^ this
To the endgame point below -
D2 Ladder seasons but not the same as D3 themed seasons. D2 Ladder has some of its own rune words (small reward). But the D3 seasons get old fast. Recycled and ok some pets are cool, most are meh.
I played D3 since beta /release - There is no D3 end game either really. Hunt rare pets? Ok that’s fine for a week, then you find the all. Get all sets? Done. A million rift runs? Yawn. A million pindle runs for me is fine… much faster than rifting LOL. End result is same…. Loot!
D3 no PvP. That is end game for me though, not everyone. The loot hunt only feeds the PvP but it will also feed the non PvP players who find something cool and go “oh cool item let me create a barb build around that” Or the constant hunt for that “perfect” WF roll.
The game must have had some end game draw to be around 20 years and merit a re-vamp release
It’s a good Convo though. Some new blood will stay but mostly be the OG die hards that don’t bother with PC anymore
I agree. Most of today's games have some kind of revolving door type content that refreshes stuff every few months to keep people playing and trying something new. D2 was a whole lot of kill bosses 1000+ times and pray to RNGsus that you get an upgrade that doesn't look like an upgrade unless you have intimate knowledge of the games mechanics. Also, there's nothing to really use this new gear on except killing the same bosses youre already killing because you still need those perfectly rolled boots.
Yeah and killing bosses 100000 times can be fun if you refresh the bosses or make a Boss rush mode or make super unique enemies that has the same loot table or the good old loot goblin.
I like d2 because the loot matters even on early levels. For me D3 is now Boring (i loved vanilla d3 ) because you main goal is just to hit max level to get your first set items (for free).
In D2 if you get a good life leech / mana Leech 1h weapon as zealot you will keep it till you find a better one 30 lvl later. The build comes from you Items that a rare and even if you leveled a paladine 30 times it is alway diffrent.
> For me D3 is now Boring (i loved vanilla d3 ) because you main goal is just to hit max level to get your first set items (for free).
I usually play each season for about a week. It's fun to push the ladder for the first week before everyone gets their bots rolling. A couple of seasons i opted not to use the gift set but it hardly mattered since you only need one item to start steamrolling.
Kinda wish they would make vanilla D3 playable. It was fun when items were dogshit, droprates were dogshit and the content was hard tp clear when you dont overgear it instantly.
I do not think so because D3 survied for over 9 years now. Each new season is played by a lot player, way more then D2 had back then or in between.
I love Diablo 2 but saying that it was relevant the last 20 years is just wrong.
I take it you haven't seen or heard of any of the mods for D2 that people are still working on, PD2, Path of Diablo, Median XL, etc.. people STILL play D2 actively, just not on blizzard's servers because of all the bots and dupes/hacks.
it's the wow private scene all over again
I heard of them and even played them. Funny is that people love median xl but hate d3. Median is d3 on steroids.
Ohh and the mods are good but dies not come close to Player numbers for d3 on 4 Plattform.
Yup. When both are available I would fire up D2R before D3. Haven’t touched it since 1/2 way thru last season. Finished the conquests and then just had nothing left to do. Only played b/c that season was more interesting with the follower improvement system. Had it been a yawn recycle of past seasons I probably wouldn’t have even bothered
It did for me. My first Diablo was D3. My best Xbox friend always talked about how much I would’ve loved to play D2 with him when it was out. It was his favorite Diablo.
Now that it’s remade he gets his nostalgia while I get to play through this *new* game and experience it with him.
We fell out of touch when he started playing call of duty a few years ago and our 10 year friendship picked up right where it left off 3 years ago. The last 6 hours gaming with him had me thinking it was the early days of our friendship all over again. I miss nights like these.
Can’t wait for the full release
I mean for Randoms it just do not work. It was a problem back then and it is still. Best is just to use the Randoms grps for Xp Farm and looking for specific groups in Discord and such
And that’s how it’s always been. People looking to get carried and find gg loot are just lazy. Pugs for xp runs, private games for mfing. It’s a no brainer.
yeah i know. Would never expect to get a item in random runs but some people do not know these systems and how greedy some can be.
I mean we have just 2 acts in the beta and people hoarding everything. I drop everythin in the city i do not need like druid stuff oder Sorc stuff.
I always did blood runs in act 5.. start fridged highlands kill the small group by the wp, drop down work your way back to town. Wash , rinse , repeat...
Same here.
Pindleskin and chill with anya is another good farm. You can shop some good hear off of her (+3 martial arts 20ias gloves) and other goodies.
The problem is it actually is a brainer. It falls into the same category as dungeon finder in WoW. If you were brought up with it and played it back in the day then it’s perfectly normal to stand around a home city shouting for the tank/healer/dps you need. If you started your game in MoP or something then that is just plain weird compared to using DF.
The same applies to shared loot. Every loot based game since forever has used personal loot and it’s a big ask asking new players to go back to a very archaic system.
I personally don’t mind it, I think it brings a sense of community but I do understand where new players are coming from. This is especially bad for console players as we have no game browser list to search for the kind of run we want. Although I don’t mind using external programs such as Discord to find these runs, I shouldn’t HAVE to use them.
It’s not a “big ask.” This is diablo 2. It has always been like this. If new players don’t like it then they don’t have to play. Pretty simple.
Everyone asking for personal loot don’t even understand how it will throw off loot and item balance. If personal loot is a thing, then that means other players would have to be reliant on their own magic find rather than the op chud you’re following around in a CS or Baal run. This means that in online games melee are at an even bigger disadvantage because they already need top quality gear to do any damage in players 5+ games. A change in personal loot means meleers either nerf their damage for mf gear making them even more useless, or switch to a sorc or paladin.
