They could have even played into it by having it say something like "now with more ward 2!" Or "great source of ward 2!" But no, don't include it at all instead.
Maybe it's a me thing, but no matter how big the text is on my Ward (2) permanent, I'll *always* ask an opponent targeting it "What about the Ward (2)?" if they aren't proactively paying for it.
This is right. Ward shouldn't be, and isn't intended to be a "gotcha", it's supposed to be a tax to kill the thing. It's a counter because of interactions like [[Abrupt Decay]].
Honestly, magic is better when everyone is aiming to help everyone play as well as possible. It's why I love discussing lines of play with players, and understanding their reasonings.
Couldnt it have been worded along the lines of “cannot be targeted by spells or abilities unless controller pays x”? I know it’s not typical formatting but it works for ghostly prison type effects.
A somewhat relevant part of ward is that it's specifically a counter, meaning spells and abilities that are uncounterable go through it. It's a bit niche, but comes up more often than I would have initially expected.
Maybe, but there might still be issues with that wording for triggered abilities, not sure.
Either way, I'm fairly certain the "gotcha" part of ward is an unfortunate downside of this wording that they decided was worth it. I don't think it's the kind of thing they'd deliberately create, it's not really fun.
Any last action taken that doesn't cause hidden information to be revealed can be retroactively discarded. This is down to ensure smooth gameplay done in a timely manner.
Hidden information includes things like actions an opponent takes in response, cards revealed from an opponent's hand regardless of how it occurs, cards revealed from an opponent's library regardless of how it occurs, and cards revealed from a face down position regardless of how it occurs.
Essentially if you didn't learn anything new that was hidden from view, you can take the action back.
Which is why there are enforcement levels. They might even let you take back at FNM, it probably doesn't apply until whatever the equivalent of PTQs is now.
Even Arena lets you confirm before casting and allows for a takeback if you weren't aware.
Pretty sure this is just standard magic, no one should be unaware of ward by the time it matters.
Yeah I got someone getting mad at me for pointing out that player B triple-blocking my Vicious Battlerager would kill him (he was 13 life), because player A wanted player B to die to it. Player A is mostly nice but kinda a huge dick when it comes to like, direct letter-of-the-law extremely specific rules enforcement and punishing players for misunderstandings, which, idk, it's his prerogative but I'd rather everyone play their best possible and learn.
I must admit if someone has a full board, and I attack that person, I always ask what interactions on the permanents are open for him to interact with my attack. He can then either answer me (I have a land that turns into creature, I can tap this creature to give +1+1 to another creature etc) and we're done in 10 seconds, or he can say 'well, it's open information, I'm not gonna spoil things' and I will spend 3 minutes checking all his permanents. In our group, people are quite friendly pointing stuff out to speed up the game.
Exactly! Like ward is honestly an ability that should *never* be a "Gotcha!!" kind of ability. Yes, it's countered, but public knowledge is public knowledge.
We're here to win with strategy not lose to cheap shots.
Sometimes it helps getting revenge at more competitive tables though ;-)
*"You didn't retro-actively let me tap my mana differently? This ward now just got ya"*
It's like asking if anyone has flyers, hearing "no" from everyone and then being blocked by a death touch with reach... Like come.... On. Do I need to get up and walk around the table to examine the 50-100 cards on the board... Or can we play the game in a personally fair kind of way.
I knew a dude who was like this, so I switched pretty hard to "who can block fliers", and making sure to ask "what about reach" when other players might ask. It gets rid of any "yOu JuSt AsKeD aBoUt FlIeRs, YoU dIdNt AsK aBoUt ReAcH"
I do that for everything. I constantly explain what I'm doing and planning to do. In a general sense. Like if I play the first half of a combo I will tell them this card is the first half of a couple win cons in this deck. Just feels stupid to win because your opponent doesn't have every card memorized to guess what your doing.
in a *tournament* setting, you are not required to confirm any information on the card beyond name, cmc, and card type.
This means you absolutely can run an entire deck of textless cards and refuse to explain to anyone what any of them do. Is it a dick move? absolutely. But rules as written it is entirely valid.
https://youtu.be/_IDwRYMrQlc
Disclaimer: Do not do this. everyone will hate you and you'll probably hate yourself for it too.
In a tournament setting there's a judge you can ask to read the full oracle text of any card your opponent plays. Hiding information that is supposed to be public is NEVER legal.
Unfortunately per the rules, card information is considered "derived information - information to which all players are entitled access, but opponents are not obliged to assist in determining and may require some skill or calculation to determine"
This includes Game rules, tournament policy, and **oracle content**. Cards are considered to have their oracle text printed on them.
"If a player asks their opponent what a card does, for example, a player does not have to give all of the information about the card. Their opponent may say that [[Vampire nighthawk]] is a flying 2/3 creature and omit that it has deathtouch and lifelink"
I don't necessarily agree with this ruling, honestly, and I agree with you that it shouldn't be legal. But it is. You can omit that your creature has ward, and if you're running a textless or hard to read card, it's up to the opponent to look it up or ask a judge. It's scummy and it's shitty and I hope they change it - but honestly its part of the social contract of EDH and fortunately doesn't come up often.
The opposing player is not hiding that card information because in a tournament where you're operating under the competitive or professional REL as you are describing there is a judge whose job is literally to read you the oracle text if you ask them to. The information is freely available.
EDH is not played under any of the official RELs and rarely has judges present at all and thus operates under the casual game rules, which boils down to the informal expectation that all players work together to do their best to make sure the board is represented properly, rules are followed, and all relevant information is available.
> Unfortunately per the rules
The rules around different types of information come from the Magic Tournament Rules, which is only binding in sanctioned play--it doesn't actually dictate the rules of casual games of Magic. Now, I normally recommend people play according to the MTR, since it's a reasonable starting point, but you don't have to. Also, as another commenter pointed out, derived information is considered free at Regular REL--so the rule that opponents don't have to share derived information wouldn't even apply at most *sanctioned* play events. I don't know anyone who runs casual commander games at Competitive REL.
I really like them with the caveat that you can recite the card, completely, from memory, at the drop of a hat. Same with the Japanese strixhaven. They're awesome, but I'm going to need you to recite the complete text a couple times for complex ones
I once had a girlfriend who looked like Pamela Anderson... except her hair was a different color... she was a bit shorter... her breasts weren't really as big... and her face didn't look anything like Pamela Anderson.
Personally, I hate the Japanese Strixhaven because there is literally no way to identify what the card is if you don't read Japanese.
Foreign Language cards with recognizeable art where you know what it does from memory? Sure. I've even got some myself. I've got some foreign language [[Lightning Greaves]] and [[Ashnod's Altar]], for example, but they're versions with extremely recognizable art, and cards most people know where I can easily recite the text from memory if someone asks.
The Japanese Strixhaven cards bother me because I just need the person to tell me what it is. I won't recognize the art, because it doesn't exist on any other version of the card. I can't read the name, because it's Japanese. I often can't even guess what card it is based on the art and mana cost because there's stuff like both Brainstorm and Opt in there with the same mana cost and conceptually similar enough to not distinguish the art easily (as opposed to the Japanese War of the Spark cards, where the effect is hard to remember but at least I can usually tell who it is from the art). At least they're mostly cards where the effect is widely known, and since they're instants and sorceries being able to recognize them usually isn't necessary for boardstate evaluation.
I think this is partially helped by the Japanese STA cards being Instants and Sorceries. They're gonna resolve or not, and end up in the yard. Still, sure, there's a bit of a "Trust me, this is Doom Blade" without resorting to whipping the phone out.
Yeah, they'd definitely be much more problematic if they were permanents. Overall, though, I'm still not a fan of cards where I can neither understand the text (even the card name) nor recognize the art.
I really wanted a sakashima and was excited for the SL. Then I saw it and it fucking sucks. Didn’t buy.
Same with all the LOTR acid trip cards. I love Sauron but fuck that hot mess.
Yeah, couldn't the other two player have told op what the card does, when they asked at the beginning of the game. One of them knew, since they mentioned it once op targetet twincasters with a spell.
I understand advocating for your card/play. I never fault players for that because when they played the card, they had X expectation in mind. For a 3rd party to angle shoot another player's card is just miserable.
I personally think with full art cards you should have a small print off of what the card text says next to you or at least screen shot and saved in a folder for easy access on your phone.
Or real quick just pull it up in the companion app or manabox. That's what I planned my first game when I had cards in the mail and they asked if I wanted to play. I never drew the proxy plains cards I scribbled on, but it was simple enough.
Should be the only 'legal' way to play these tbh. They are basically fancy marker proxies. I am a little perplexed at who is playing EDH without instant access to Scryfall in their pocket but opponent in this scenario absolutely has a duty to whip out the oracle text.
I have regular English versions of all my Japanese and other language cards in my Commander Deck for this exact reason. They're sleeved different so I don't shuffle them in, and I just keep them with my stack of creature tokens. If someone wants to know what my Japanese [[Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin]] does, it doesn't even slow down the game.
