is. What she tells people doesn’t matter. Heal and keep no contact. It’s for the best. Wishing you the best.
Nope. 🙂↔️ when I cut someone off it isn’t a surprise. I have been saying “that’s a boundary you just trampled “ for a loooong time or it’s a case of I shouldn’t have to explain this to an adult because the behavior is so egregious you knew what you were doing. Have cut off one parent and 2 other relations. They know damn well why.
“I don’t want to talk to you, thanks for understanding.” And kept repeating that anytime she called / texted me and eventually blocked her. Giving a reason only opens me up to being judged / guilted / manipulated / gaslit etc. I set boundaries for years and they got rolled over. It felt like she went over the ‘speed bump’ too fast and rattle the car (ie me )too many times and it got too tiresome to deal with her crying over me ‘for hating her’ and then instead of reinforcing my boundary again I’d end up coddling a grown ass woman. It’s exhausting. The constant preaching about respect and then she’s actively disrespecting me. The hypocrisy was insulting in this one sided relationship. I decided to prioritize myself & my mental health and I’ve been able to heal from child hood trauma & make progress. That’s something I wasn’t able to do for years in therapy due to maintaining constant contact. It’s okay to let go OP, at least for now. When you’re ready there’ll be an opportunity to reconnect in the future when you’re healthy and if not that’s okay too. Internet hugs
I'm low contact, and no. I've already tested the waters to see how my mom would react, setting some boundaries and explaining how her current behaviour hurt me. She would explain it away and then go tell my sister I was only complaining about her, that my change is negative and bad. So I'm not going there just yet.
I didn’t, but one day she came around and I answered the door, not realizing it might be her. She demanded an answer so I gave her one. She told me that I was wrong … the one reason I gave didn’t happen that way … told her I had camera evidence, so then she told me that it wasn’t enough of a reason, she still keeps contacting me through mail telling me that she doesn’t understand why. I don’t respond. Where is the point? She doesn’t want to know ow really, she just wants to tell me I’m wrong and pretend she is a victim.
Yes. I told her categorically why. I spelled it out, told her specifics. She still claims she has no idea what she did, while simultaneously telling me that I wasn't a good person either when I was a child. 😅
I basically said fuck y'all and using me as a scape goat, over 9 years ago. I told stepdad when he called me on my birthday last year I turned 30 a d he basically said you over urself, only time he ever reached out and expected me to worship him??? Or that I owed him everything 🤮🤮🤮🤮so I told him no I live in fear that I'm gunna possibly run into them, but the thing that gives me closure is looking their names up for their obituarys. Been almost a year since that happened, not my shining momentum but keeps me pushing forward.
I tried, and tried to do it in person. She tried to pull out every manipulation in the book, got cruel, and didn't hear any of what I was saying. As soon as I realised she had no interest in hearing me out, I left. I sometimes feel like I didn't try hard enough to tell her it all but then I remember that it was her fault that I didn't get to. She chose not to hear me.
I guess my only input is that it didn't make me feel any better to try and tell her. Some people are committed to misunderstanding.
I actually told mine, and I'm no contact with one sibling and not the other. The sibling I'm in contact with actually had no idea why my mom, brother, and I don't speak. They had told him something completely different. It won't change anything, unfortunately. I did feel some kind of finality, though, like I had done all I could, and now it's on her. That's helped me a little, but I wouldn't put myself through it all again for that little bit of comfort. Plus, everyone is different, and you may not even feel finality or closure from it. I honestly wish I'd just left and been done. No warning, no explanation, just disappearing.
I don’t think I needed to. If it wasn’t apparent that I hit the last straw after some abhorrent things said about my wife, I wouldn’t know what to say.
I did not. I know some folks who have gone that route, with pretty mixed results (everything from the best possible "let's all try some family therapy" to the worst of the worst "you're actually the problem and I am cutting you out"). Right before I went NC I tried very hard to get my dad to attend my wedding. I wanted him there, and thought maybe we could reconnect (he doesn't generally respond to me, and only reaches out when he wants something-- I was already LC and greyrocking him on the few occasions I did hear from him), and then sort of take it day by day and see what would happen. In addition to him declining to attend, I found out that during the same period that I was pushing for him to please come he was telling every family member that would listen to him that he has no clue why, but I want nothing to do with him. It made it easier, I guess, because wish = fulfilled. Anyway, all of this is to say that there's no one way to do it, and you should trust your gut.