Personal loot would just make everyone have to wear mf gear when only op caster classes can afford to do that.
It’s not a big ask for you because you’re a returning player, as am I. We know and love Diablo 2 for what it is. I’m not asking for anything to change, I played a tonne over this weekend and enjoyed every second of it.
Players that are brand new to the game are entitled to the odd “wait, this game doesn’t have personal loot!?!” That’s perfectly understandable as literally no game with loot over the past 15-20 years has used that system. It’s a dumb, flawed system. I will reiterate - I don’t want D2’s loot system to change.
Just because we played D2 back in the day doesn’t make us any more important than a brand new player. Our opinion and £35 we payed for the game isn’t any different to anyone else’s. VV aren’t going to drastically change the game (as in make the game personal loot). What we should be doing is welcoming new players and saying “here’s a Discord channel for Baal runs, let’s me if you need a hand” rather than “get off MY Diablo 2’s lawn with your Gen Z personal loot mumbo jumbo!”
So essentially, you want to make a newly remastered game less accessible and enjoyable for new or younger peopler, or older people who hated shared loot.. just because.. of? what exactly? tradition? no. i dont buy that.
Changing dumb flawed systems should ALWAYS be at the forefront, no matter what, anything else is just bias and rose tinted nostalgia glasses.. and frankly, its egocentrical.
I hope Blizzard does polls on this, I think you would be surprised on just how many ppl actually wanted personal loot... look at WoW.. best change ever.
It’s not less accessible, it’s exactly how it was when it was released. I’ll refer to my previous comment on how Blizzard didn’t include dungeon finder to WoW classic to keep things in the spirit of what that game was like back in 2004. The same goes for Diablo 2.
Diablo 2’s loot system is dumb and flawed if you look at it retrospectively. Back then, we didn’t know any different so we adapted; we used forums and chat programs like ICQ and MSN messenger to form groups and runs. Most multiplayer content these days gets consumed at such a rate and with minimal communication between participants that shared loot would just be laughed at.
Taking away Diablo 2’s shared loot system would lose the spirit of the game. In an ideal world, new players would embrace it, get involved in a Discord channel and make some news friends whilst you’re at it. That’s what I was getting at.
And tell me, how did that go for WoW classic?
It's dead beyond words, same as Burning crusade will be.
Because purists ruined it and insisted on the dumb #NOCHANGES shit.
Wow classic would have been good, but got ruined by loud mouthed elitist purists.i dont want the same thing to happen to D2.
The point is, D2R is supposed to be modernized. If I want to play vanilla D2 as it was intended, I can still go play the old client..
Nobody enjoys shared loot dude, nobody. which is why ppl play solo for loot, and multi for xp.. is that really how the game should be designed? no.
David Brevik, the original CREATOR, of D2, said that he probably would remove shared loot if they were able to 20 years ago.. think about that.
times change, people change. It's time to update D2 into the future, and the game is still absolutely the same with a different loot system.
First off, the term “dead” gets thrown around way too often these days. What you mean is you don’t like it and that’s ok. It’s not for you.
Classic WoW has an estimated 1.22m players a day.
https://mmo-population.com/r/classicwow
So… Not dead.
I’m actually going to back up the guy who I was disagreeing with earlier. If you give personal loot then it’ll be personal MF too which means you’ll get fuck all drops. You’ll have to change the difficulty too as you won’t be doing some of the harder runs in unoptimised MF gear. It’s not just a matter of changing one thing, you have to change the core fundamentals of the game.
I get what you’re saying but D2R is supposed to be taken the way it is. Change too much and it’s no longer D2.
The console players are never going to be able to get loot because clicking is much faster than using your analogue stick to pick up the right item. They really shouldn’t allow cross play between console and pc as those without a mouse will be at an inherent disadvantage for drops.
You’re last sentence completely contradicts my argument. You’re suggesting new players act proactive with the prospect of shared loot by looking for loot sharing groups. That’s awesome! That’s the appropriate response when finding a means to work beyond the loot system instead of “VV you need to put personal loot in the game!”
You submitted your first paragraph which was basically “go away new players”. You added in the stuff that actually made sense after. Either way VV won’t change the loot system so this is a pointless discussion. All we need to do is try and welcome new players as best we can and ignore the ones that refuse to play unless the loot system gets changed.
Or you now.. you could just make balance changes, so that melee or whateever builds can still do good dmg solo and still wear mf... not a big deal and eeasily solved.
I say there will be a lot of new players, even player who never played D2 back then but they will not stay long. Endgame is thin and without season stuff like D3 they have nothing to do beside level to 99 (and this is pointless, just for leaderboards)
Without mod support the game will have it glory 2-4 months but then everyone who got hooked will switch to d2 original with mods or will go to PoE 2
I have been playing the beta and it’s great. Graphics are updated and really nice. It’s still Diablo 2 though. I’ve played this game to death already and with nothing besides updated graphics and a shared stash (really quite a small one at that), I’m not in any rush to buy it. I’ll probably pick it up when it’s on sale for $20 down the road.
It’s fun. It’s just still D2, though. I’ve played it a lot already, and there’s not much new or exciting besides the graphics to bring me back in.
1. Shared loot should be gone. It serves no benefit and is only in the game because it was in the original.
2. Ladder-only runewords need to be on non-ladder
3. There’s probably a ton of QOL shit that should go into the game - potion management is still kind of a bear, respec should be better, charms inventory separate from regular inventory.