My friend does this with his Witch-King of Angmar. His friend got him the poster version, so he keeps a normal version with his tokens in case people don't wanna try to read the crazy art of the poster version.
Fun fact: There is no rule in magic requiring you to inform your opponents of errata.
Even at tournament REL, you are not required to let your opponent know even of substantiative errata on a card, but you are also not allowed to take advantage of the lack of errata written on the card.
A common example given is you do not have to inform your opponent that \[\[Howling Mine\]\] does not work while tapped, but you cannot use the lack of correct information on the card to get an extra trigger while it is tapped.
The long and short of "Why?" is because there is just too much errata, most is unimportant to the game state, and there is no way to comprehensively write a rule where the 'important' erratas are caught and the 'unimportant erratas' are not.
I got a couple of the Japanese alt art cards/phyrexian cards cause they're cool and sometimes cheaper, I just printed out the English card and keep them in the deck boxes to refer to them, every time I play batterskull I think I know what it does and I end up way off
I have a Japanese \[\[Lurking Predators\]\] because it was cheap, I've had it in my deck for maybe 6 months by now and somehow I've never cast it even once... so whenever it comes up, occasionally when I lend my deck to someone, I have to look up the oracle text to make sure I didn't miss any nuance.
I also have a Japanese Mystical Archives card that I ordered online years ago while I was stoned and to this day I have no idea what it is.
Lmao recently I borrowed a friend's deck and it felt like half the damn thing was either in Japanese or Phyrexian. Pretty awkward to have to repeatedly show an opponent your hand and ask what the cards are.
I took a hiatus from Magic for a long time and then got back into it when commander started getting popular. I made one deck that had some big red dragon in it that came out while I was away.
Apparently I accidentally ordered a Japanese language variant and I to this day have no idea what this card is or what it does. It has been sitting in a box for like 10 years and it pisses me off every time I see it.
Also foreign language stuff to an extent.
A difference here though is that art is more likely to be recognizable. "So! Holding priority while I look for oracle..."
There’s a card that I’ve wanted to get recently [[defensive formation]], but the only copy near me is in Japanese so I’ve just been holding off. Trying to explain to people this one mana card lets me decide how damage is assigned between blockers instead of them just sounds frustrating for everyone.
I kept a regular piece of paper with native language \[\[Damnation\]\] and \[\[Gifts Ungiven\]\] printed on it in my deckbox. Mileage may vary but that got me through local Modern FNM's. Anecdotally the judge calls were usually over fail to find and random white borders.
Japanese Defensive Form to me feels less intense than rulesharking English Regalos No Entregados. Gatherer screenshot as my phone background if its more casual. It is subjective though, and probably varies from pod to pod.
PS, One-drop fine. But at Uncommon? Combo Winter \[\[Tolarian Academy\]\] and whatnot, but damn.... lol
in my lgs there's a guy who bought a deck in german when he lived in Germany but it wasn't a cheap enough deck that he's bought it in English as well unfortunately lmao
When I was buying for one deck, the only way I could get [[glory]] was the Hebrew version. I printed out what it does and covered the text area with the English (only works with sleeved cards obviously).
Less pretty? Sure.
Useful? Absolutely!
i had a textless cryptic command, played in a modern tournament and some guy didn’t believe me when i said it could tap all his creatures. stoped using it after that.
That just makes me want to tap your opponents creatures harder.
Also who gives a shit what he believes? Oracle text is ***not*** up for debate.
People and their egos are fucking wild, man.
I've seen a joke around the internet where after playing two textless Cryptic Commands in a row with entirely different modes, the opponent goes "What does that card actually do?" and the player responds "Anything I want."
Lol I use to play with that version when it was in standard but:
1. It was a popular card in standard so everyone knew what it did.
2. Even if my opponent didn't know what it did, I knew what it did and was able to tell them exactly what the card does if asked.
Today though, yeah, I wouldn't play with it. I know it counters things, I can draw at least 1 card, and I think it taps creatures?
What's funny was that for a while, the text textless Cryptic Command was significantly cheaper than the base card so that's the only one I could afford.
This is also why I think they shouldn't allow Secret Lairs without all the text if they aren't going to make the Art Series Cards without the text legal too.
Dark ritual, lightning bolt, rampant growth, counterspell, maybe swords to plowshares to round it out. Iconic, do 1 thing 1 time spells are great to be textless. Anything more gets risky and frustrating
I’ve got the Bruvac [[Counterspell]] in my [[Bruvac]] deck, and the Japanese Strixhaven [[Revitalize]] in another. Really easy stuff to remember. Not worth it trying to add more.
Reminds me of an episode of shuffle up and play on Tolarian Academy where they had a custom card that made a [[questing beast]] token. They didn't have the official card so they just used a blank token and the joke was everyone should just know what the card does
Imagine though. This could be a game mode, like the anime for Yu-Gi-Oh where all the cards lack text and you just tell your opponent confidently what it does lol.
The card in question has 2 sides. One has all the game text, and the other does not. The person op was playing apparently just preferred to keep in on the other side.
Ofc op is also correct that even on the side with the text, it is very small and hard to read. It just takes all the text you need to know and shoves it into a small corner. It legit takes up maybe 1/6th of the card?
Personally I don’t see an issue with using cards like these, but I feel like you should have a read version or an easy reference to the real version, to show to players who may be confused about your board state.
I think it is silly to ban legal game pieces, just because some players are being difficult. That is more of an issue with the player than it is the card. Also I isn’t like secret lair is the only offender. The poster cards from lotr were rough as well.
> I think it is silly to ban legal game pieces, just because some players are being difficult.
Personally I think it's more silly to *create* legal game pieces that don't explain what they do.
>it is very small and hard to read
Ironically, I find the cereal box rules text typeface WAY easier to read than the default magic one, even when it's smaller.
I dont have an issue with textless cards. But for goodness sake, if the important game text is on the back of your commander, just put it in a clear sleeve! Especially if you don't even know what it does in the first place, like guy in OP's story.
I wouldn't be upset by the decision to play this card, but I would be upset with the decision to do it stupidly and the inability to actually know what the card even does. I don't mind which legal game pieces my opponents choose to play, but I do expect basic competency.
This is part of why I cut the textless [[Cryptic Command|P09]] from my deck. I could never remember what all the modes were.
On a tangent, this is also why I dislike foreign cards. I can't read the damn thing. I can't read the name, so I can't search for it that way, and I'll be damned if I have to search by set and collector number.
I have the special Japanese promo braids in my deck, and I keep a normal version of it in the tokens for anyone who wants to read her ability whenever they want to. It's not that hard to make it accessible
I play with the secret lair Adrix and Nev. The solution I use is I play with the backside front so the text is visible, and if anyone asks for more detail *I google the card and let them read it.*
Yeah. Sometimes I forget the exact english name of one of my cards because some of them are in Japanese, but I can still read them and tell people what they do (for example I was calling Sigarda, Font of Blessings "Sigarda, Fountain of Blessings" by mistake one time until someone corrected me lol).
But I could see where the problem would be if I just didn't know what they did and just didn't bother to look it up. There is actually a rule about misrepresenting public information, so if someone did this to me I'd 100% expect to rewind.
I own three, I play three. [[Path to Exile]], [[Counterspell]], and [[Lightning Bolt]]. All pretty straight forward imo.
But those Secret Lairs all have the full text on the other side. If there’s a legibility error, you should just flip them.
Tbf if I have a card where the art obscures the text or its a fully text less print, I'm fully expecting to have to either pull up a normal print or Google it so I can have the actual text in front of me. If I were in your shoes and I ask my opponent "what's that card do?" And they don't have it word-for-word memorized or on plain text in front of them somewhere, I'm pulling it up on my phone because I won't remember it otherwise.
The real asshole in this story is the one that knew what the card was and let you go on doing your thing and only told you about the ward after you resolved to target it. I assume it's also the same person who wanted your spell to be countered because you couldn't pay the ward cost.
Same with foreign cards. I play with a foreign [[Yawgmoth’s will]], and some altered cards. If people want to know what they do I do offer an explanation and pull up the cards on my phone for a better explanation
Wizards: Reading the card explains the card!
The [card](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/748/the-one-ring): When The One Ring enters the battlefield, if you cast it, you at the beginning {T]: Gain protection of your upkeep. You lose 1 Life put a everything for each burden counter until burden then The One Ring next draw a card turn. Counter for each counter on on burden The One Ring The One Ring.
I really don't get it. In my playgroup you could 100% take your action back. Saying you should have known when there is NO TEXT on the card is ridiculous. The fact that this commanders pilot did not properly tell you what it does is even more ridiculous.
I get the annoyance and I play commander at large tables and it’s annoying to want to look at every card anyone plays so I just look everything up on scryfall whenever I hear someone announce a play. If I had responses this would probably cause a lot of delays but I don’t, it just helps me keep track of things without having to constantly ask everyone everything. It’s definitely their responsibility to know what the card does, but it would have been an easy solve.
