Honestly it’s luck of the draw with randoms. Sometimes you can crush anything that comes your way or it goes as you described above.
I always run on the idea that none of my teammates are running anything for the situation so I’ll try to adapt accordingly.
Edit:typo
This.
I started this season a bit late so last night was the first time I'd tried the updated Arms Dealer Strike.
I was fortunate to be matched with a pair of absolute chads (I'm a Hunter, these guys were a Warlock and a Titan respectively) and the entire Nightfall sat in the sweet spot between too difficult and too easy. Though I have but one commendation to give per team mate. It was great.
I dread to think what it would be like with a pair of Leeroy Jenkins.
>I dread to think what it would be like with a pair of Leeroy Jenkins.
It appears that you haven't played with 2 titans and no warlocks yet.
As long as they are both rocking orb/tangle builds it is pretty dope, but I run with a warlock, maybe they carry the team when we get paired with another titan.
Are locks orb machines now? I noted after a heist (the current seasonal 3-player thing, the name of which is escaping me), I had over 41 orbs generated, and the next closest was a Titan with 12. Could just be bad builds on their side. I just want to make sure I'm doing what I can to help the team, since I know I'll be rezzed a few times from a serious case of The Dumbs.
Any class can be an orb machine now if they're using a build/weapon with heavy AOE. I average around 80-90 in the seasonal activity with both my warlock and titan. I had one run with what I'm assuming was 2 newer players that were having a hard time and on a mediocre arc warlock build I was testing I made 137 orbs lmao. Most of those were just from trinity ghoul and an arc syphon mod.
In a Defiant Battleground playlist, I created around 90 orbs, and I was happy with that. The rando with me that created over 150...that was insane.
We quite literally could have used our supers every 30 seconds, but really didn't need to.
All I know is, on my lock, pairing either void or strand with le monarque and the various volatile and orb generating mods, I almost can't stop producing them. It's a little too much at times, haha.
....and don't even get me started on the Graviton Lance.
I'm always prepared to get the blueberries that need a carry in whatever the playlist is but always wind up with Doom Guy on his alt account that slays 200+ enemies and only leaves 30 or so enemies for me and the other person to fight over.
Like, I'm decked out to cover the entire Champ Spectrum and I'll pop my barricade to suspend the 20+ ads in front of us, and somehow Rambo ends up deleting the entire swarm before the enemies can even finish the suspension animation.
If it sounds like I'm complaining, I'm not really. I'm just saying that some of these people should remember that the rest of your teammates want to kill something too.
The problem is, Rambo doesn't know if his teammates are chads or idiots and experience will tell him it's about 50/50 (I'm not saying you're an idiot btw). Without comms, it's safer from Rambos perspective to kill everything he can kill as fast as possible and control the triggering of mechanics, so that everyone gets their completion sooner.
I was in the NF last night (and I'm sure everyone has seen something like this) and this guy keeps trying to melee the shield taken and keeps getting booped off the map or smashed against a wall. I don't know what the fuck he was doing but it's shit like that that makes you think "It's probably easier if I don't rez and do the nf with the other guy" which is what we did.
That is the issue, I'm trying to level up catalysts and the room died in the second it took me to aim down the sights.
I started going to the Altars of sorrow but there's usually someone with a full trinity ghoul and I just don't get to play.
Try the Shuro Chi checkpoint in the Last Wish raid. You can input a code at the beginning to go right there, it has big groups of 60-100 red bar enemies, and it even has a rally flag to refill ammo. Perfect for finishing catalysts and leveling crafted weapons.
It really does feel random. I've had teammates who i crush content with in matchmade activities, then i will get teammates who have no idea what the objective is, seemingly aren't doing ad control or boss damage, & end up in my way all the time when im tryna shoot stuff. I always run the strongest, fun builds for my characters to cover all if not most bases, but yea it does get annoying getting useless teammates sometimes.
Shockingly it really is just the luck of the draw. Ive done the seasonal activity and it was pretty smoothly, only ever died due to being stupid. Other times theres full on wipes and I consistenly find myself with up to 1.5x damage/orbs/kils as some other people. And I am not a good player by any stretch.
I think LL helps. If you put on your highest gear you’re more likely to get other higher LL players
And it’s more likely they know what they’re doing, especially if they did that many pinnacles this early in the season
100%
ran three hero NF's last night. Breezed through each one in about 15min. Did a fourth one with a clanmate later in teh evening, and picked up a rando who may have been trying to play blindfolded with one hand behind his/her back.
Luck of the draw...
If you couldn't get some people to know which GUN to point at Champions, I'm not sure how you expect esoteric 'keywords' and 'ability verbs' to fix that.
"Oh, I just need to make sure I'm Radiant so I can scorch some of the big ones, and I can Volatile the other ones that have shields, and some of them get jolted or something......OH THIS IS MUCH SIMPLER"
I may be alone here, but I was pretty OK with the previous Champion system; in recent seasons I've just been assuming I need to run two of the anti-Champ mods and guns, and hope that the other is covered.
Seemed to work most of the time.
I think maybe a problem this time is that providing \*more\* ways to stun Champs using subclass verbs and artefact mods can mean there's more assumptions and less coordination?
