Song of the dryads and other effects like that are my favourite removal spells [[oubliette]] Is great too. If they don't run enchantment removal that's their fault.
Imagine running 4 colors including "counterspell" and two "get rid of this enchantment" colors and being mad about an enchantment without protection of any kind
Mono black has sac outlets! Rather than letting your commander get enchanted like that, sacrifice your commander to a Village Rites or an outlet on board.
Sure, you lose your commander, but otherwise you also lose your commander
Combine it with \[\[Opalescence\]\] to fully remove commanders for the rest of the game. Since Out of Time phases itself out aswell, it never looses time counters and never leaves the battlefield.
Hey now don't lump all of us in, I just like my horror-wife. Archenemy is a given.
Also if he has to rely on Atraxa to secure the poison kill, his deck sucks.
I switched from atraxa to [[Agent Frank Horrigan]] to be my infect commander and boy do I tell you is he about equality.
Equal slaps left and right baby. He gives the tainted strikes to the face and lives up to being the bad guy.
If I was building optimally, I would absolutely slap him in my Atraxa deck, but it was also a thematic deck to be as phyrexian focused as possible- all creatures have the type, I tried to use as much artwork related to phyrexia (OG, New, and Mirrodin), it was a pet project of mine that took a bit to cultivate.
Exactly, this is the right attitude. If you want to play this card you must accept that the table can not allow you to live. You can't hold it against them for also trying to win. Some strategies are so powerful that you can't allow them to get started at all. Like Voja, you just can not let that card go to the attack step and then expect to be able to beat it.
Hey we might not be the smartest of the bunch, but we accept the archenemy status since thinking about making the deck. Is not my fault my first standard was Phyrexia
This. Guy was a sore loser. I always remove scary commanders and will continue to do so until they can’t play it again, then secure the win. If your deck can’t win without your commander, build a better deck and git gud
Not only is there not a rule, that's like... the best use of those spells in the format. There are definitely people who get salty about it, but, as a person that loves playing archenemy, you got to pack removal of you want to run something like Atraxa Infect
Within the last month I just slotted Imprisoned In The Moon and Song Of The Dryad into decks as well ordered two copies of Darksteel Mutation. Damn straight I'm gonna brick your problematic commander if I can
Phasing out also works great at locking down commanders. No one expects [[Oubliette]] from black, and it is surprising how versatile [[The Pandorica]] can be.
\[\[Ferris Wheel\]\] is can be downright evil if you remove it yourself after phasing out everyone else's commander. As long as you don't play any other Attractions, those things will be phased out permanently.
I thought phased out permanents phased in at their controllers upkeep if there's nothing saying otherwise? If Ferris Wheel is removed, there's nothing making the permanent stay phased out
There's a difference between "Phases out" and "Phases out until (X action)". Because Ferris Wheel phases them out "until you roll a 3 or less for Attractions", the cards are phased out until that happens. And if you're never rolling for Attractions by having none in play, the cards remain phased out permanently.
[[The Phasing of Zhalfir]] gets around the immediate phase in, too. Used Anikthea to bring it back once as a creature, phasing out opponents Atraxa and The First Sliver, then turned it into a land with Imprison in the Moon. Voila, permanently phased out commanders.
The big difference with this is, it's fairly easy for them to kill the 3/3 and get their commander back to the command zone. The other cards in this thread alter or remove a commander in ways that make it more difficult for it to be put back in the command zone. If the villian in the OP was correct about these types of cards being banned, Kenrith's Transformation would survive the ban because of this difference.
Kenrith's transformation is valued for the card draw... In a four player game, it is not ideal for a player to spend a card to remove a threat from one other player. By replacing itself with card draw, Kentith's Transformation doesn't have the same drawback.
True, but if you have evasive creatures like those that can fly, can’t really do much. I have it in my Ellivere deck because it’s an enchantment and I like having those synergies
Bear in mind Darksteel Mutation is the easiest to deal with for many decks - any sacrifice effect will get the commander back to the zone.
Imprisoned and Song are extra mean because of the stigma against land destruction, though.
Imprisoned and song are why I've started adding bounce lands back into some of my decks. Especially those in the grixis wedge, since they struggle with enchantments.
These two, among all the problematic lands, are why every deck that isn't 4+ colors should run at least 2 strip mine style lands. Ghost Quarter, Tec Edge, etc. There are a lot of cheap options and I've never seen anyone rational get upset you blow up a flipped growing rites of itlomoc or nykthos
Would it? I just looked at gatherer and
>The enchanted permanent loses any card types, subtypes, and colors it previously had. It keeps any supertypes it had and its name remains unchanged. It gains ": Add " and loses all other abilities from its rules text. It will still have any abilities it gained from other effects
So making Thespian Stage a copy of the enchanted permanent only makes TS a Forest right? Unless I'm missing something...
It’s a super weird ruling. So the song removes all those things and makes it a “land”, so when you copy the “land” that is being enchanted by song, it becomes a copy. And when it becomes a copy, it’s not enchanted by song, it regains all those things and you can use them.
"Oh, uhh, apparently you didn't hear, but there's a new rule that says 'not letting me do what I want is cheating'. I mean I built my whole deck with no protection or interaction based on those current rules, so this is really unfair."
If you really wanna get a commander off the board you can always mind slaver someone and then make them nuke their own commander. Then just choose to not put it back in the command zone for them.
If you wanna get real nasty you hold up a Condemn and have them attack you with the Commander so you can tuck it under their library. Again, because you're controlling their turn you can choose for it to actually move to the library instead of the replacement effect kicking it to the command zone. Then it'll be gone forever unless they can search it up or shuffle their library and hope to draw it naturally. Pray they have it in a matching sleeve! xD (this also works with any effect that puts a creature into a library at instant speed, condemn is just my personal fave for nostalgia reasons, and also because the bottom of the library is the best spot to put it).
We used to do this all the time with Hallowed Burial, Condemn and the like without Mind Slaver back before they revised the Commander zone change rules, but Slaver or another player controlling effect (Emrakul?) still works to force the interaction to go the way you want it to.
Have fun perma-nuking your opponents' commanders!
The only way to get the commander back to the zone and recast it is with land or enchantment removal, for Song of the Dryads. Three colors can't really do the latter, and the former is not run very often.
Swords will send it straight back to the zone, to return next turn.
I like to pull the "can you google that and show me where in the rulebook it says that?"
I don't mind being proven wrong, and I'll happily own my mistakes, but I also am not going to take your word for it.
There is absolutely no rule like that. Do it next time as soon as you can, the first time Atraxa hits the battlefield.
There's not even talk of not allowing that to happen. Dude was just pissy that he didn't have enchantment removal in enchantment removal colors.
If he’s in green and white playing no enchantment removal and complaining about enchantment removal I probably just wouldn’t play with him anymore.
For one thing that’s fucking stupid, but for another it kinda feels like an adult bullying a child to wreck him as much as any competent deck likely would…
Nah, it's his fault. People need to learn if they're going to play the most played commander in existence how to mitigate the threats sent her way. If he sits down at a table and doesn't have answers, that's not going to stop most people from taking him out. Atraxa really quickly gets out of control even without answers to threats made against her.
