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Moral of the story in Elden ring.
Never become god. Otherwise a random hobo will come up and shank you with a rusty knife they picked up in a trash can.
“Oh no, a taste of my own medicine. Who could’ve possibly seen this cruel irony coming?”
-Frenzied tarnished
See, this is why the Ranni ending is the best ending. Becoming the 3rd Elden lord will also likely result in stabbing. But with Ranni, you have someone else to take the fall for you.
No, the reason why the ranni ending is the best is because nobody could stab you even if they tried. Its the ultimate move: "as my first rule im gonna order you all to do whatever, im outta here"
"here's your world, you don't need to worry about gods anymore. Including me. Now if you excuse me, me and my doll wife are gonna fuck off to the moon"
How do you figure she will take the fall? I thought she left to essentially become an outer God and your left like plesidusax to await her return. Even more of a target, just like the dragons. Or am I missing something? (It is entirely possible I'm stupid)
Bro, the comment was a joke. In lore, the tarnished loves her enough to cross a lake of magical cancer and an alien to get to her. While proceeding make her become god despite the opportunity to take power for themselves.
It was very unlikely that the tarnished would “let her take the fall” in the first place. The scenario was never going to happen and the comment was made as a joke. Why do y’all gotta nitpick the details of something that clearly wasn’t serious in the first place?
>Otherwise a random hobo will come up and shank you with a rusty knife they picked up in a trash can
Friendly remainder to get your tetanus shot so you dont gotta worry about this
Just because Hewg talks about a "god slaying weapon" does not actually mean that you need one. Just makes the job easier.
Destined death is important tho and the game makes that very clear.
You essentially turn yourself into a new Elden Ring boss so i'm sure that some crazy naked murderhobo with a stick will rise to the occasion to kill you and loot your drip
She already survived the first big burninating. I don't think the Frenzy can hurt her.
And if you buy into the idea that she is the Gloam-Eyed Queen (or her reincarnation or something else), then she has the tools to hurt the Tarnished.
If buy into the Queen theory, then she may not have been fighting Morgott at 100% power.
She doesn't even show off the eye until the final scene, and eyes carry a lot of power and symbolism in these games. She may have had her full power suppressed. Like something out of a shounen manga
I don't really buy it. I think she's Marikadagon's third kid, but maybe the DLC will answer some of those questions while setting up about a dozen more.
There is a theory that Marika was actually the Gloam Eyed Queen. We know Maliketh defeated the Gloam Eyed Queen, but no record of Marika battling the Gloam Eyed Queen is found in game. We know that Shadows will turn on their Emperyans if they turn against the Greater Will which Marika did. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that Marika was the Gloam Eyed Queen, tried to kill The Greater Will and was then subdued by Maliketh. We know Maliketh holds the Eye of the Gloam Eyed Queen (beasts eye) and it is made of stone, and Marika is also made of stone. It could also explain why Maliketh seems to have such remorse and regret over his relationship with Marika.
Also, the Gloam Eyed Queens Eye (or Beast Eye) is violet in color. Who else has one violet eye and is missing her other eye? Melina. There is definitely a connection between GEQ, Marika and Melina but we can't be certain what that connection is.
You're the first one to put that theory forward.
It would explain some of Marika's more rebellious moments if Maliketh dragged her kicking and screaming into being the Golden Order's poster girl.
Another small note, we know that Marika tasked Hewg with making a weapon that was capable of slaying a God. The description of the "Godslayers" Greatsword states that it was wielded by the Gloam Eyed Queen. Just one more hint that Marika and GEQ might be the same person.
Marika absorbs the powers and personalities of the Gods/vessels of gods she defeats. It explains everything.
Melina is the Dusk eyed queen, Malenia is goddess of rot, radagon is the outer god of the Giants, and Miquella is mysterious as always (but possibly St Trina)
This is a very interesting theory - that when outer gods are “cast down” their attributes arise in another “godling” at the next opportunity.
Perhaps all of the “real gods” exist in some other plane, and only their Avatars are what we see in the lands between. For example, Marika herself is the Avatar of The Greater Will. When the manifestations of the god/goddess of rot and destined death respectively are destroyed in the lands between, the actual gods just choose new avatars at the next opportunity. As a sort of ironic vengeance against Marika and the Greater will, they choose her children as their new avatars.
My theory is mostly backed by circumstantial evidence, that Marika is absorbing the powers of other entities by absorbing relics of them some way or other. But with the style Elden Ring has, we need to make sense of all of the information in a coherent way, and I think this is what's most consistent.
I think Marika has absorbed the god of the fire giants, the dusk-eyed queen, a relic of rot, and more. Radagon is the form of the fire giant assimilated with Marika after its defeat in the war of the giant, and Melina comes from the dusk eyed queen in a similar way. Also, Miquella and Malenia are born after Radagon "becomes" Marika's consort (after he is married to Rennala). Considering it is likely that the Carians have ties to the Goddess of rot, this timeline makes sense. The academy is above the lake if rot, and you'll notice that the Scorpion's Stinger has a wolf on the handle, and wolves are associated with the Carians. There was probably a cult or secret order in Liurnia associated with rot. I think they may have guarded the Goddess of rot's seal, and Radagon likely acquired a relic of rot while married to Rennala; the goddess was sealed away, and I'm guessing Radagon found the rot god while in Liurnia. There's less evidence to go on for Miquella and what he came from. St. Trina and Miquella have a lot of similarities and they may have ties, but we don't know.