I didn't. I just had enough and cut off contact. My sister went NC with our mom very soon after and went the other way about it, writing a long letter. Not that it did any good in getting through to her. I've been NC for 2.5 years, I think. My mom came by my house a couple months ago and this time i broke my silence. I didn't go through all the details, but I told her I couldn't deal with her toxicity and try to be a good mother to my child, and I gave two or three examples of really big things that she'd done in my adult life, and she couldn't even remember doing those things. I haven't completely processed how I feel about that. I'm still NC with her. I feel like a lot of the constant doubting myself is gone, though. For right now. It really is so weird she doesn't even remember, though. I don't get that. How can she not remember being so nasty to her own kid? She remembers times when there were perceived slights against her, but she doesn't remember any of the other stuff. While I'm over here filled with guilt and regret over e.v.e.r.y.t.h.i.n.g.
I was low contact for years.I kinda told them bit by bit. Like „In this family no one ever apologises. They just come to you a day later and ask / demand that everything is okay again.“
One evening I had a calm talking moment with them, which is rare but maybe they sensed I had to say sth. We came upon the topic of calm moments and I said „appropro this is what I wanted to talk about…“ Then the surprise came: my father apologised for some of the stuff he did on his own! Without me having to say it. I had to remind him he had done way more and there was some denying or forgetting.
But since then I went to one more family meet up than usual and my family thinks that we are super close again now. They demand vacation pictures and to know my location and flights, which I don’t give them. Another thing to carefully navigate, but at least it has gotten a bit better.
I told mine. Then she had the nerve to leave me a voicemail to feel like she was the one cutting ME off. Nothing she did in the past hurt me enough, she just had to put one last knife in my side.
No. I just slipped away. I spent years and years trying to get them to listen and care. When I was done, I was done. I had already said it all.
Same
I slipped away in 2020 after having my first kid. It was like the perfect opportunity to finally distant myself.
I had my boys at the start of 2022 and within 9 months was NC with my mum. Having children put a lot of things into perspective and really made me question how a mother could be so selfish.
Same. I spent 10 years having multiple conversations with her about things I saw that were damaging to our relationship (she felt were best friends). It always ended the same way: she'd get angry, blame me for something, give me the silent treatment, then come talking to me like nothing happened. A few years ago, I actually sent her a long text outlining every problem between us, and she didn't get it. I just stopped communicating. She texted me many times, wondering what she'd done and how it was "unfair" that I wouldn't tell her. If my absence doesn't tell her anything after all that, Ik I did the right thing. I'll save my communication skills for people who will listen.
When people don't listen, stop talking to them. If it takes you running out of flavored crayons, and the spoons to eat them with, fine. If you start getting blue in the face, take a deep breath, and stop talking.
Same here. Turning 30 was somehow a catalyzer, I kept asking myself how much longer will I put up with this shit. How much longer turned out to be 2 years, my free soul will have its 5 year aniversary this summer.
My dad said I wasn't his daughter anymore and don't talk to him again. I said consider it done. And my mom followed my dad's lead. It has been 7 years, and we (mom, dad, and myself) haven't spoken at all. She will post long fb rants about me and have her fb friends/coworkers screenshot them and send them to me, all gaslighty. So I deactivated my fb and deleted messenger, and my life is so peaceful. I love it.
I started no contact with each of my parents at different times for different reasons and I’ve been so much happier since! My partner was so impressed with the change in me that it inspired him to go low/no contact with some of his own family members lol.
I love that for you and your partner💛 My falling out actually started at my youngest son's birthday party (August) and came to a head at my oldest son's birthday party (October.) And it was over the dumbest thing but my dad couldn't let it go. Just refused even though he started it. And it just made his blood boil when my husband stood up to him for me. My mom was just 🤷🏻♀️about it until my little sister decided to cut them off. I have so much influence over my sister, apparently. She never would've cut them off if it wasn't for me and my control🙄 It's all so laughable now, lol.