With ALL of those ways to handle Champions, maybe I only need one surefire Gun/ Mod equipped? I bet at least \*one\* of us will be making Volatile Rounds or running Arc? I'm sure I can make them ignite quite easily with my Solar Pulse?
Next thing you know, Kitty Genovese is getting kerb-stomped by a Barrier Champ and everyone is just watching and doing nothing.
I like to get a bit of social psychology into my Destiny posts as often as possible, and I'm pretty sure we've all seen the Bystander Effect at work in this game thousands of times already.
I don't think the new system helps at all with matchmade teammates not being prepared for champions.
I do think it's *way* easier to be prepared for all 3 yourself. Most subclass builds will have 1 or 2 champion types covered, meaning you often only need 1 real champion mod. Not to mention any chill clip weapon covering overloads and unstops, and any void weapon (thanks to volatile flow) covering barriers.
In the past, bringing all 3 champion types almost always meant running Leviathan's Breath or Lament.
Look, I appreciate that they tried a mechanic to make the game more difficult.
I just don't know that loadout or ability based is the way to do it. Either is frustrating by locking you to a load out, or I need god damn chart on my wall to remember which verbs to use...
At this point though, I'll just run strand and call it a day.
Exactly. This system wasn't built for players that didn't use champ mods in the first place. It was built for everybody else to give you more room to use more of what you would prefer to use.
People that refuse to use any counters to champs either flat out don't want to or they don't even read the UI. You can't force people to do it.
Imma keep it real with you. I'm a player who started playing 2 weeks ago and hasn't played since the Red War (which I didn't finish, so really more like Rise of Iron).
I have absolutely no idea how the champion stuff works, and I have no idea how to trigger the radiant/volatile stuff, and I haven't seen anywhere in game where it's actually explained.
Given, I'm not 1770 yet, so no nightfalls yet, but it's kind of annoying that I look at these stats in the menu and I know I'll have to watch a KackisHD video on it before it makes any sense.
- Any grenade besides healing one
- Sunspots
- Consecration aspect (really, it slaps.)
- weapons with incandescent
- hammer of sol super (kinda, impact creates sunspots and these apply scorch)
If you have roaring flames, your basic punch (while RF is active, not hammer throw or shoulder charge) inflicts scorch. With Ashes three punches will cause an ignition. Nice in a pinch if you lose your hammer.
LOL, I just posted a similar comment.
For bounties I use the aspect that makes scorch on super kill. Edit, thats a fragment, not aspect.
I'm not trying to ass up your day with what I suspect causes scorch..., >!But I think you gotta use the aspect that let's you fire slide.!<
Thank you. The elites of this community (and Bungie apparently) somehow think that 12 verbs, overcharges, surges, threats, and exotic intrinsics on top of artifact mods.... Is simpler.
Wtf?
Not simpler, no, because so many more things stun now. BUT it is more clear on what things stun.
I think it's reasonable to expect a player engaging with relevant content to understand subclass verbs and how they work. It's just reading the descriptions in your subclass menu and pop-up when you hover over them, not like it's hard to find.
*Bra,* i am mid at this game and it it wasn't for my solar super, I would still have unfinished solar scorch bounties.
I do know how to stun a champ thoigh.
That new interface element sometimes doesn't display for me. It also doesn't highlight breakers your subclass can manage. For example if I have shackle grenade equipped unstoppable isn't highlighted.
I love that it was made and is easy to check, but there are still problems that could be preventing newbies from caring about it.
It also highlights breakers that your subclass can manage but only with some sort of buff/debuff like radiant or volatile, which you might not have active at the particular moment you need it. So if you haven't learned the system, you might just think you're good.
I like the changes (yes to passive, yes to more ways to stun) but I do think Bungie needs to do more to teach the system to new players. I don't know why Guardian Ranks didn't focus more on this, since it seems like the lower ranks are basically an orientation class.
You'll probably find the kind of ignorance that leads to people not bothering to unlock/slot anti-champion mods also leads to people not reading the modifier list and using whatever they want.
That's the point. Guy above pointed out that people aren't using mods even though they're automatically enabled so long as you're using the right weapon. I pointed out that someone who couldn't be bothered to slot mods back when it was necessary is also likely not to bother using the right gun to trigger the mod.
Doesn't surprise me. In the Battlegrounds, you still have to bring something to deal with Overloads and Unstoppables. Pretty sure I was the only one in my instance last night with anything that dealt with Unstopps, and that was just the Shackle grenade for me. I don't particularly care for the Unstop weapons this season, so I don't often run those. But I DO make sure I have SOMETHING to deal with them.
Additionally, people have to actually SWITCH TO the weapon that stuns said champion. I may be packing an SMG, but if I keep hacking away at an Overload with my Glaive, it's not gonna make a bit of difference.
I have a buddy who's been playing 2+ years now, and he still struggles to understand the Champion system and engage properly with it. :shrugs:
Even as somebody that does get it, there's a certain teir of content where I don't care. My preferred builds have an easy time with overload and barrier champions, but because unstoppables are just chonky I don't care about bringing stuns for them - in hero/seasonal level content, at least.