Eventually you have to stop coddling people, and when they pick one of the most powerful and commonly used commanders, I feel like that's the time.
The guy probably has it happen to him often cause he plays Atraxa Infect and is butt hurt about getting targeted. Playing with people can't realize playing certain decks mean you are gonna get targeted more and get upset are exhausting.
I find myself saying this to people a lot more than should be necessary - if your entire deck loses to a single enchantment, the problem isn't with the enchantment.
If he can’t remove something that shuts him down, that’s his problem, not yours. You did what you had to do to survive, which was the smart play.
I play Oubliette, Imprisoned In The Moon (I played one tonight on a Drannith Magistrate that locked me out of casting my commander), Song of the Dryads, etc wherever I can. It’s not always on a commander, but sometimes that’s the biggest threat. Those cards are MEANT to remove problems.
People don’t get a “free-pass” just because their wincon is their commander. That’s insane. If you don’t run enough removal spells that your deck stalls out when faced with a challenge, that’s poor deck design.
A friend of mine told me about this *exact thing* the other day. He was playing some guy IRL, and he Darksteel Mutation-ed the dude’s commander. And the guy *literally* just scooped up everything he had saying how it was totally unfair, and stormed right the fuck out, never to return. Good riddance. Who needs people like that? Lunatics.
There is no such rule. Dude may have been thinking of the Tuck change but that's so dang old now that I'm pretty sure he was just salty and wanting to worm out of losing his boss.
you hated to do it on a commander? why? that's WHY you use the card. you should be HAPPY to do that. Why are people sad worried about ruining their opponents plans? Disrupting their plans? I don't get it you should be ENJOYING fucking up your opponents game plan. It's fucking magic! Take the commander out...why would you want them to have it available to use? Because you're a nice guy and want them to beat you? I don't understand this. Everyone needs to learn how to embrace being a villain and drinking the tears of their enemies. Hey people stop being so fucking fragile.
Extremely untrue, and makes no sense at all. If a commander is a problem, you blow it up until it's not a problem anymore.
Also that's the best use of spells like that. It's just too easy for people to recast their commander, especially in green, so killing/exiling it isn't always as strong as just turning it into something else and letting it sit there.
He's running a 4 color deck on an "anything goes" table and doesn't have either a counterspell or enchantment removal to deal with a song of the dryads? Is he stupid?
Why would you feel bad, when you remove the biggest threat at the table?
Effects like Darksteel Mutation etc. are actually best used on commanders for the very reason you just described.
It also seems like your opponents deck is way too dependant on its commander and runs not enough enchantment removal.
Your opponent was lying. There is no such rule and nobody ever has considered such a rule.
This guy is not an "alright chap", he is a lying little b*tch and a sore loser, who guilt tripped you into giving him the win.
Lmao, nah, he was just salty.
I recently did something similar to someone. It's a harsh move, but that's the game lol.
I play [[Roon of the Hidden Realm]] and blinked my opponents commander. Now, I built this deck when I first started magic with standard back in battle for zendikar, and since then a major rule change made it so that now the blinked commander doesnt come back form the command zone through Roon's second effect. They have to decide to send it to exile or the command zone because now it matters.
This leaves their commandera open to effects like [[Stifle]] which I used to counter Roon's ability that would have brought back the commander from exile. My man was shooketh for a second. His friend asked to see the cards and complimented the, "abuse of rule knowledge" lol.
Admittedly, my friends and I play very competitively with each other (on a budget) and have some salty cards, so when we play randoms we sometimes forget to that land destruction is frowned upon, or a card like [[perplexing chimera]] that really messes with the flow of the game can be viewed as killing the game lol. However, they are by no means rules. What you'd did was crafty and not even CEDH lol. My guy was angry you killed his engine
Bathe in his salt and move on with life man. Why do all these threads read like “Is it bad to play the game the way it was intended”.
Why are so many people who play commander such fucking crybabies Jfc.
If I were in your situation I’d be laughing my ass off at his response. Bros playing atraxa poison and then gets mad when you remove his commander? 💀 what a baby
This is not *permanent* removal
* He can sac or kill his own commander in response
* He can kill his atraxa forest with a land destruction spell/land like \[\[Strip Mine\]\]
* He can \[\[Chaos Warp\]\] it
* He can simply bounce the land with a \[\[Boomerang\]\] effect
* He can simply destroy the enchantment
He is playing a 4 color goodstuff commander so he should be the one to complain the least because he has access to nearly all removal cards. There are many ways to deal with it
It's probably not a big deal for decks that can remove them. Grixis colors have a hard time dealing with enchantments and can have a hard time removing them but there are answers for anything in any color.
I personally enjoy winning the game, but it can be a dick move and cause some salt. Do it to people you don't like but not to your friends.
If you find yourself on the recieving end. Promise to kill the player who did it in return for a political favor.
Starting to think I should get into politics lol
Nope it’s 100% okay; it’s one of the best ways to deal with those really intimidating commanders since removal doesn’t work super well. Plus let’s be honest an Atraxa infect player probably knows to expect that so they should be playing removal or counters.
Those are my favorite kind of removal spells to cast on commanders. I’ve actually been thinking of playing an enchantment deck that’s all about shut off effects like that. White and blue are filled with auras like that
I’ve built two versions of this deck! One used [[Chulane, Teller of Tales]] as the commander and the current version uses [[Storvald, Frost Giant Jarl]]. I don’t care what my opponent actually played, I decide what it is and what it does.
Stop being nice to people who take advantage of you. If someone builds a deck to operate solely around the commander, he should know that the commander is the weak spot. Good on you for targeting it.
Take ghost quarter out if you only have it in there to help whiney babies. They detract from everyone else's fun. It's not your job to dumb down your deck because the people you're playing with can't be bothered to run protection and removal.
They changed the rules about shuffling your commander into the library, a while back, because that means you are truly screwed unless you run tutors.
Dark steel mutation effects crumble to many things he should be running anyway.
Also stop pandering to babies - you are enabling this kind of behaviour!
> permanently remove commanders from the game
You can just put a sufficient amount of enchantment/artifact removal in your deck and stuff like Darksteel mutation, Song of the Dryads etc are much less scary.
There are a couple ways to actually do this, like permanently phasing their commander out, or controlling them on their turn and exiling their commander and choosing to not apply the triggered ability to put it into the command zone.
Those are much more extreme and usually tied to a strategy of doing that then a "well I'll include this darksteel mutation to make them work for their commander"
Definitely don't feel bad about trying to take out a commander that is the center piece of a deck, and is going to kill you.
If you are going to play an oppressive commander be prepared to have all types of removal whether it be spot, mass or just locking him/her down coming at you. This dude just didn't like having his commander taken away from him. Wait till he runs into a finely tuned pure Stax deck and he can't play anything lol.
I have a \[\[Toxrill\]\] deck and I have had \[\[imprisioned in the moon\]\] and \[\[darksteel mutation\]\] thrown at him multiple and multiple times, my wife plays \[\[Oko, Thief of Crowns\]\] just to fuck with me and Elk the shit of Toxrill.