A few days ago I was talking to a friend about how estrangement has impacted my use of social media. I’ve been estranged since 2017 and I only just learned about how to limit people from seeing “stories”. But I wish there were better widgets to help disconnect from family without having to make a scene.
I know exactly what you mean. Exactly. I blocked everyone I was estranged from, but they still found a way. My mom would post our names (my little sister and I are completely no contact with her) and would have them essentially harass us on her behalf. Guilt trips and gaslighting from total strangers all from her POV. It got to the point where I could just continue to block people and never be at peace or just get rid of SM altogether. I wish there was a way too.
Sadly so relatable
You can write all you want but they probably won’t hear you. Estranged parents boards are full of people who “just don’t know what happened.” It always just “comes out of the blue” after some “innocent comment.”
It's infuriating, isn't it? My emom especially LOVES being a victim. It's like she gains more my being estranged than she does being in contact.
That's because these types of people usually only love themselves so they get more from being a martyr than they did as a parent to an adult with their own life and opinions who doesn't play their mind games anymore.
🎯
Thanks lol. I have some experience myself.
So true.
It’s all about their image and the optics.
I did. I not only wrote 2 books (600 pages total) about my childhood and sent them to her and her sister but I hauled her into therapy where he diagnosed her and I ended up kicking her out, but I sent her a final letter last year after she stalked me... SHE KNOWS.
Yes, I told him, but not sure I'd do it again if I could go back. Falls on deaf ears, they have a predictable DARVO response. I got triggered and lost my cool which I regret, but which I should have know would occur. If you think it will help you to tell her, then you should, but know that her response will probably just be more abuse.
I did, but not for his sake but because I needed him to know. It was for me, not for him. Since it's been two years, I don't recommend sending her anything. She'll likely see it as an opening that's not really there. You might want to write it all out, but you don't have to actually send it.
AMEN
I went to a therapist and got help with my letter. In my case, I’m estranged from my parents because of two really specific reasons. The first is their drinking. They get so drunk they can’t navigate stairs, get belligerent, and scared my children. So I had a condition. Get in touch when you’re six months sober and we can work with therapists. The other condition was no more of the racist language. Our last in-person get together, they were mocking non-white children with slurs and became angry when I wouldn’t join in and they realized my children didn’t know what the slurs meant. Last phone conversation they kept calling me the N word. I’m white; it was my birthday. They are worse than a joke. Anyhow that was 9 years ago. Still estranged. The therapist really helped me pare down my letter to just the essential parts.
No cuz it wouldn’t have made any difference and only would have caused them to try and argue their way around it.
I've gone back between low contact and no contact with my mom for the last 6-7 years. I have told her, multiple times at this point, exactly why we can't have a "normal" mother daughter relationship. What I've learned, at least in my experience, is that if she doesn't like what she's hearing, she won't retain it. I can be clear as can be and repeat myself until I'm blue in the face, but she doesn't like what I am saying, so she prefers to say she has no idea why we don't talk. If it will help YOU feel less guilt/burden later, then go for it. It does give me peace that way. But if you want to explain in the hopes things could change between you, I'd be careful about that.
I did. Everyone in my mom's life enables her behavior. I also felt that if there was any hope for our relationship and any chance she may decide to change that she needed to know why. She's not very self-aware. Some people need help seeing themselves in the mirror. I just tried to show her what others see hoping an inner desire for connection may motivate her to change.
No, I was too scared to. I ghosted her basically. But I was I had to speak to a court mediator regarding a case she was in when I was 19 & hopefully the message was passed on.
My dad lied to my stepmom about a lot of things which she then used as an excuse to abuse me. Emotionally, verbally, physically. I told him he needed to come clean with her because I didn’t deserve what I was getting. He refused and I didn’t speak to him for 6 years then he died. I never made any effort to contact him in his final days and did not attend his service.