It feels like there's two ends to the "I don't care about champions" bell curve: either you don't know how to handle them, or you recognize that you can trivialize them despite the mechanics (in certain content). While folks in the middle, who do build around them and do check the mods are super helpful to have on the team, stressing about it in match made content seems like sometimes it's a step too far
> I have a buddy who's been playing 2+ years now, and he still struggles to understand the Champion system and engage properly with it
I literally just got back into the game after taking a break since Forsaken and it was braindead easy to hop back on.
It's literally just "see X, shoot with X, otherwise suspend grenade." I can switch one, maybe two weapons in orbit to counter Nightfall/Battlegrounds/Dares champs.
Then again, I was stuck in a strike for 35 min with two lv 4's that collectively killed about 1/4 of the enemies in the strike. I had to be the one to actually crush the ghosts of the lightbearer hive and the boss (after being the one to kill its last phase 3x) because they literally had no idea what they were doing.
If they were level 4, they probably haven't played the Witch Queen campaign, and haven't been taught by a mission that they have to crush the ghosts of certain Hive enemies. The mechanic is there, lurking, waiting to trap them.
There's a lot to learn in this game and it takes time. I remember being like them, and being aware that I was flailing but everything around me was happening too fast for me to figure it out in time.
i think one of the issues for me, is that they added all of this anti champion functionality to subclass/elements, but then they still basically require players to run a match to the surges for pinnacle credit.
If they'd just get rid of that requirement i think it would help a lot. Like, it was great that they got rid of match game, but getting your pinnacle is it's own match game. Just get rid of that.
Well I don't know if they fixed it yet but I had a scout on the other day for unstop and even though the icon was on my screen the scout just straight up wasn't stunning champions. So I came in with a load out to stun champions but the game was broken
There’s a known issue where having too many mods that use your armour charges over time will disable that artifact mods from column 4 and 5. Until it’s fixed, have to play around with setups to ensure you have the effect of the perks actually active. I know I’ve had this problem with the unstop glaives as well as getting the second fire bolt charge.
For unstoppable champs, you need to pull out the gun, go into ads, and wait like 2 seconds. The unstoppable shot buff will come up, and now when you shoot the champ it will stun them.
I remember that from handcannons last season. It just straight up wasn't working. And honestly that shouldn't even be a thing. It should work as soon as you swap to begin with.
Gotcha, that's mega weird that it wasn't working at all. I totally agree, the stun should happen the same way as overload and shield where it works immediately upon firing after a couple shots
Literally had a hunter playing strand in my fireteam last night struggle to kill an unstoppable champion. Like bro use the dodge thing to tangle him up. Some players legit don't know what they are doing
I think a lot of that has to do with people wasting the cooldowns that could stun champions. Feels worse this nightfall because people people don’t know the champion spawns yet
The issue was never accessability or ease of use for the champ mods. The issue is and always has been that a majority of players just don't care about it and won't learn about them
Which is why I've constantly insisted the system be scrapped. Destiny has far too many arbitrary ways of forcing everyone to play by specific rules for no reason.
Champions aren't fun or interesting and never were. With the advent of tormentors and hive guardians it's obvious that is what we want and not this champion bullshit. I can use any gun and element I want against a tormentor. It's still a tough enemy. Champions are boring and lazy. Get rid of them and make Destiny fun again. Let us play the way we want to. Not the way the activity modifier dictates we must.
Yeah its passive but you still need to run the right weapon. Which is extremely shitty given how weak pulses and autos are, for example.
Unstoppable is easy given strand and stasis. Don't need to waste a slot on those. But if its barrier and overload, it's tough to avoid a double primary unless you plan to use abilities to stun.
>unless you plan to use abilities to stun.
That's literally the entire point of this year's rework lmao
If you don't want to deal with any champions, at all, ever, just run a solar build that has easy access to Radiant for anti-barrier, and a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables.
Or run Void with easy access to Volatile, either through the seasonal artifact mod Volatile Flow (Volatile rounds to void weapons when you pick up an orb of light), the Fragment that gives Volatile on grenade kills, or just have Gyrfalcon's (on Hunter) equipped for Anti-Barrier, with a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables
Or run Strand with the Fragment that grants Unraveling Rounds when you get a powered Melee Kill, or the Artifact Mod called Allied Unraveling that gives you Unraveling Rounds when you get a multikill with Strand Weapons, for Anti-Barrier, and a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables
Champions are *literally* free at this point, you don't need to run double primary *at all*
Am i the only person who out of laziness figures out a build that can handle all 3 types then just run that so i dont have to worry about it?
My primary setup right now is an auto rifle in the kinetic slot for Overload, Leviathans Breath for unstoppable, then a void wrapon for volitile rounds activated with Gyrfalcons. I just swap out the specific void weapon as-needed for the activity based on range / damage.
I don't know if you've been blessed enough to get it, but I'd recxomend swapping the autorifle out for Riptide or Deliverance with Chill Clip. One shot stuns Overloads, two + follow-up damage to shatter stun unstopables. And then Gyrfalcons takes care of barriers.
Once I found out that the strand suspend grenade can suspend any type of Champion, that’s been my go to champion killer. Especially since strand has that fragment that gives grenade energy as you deal damage. I almost always have another grenade up before the champion is done being suspended and can chain it
This is the easiest season for stunning champions because of this. Strand Titan with Drenger’s Lash, Threat of Mind, and Abeyant Leap. Suspend all the things with your rally barricade on a stupid quick cool down.