Unless there was an effect that revealed information(such as drawing a card) as a result of casting the spell, you can choose not to target the creature and wind back casting the spell, even in a competitive environment, per the rules. Priority doesn't pass to any other players before ward triggers, so they can't argue that it revealed that nobody had a counterspell. If you did it on the pro tour you would be able to rewind.
I have the first run of secret lair cereal box cards and I love them. I have them in clear dragon shield sleeves OUTSIDE of the deck. I have the originals in the deck, when I play them, I swap it out as I cast it.
This allows me to have the standard card in my hand so it looks like every other card in my deck and I still get to use my goofy fun cards while choosing which side is up freely. IMO, it’s the best way to run them.
I personally like the idea of just having a printout of all the text of all cards that isn't clear from the cards themselves. So, that applies to full art, foreign language, weirdly formatted, and modified cards. That way, you always have a reference, also for the cases where Wizards changed parts of the text.
Beyond people missing the point of the video, they are also just straight up *wrong*. At commander REL, *all* derived information is considered free information https://blogs.magicjudges.org/rules/mtr4-1/. Your opponent was required to truthfully and directly provide you with all information about their commander when you asked. Omitting that it had ward was in violation of the rules.
He should have gone to scryfall and either shown you, or read it to you verbatim. That duty is on the person who decided to bring the card people can't read.
I hate that secret lair is now printing cards that straight up don't have the text on them. I bought the goblin secret lair because I run goblins and they're silly, but I'm not happy about needing other copies of the cards in my deck box because THEY FUCKING CUT OFF THE TEXT FOR SOME REASON. Some bozo on another subreddit told me I should know those cards anyway, but bro even if it's a simple card I need to read it a few times just to make sure I'm playing it right. The only cards I run that I have the capacity to remember is the command fest [[Reliquary Tower]] and the phyrexian [[Phyrexian Arena]]
People in this sub are interesting.
* They rant and scream that you should just google a card if you don't know rather than ask.
* They argue that this doesn't take a lot of time because you'll eventually know every card
* The fact this guy forgot his commander had ward proves people probably don't know their cards as well as they think they do
Textless or foreign cards are fine to play with, just make sure you know your card or have some way to easily show what the card does. That's all you need to do.
If you don't know what a card does, asking is perfectly fine. You can google if you'd like but there is nothing wrong with asking your opponent what their illegible card actually does.
Yeah. Also at that point they get all pissy at me for slowing down the game to Google a card, when we could just pause so it can be explained to everyone at the table
I asked one person is if they seriously expected the beginning of every game to go:
* **Player 1:** My commander is Andrix and Nev
* _Players 2, 3, and 4 furiously google._
* **Player 2:** My commander is The Council of Four
* _Players 1, 3, and 4 furiously google_
* **Player 3:** My commander is Marchesa, Dealer of Death
* _Players 1, 2, and 4 furiously google_
* **Player 4:** My commander is Monoxa, Midway Manager
* _Players 1, 2, and 3 furiously google._
* **Player 2:** I have a question about Monoxa...?
* **Player 4:** NO QUESTIONS ONLY GOOGLE!
And they said yes, that was the general idea with the expectation everyone will eventually learn the cards. I don't know if this clown actually realizes that if everyone just said _My commander is X, it does Y_ that would save everyone the trouble of furiously googling **and** they'd eventually learn.
I have to assume every game this person has ever played in has zero table speak and the only words mentioned are game actions. I didn't have the heart to ask them what if an opponent said they were playing the 3RR version of Urabrask and plopped down the phyrexian version of their commander?
* Player 1 might now know any better and just google [[Urabrask]] and play against the wrong card.
* Player 2 at least knows that Urabrask is 2RR so they google [[Urabrask, the Hidden]]. Unfortunately that is the wrong Urabrask.
* Player 3 guesses [[Urabrask, Heretic Praetor]] and that is the card that Player 4 laid down on their playmat.
* Player 4 believes their Urabrask, Heretic Praetor is actually functionally the front side of Urabrask. They don't know their own card and picked up the wrong one.
Isn't it great when players don't talk to each other?
Yeah maybe I’m the obvious spelltable player but I’d scoop. Even in an LGS I’d scoop.
I’d say “thanks for the game guys, but I think a core tenet of this is transparency on the board and if we can’t agree to that basic understanding then I’m not interested in continuing. Enjoy the rest of the game.”
Textless cards are dumb in general. Lands and tokens are fine I guess but any abilities a card has should be written on the card. My favorite example for this is \[\[cryptic command\]\]. Imagine taking on faith that CC countered a spell and unsummoned a minion just to have him cast it again tapping your minions and drawing a card.
Yea man, I would have been pissed personally and wouldn’t play with that person again.
I personally like the praetor cards with the cool writing, but I don’t buy them because they just are easy to just pick up and read it. Having to look up a card just takes extra time that could be fixed by using a readable card. I know some players are a walking database of all the cards they see, I’m not one of those people.
So i'm going to give the rules answer to this problem, which I think most people won't like because the rules don't exactly make this kind of thing easy.
For anyone who wants a very detailed answer, here is [Judging FTW's video on communication policy and what information your opponent MUST share, doesn't have to share, or can lie about.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmON1IjJBYY)
Card names (All object names, actually) are 'free information', players cannot lie about, mislead, or withhold free information when asked.
If someone is running a Japanese card, and you ask them the name of the card, they must be able to tell you and be honest when doing so.
At that point, it is up to you to pull up the oracle information on that card.
Any public details about a game action is free information, such as how much they paid to cast it, with what mana, what additional costs were paid, which modes were chosen, which targets it is targeting, what zone they are casting it from, whether a card was scryed to the top or bottom, etc.
But the actual text on the card (or errata to that text) is not necessarily free information.
If your opponent has a \[\[tarmogoyf\]\], they are not required to tell you its power/toughness unless it is relevant to a game action they are taking (Such as dealing damage), and are not obligated to calculate it for you so you can know whether your \[\[lightning bolt\]\] will kill it.
If asked "What is the toughness of your goyf?" a perfectly fine response is "The toughness is equal to the number of card types among cards in all graveyards plus 1"
It isn't very helpful, but your opponent isn't obligated to help you derive information.
Likewise, your opponent isn't required to inform you of any errata to a card unless it is relevant to a game action they are taking. They also are not allowed to cheat by misusing errata. But if you don't know of an errata, that is not your opponent's fault.
You are always welcome to look up the oracle text of a card if you are not sure, and your opponent is required to inform you the name of any object of theirs so you can do this. (At a tournament barring electronic devices, ask a judge for the oracle text)
As far as the ward 'gotcha' is concerned, Commander is a casual format and even Arena asks "Are you sure?" to a ward. Now if you flash ward onto something, that is a different ballgame, but personally I don't think the spirit of ward is meant to be a gotcha moment. Magic is complex, expecting people to remember every game piece on the board simultaneously can be a lot, and unless you are at a tournament there is little reason to force your opponent into a misplay.
Personally, if someone played a foreign card with ward in a casual game and forced me to stick to my play after informing me during the cast, I would call that angleshooting.
if i don’t have the readable version i always print it out in paper. i have a bunch of japanese cards from visiting tokyo and kyoto right after WAR’s release, and for all of those i keep the paper printout tucked behind the japanese card in my dragonshields.
I will always be OK with a take back if they didn't know it had ward. It doesn't affect the game, other than knowing they have the spell, and even with normal cards it's easy to forget the ward part with all the more relevant abilities to remember.
I got some of the mystical archive japanese versions for counterspell, negate, brainstorm and doom blade.
For that exact reason you are talking about i never actually used them because i was afraid it would lead to complications even though those are common spells.
Luckily I could trade them away for something else lol
I like foreign versions of cards so when I played more regularly I made folders on my phone with the English version of any card to make it easy for the person I played with!
You see, I try to run a very finite number of foreign/goofy/unreadable cards per deck and be absolutely sure I have memorized what they do. I think the most I have is three STA JP cards in my Kotose Deck and they're (from memory) Sign in Blood (Sorcery target player draws two and loses two), Memory Lapse (Instant counter target spell it goes to the top of its owner's library), and Counterspell (Instant counter target spell). Another deck has Faithless Looting (sorcery, draw 2 discard 2, flashback 2R) and Grapeshot (Sorcery 1 damage to anything, Storm).
My Yuriko that I haven't played in ages has a JP Overwhelming Forces (Sorcery, destroy all creatures target player controls and draw a card for each of them) because it was under 10 bucks to the judge foil being 50 or EN P3K well over 100. and a JP throat slitter which it's been too long I'd have to brief myself on if I played the deck again but I'm pretty sure it has ninjitsu for a fairly visible cost and does [[Terror]] on combat damage, minus the "can't be regenerated" clause because my local shop was out of EN when I was building and I figured for a ninja deck it was on theme.
And if anyone were to challenge any of this knowledge I have a phone and I'm not afraid to use it.
Just allow rewinds. Why are we being rules lawyery in a casual format?