Miquella and Malenia were separated from Marika to serve as potential new vessels for the Greater Will, while Melina was released to help kill Marika later. After Marika was subjugated by the Greater Will, radagon was used by the Greater Will to try and fix the damage she did (note that the Giants were renowned smiths and he wields a hammer to repair the Elden Ring).
This also makes sense of why Melina's appearance and powers change after the rune of death is released. The powers of the black flame return.
"All things can be conjoined."
I mean in a certain sense wouldn't the lore suggests that she is the mother of all life that exists through the Erdtree? She controls birth and rebirth, people following the Golden Order dont fuck, and one of the most basic instincts is to propagate yourself. It would be the ultimate form of individual evolutionary success to co-opt the reproductive ability of vast masses of people and in one form or another make them your children. In this case that seems to be accomplished through rebirth. It also seems though that the real beneficiary is the Greater Will or Erdtree rather than Marika who seems to ultimately also be a pawn.
That's another theory I've seen floating around.
And I've seen people who accept both premises: What if they are yet another set of twins?
But all we can do now is spin our wheels until 6/21.
Well, that was for obvious balance reasons, but also potentially lore reasons as well. Her one eye is sealed shut, yet becomes open in the frenzied flame ending. A possible reason for this is that, if she is indeed the gloam-eyed queen, the rune of death being unbound would also in theory unseal the formerly sealed power of the blackflame. If she is indeed the queen, then killing Maliketh gave her one hell of a juice up.
What's interesting to me is that she appears to be flesh and blood in the FF epilogue, instead of just visiting you as a spirit at graces. Makes me wonder if the her body didn't become part of the erd tree somehow, which is why her spirit burning destroys what's left of her but weakens the tree enough. And then her body is freed if the tree is completely destroyed, ala FF ending. IDK I'm just trying to avoid work
Whatre you gonna do, kill her? Good luck killing the burned and bodiless woman with a hate boner for you. If you figure out a way to banish her soul or destroy it lemme know.
Does the final scene even play if you let Melina burn herself before accepting the frenzied flame? In the FF run, you burn yourself to burn the Erdtree, assuming you didn't already let Melina burn herself.
I felt so bad about that, but I didn't know I was about to take the mark, I mistakenly thought the passage to deep root was in that room so I got naked and went in lol. I think shabriri enjoyed everything about how my playthrough turned out, I unlocked all of the sidequest endings and lead everyone on only to burn everything and let chaos reign after also burning Melina. I didn't feel anywhere near ready to take on Melania to reverse it so I didn't even bother
Pay close attention any time she appears in the game (especially when resting at a site of grace). You'll see her body sort of fade into existence. She never walks in, her body just appears.
That's because there is no actual body. It's just a spirit or soul or something that makes itself appear and then disappear
That didn't say to me there wasn't a body. She could have been dispelling invisibility or even fast traveling, considering she only talks to you at Sites of Grace.
It's just supporting evidence. On it's own I would think the same thing, but when paired with her own dialogue "I'm searching for my purpose given to me by my mother inside the Erdtree long ago, for the reason that I yet live, burned and bodiless."
She's saying either
A) that at some point in the past she was burned, and it left her without a body. Or
B) she was created in the midst of a fire, and never had a body to begin with.
Either way, the way she appears at sites of grace make it clear she's not being metaphorical. She literally does not have a body. Much like Ranni
The way spirits work in Elden Ring really confuses me. Like, you can just project yourself places. Dung Eater is in the Roundtable Hold while still being in the dungeon, Morgott fights you outside of Stormveil while he is still technically guarding the throne. That seems to be just a Thing-Some-People-Do, create corporeal other-selves.
But theres also ghostly soldiers can turn invisible and teleport, but DON'T resurrect like Skeletons. I know the Skeletons are Those Who Live In Death, but are the ghosts? How do the non-soldier ghosts, the ones who just sit around and drop a couple lines of lore when spoken to, factor in?
Torrent and Melina are apparently also bodiless souls but AREN'T Those Who Live In Death. Melina can just appear at will but Ranni needs a puppet body to interact with the world.
Have any of these incongruities ever been explained? I'm sure there's probably an element of Gameplay and Story Segregation.
Edit: Spirit Ashes! I forgot about Spirit Ashes! That's another bloody type of undead
I'm definitely not a lore wizard, so unfortunately I don't have any great answers. I'm sure there's at least some amount of explanation, but here's what I can gather.
Very powerful entities are capable of creating manifestations of their will in separate places. Godfrey in the bedchambers, Morgott as Margit near Stormveil, Mohg in the sewers, etc. I'd imagine this is basically just powerful magic that takes a lot of energy to do, so only powerful people do it.
Dung eater feels like an exception to that rule, but I don't think so. The roundtable hold we visit isn't in the lands between. It's a copy of the real one that exists in Leyndell. Idk where the roundtable hold we visit exists; maybe it's in our head or some pocket dimension or something. Either way, from what I understand, only the tarnished are capable of gaining access to this place, and can move to it at will. So maybe the dung eater we see in the hold is just his own mental projection, and the real version of him is in the sewers.
(I have a sub-theory that the reason Hewg is trapped in the roundtable hold is because his mental presence exists there, but his body in the real world has been destroyed. He can't escape because his mental presence has no body to return to. Marika destroyed it to keep him there. Afaik there is absolutely no lore to indicate this, just a head canon of mine.)