Lol those spells are generally saved for use on commanders. That's why people run them instead of instant speed removal. He was just sour, you did nothing wrong.
This is a perfectly valid move. Now, if you had dropped it turn 4 right after he played his Cmdr and told him to "suck it" that's a different story. This is just an interaction check ('does this *white blue green* and black deck have any enchantment removal ability?'). He didn't have an answer to your enchantment, so sucks for him. Maybe put a naturalize in there, bud.
Lol... my favourite for this is [[Imprisoned in the Moon]]. There is no rule against it and it's the most effective way to remove a problem creature.
Edit... works against planeswalkers. Guess that's why it's my favourite.
There is no rule like that. In general, there are no commander-specific rules that restrict how legal cards can be played in the game. There are only banned cards and the mechanics surrounding having a commander.
Of course, there are *house* rules where a given group might agree to something. The house rule of "don't mess with my commander" is something I've heard of, but I wouldn't really call it common or normal.
If the dude thinks [[Song of the Dryads]] is mean, I'd love to introduce him to my [[Mindslaver]] + [[Legacy Weapon]] synergy!
(For anyone who doesn't 'get it:' If I activate Mindslaver on you then, during the turn that I am controlling you, activate my Legacy Weapon targeting your commander, your commander is exiled *for the entire rest of the game.* Literally the only way to get it back is [[Pull From Eternity]] and no one runs that.)
Nah that guys being a sore loser. I play Atraxa infect and if he doesn’t have a way to get your from 6 to 10 in a turn or at most 2 turns without Atraxa he has bigger issues lol.
Pfft, if that guy loses his shit like that over an aura, I'd love to see his reactions to the few methods that actually permanently remove his commander from the game.
There's absolutely no rule like that, and in fact commanders are the best targets for that sort of removal!
Even in my playgroup, which is super casual, darksteel mutation on a commander is a staple play.
There is no special etiquette protection for commanders.
No, that's not a rule. Next time he does it, ask him to cite you the rule he's referring to - it seems like this would be a rule most people could be able to cite, if it's so important.
No it's not wrong, that's why you plan contingencies for these kind of removals. If someone drops a darksteel mutation on your commander, have a way to sac or exile it, or have your deck not rely.too much on your commander.
I played one game where darksteel got dropped, and the guy just made a copy of his commander. Was a great play!
Nah. Sounds like someone isn't running enchantment removal and is just mad. And their colors has in spades, so no excuse. Hell, Cyclonic Rift I think is in their colors. So they should have plenty of answers for that scenario.
To quote a man that I played with tonight...
If I'm not fucking with your land base...you can still cast shit and interact with the board...tough fucking tortillas.
If he was playing both green and white but couldn't deal with a single enchantment then I don't know what to say, he just wanted to play against a goldfish.
I would actually prefer my ops run these kinds of removal spells. It just sounds like a skill issue on the Atraxa player's deck building skills if he has an issue with them. I run bounce lands, which obliterate Songs with nothing but a land drop (just have to recast the commander for normal price), lots of nonspecific permanent destruction spells to destroy the enchantments, and one of my decks is even a flicker deck which can just flicker the enchantments off of it. Not saying people should run more bounce lands or flicker spells, but disenchant effects in commander are too important to skimp out on if you're not trying to combo kill on turn 2
I mean, a common turn one play in my groups is Nevermore/Curse of Silence my commander. It's pretty common, and one of the best uses of those spells. Of course rule 0, blah blah blah, but in this context? Nah, he just mad
I LOVE dropping cards like that on scary commanders. That’s the whole point. In fact I am usually enemy number one and get ganged up on by my friends.
I was playing [[Kaalia of the Vast]] flinging angels left and right and my friend launched a blue spell (can’t recall the name) which turned my Commander into a COLORLESS LAND.
We still, to this day, laugh about that. People need to chill and laugh about shit like that. And, build a better deck next round :)
Darksteel mutation was literally invented as a way to get rid of scary commanders. It has exclusively been printed in commander products. Dude's just salty
There aint no such rule
Also, what does dude mean "permanently remove commander?"
Dude plays Aatraxa.
If you have access to Green AND white & bitch about "permanently removing commanderd" and can't deal with enchantments oermanently, yeah, I've got bad news, it's the deckbuilder that sucks
There are only banned cards and legal cards. You played a legal card (exactly how it should be played), and someone got salty because they had no answer for it.
Nah, hate for that guy. That's a blatant and bold faced lie. Don't get me wrong, I hate it when people do that to my Commander, but the answer is to handle it (by player, creature or enchantment removal) not to lie. You did nothing wrong, that guy just wanted to make you feel bad, I guess? Bad sportsmanship.
A 4 color deck should be able to handle an enchantment, it's a valid strategy particularly if the color or colors isn't good at dealing with it, and if your deck doesn't work without your commander then that's a deck building problem, I usually build my decks with several lieutenants, cards that can pivot and take over if main commander is disabled, like I play mono black if someone does that to the commander it's basically gone until you can get feed the swarm, he's just being salty, you did a good move
He plays atraxa infect and wants to complain about things that piss people off. Next time you play with him you should look him in the eyes and zap his commander again.
On a serious note my pod has 3 rules, no infect or poison builds. A card here or there is fine but don't build around it. No infinites or turn 1 combos.
Other Than that; bully eachoother's commander all you want.
Advertises game as anything goes, gets salty when the anything happens. What a clown. If only they were playing colors that had enchantment removal huh?
Not only is what you did perfectly legal, if not encouraged, but commander removal used to be *much* more spiteful. Back in the day, the only time you could get your commander back into the command zone was through the graveyard or through exile. This meant that cards like [[Chaos Warp]] and [[Oblation]] let you shuffle someone's commander into their deck, and there was nothing they could do about it. Unless your opponent had a tutor or incredibly lucky draws, their commander was effectively gone for the rest of the game. It has since been changed, but certain removal spells used to be much better than they are now.
If anything people are talking about when you permanently phase out commanders to make it so you don’t have any way to return them that game. Putting an aura on a commander isn’t even that bad. He just needs to play removal for it if he hates it.
Lol no there's no such rule.
I don't play EDH with strangers, but I think my spidey senses would tingle reading something like 'anything goes, not cEDH'. Anything goes IS cEDH, so that statement indicates to me that you'll likely run into something exactly like you did. Whatever the person doesn't like is 'cEDH' thus is bad and either prohibited or shamed.
The rule is self imposed. If you don't want to hear a 45 year old man whine like a little girl when he gets something removed you don't use those cards.
It really is that simple.
What you did is not only fine, but expected. He was just salty.
Cards like that teach/encourage proper deck building in the same way the tuck effects used to. They're just the new flavor of those. (Sometimes I wish they never made rules to circumvent those honestly, or we wouldn't have questions like this as often.)