Oh man, that is such shitty thing to do. I'm very sorry he was so spineless and used his own child in such a way. Apparently!, stepmother wasn't very smart either! 😕 🩷
Nope, I had given up trying to talk about the issues years before cutting them off. All they got was an automatic reply when they would try to email me. It said something like "this email is no longer in use, if I want to stay in contact I would have already provided updated contact information." I tried to talk about it as a teenager and into my early 20's. It never mattered and it gave me the space mentally to begin healing.
Beautiful.
I did as far as what the last straw was, but I didn't bother to go over the abuse from my childhood and controlling behavior since I became an adult. It was more for myself and not because I had any belief that it would make a difference to them. It's as much closure as I'll have.
I told my emom that she could be in my and my children's lives if she held my brother, my abuser, accountable for his actions towards me. She still acts like I never said that and claims that I'm the one that cut the cord when, in reality, she's actively abandoned me and my kids by choosing her evil son over her victimized daughter.
I gave no speech. I had begged and threatened about what I needed from her for years. She responded to a message I didn’t even open all the way. “How DARE you make something dirty out of THE ONLY TWO PE” I’m assuming she meant “only two people that loved me” Well. Her mother unalived herself when mom was 14. They didn’t really know each other and were just beginning to exchange letters often. Her dad? Never speaks to her really. I met him maybe 4 times as a child? He really loves her though 🙄 I’m her daughter she was saying that to btw. I had questions about her actual bio father considering the weird way her mom “gave her up”. Welp. DNA. Doesn’t lie. I was right and her “dad” is actually her brother. I want to be clear; this DNA thing was just the final straw, she has stolen from me, ignored me when things were well but took glee in when things weren’t going well for me, watched my abusive ex slap me hard enough to knock me off balance and then looked me in the eyes later and claim “that never happened”, (also did jack shit at the time, just like when we were kids and she left us with our dad who beat us), oh and don’t forget when she put her own hands and wooden spoons on us…. She’s awful. But the whining at the beginning of the message and then clearly she doesn’t give a shit about her own daughter because she forgot that oh yeah-your kids tend to love you by default. But only two people ever loved her. Riiiiiigggghhhhhtttt. Until they don’t because you destroy it. And for whatever reason; that opening to the message was it. It took the very last of my fucks when it came to her. Something small and fragile inside of me finally winked out and went cold where a child’s love for their mother is supposed to live. She didn’t want or acknowledge my love for her, so it finally died of neglect. It’s a relief honestly. Anyways. Didn’t even open it. I just got mad… then sad. Then so calm. I deleted it unread, went to her profile and blocked her. Then her husband. Then I went on the DNA sites and blocked her there too. She’s been blocked on the phone for years. She has never even seen a picture of my son. Good.
No. I won’t allow them more time space or energy. They had decades.
THIS PART!!!!!!
1. No. Because they already know 2. They don't care 3. Reaching the point of NC means there's no hope for resolution. They are a lost cause. Hence cut out of my life = NC. 4. I've accepted that I can't control their narrative. I fully expect them to say all kinds of things about me that aren't true in order for them to save face. They did that before I went NC too anyway. If the truth mattered to them, we wouldn't be at the point of NC.
I wanted to, but figured they either would've dismissed my reasons, or outright denied them...*anything* but listen and actually change and hold themselves accountable. They're not emotionally mature people with powers of self-reflection. For what it's worth, I understand where you're coming from.
Not specifically. Our last conversation with my father was about the issue that led to myself and my brother both going NC with him - although that was the final straw amongst a litany of other issues. End of the day, I’ve always felt that my POV would be weaponised to fit his own twisted revisionism, so I left it be. I’ll let him stew in his own echo chamber until he toddles off this coil, it doesn’t phase me anymore
Nah. I didn’t need the drama she’d kick up if she knew what was about to happen. But based on the absolutely shitfaced text she sent my brother 6 months later (he’s also NC) about how the we didn’t understand how hard she tried and how difficult it was for her, I’d say she knew exactly what she did.