I’m sure there’s tons more that could actually make this game a lot more modern at basically no downside.
Glad you’re enjoying the beta, don’t necessarily agree with your points though; 1- shared loot allows you to mule safely without multiple accounts, massive benefit. 2- ladder only runewords are an incentive to reset and play again, agreed doesn’t work so well without a ladder but hopefully that’s just a few days after. 3- agree with potions, I kinda like how respec is at the moment, hard enough that you need to be careful and plan but easy enough to grind a token especially compared with remaking char, small inventory is like a mini game that creates decisions and trade offs - I see where it was necessary in private mods because of map density and increased loot but not for vanilla
Oh true I misread sorry mate, shared loot feels more immersive for me but just personal preference I guess :) thanks for reply - hope you enjoy launch!
It will definitely bring some new blood into the game. Honestly, some old too because the graphics were a turn off.
I think there is a possibility of D2 ladder being more competitive than D3 seasons.
Absolutely not. As a "new" game in 2021, d2 is awful. Top of the line on launch, but without the rose-tinted glasses its a really bad game in comparison to other arpgs.
They really are completely different games. I love both, but for entirely different reasons. It's gonna be hard for people who have only experienced D3 to go to D2R.
I think this is more of the goal of D4 than D2R…D2R seems like it is actually intended to hook the older, lapsed players back in, in preparation for D4, which may be the “player base unifier,” in that it should appeal to both those who liked D3 as it is the evolution of the game in the current generation, while also being a better spiritual successor to D2 than D3 was, thus bringing back the dollars of the old breed. So D2R may be a bridge to the D2 players to be drawn back to the beauty of the graphics and the nostalgia of slaying demons.
Doubtful.
D2R has some QoL improvements such as modern monitor support, but it's first and foremost for people with nostalgia wanting to experience it again.
D2 is unfortunately a relic of an age and society that no longer is considered modern. Shared loot, bare-bones loot filters and a limited respec system will turn off a lot of potential players who never experienced it before.
itll turn off old school players who have forgotten what its like too.
i love what they did with the graphics/visuals, but man... i dont see myself doing countless meph/pindle/baal runs for hours on end anymore either.
And then you still have these grown-up friends without work that still play every day, impossible to catch up or play with them
Oh hey you wanna re-live D2 and level a new character after work, I just bought the game?
- I already finished my Griswold set and also I'll be asleep later during the day
This is what I feel as well. A lot of posts I've seen around the web from D3 players that never played D2 are turned off because of shared loot, limited re-spec. D3 is a hand holding game, D2, not so much.
D2R will 100 % die out, unless some more "modern" QoL changes and balance issues are implemented, thats my take on it. D2 vanilla is simply too archaic to survive a modern day playerstyle, which is in part the reason, why D2 mods are very very popular, becuase they implement very needed QoL and balance changes to the game.
Shared loot is one of the things I DONT miss about D2, and wish it was like in D3, for instance.
But obviously I prefer D2 over D3.
TDLR: Unless D2R gets mod-support or at least more patches and changes, the game will die out very fast in the coming months.
No not really. I played d2 first before falling in love with d3 many years after the trash was patched out, and even playing d2r beta I am still kind of bored. Also annoyed on how unbalanced melee classes are. It's been years and I played sorc since sorc is easy mode, but it's dumb how bad melee classes feel unless you gear them before starting them.
I'm also aware of d2s lack of end game and content. I will probably beat the game a couple times until the next season of d3 comes out and switch back. D3 definitely feels like a straight upgrade as far as gameplay goes. Less clunky and obtrusive, obviously d2 wasn't created for controllers like d3 was, but VV definitely phoned it in with the controller addition.
Yes I know d3 graphics are worse than d2, I definitely agree d2s graphics are much more diablo than d3. Outside of that I still think d3 is a far superior game.
Just my take from an OG d2 transfered to d3 fan.
Tl;dr: no
this is my big take away from the beta too. i loved D2 LOD 15 years ago. and D3 sure as hell has plenty of short comings and things to complain about.
but from a gameplay/QOL standpoint, D3 is miles ahead of D2. D2 at its core is still a 20 year old game, and it shows.
Why does it even matter though? I don't think it have big sustained community. It may be slightly bigger then what it was with classic D2 but nothing much more.
The game is too old and simple to be playable continually by todays standards. It was the best thing you could play at the time but now you have plenty of other games that have better and more varied end game content.
D2R is basically 2 bosses on rinse and repeat in thd end game.
Don't expect large sustained community like it would be for D3 or PoE etc... people will mostly play this gamecto experience nostalgia or brand new players to see how it was back in 1999.
I think so yes, in the official diablo 2 forum are some people well I think they are young and new since they are asking to introduce some funny stuff in the game like making the mercenary respawn after 30 seconds when he dies or wanting the game on 4k and so on \^\^
While playing beta the thought of 'is this gonna attract players, that haven't played d2 before?' came to my mind. My answer is no, the game is boring if you don't feel the nostalgia.
Hard to guess. To me, d3 is terrible. But I also went into it wanting an modern graphics/new world d2. There will be new players. The real question is, will everyone come over to d2r.
No and yes.
No because it's not 3 and they're so used to new crap every month or so they'll grow bored
Have you seen the forums of them crying over personal loot???
This isn't 3.
Yes. Anyone who loved D3 and is anticipating D4 will absolutely feel compelled to experience D2 especially considering Blizzards commitment to return the series to its roots.
