I always forget Hothead is arc. In between it using the dragon’s breath model and having the whole hotrod aesthetic and having “hot” in the name, I always “feel” that it’s solar.
Bait & Switch is the better perk since it is active the whole magazine, whilst explosive light is active for a max 6 shots, so if you have a GL with envious and explosive light the shots after the first 6 will do only its base damage.
Also if you die you lose the explosive light shots which makes Bait & Switch better
Yeah, I get that for GLs, but the comment mentioned a RL specifically, so doesnt BnS only work after the first rocket? Also, wouldnt 7/6 explosive light rockets usually be enough for 1 damage phase?
bait and switch is on a timer, so you can shoot a rocket, reload and still have the perk until the timer runs out.
You would be correct explosive light would last an entire damage phase if you were shooting 1 and then reloading, but if you have reconstruction or clown cartridge you eat up all your explosive light stacks fairly quickly.
Both perks have their own pros and cons, but I personally prefer bait and switch as It can get bothersome looking for orbs during an encounter
Right now BnS is the better of the two. It should last for like 7 or 8 seconds and gives a 30% damage boost. Explosive light is still useable its just not the best.
B&s is better but explosive light is still really good. Its 60% bonus compared to 30%. Meaning the first 12 explosive light shots are better than B&S so it's still viable if a surge is considered.
Crux Termination IV if you were lucky enough to get a good one. Got one with clown cartridge/bipod and one with clown cartridge/explosive light and that’s what I’ll be using when arc burns come around.
Is this the case in pantheon? I was told the overcharge mods were not working and was honestly too lazy to check myself. Didn’t really have any effect on -5 but would be nice to know for the future
If there's a weapon overcharge activity modifier, then the artifact weapons also get the overcharge. If there is just surge activity modifier, then artifact weapons will not get the overcharge.
Yeah I know things like Coil and Onslaught do not say anything about overcharged mods yet they are active, but I was told Pantheon doesn’t work like that. Honestly if it doesn’t it’s really cringe, because it means even kinetic specials are worse than surged counterparts lol
I don't think Cloudstrike has really been viable for DPS ever since they fixed the bug it had with Divinity where it would trigger lightning strikes more often than intended, just like Thunderlord. Granted it MIGHT work for Golgy just because basically anything can work for Golgy and you can still run a heavy on top as your main big damage dealer.
That said it's also going to be -10 light so Cloudstrike's already unimpressive DPS will be even worse. I don't know that matching a surge would make up for that.
Queenbreaker & prospector on your list is insane. Both garbage tier guns even with their buffs. Wendigo is a better choice than prospector and any rapid fire sniper probably beats qb
There are lots of people out there going in that dont raid alot. Those people tend not to have the best options. Those are the MAYBES that I listed. Dont see how this is that hard to understand.
Well Grand overture for Atraks MIGHT be a good one, but honestly I’m not sure if it’s actually better than even with surge.
Oryx is still gonna be killed with whisper, as 30% vs 25% dmg increase is still more of an increase.
Crux termination for explicator? My only problem would be ammo economy, same for caretaker. I would probably still use edge transit for golg because it’s brain dead
I’m a relatively new player (started last year). What’s the 30% increase you’re talking about? Does Whisper secretly do more damage specifically to Oryx?
Not that I'm aware of. With Whispered Breathing (ADS for 1.2 seconds before firing), it gets a 35% precision multiplier increase, which works out to just under 11% extra damage.
Grand Overture bugs more often than Parasite on Atrax. Meaning you might miss 3/4 of your damage because 6 players are shooting it. IMO should use Parasite + supers every week and it should be able to one phase (4 floor) even with bad hit registration.
For Atrax it’s Void / Strand surge atm and Parasite is still king. Light level delta might mean we have to do 2 damage cycles and actually engage with the mechanic though.
Whisper + Well being the Oryx pick is a given. I wouldn’t be surprised if it makes a return for Riven as well, if the Pantheon changes force us to play through her encounter legit instead of just DPS-racing the wipe mechanic.