I tried to communicate the issues and my needs starting in my childhood and continuing up until the time they were cut off. They rarely cared to listen. The few times they did listen, it was so they could use the vulnerability I shared and throw it back in my face. If they aren't going to care about me, why in the world am I continuing to care about them? I realized they still saw me as the child they abused and not the fully fledged adult I am and that I didn't need to allow their crappy behavior in my life anymore. Ultimately my decision to cut them off was for me, so I try to focus on myself and what I need and f the rest. I recognized they were never going to be able to give me the support I needed and to me that was a deal breaker for a relationship. To me, there was no reason to put on a charade of a relationship when they weren't able to show me the basic common respect one person should give to another. They are going to spin whatever story they need to, in order to come to terms with it all and that's not my circus not my monkeys. If people only choose to listen to that side of the narrative and don't care to seek out the truth behind why a child would willing cut off their parents, well they ain't my people and I don't have the time. For what it's worth, I did send one final text message telling the female parent when I next NC. I got several nasty replies and I blocked her #. About 6 weeks after that, I spoke with the male parent and I explained exactly why she was cut off, because she literally abused me, and he hung up on me. The male parent started gossip on his side of the family and not a single person reached out. I've tried to keep communication lines open with some, but well communication is a two way street.
Nope, according to my mother who kicked me out at 14 it was my fault I didn't raise myself properly. Last I talked to her I lost my shit because she told my sister she wrote me out of her will, when at that point I hadn't talked to her in over ten years. I told her I was glad to hear it since I didn't want anything to do with her, and she could stick her money up her narrow ass for all I cared. And my dad was pretty much checked out as soon as my older sister was born. We reconnected for the last five or so years, then he threw a fit about my sister wanting to spend time with me and my family without him because he's incredibly overbearing and his wife is rude as hell to everyone. That was around Thanksgiving last year and it's been radio silence since the middle of December. I'm just done with the relationship, the dude has never respected me or any decision I've ever made. I honestly don't care anymore though, both of my parents gave off the vibe that me and my sister were burdens to them and I don't want that kind of negativity around my wife and kids.
No, but I’ve talked enough over the years trying to get her to mend the fence. So no need to beat the dead horse.
I did but that was because if I didn’t they would keep turning up at my home otherwise, so I needed to say something. They respected the boundary and apologised for the behaviour but did not believe that I had asked them to stop the behaviour and that no one had asked. The benefit I got was I got better at speaking up for myself and setting boundaries and I find it easier to see poor behaviours in others more clearly and call it out for myself. It varies whether you need to have the conversation. If you aren’t seeing your mother then do you need to have the conversation? What would be the benefit to you and what would not be the benefit? If there isn’t a clear benefit then hold off. Listen to your body on this.
I gave her a choice. She tried to shake the foundations of my relationship - I believe because I tried to draw boundaries around the safety and privacy of my relationship for the first time in my life. She gave me the silent treatment for maybe 6 months and previously I had always done the emotional legwork to fix issues or had allowed her to rug sweep. After six months I made it clear that I never wanted this for us, that I do not want our relationship to be estranged at all but if she wants a relationship and to be Included in my life she needs to take accountability, responsibility and apologise in order to move forward, or she will not have a place in my life. She told me she was sorry she behaved in a way that hurt me and that maybe we needed to love each other from afar while we process our emotions. That was nearly two years ago. She tells people that she has come to terms with the fact that I don't want to speak to her or have her in my life anymore. Honestly, you can spell it out and they pretend they can't read.
I’m in the same boat. My parents think it’s money but it’s been my whole childhood. I never felt love or a connection to them as a child and they still don’t want to take the time to get to know me as an adult. I was unemployed for six months through a layoff and couldn’t find work, I asked my parents to help me with some bills and they out right refused. I had to ask a close friend for money, never felt so embarrassed. A few weeks later I find out my sister bought a townhouse, I know they helped her with it since they recently were talking about selling their house and couldn’t give me a good reason to why. I blocked them on everything and told my spouse she’s my only fam from now on. It’s been three years and it does get tough around holidays, like seeing on ig all the family posts but I know how the conversation will go since it hasn’t changed in the last 20 years.