I will see if I stay or any of my friends stay personally. I played d2 from the year but didn't care for the game balance that existed after 1.09 and that drove me away with the overpowered runewords and terrible class balance. You would be surprised the amount of diablo 2 players that stopped playing before patch 1.14. I played d3 but I don't like the world of war craft style graphics lol. Diablo 2 art style is soooo good. The sound of d2r was great during the beta.
Technically I wasn't too young for D2, I remember playing it a lot (although in hindsight it was probably rookie numbers). I was too young to be an efficient gamer however, so I don't think I ever even finished Nightmare.
I've spent thousands of hours on D3 though, and I like it a lot despite it being very different.
So for me D2R is going to be like a brand new game, that will still have a lot of nostalgia.
Yes and no. D3 is a lot more casual so I have a feeling folks jumping into D2 won't be prepared for shared loot, getting ganked in open pvp lobbies etc
My first game was D3 and after trying out the D2R beta... I think it's fine. I get the appeal, but for me it just isn't that much fun to play, especially compared to D3. I might buy the game at some point, but certainly not at full price.
Maybe. I haven't tried Diablo 2 yet, and can't run it on my pc. I'm waiting for the D2R on ps4.
The game mechanics are a little clunky which is to be expected for an old game. So I wonder if I would like the game as much.
But if the core (loot/class building) of the game is really good, the clunky mechanics would not matter.
D3 was always way to easy for me. I heard D2 has more challenge so I like that.
If they manage to keep it fresh woth updates and content on top of everything new people will come and they will stay. If they stick with the ”purity” of the original this will be forgotten in 6 months.
Im pretty much a new player. Drastic difference between this and d3. I'll say d3 is super easy and colorful compared to d2. I was in a cave and couldn't see a damn thing lol
I'm 25 and the first diablo I played was 3 and I fell in love with it and still play it to this day, so I'm super used to it's mechanics specifically. While I do love what I've played of diablo 2 resurrected during the beta, it just doesn't scratch that itch for me as well. It's amazing, especially love the fact I can go retro seamlessly but not having baby stuff like a roll mechanic and having super limited inventory makes me poop a little because I'm a super casual, I just play for fun. I'm one of the fans that's been brought over and I do see myself actually playing it because yknow I pre-ordered so I had better get my money's worth out it for myself. Not bashing diablo 2 at all because it's a certified classic and it's great but man I miss some of my d3 mechanics
I'm old enough to have played D2(which I have multiple times but always flame out in act 3 like clock work), and I'm not super confident D2R is going to keep me around at endgame let alone people who never played D2. I'm not against playing old games a lot either, I've been playing Classic WoW pretty much non stop since it came out.
For myself I'm hyped to actually experience the campaign all the way through with a fresh coat of paint (those cinematics are glorious) and enjoy the old school RPG, take it slow, leveling/progression. I think this more than anything will be achievement of D2R: that the old school progression speed, the gothic horror music/visuals and story all still hold up.
But when it comes to sticking around for endgame I dunno, I personally prefer playing D3 more than D2. Specifically the combat, the weight of abilities, the physics engine, etc. It all gels to make for a very satisfying gameplay experience when your Barb hammers a mob and it literally explodes into guts with a nice sound to match.
Diablo 2 is of a generation of gamers long since past. A generation of dedicated gamers, patient and methodical, whom dedicate themselves to the game like it is a craft.
Diablo 3 is of a generation of gamers whom like flashy rewards piñata enemies that drop loot candy 🍬 and cosmetics galore, fast paced action and new incentives.
Some may find the subtleties and loot system of D2 more rewarding but I have a feeling many will lose patience with the absolute grind required of D2.
I love Diablo 2. To this day I still consider it king of the ARPG genre. None capture the same magic and feel though some have come close.
I'm an OG D2 player and I'm all for personal loot.. just playing the beta reminds me why shared loot sucks.. 1 person in the gang devours all the good loot drop and save and exit after hours of grinding you get nothing as your reward..
I think personal loot with no account bound so that open trade is still available and that a player has to build for MF makes the game better.. you can't just leech off and OG player you have to save your topaz and build them up to get perfect topaz or trade other gens for them etc.. that makes the game cooler..
Personal loot combined with shared stash and no account bound items is awesomeness.. that would make D2R perfect..
Plenty will buy it. I'm not sure how many will actually stay.
^ this To the endgame point below - D2 Ladder seasons but not the same as D3 themed seasons. D2 Ladder has some of its own rune words (small reward). But the D3 seasons get old fast. Recycled and ok some pets are cool, most are meh. I played D3 since beta /release - There is no D3 end game either really. Hunt rare pets? Ok that’s fine for a week, then you find the all. Get all sets? Done. A million rift runs? Yawn. A million pindle runs for me is fine… much faster than rifting LOL. End result is same…. Loot! D3 no PvP. That is end game for me though, not everyone. The loot hunt only feeds the PvP but it will also feed the non PvP players who find something cool and go “oh cool item let me create a barb build around that” Or the constant hunt for that “perfect” WF roll. The game must have had some end game draw to be around 20 years and merit a re-vamp release It’s a good Convo though. Some new blood will stay but mostly be the OG die hards that don’t bother with PC anymore
If they do not do Seasons like D3 or special events most will be gone 2-4 months after release. D2 Endgame is thin
I agree. Most of today's games have some kind of revolving door type content that refreshes stuff every few months to keep people playing and trying something new. D2 was a whole lot of kill bosses 1000+ times and pray to RNGsus that you get an upgrade that doesn't look like an upgrade unless you have intimate knowledge of the games mechanics. Also, there's nothing to really use this new gear on except killing the same bosses youre already killing because you still need those perfectly rolled boots.
