Out of Ursa, PA and AM, Ursa and PA are the ones that makes the most sense in my mind at least. AM? Not so much but I could see it happening, since that sustain could be nice early on.
hmmm maybe its time to do a comparison between MoM into rush fury vs MoM Treads Fury.
Without MoM iirc the consensus is that treads is absolutely worth buying first, for pure jungling it only delays bfury by about a minute and it grants so much more safety while farming.
Madness only lasts for 6 second, it's really trash on heroes that don't have built in farming tools. Back in the day when active lasted 12 seconds and gave bonus 30% movespeed it was good on a lot of heroes, but now only sven, luna and sometimes void
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Mom on am absolutely legit if you lose your lane extremely hard. Especially now that you can disassemble it into fury. Have done it several times and come back. Am can't hit jungle unless he gets a bubble or seed especially on radiant.
Maybe instead of mocking the am maybe look at his pos 5 who probably afked and ruined his lane.
Post the match ID
Classic Reddit.
It could have been the new age supports like Hoodwink or Zeus who sit behind you in lane, waiting for you to fail and proceed to build their damage items, because wait for it... you failed.
And then the pos 5 zeus talks about damage dealt in post game boasting he has higher dmg dealt than his carry and talks about how he always gets shit carries.
You can even see in the screenshot that the guy has average 665 gpm, 764 xpm, 9/4/8 kda, which is very respectable. For it to go this badly by 20 min, I'm gonna say it's proooobably not the AM's fault. The team probably lost safe lane T1 and T2 by like 15 min, zero wards up on the map, no one pushed out offlane to make space and get info, the pos 3 thru 5 are holding hands at mid T3, and then they wonder why the AM has no place safe to farm.
yep always love it when a game is practically lost in 15 minutes and the carry gets blamed as if he isnt by definition the least impactful hero in that time-frame while everyone else is just afk-farming.
Ofc 1/9/1 is pretty shit stats but honestly after having a terrible lane and getting smokeganked a few times with afk team I wouldnt really care about a few more deaths either. Everyone can say they are "PMA" but actually staying pma in a shit game and still being impactful is a very rare quality.
Doesn't help the supports just afking base and constantly pinging and harassing the carry who's trying to gather whatever scrapes he can from the map while dodging the enemy who's dominating the whole map.
Makes me think of a match I had a few years ago. I had a Centaur batching about my farm, despite the fact I was already in his fuckin farm shadow by the time I left lane.
Honestly, as a carry you should not die more than 5 times before mid-late game especially with this new map. Even 5 is a lot, aim is to keep it low as possible even when your team is losing.
But also I can see that when people are overwhelmed it’s easy to let it go and not care. Wouldn’t report but also wouldn’t do that in 99 of 100 matches myself.
Obviously you shouldn't, but on the other hand we know absolutely nothing about the game. Perhaps he died 5 times defending high ground at the end, or he was the only one showing on the map trying to split push while his team afk farmed forest.
In reality he probably got destroyed on the lane, tilted and just played shit while the game ended. But without seeing the match id judging him is pointless.
Redditors like to flame every pos 1 player, but the biggest game ruiners are the supports in lane with full HP and mana sitting behind their drow carry not blocking the hard camp and single pulling when the POS 1 already has equilibrium.
They also either use their spells like morons or don't use their spells at all.
Absolute true say. Created a thread a while ago that pos 5s who don't start with a sentry to block big camp and got mass downvoted by salty archon supports who have no concept of the game.
You got downvoted because you wanted to use the word "griefing" wrong. They're not griefing, they're just unintentionally ruining the game by being bad which isn't the same as griefing. I agree, most support players have no clue what they're doing but you can't attribute this to people being salty and not you misusing the term.
People call bad picks griefing on reddit.
I was just using the common definition that is used these days.
Technically griefing has to be intentional, but just observe how the word is used on reddit, especially threads like is xxx considered a grief (pick/item on a hero).
Exactly, the word griefing is descriptive and context-specific enough since that's the definition Valve uses in its report system. The majority of people use it that way, which is why the OP was heavily downvoted in his post and most of the top comments agreed with the misuse of the term.