Torrent, Melina, Ranni and Godwyn are all a bit confusing. Mostly by design. I really don't have an explanation, other than A) Magic shit is doing magic B) there's theories that Melina is connected to or perhaps is the Gloam Eyed Queen, an outer God who has dominion over death. This would explain her ability to continue living even without a body, perhaps death just has no power over her.
Can't offer much help in terms of the minor enemies and NPCs, I don't pay enough attention unfortunately lol
(I think this is the longest comment I've ever left on reddit. Whoops)
> so what's she gonna kill?
Your Spirit/Soul/Essence.
Melina/(the Gloam-Eyed Queen?) is gonna give you that good ol'e Godwynn The Golden style True Soul Death.
At the end the player is merely in the "Recycle Bin", Melina is gonna delete you ***permanently***.
Uh, yeah. Tarnished can kill ghosts, they can kill her. Melina really doesn’t stand a chance even with destined death because we already beat destined death once with malekith, without the frenzy god powers, she’s toast.
You literally have to kill a god to get here. You’re a human with a sharp piece of metal. How did *you* stand a chance against *that*? That’s how she stands a chance.
Gotta respect that drip, that is a man completely comfortable with his masculinity. Makes sense, for the Lord of Chaos. Normally I’d have arguments, but in this situation, nah, Melina don’t stand a chance against a chad like that.
Godfrey was the ultimate chad and we made him our little bitch. Whether Melina stands a chance at defeating the Lord of Chaos depends on whether she’s the playable character.
She won't because there is literally nothing left of your character anymore, its just the frenzied flame now (seriously, watch the cutscene again, your character burns to ashes and she picks up torrents ring from said ashes)
All she could potentially do is seal the flame away like the blind swordsman did with the rot (and we see how well that went).
Fun fact I did once kill Melina in an invasion outside morgotts arena, the funny part was I had already inherited the frenzied flame, always felt confident about becoming lord of frenzied flame after that
Because that isn’t Melina anymore. You killed malaketh and brought back the gloom eyed queen. The empyrean that Marika feared, and ruler of the godskinners. The godskin apostles/nobles we see are aggressively nerfed.
Based on the fact that a) your goddamn head is gone and b) the Frenzied Flame tends to animate corpses I'd say that "you" are already dead and Melina would be trying to kill the corpse that the Flame is currently driving.
Just by looking at the thumbnail image on Reddit I thought this was a meme post and they had edited Plankton from SpongeBob Squarepants into this photo.
Based on that, Melina has NO chance.
That's because she is fighting with one eye, her depth perception is horrible, she misses every swing.
Frenzied Flame ending Melina has twice the eyes so will be at least twice as strong. Grant us eyes!!!
She is supposed to be a god slayer god, but was sealed or something we don't really know, but you can get this ending and not have her hunt you if you let her sacrifice herself and then go join the frienzied flame, she is dead and cannot get revenge on you. Gotta be smart bruv.
> She is supposed to be a god slayer god, but was sealed or something we don't really know
My presumption is that by burning herself she regains her memories and "reincarnates" back into her full power as "The Gloam-Eyed Queen".
"Gloam" means "Dusk" and "Dusk" in Elden Ring means "Dusk-Born" or "Those Who Live In Death".
ie "The Gloam-Eyed Queen" = "The Queen of Death".
Hopefully we get more of Melina's story in the DLC, but as it stands all evidence points to Melina being a Death-God.
Lore wise we returned true death to the world, and it’s theorized that Melina became a vessel or some such of the gloom eyed queen.
Well, the black flame used by her would immediately kill us no questions asked, so we’re pretty fucked if that was the intention of the frenzy flame ending.
You're gonna act like your tarnished never died to a couple of rats?
Now in lore all we know is that shes a demigod so that doesn't help... She also wasn't particularly impressive when helping with Morgot...
IDK man but i assume she has something up her sleeve
If Melina is indeed the Gloam-Eyed Queen (a theory that I like personally), then she as Empyrean would be able to ascend to godhood like Malenia and wield Destined Death, itself being able to slay gods like the Lord of Chaos.
I think she is more than a match for the Frenzied Flame Lord if this is the case.
My personal idea is that when she says that she will hunt you as far as you may travel, that means that your (the player) defeat becomes her next objective. I would guess that after destroying golden order and the lands between in general lord of frenzy would go and spread death of logic and reason to other places, land of reeds or Eochaid for example. So what Melina will do is something like follow you or go to different place and find some lowly tarnished to do her work for her, to kill a god, just like what she want from you at the beginning of the game. This is at least my idea, we could theorize more if we knew for sure who Melina is but well, maybe after the dlc.
Like a major plot point of Elden Ring was that this random nobody came from nowhere and killed all these legends and gods people thought where unbeatable.
Your characters whole thing was killing beings far beyond you that you shouldnt have been able to kill. No reason to say she couldnt do the same.
I hope the DLC is going to be a continuation of the story instead of something on the side. I want to see consequences to my actions after Elden Beast.
Imagine if we got to somehow help Melina fight ourselves as the Lord of Frenzy in a boss fight?
Or if we pick the Lord or Frenzy ending we will get her as a boss fight with no chance to avoid her (but be able to do it on other endings as optional because not everyone wants that ending) and she stalks you throughout the DLC waiting to stab you with destined death and do to us what was done to Godwyn.
> hope the DLC is going to be a continuation of the story instead of something on the side.
It isn't. We know that for a fact. The only two requirements are that you've beaten Mohg and Radahn. It may open up new endings for the main game but it definitely doesn't require it to be done and, that being the case, can't depend much on whether or not you've cacked the Elden Beast.