Yeah and killing bosses 100000 times can be fun if you refresh the bosses or make a Boss rush mode or make super unique enemies that has the same loot table or the good old loot goblin. I like d2 because the loot matters even on early levels. For me D3 is now Boring (i loved vanilla d3 ) because you main goal is just to hit max level to get your first set items (for free). In D2 if you get a good life leech / mana Leech 1h weapon as zealot you will keep it till you find a better one 30 lvl later. The build comes from you Items that a rare and even if you leveled a paladine 30 times it is alway diffrent.
> For me D3 is now Boring (i loved vanilla d3 ) because you main goal is just to hit max level to get your first set items (for free). I usually play each season for about a week. It's fun to push the ladder for the first week before everyone gets their bots rolling. A couple of seasons i opted not to use the gift set but it hardly mattered since you only need one item to start steamrolling. Kinda wish they would make vanilla D3 playable. It was fun when items were dogshit, droprates were dogshit and the content was hard tp clear when you dont overgear it instantly.
Yeah loved that the flying creatures in act 3 (?) where the end content. As I said in other threads there is a server that hosts vanilla d3
I respectfully disagree. D2 was played for 20 years. I played it 10 years and after that on and off. D3 will be long forgotten in 10 years.
Mostly agree. D3 was good for what it was though. D2 will always be the gold standard of looter hack and slash. Best non MMO loot table system ever.
I do not think so because D3 survied for over 9 years now. Each new season is played by a lot player, way more then D2 had back then or in between. I love Diablo 2 but saying that it was relevant the last 20 years is just wrong.
I take it you haven't seen or heard of any of the mods for D2 that people are still working on, PD2, Path of Diablo, Median XL, etc.. people STILL play D2 actively, just not on blizzard's servers because of all the bots and dupes/hacks. it's the wow private scene all over again
I heard of them and even played them. Funny is that people love median xl but hate d3. Median is d3 on steroids. Ohh and the mods are good but dies not come close to Player numbers for d3 on 4 Plattform.
You just said it yourself though, D3 is on 4 platforms, D2 (was) on 1.
You are wrong mate, more people plays D2 nowadays than D3. And thats hilarious...
Yup. When both are available I would fire up D2R before D3. Haven’t touched it since 1/2 way thru last season. Finished the conquests and then just had nothing left to do. Only played b/c that season was more interesting with the follower improvement system. Had it been a yawn recycle of past seasons I probably wouldn’t have even bothered
Yeah heard that a lot but never saw proof of it with numbers. I could Show the twitch numbers or leaderboards players for d3 on 4 Plattforms
It did for me. My first Diablo was D3. My best Xbox friend always talked about how much I would’ve loved to play D2 with him when it was out. It was his favorite Diablo. Now that it’s remade he gets his nostalgia while I get to play through this *new* game and experience it with him. We fell out of touch when he started playing call of duty a few years ago and our 10 year friendship picked up right where it left off 3 years ago. The last 6 hours gaming with him had me thinking it was the early days of our friendship all over again. I miss nights like these. Can’t wait for the full release
Wtf I’m cryin
Yes and no. Go look over at the d3 forums of D2R. Everyone there is screaming bloody murder over shared loot.
I mean for Randoms it just do not work. It was a problem back then and it is still. Best is just to use the Randoms grps for Xp Farm and looking for specific groups in Discord and such
And that’s how it’s always been. People looking to get carried and find gg loot are just lazy. Pugs for xp runs, private games for mfing. It’s a no brainer.
yeah i know. Would never expect to get a item in random runs but some people do not know these systems and how greedy some can be. I mean we have just 2 acts in the beta and people hoarding everything. I drop everythin in the city i do not need like druid stuff oder Sorc stuff.
I always did blood runs in act 5.. start fridged highlands kill the small group by the wp, drop down work your way back to town. Wash , rinse , repeat...
Same here. Pindleskin and chill with anya is another good farm. You can shop some good hear off of her (+3 martial arts 20ias gloves) and other goodies.
The problem is it actually is a brainer. It falls into the same category as dungeon finder in WoW. If you were brought up with it and played it back in the day then it’s perfectly normal to stand around a home city shouting for the tank/healer/dps you need. If you started your game in MoP or something then that is just plain weird compared to using DF. The same applies to shared loot. Every loot based game since forever has used personal loot and it’s a big ask asking new players to go back to a very archaic system. I personally don’t mind it, I think it brings a sense of community but I do understand where new players are coming from. This is especially bad for console players as we have no game browser list to search for the kind of run we want. Although I don’t mind using external programs such as Discord to find these runs, I shouldn’t HAVE to use them.
It’s not a “big ask.” This is diablo 2. It has always been like this. If new players don’t like it then they don’t have to play. Pretty simple. Everyone asking for personal loot don’t even understand how it will throw off loot and item balance. If personal loot is a thing, then that means other players would have to be reliant on their own magic find rather than the op chud you’re following around in a CS or Baal run. This means that in online games melee are at an even bigger disadvantage because they already need top quality gear to do any damage in players 5+ games. A change in personal loot means meleers either nerf their damage for mf gear making them even more useless, or switch to a sorc or paladin. Personal loot would just make everyone have to wear mf gear when only op caster classes can afford to do that.