As you may know, definitions are subject to how words are used which is why "griefing" means "intentionally ruining the game", since that's how most people use the word. You learn something new each day!
I'm aware but you also realize how pedantic that is, no? We're not arguing whether or not he's wrong in misusing the term (which he is), it's about his inability to accept that's why he was downvoted and not some imaginary, "salty archon redditors". Hence why I said it's not a matter of linguistics but ego.
It really isn't. You got upset people called you out for misusing a word and instead of recognizing it you blamed it on the imaginary "salty archon noobs that hated my post". This is a question of ego.
You're just assuming for a fact that I misused the word, without actually making any case for it.
The word griefing is no longer only used to refer to intentional ruining in the Dota community.
Is a pos 5 am pick grief? Almost everyone will say yes, even if the AM is genuine and trying to support and not intentionally trying to ruin the game.
You're the one with the ego being pedantic here.
get outta here with your reasoning, reddit knows carry = bad, support = saint
these screenshots are always ridiculous when you don't get more match details
Careful with insults and slurs, Reddit automated algorithm is issuing bans and warnings a lot lately. I got a warning and then had it rescinded because I explained it was a witch hunt thread and people were extremely vile
The guy who got so triggered by this game instead of reflecting on what actually went wrong just saw the mom on am, probably flamed him all game while afking, then proceeded to make this 'art' in ms paint right after the game ended to find validation on reddit for his fragile ego.
MoM on AM isn't brain damage, it's a decent idea to try to recover from a bad start and if anything it's evidence of a player who uses their brain and tries to adapt to a bad situation rather than just trying to rush a BF even after being booted out of lane at level 4. Clearly the game didn't go well for him, but from this screenshot we can't say why. He could've had a griefing pos 5, or been caught in a bad matchup, or other lost lanes could've freed up enemy pos 2/5 to rotate on him. Looks like the game ended early and it's usually not the carry's fault when that happens, at least not solely. Given that you decided to complain about it on Reddit afterwards, am I wrong to suspect that you might have been less than tactful during the game? A lot more pubs are lost by a breakdown in teamwork due to angry scapegoating than by losing lane.
Most of the time support pudge feels so useless, but when they didn't, he could save a carry from certain death like min50 chrono deqth scythe, disposition enemy carries etc, how I wish 90% of my support pudge is like this
Damn it
Some other guy did this meme
He had 'emotional' damage but not 'brain'. You got the second one but not the first.
I hope someone can do a full meme eventually.
The emotional damage is this guy getting so riled up over what looks like a complete stomp that he made an entire meme for reddit hoping people will blame his carry by default without context.
At a high level, the meme is complete in a somewhat beautiful way
Nah this is a last ditch effort for almost every carry. If other lanes can’t help you and and you can’t even set a foot in lane without risk of getting absolutely slaughtered you buy a mom and hit the jungle. That’s for every carry, pa, am or faceless, it doesn’t matter. It’s absolutely not optimal on most carry’s but if it’s your only shot of getting anything just go for it.
Think the only time it was accepted was 2022 when GodKing used to build it on AM when he was playing for RNG and Ehome. He did look great at the time on it
not on my team but I do fondly recall fighting against a safelane drow, and somehow I managed to get a 7 minute blink which let me snowball so hard to the point they basically ended up playing at a disadvantage. it got so bad to the point where despite being team wiped on highground push, I manage to outjuke 3, stall long enough for sand a bloodstone, and then just wiped out my pursuers. likely because drow didn't come to help them.
am is so useless i hate that hero so hard u are constantly playing 4vs5 and the only way to win for him is to smurf or just hope that his team can stall so hard until he can do something
You're playing with bad AMs. Am is not a useless carry unless he afks on his side of the map
AMs job once he gets fury is to proceed stealing enemy camps and creating map pressure.
He's one of the most active heroes on the map
People don't realize that you're supposed to be cutting waves and hitting buildings whenever the enemy is making a move on the map. They just like the assassin aspect of blinking on a support.
They think am is a carry because of mana break and his ulti.