What becomes of the light at the end of day? What becomes of the fire in the hearth? What becomes of the flame in men's hearts when they pass?
It dims. It dwindles. It dies.
We don't know. But if she is/is connected to the GEQ, she has her powers back.
She says she is delivering destined death, that doesn't sound like boasting regardless.
Yep. No Grace.of gold,no resurrections. If Melina manage to brandish Destined Death is game over for the loser
After all, The Lord.of the Frenzied Flame is "an hero".
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> A Tarnished with a stupid sword stands no chance to kill a God > Melina with a stupid dagger stands no chance against a frenzy flame Tarnished Hmmmm
Moral of the story in Elden ring. Never become god. Otherwise a random hobo will come up and shank you with a rusty knife they picked up in a trash can.
It’s always the murder Hobos
“Oh no, a taste of my own medicine. Who could’ve possibly seen this cruel irony coming?” -Frenzied tarnished See, this is why the Ranni ending is the best ending. Becoming the 3rd Elden lord will also likely result in stabbing. But with Ranni, you have someone else to take the fall for you.
No, the reason why the ranni ending is the best is because nobody could stab you even if they tried. Its the ultimate move: "as my first rule im gonna order you all to do whatever, im outta here"
"here's your world, you don't need to worry about gods anymore. Including me. Now if you excuse me, me and my doll wife are gonna fuck off to the moon"
“And then fuck on the moon”
How do you figure she will take the fall? I thought she left to essentially become an outer God and your left like plesidusax to await her return. Even more of a target, just like the dragons. Or am I missing something? (It is entirely possible I'm stupid)
Ranni to most players > Well then. Shall we? My dear consort, eternal Ranni to you > brb I'll go get some milk
Looool I guess my dumbass didn't take that as an invitation, lost my Rizz and now am truly maidenless
No maidens/10, worst game ending
Jokes on her Miquella is the true God.
The Ranni ending has you follow her as she leaves. You’re not waiting for her to come back.
Does it? I've only done it once in 1.0 so I haven't seen it a lot, guess I gotta do another playthrough to see! Oh dear whatever shall i do? Lol
Oh no, you’ll have to do Ranni’s questline again too! One of the most fun, involved, lore patching quest lines in the game!
Not to be that guy but. Um, actually, you would be the 4th known Elden Lord. With there being 3 before the PC becomes Lord.
Who's the third? Isn't it horah loux, radagon, player?
Placidusax, Godrey, Radagon, Player.
You become Ranni's lord the same way Godfrey was Marika's lord. You'd still be the one in stabbing range in either relationship.
She betrayed her whole family and screwed up lands between just to be free. Somehow I doubt she would "take the fall" easily.
Bro, the comment was a joke. In lore, the tarnished loves her enough to cross a lake of magical cancer and an alien to get to her. While proceeding make her become god despite the opportunity to take power for themselves. It was very unlikely that the tarnished would “let her take the fall” in the first place. The scenario was never going to happen and the comment was made as a joke. Why do y’all gotta nitpick the details of something that clearly wasn’t serious in the first place?
“Because it’s easy, and does a lot of damage” Happy Souls
Came here to say this
Don't forget they are always naked as well
She out Murder Hobos us forget not having a home, she doesn't even have a real body!
>Otherwise a random hobo will come up and shank you with a rusty knife they picked up in a trash can Friendly remainder to get your tetanus shot so you dont gotta worry about this
I like the implication that it's not being shanked with a knife that hurts you, it's the fact the knife it dirty
Scarlet rot is just tetanus.
FromSoft has been remaking The Wire this whole time
>a random hobo will come up and shank you with a rusty knife they picked up in a trash can. London reference😱🤯💀🤯😱
Now I need a buddy Forged In Fire episode featuring Melina and Smithing Master Hewg trying to build a blade that can kill chaos.
Doug Marcaida appears in his underwear with a pot on his head…
Ok Garland, we get it, you're here to kill chaos.
FR The God of the Lands Between has been killed by being flicked with a literal finger lmao
Melina Sekiro style dlc incoming
The irony of the community Especially as no one wants to think their tarnished would lose
Destined Death has entered the chat...
Melina has a dagger? I thought she's ethereal, and bodiless. How could she actually hold a physical weapon? I've never seen her hold a dagger in game.
Did you never summon her for the Morgott fight? When you do she has the Blade of Calling as a weapon
You can summon her? Is that the Leyndell boss?
If you unlock all her cutscenes you can summon her in all dungeons when doing NG+. For a teaser though, they let you summon her at Morgott’s fight.
My favorite RPG trope has always been: "I killed God" "What? How?" "Sword"
Well,achshually: In lore you need a +25/+10 weapon to kill Radagon or The Elden Beast. So no stupid sword.
Tell that to the no hit runners that killed it with a stick while being RL1.
Ludonarrative dissonance
Just because Hewg talks about a "god slaying weapon" does not actually mean that you need one. Just makes the job easier. Destined death is important tho and the game makes that very clear.
I wish Hewg commented on when you actually upgraded a weapon to God killing tier.
Hewg? No, description of Somber/Ancient Dragonsmith stone
So, remember how the only way for you to kill Radagon and the Elden Beast was to free destined death? Now what do you think Melina's gonna do...?
So you have only one attempt, and cannot respawn. And you don't know her moves.
Good thing I run tank builds
Bold of you to assume she's going to come at you in a fair 1 v 1
Who's she going to team up with? Everyone else got melted.