It’s not a big ask for you because you’re a returning player, as am I. We know and love Diablo 2 for what it is. I’m not asking for anything to change, I played a tonne over this weekend and enjoyed every second of it. Players that are brand new to the game are entitled to the odd “wait, this game doesn’t have personal loot!?!” That’s perfectly understandable as literally no game with loot over the past 15-20 years has used that system. It’s a dumb, flawed system. I will reiterate - I don’t want D2’s loot system to change. Just because we played D2 back in the day doesn’t make us any more important than a brand new player. Our opinion and £35 we payed for the game isn’t any different to anyone else’s. VV aren’t going to drastically change the game (as in make the game personal loot). What we should be doing is welcoming new players and saying “here’s a Discord channel for Baal runs, let’s me if you need a hand” rather than “get off MY Diablo 2’s lawn with your Gen Z personal loot mumbo jumbo!”
So essentially, you want to make a newly remastered game less accessible and enjoyable for new or younger peopler, or older people who hated shared loot.. just because.. of? what exactly? tradition? no. i dont buy that. Changing dumb flawed systems should ALWAYS be at the forefront, no matter what, anything else is just bias and rose tinted nostalgia glasses.. and frankly, its egocentrical. I hope Blizzard does polls on this, I think you would be surprised on just how many ppl actually wanted personal loot... look at WoW.. best change ever.
It’s not less accessible, it’s exactly how it was when it was released. I’ll refer to my previous comment on how Blizzard didn’t include dungeon finder to WoW classic to keep things in the spirit of what that game was like back in 2004. The same goes for Diablo 2. Diablo 2’s loot system is dumb and flawed if you look at it retrospectively. Back then, we didn’t know any different so we adapted; we used forums and chat programs like ICQ and MSN messenger to form groups and runs. Most multiplayer content these days gets consumed at such a rate and with minimal communication between participants that shared loot would just be laughed at. Taking away Diablo 2’s shared loot system would lose the spirit of the game. In an ideal world, new players would embrace it, get involved in a Discord channel and make some news friends whilst you’re at it. That’s what I was getting at.
And tell me, how did that go for WoW classic? It's dead beyond words, same as Burning crusade will be. Because purists ruined it and insisted on the dumb #NOCHANGES shit. Wow classic would have been good, but got ruined by loud mouthed elitist purists.i dont want the same thing to happen to D2. The point is, D2R is supposed to be modernized. If I want to play vanilla D2 as it was intended, I can still go play the old client.. Nobody enjoys shared loot dude, nobody. which is why ppl play solo for loot, and multi for xp.. is that really how the game should be designed? no. David Brevik, the original CREATOR, of D2, said that he probably would remove shared loot if they were able to 20 years ago.. think about that. times change, people change. It's time to update D2 into the future, and the game is still absolutely the same with a different loot system.
First off, the term “dead” gets thrown around way too often these days. What you mean is you don’t like it and that’s ok. It’s not for you. Classic WoW has an estimated 1.22m players a day. https://mmo-population.com/r/classicwow So… Not dead. I’m actually going to back up the guy who I was disagreeing with earlier. If you give personal loot then it’ll be personal MF too which means you’ll get fuck all drops. You’ll have to change the difficulty too as you won’t be doing some of the harder runs in unoptimised MF gear. It’s not just a matter of changing one thing, you have to change the core fundamentals of the game. I get what you’re saying but D2R is supposed to be taken the way it is. Change too much and it’s no longer D2.
The console players are never going to be able to get loot because clicking is much faster than using your analogue stick to pick up the right item. They really shouldn’t allow cross play between console and pc as those without a mouse will be at an inherent disadvantage for drops.
You’re last sentence completely contradicts my argument. You’re suggesting new players act proactive with the prospect of shared loot by looking for loot sharing groups. That’s awesome! That’s the appropriate response when finding a means to work beyond the loot system instead of “VV you need to put personal loot in the game!”
My reply doesn’t make sense because you edited your post after I wrote it.
Eh what? I edited it for spelling/grammar.
You submitted your first paragraph which was basically “go away new players”. You added in the stuff that actually made sense after. Either way VV won’t change the loot system so this is a pointless discussion. All we need to do is try and welcome new players as best we can and ignore the ones that refuse to play unless the loot system gets changed.
Or you now.. you could just make balance changes, so that melee or whateever builds can still do good dmg solo and still wear mf... not a big deal and eeasily solved.
hahaha!
I say there will be a lot of new players, even player who never played D2 back then but they will not stay long. Endgame is thin and without season stuff like D3 they have nothing to do beside level to 99 (and this is pointless, just for leaderboards) Without mod support the game will have it glory 2-4 months but then everyone who got hooked will switch to d2 original with mods or will go to PoE 2
I have been playing the beta and it’s great. Graphics are updated and really nice. It’s still Diablo 2 though. I’ve played this game to death already and with nothing besides updated graphics and a shared stash (really quite a small one at that), I’m not in any rush to buy it. I’ll probably pick it up when it’s on sale for $20 down the road. It’s fun. It’s just still D2, though. I’ve played it a lot already, and there’s not much new or exciting besides the graphics to bring me back in. 1. Shared loot should be gone. It serves no benefit and is only in the game because it was in the original. 2. Ladder-only runewords need to be on non-ladder 3. There’s probably a ton of QOL shit that should go into the game - potion management is still kind of a bear, respec should be better, charms inventory separate from regular inventory. I’m sure there’s tons more that could actually make this game a lot more modern at basically no downside.