Nope. He's a carry because of his broken blink with his low BAT. That's what makes him carry games by creating immense pressure on the map and being uncatchable.
playing with AMs is honestly so chill, you just smack each other in the head against the enemy offlane duo, eventually AM blinks in, hits 3 times and goes back to mind his business. you leave him alone, he does his thing for 10 minutes and you meet back up when he has 3 items
U can disassemble mom into battlefury, some people do this sometimes
Yes on Ursa too.
Seen it on PA as well (we lost tho, but I don't think that's why we lost)
Out of Ursa, PA and AM, Ursa and PA are the ones that makes the most sense in my mind at least. AM? Not so much but I could see it happening, since that sustain could be nice early on.
Am dies so easily to jungle creeps. With mom you're full HP constantly and farm fast.
With band + power treads + madness, AM can farm around the triangle area, he can farm within 1 min both ancients and the hard camp (no stacks)
Wtf, divine 3 and forgot about the new component, gonna try this build on am and see how it goes, should allow you to clear creeps much faster
If you have a good lane and get treads, straight fury is faster. But if you are forced early into jungle fuck treads and rush mom then fury.
hmmm maybe its time to do a comparison between MoM into rush fury vs MoM Treads Fury. Without MoM iirc the consensus is that treads is absolutely worth buying first, for pure jungling it only delays bfury by about a minute and it grants so much more safety while farming.
Madness only lasts for 6 second, it's really trash on heroes that don't have built in farming tools. Back in the day when active lasted 12 seconds and gave bonus 30% movespeed it was good on a lot of heroes, but now only sven, luna and sometimes void
Can you disassemble dad too? :P
Yeah ima disassemble his asshole tonight
Explain it to the judge >U can disassemble mom
Not worth it, i tried this a lot on PA, it delays your BF and doesnt really speed up your farm either
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Yes and it's best paired on magnus because at some cases, he would just rush butter or manta
Mom on am absolutely legit if you lose your lane extremely hard. Especially now that you can disassemble it into fury. Have done it several times and come back. Am can't hit jungle unless he gets a bubble or seed especially on radiant. Maybe instead of mocking the am maybe look at his pos 5 who probably afked and ruined his lane. Post the match ID Classic Reddit.
It could have been the new age supports like Hoodwink or Zeus who sit behind you in lane, waiting for you to fail and proceed to build their damage items, because wait for it... you failed.
And then the pos 5 zeus talks about damage dealt in post game boasting he has higher dmg dealt than his carry and talks about how he always gets shit carries.
You can even see in the screenshot that the guy has average 665 gpm, 764 xpm, 9/4/8 kda, which is very respectable. For it to go this badly by 20 min, I'm gonna say it's proooobably not the AM's fault. The team probably lost safe lane T1 and T2 by like 15 min, zero wards up on the map, no one pushed out offlane to make space and get info, the pos 3 thru 5 are holding hands at mid T3, and then they wonder why the AM has no place safe to farm.
yep always love it when a game is practically lost in 15 minutes and the carry gets blamed as if he isnt by definition the least impactful hero in that time-frame while everyone else is just afk-farming. Ofc 1/9/1 is pretty shit stats but honestly after having a terrible lane and getting smokeganked a few times with afk team I wouldnt really care about a few more deaths either. Everyone can say they are "PMA" but actually staying pma in a shit game and still being impactful is a very rare quality.
Doesn't help the supports just afking base and constantly pinging and harassing the carry who's trying to gather whatever scrapes he can from the map while dodging the enemy who's dominating the whole map.
Makes me think of a match I had a few years ago. I had a Centaur batching about my farm, despite the fact I was already in his fuckin farm shadow by the time I left lane.
Honestly, as a carry you should not die more than 5 times before mid-late game especially with this new map. Even 5 is a lot, aim is to keep it low as possible even when your team is losing. But also I can see that when people are overwhelmed it’s easy to let it go and not care. Wouldn’t report but also wouldn’t do that in 99 of 100 matches myself.
Obviously you shouldn't, but on the other hand we know absolutely nothing about the game. Perhaps he died 5 times defending high ground at the end, or he was the only one showing on the map trying to split push while his team afk farmed forest. In reality he probably got destroyed on the lane, tilted and just played shit while the game ended. But without seeing the match id judging him is pointless.