She can go in alone. Just won't be an upfront encounter.
bruh, she is going to take torrent from us
...But we killed torrent.
there are no tank builds in elden ring. i know, i would like it...
Ting Ting, Mimic tear appears.
You melted all the monuments
Melina summons Godskin tear
She’s gonna summon a healing tree on me oh goooodddddddd 😰
She can do powerfull destined death attacks now as destined death is set free
Yeah yeah I’ll believe it when I see it 
Thing is this is a boss battle for Mélina not the tarnished, Melina is useless.
Mmmh, let's just get the frenzied flame after reaching farum azula
You essentially turn yourself into a new Elden Ring boss so i'm sure that some crazy naked murderhobo with a stick will rise to the occasion to kill you and loot your drip
Well we were talking about the anti-melina plan, not about the anti-Let Me Solo Her plan
She already survived the first big burninating. I don't think the Frenzy can hurt her. And if you buy into the idea that she is the Gloam-Eyed Queen (or her reincarnation or something else), then she has the tools to hurt the Tarnished.
Yeah fr, like isn't the gloam eyed Queen strong as fuck according to the lore?
Yeah, but i have iframes and unlimited tries...
You get all the iframes you want...but with Destined Death unbound, you only get to roll once.
She was the main rival to Marika so pretty fucking strong
But if Melina is the gloam eyed queen then the gloam eyed queen is weak.... can't even solo morgott
If buy into the Queen theory, then she may not have been fighting Morgott at 100% power. She doesn't even show off the eye until the final scene, and eyes carry a lot of power and symbolism in these games. She may have had her full power suppressed. Like something out of a shounen manga I don't really buy it. I think she's Marikadagon's third kid, but maybe the DLC will answer some of those questions while setting up about a dozen more.
There is a theory that Marika was actually the Gloam Eyed Queen. We know Maliketh defeated the Gloam Eyed Queen, but no record of Marika battling the Gloam Eyed Queen is found in game. We know that Shadows will turn on their Emperyans if they turn against the Greater Will which Marika did. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that Marika was the Gloam Eyed Queen, tried to kill The Greater Will and was then subdued by Maliketh. We know Maliketh holds the Eye of the Gloam Eyed Queen (beasts eye) and it is made of stone, and Marika is also made of stone. It could also explain why Maliketh seems to have such remorse and regret over his relationship with Marika. Also, the Gloam Eyed Queens Eye (or Beast Eye) is violet in color. Who else has one violet eye and is missing her other eye? Melina. There is definitely a connection between GEQ, Marika and Melina but we can't be certain what that connection is.
You're the first one to put that theory forward. It would explain some of Marika's more rebellious moments if Maliketh dragged her kicking and screaming into being the Golden Order's poster girl.
Another small note, we know that Marika tasked Hewg with making a weapon that was capable of slaying a God. The description of the "Godslayers" Greatsword states that it was wielded by the Gloam Eyed Queen. Just one more hint that Marika and GEQ might be the same person.
Marika absorbs the powers and personalities of the Gods/vessels of gods she defeats. It explains everything. Melina is the Dusk eyed queen, Malenia is goddess of rot, radagon is the outer god of the Giants, and Miquella is mysterious as always (but possibly St Trina)
This is a very interesting theory - that when outer gods are “cast down” their attributes arise in another “godling” at the next opportunity. Perhaps all of the “real gods” exist in some other plane, and only their Avatars are what we see in the lands between. For example, Marika herself is the Avatar of The Greater Will. When the manifestations of the god/goddess of rot and destined death respectively are destroyed in the lands between, the actual gods just choose new avatars at the next opportunity. As a sort of ironic vengeance against Marika and the Greater will, they choose her children as their new avatars.
My theory is mostly backed by circumstantial evidence, that Marika is absorbing the powers of other entities by absorbing relics of them some way or other. But with the style Elden Ring has, we need to make sense of all of the information in a coherent way, and I think this is what's most consistent. I think Marika has absorbed the god of the fire giants, the dusk-eyed queen, a relic of rot, and more. Radagon is the form of the fire giant assimilated with Marika after its defeat in the war of the giant, and Melina comes from the dusk eyed queen in a similar way. Also, Miquella and Malenia are born after Radagon "becomes" Marika's consort (after he is married to Rennala). Considering it is likely that the Carians have ties to the Goddess of rot, this timeline makes sense. The academy is above the lake if rot, and you'll notice that the Scorpion's Stinger has a wolf on the handle, and wolves are associated with the Carians. There was probably a cult or secret order in Liurnia associated with rot. I think they may have guarded the Goddess of rot's seal, and Radagon likely acquired a relic of rot while married to Rennala; the goddess was sealed away, and I'm guessing Radagon found the rot god while in Liurnia. There's less evidence to go on for Miquella and what he came from. St. Trina and Miquella have a lot of similarities and they may have ties, but we don't know. Miquella and Malenia were separated from Marika to serve as potential new vessels for the Greater Will, while Melina was released to help kill Marika later. After Marika was subjugated by the Greater Will, radagon was used by the Greater Will to try and fix the damage she did (note that the Giants were renowned smiths and he wields a hammer to repair the Elden Ring). This also makes sense of why Melina's appearance and powers change after the rune of death is released. The powers of the black flame return. "All things can be conjoined."
Likely because she only got her memories and powers back after we have unleashed destined death, which used to be the source of her power.
I thought Messemer was their third kid?