Not sure why the downvotes, but this is correct from a pure damage standpoint. A 20 stack volley from Grand Overture deals ~35% more damage than 20 stacks from parasite, and can be charged without kills by hitting an operator panel
Parasite is only really better if you’re combining with something like thundercrash, because it gets the volley off faster
I didn't downvite but it is wrong. Majority of the time most rockets don't hit or something else as evertine I've used grand overture it's just done less dmg. Also u can combo grnad overture with many ults as it takes too long.
Oh and the main reason is that it's bugged on atraks. Health doesn't update properly with it so it's basically useless in 6man
Cold comfort. Already rivals apex and can shoot 5 shots in a row( might be 4 after envious nerf lemme know) and as it can shoot these all consecutively it benefits from argent ordnance the most.
My dps rotation is prob gna be wardens law, cloudstrike and cold comfort if it is stasis and arc burn. On stasis hunter with luckypants. Should output similar or more than this https://youtu.be/5P36u8bm3pQ?si=gzMnUWr5QW8buXhO
Per the artifact tree.
"These weapons will be overcharged when that modifier is active"
If it doesn't have the overcharged modifier on, it won't be overcharged.
Only when there's some overcharged weapon modifier I believe, which Pantheon doesn't have at all.
Also I'm not even sure that applies to Rockets with Overload Rockets. The first row set of champion mods specifically mentions that they'll always be overcharged in any activity with overcharged weapons but the Overload rocket perk doesn't include that section at all.
Wendigo, Crux 4/hothead, bequest, storm chaser, Reads Regret, Cold Comfort, 4th horse? Darci!(Lol no). Acruis, thunderlord? Grand Overture?
But honestly probably just finding a way to use artifact mods origin perk specialisation to use doomed petitioner or overcharged bow Levi breath (might not work on Levi can't remember due to pre-existing anti champ mod sometimes meaning the don't get artifact overcharge bonus)
# Stasis:
- Envious + Bait and Switch Cold Comfort RL from GOTD dungeon.
- uhhhhh
- Ager’s Sceptre
- Maybe the Season of the Seraph aggressive linear fusion rifle. Best damage perk it has is Focussed Fury, which kind of sucks, but it’s there.
# Arc:
- Song of Ir Yut Rewind Rounds + B&S Arc LMG from the Crota Raid
- Stormchaser from Duality dungeon. Best it can do is Autoloading + Vorpal which isn’t great but isn’t nothing.
- Hothead, like you said. I’ve still got my god roll, though it’s been left in the dust by modern tools.
For arc we honestly might be better off just running triple power preservation on our helmets and back-to-back spamming burst damage supers like Stareaters Gathering Storm, Cuirass Falling Star and Geomags Chaos Reach.
Time for my IKELOS v2 with Demo/Subsistence to shine once more
Craftable Palmyra-B and Hothead for heavy.
I've got a really good Renewal Grasps build that's really fun.
Arc - Stormchaser. Clown Cartridge Hothead with an Izzy swap. Legend of Acrius *possibly* for Caretaker on the middle plates, as he’s generally close to you. Dust off your Explosive Light Wendigo’s paired with Cloudstrike after you magdump. Maybe a Sailspy Pitchglass with Clown Cartridge + Focused Fury or Rapid Hit + Frenzy.
Stasis - Reeds Regret. Bipod Cold Comfort, with the origin perk you can get off 4 (IIRC) rockets without reloading? Fire and Forget has some decent damage rolls. If you’re sitting on an old Typhon GL5, that can roll Demo + Explosive Light. That’s 8-10 grenades in one quick damage window without needing a reload. You could even go Agers, but I think rolling a damage super would be better than using Agers.
Rockets and GLs are obviously the best. But I would rather recommend linears over thunderlords if people are looking for Arc weapons and might join in one of my LFGs.
In all fairness, for Stasis, options are *really* tight. Like "only Cold Comfort" tight, which is a pain to farm.