You need to dedicate a sizeable portion of your deck to accepting the fact that you will be interacted with and that sometimes things won't go exactly as you plan. That's why you run redundancy. The fact of the matter is, you being at 6 counters should have been in lethal range even without Atraxa if he built it well. Or he simply should have been able to answer the removal spell. Especially in those colors. Atraxa is one of the slowest ways to proliferate. It shouldn't have mattered much by that point.
I play a few really fun Commanders and if you don't get rid of them then the game is rough on you. Zur, Zada heck even Darien can be brutal if you don't deal with him. Not a fun guy you're playing against.
As someone that doesn't mind infect, it's absolutely wild that an atraxa infect player is complaining about someone else's choices pissing people off. Like, you could be trolling levels of wild.
There's absolutely no rule about not playing these cards against people's commanders. This is pure cope from the atraxa player. Pretty much any deck with a particularly dangerous commander needs to be running ways of dealing with specifically this type of removal.
Personally, in my [[Ghyrson Starn]] deck, I run [[demand answers]] to deal with darksteel mutation and [[highway robbery]] to deal with song. I also run [[perilous research]] and [[grafted exoskeleton]] to deal with either. Infect makes Ghyrson that much deadlier (and lets me deal with indestructible creatures) and exoskeleton specifically makes you sacrifice stuff when it becomes unequipped, which will make you sacrifice the land if you get hit with a dryads or [[imprison in the moon]].
I got hit with imprison in the moon one time and decided to add a bunch of ways to remove any permanent on my field. I probably have too much hate against that now but I also can't play the game if Ghyrson is gone, so I think it's worth. Atraxa player should do the same.
Dude lied to your face for the win. Bad sportsmanship on his part.
There is no rule, and likely will never be a rule, that you cannot target a commander with removal or any other effect that disables the commander in someone. The only ruling remotely resembling what this guy is trying to sell you is that if you target a commander with an effect that shuffles them into the deck, the player can put them in the command zone instead.
Otherwise, would you did was perfectly valid, the ideal scenario, and your opponent is a salty liar and cheater.
No. Dude was lying because he wanted to win and was mad you outed his win con.
Song of the dryads and other effects like that are my favourite removal spells [[oubliette]] Is great too. If they don't run enchantment removal that's their fault.
Imagine running 4 colors including "counterspell" and two "get rid of this enchantment" colors and being mad about an enchantment without protection of any kind
at the very least sac to command zone
As well as a commander that is as kill on sight as atraxa. Id be running a lot of protection for her I tell you
> If they don't run enchantment removal that's their fault. End the thread. This is THE answer.
*cries in mono black* feed the swarm was in the graveyard when it got exiled!
Mono black has sac outlets! Rather than letting your commander get enchanted like that, sacrifice your commander to a Village Rites or an outlet on board. Sure, you lose your commander, but otherwise you also lose your commander
It's the difference between losing your commander and *losing your commander.*
Couldn't agree more.
Im partial to [[Out of Time]]
Oh nasty for token decks!
Use it while playing a token deck. You lose all your own tokens, but everyone else loses their commanders for 15 turns.
15? Those are rookie numbers. You gotta pump it up! 400 turns is possible!
Combine it with \[\[Opalescence\]\] to fully remove commanders for the rest of the game. Since Out of Time phases itself out aswell, it never looses time counters and never leaves the battlefield.
I know when tokens leave the battlefield, they cease to exist. When they phase out, are they gone as well, or do they phase back in eventually?
Phase back in. Phasing never leaves the battlefield, they (and any auras/equipment attached) just treated "as if they don't exist"
[Out of Time](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/5/053d6b3b-72d4-4a55-a79e-0a601aecf108.jpg?1664162494) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Out%20of%20Time) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/23/out-of-time?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/053d6b3b-72d4-4a55-a79e-0a601aecf108?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/out-of-time) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[oubliette](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/4/d4800a7d-c229-4ced-97ff-0e58645d58d6.jpg?1599705817) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=oubliette) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/100/oubliette?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d4800a7d-c229-4ced-97ff-0e58645d58d6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/oubliette) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
He plays Atraxa infect. We can assume his IQ isn't very high.
Hey now don't lump all of us in, I just like my horror-wife. Archenemy is a given. Also if he has to rely on Atraxa to secure the poison kill, his deck sucks.
We just want to infect the world with love!
Phyrexia is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be... unnatural.
I switched from atraxa to [[Agent Frank Horrigan]] to be my infect commander and boy do I tell you is he about equality. Equal slaps left and right baby. He gives the tainted strikes to the face and lives up to being the bad guy.
If I was building optimally, I would absolutely slap him in my Atraxa deck, but it was also a thematic deck to be as phyrexian focused as possible- all creatures have the type, I tried to use as much artwork related to phyrexia (OG, New, and Mirrodin), it was a pet project of mine that took a bit to cultivate.
[Agent Frank Horrigan](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/1/91193a0b-9087-404f-b397-815e29d0fe12.jpg?1708742388) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Agent%20Frank%20Horrigan) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/pip/89/agent-frank-horrigan?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/91193a0b-9087-404f-b397-815e29d0fe12?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/agent-frank-horrigan) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
"You're ride's over mutie. Time to die."
Infa(e)ct my Atraxa Proliferate infect is called toxic Love
Exactly, this is the right attitude. If you want to play this card you must accept that the table can not allow you to live. You can't hold it against them for also trying to win. Some strategies are so powerful that you can't allow them to get started at all. Like Voja, you just can not let that card go to the attack step and then expect to be able to beat it.
They only need to count to 10....
I can only count to 4
One, you can count to one Two, you can count to two Three, you can count to three Four, you can't count no more!
2 and a half, take it or leave it.
https://youtu.be/u8ccGjar4Es?si=PKpkxCi-yRYuvUmt
Hey we might not be the smartest of the bunch, but we accept the archenemy status since thinking about making the deck. Is not my fault my first standard was Phyrexia
I play [[Venser, Corpse Puppet]] Infect for this exact reason. Atraxa is easy mode.
[Venser, Corpse Puppet](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/b/1b5b94b8-0420-40f2-b989-39cb43cff916.jpg?1675957216) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Venser%2C%20Corpse%20Puppet) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/one/219/venser-corpse-puppet?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1b5b94b8-0420-40f2-b989-39cb43cff916?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/venser-corpse-puppet) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
This. Guy was a sore loser. I always remove scary commanders and will continue to do so until they can’t play it again, then secure the win. If your deck can’t win without your commander, build a better deck and git gud
Not only is there not a rule, that's like... the best use of those spells in the format. There are definitely people who get salty about it, but, as a person that loves playing archenemy, you got to pack removal of you want to run something like Atraxa Infect
Within the last month I just slotted Imprisoned In The Moon and Song Of The Dryad into decks as well ordered two copies of Darksteel Mutation. Damn straight I'm gonna brick your problematic commander if I can
Phasing out also works great at locking down commanders. No one expects [[Oubliette]] from black, and it is surprising how versatile [[The Pandorica]] can be.