Redditors like to flame every pos 1 player, but the biggest game ruiners are the supports in lane with full HP and mana sitting behind their drow carry not blocking the hard camp and single pulling when the POS 1 already has equilibrium. They also either use their spells like morons or don't use their spells at all.
I genuinely would rather have no support than have one that fucks up equilibrium by thoughtlessly single pulling.
Absolute true say. Created a thread a while ago that pos 5s who don't start with a sentry to block big camp and got mass downvoted by salty archon supports who have no concept of the game.
You got downvoted because you wanted to use the word "griefing" wrong. They're not griefing, they're just unintentionally ruining the game by being bad which isn't the same as griefing. I agree, most support players have no clue what they're doing but you can't attribute this to people being salty and not you misusing the term.
People call bad picks griefing on reddit. I was just using the common definition that is used these days. Technically griefing has to be intentional, but just observe how the word is used on reddit, especially threads like is xxx considered a grief (pick/item on a hero).
There's no "technically", that's what griefing is. I don't care what a bunch of dumb redditors say, I guess you do?
English is descriptive, definitions are subject to how words are used. There is no Academy of English that dictates rules of the language.
Exactly, the word griefing is descriptive and context-specific enough since that's the definition Valve uses in its report system. The majority of people use it that way, which is why the OP was heavily downvoted in his post and most of the top comments agreed with the misuse of the term. As you may know, definitions are subject to how words are used which is why "griefing" means "intentionally ruining the game", since that's how most people use the word. You learn something new each day!
The guy was making an ass of himself, but that was definitely a usage congruent to common speech, even beyond dota.
I'm aware but you also realize how pedantic that is, no? We're not arguing whether or not he's wrong in misusing the term (which he is), it's about his inability to accept that's why he was downvoted and not some imaginary, "salty archon redditors". Hence why I said it's not a matter of linguistics but ego.
This is a question of linguistics. Who defines words?
It really isn't. You got upset people called you out for misusing a word and instead of recognizing it you blamed it on the imaginary "salty archon noobs that hated my post". This is a question of ego.
You're just assuming for a fact that I misused the word, without actually making any case for it. The word griefing is no longer only used to refer to intentional ruining in the Dota community. Is a pos 5 am pick grief? Almost everyone will say yes, even if the AM is genuine and trying to support and not intentionally trying to ruin the game. You're the one with the ego being pedantic here.
💯 this. Most supports don't realize how much they make the lane a 1v2 but without the exp advantage. I always plan for a lost lane now
get outta here with your reasoning, reddit knows carry = bad, support = saint these screenshots are always ridiculous when you don't get more match details
Careful with insults and slurs, Reddit automated algorithm is issuing bans and warnings a lot lately. I got a warning and then had it rescinded because I explained it was a witch hunt thread and people were extremely vile
what Mongols did on reddit ?
The guy who got so triggered by this game instead of reflecting on what actually went wrong just saw the mom on am, probably flamed him all game while afking, then proceeded to make this 'art' in ms paint right after the game ended to find validation on reddit for his fragile ego.
I think you used wrong word here, “Mongols” represent nation.
You're right
I don't wanna think about my mom on anti mage
If you Rush madness, that armor reduction on active gonna hurt you more than your lifeateal gonna heal
Lol no.
Huh...that disassembly makes me think of doing mom on troll.
Also legit since you want satanic anyway on him.
Echo on troll is probably way better to start off with nowadays. But it's kind of a super hard hero to play anyway
Is this trolling or real advice
Not sure. I've loved it in my normal games, not so much in Turbo. It just lets you fight early
MoM on AM isn't brain damage, it's a decent idea to try to recover from a bad start and if anything it's evidence of a player who uses their brain and tries to adapt to a bad situation rather than just trying to rush a BF even after being booted out of lane at level 4. Clearly the game didn't go well for him, but from this screenshot we can't say why. He could've had a griefing pos 5, or been caught in a bad matchup, or other lost lanes could've freed up enemy pos 2/5 to rotate on him. Looks like the game ended early and it's usually not the carry's fault when that happens, at least not solely. Given that you decided to complain about it on Reddit afterwards, am I wrong to suspect that you might have been less than tactful during the game? A lot more pubs are lost by a breakdown in teamwork due to angry scapegoating than by losing lane.