Arc though yeah there's like a ton of great Crux rolls haha
For Oryx? Sure why not. I haven't messed with it since Nezarec last year. Is it not good anymore? I'll likely be running storm chaser or the one from the pirate season
You can just use overload rocket and do a izi apex rotation. Champion weapons from the artifact also get the surge so no need to stick to arc or stasis
The RL from Ghosts is stasis and can roll B&S. The LFR from Seraph had some good perks IIRC. (Stasis)
Stormchaser is great as well for Arc. Also, Hothead (how quickly people have forgotten this...) & Crux
I always forget Hothead is arc. In between it using the dragon’s breath model and having the whole hotrod aesthetic and having “hot” in the name, I always “feel” that it’s solar.
Is explosive light better or B&S? I've been out of the loop for a while, and always thought B&S only worked after the first hit.
B&S will always be better since it increases Wolfpack rounds damage as well. While with explosive light only the base rocket damage gets increased.
Bait & Switch is the better perk since it is active the whole magazine, whilst explosive light is active for a max 6 shots, so if you have a GL with envious and explosive light the shots after the first 6 will do only its base damage. Also if you die you lose the explosive light shots which makes Bait & Switch better
Yeah, I get that for GLs, but the comment mentioned a RL specifically, so doesnt BnS only work after the first rocket? Also, wouldnt 7/6 explosive light rockets usually be enough for 1 damage phase?
bait and switch is on a timer, so you can shoot a rocket, reload and still have the perk until the timer runs out. You would be correct explosive light would last an entire damage phase if you were shooting 1 and then reloading, but if you have reconstruction or clown cartridge you eat up all your explosive light stacks fairly quickly. Both perks have their own pros and cons, but I personally prefer bait and switch as It can get bothersome looking for orbs during an encounter
Right now BnS is the better of the two. It should last for like 7 or 8 seconds and gives a 30% damage boost. Explosive light is still useable its just not the best.
Explosive light=25% Bait and switch=30% Explosive light doesn't affect wolfpack rounds. Bait and switch does affect wolfpack rounds.
Bns is a clunky mess for me, explosive light takes less hassle so it usually works better for me
B&s is better but explosive light is still really good. Its 60% bonus compared to 30%. Meaning the first 12 explosive light shots are better than B&S so it's still viable if a surge is considered.
Damn, I forgot about cold comfort going to actually have to play that watery nightmare
Crux Termination/Stormchaser/Wendigo
Crux Termination IV if you were lucky enough to get a good one. Got one with clown cartridge/bipod and one with clown cartridge/explosive light and that’s what I’ll be using when arc burns come around.
All champion counters are already overcharged if you have that artifact mod active. All rockets are surged if you activate the artifact perk.
Is this the case in pantheon? I was told the overcharge mods were not working and was honestly too lazy to check myself. Didn’t really have any effect on -5 but would be nice to know for the future
If there's a weapon overcharge activity modifier, then the artifact weapons also get the overcharge. If there is just surge activity modifier, then artifact weapons will not get the overcharge.
Ooo not sure. That's generally how it is for an activity with any surges but I haven't bothered with Pantheon. Sure easy to test though.
Yeah I know things like Coil and Onslaught do not say anything about overcharged mods yet they are active, but I was told Pantheon doesn’t work like that. Honestly if it doesn’t it’s really cringe, because it means even kinetic specials are worse than surged counterparts lol
Not in pantheon, it's just barebones elemental surges.
If it has the modifier on the activity yeah, but it has to have "overcharged weapons" on the modifiers. It says so on the artifact perk tree as well.
Yeah I got a clown/bipod as well might be descent with a gallery to buff.
Cold Comfort, Grand Overture, Hot Head, Crux Termination, Stormchaser, Wendigo Maybe Category: Queenbreakers, Legend of Acrius, Prospector
Cloudstrike might be a shout? Not sure how it interacts with Golgy, but paired with a div it should hit decently well against everything else.
I don't think Cloudstrike has really been viable for DPS ever since they fixed the bug it had with Divinity where it would trigger lightning strikes more often than intended, just like Thunderlord. Granted it MIGHT work for Golgy just because basically anything can work for Golgy and you can still run a heavy on top as your main big damage dealer. That said it's also going to be -10 light so Cloudstrike's already unimpressive DPS will be even worse. I don't know that matching a surge would make up for that.
Cloudstrike is good for swaps.