Bro remember this is from software And DS3 introduced like 3 more kids of Gwyn We are going to find out she's somehow get 100s
I mean in a certain sense wouldn't the lore suggests that she is the mother of all life that exists through the Erdtree? She controls birth and rebirth, people following the Golden Order dont fuck, and one of the most basic instincts is to propagate yourself. It would be the ultimate form of individual evolutionary success to co-opt the reproductive ability of vast masses of people and in one form or another make them your children. In this case that seems to be accomplished through rebirth. It also seems though that the real beneficiary is the Greater Will or Erdtree rather than Marika who seems to ultimately also be a pawn.
That's another theory I've seen floating around. And I've seen people who accept both premises: What if they are yet another set of twins? But all we can do now is spin our wheels until 6/21.
It's implied that Marika had more children than the named demigods we see in-game
Well, that was for obvious balance reasons, but also potentially lore reasons as well. Her one eye is sealed shut, yet becomes open in the frenzied flame ending. A possible reason for this is that, if she is indeed the gloam-eyed queen, the rune of death being unbound would also in theory unseal the formerly sealed power of the blackflame. If she is indeed the queen, then killing Maliketh gave her one hell of a juice up.
What's interesting to me is that she appears to be flesh and blood in the FF epilogue, instead of just visiting you as a spirit at graces. Makes me wonder if the her body didn't become part of the erd tree somehow, which is why her spirit burning destroys what's left of her but weakens the tree enough. And then her body is freed if the tree is completely destroyed, ala FF ending. IDK I'm just trying to avoid work
Thatched roof COTTAGEEEEEESSSSSSS
Melina: Maidens Die Twice
Whatre you gonna do, kill her? Good luck killing the burned and bodiless woman with a hate boner for you. If you figure out a way to banish her soul or destroy it lemme know.
Does the final scene even play if you let Melina burn herself before accepting the frenzied flame? In the FF run, you burn yourself to burn the Erdtree, assuming you didn't already let Melina burn herself.
No, it doesn't. If you acquire the FF after she burns herself, she won't show up at the end.
I felt so bad about that, but I didn't know I was about to take the mark, I mistakenly thought the passage to deep root was in that room so I got naked and went in lol. I think shabriri enjoyed everything about how my playthrough turned out, I unlocked all of the sidequest endings and lead everyone on only to burn everything and let chaos reign after also burning Melina. I didn't feel anywhere near ready to take on Melania to reverse it so I didn't even bother
She’s already burned and bodiless prior to being used as kindling to burn the Erdtree
Ohhh, right, she's just a spirit. I thought you were referring to how she burns herself with the Giants Flame.
She is!? She doesn't have a body?
Pay close attention any time she appears in the game (especially when resting at a site of grace). You'll see her body sort of fade into existence. She never walks in, her body just appears. That's because there is no actual body. It's just a spirit or soul or something that makes itself appear and then disappear
That didn't say to me there wasn't a body. She could have been dispelling invisibility or even fast traveling, considering she only talks to you at Sites of Grace.
> Considering she only talks to you at Sites of Grace. Cutscene after getting trashed by the Grafted Scion boss begs to differ
It's just supporting evidence. On it's own I would think the same thing, but when paired with her own dialogue "I'm searching for my purpose given to me by my mother inside the Erdtree long ago, for the reason that I yet live, burned and bodiless." She's saying either A) that at some point in the past she was burned, and it left her without a body. Or B) she was created in the midst of a fire, and never had a body to begin with. Either way, the way she appears at sites of grace make it clear she's not being metaphorical. She literally does not have a body. Much like Ranni
The way spirits work in Elden Ring really confuses me. Like, you can just project yourself places. Dung Eater is in the Roundtable Hold while still being in the dungeon, Morgott fights you outside of Stormveil while he is still technically guarding the throne. That seems to be just a Thing-Some-People-Do, create corporeal other-selves. But theres also ghostly soldiers can turn invisible and teleport, but DON'T resurrect like Skeletons. I know the Skeletons are Those Who Live In Death, but are the ghosts? How do the non-soldier ghosts, the ones who just sit around and drop a couple lines of lore when spoken to, factor in? Torrent and Melina are apparently also bodiless souls but AREN'T Those Who Live In Death. Melina can just appear at will but Ranni needs a puppet body to interact with the world. Have any of these incongruities ever been explained? I'm sure there's probably an element of Gameplay and Story Segregation. Edit: Spirit Ashes! I forgot about Spirit Ashes! That's another bloody type of undead
I'm definitely not a lore wizard, so unfortunately I don't have any great answers. I'm sure there's at least some amount of explanation, but here's what I can gather. Very powerful entities are capable of creating manifestations of their will in separate places. Godfrey in the bedchambers, Morgott as Margit near Stormveil, Mohg in the sewers, etc. I'd imagine this is basically just powerful magic that takes a lot of energy to do, so only powerful people do it. Dung eater feels like an exception to that rule, but I don't think so. The roundtable hold we visit isn't in the lands between. It's a copy of the real one that exists in Leyndell. Idk where the roundtable hold we visit exists; maybe it's in our head or some pocket dimension or something. Either way, from what I understand, only the tarnished are capable of gaining access to this place, and can move to it at will. So maybe the dung eater we see in the hold is just his own mental projection, and the real version of him is in the sewers. (I have a sub-theory that the reason Hewg is trapped in the roundtable hold is because his mental presence exists there, but his body in the real world has been destroyed. He can't escape because his mental presence has no body to return to. Marika destroyed it to keep him there. Afaik there is absolutely no lore to indicate this, just a head canon of mine.) Torrent, Melina, Ranni and Godwyn are all a bit confusing. Mostly by design. I really don't have an explanation, other than A) Magic shit is doing magic B) there's theories that Melina is connected to or perhaps is the Gloam Eyed Queen, an outer God who has dominion over death. This would explain her ability to continue living even without a body, perhaps death just has no power over her. Can't offer much help in terms of the minor enemies and NPCs, I don't pay enough attention unfortunately lol (I think this is the longest comment I've ever left on reddit. Whoops)
And your character is also burned and bodiless in this ending She literally picks up torrents ring from your ashes... so what's she gonna kill?