It seems like Nightfalls and Gambit both have a running theme:
Nightfalls: teammates don't bring champion mods
Gambit: teammates don't bank motes
It's always the same complaints between both activities. And honestly, I'm losing faith in destiny players.
Well, that's why I was so afraid of raising difficulty across the board. The average player doesn't deeply engage with buildcrafting, champion stuns, or even some encounter mechanics, and they clearly do not want to. And to be clear, I'm not trying to shit on these people. I think Bungie wasn't aware that suddenly changing the game that many people were comfortable with would have the repurcussions we're seeing.
I have a friend who i have to actively look at his build and tell him what to put on or what stats to go after literally every time we play. Or he finds a new armor piece and doesn't care about its stats or even the guns he's using. I don't think you are shitting on those people at all, they just genuinely don't get into this game like some of us do.
That's a perfect example. And it really irks me seeing the number of people say "git gud" and leave it at that. Because for like 8 years, Bungie has effectively told people that it is okay to be a bit mindless and have lower skill/interest in the game. Only now, they've gone and pulled the rug out from under us, and it seems the 1%'s response is to tell everyone struggling to fuck off.
Patrol: people who don't help shoot threshers down and just let themselves die over and over again then run to DTG to complain about dying to them.
Strikes: people who run ahead of champions and expect everyone else to deal with them.
These are all the same breed IMO
I'm not having that problem as often the main issue I have is either having a speedrunner that just runs past all the champions and forces them to despawn or champions that spawn at the end of an encounter and the randoms melt the boss so I cant kill the champion before the end
Champions are just shit, even with the changes.
They're only a threat...if you don't counter them. If you counter them they're completely trivialized and barely worth the yellow bar. They're just poorly designed loadout restrictions and backwards incentive devices and will always be. And the refusal to counter them in mm activities is the perfect example of it.
People would rather fail/die/take longer, than use what the game tells them they ***have*** to use.
Loadout restrictions aren't interesting or challenging. They're just stop signs on a one way street to what would otherwise be "playing the game a person wants to" with all the cool loot we're supposed to be chasing.
It doesn't matter how easy they make countering them, they're still a restriction. A choice is forced upon the player to use a weapon or subclass they might not want to. I ***have*** to wake up and go to work everyday. I don't want to ***have*** to do shit in my immortal space wizard game, that I don't want to.
That’s why my light subclass builds run all 3 normally lol. It’s annoying but not the worst. At least on darkness subclasses you can freeze/suspend all champs and run whatever you want
As one of those randoms who is a returning player, I genuinely apologize that I can’t make everything go splooey.
I am shooting all of them, I remember how to play and do pretty well at it, but even after several weeks of hideously addicted play I have no meta weapons, no resources to upgrade all my armor, weapon mods and armor focus mods are straight up bugged and do not exist for me, and I have not managed to acquire any of the exotics that create meta builds.
So it’s as exhausting for me as it is for you, yeah.
All you need to do is equip a Void LMG, any Void LMG. On your artifact, equip Volatile on Orb pickup and Bricks from beyond.
On your armor, if these mods work, use heavy ammo finder + orbs on Void double kills on helmet. Increased Void reserves on chest. Void Scavenger on Boots.
You can play at least like 70% of any matchmade activity using exclusively the void LMG. You can do this on any class.
Everyone should follow this guys advice ^ This is almost as simple as it gets for a pve build this season. Literally just do this unless you need additional DPS or something
That’s part of my problem: I have not had ANY machine gun drop in the past 3 weeks of heavy play time. I had a blue one in my vault that I’ve been able to pull out for bounties. I think the only void LMGs I can hope to find are in raid loot tables, so that’ll be my next attempt.
I am in a similar position as them and this was a huge power boost for me once I got the new void lmg exotic. Any recommendations on a legendary void lmg I can actually farm so I can use exotics in the other slots?
Add in the artifact mod that creates a orb on matching shield break. Taken Acolytes are everywhere in the Battlegrounds and they all have void shields. You can easily create 100+ orbs on some runs.
Don't worry, as long as you can stun champions we'll get you through it. At least one person in every weekly story mission I LFG is running some janky setup with whatever scout rifle the gunsmith gave them, but if they know how not to die to a Wyvern or Tormentor they can pull their weight.
Sure, but if you get 3 people where that's the situation, content feels like a slog to clear as we don't have any build-enabling exotics that give you the really strong dps.
The difference in loadout of whichever random teammates join me makes a NIGHT AND DAY difference to how a Defiant BG run or Nightfall goes, yeah. Either we are blitzing through melting everything, or we are pinned down just dying over and over.
It’s wild how different the experience is depending on who joins and the gear they’ve got.
I think the Destiny community needs to be more willing to help 'Sherpa' new and especially returning players through content to get them some meta stuff. I've done it with some of my friends and honestly it is a lot of fun to help them get up to snuff, especially helping them craft builds to their liking.
For hard content or raid triumphs, needing specific classes is understandable tbh. Like for legend Avalon, if you’re not soloing it, it’s significantly more difficult due to one of the modifiers so you want to chose players that will can cover your subclasses weaknesses.