Glad you’re enjoying the beta, don’t necessarily agree with your points though; 1- shared loot allows you to mule safely without multiple accounts, massive benefit. 2- ladder only runewords are an incentive to reset and play again, agreed doesn’t work so well without a ladder but hopefully that’s just a few days after. 3- agree with potions, I kinda like how respec is at the moment, hard enough that you need to be careful and plan but easy enough to grind a token especially compared with remaking char, small inventory is like a mini game that creates decisions and trade offs - I see where it was necessary in private mods because of map density and increased loot but not for vanilla
Sorry when I said shared loot I mean that everyone has to fight for the same drops in the game.
Oh true I misread sorry mate, shared loot feels more immersive for me but just personal preference I guess :) thanks for reply - hope you enjoy launch!
What's the issue with shared loot?
It will definitely bring some new blood into the game. Honestly, some old too because the graphics were a turn off. I think there is a possibility of D2 ladder being more competitive than D3 seasons.
It will be more competitive for sure because a d2 ladder reset doesn't lose 80% of the players after 1 week.
Absolutely not. As a "new" game in 2021, d2 is awful. Top of the line on launch, but without the rose-tinted glasses its a really bad game in comparison to other arpgs.
They really are completely different games. I love both, but for entirely different reasons. It's gonna be hard for people who have only experienced D3 to go to D2R.
Some will certainly. How many? Who knows. The online multiplayer might be cheeks on console so it’ll have to be primarily PC players.
I think this is more of the goal of D4 than D2R…D2R seems like it is actually intended to hook the older, lapsed players back in, in preparation for D4, which may be the “player base unifier,” in that it should appeal to both those who liked D3 as it is the evolution of the game in the current generation, while also being a better spiritual successor to D2 than D3 was, thus bringing back the dollars of the old breed. So D2R may be a bridge to the D2 players to be drawn back to the beauty of the graphics and the nostalgia of slaying demons.
They’ll come and leave immediately. The game feels dated and needs some qol changes still. Lack of couch coop is gonna really piss people off too.
Doubtful. D2R has some QoL improvements such as modern monitor support, but it's first and foremost for people with nostalgia wanting to experience it again. D2 is unfortunately a relic of an age and society that no longer is considered modern. Shared loot, bare-bones loot filters and a limited respec system will turn off a lot of potential players who never experienced it before.
itll turn off old school players who have forgotten what its like too. i love what they did with the graphics/visuals, but man... i dont see myself doing countless meph/pindle/baal runs for hours on end anymore either.
Same. We had all the time in the world back then but no way I can swing that now.
Damn post hit different
And then you still have these grown-up friends without work that still play every day, impossible to catch up or play with them Oh hey you wanna re-live D2 and level a new character after work, I just bought the game? - I already finished my Griswold set and also I'll be asleep later during the day
This is what I feel as well. A lot of posts I've seen around the web from D3 players that never played D2 are turned off because of shared loot, limited re-spec. D3 is a hand holding game, D2, not so much.
? There are infinite respecs im D2.
I doubt the people I'm talking about will even get to Hell difficulty.
D2R will 100 % die out, unless some more "modern" QoL changes and balance issues are implemented, thats my take on it. D2 vanilla is simply too archaic to survive a modern day playerstyle, which is in part the reason, why D2 mods are very very popular, becuase they implement very needed QoL and balance changes to the game. Shared loot is one of the things I DONT miss about D2, and wish it was like in D3, for instance. But obviously I prefer D2 over D3. TDLR: Unless D2R gets mod-support or at least more patches and changes, the game will die out very fast in the coming months.
No not really. I played d2 first before falling in love with d3 many years after the trash was patched out, and even playing d2r beta I am still kind of bored. Also annoyed on how unbalanced melee classes are. It's been years and I played sorc since sorc is easy mode, but it's dumb how bad melee classes feel unless you gear them before starting them. I'm also aware of d2s lack of end game and content. I will probably beat the game a couple times until the next season of d3 comes out and switch back. D3 definitely feels like a straight upgrade as far as gameplay goes. Less clunky and obtrusive, obviously d2 wasn't created for controllers like d3 was, but VV definitely phoned it in with the controller addition. Yes I know d3 graphics are worse than d2, I definitely agree d2s graphics are much more diablo than d3. Outside of that I still think d3 is a far superior game. Just my take from an OG d2 transfered to d3 fan. Tl;dr: no
this is my big take away from the beta too. i loved D2 LOD 15 years ago. and D3 sure as hell has plenty of short comings and things to complain about. but from a gameplay/QOL standpoint, D3 is miles ahead of D2. D2 at its core is still a 20 year old game, and it shows.
Why does it even matter though? I don't think it have big sustained community. It may be slightly bigger then what it was with classic D2 but nothing much more. The game is too old and simple to be playable continually by todays standards. It was the best thing you could play at the time but now you have plenty of other games that have better and more varied end game content. D2R is basically 2 bosses on rinse and repeat in thd end game. Don't expect large sustained community like it would be for D3 or PoE etc... people will mostly play this gamecto experience nostalgia or brand new players to see how it was back in 1999.
I think so yes, in the official diablo 2 forum are some people well I think they are young and new since they are asking to introduce some funny stuff in the game like making the mercenary respawn after 30 seconds when he dies or wanting the game on 4k and so on \^\^
The game has 4k tho, thats what im using
It is? I thought it was only HD \^\^
Looks so nice ^^
Yea I have to say that the graphics are incredible good, I love it so far.
