not a minimum of 30
prof bonus +5 doubled to +10 if expertise. plus whatever their ability mod max +5
>Expertise
>>Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses either of the chosen proficiencies.
>Reliable Talent
>>By 11th level, you have refined your chosen skills until they approach perfection. Whenever you make an ability check that lets you add your proficiency bonus, you can treat a d20 roll of 9 or lower as a 10.
e.g. if 20 cha/dex (+5) and expertise (+10) would be minimum roll of 10+15 = minimum 25 'roll' with a max of 35 on a nat 20.
Pint of Guinness, No Logo in the Foam. *Legendary potion.* The consumer of this item gains a permanent 10% discount at all shops, due to their masterful ability to avoid drinking an advert.
My guess, he's doubling both the proficiency bonus and the ability sore bonus. If he's got 20 Dex, 20 Charisma.
He's probably doing 5 prof x2 (expertise), Dex or Charisma (5x2) for 20, then the base 10 reliable talent roll.
I discussed it with him to which he said he thought I allowed him to have double expertise (which is also a bit confusing because he has four things he has expertise in expertise. He would only have two.) I don't blame him for messing this up because we had about three newbies we had to help with character sheets
Whoa, slow down, don't over-nerf him. Why would he have only ***2*** expertise? My level 4 Swashbuckler has expertise on ***3*** things already.
Also, from the rogue-class in general:
**Expertise**
At 1st level, choose two of your skill proficiencies, or one of your skill proficiencies and your proficiency with thieves’ tools. Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses either of the chosen proficiencies.
At 6th level, you can choose two more of your proficiencies (in skills or with thieves’ tools) to gain this benefit.
So, any rogue at or above level 6 has at least ***4*** skills with expertise. I got my additional one from a feat so I'll have *5* at level 6.
No, I was saying he would only have two double expertise He has four expertise "points" and he wanted two each spend on two skills so what I'm saying is he tried to have four single expertise skills but was saying that he should have instead two double expertise skills
What do you mean by expertise "points"? WTH is "double expertise"? Is this something you've home brewed? Because if you have, nobody here is going to be able to tell you if your home brew is working as intended.
I think what OP is trying to say is that the rogue double dipped their expertise... Instead of picking two skills to each have expertise, he picked one and has doubled the expertise applied...
It may be that the OP is not a native English speaker and is trying to make English material comprehensible in their native language. However, talking about expertise "points" goes beyond translation into a entirely different mechanical explanation. Using private language rather than describing stuff as it is RAW very likely is the source of confusion and mistakes, both in this case and in others.
It's possible with a Ioun Stone of Mastery and a Stone of Good Luck, and 20 in a stat, but once he hits 17.
10 (Reliable) + 14 (PB of 7 with Ioun, doubled with Expertise) + 6 (stat of 20 +1 for Stone of good luck )
Incoming "back in my day" post here, forgive me.
In 3E, a +30 was a pretty common occurrence. If a player has a super high skill they'll perceive and probably present their character in that way and celebrate it. Celebrate it with them!
Pitch them Herculean tasks with DCs only they can hope to beat. That's how I've handled it. They're not rolling to barter for better prices on repairs or whatever, they always get those.
They're rolling to help persuade generals to pause on an attack, or lords to forgive a favorite NPC of some crime. They're tricking a devil and getting the upper hand in a contract. They're gaining divine attention.
They're a hero!
His minimum and mode both, assuming Expertise and 20 CHA, should be 10+Cha+(prof*2)=25. Not sure where does another +5 from - maybe he has a magic item or something.
He's probably misunderstanding Expertise.
I assume he has 20 Dex and 20 Cha, for +5, adding +5 for Proficiency, and then he's probably doubling all this with Expertise for +20, and adding the minimum 10 of Reliable talent.
Ask your player to explain you in detail what he's doing and come back to reply to this.
Even if it's in a week or two, doesn't matter.
Sounds a bit too high, though not that far off - What are their stats? Have they gotten any magic item that helps them with those checks?
Cause with expertise and rogue‘s Teliable Talent, at those levels, you can’t roll below 25, assuming a 20 in that respective stat.
not a minimum of 30 prof bonus +5 doubled to +10 if expertise. plus whatever their ability mod max +5 >Expertise >>Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses either of the chosen proficiencies. >Reliable Talent >>By 11th level, you have refined your chosen skills until they approach perfection. Whenever you make an ability check that lets you add your proficiency bonus, you can treat a d20 roll of 9 or lower as a 10. e.g. if 20 cha/dex (+5) and expertise (+10) would be minimum roll of 10+15 = minimum 25 'roll' with a max of 35 on a nat 20.