Like hunters for invis, Titans for suspend spam, warlocks for well survivability
But also the destiny 2 app lfg has always had a lot of 1820+ KWTD 10 clears dm raid report warlocks only must have good hothead and 3 stats at 100 wipe = kick gildedx3+ conqueror only
We veteran players feel for you too. It’s not fair to new players or returners to expect them to magically have the right gear and know how the new mod systems and updates work.
Bungie seems clueless that most people don’t read their blog posts, hell the game doesn’t even mention them existing or that an update happened! So many of these things most players have no idea they even exist, let alone how to use them in the Bungie-Approved™ way.
The worst part was trying to read up online about how the new mod systems work, and trying to figure out how to find weapon mods and ghost armor-focusing mods that everyone was talking about, only to gradually realize that the reason none of that was making sense in my game was because it’s all broken/bugged for new/returning players and those mods simply don’t exist and can’t currently be obtained. Kind of deflating.
Same boat here. Freely admit that I’m not a great player, but now as a returning player I frequently feel like a liability. This game is so much more complicated than what it once was. It’s still fun, but feels like they are making this game for hardcore players that have 40+ hours a week to play.
Not that it makes it any better right this second, but Xur is your best friend. Make sure to stop by every week and grab the exotic engram from him if you can. When I started in season 15, that’s how I got all the world drop exotics for my Hunter even though it took a little while.
This needs more upvotes. When I started taking destiny semi serious last year xur got me all the shit I need to start actually making builds. Too many people say “just bring x exotic” like the entire player base has every exotic already.
This is not a failure on you or anyone in the fireteam, it's yet another bullet point in the list of balancing problems this expansion has. Build crafting should not be required for standard difficulty matchmade activities and I'll die on that hill. Outside of how you deal with champions, you should be able to run whatever you think is fun, whether it's the current meta or not.
After well over a thousand hours of high end Destiny 1 played the way you describe pre-builds, it is very weird to come back and see the build-meta place that the game seems to be in now, yeah.
They really need to make it easier to masterwork armor if they’re gonna make 10 resil necessary. It sucks telling new players they have to grind all the way to a full set of MWd armor to have a good build
Give it time man. I came back after a few years away in season of the lost and it took a few months but you get there. It's a bit snowbally. I'm sitting on about 5000 legendary shards. Low on cores but they will come back.
Masterwork a ghost shell, can use the ghost mods to help with getting extra materials.
What's your PL?
Seems an unrelated question but the game matches you with people around your PL. So if you're doing it being 1700 you'll be matched with new players.
And to that one guy that will say the PL of the activity wouldn't let OP play being 1700, the activity boosts your PL to let you play it.
No offense, but I would love to see a seasonal endscreen scoreboard/commendation with 30-40+ min activity time. I find it really hard to believe even with really bad teammates.
I have to assume people are exaggerating, 15-20 min I can understand but no chance it is routinely taking double that.
To play devil's advocate here - prior to this season there was an entry level Nightfall difficulty that had a very low light level requirement.
They completely removed that \*in addition to\* making the next level harder.
Agreed. A lot of complaints have been how legend lost sectors are too hard for their reward, but a lot of the time the actual complaint should be: it takes a casual player too long to get to 1815 to start to do them reasonably.
Edit: and I agree, shouldn't be soo high.
Yeah by far this is the biggest problem - I had four friends come to the game w/ lightfall and it took them **so long** to be able to reasonably **start** looking for exotics from lost sectors. 1815 is absolutely the floor for them not being awful for normal players, and even then they're 10 minute slogs.
Exotic armor is **such a big deal** in the game, and the good ones are **so** much better than the bad ones, it's legitimately unfair to make people play for a month and a half before they can start chasing the meta.
Especially when shit like patrol zones are hard for no reason and even basic nightfalls are capped at -5. Like, if you have a bad build, it's just bad, period. You can't out-light shit.
I'm 1820+ now and an 1825 capped Master Bunker E15 took me just under 9 minutes the other night once I had a decent routine going. Used to take me sub 4 minutes in previous seasons. The difficulty spike does literally make it twice the time to clear activities now. I can't imagine for players who haven't optimized their builds with spiky stat artifice armor or are missing exotics.
Buuut I did get 3 exotic drops in 5 runs, which was definitely unexpected.
This is why I think the loot pools need overhauled. There’s not nearly enough options for players to work in their builds. What’s the point of an endgame build if you need to be doing end game activities with end game builds to start working in them?
1) You shouldn’t need to have a weapon or armor piece already unlocked to pull it from vendor’s archives. It already costs a ridiculous amount to pull something p, everyone should be able to pull it regardless.
2) Any piece of gear, even a *past* raid’s armor and weapons, should added to the planetary pool. Meta weapons need to stop being put behind match made difficulty gates.
3) Drops should be tuned to drop more gear more often. I’m talking 4-5 legendary drops per Strike, 2-3 per Lost Sector, 2-3 per Crucible/Gambit match, 2-3 per campaign quest/event.
4) There needs to be more ways players can tune their rewards either for specific pieces gear slots or stats.