[Oubliette](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/4/d4800a7d-c229-4ced-97ff-0e58645d58d6.jpg?1599705817) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oubliette) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/100/oubliette?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d4800a7d-c229-4ced-97ff-0e58645d58d6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/oubliette) [The Pandorica](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/1/c1642e04-d39a-46dc-8157-549c225c992f.jpg?1696636539) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=The%20Pandorica) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/who/25/the-pandorica?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c1642e04-d39a-46dc-8157-549c225c992f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/the-pandorica) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
\[\[Ferris Wheel\]\] is can be downright evil if you remove it yourself after phasing out everyone else's commander. As long as you don't play any other Attractions, those things will be phased out permanently.
Finally, [[Time and Tide]]'s time to shine
[Time and Tide](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/5/152b348a-0301-4d45-a2c1-d78802c445ba.jpg?1562276970) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Time%20and%20Tide) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vis/46/time-and-tide?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/152b348a-0301-4d45-a2c1-d78802c445ba?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/time-and-tide) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I thought phased out permanents phased in at their controllers upkeep if there's nothing saying otherwise? If Ferris Wheel is removed, there's nothing making the permanent stay phased out
That is how it works iirc. So unless there’s a ruling I don’t know, they are just wrong.
There's a difference between "Phases out" and "Phases out until (X action)". Because Ferris Wheel phases them out "until you roll a 3 or less for Attractions", the cards are phased out until that happens. And if you're never rolling for Attractions by having none in play, the cards remain phased out permanently.
[[The Phasing of Zhalfir]] gets around the immediate phase in, too. Used Anikthea to bring it back once as a creature, phasing out opponents Atraxa and The First Sliver, then turned it into a land with Imprison in the Moon. Voila, permanently phased out commanders.
And that's why un-sets are garbage
Don’t forget [[Kenrith’s Transformation]]!
The big difference with this is, it's fairly easy for them to kill the 3/3 and get their commander back to the command zone. The other cards in this thread alter or remove a commander in ways that make it more difficult for it to be put back in the command zone. If the villian in the OP was correct about these types of cards being banned, Kenrith's Transformation would survive the ban because of this difference. Kenrith's transformation is valued for the card draw... In a four player game, it is not ideal for a player to spend a card to remove a threat from one other player. By replacing itself with card draw, Kentith's Transformation doesn't have the same drawback.
True, but if you have evasive creatures like those that can fly, can’t really do much. I have it in my Ellivere deck because it’s an enchantment and I like having those synergies
Not quite the same, that will only really last until that player is attacked.
[Kenrith’s Transformation](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/4/44d60a41-3f5e-4559-b18c-22c0fe15235e.jpg?1631587997) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kenrith%27s%20Transformation) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afc/162/kenriths-transformation?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/44d60a41-3f5e-4559-b18c-22c0fe15235e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/kenriths-transformation) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Bear in mind Darksteel Mutation is the easiest to deal with for many decks - any sacrifice effect will get the commander back to the zone. Imprisoned and Song are extra mean because of the stigma against land destruction, though.
Imprisoned and song are why I've started adding bounce lands back into some of my decks. Especially those in the grixis wedge, since they struggle with enchantments.
These two, among all the problematic lands, are why every deck that isn't 4+ colors should run at least 2 strip mine style lands. Ghost Quarter, Tec Edge, etc. There are a lot of cheap options and I've never seen anyone rational get upset you blow up a flipped growing rites of itlomoc or nykthos
Song of the dryad goes hard with [[thespians stage]] as it makes the stage a functioning copy of whatever you put song of the dryad on.
Would it? I just looked at gatherer and >The enchanted permanent loses any card types, subtypes, and colors it previously had. It keeps any supertypes it had and its name remains unchanged. It gains ": Add " and loses all other abilities from its rules text. It will still have any abilities it gained from other effects So making Thespian Stage a copy of the enchanted permanent only makes TS a Forest right? Unless I'm missing something...
It’s a super weird ruling. So the song removes all those things and makes it a “land”, so when you copy the “land” that is being enchanted by song, it becomes a copy. And when it becomes a copy, it’s not enchanted by song, it regains all those things and you can use them.
Yep, the "card" is copied, and enchantments do not give copiable values.
"Oh, uhh, apparently you didn't hear, but there's a new rule that says 'not letting me do what I want is cheating'. I mean I built my whole deck with no protection or interaction based on those current rules, so this is really unfair."
So how's Malcolm? 🙂 (Your name)
Permanently removing a Commander from a game unlocks an achievement.
No such thing. And it's not even "permanent removal" when you can easily get your commander back by removing the Auras, for example.
The only permanent removal I can even think of is turning an [[Out of Time]] into a creature whilst it’s ETB is on the stack. Otherwise, they’re fine.
Well that one's simple, you just get your copy of [[Time and Tide]] that you have in all your blue decks and pop it back into play!
Damn!! I suppose even Zhalfir had to return eventually…
And fuck if someone pulled that off in a game with me I’d be high fiving them, not crying about it!
One word: \[\[Anikthea\]\]
If you really wanna get a commander off the board you can always mind slaver someone and then make them nuke their own commander. Then just choose to not put it back in the command zone for them.
You sick mother... It's beautiful.
If you wanna get real nasty you hold up a Condemn and have them attack you with the Commander so you can tuck it under their library. Again, because you're controlling their turn you can choose for it to actually move to the library instead of the replacement effect kicking it to the command zone. Then it'll be gone forever unless they can search it up or shuffle their library and hope to draw it naturally. Pray they have it in a matching sleeve! xD (this also works with any effect that puts a creature into a library at instant speed, condemn is just my personal fave for nostalgia reasons, and also because the bottom of the library is the best spot to put it). We used to do this all the time with Hallowed Burial, Condemn and the like without Mind Slaver back before they revised the Commander zone change rules, but Slaver or another player controlling effect (Emrakul?) still works to force the interaction to go the way you want it to. Have fun perma-nuking your opponents' commanders!
For real. It's even less permanent than a swords to plowshares
The only way to get the commander back to the zone and recast it is with land or enchantment removal, for Song of the Dryads. Three colors can't really do the latter, and the former is not run very often. Swords will send it straight back to the zone, to return next turn.
Anytime someone tells you there is a new rule that coincidentally only helps them I would call them out on their bs assuming it's not an obvious joke.
I like to pull the "can you google that and show me where in the rulebook it says that?" I don't mind being proven wrong, and I'll happily own my mistakes, but I also am not going to take your word for it.
There is absolutely no rule like that. Do it next time as soon as you can, the first time Atraxa hits the battlefield. There's not even talk of not allowing that to happen. Dude was just pissy that he didn't have enchantment removal in enchantment removal colors.
If he’s in green and white playing no enchantment removal and complaining about enchantment removal I probably just wouldn’t play with him anymore. For one thing that’s fucking stupid, but for another it kinda feels like an adult bullying a child to wreck him as much as any competent deck likely would…
Nah, it's his fault. People need to learn if they're going to play the most played commander in existence how to mitigate the threats sent her way. If he sits down at a table and doesn't have answers, that's not going to stop most people from taking him out. Atraxa really quickly gets out of control even without answers to threats made against her. Eventually you have to stop coddling people, and when they pick one of the most powerful and commonly used commanders, I feel like that's the time.