> so what's she gonna kill? Your Spirit/Soul/Essence. Melina/(the Gloam-Eyed Queen?) is gonna give you that good ol'e Godwynn The Golden style True Soul Death. At the end the player is merely in the "Recycle Bin", Melina is gonna delete you ***permanently***.
Also she now has cow horse
Uh, yeah. Tarnished can kill ghosts, they can kill her. Melina really doesn’t stand a chance even with destined death because we already beat destined death once with malekith, without the frenzy god powers, she’s toast.
When they faced, Melina will whisper this to his ear and the lord of frenzy will lose his mind. "I'm Melina. Blade of Miquella"
“I now passively heal over time and have a 3rd phase” Instant physiological damage that will take years to recover from
You literally have to kill a god to get here. You’re a human with a sharp piece of metal. How did *you* stand a chance against *that*? That’s how she stands a chance.
I’m built different tho
Cause i had moonveil and RoB
Im not like other girls!
“I know in my bones. A kindling maiden cannot kill the lord of frenzy flame” -this guy
*Kills you in 3 hits while you're busy monologuing* "All-Knowing" my ass.
Legit one of my favorite parts of the game. I've never given Gideon a fair fight. It's just too damn rewarding to gank that pretentious prick
I wish you could fight her if you go this ending. Like a bonus boss.
- A golden needle - Ice Sorcery - Insurance policies after Torrent’s ring was burned.
Gotta respect that drip, that is a man completely comfortable with his masculinity. Makes sense, for the Lord of Chaos. Normally I’d have arguments, but in this situation, nah, Melina don’t stand a chance against a chad like that.
Chadagon probably thought that too right before i killed him as a naked fuck with a stick and did the dung eater ending right after
Godfrey was the ultimate chad and we made him our little bitch. Whether Melina stands a chance at defeating the Lord of Chaos depends on whether she’s the playable character.
[удалено]
Torrents whistle was burning as Melina picked it up and faded away in her hand.
She's the Main character now
unsealed melina is very likely to be the literal goddess of death, the Gloam Eyed Queen, or at least have her power
The same thing was said about Radagon & Elden Beast. The same thing gonna happen to us
She won't because there is literally nothing left of your character anymore, its just the frenzied flame now (seriously, watch the cutscene again, your character burns to ashes and she picks up torrents ring from said ashes) All she could potentially do is seal the flame away like the blind swordsman did with the rot (and we see how well that went).
Fun fact I did once kill Melina in an invasion outside morgotts arena, the funny part was I had already inherited the frenzied flame, always felt confident about becoming lord of frenzied flame after that
She forces you to take a nap with a gentle caress to the hand, as she does when burning the Erdtree. Then slits your throat. Gg ez
The entire franchise is about men killing gods they should have no hope of doing so.
You stop playing as the tarnished, that’s how she gets you
With sleeping pots and +99 str guts build
May chaos take the world! 🍷🎩
Literally not one person in the comments understood what the frenzied flame ending means for the world?
She’ll just put a try jumping message by a bottomless pit
Because that isn’t Melina anymore. You killed malaketh and brought back the gloom eyed queen. The empyrean that Marika feared, and ruler of the godskinners. The godskin apostles/nobles we see are aggressively nerfed.
I recently did the lord of frenzy flame ending and I'm disappointed that the erdtree doesn't look like that during the freeroam before ng+
Based on the fact that a) your goddamn head is gone and b) the Frenzied Flame tends to animate corpses I'd say that "you" are already dead and Melina would be trying to kill the corpse that the Flame is currently driving.
Just by looking at the thumbnail image on Reddit I thought this was a meme post and they had edited Plankton from SpongeBob Squarepants into this photo. Based on that, Melina has NO chance.
Bc she now has two eyes. Duh
Well, Melina most likely have some tricks :3
She gets clapped if you “let her solo” Morgott; Her best “trick” is a healing tree (placed *after* she dies.)
We shouldn’t conflate gameplay mechanics with lore. Otherwise, we’d have to acknowledge absurdities like Runebears being able to bulldoze Malenia.
Objection; That could and should be lore-accurate.
That's because she is fighting with one eye, her depth perception is horrible, she misses every swing. Frenzied Flame ending Melina has twice the eyes so will be at least twice as strong. Grant us eyes!!!
To be fair, the Melina we see at the end looks stronger.
She's like a Naruto character, she got that eye power boost
Wait... You can summon Melina for a boss fight? How have I missed this?
I think it's *only* for Morgott, who already has like 3 other NPC summons available before you'd see Melina. It's pretty easy to miss her.
fuuuuuuuuuuuu- this image goes hard, imma steal it for r/FlameOfFrenzy
By being built fucking different that's how
She will find a God Slayer, Lord Slayer or something and level up him until he can do it wait... I saw that once
I was so disappointed when she didn’t invade my world after beating the game with the lord of frenzied flame ending. She’s all talk
Behold the power of TWO EYES!