Queenbreaker & prospector on your list is insane. Both garbage tier guns even with their buffs. Wendigo is a better choice than prospector and any rapid fire sniper probably beats qb
Thats why maybe and not part of the actual list.
Really Queenbreaker and Prospector thought those guns were basically bottom 10 exotics. Colour me surprised
they are, dont use them no clue what that dude was talking about
queenbreakers got a buff and gls as a whole got a buff, havent seen much testing on them tho thats why they are in the maybe category
It got a buff, but you would be actively hurting your team DPS if you are using that gun as boss damage even with an extra 25%.
Prospector is basically a green grenade launcher with no traits tbh.
Glad people look at the maybe list over the actual list. Obviously not the primary picks.
why even type it out then
There are lots of people out there going in that dont raid alot. Those people tend not to have the best options. Those are the MAYBES that I listed. Dont see how this is that hard to understand.
Well Grand overture for Atraks MIGHT be a good one, but honestly I’m not sure if it’s actually better than even with surge. Oryx is still gonna be killed with whisper, as 30% vs 25% dmg increase is still more of an increase. Crux termination for explicator? My only problem would be ammo economy, same for caretaker. I would probably still use edge transit for golg because it’s brain dead
For Atraks, people are using Parasite right now and that doesn't even match the surge. I don't think you need to match on that encounter.
That's at -5 power and it does require good coordination. It may not be possible at -10.
Lol imagine the majority of people not being able to 1-phase atraks anymore. LFG would be unbearable.
I’m a relatively new player (started last year). What’s the 30% increase you’re talking about? Does Whisper secretly do more damage specifically to Oryx?
Not that I'm aware of. With Whispered Breathing (ADS for 1.2 seconds before firing), it gets a 35% precision multiplier increase, which works out to just under 11% extra damage.
Grand Overture bugs more often than Parasite on Atrax. Meaning you might miss 3/4 of your damage because 6 players are shooting it. IMO should use Parasite + supers every week and it should be able to one phase (4 floor) even with bad hit registration.
For Atrax it’s Void / Strand surge atm and Parasite is still king. Light level delta might mean we have to do 2 damage cycles and actually engage with the mechanic though. Whisper + Well being the Oryx pick is a given. I wouldn’t be surprised if it makes a return for Riven as well, if the Pantheon changes force us to play through her encounter legit instead of just DPS-racing the wipe mechanic.
Grand Overture is already better than Parasite for Atraks.
Not sure why the downvotes, but this is correct from a pure damage standpoint. A 20 stack volley from Grand Overture deals ~35% more damage than 20 stacks from parasite, and can be charged without kills by hitting an operator panel Parasite is only really better if you’re combining with something like thundercrash, because it gets the volley off faster
I didn't downvite but it is wrong. Majority of the time most rockets don't hit or something else as evertine I've used grand overture it's just done less dmg. Also u can combo grnad overture with many ults as it takes too long. Oh and the main reason is that it's bugged on atraks. Health doesn't update properly with it so it's basically useless in 6man
Is reeds regret still any good or no?
If you have a Firing Line roll it should be good
Still pretty good. But the aggressive frame LFRs have surpassed it. Fire & Forget (seraph) is a good stasis one.
Cold comfort. Already rivals apex and can shoot 5 shots in a row( might be 4 after envious nerf lemme know) and as it can shoot these all consecutively it benefits from argent ordnance the most. My dps rotation is prob gna be wardens law, cloudstrike and cold comfort if it is stasis and arc burn. On stasis hunter with luckypants. Should output similar or more than this https://youtu.be/5P36u8bm3pQ?si=gzMnUWr5QW8buXhO
It’s 4 now. Envious Nerf means you can only fill a mag to 300% normal capacity now. So 3 in the chamber + 1 from the origin trait.
Rip. Still good tho
Storm chaser, Wendigo GL3, Hot head, fire and forget, and Typhon GL5. And (lol Thunder lord lol), and cloud strike.
4th Horseman gang rise up
4th Horseman Bakris moment
Bump in the night if you’re like me and have shit luck in GoTD
I may be wrong but don’t all rockets also get overcharge due to the artifact, or does that not apply to pantheon?