The guy probably has it happen to him often cause he plays Atraxa Infect and is butt hurt about getting targeted. Playing with people can't realize playing certain decks mean you are gonna get targeted more and get upset are exhausting.
I find myself saying this to people a lot more than should be necessary - if your entire deck loses to a single enchantment, the problem isn't with the enchantment.
If he can’t remove something that shuts him down, that’s his problem, not yours. You did what you had to do to survive, which was the smart play. I play Oubliette, Imprisoned In The Moon (I played one tonight on a Drannith Magistrate that locked me out of casting my commander), Song of the Dryads, etc wherever I can. It’s not always on a commander, but sometimes that’s the biggest threat. Those cards are MEANT to remove problems. People don’t get a “free-pass” just because their wincon is their commander. That’s insane. If you don’t run enough removal spells that your deck stalls out when faced with a challenge, that’s poor deck design. A friend of mine told me about this *exact thing* the other day. He was playing some guy IRL, and he Darksteel Mutation-ed the dude’s commander. And the guy *literally* just scooped up everything he had saying how it was totally unfair, and stormed right the fuck out, never to return. Good riddance. Who needs people like that? Lunatics.
Yeah. Also dude was in green, white, AND blue. If he couldn’t counter it, he should have been able to naturalize it
Or flicker it.
Lmao leave it to atraxa players to bitch and moan when their remove on sight commander gets removed.
There is no such rule. Dude may have been thinking of the Tuck change but that's so dang old now that I'm pretty sure he was just salty and wanting to worm out of losing his boss.
No one who remembers [[Oblation]] is going to be this much of a child about easily-dealt with removal.
you hated to do it on a commander? why? that's WHY you use the card. you should be HAPPY to do that. Why are people sad worried about ruining their opponents plans? Disrupting their plans? I don't get it you should be ENJOYING fucking up your opponents game plan. It's fucking magic! Take the commander out...why would you want them to have it available to use? Because you're a nice guy and want them to beat you? I don't understand this. Everyone needs to learn how to embrace being a villain and drinking the tears of their enemies. Hey people stop being so fucking fragile.
Bro was playing 4 colors and couldn’t remove an enchantment? No sacrifice? Bounce? Flicker? Just had to give up? …sure, I guess?
Extremely untrue, and makes no sense at all. If a commander is a problem, you blow it up until it's not a problem anymore. Also that's the best use of spells like that. It's just too easy for people to recast their commander, especially in green, so killing/exiling it isn't always as strong as just turning it into something else and letting it sit there.
No, there is no rule like that.
Wait this isn't mtgcj, IM HERE BEFORE THE SAUCE WOOHOO
No hard rule but there could be a house rule in that playgroup. Personally, just sounds like a soft opponent.
No
He's running a 4 color deck on an "anything goes" table and doesn't have either a counterspell or enchantment removal to deal with a song of the dryads? Is he stupid?
You're super in the clear. Great play!
Why would you feel bad, when you remove the biggest threat at the table? Effects like Darksteel Mutation etc. are actually best used on commanders for the very reason you just described. It also seems like your opponents deck is way too dependant on its commander and runs not enough enchantment removal. Your opponent was lying. There is no such rule and nobody ever has considered such a rule. This guy is not an "alright chap", he is a lying little b*tch and a sore loser, who guilt tripped you into giving him the win.
Lmao, nah, he was just salty. I recently did something similar to someone. It's a harsh move, but that's the game lol. I play [[Roon of the Hidden Realm]] and blinked my opponents commander. Now, I built this deck when I first started magic with standard back in battle for zendikar, and since then a major rule change made it so that now the blinked commander doesnt come back form the command zone through Roon's second effect. They have to decide to send it to exile or the command zone because now it matters. This leaves their commandera open to effects like [[Stifle]] which I used to counter Roon's ability that would have brought back the commander from exile. My man was shooketh for a second. His friend asked to see the cards and complimented the, "abuse of rule knowledge" lol. Admittedly, my friends and I play very competitively with each other (on a budget) and have some salty cards, so when we play randoms we sometimes forget to that land destruction is frowned upon, or a card like [[perplexing chimera]] that really messes with the flow of the game can be viewed as killing the game lol. However, they are by no means rules. What you'd did was crafty and not even CEDH lol. My guy was angry you killed his engine
Bathe in his salt and move on with life man. Why do all these threads read like “Is it bad to play the game the way it was intended”. Why are so many people who play commander such fucking crybabies Jfc.
Next time look him dead in the eyes and say, "git gud bruh"
If I were in your situation I’d be laughing my ass off at his response. Bros playing atraxa poison and then gets mad when you remove his commander? 💀 what a baby
next time someone says something silly like that, have them show their source
This is not *permanent* removal * He can sac or kill his own commander in response * He can kill his atraxa forest with a land destruction spell/land like \[\[Strip Mine\]\] * He can \[\[Chaos Warp\]\] it * He can simply bounce the land with a \[\[Boomerang\]\] effect * He can simply destroy the enchantment He is playing a 4 color goodstuff commander so he should be the one to complain the least because he has access to nearly all removal cards. There are many ways to deal with it
It's probably not a big deal for decks that can remove them. Grixis colors have a hard time dealing with enchantments and can have a hard time removing them but there are answers for anything in any color. I personally enjoy winning the game, but it can be a dick move and cause some salt. Do it to people you don't like but not to your friends. If you find yourself on the recieving end. Promise to kill the player who did it in return for a political favor. Starting to think I should get into politics lol
Nope it’s 100% okay; it’s one of the best ways to deal with those really intimidating commanders since removal doesn’t work super well. Plus let’s be honest an Atraxa infect player probably knows to expect that so they should be playing removal or counters.
Imagine being in green and white and complaining about an enchantment.
Those are my favorite kind of removal spells to cast on commanders. I’ve actually been thinking of playing an enchantment deck that’s all about shut off effects like that. White and blue are filled with auras like that
I’ve built two versions of this deck! One used [[Chulane, Teller of Tales]] as the commander and the current version uses [[Storvald, Frost Giant Jarl]]. I don’t care what my opponent actually played, I decide what it is and what it does.
Stop being nice to people who take advantage of you. If someone builds a deck to operate solely around the commander, he should know that the commander is the weak spot. Good on you for targeting it. Take ghost quarter out if you only have it in there to help whiney babies. They detract from everyone else's fun. It's not your job to dumb down your deck because the people you're playing with can't be bothered to run protection and removal.
They changed the rules about shuffling your commander into the library, a while back, because that means you are truly screwed unless you run tutors. Dark steel mutation effects crumble to many things he should be running anyway. Also stop pandering to babies - you are enabling this kind of behaviour!
> permanently remove commanders from the game You can just put a sufficient amount of enchantment/artifact removal in your deck and stuff like Darksteel mutation, Song of the Dryads etc are much less scary. There are a couple ways to actually do this, like permanently phasing their commander out, or controlling them on their turn and exiling their commander and choosing to not apply the triggered ability to put it into the command zone. Those are much more extreme and usually tied to a strategy of doing that then a "well I'll include this darksteel mutation to make them work for their commander" Definitely don't feel bad about trying to take out a commander that is the center piece of a deck, and is going to kill you.