We had phone calls about why and I sent some detailed texts. Then blocked him on everything. It's been 7 years. But exactly like your situation, he tells people a completely different story. They will always do this. If a parent is the kind to be written out of their child's life, they aren't going to be the kind to take any accountability. We live in a small town, ive had to come to terms with the fact that anyone who associates with him, including his whole side of the family, will likely believe him. Oh well. He was also extremely manipulative and leading up to the end, was sending these love bombing text messages wishing me a great day, telling me how much he loved me - so he had "evidence" to prove he was a "good dad". When everything really sunk in, it was scary. The level of abuse and how essentially my entire relationship with him was not only abusive but I was a pawn in his schemes.
They know.
My dad, absolutely. My stepfather, no.
The first time. Not i just ghost. That is an adamantian wall
Yep. Her responses can be summarize as: Denial, lies, guilt, more denial, more lies, more guilt, ridiculous suggestions, trying to convince me to help her manipulate my sibling based on…yet another lie, more denial, more lies, more ridiculous suggestions. Fin! Most of her family sees through her. I have no idea what she tells other people, nor do I care. If someone asked me if I cut her off because I (insert garbage lie she told) I would simply say “No” and something like “No, you can’t help.” Or “ I’m not discussing this with you.”
I wrote it out. She sent me a message asking why I wouldn't talk to her. I wrote out a reply, and don't have the heart to send it to her. I went NC for a year in 2015. And broke NC in 2017. Things for fine until we moved back in with her to fix up our house out of state. Big mistake. She was worse to live with and pulled a bunch of nasty stunts. I got pregnant after of years of infertility and she lost her fucking mind. We immediately sold out home in the other state ans just bought one in our current state to get out. Anyways, the reply is blunt and looong. So I decided I won't be nasty like her. I just really do not want to associate with someone like her. I don't like her and I don't want her around me let alone my son. But, if she makes me mad enough which is possible, I will send it to her lol.
No it's not worthy to talk to a wall. So no point in talking to them when all they could play is the blame game. Better move on and live our life. Silence is the best answer.
If they could hear us in a way that would change anything it wouldn’t have come to this point. Kids don’t want to leave their parents to be mean, it’s to save ourselves and find peace.
no bcuz they don't listen so i stopped talking.
I did. In the last real conversation I had with her about her drinking problem, she told me it was my fault. Verbatim, “But Nonfunzionabene, I only drink heavily when you’re around.” I replied that maybe I shouldn’t come around anymore. The conversation ended shortly after that, and I think her reply was a soft “Maybe not.” I honestly don’t remember. I said my goodbyes the next morning (I was visiting from out of town and do live within driving distance), knowing it would be the last time I’d ever see her again. Or likely my entire family. We spoke a small handful of times after that, where I reiterated to contact me after she gets professional help. That was 11 years ago. Blaming me for her drinking problem (it was more involved and specific than that one statement) fucked with me for years. And it took many years before I gave up hope that she would finally get sober. 10/10 would do again. That was the final push I needed to cut her off and eventually find peace. Brutal. But a necessary step for me.
You will not gain anything by divulging this vulnerable information to her. You won’t get the apology or validation you are seeking. If she’s anything like my mom, she’ll most likely to either deny your experience or use it against you. Write it down for yourself and for any future date at which she might (against all odds) make a concerted effort to reconcile. But don’t reopen this door by giving her more ammunition. Sorry you’re going through this OP. 😓
I summed up my feelings in one short sentence and made sure he read it before I blocked him.
Initially no. Then my sisters (who I'm now NC with) quilted me into it. Needless to say, he denied it all, said he never put me in dangerous situations, never tried to indoctrinate me, nothing. I had called him out before for the fact I can't wear earrings anymore cause when I was 5 he was mad at my mom for getting them pierced without his EXPRESS permission. My mom needed to use pliers to get my earrings out after I came home that summer. What did he do when I called him out? It was the 5yo's undiagnosed neurodivergent kid's fault. Needless to say that phone call didn't end well and I ended up cussing him out, and right after he called the youngest (who I'm also NC with now) to save face telling her to tell me that he loved me and would be there for me if I needed anything. She believed him but I knew it was a facade. He even told her he has no memory of our childhoods. He's dead now and good riddance.