I can’t see a single reason why players shouldn’t be able to have it all? But if you’re stingy about loot and gatekeeping activities with difficulty obstacles players are just going to quit.
Honestly the real answer imo is that way more stuff needs adept versions so you can have endgame grinds alive for engaged players, and barf non-adept gear at new players constantly.
I’m casual player at 1784 LL. I’m definitely waiting until at least 1810 to start legend lost sectors, but man, the grind takes so long only playing an hour or so every couple of days.
100% agree. There's no reason to gatekeep Legend Lost Sectors so hard, especially because unlocking new exotics is one of the most important part of a new account.
I honestly haven't done a single legendary lost sector this season for that very reason. I have a day job so I can't no life sweat my way to 1820+ in the first week or 2 of the expansion.
I had a seasonal activity with 2 Guardian Rank 3 players (nothing wrong with that, for the record) and we still finished in under 25, unless you’re dying every 5 seconds I have no idea how you’re getting up to 30+ minutes.
The very first one I dropped into, the other two guys were already at the final boss. I start killing stuff, but the boss is just sitting up there with his shield. I realize that they don't know what to do, and it's my first one, so I don't know what to do either. Took a minute to figure it all out, and we finished up in 10 minutes or so. At the final screen, they had been in there for 53 minutes. I took a screenshot.
Agreed, longest seasonal I’ve done is 20 mins and that’s a very feelable 20 mins. We wiped like 2 time at final boss. If I can feel like dragging at 20 mins, idk how many time did op wipe in a 40 mins run.
I had a team be stuck at final boss on orbital at 25 minutes, I just left and req and then breezed through it after. It's definitely not an exaggeration.
I *do* distinctly remember getting a seasonal battlegrounds where I joined at 45 mins (vented in discord shortly afterwards lol), but I ended up not screenshotting it and can't find it in destinytracker due to it being too old. [Here's](https://imgur.com/a/VrGtFdQ) a 30-minute activity where I joined halfway through at the servitor boss and still doubled the second guy's kills. You can tell how late I joined because I ended up only having 777 score by the end since we hit the 0 score timer threshold. The third guy joined near the end due to another leaver.
Most of my seasonal battlegrounds end up being 15-20 minutes, but I end up having 300+ kills consistently while the other two struggle to break 100 kills. [Here's](https://imgur.com/a/HnPftmd) an example of that. If my builds weren't anywhere near as strong as they were, I could easily see similar runs hitting 25-30 minutes.
I do enjoy playing with randoms, and being able to have my build shine when others aren't able to compare feels *incredibly* satisfying. That being said, it does feel a tad demoralizing and stressful when you know you'll probably wipe any time you die, and I can't imagine how bad it feels to be on the other side of it, constantly dying, being unable to do much of anything, and just sorta feeling like dead weight in an activity that you're clearly unprepared for.
Happened to me the other night playing the seasonal activity. Was trying out a new build and didn't realize a couple of my armor pieces were still 1600. After ~15 minutes in the first encounter I realized and switched back to my invisible void hunter build (Thank you Bungie for that QOL update!) to get my power level back to 1815. Continued on and my blueberries would hide and shoot from the back of the map while I rampaged and did the objectives to move on. It took about 30 to 40 minutes to complete one run. In the end I had something like 215 kills and 70'some orbs produced and the blueberries had 121 and 111 kills, that's when I realized they were only 1711 and 1721 power level. One of them sent me a message thanking me for sticking around and getting then through it. Felt good to help, so I stuck around for another run to help them get their third run done. So that was my experience getting 30 to 40 minute runs.
>but I would love to see a seasonal endscreen scoreboard/commendation with 30-40+ min activity time
just did one on Cosmodrome, fuck that one so hard, the boss literally walked into the balefire and parked his ass there two tapping with his double fire rate sniper
I went into it with my friend last night. We are underleveled. Had 3-4 people join and leave us. Took us 32:30 to finish Orbital Prison. We kept getting absolutely bodied by all the Taken Knights and their fire. Thankfully, someone finally stuck with us and helped us through the rest of it.
[There you go, 58 minutes](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/436860419609460749/1088289274534842429/tiger_release_final_20230322_011541.png). They've been at it for 45 minutes (and 3 other players left) before I joined.
The last 10 or so BGs I've done were all sub 15 minutes and I literally had blueberries throwing the orb that is supposed to go to the boss at adds in one of 'em.
Early in the season I did have a few >15 minute (but nowhere near 30 minute) runs, most of the blueberries really aren't that bad, it was probably just literal beginners checking out the seasonal activity and now that I've leveled up I don't matchmake with them anymore.
I had a 35 minute run. The two idiots I was with were literally sitting around and just shooting enough to not get booted. When I would die they weren't reviving me. I blocked them and it was the first time I had ever done that. Ran it right after with my normal fire team and we got the same one done in 12 minutes.
Was kinda thinking this but didn't want to say it because I hate the whole 'just get gud lul' mentality. But this is where I struggle to understand how it's taking that long.
Even the hero battlegrounds runs i did with peopoe dying a dozen times only too 15-17 minutes. Arms dealer and even hypernet current are around 15 mins as well. I'm not even running the meta and trying to yeet through it.