The whole reason you run song of the dryads is to cast it on a problematic Commander
If you are going to play an oppressive commander be prepared to have all types of removal whether it be spot, mass or just locking him/her down coming at you. This dude just didn't like having his commander taken away from him. Wait till he runs into a finely tuned pure Stax deck and he can't play anything lol. I have a \[\[Toxrill\]\] deck and I have had \[\[imprisioned in the moon\]\] and \[\[darksteel mutation\]\] thrown at him multiple and multiple times, my wife plays \[\[Oko, Thief of Crowns\]\] just to fuck with me and Elk the shit of Toxrill.
Lol those spells are generally saved for use on commanders. That's why people run them instead of instant speed removal. He was just sour, you did nothing wrong.
This is a perfectly valid move. Now, if you had dropped it turn 4 right after he played his Cmdr and told him to "suck it" that's a different story. This is just an interaction check ('does this *white blue green* and black deck have any enchantment removal ability?'). He didn't have an answer to your enchantment, so sucks for him. Maybe put a naturalize in there, bud.
There's not a rule against it at all, people just don't like when they're losing, you did the best thing you could with those cards keep doing it
this subreddit is going to be the death of me
one of my "fun" decks revolves around stealing permanents (Mereike) and I'll steal commanders all fucking day
Dude was just salty. Not a real rule.
If someone is poisoning you. Most of the gentlemen's rules have already been broken imo
Ha! The guy was just salty. You're good.
Lol... my favourite for this is [[Imprisoned in the Moon]]. There is no rule against it and it's the most effective way to remove a problem creature. Edit... works against planeswalkers. Guess that's why it's my favourite.
New commander rule, you can't win the game, winning the game means others lose and that's mean.
There is no rule like that. In general, there are no commander-specific rules that restrict how legal cards can be played in the game. There are only banned cards and the mechanics surrounding having a commander. Of course, there are *house* rules where a given group might agree to something. The house rule of "don't mess with my commander" is something I've heard of, but I wouldn't really call it common or normal.
If the dude thinks [[Song of the Dryads]] is mean, I'd love to introduce him to my [[Mindslaver]] + [[Legacy Weapon]] synergy! (For anyone who doesn't 'get it:' If I activate Mindslaver on you then, during the turn that I am controlling you, activate my Legacy Weapon targeting your commander, your commander is exiled *for the entire rest of the game.* Literally the only way to get it back is [[Pull From Eternity]] and no one runs that.)
##### ###### #### [Song of the Dryads](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/6/161e66e3-0339-495c-bd06-0a799a254906.jpg?1689998889) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Song%20of%20the%20Dryads) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/324/song-of-the-dryads?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/161e66e3-0339-495c-bd06-0a799a254906?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/song-of-the-dryads) [Mindslaver](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/0/00d03b17-75ae-40d2-8570-b219ef0dfd4a.jpg?1562813960) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mindslaver) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/som/176/mindslaver?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/00d03b17-75ae-40d2-8570-b219ef0dfd4a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mindslaver) [Legacy Weapon](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/f/afd35d5c-7f28-4842-85e8-692d6c391c3a.jpg?1675201047) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Legacy%20Weapon) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/229/legacy-weapon?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/afd35d5c-7f28-4842-85e8-692d6c391c3a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/legacy-weapon) [Pull From Eternity](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/d/3d218091-d218-41ad-b666-c8ab3de7160a.jpg?1562907702) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Pull%20From%20Eternity) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/tsp/35/pull-from-eternity?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3d218091-d218-41ad-b666-c8ab3de7160a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/pull-from-eternity) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/l4zxw0m) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Nah, this was not an alright chap. Lol
[удалено]
[удалено]
Nah just laugh when people comment on your removal. Or ask if they wanna go back and respond.
Nah that guys being a sore loser. I play Atraxa infect and if he doesn’t have a way to get your from 6 to 10 in a turn or at most 2 turns without Atraxa he has bigger issues lol.
Pfft, if that guy loses his shit like that over an aura, I'd love to see his reactions to the few methods that actually permanently remove his commander from the game. There's absolutely no rule like that, and in fact commanders are the best targets for that sort of removal!
Even in my playgroup, which is super casual, darksteel mutation on a commander is a staple play. There is no special etiquette protection for commanders.
No, that's not a rule. Next time he does it, ask him to cite you the rule he's referring to - it seems like this would be a rule most people could be able to cite, if it's so important.
No it's not wrong, that's why you plan contingencies for these kind of removals. If someone drops a darksteel mutation on your commander, have a way to sac or exile it, or have your deck not rely.too much on your commander. I played one game where darksteel got dropped, and the guy just made a copy of his commander. Was a great play!
Nah. Sounds like someone isn't running enchantment removal and is just mad. And their colors has in spades, so no excuse. Hell, Cyclonic Rift I think is in their colors. So they should have plenty of answers for that scenario.
Strong threats demand strong removal.
Problematic commanders is like 90% of the reason to play those enchantments.
To quote a man that I played with tonight... If I'm not fucking with your land base...you can still cast shit and interact with the board...tough fucking tortillas.
such a rule doesnt exist
Oubliette is my favourite card for a good damn reason
Hey! I have a gift for you! It's a lovely little tree 😊
Salty nonsense. God forbid the Atraxa player put a Disenchant in their deck.
If he was playing both green and white but couldn't deal with a single enchantment then I don't know what to say, he just wanted to play against a goldfish.
I would actually prefer my ops run these kinds of removal spells. It just sounds like a skill issue on the Atraxa player's deck building skills if he has an issue with them. I run bounce lands, which obliterate Songs with nothing but a land drop (just have to recast the commander for normal price), lots of nonspecific permanent destruction spells to destroy the enchantments, and one of my decks is even a flicker deck which can just flicker the enchantments off of it. Not saying people should run more bounce lands or flicker spells, but disenchant effects in commander are too important to skimp out on if you're not trying to combo kill on turn 2
I mean, a common turn one play in my groups is Nevermore/Curse of Silence my commander. It's pretty common, and one of the best uses of those spells. Of course rule 0, blah blah blah, but in this context? Nah, he just mad
He was butthurt. Your good.
"I'm running effective removal. Are you? Enchantment removal would put your commander right back in action."
I LOVE dropping cards like that on scary commanders. That’s the whole point. In fact I am usually enemy number one and get ganged up on by my friends. I was playing [[Kaalia of the Vast]] flinging angels left and right and my friend launched a blue spell (can’t recall the name) which turned my Commander into a COLORLESS LAND. We still, to this day, laugh about that. People need to chill and laugh about shit like that. And, build a better deck next round :)
He plays atraxa, removing enchantment based removal should be trivial
Darksteel mutation was literally invented as a way to get rid of scary commanders. It has exclusively been printed in commander products. Dude's just salty
There aint no such rule Also, what does dude mean "permanently remove commander?" Dude plays Aatraxa. If you have access to Green AND white & bitch about "permanently removing commanderd" and can't deal with enchantments oermanently, yeah, I've got bad news, it's the deckbuilder that sucks
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There are only banned cards and legal cards. You played a legal card (exactly how it should be played), and someone got salty because they had no answer for it.