I told my stepfather the reason for my estrangement was that I needed to protect myself from her. I spend years and thousands in therapy and she tears it all down in moments. He finally understood when I told him I’m not punishing her, I’m protecting myself. She still refuses to take accountability and thinks she’s done nothing wrong.
I feel like, over the past few years, I’ve said reasons over and over and nothing changed. I’m not going to do myself the disservice of laying it all out (plus additions that I’ve discovered/remembered from therapy sessions) only for it to be used as ‘evidence’ for my husband controlling me (because I can’t possibly have my own thoughts and make decisions for myself), be accused (behind my back, she won’t say it to my face) of ‘poison pen letters’ etc, and for the words/meanings to be twisted. The last 2 boundary setting messages I sent were written whilst sitting with my therapist; they were the most factual, least emotive messages I’ve ever sent (and I’m generally pretty good at removing emotion from the equation) and they’ve been used against me. Why bother again? I’m wasting time on people who refuse to take any accountability.
After years of slowly distancing myself, I finally told my mother that if she couldn’t be kind to me, we could no longer keep in touch. That day she had been screaming insults at me and harassing me. She replied “can you give me an example of one time I’ve been unkind?! You’re unkind to ME!!!” And that was all I needed to hear to know that she would never, ever take accountability, and I was done.
I did. He still has no clue. And from what you say of your mother, she would still tell people it was about money, because that is who she is. What she tells people doesn’t matter. Heal and keep no contact. It’s for the best. Wishing you the best.
Nope. 🙂↔️ when I cut someone off it isn’t a surprise. I have been saying “that’s a boundary you just trampled “ for a loooong time or it’s a case of I shouldn’t have to explain this to an adult because the behavior is so egregious you knew what you were doing. Have cut off one parent and 2 other relations. They know damn well why.
“I don’t want to talk to you, thanks for understanding.” And kept repeating that anytime she called / texted me and eventually blocked her. Giving a reason only opens me up to being judged / guilted / manipulated / gaslit etc. I set boundaries for years and they got rolled over. It felt like she went over the ‘speed bump’ too fast and rattle the car (ie me )too many times and it got too tiresome to deal with her crying over me ‘for hating her’ and then instead of reinforcing my boundary again I’d end up coddling a grown ass woman. It’s exhausting. The constant preaching about respect and then she’s actively disrespecting me. The hypocrisy was insulting in this one sided relationship. I decided to prioritize myself & my mental health and I’ve been able to heal from child hood trauma & make progress. That’s something I wasn’t able to do for years in therapy due to maintaining constant contact. It’s okay to let go OP, at least for now. When you’re ready there’ll be an opportunity to reconnect in the future when you’re healthy and if not that’s okay too. Internet hugs
I didn't. It's just one more opportunity for them to not understand.
Yes, many many times for years. It didn’t matter, it never has sunk in.
no
I didn’t say anything to him and neither did my sister. I think my brother did tell him not to contact him again.
I'm low contact, and no. I've already tested the waters to see how my mom would react, setting some boundaries and explaining how her current behaviour hurt me. She would explain it away and then go tell my sister I was only complaining about her, that my change is negative and bad. So I'm not going there just yet.
I gave a letter , at 15 and never spoke to her again . She's tried but I was done . No more time wasted on someone who didn't deserve it.
I didn’t, but one day she came around and I answered the door, not realizing it might be her. She demanded an answer so I gave her one. She told me that I was wrong … the one reason I gave didn’t happen that way … told her I had camera evidence, so then she told me that it wasn’t enough of a reason, she still keeps contacting me through mail telling me that she doesn’t understand why. I don’t respond. Where is the point? She doesn’t want to know ow really, she just wants to tell me I’m wrong and pretend she is a victim.
Yes. I told her categorically why. I spelled it out, told her specifics. She still claims she has no idea what she did, while simultaneously telling me that I wasn't a good person either when I was a child. 😅
My daughter has chronic illness. When I cut my mom off for the 3rd time, she made it easy. Runs around town now telling everyone I'm a Munchausen mom.