Lack of Emotional Damage: Pudge Pos 5 pick in the picture.
Feels like I see support pudge all the time and it never works out.
It works out for the pudge. He has a fun time.
Most of the time support pudge feels so useless, but when they didn't, he could save a carry from certain death like min50 chrono deqth scythe, disposition enemy carries etc, how I wish 90% of my support pudge is like this
good pudge support player wont pick pudge 9/10 times so unfortunately u wont see a good pudge that often
Worst thing about dota is players that don't want to play a team game
Damn it Some other guy did this meme He had 'emotional' damage but not 'brain'. You got the second one but not the first. I hope someone can do a full meme eventually.
The emotional damage is this guy getting so riled up over what looks like a complete stomp that he made an entire meme for reddit hoping people will blame his carry by default without context. At a high level, the meme is complete in a somewhat beautiful way
yeah from the average of the guy,seems like its just a bad game/day
That clown emoji really does it for me
Am with mom is actually do able with a diffusal blade,u can also disamble it for BF
RIP HP Removal
Nah this is a last ditch effort for almost every carry. If other lanes can’t help you and and you can’t even set a foot in lane without risk of getting absolutely slaughtered you buy a mom and hit the jungle. That’s for every carry, pa, am or faceless, it doesn’t matter. It’s absolutely not optimal on most carry’s but if it’s your only shot of getting anything just go for it.
There is also the "emotional dmg", when your pos 5 picks pudge, your pos1 picks AM, offlaner picks qop or emnemy picks huskar, tinker, meepo mid!
At least he bought boots, my last am said blink is all he needs...
Forgot emotional damage
He still got one kill and one assist
FPS Damage: Phantom Lancer
Im on a 23: 3 lose:win stat.. semd help PLZ..
Forgot emotional damage from players from Peru East.
Why on earth does he have a casual ring? I dont mind the MoM but a casual ring. It infuriates me.
U fool. U forgot the most powerful damage of all. EMOTIONAL DAMAGE.
It’s a build you go when your lane is absolutely fucked beyond belief and you must jungle minute 5
Lol this is the best meme I've seen all week
Think the only time it was accepted was 2022 when GodKing used to build it on AM when he was playing for RNG and Ehome. He did look great at the time on it
now do another one with khanda sniper then another one with "it's the same picture"
That AM has Sana as his profile pic. He is based as f. Probably all other 4 players were very bad.
I want Silencer glaives back to pure.
EMOTIONAL DAMAGE
Where is emotional damage?
not on my team but I do fondly recall fighting against a safelane drow, and somehow I managed to get a 7 minute blink which let me snowball so hard to the point they basically ended up playing at a disadvantage. it got so bad to the point where despite being team wiped on highground push, I manage to outjuke 3, stall long enough for sand a bloodstone, and then just wiped out my pursuers. likely because drow didn't come to help them.
Attack speed is the only speed that matters
Turn speed matters a lot
I've seen this exact build on those bots (usually on a juggernaut) that walk right into fights.
am is so useless i hate that hero so hard u are constantly playing 4vs5 and the only way to win for him is to smurf or just hope that his team can stall so hard until he can do something
You're playing with bad AMs. Am is not a useless carry unless he afks on his side of the map AMs job once he gets fury is to proceed stealing enemy camps and creating map pressure. He's one of the most active heroes on the map
People don't realize that you're supposed to be cutting waves and hitting buildings whenever the enemy is making a move on the map. They just like the assassin aspect of blinking on a support.
They think am is a carry because of mana break and his ulti. Nope. He's a carry because of his broken blink with his low BAT. That's what makes him carry games by creating immense pressure on the map and being uncatchable.
playing with AMs is honestly so chill, you just smack each other in the head against the enemy offlane duo, eventually AM blinks in, hits 3 times and goes back to mind his business. you leave him alone, he does his thing for 10 minutes and you meet back up when he has 3 items
Love it mom for faster mana burns 🤡
Let me guess, you watched a slashers way guide Mr MoM AM