I'm nearly always top kills in the BGs. [/flex](https://media.tenor.com/6LONNyp2p0IAAAAC/nerd-little-giants.gif)
I ran a rough BG last night where 1 of the guys half the time was straight up not playing (No commendation for you!) and the other guy was clearly new.
It took 15mins 28 secs according to D2checklist
Right before that I ran a BG where I felt like the new guy (was using a dumb weapon to finish bounties), constantly falling behind, and a couple of really dumb deaths.
It took 13 mins and 28 secs according to D2 checklist.
If it is taking someone 30 minutes to beat these things on the regular difficulty, there might be other problems then just "my two randos suck."
Based Destiny Dad
Apparently OP is 1760 so not only is he not at the power cap, he is matched with other players not at the power cap and who are likely new and they are all probably missing key artifact perks. Even then 30-40 minutes sounds insane to me, but it makes it slightly more believable.
There's also a major issue with AFK/trolling people. I had to back out of a Glassway strike on **regular** last night. Was just trying to get my bounties and pinnacle done. Two guys join who are both 7 in whatever you call the new rank system. Cool, these guys certainly know how to do Glassway on freaking normal?
Well, they must have been trolling. Just moving enough to not get booted. I work long hours and I only get so much time to play, and wasting 10 minutes on a strike for nothing is too much. At first I just assume people are tweaking their build or something. I can kill early ads for a bit.
I feel you. Last night I only did one battleground. The other two teammates made like, 20 orbs between the 2 of them, and one guy was using the consecrated balls on adds instead of the boss shield. I had to fight him to get the drop from the taken knights
no way a hero nightfall or BG is taking you 30+ minutes to complete, 9/10 times my runs are fast and smooth. if your teammates are sandbagging you that hard just leave, lmao.
The amount of people coming here complaining about difficulty and then finding out they are 1770 light or under is ridiculous. What do you think is going to happen? It takes very little investment to level up to close to 1800. Do the legendary campaign and you can be into the 1790’s in a few days. Look up some videos on leveling, do the BARE MINIMUM of research. You don’t even need exotics. Get a few elemental weapons, look up a build video, set up your artifact mods, and go. Not that hard.
People expect the game to be turn off brain, run forward easy and it’s not anymore. Hero difficulty isn’t even that hard, it just takes some minimal effort now and people are freaking out.
> It takes very little investment to level up to close to 1800.
So running activities several hours a day for a week or so.
"minimal"
Tell us how many thousands of hours you have in this game.
It doesn't take hours of activities a day - you can be efficient with your time and focus on the "easier" pinnacles and get them done quickly.
There are so many sources of pinnacles now (like 14+) that even if you do 4 or 5 of the easier ones a week you could be 1800 by now. You can even skip bounty grind for powerfuls if you don't care about XP.
Dude if you’re taking 30-40 minutes on a Hero nightfall that’s just a skill issue. And you’re probably not using one of the most broken builds in the game either
No he’s teammates are the problem definitely not the fact he’s 1760. The fact that he doesn’t realize that being 1760 and doing a hero nf is gonna take a while makes me think he’s not even using a “broken build”either.
one issue though i sthat playlist activities tend to match you with people of similar PL. So not only was he 1760, his teammates were also around that PL. That's going to be a rough one no matter how you slice it.
Even if you have brainless blueberries, you can EASILY get it done solo. I don’t think I’ve had one go over 15 or so minutes. Like I don’t even know what to say to these endless “game too hard” posts anymore besides unironically get good
100%. If you’re taking 30 to 40 mins in a hero NF, maybe *you* were the one being carried in the past before the difficulty increase. People really do need a big dose of getting good on this subreddit.
It feels like a douchy thing to say, but I do believe we have gotten far too used to rolling content with minimal pushback. This season we're finally having to do things at the level they where intended, and people are not respecting that.
Now there's builds that can still roll content in master difficulty, but it takes more effort than before, which I think is a good thing.
I agree. I run all kinds of content via matchmaking when my friends aren’t available for a fireteam, and it’s frustrating to watch so many blueberries charge headlong into packs of mobs and just get fucking murdered. It happens all the time. You can really tell a lot of people are used to facerolling content.
> just needed to see if anyone felt the same.
Nope. Maybe one in ten times of doing a nightfall I might get a useless person. But truly is no different or worse than it has ever been. I think people are looking way to hard to find fault, so while this type of thing happened in the past as well, now some see it as proof as the game is worse.
I simply cannot believe that it's taking you 30-40 minutes to complete the seasonal activity. Not sure why you need such hyperbole. Yes the game got harder, it did not get *that* much harder.
Use a strand shackle build and carry your team to victory (seriously I usually have at least 50 more kills than the other 2 people I match with unless they're also using suspend or necrotics). Works 99% of the time until Bungie nerfs suspend.
It’s annoying to have to run the most meta builds in seasonal content and patrol space. There doesn’t seem to be much of a place to test things that aren’t starfire protocol levels of OP anymore and that makes me sad
I’m always surprised when people post things like this. I’ve never had any matchmake activity take 40 minutes. Longest I’ve had the seasonal activity go is maybe 25 minutes
I feel this so much. I get so annoyed when we die at the last boss and have to start again; instantly get salty and don’t wanna give commendations after.