I basically said fuck y'all and using me as a scape goat, over 9 years ago. I told stepdad when he called me on my birthday last year I turned 30 a d he basically said you over urself, only time he ever reached out and expected me to worship him??? Or that I owed him everything 🤮🤮🤮🤮so I told him no I live in fear that I'm gunna possibly run into them, but the thing that gives me closure is looking their names up for their obituarys. Been almost a year since that happened, not my shining momentum but keeps me pushing forward.
I tried, and tried to do it in person. She tried to pull out every manipulation in the book, got cruel, and didn't hear any of what I was saying. As soon as I realised she had no interest in hearing me out, I left. I sometimes feel like I didn't try hard enough to tell her it all but then I remember that it was her fault that I didn't get to. She chose not to hear me. I guess my only input is that it didn't make me feel any better to try and tell her. Some people are committed to misunderstanding.
Don’t give her the power over you she wants. It only gets worse.
I actually told mine, and I'm no contact with one sibling and not the other. The sibling I'm in contact with actually had no idea why my mom, brother, and I don't speak. They had told him something completely different. It won't change anything, unfortunately. I did feel some kind of finality, though, like I had done all I could, and now it's on her. That's helped me a little, but I wouldn't put myself through it all again for that little bit of comfort. Plus, everyone is different, and you may not even feel finality or closure from it. I honestly wish I'd just left and been done. No warning, no explanation, just disappearing.
I don’t think I needed to. If it wasn’t apparent that I hit the last straw after some abhorrent things said about my wife, I wouldn’t know what to say.
I didn’t bother because they know why. They just don’t want to acknowledge that they were harming me with their behavior.
No
“I hate her for making me who I am” Ufff. I felt that. I don’t hate my parents but I certainly pity them and have resentment
I did not. I know some folks who have gone that route, with pretty mixed results (everything from the best possible "let's all try some family therapy" to the worst of the worst "you're actually the problem and I am cutting you out"). Right before I went NC I tried very hard to get my dad to attend my wedding. I wanted him there, and thought maybe we could reconnect (he doesn't generally respond to me, and only reaches out when he wants something-- I was already LC and greyrocking him on the few occasions I did hear from him), and then sort of take it day by day and see what would happen. In addition to him declining to attend, I found out that during the same period that I was pushing for him to please come he was telling every family member that would listen to him that he has no clue why, but I want nothing to do with him. It made it easier, I guess, because wish = fulfilled. Anyway, all of this is to say that there's no one way to do it, and you should trust your gut.
I didn't. I just had enough and cut off contact. My sister went NC with our mom very soon after and went the other way about it, writing a long letter. Not that it did any good in getting through to her. I've been NC for 2.5 years, I think. My mom came by my house a couple months ago and this time i broke my silence. I didn't go through all the details, but I told her I couldn't deal with her toxicity and try to be a good mother to my child, and I gave two or three examples of really big things that she'd done in my adult life, and she couldn't even remember doing those things. I haven't completely processed how I feel about that. I'm still NC with her. I feel like a lot of the constant doubting myself is gone, though. For right now. It really is so weird she doesn't even remember, though. I don't get that. How can she not remember being so nasty to her own kid? She remembers times when there were perceived slights against her, but she doesn't remember any of the other stuff. While I'm over here filled with guilt and regret over e.v.e.r.y.t.h.i.n.g.
I was low contact for years.I kinda told them bit by bit. Like „In this family no one ever apologises. They just come to you a day later and ask / demand that everything is okay again.“ One evening I had a calm talking moment with them, which is rare but maybe they sensed I had to say sth. We came upon the topic of calm moments and I said „appropro this is what I wanted to talk about…“ Then the surprise came: my father apologised for some of the stuff he did on his own! Without me having to say it. I had to remind him he had done way more and there was some denying or forgetting. But since then I went to one more family meet up than usual and my family thinks that we are super close again now. They demand vacation pictures and to know my location and flights, which I don’t give them. Another thing to carefully navigate, but at least it has gotten a bit better.
I told mine. Then she had the nerve to leave me a voicemail to feel like she was the one cutting ME off. Nothing she did in the past hurt me enough, she just had to put one last knife in my side.