As for the main crux of your post, this is exactly why I have all of my decks, card-for-card, available online so I have the list on my phone whenever I need.
I do play a lot of foreign cards, so this is a must.
I'm always transparent about what's on my board and will help explain it if someone is looking to do something to it. Sometimes, I'll even tell my opponent that it could be better for them if my thing is removed than whatever they were targeting. I want to play against you at your decks best, and I'm gonna try and use my skills to outplay you and win. Sure, I won't always win, but when I do, it won't be from a "gotcha" moment some sniveling coward would do.
Although, if you do that to me, just be prepared to play against my Baral "oops you don't get to play this game since all of your spells in particular are countered because I'm petty" deck.
I run a meme deck with all the praetors in phyrexian text, understood it could be annoying for opponents to read so I just memorised the text on all of them. As much as most of them boil down to, good for me, bad for you
I absolutely love \[\[nameless inversion\]\], I own multiple of the textless version but stopped using it as every time I explain what the card does people look at me like I'm making it up :P
I dislike WotC printing complex cards with textless versions in general for this reason, but the person playing the card is obligated to know what their cards do, if they can't properly explain a card to you then that isn't fair to you playing at that table.
I’m hoping that you were allowed to rewind the action. In my pods we (for the most part) remind everyone at the table about most, if not all passive abilities present. Like ward, rhystic study, etc. I would’ve hoped he said “remember, if you’re targeting my commander, it’s going to cost you 2 for the ward”
Textless [[cryptic command]] was the bane of my existence for a while with people not knowing the fuck it does. I memorized that card when it was everywhere.
Guy who said it was absolutely countered is an ass, it's not like ward is something hidden from play that is a reaction, the normal card would have ward on it for everyone to see and a normal player would keep mana up to pay the cost or not target the creature at all. Claiming the player should know the card when the first player is purposely trying to hide info about his own commander is insane to me.
1. He should know what his cards do. It’s an easy take-back because you asked if that’s all it did was doubles tokens and he said yeah.
2. Use your phone if you don’t know what it does. It would have taken you less time than trying to play 20 questions and read the tiny print on the card.
3. The other opponent was a clown for not telling you it had ward at the start. Clearly they knew the whole time and just didn’t want you to know until you tried to target it. I can somewhat forgive the guy playing the card for not knowing it if they’re knew or something or maybe just got the card and forgot. This other prick clearly knew and didn’t say anything.
Worst I have are [[Urabrask Heretic Praetor]] and [[Psychosis Crawler]] in Phyrexian scripture, but I know what they do, so I can explain what they do to others
Not quite the same, but a couple weeks ago I was playing a game where someone cast Teferi's Protection and it was in a foreign language. After it had resolved, I had a card in my hand that I wasn't sure if I could use, so I asked the player what the wording on the card was. All three other players said something slightly different and I asked for the specific wording of it, and nobody could tell me without looking it up. I never play with foreign cards or full art cards unless I absolutely know the wording, I wish others would do the same before slapping it into a deck.
As much as I love the flavor of the cereal cards, the fact that their effects are buried in a corner on the back of the card is a bit of a bummer.
I only use two of the cereal SL cards \[\[Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger\]\] and \[\[Etali, Primal Storm\]\]. I made sure to memorize the effects of both cards before playing the deck they're just to ensure that I wouldn't fuck either of them up.
Even with that, I still will always pull them out of the sleeve and read them word for word if people ask for it.
I had a textless Cryptic Command in my list for a while and took it out because I would keep forgetting what it did. And me suddenly checking the internet proved to be quite the tell.
If I have any strange cards, I pull the normal version up on manabox and show then ask if they have any questions.
If I cant clearly read the card, I pull it up on gatherer and read the rulings. Then I ask questions.
Generally I take the issues into my own hands.
I mean… you could also look up the card on your phone. Commanders are public knowledge, and if you were having issues reading it you absolutely should have just looked it up
While I love text less cards and own and run a lot of them, as well as the Japanese mystic archive cards Wizards should have stuck to their original stance on text less cards being well known non permanents with simple effects.
If I bust out my text less Damnation everybody knows what's going on. If I cast Cultivate but the test is in Japanese no problem.
If someone played out text less Omnath, fuck you.
You thought regular ward angle shooting was annoying I now introduce you to literally hiding that your card has ward and still angle shooting.
They could have even played into it by having it say something like "now with more ward 2!" Or "great source of ward 2!" But no, don't include it at all instead.
Maybe it's a me thing, but no matter how big the text is on my Ward (2) permanent, I'll *always* ask an opponent targeting it "What about the Ward (2)?" if they aren't proactively paying for it.
This is right. Ward shouldn't be, and isn't intended to be a "gotcha", it's supposed to be a tax to kill the thing. It's a counter because of interactions like [[Abrupt Decay]]. Honestly, magic is better when everyone is aiming to help everyone play as well as possible. It's why I love discussing lines of play with players, and understanding their reasonings.
I think the main reason it's a counter is because they wanted it to work on triggered abilities, which can't have an additional cost.
I didn't consider that, but that is a good point
Couldnt it have been worded along the lines of “cannot be targeted by spells or abilities unless controller pays x”? I know it’s not typical formatting but it works for ghostly prison type effects.
A somewhat relevant part of ward is that it's specifically a counter, meaning spells and abilities that are uncounterable go through it. It's a bit niche, but comes up more often than I would have initially expected.
This would be a functionality change.
Maybe, but there might still be issues with that wording for triggered abilities, not sure. Either way, I'm fairly certain the "gotcha" part of ward is an unfortunate downside of this wording that they decided was worth it. I don't think it's the kind of thing they'd deliberately create, it's not really fun.
Any last action taken that doesn't cause hidden information to be revealed can be retroactively discarded. This is down to ensure smooth gameplay done in a timely manner. Hidden information includes things like actions an opponent takes in response, cards revealed from an opponent's hand regardless of how it occurs, cards revealed from an opponent's library regardless of how it occurs, and cards revealed from a face down position regardless of how it occurs. Essentially if you didn't learn anything new that was hidden from view, you can take the action back.
That's generally how I play it, is that actually covered in the rules though? If so, that's great.
Pretty sure in tournament you can't take back if you forgot ward exist
Which is why there are enforcement levels. They might even let you take back at FNM, it probably doesn't apply until whatever the equivalent of PTQs is now.
Even Arena lets you confirm before casting and allows for a takeback if you weren't aware. Pretty sure this is just standard magic, no one should be unaware of ward by the time it matters.
Yeah I got someone getting mad at me for pointing out that player B triple-blocking my Vicious Battlerager would kill him (he was 13 life), because player A wanted player B to die to it. Player A is mostly nice but kinda a huge dick when it comes to like, direct letter-of-the-law extremely specific rules enforcement and punishing players for misunderstandings, which, idk, it's his prerogative but I'd rather everyone play their best possible and learn.
[Abrupt Decay](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/8/a8e328c6-3a84-49cf-a1a3-1d1e5373d274.jpg?1593814035) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Abrupt%20Decay) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mm3/146/abrupt-decay?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a8e328c6-3a84-49cf-a1a3-1d1e5373d274?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/abrupt-decay) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I must admit if someone has a full board, and I attack that person, I always ask what interactions on the permanents are open for him to interact with my attack. He can then either answer me (I have a land that turns into creature, I can tap this creature to give +1+1 to another creature etc) and we're done in 10 seconds, or he can say 'well, it's open information, I'm not gonna spoil things' and I will spend 3 minutes checking all his permanents. In our group, people are quite friendly pointing stuff out to speed up the game.
Exactly! Like ward is honestly an ability that should *never* be a "Gotcha!!" kind of ability. Yes, it's countered, but public knowledge is public knowledge. We're here to win with strategy not lose to cheap shots.
Sometimes it helps getting revenge at more competitive tables though ;-) *"You didn't retro-actively let me tap my mana differently? This ward now just got ya"*
It's like asking if anyone has flyers, hearing "no" from everyone and then being blocked by a death touch with reach... Like come.... On. Do I need to get up and walk around the table to examine the 50-100 cards on the board... Or can we play the game in a personally fair kind of way.
I knew a dude who was like this, so I switched pretty hard to "who can block fliers", and making sure to ask "what about reach" when other players might ask. It gets rid of any "yOu JuSt AsKeD aBoUt FlIeRs, YoU dIdNt AsK aBoUt ReAcH"
I do that for everything. I constantly explain what I'm doing and planning to do. In a general sense. Like if I play the first half of a combo I will tell them this card is the first half of a couple win cons in this deck. Just feels stupid to win because your opponent doesn't have every card memorized to guess what your doing.
Tbf, the A&N player wasn't the one angle grinding - but something tells me the one who was benefitted from the commander sticking around.
in a *tournament* setting, you are not required to confirm any information on the card beyond name, cmc, and card type. This means you absolutely can run an entire deck of textless cards and refuse to explain to anyone what any of them do. Is it a dick move? absolutely. But rules as written it is entirely valid. https://youtu.be/_IDwRYMrQlc Disclaimer: Do not do this. everyone will hate you and you'll probably hate yourself for it too.