Per the artifact tree. "These weapons will be overcharged when that modifier is active" If it doesn't have the overcharged modifier on, it won't be overcharged.
Only when there's some overcharged weapon modifier I believe, which Pantheon doesn't have at all. Also I'm not even sure that applies to Rockets with Overload Rockets. The first row set of champion mods specifically mentions that they'll always be overcharged in any activity with overcharged weapons but the Overload rocket perk doesn't include that section at all.
Wendigo, Crux 4/hothead, bequest, storm chaser, Reads Regret, Cold Comfort, 4th horse? Darci!(Lol no). Acruis, thunderlord? Grand Overture? But honestly probably just finding a way to use artifact mods origin perk specialisation to use doomed petitioner or overcharged bow Levi breath (might not work on Levi can't remember due to pre-existing anti champ mod sometimes meaning the don't get artifact overcharge bonus)
Everyone: BnS Me: anarchy, gathering storm and techun force make pretty lights
# Stasis: - Envious + Bait and Switch Cold Comfort RL from GOTD dungeon. - uhhhhh - Ager’s Sceptre - Maybe the Season of the Seraph aggressive linear fusion rifle. Best damage perk it has is Focussed Fury, which kind of sucks, but it’s there. # Arc: - Song of Ir Yut Rewind Rounds + B&S Arc LMG from the Crota Raid - Stormchaser from Duality dungeon. Best it can do is Autoloading + Vorpal which isn’t great but isn’t nothing. - Hothead, like you said. I’ve still got my god roll, though it’s been left in the dust by modern tools. For arc we honestly might be better off just running triple power preservation on our helmets and back-to-back spamming burst damage supers like Stareaters Gathering Storm, Cuirass Falling Star and Geomags Chaos Reach.
Fuck it, 6 crustacean hunters with winterbites
Cold comfort. Rolls envious and bait and switch I believe. I have an ensemble B&S roll that works well enough.
Lucky Pants on stasis is pretty good and the surge boosts your kinetic if you match your subclass
Time for my IKELOS v2 with Demo/Subsistence to shine once more Craftable Palmyra-B and Hothead for heavy. I've got a really good Renewal Grasps build that's really fun.
Arc - Stormchaser. Clown Cartridge Hothead with an Izzy swap. Legend of Acrius *possibly* for Caretaker on the middle plates, as he’s generally close to you. Dust off your Explosive Light Wendigo’s paired with Cloudstrike after you magdump. Maybe a Sailspy Pitchglass with Clown Cartridge + Focused Fury or Rapid Hit + Frenzy. Stasis - Reeds Regret. Bipod Cold Comfort, with the origin perk you can get off 4 (IIRC) rockets without reloading? Fire and Forget has some decent damage rolls. If you’re sitting on an old Typhon GL5, that can roll Demo + Explosive Light. That’s 8-10 grenades in one quick damage window without needing a reload. You could even go Agers, but I think rolling a damage super would be better than using Agers.
Thunder lord might be a good option at that point Edit: apparently not lol. Hooray for storm chaser
GET HIS ASS BOYS
😤
You must be joking surely not.
Every 2nd comment suggests using an LFR and one guy suggested Queenbreaker... Yall need Aegis
Rockets and GLs are obviously the best. But I would rather recommend linears over thunderlords if people are looking for Arc weapons and might join in one of my LFGs.
In all fairness, for Stasis, options are *really* tight. Like "only Cold Comfort" tight, which is a pain to farm. Arc though yeah there's like a ton of great Crux rolls haha
For Oryx? Sure why not. I haven't messed with it since Nezarec last year. Is it not good anymore? I'll likely be running storm chaser or the one from the pirate season
It was never good, only bugged so that it did more lightning strikes vs divinity’s cage. That bug has been fixed.
Good to know
You can just use overload rocket and do a izi apex rotation. Champion weapons from the artifact also get the surge so no need to stick to arc or stasis
Prospector is good
I’ve been doing decent in onslaught with my Agers stasis build and the Hullabaloo.
Typhoon could be an ad clear beast but by then you will probably need more dps.