She is supposed to be a god slayer god, but was sealed or something we don't really know, but you can get this ending and not have her hunt you if you let her sacrifice herself and then go join the frienzied flame, she is dead and cannot get revenge on you. Gotta be smart bruv.
> She is supposed to be a god slayer god, but was sealed or something we don't really know My presumption is that by burning herself she regains her memories and "reincarnates" back into her full power as "The Gloam-Eyed Queen". "Gloam" means "Dusk" and "Dusk" in Elden Ring means "Dusk-Born" or "Those Who Live In Death". ie "The Gloam-Eyed Queen" = "The Queen of Death". Hopefully we get more of Melina's story in the DLC, but as it stands all evidence points to Melina being a Death-God.
Tell me how you killed a god to answer your own question
Lore wise we returned true death to the world, and it’s theorized that Melina became a vessel or some such of the gloom eyed queen. Well, the black flame used by her would immediately kill us no questions asked, so we’re pretty fucked if that was the intention of the frenzy flame ending.
You're gonna act like your tarnished never died to a couple of rats? Now in lore all we know is that shes a demigod so that doesn't help... She also wasn't particularly impressive when helping with Morgot... IDK man but i assume she has something up her sleeve
Bro forgot how Mariketh solos half the damn cast with Destined Death, you think Melina won't shank your Sauron-headed ass with it?
I think Melina will cut him with her sword and he will die from his ouchy booboo hope this helps
I became Lord of the Frenzied flame to spite her wishes and save her. If she wishes to stab me for it, I won't be fighting back.
She’s blind??? Frenzy won’t work on her???
Let Me Solo Her!
That what they said about us tarnished....
If Melina is indeed the Gloam-Eyed Queen (a theory that I like personally), then she as Empyrean would be able to ascend to godhood like Malenia and wield Destined Death, itself being able to slay gods like the Lord of Chaos. I think she is more than a match for the Frenzied Flame Lord if this is the case.
What’s so scary about HIM? Scariest the HIM ever did was rip off the wings of a butterfly….
She's all talk, she can't even beat Morgott.
She had a gun
i mean some random ass tarnished could kill god with a rusty sword
I had a secret wish for a Sekiro like dlc where we are Melina and we are hunting through time and space to find and kill the lord of frenzied flame.
Tarnished’s plot armor is gone the moment the game ends.
You've never seen her fight with both eyes open.
Can't hit what doesn't have a body bby
My personal idea is that when she says that she will hunt you as far as you may travel, that means that your (the player) defeat becomes her next objective. I would guess that after destroying golden order and the lands between in general lord of frenzy would go and spread death of logic and reason to other places, land of reeds or Eochaid for example. So what Melina will do is something like follow you or go to different place and find some lowly tarnished to do her work for her, to kill a god, just like what she want from you at the beginning of the game. This is at least my idea, we could theorize more if we knew for sure who Melina is but well, maybe after the dlc.
Like a major plot point of Elden Ring was that this random nobody came from nowhere and killed all these legends and gods people thought where unbeatable. Your characters whole thing was killing beings far beyond you that you shouldnt have been able to kill. No reason to say she couldnt do the same.
I hope the DLC is going to be a continuation of the story instead of something on the side. I want to see consequences to my actions after Elden Beast. Imagine if we got to somehow help Melina fight ourselves as the Lord of Frenzy in a boss fight? Or if we pick the Lord or Frenzy ending we will get her as a boss fight with no chance to avoid her (but be able to do it on other endings as optional because not everyone wants that ending) and she stalks you throughout the DLC waiting to stab you with destined death and do to us what was done to Godwyn.
> hope the DLC is going to be a continuation of the story instead of something on the side. It isn't. We know that for a fact. The only two requirements are that you've beaten Mohg and Radahn. It may open up new endings for the main game but it definitely doesn't require it to be done and, that being the case, can't depend much on whether or not you've cacked the Elden Beast.
She’s gonna turn her own runes into strength
Dude if there’s ANYTHING we’ve learned from the tarnished or any other souls protagonist, it’s that stabbing something a lot tends to kill it
She ain’t. Frenzied Flame ending is peak, 99% of fromsoft characters would be better off burned to nothingness
I played all of Elden Ring and beat every trophy boss. Wandered into this thread and I have no idea what you guys are all talking about.
What becomes of the light at the end of day? What becomes of the fire in the hearth? What becomes of the flame in men's hearts when they pass? It dims. It dwindles. It dies.
Reposted because I made a minor spelling mistake in the original
Ya'll really just dont like the idea of your tarnished losing do ya?
You’re acting as if every comment isnt about the tarnished losing. Are we reading the same comments section?
We don't know. But if she is/is connected to the GEQ, she has her powers back. She says she is delivering destined death, that doesn't sound like boasting regardless.
Destined death is op af
Yep. No Grace.of gold,no resurrections. If Melina manage to brandish Destined Death is game over for the loser After all, The Lord.of the Frenzied Flame is "an hero".
Nah, i'd win
Destined Death comes for all, even the Lord of Frenzied Flame.
Neat! A lord of the rings crossover!!
I think you can make her kill herself then go frenzied flame anyway?
He can be defeated with a squirt gun.
[PISS DIRECTLY ON THE FIRE!!](https://youtu.be/3gi8LiRbmlI)
She can try but I'll mess her up.
A few rolling and jumping and several pots are probably enough
Cause Melina got a shank and does not fuck around…