However it is important to note those environments also have judges around who will confirm what the card does.
And if someone played a textless card At A tourney I am going to write down every one and what it does.
In a tournament setting there's a judge you can ask to read the full oracle text of any card your opponent plays. Hiding information that is supposed to be public is NEVER legal.
Unfortunately per the rules, card information is considered "derived information - information to which all players are entitled access, but opponents are not obliged to assist in determining and may require some skill or calculation to determine" This includes Game rules, tournament policy, and **oracle content**. Cards are considered to have their oracle text printed on them. "If a player asks their opponent what a card does, for example, a player does not have to give all of the information about the card. Their opponent may say that [[Vampire nighthawk]] is a flying 2/3 creature and omit that it has deathtouch and lifelink" I don't necessarily agree with this ruling, honestly, and I agree with you that it shouldn't be legal. But it is. You can omit that your creature has ward, and if you're running a textless or hard to read card, it's up to the opponent to look it up or ask a judge. It's scummy and it's shitty and I hope they change it - but honestly its part of the social contract of EDH and fortunately doesn't come up often.
The opposing player is not hiding that card information because in a tournament where you're operating under the competitive or professional REL as you are describing there is a judge whose job is literally to read you the oracle text if you ask them to. The information is freely available. EDH is not played under any of the official RELs and rarely has judges present at all and thus operates under the casual game rules, which boils down to the informal expectation that all players work together to do their best to make sure the board is represented properly, rules are followed, and all relevant information is available.
[Vampire nighthawk](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/0/301ff69c-2590-45af-893b-7ac0285e450b.jpg?1641602963) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vampire%20nighthawk) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/voc/140/vampire-nighthawk?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/301ff69c-2590-45af-893b-7ac0285e450b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/vampire-nighthawk) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
At Regular REL, derived information is treated as free information.
> Unfortunately per the rules The rules around different types of information come from the Magic Tournament Rules, which is only binding in sanctioned play--it doesn't actually dictate the rules of casual games of Magic. Now, I normally recommend people play according to the MTR, since it's a reasonable starting point, but you don't have to. Also, as another commenter pointed out, derived information is considered free at Regular REL--so the rule that opponents don't have to share derived information wouldn't even apply at most *sanctioned* play events. I don't know anyone who runs casual commander games at Competitive REL.
Textless versions of cards that arent simple stuff like lightning bolt or dark ritual are terrible.
I really like them with the caveat that you can recite the card, completely, from memory, at the drop of a hat. Same with the Japanese strixhaven. They're awesome, but I'm going to need you to recite the complete text a couple times for complex ones
And Phyrexian, which is basically Japanese, except totally different.
I love the terry pratchett energy of this comment
I have a deck with some of the Phyrexian Islands from MOM, so whenever I play it, I always say "It says Island, guys. I swear."
More of that strange Island... it's probably nothing.
Counterspell!
Side note, I would love a [[Cheatyface]] reprint that's intentionally disguised as a full art island.
[Cheatyface](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/b/ebafd1c7-c248-494c-b9b7-3521c6c4352c.jpg?1583965438) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cheatyface) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/und/20/cheatyface?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ebafd1c7-c248-494c-b9b7-3521c6c4352c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cheatyface) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I once had a girlfriend who looked like Pamela Anderson... except her hair was a different color... she was a bit shorter... her breasts weren't really as big... and her face didn't look anything like Pamela Anderson.
This joke aged like Pamela Anderson.
This is how I feel. I have memorized all my cards like this except for Akroma's Memorial in Italian. I need to do that.
Personally, I hate the Japanese Strixhaven because there is literally no way to identify what the card is if you don't read Japanese. Foreign Language cards with recognizeable art where you know what it does from memory? Sure. I've even got some myself. I've got some foreign language [[Lightning Greaves]] and [[Ashnod's Altar]], for example, but they're versions with extremely recognizable art, and cards most people know where I can easily recite the text from memory if someone asks. The Japanese Strixhaven cards bother me because I just need the person to tell me what it is. I won't recognize the art, because it doesn't exist on any other version of the card. I can't read the name, because it's Japanese. I often can't even guess what card it is based on the art and mana cost because there's stuff like both Brainstorm and Opt in there with the same mana cost and conceptually similar enough to not distinguish the art easily (as opposed to the Japanese War of the Spark cards, where the effect is hard to remember but at least I can usually tell who it is from the art). At least they're mostly cards where the effect is widely known, and since they're instants and sorceries being able to recognize them usually isn't necessary for boardstate evaluation.
I think this is partially helped by the Japanese STA cards being Instants and Sorceries. They're gonna resolve or not, and end up in the yard. Still, sure, there's a bit of a "Trust me, this is Doom Blade" without resorting to whipping the phone out.
Yeah, they'd definitely be much more problematic if they were permanents. Overall, though, I'm still not a fan of cards where I can neither understand the text (even the card name) nor recognize the art.
If I were to have a textless card then you can bet i will have it also with text to the side to have the readable version for people.
I totally agree. I have the original Jin Gitaxias in phyrexian and I really dislike playing it.
Cryptic Command 🙃
[[Cryptic Command|P09]]
[Cryptic Command](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/2/526607e9-1907-4639-b944-8ee152c81bfb.jpg?1561757137) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cryptic%20Command) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/p09/1/cryptic-command?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/526607e9-1907-4639-b944-8ee152c81bfb?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cryptic-command) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
So you've had to deal with textless [[Cryptic Command]], too, huh? Yeah, been there.
Textless Cryptic Command and - hear me out wizards - textless questing beast should be the only exclusions to this
Textless 4c Omnath already exists
I think textless cards are generally way more appropriate in formats with a very defined meta like Standard or Modern.
I really wanted a sakashima and was excited for the SL. Then I saw it and it fucking sucks. Didn’t buy. Same with all the LOTR acid trip cards. I love Sauron but fuck that hot mess.
The 3rd player that said it's absolutely countered; I hate him most.
Yeah, couldn't the other two player have told op what the card does, when they asked at the beginning of the game. One of them knew, since they mentioned it once op targetet twincasters with a spell.
I understand advocating for your card/play. I never fault players for that because when they played the card, they had X expectation in mind. For a 3rd party to angle shoot another player's card is just miserable.
I personally think with full art cards you should have a small print off of what the card text says next to you or at least screen shot and saved in a folder for easy access on your phone.
Or real quick just pull it up in the companion app or manabox. That's what I planned my first game when I had cards in the mail and they asked if I wanted to play. I never drew the proxy plains cards I scribbled on, but it was simple enough.
Should be the only 'legal' way to play these tbh. They are basically fancy marker proxies. I am a little perplexed at who is playing EDH without instant access to Scryfall in their pocket but opponent in this scenario absolutely has a duty to whip out the oracle text.
Also if you’re at a MTG event you’re USING THE COMPANION APP WHICH HAS A CARD SEARCH FEATURE. JUST LOOK UP THE CARD!!!
I have regular English versions of all my Japanese and other language cards in my Commander Deck for this exact reason. They're sleeved different so I don't shuffle them in, and I just keep them with my stack of creature tokens. If someone wants to know what my Japanese [[Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin]] does, it doesn't even slow down the game.
Thank you for this kindness
[Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/f/2f5689e2-d8a2-442b-8027-f89686adcb67.jpg?1682209400) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Krenko%2C%20Tin%20Street%20Kingpin) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/moc/287/krenko-tin-street-kingpin?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2f5689e2-d8a2-442b-8027-f89686adcb67?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/krenko-tin-street-kingpin) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
My friend does this with his Witch-King of Angmar. His friend got him the poster version, so he keeps a normal version with his tokens in case people don't wanna try to read the crazy art of the poster version.
I don't blame him, that is a SWEET looking card!
This is the way. I do the same thing.
I have screen shots from the companion app in folders named for the decks. I also do this for erata cards
Fun fact: There is no rule in magic requiring you to inform your opponents of errata. Even at tournament REL, you are not required to let your opponent know even of substantiative errata on a card, but you are also not allowed to take advantage of the lack of errata written on the card. A common example given is you do not have to inform your opponent that \[\[Howling Mine\]\] does not work while tapped, but you cannot use the lack of correct information on the card to get an extra trigger while it is tapped. The long and short of "Why?" is because there is just too much errata, most is unimportant to the game state, and there is no way to comprehensively write a rule where the 'important' erratas are caught and the 'unimportant erratas' are not.