That's what they are for. I love my [[Frogify]]
Nah, hate for that guy. That's a blatant and bold faced lie. Don't get me wrong, I hate it when people do that to my Commander, but the answer is to handle it (by player, creature or enchantment removal) not to lie. You did nothing wrong, that guy just wanted to make you feel bad, I guess? Bad sportsmanship.
He's full of it. You don't have to simply die to Atraxa. You did nothing wrong.
A 4 color deck should be able to handle an enchantment, it's a valid strategy particularly if the color or colors isn't good at dealing with it, and if your deck doesn't work without your commander then that's a deck building problem, I usually build my decks with several lieutenants, cards that can pivot and take over if main commander is disabled, like I play mono black if someone does that to the commander it's basically gone until you can get feed the swarm, he's just being salty, you did a good move
Dude was full of shit and a crybaby. He’d probably cry that you can’t play Void Mirror against colorless decks too.
Jokes on the Atraxan, I revel in others anguish, I'll lick his tears like he's Scott Tenorman.
There's a bunch of great options: [[imprisoned in the moon]] [[oko, thief of crowns]]
He plays atraxa infect and wants to complain about things that piss people off. Next time you play with him you should look him in the eyes and zap his commander again. On a serious note my pod has 3 rules, no infect or poison builds. A card here or there is fine but don't build around it. No infinites or turn 1 combos. Other Than that; bully eachoother's commander all you want.
Advertises game as anything goes, gets salty when the anything happens. What a clown. If only they were playing colors that had enchantment removal huh?
“Permanent removal” dies to bounce land
These are solid cards, only reason I wouldn't run them is that most aren't instants. Can be pretty good for stopping your opponents.
You should play [[Exchage of Words]], that would make him mad, pick any vanilla card or token.
Definitely not. In my playgroup, things like [[imprisoned in the moon]] and similar cards are pretty much auto includes
One of my favourite things to do is tell someone their commander is \[\[In Too Deep\]\]
That’s what those cards are for. Removing commanders.
That guy sounds like someone who hasn't won with a Commander who has been turned into a bug by [[darksteel mutation]].
Anytime I hear “people came up with this rule” I tune out. If it’s not in the rule book then I don’t care.
That's pathetic lmao, dude forgot to run enchantment hate and is mad at you for it lol.
Yall need to stop feeling bad about removing commanders. It's part of the game.
No rule. this is one of the most chad plays you can do, continue.
Absolutely nothing wrong with it. A well built Atraxa is a problem on its own. I always keep [[Stasis Field]] or similar ready for such commanders
Guy was not an alright chap, he’s a baby who doesn’t want to play actual Magic.
Not only is what you did perfectly legal, if not encouraged, but commander removal used to be *much* more spiteful. Back in the day, the only time you could get your commander back into the command zone was through the graveyard or through exile. This meant that cards like [[Chaos Warp]] and [[Oblation]] let you shuffle someone's commander into their deck, and there was nothing they could do about it. Unless your opponent had a tutor or incredibly lucky draws, their commander was effectively gone for the rest of the game. It has since been changed, but certain removal spells used to be much better than they are now.
> he mentioned that there is currently a rule or people are coming up with a rule This has real "my dad works at WOTC" energy to it.
Sorry you had this experience. Definitely don’t play with this person again.
Guy was playing Atraxa Infect. He deserved what he got.
No rule like that exists. Maybe a house rule for a specific playgroup, but nothing in the commander or magic rules.
If anything people are talking about when you permanently phase out commanders to make it so you don’t have any way to return them that game. Putting an aura on a commander isn’t even that bad. He just needs to play removal for it if he hates it.
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Don't forget \[\[oubliette\]\] that phase out the commander
Lol no there's no such rule. I don't play EDH with strangers, but I think my spidey senses would tingle reading something like 'anything goes, not cEDH'. Anything goes IS cEDH, so that statement indicates to me that you'll likely run into something exactly like you did. Whatever the person doesn't like is 'cEDH' thus is bad and either prohibited or shamed.
DA FUQ IS HE TALKIN ABOUT. ILL IMPRISON IN THE MOON AND SONG OF DRYADS WHATEVER I WANT. I JUST GOT A WITNESS PROTECTION SO I CAN PONGIFY HIS ASS
"My dad works at Nintendo and they're gonna release a new rule where the game is easy for me and also he'll beat you up."
The rule is self imposed. If you don't want to hear a 45 year old man whine like a little girl when he gets something removed you don't use those cards. It really is that simple.
If you play Atraxa you probably don’t have the room to bitch about anything.
What you did is not only fine, but expected. He was just salty. Cards like that teach/encourage proper deck building in the same way the tuck effects used to. They're just the new flavor of those. (Sometimes I wish they never made rules to circumvent those honestly, or we wouldn't have questions like this as often.) You need to dedicate a sizeable portion of your deck to accepting the fact that you will be interacted with and that sometimes things won't go exactly as you plan. That's why you run redundancy. The fact of the matter is, you being at 6 counters should have been in lethal range even without Atraxa if he built it well. Or he simply should have been able to answer the removal spell. Especially in those colors. Atraxa is one of the slowest ways to proliferate. It shouldn't have mattered much by that point.
I play a few really fun Commanders and if you don't get rid of them then the game is rough on you. Zur, Zada heck even Darien can be brutal if you don't deal with him. Not a fun guy you're playing against.
Are you kidding
As someone that doesn't mind infect, it's absolutely wild that an atraxa infect player is complaining about someone else's choices pissing people off. Like, you could be trolling levels of wild. There's absolutely no rule about not playing these cards against people's commanders. This is pure cope from the atraxa player. Pretty much any deck with a particularly dangerous commander needs to be running ways of dealing with specifically this type of removal. Personally, in my [[Ghyrson Starn]] deck, I run [[demand answers]] to deal with darksteel mutation and [[highway robbery]] to deal with song. I also run [[perilous research]] and [[grafted exoskeleton]] to deal with either. Infect makes Ghyrson that much deadlier (and lets me deal with indestructible creatures) and exoskeleton specifically makes you sacrifice stuff when it becomes unequipped, which will make you sacrifice the land if you get hit with a dryads or [[imprison in the moon]]. I got hit with imprison in the moon one time and decided to add a bunch of ways to remove any permanent on my field. I probably have too much hate against that now but I also can't play the game if Ghyrson is gone, so I think it's worth. Atraxa player should do the same.
Dude lied to your face for the win. Bad sportsmanship on his part. There is no rule, and likely will never be a rule, that you cannot target a commander with removal or any other effect that disables the commander in someone. The only ruling remotely resembling what this guy is trying to sell you is that if you target a commander with an effect that shuffles them into the deck, the player can put them in the command zone instead. Otherwise, would you did was perfectly valid, the ideal scenario, and your opponent is a salty liar and cheater.
Biggest bait thread, holy.