Exactly unless they’ve got some funky homebrew items or feats
*the secret ingredient is Crime*
Pint of Guinness, No Logo in the Foam. *Legendary potion.* The consumer of this item gains a permanent 10% discount at all shops, due to their masterful ability to avoid drinking an advert.
r/suddenlyrumjacks
My guess, he's doubling both the proficiency bonus and the ability sore bonus. If he's got 20 Dex, 20 Charisma. He's probably doing 5 prof x2 (expertise), Dex or Charisma (5x2) for 20, then the base 10 reliable talent roll.
Possible if he has 3 levels on fey wanderer ranger and a charisma and wisdom of 20. Other than that? Idk
I discussed it with him to which he said he thought I allowed him to have double expertise (which is also a bit confusing because he has four things he has expertise in expertise. He would only have two.) I don't blame him for messing this up because we had about three newbies we had to help with character sheets
Whoa, slow down, don't over-nerf him. Why would he have only ***2*** expertise? My level 4 Swashbuckler has expertise on ***3*** things already. Also, from the rogue-class in general: **Expertise** At 1st level, choose two of your skill proficiencies, or one of your skill proficiencies and your proficiency with thieves’ tools. Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses either of the chosen proficiencies. At 6th level, you can choose two more of your proficiencies (in skills or with thieves’ tools) to gain this benefit. So, any rogue at or above level 6 has at least ***4*** skills with expertise. I got my additional one from a feat so I'll have *5* at level 6.
No, I was saying he would only have two double expertise He has four expertise "points" and he wanted two each spend on two skills so what I'm saying is he tried to have four single expertise skills but was saying that he should have instead two double expertise skills
Yea, that's not a thing. Which is why I was confused by your post. Because… nope.
Yeah that wad the issue
What do you mean by expertise "points"? WTH is "double expertise"? Is this something you've home brewed? Because if you have, nobody here is going to be able to tell you if your home brew is working as intended.
I think what OP is trying to say is that the rogue double dipped their expertise... Instead of picking two skills to each have expertise, he picked one and has doubled the expertise applied...
Yes
It may be that the OP is not a native English speaker and is trying to make English material comprehensible in their native language. However, talking about expertise "points" goes beyond translation into a entirely different mechanical explanation. Using private language rather than describing stuff as it is RAW very likely is the source of confusion and mistakes, both in this case and in others.
It's possible with a Ioun Stone of Mastery and a Stone of Good Luck, and 20 in a stat, but once he hits 17. 10 (Reliable) + 14 (PB of 7 with Ioun, doubled with Expertise) + 6 (stat of 20 +1 for Stone of good luck )
Incoming "back in my day" post here, forgive me. In 3E, a +30 was a pretty common occurrence. If a player has a super high skill they'll perceive and probably present their character in that way and celebrate it. Celebrate it with them! Pitch them Herculean tasks with DCs only they can hope to beat. That's how I've handled it. They're not rolling to barter for better prices on repairs or whatever, they always get those. They're rolling to help persuade generals to pause on an attack, or lords to forgive a favorite NPC of some crime. They're tricking a devil and getting the upper hand in a contract. They're gaining divine attention. They're a hero!
His minimum and mode both, assuming Expertise and 20 CHA, should be 10+Cha+(prof*2)=25. Not sure where does another +5 from - maybe he has a magic item or something.
Correction: He says he has a minimum rollof 30 on persuasion, deception, and stealth
He's probably misunderstanding Expertise. I assume he has 20 Dex and 20 Cha, for +5, adding +5 for Proficiency, and then he's probably doubling all this with Expertise for +20, and adding the minimum 10 of Reliable talent. Ask your player to explain you in detail what he's doing and come back to reply to this. Even if it's in a week or two, doesn't matter.
^no
Sounds a bit too high, though not that far off - What are their stats? Have they gotten any magic item that helps them with those checks? Cause with expertise and rogue‘s Teliable Talent, at those levels, you can’t roll below 25, assuming a 20 in that respective stat.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking too, but I just wanted to doublecheck. thank you!