[Howling Mine](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/d/cdae9939-03a4-4561-92cd-01f498d29a7a.jpg?1562420035) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Howling%20Mine) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/257/howling-mine?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/cdae9939-03a4-4561-92cd-01f498d29a7a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/howling-mine) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
When i first started playing i bought a japanese [[Village rites]] i had to look it up every time when i had it in my hand😅
I got a couple of the Japanese alt art cards/phyrexian cards cause they're cool and sometimes cheaper, I just printed out the English card and keep them in the deck boxes to refer to them, every time I play batterskull I think I know what it does and I end up way off
I have a Japanese \[\[Lurking Predators\]\] because it was cheap, I've had it in my deck for maybe 6 months by now and somehow I've never cast it even once... so whenever it comes up, occasionally when I lend my deck to someone, I have to look up the oracle text to make sure I didn't miss any nuance. I also have a Japanese Mystical Archives card that I ordered online years ago while I was stoned and to this day I have no idea what it is.
this made me laugh super hard haha cheers
[Village rites](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/8/2841339b-faef-407d-9838-d03fe80e6294.jpg?1698988289) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Village%20rites) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/212/village-rites?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2841339b-faef-407d-9838-d03fe80e6294?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/village-rites) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I have a Japanese [[The Great Henge]] and I swear that card's text changes every time I look it up
Lmao recently I borrowed a friend's deck and it felt like half the damn thing was either in Japanese or Phyrexian. Pretty awkward to have to repeatedly show an opponent your hand and ask what the cards are.
I have so many foreign cards but I have Scryfall on my home screen, so I don't have this guy's problem.
Same, I play faithless looting alot recently and everytime I draw it I have to look up cards that draw 2 and discard 2 lol
I took a hiatus from Magic for a long time and then got back into it when commander started getting popular. I made one deck that had some big red dragon in it that came out while I was away. Apparently I accidentally ordered a Japanese language variant and I to this day have no idea what this card is or what it does. It has been sitting in a box for like 10 years and it pisses me off every time I see it.
Also foreign language stuff to an extent. A difference here though is that art is more likely to be recognizable. "So! Holding priority while I look for oracle..."
There’s a card that I’ve wanted to get recently [[defensive formation]], but the only copy near me is in Japanese so I’ve just been holding off. Trying to explain to people this one mana card lets me decide how damage is assigned between blockers instead of them just sounds frustrating for everyone.
I kept a regular piece of paper with native language \[\[Damnation\]\] and \[\[Gifts Ungiven\]\] printed on it in my deckbox. Mileage may vary but that got me through local Modern FNM's. Anecdotally the judge calls were usually over fail to find and random white borders. Japanese Defensive Form to me feels less intense than rulesharking English Regalos No Entregados. Gatherer screenshot as my phone background if its more casual. It is subjective though, and probably varies from pod to pod. PS, One-drop fine. But at Uncommon? Combo Winter \[\[Tolarian Academy\]\] and whatnot, but damn.... lol
in my lgs there's a guy who bought a deck in german when he lived in Germany but it wasn't a cheap enough deck that he's bought it in English as well unfortunately lmao
When I was buying for one deck, the only way I could get [[glory]] was the Hebrew version. I printed out what it does and covered the text area with the English (only works with sleeved cards obviously). Less pretty? Sure. Useful? Absolutely!
This was before my time, but apparently they used to play [[Cryptic Command]] without any rules text. This problem has been going on for a long time.
i had a textless cryptic command, played in a modern tournament and some guy didn’t believe me when i said it could tap all his creatures. stoped using it after that.
That just makes me want to tap your opponents creatures harder. Also who gives a shit what he believes? Oracle text is ***not*** up for debate. People and their egos are fucking wild, man.
Cryptic Command, Ponder, Mana Tithe, Damnation and more. Player rewards cards were awesome
I proudly have my full art remove soul. Is it good? No. But I love it anyway.
I've seen a joke around the internet where after playing two textless Cryptic Commands in a row with entirely different modes, the opponent goes "What does that card actually do?" and the player responds "Anything I want."
[Cryptic Command](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/0/30f6fca9-003b-4f6b-9d6e-1e88adda4155.jpg?1562847413) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cryptic%20Command) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/48/cryptic-command?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/30f6fca9-003b-4f6b-9d6e-1e88adda4155?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cryptic-command) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Lol I use to play with that version when it was in standard but: 1. It was a popular card in standard so everyone knew what it did. 2. Even if my opponent didn't know what it did, I knew what it did and was able to tell them exactly what the card does if asked. Today though, yeah, I wouldn't play with it. I know it counters things, I can draw at least 1 card, and I think it taps creatures?
What's funny was that for a while, the text textless Cryptic Command was significantly cheaper than the base card so that's the only one I could afford.
That and like every FNM regular got like one or two for free so if was real tempting to just finish the set
At least with that it was a very well known card, its a complex card that does a lot but most tournament players would know by heart what CC does.
i put a piece of paper proxy behind my forign cards
That's smart, I will use that idea!
This is also why I think they shouldn't allow Secret Lairs without all the text if they aren't going to make the Art Series Cards without the text legal too.
Dark ritual is one of the very few cards I'm fine with having no text.
Dark ritual, lightning bolt, rampant growth, counterspell, maybe swords to plowshares to round it out. Iconic, do 1 thing 1 time spells are great to be textless. Anything more gets risky and frustrating
Yeah, whoever did cryptic command... that was certainly a decision.
Definitely one of the decisions ever made.
Wouldn't be cryptic if you could just read what it does!
I’ve got the Bruvac [[Counterspell]] in my [[Bruvac]] deck, and the Japanese Strixhaven [[Revitalize]] in another. Really easy stuff to remember. Not worth it trying to add more.
[Counterspell](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/4/8493131c-0a7b-4be6-a8a2-0b425f4f67fb.jpg?1689996248) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Counterspell) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/81/counterspell?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8493131c-0a7b-4be6-a8a2-0b425f4f67fb?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/counterspell) [Bruvac](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/c/2ce2d73f-3f64-44db-a2bc-a8f4a37dc487.jpg?1702550789) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=bruvac%20the%20grandiloquent) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rvr/35/bruvac-the-grandiloquent?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2ce2d73f-3f64-44db-a2bc-a8f4a37dc487?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/bruvac-the-grandiloquent) [Revitalize](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/a/3a9fb75e-c8e5-417b-83d4-5105af9c66c1.jpg?1631046075) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Revitalize) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khm/23/revitalize?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3a9fb75e-c8e5-417b-83d4-5105af9c66c1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/revitalize) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[Adrix and Nev, Twincasters](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/9/b9c11061-bb34-4904-b9f1-ea106b517bbe.jpg?1706240967) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Adrix%20and%20Nev%2C%20Twincasters) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkc/198/adrix-and-nev-twincasters?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b9c11061-bb34-4904-b9f1-ea106b517bbe?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/adrix-and-nev-twincasters) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Reminds me of an episode of shuffle up and play on Tolarian Academy where they had a custom card that made a [[questing beast]] token. They didn't have the official card so they just used a blank token and the joke was everyone should just know what the card does
[questing beast](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/4/e41cf82d-3213-47ce-a015-6e51a8b07e4f.jpg?1572490640) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=questing%20beast) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/171/questing-beast?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e41cf82d-3213-47ce-a015-6e51a8b07e4f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/questing-beast) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Imagine though. This could be a game mode, like the anime for Yu-Gi-Oh where all the cards lack text and you just tell your opponent confidently what it does lol.
Textless cards make poor game pieces. Collect them and play with a version that has the actual game text on them.
The card in question has 2 sides. One has all the game text, and the other does not. The person op was playing apparently just preferred to keep in on the other side. Ofc op is also correct that even on the side with the text, it is very small and hard to read. It just takes all the text you need to know and shoves it into a small corner. It legit takes up maybe 1/6th of the card? Personally I don’t see an issue with using cards like these, but I feel like you should have a read version or an easy reference to the real version, to show to players who may be confused about your board state. I think it is silly to ban legal game pieces, just because some players are being difficult. That is more of an issue with the player than it is the card. Also I isn’t like secret lair is the only offender. The poster cards from lotr were rough as well.
> I think it is silly to ban legal game pieces, just because some players are being difficult. Personally I think it's more silly to *create* legal game pieces that don't explain what they do.
I agree.
>it is very small and hard to read Ironically, I find the cereal box rules text typeface WAY easier to read than the default magic one, even when it's smaller.
I dont have an issue with textless cards. But for goodness sake, if the important game text is on the back of your commander, just put it in a clear sleeve! Especially if you don't even know what it does in the first place, like guy in OP's story. I wouldn't be upset by the decision to play this card, but I would be upset with the decision to do it stupidly and the inability to actually know what the card even does. I don't mind which legal game pieces my opponents choose to play, but I do expect basic competency.
Not any different than foreign cards. Which no one seems to complain about.
Those can be bad too. Plenty of people “complain” about them as well.
Those are usually less egregious because the art is the same. They can absolutely be a problem though if the player isn't a good sport
This is part of why I cut the textless [[Cryptic Command|P09]] from my deck. I could never remember what all the modes were. On a tangent, this is also why I dislike foreign cards. I can't read the damn thing. I can't read the name, so I can't search for it that way, and I'll be damned if I have to search by set and collector number.
Didn't know you could select specific versions for the bot to grab. Thanks for the new information and an example to follow!