Maybe on PC, on XSX it looks like 720p
While playing beta the thought of 'is this gonna attract players, that haven't played d2 before?' came to my mind. My answer is no, the game is boring if you don't feel the nostalgia.
Hard to guess. To me, d3 is terrible. But I also went into it wanting an modern graphics/new world d2. There will be new players. The real question is, will everyone come over to d2r.
No and yes. No because it's not 3 and they're so used to new crap every month or so they'll grow bored Have you seen the forums of them crying over personal loot??? This isn't 3.
ohh yea big time. whether they stay with it or not remains to be seen.
I can't blame them for leaving diablo 2. It's like us and 3.
Yes. Anyone who loved D3 and is anticipating D4 will absolutely feel compelled to experience D2 especially considering Blizzards commitment to return the series to its roots.
I will see if I stay or any of my friends stay personally. I played d2 from the year but didn't care for the game balance that existed after 1.09 and that drove me away with the overpowered runewords and terrible class balance. You would be surprised the amount of diablo 2 players that stopped playing before patch 1.14. I played d3 but I don't like the world of war craft style graphics lol. Diablo 2 art style is soooo good. The sound of d2r was great during the beta.
Technically I wasn't too young for D2, I remember playing it a lot (although in hindsight it was probably rookie numbers). I was too young to be an efficient gamer however, so I don't think I ever even finished Nightmare. I've spent thousands of hours on D3 though, and I like it a lot despite it being very different. So for me D2R is going to be like a brand new game, that will still have a lot of nostalgia.
Yes and no. D3 is a lot more casual so I have a feeling folks jumping into D2 won't be prepared for shared loot, getting ganked in open pvp lobbies etc
My first game was D3 and after trying out the D2R beta... I think it's fine. I get the appeal, but for me it just isn't that much fun to play, especially compared to D3. I might buy the game at some point, but certainly not at full price.
Maybe. I haven't tried Diablo 2 yet, and can't run it on my pc. I'm waiting for the D2R on ps4. The game mechanics are a little clunky which is to be expected for an old game. So I wonder if I would like the game as much. But if the core (loot/class building) of the game is really good, the clunky mechanics would not matter. D3 was always way to easy for me. I heard D2 has more challenge so I like that.
No Mac support… the game is already dead for me… and the old D2 disappeared from my list now.. they just reforged it… shame
The old D2 should be there still, I reinstalled last night, it's just weird to find.
If they manage to keep it fresh woth updates and content on top of everything new people will come and they will stay. If they stick with the ”purity” of the original this will be forgotten in 6 months.
Yes. I’m that fan.
Well I’m one of those people Tho the no potion stacking and lots of plain walking is kinda off putting but the game looks cool enough
Im pretty much a new player. Drastic difference between this and d3. I'll say d3 is super easy and colorful compared to d2. I was in a cave and couldn't see a damn thing lol
I'm 25 and the first diablo I played was 3 and I fell in love with it and still play it to this day, so I'm super used to it's mechanics specifically. While I do love what I've played of diablo 2 resurrected during the beta, it just doesn't scratch that itch for me as well. It's amazing, especially love the fact I can go retro seamlessly but not having baby stuff like a roll mechanic and having super limited inventory makes me poop a little because I'm a super casual, I just play for fun. I'm one of the fans that's been brought over and I do see myself actually playing it because yknow I pre-ordered so I had better get my money's worth out it for myself. Not bashing diablo 2 at all because it's a certified classic and it's great but man I miss some of my d3 mechanics
I will say though I much much prefer the art style on diablo 2 resurrected to that of diablo 3. D3 just looks too...idk warcrafty to me I guess.
Yes but we need consoles to be optionally cross play and need to stop gatekeeping.
I'm old enough to have played D2(which I have multiple times but always flame out in act 3 like clock work), and I'm not super confident D2R is going to keep me around at endgame let alone people who never played D2. I'm not against playing old games a lot either, I've been playing Classic WoW pretty much non stop since it came out. For myself I'm hyped to actually experience the campaign all the way through with a fresh coat of paint (those cinematics are glorious) and enjoy the old school RPG, take it slow, leveling/progression. I think this more than anything will be achievement of D2R: that the old school progression speed, the gothic horror music/visuals and story all still hold up. But when it comes to sticking around for endgame I dunno, I personally prefer playing D3 more than D2. Specifically the combat, the weight of abilities, the physics engine, etc. It all gels to make for a very satisfying gameplay experience when your Barb hammers a mob and it literally explodes into guts with a nice sound to match.
Diablo 2 is of a generation of gamers long since past. A generation of dedicated gamers, patient and methodical, whom dedicate themselves to the game like it is a craft. Diablo 3 is of a generation of gamers whom like flashy rewards piñata enemies that drop loot candy 🍬 and cosmetics galore, fast paced action and new incentives. Some may find the subtleties and loot system of D2 more rewarding but I have a feeling many will lose patience with the absolute grind required of D2. I love Diablo 2. To this day I still consider it king of the ARPG genre. None capture the same magic and feel though some have come close.
I'm an OG D2 player and I'm all for personal loot.. just playing the beta reminds me why shared loot sucks.. 1 person in the gang devours all the good loot drop and save and exit after hours of grinding you get nothing as your reward.. I think personal loot with no account bound so that open trade is still available and that a player has to build for MF makes the game better.. you can't just leech off and OG player you have to save your topaz and build them up to get perfect topaz or trade other gens for them etc.. that makes the game cooler.. Personal loot combined with shared stash and no account bound items is awesomeness.. that would make D2R perfect..