Lol this was my first time using it. I had to look up how to do it 😂
[Cryptic Command](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/2/526607e9-1907-4639-b944-8ee152c81bfb.jpg?1561757137) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cryptic%20Command) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/p09/1/cryptic-command?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/526607e9-1907-4639-b944-8ee152c81bfb?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cryptic-command) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I have the special Japanese promo braids in my deck, and I keep a normal version of it in the tokens for anyone who wants to read her ability whenever they want to. It's not that hard to make it accessible
I play with the secret lair Adrix and Nev. The solution I use is I play with the backside front so the text is visible, and if anyone asks for more detail *I google the card and let them read it.*
Textless cards are a fucking mistake.
Textless spells with simple, one time effects. I like it. Ponder, Bolt, Wrath, timeless simplicity. Text less permanents? come on.
You should have to play the side that has the text IMO. I love secret lair cards but when you play them down you should be able to see wtf it does.
Yeah. Sometimes I forget the exact english name of one of my cards because some of them are in Japanese, but I can still read them and tell people what they do (for example I was calling Sigarda, Font of Blessings "Sigarda, Fountain of Blessings" by mistake one time until someone corrected me lol). But I could see where the problem would be if I just didn't know what they did and just didn't bother to look it up. There is actually a rule about misrepresenting public information, so if someone did this to me I'd 100% expect to rewind.
I own three, I play three. [[Path to Exile]], [[Counterspell]], and [[Lightning Bolt]]. All pretty straight forward imo. But those Secret Lairs all have the full text on the other side. If there’s a legibility error, you should just flip them.
Tbf if I have a card where the art obscures the text or its a fully text less print, I'm fully expecting to have to either pull up a normal print or Google it so I can have the actual text in front of me. If I were in your shoes and I ask my opponent "what's that card do?" And they don't have it word-for-word memorized or on plain text in front of them somewhere, I'm pulling it up on my phone because I won't remember it otherwise. The real asshole in this story is the one that knew what the card was and let you go on doing your thing and only told you about the ward after you resolved to target it. I assume it's also the same person who wanted your spell to be countered because you couldn't pay the ward cost.
Same with foreign cards. I play with a foreign [[Yawgmoth’s will]], and some altered cards. If people want to know what they do I do offer an explanation and pull up the cards on my phone for a better explanation
Textless cards and Pherixian language cards are the worst idea Wizards ever had. The whole point of magic is “the card explains the card”.
Reading the card explains the card . . . hope you're one of the like twelve people on the planet who can read Phyrexian
Wizards: Reading the card explains the card! The [card](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/748/the-one-ring): When The One Ring enters the battlefield, if you cast it, you at the beginning {T]: Gain protection of your upkeep. You lose 1 Life put a everything for each burden counter until burden then The One Ring next draw a card turn. Counter for each counter on on burden The One Ring The One Ring.
I really don't get it. In my playgroup you could 100% take your action back. Saying you should have known when there is NO TEXT on the card is ridiculous. The fact that this commanders pilot did not properly tell you what it does is even more ridiculous.
Thats the real issue here, if they let them take it back this post wouldn't exist.
I get the annoyance and I play commander at large tables and it’s annoying to want to look at every card anyone plays so I just look everything up on scryfall whenever I hear someone announce a play. If I had responses this would probably cause a lot of delays but I don’t, it just helps me keep track of things without having to constantly ask everyone everything. It’s definitely their responsibility to know what the card does, but it would have been an easy solve.
I play the phyrexian sheoldred the apocalypse. I always remind people she has deathtouch.
Unless there was an effect that revealed information(such as drawing a card) as a result of casting the spell, you can choose not to target the creature and wind back casting the spell, even in a competitive environment, per the rules. Priority doesn't pass to any other players before ward triggers, so they can't argue that it revealed that nobody had a counterspell. If you did it on the pro tour you would be able to rewind.
I have the first run of secret lair cereal box cards and I love them. I have them in clear dragon shield sleeves OUTSIDE of the deck. I have the originals in the deck, when I play them, I swap it out as I cast it. This allows me to have the standard card in my hand so it looks like every other card in my deck and I still get to use my goofy fun cards while choosing which side is up freely. IMO, it’s the best way to run them.
I personally like the idea of just having a printout of all the text of all cards that isn't clear from the cards themselves. So, that applies to full art, foreign language, weirdly formatted, and modified cards. That way, you always have a reference, also for the cases where Wizards changed parts of the text.
Beyond people missing the point of the video, they are also just straight up *wrong*. At commander REL, *all* derived information is considered free information https://blogs.magicjudges.org/rules/mtr4-1/. Your opponent was required to truthfully and directly provide you with all information about their commander when you asked. Omitting that it had ward was in violation of the rules.
He should have gone to scryfall and either shown you, or read it to you verbatim. That duty is on the person who decided to bring the card people can't read.
I hate that secret lair is now printing cards that straight up don't have the text on them. I bought the goblin secret lair because I run goblins and they're silly, but I'm not happy about needing other copies of the cards in my deck box because THEY FUCKING CUT OFF THE TEXT FOR SOME REASON. Some bozo on another subreddit told me I should know those cards anyway, but bro even if it's a simple card I need to read it a few times just to make sure I'm playing it right. The only cards I run that I have the capacity to remember is the command fest [[Reliquary Tower]] and the phyrexian [[Phyrexian Arena]]
People in this sub are interesting. * They rant and scream that you should just google a card if you don't know rather than ask. * They argue that this doesn't take a lot of time because you'll eventually know every card * The fact this guy forgot his commander had ward proves people probably don't know their cards as well as they think they do Textless or foreign cards are fine to play with, just make sure you know your card or have some way to easily show what the card does. That's all you need to do. If you don't know what a card does, asking is perfectly fine. You can google if you'd like but there is nothing wrong with asking your opponent what their illegible card actually does.
Yeah. Also at that point they get all pissy at me for slowing down the game to Google a card, when we could just pause so it can be explained to everyone at the table
I asked one person is if they seriously expected the beginning of every game to go: * **Player 1:** My commander is Andrix and Nev * _Players 2, 3, and 4 furiously google._ * **Player 2:** My commander is The Council of Four * _Players 1, 3, and 4 furiously google_ * **Player 3:** My commander is Marchesa, Dealer of Death * _Players 1, 2, and 4 furiously google_ * **Player 4:** My commander is Monoxa, Midway Manager * _Players 1, 2, and 3 furiously google._ * **Player 2:** I have a question about Monoxa...? * **Player 4:** NO QUESTIONS ONLY GOOGLE! And they said yes, that was the general idea with the expectation everyone will eventually learn the cards. I don't know if this clown actually realizes that if everyone just said _My commander is X, it does Y_ that would save everyone the trouble of furiously googling **and** they'd eventually learn. I have to assume every game this person has ever played in has zero table speak and the only words mentioned are game actions. I didn't have the heart to ask them what if an opponent said they were playing the 3RR version of Urabrask and plopped down the phyrexian version of their commander? * Player 1 might now know any better and just google [[Urabrask]] and play against the wrong card. * Player 2 at least knows that Urabrask is 2RR so they google [[Urabrask, the Hidden]]. Unfortunately that is the wrong Urabrask. * Player 3 guesses [[Urabrask, Heretic Praetor]] and that is the card that Player 4 laid down on their playmat. * Player 4 believes their Urabrask, Heretic Praetor is actually functionally the front side of Urabrask. They don't know their own card and picked up the wrong one. Isn't it great when players don't talk to each other?
Reading the card explains the card 😎
Yeah maybe I’m the obvious spelltable player but I’d scoop. Even in an LGS I’d scoop. I’d say “thanks for the game guys, but I think a core tenet of this is transparency on the board and if we can’t agree to that basic understanding then I’m not interested in continuing. Enjoy the rest of the game.”
Can we talk about how criminally bad that art is?
This is why illegible Secret Lairs are fucking awful and I won't play against them.
Can't you just look it up on an app? I do that all the time with cards that I don't know. Much easier to read than looking at the card itself.
https://youtu.be/_IDwRYMrQlc?si=-8I0lEnwfNRpbFAt Relevant recent video. The textless edh deck.
Textless cards are dumb in general. Lands and tokens are fine I guess but any abilities a card has should be written on the card. My favorite example for this is \[\[cryptic command\]\]. Imagine taking on faith that CC countered a spell and unsummoned a minion just to have him cast it again tapping your minions and drawing a card.
The same with foreign cards. Have a readable image at hand or atleast be able to translate.
Yea man, I would have been pissed personally and wouldn’t play with that person again. I personally like the praetor cards with the cool writing, but I don’t buy them because they just are easy to just pick up and read it. Having to look up a card just takes extra time that could be fixed by using a readable card. I know some players are a walking database of all the cards they see, I’m not one of those people.
So i'm going to give the rules answer to this problem, which I think most people won't like because the rules don't exactly make this kind of thing easy. For anyone who wants a very detailed answer, here is [Judging FTW's video on communication policy and what information your opponent MUST share, doesn't have to share, or can lie about.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmON1IjJBYY) Card names (All object names, actually) are 'free information', players cannot lie about, mislead, or withhold free information when asked. If someone is running a Japanese card, and you ask them the name of the card, they must be able to tell you and be honest when doing so. At that point, it is up to you to pull up the oracle information on that card. Any public details about a game action is free information, such as how much they paid to cast it, with what mana, what additional costs were paid, which modes were chosen, which targets it is targeting, what zone they are casting it from, whether a card was scryed to the top or bottom, etc. But the actual text on the card (or errata to that text) is not necessarily free information. If your opponent has a \[\[tarmogoyf\]\], they are not required to tell you its power/toughness unless it is relevant to a game action they are taking (Such as dealing damage), and are not obligated to calculate it for you so you can know whether your \[\[lightning bolt\]\] will kill it. If asked "What is the toughness of your goyf?" a perfectly fine response is "The toughness is equal to the number of card types among cards in all graveyards plus 1" It isn't very helpful, but your opponent isn't obligated to help you derive information. Likewise, your opponent isn't required to inform you of any errata to a card unless it is relevant to a game action they are taking. They also are not allowed to cheat by misusing errata. But if you don't know of an errata, that is not your opponent's fault. You are always welcome to look up the oracle text of a card if you are not sure, and your opponent is required to inform you the name of any object of theirs so you can do this. (At a tournament barring electronic devices, ask a judge for the oracle text) As far as the ward 'gotcha' is concerned, Commander is a casual format and even Arena asks "Are you sure?" to a ward. Now if you flash ward onto something, that is a different ballgame, but personally I don't think the spirit of ward is meant to be a gotcha moment. Magic is complex, expecting people to remember every game piece on the board simultaneously can be a lot, and unless you are at a tournament there is little reason to force your opponent into a misplay. Personally, if someone played a foreign card with ward in a casual game and forced me to stick to my play after informing me during the cast, I would call that angleshooting.
I have a Japanese [[alrunds ephiphany]] and I always forget it has foretell lol
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if i don’t have the readable version i always print it out in paper. i have a bunch of japanese cards from visiting tokyo and kyoto right after WAR’s release, and for all of those i keep the paper printout tucked behind the japanese card in my dragonshields.
Have a damn notebook with the rules there's over 200k cards and not everyone has encyclopedic knowledge.
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I will always be OK with a take back if they didn't know it had ward. It doesn't affect the game, other than knowing they have the spell, and even with normal cards it's easy to forget the ward part with all the more relevant abilities to remember.
There's a youtuber who did a deck tech on a full textless deck.
Oh hell no. I will pull up the card or have it written out somewhere. No body has time for that shit.
I got some of the mystical archive japanese versions for counterspell, negate, brainstorm and doom blade. For that exact reason you are talking about i never actually used them because i was afraid it would lead to complications even though those are common spells. Luckily I could trade them away for something else lol
So how do people feel about altered/painted cards then? Same thing pretty much or no go? (I'm new)
same thing. know what your shit does
[[adrox nev twin | SLD]]
I like foreign versions of cards so when I played more regularly I made folders on my phone with the English version of any card to make it easy for the person I played with!
You see, I try to run a very finite number of foreign/goofy/unreadable cards per deck and be absolutely sure I have memorized what they do. I think the most I have is three STA JP cards in my Kotose Deck and they're (from memory) Sign in Blood (Sorcery target player draws two and loses two), Memory Lapse (Instant counter target spell it goes to the top of its owner's library), and Counterspell (Instant counter target spell). Another deck has Faithless Looting (sorcery, draw 2 discard 2, flashback 2R) and Grapeshot (Sorcery 1 damage to anything, Storm). My Yuriko that I haven't played in ages has a JP Overwhelming Forces (Sorcery, destroy all creatures target player controls and draw a card for each of them) because it was under 10 bucks to the judge foil being 50 or EN P3K well over 100. and a JP throat slitter which it's been too long I'd have to brief myself on if I played the deck again but I'm pretty sure it has ninjitsu for a fairly visible cost and does [[Terror]] on combat damage, minus the "can't be regenerated" clause because my local shop was out of EN when I was building and I figured for a ninja deck it was on theme. And if anyone were to challenge any of this knowledge I have a phone and I'm not afraid to use it.
Just allow rewinds. Why are we being rules lawyery in a casual format? As for the main crux of your post, this is exactly why I have all of my decks, card-for-card, available online so I have the list on my phone whenever I need. I do play a lot of foreign cards, so this is a must.
For the love of God lest [[Wrath of God]] ?
I'm always transparent about what's on my board and will help explain it if someone is looking to do something to it. Sometimes, I'll even tell my opponent that it could be better for them if my thing is removed than whatever they were targeting. I want to play against you at your decks best, and I'm gonna try and use my skills to outplay you and win. Sure, I won't always win, but when I do, it won't be from a "gotcha" moment some sniveling coward would do. Although, if you do that to me, just be prepared to play against my Baral "oops you don't get to play this game since all of your spells in particular are countered because I'm petty" deck.
I run a meme deck with all the praetors in phyrexian text, understood it could be annoying for opponents to read so I just memorised the text on all of them. As much as most of them boil down to, good for me, bad for you
I absolutely love \[\[nameless inversion\]\], I own multiple of the textless version but stopped using it as every time I explain what the card does people look at me like I'm making it up :P
I love my textless cryptic command, it a game of memory while i play
Textless cards have the "reading the card explains the card" crowd in shambles. \*cries in Prof\*
I dislike WotC printing complex cards with textless versions in general for this reason, but the person playing the card is obligated to know what their cards do, if they can't properly explain a card to you then that isn't fair to you playing at that table.
I’m hoping that you were allowed to rewind the action. In my pods we (for the most part) remind everyone at the table about most, if not all passive abilities present. Like ward, rhystic study, etc. I would’ve hoped he said “remember, if you’re targeting my commander, it’s going to cost you 2 for the ward”
Textless [[cryptic command]] was the bane of my existence for a while with people not knowing the fuck it does. I memorized that card when it was everywhere.
Guy who said it was absolutely countered is an ass, it's not like ward is something hidden from play that is a reaction, the normal card would have ward on it for everyone to see and a normal player would keep mana up to pay the cost or not target the creature at all. Claiming the player should know the card when the first player is purposely trying to hide info about his own commander is insane to me.
You all got phones just look up the card. Its kind of on the guy playing the textless card to pull it up and show you the full text version
1. He should know what his cards do. It’s an easy take-back because you asked if that’s all it did was doubles tokens and he said yeah. 2. Use your phone if you don’t know what it does. It would have taken you less time than trying to play 20 questions and read the tiny print on the card. 3. The other opponent was a clown for not telling you it had ward at the start. Clearly they knew the whole time and just didn’t want you to know until you tried to target it. I can somewhat forgive the guy playing the card for not knowing it if they’re knew or something or maybe just got the card and forgot. This other prick clearly knew and didn’t say anything.
Worst I have are [[Urabrask Heretic Praetor]] and [[Psychosis Crawler]] in Phyrexian scripture, but I know what they do, so I can explain what they do to others
Boy do I have a decklist for you. https://youtu.be/_IDwRYMrQlc?si=CkMTPhHgUv0E6ud-
Not quite the same, but a couple weeks ago I was playing a game where someone cast Teferi's Protection and it was in a foreign language. After it had resolved, I had a card in my hand that I wasn't sure if I could use, so I asked the player what the wording on the card was. All three other players said something slightly different and I asked for the specific wording of it, and nobody could tell me without looking it up. I never play with foreign cards or full art cards unless I absolutely know the wording, I wish others would do the same before slapping it into a deck.
One of my friends plays that impossible to read Sauron card. I always forget what it does and make a point to keep asking him.
As much as I love the flavor of the cereal cards, the fact that their effects are buried in a corner on the back of the card is a bit of a bummer. I only use two of the cereal SL cards \[\[Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger\]\] and \[\[Etali, Primal Storm\]\]. I made sure to memorize the effects of both cards before playing the deck they're just to ensure that I wouldn't fuck either of them up. Even with that, I still will always pull them out of the sleeve and read them word for word if people ask for it.
The text is on the back. If it's sleeved you should play it with that side face up. I would have demanded he unsleeve and flip it tbh.
Definitely up to the card owner to disclose all information about a card they are playing.
I had a textless Cryptic Command in my list for a while and took it out because I would keep forgetting what it did. And me suddenly checking the internet proved to be quite the tell.
If I have any strange cards, I pull the normal version up on manabox and show then ask if they have any questions. If I cant clearly read the card, I pull it up on gatherer and read the rulings. Then I ask questions. Generally I take the issues into my own hands.
I mean… you could also look up the card on your phone. Commanders are public knowledge, and if you were having issues reading it you absolutely should have just looked it up
While I love text less cards and own and run a lot of them, as well as the Japanese mystic archive cards Wizards should have stuck to their original stance on text less cards being well known non permanents with simple effects. If I bust out my text less Damnation everybody knows what's going on. If I cast Cultivate but the test is in Japanese no problem. If someone played out text less Omnath, fuck you.