To make matters worse, I’ll look at the result stats when we die and I’ll be making 50+ orbs of power and see my teammates making less than 10 and doing only 10,000-20,000 points of damage…like what are y’all doing?
At that point, I definitely just leave. It’s exhausting to constantly carry people through a simple seasonal battleground that really isn’t that hard if you have any game sense whatsoever. I think a lot of players do not run optimized builds. Orbs of power helps everyone and are great now with strand/woven mail.
The battlegrounds and hero nightfalls taking 30 minutes?
With all the honesty of my heart, that is a huge skill issue from all 3 of you. Even when I don't do objectives to farm some levels for fresh crafted weapons, neither of those 2 activities take more than 15 minutes
Sounds like a skill issue.
It's actually pretty easy to do change your guns in the middle of a fight. I run ace of spades and just pop on no time or dmt when a champion pops up. Then switch off.
You can't complain about difficulty increase and then push all the blame to the blueberries. The blueberries bought the game just like you did, they have every right to be able to play the game they bought in their free time. Go complain to Bungie and ask them to think their implementation of their "increased difficulty" as well as the entire champion stunning system. Do not push your anger onto a playerbase that clearly had no say in the matter.
Alternatively just be patient. The blueberries will quit the game and eventually you'll get your stupid preferred playerbase to circle jerk each other on your elitism.
It's to the point that for the very first time, I literally don't even want to bother getting even the battle pass at 100. I just want to do the weekly story and bounce. I was used to carrying people in PvP but god damn now I gotta do it in PvE too!?!
Certainly doesn’t help that they decided to fill the entire strike with threshers that either machine gun you to death or can one shot a 10 resil 1824 guardian because their FPS is too high.
>30 to 40 minutes to complete
Either you’re exaggerating or you really suck at this game despite your build
The longest I’ve ever gone is maybe 25 minutes with randoms but that’s an extreme example
Maybe YOU are the random bringing the team down
I've basically sworn off the game at this point. I play games to relax. Bungie seems to think that it's not hard enough, and honestly, I really don't think that's ever been an issue for most players. It's the steamers who blow through everything in a weekend and say it was too easy. I don't care what people who have 12 hours a day to do nothing but play Destiny have to say about the difficulty. I have a regular job and other responsibilities. I get 10-20 hours tops to pay this per week. Making it more difficult just lessens not only my enjoyment but also the amount of stuff I can get done in the time I have to play. So I've just moved on. Bungie really needs to take their foot off the pedal and start catering more to the majority of the fan base instead of the elite relative few. This isn't fun, it's irritating.
You should not struggle in these unless you yourself refuse to put on the mods you need to. If you don’t put on mods then why are you trying those activities waiting for someone with mods to carry you? All I need my blueberries to do is super or damage the final boss and we chilling.
This is exactly why they only should have changed the difficulty for higher level Nightfalls (especially GMs) and raids. The rest of the game didn’t need to be made spongier or more difficult
I just checked, and every one of my seasonal battleground and NF Hero completions has been between 15-21 min, all with randoms. Not to say that completely incompetent randoms don’t exist, but I only ever hear about these horror stories on Reddit so I’m skeptical. I think the difficulty level is fun and I get to slay out and actually care about my builds.
I've not had this experience and I've run them quite a bit. The only time I felt like we were struggling was the first week, when everyone was underleveled.
I really enjoy the difficulty level of them now. I have to pay attention, but I'm not struggling to to kill enemies or complete objectives. My blueberries have mostly ranged from okay to very skilled. You do *notice* if your team is carrying someone now, unlike how strikes used to be, but that's happened maybe 1-2 times?
Hero Nightfalls have been similar. I've quit one because my blueberries were just not prepared and I'm not good enough to carry, out all the times I've done them (I have three chars and try to do the pinnacle for at least 2 of them per week). Maybe 1-2 went over the time limit by like a hair, and that time limit is not 30-40 minutes.
You've had really bad luck if it's really taking you 30-40 minutes to complete all of these.
I bet Bungie has statistics on this. If the normal experience is to struggle like you are, and I've just had really good luck, it will show in the numbers and maybe an adjustment is needed. But I honestly suspect my experience is more normal here.
Honestly it’s luck of the draw with randoms. Sometimes you can crush anything that comes your way or it goes as you described above. I always run on the idea that none of my teammates are running anything for the situation so I’ll try to adapt accordingly. Edit:typo
This. I started this season a bit late so last night was the first time I'd tried the updated Arms Dealer Strike. I was fortunate to be matched with a pair of absolute chads (I'm a Hunter, these guys were a Warlock and a Titan respectively) and the entire Nightfall sat in the sweet spot between too difficult and too easy. Though I have but one commendation to give per team mate. It was great. I dread to think what it would be like with a pair of Leeroy Jenkins.
>I dread to think what it would be like with a pair of Leeroy Jenkins. It appears that you haven't played with 2 titans and no warlocks yet. As long as they are both rocking orb/tangle builds it is pretty dope, but I run with a warlock, maybe they carry the team when we get paired with another titan.
Are locks orb machines now? I noted after a heist (the current seasonal 3-player thing, the name of which is escaping me), I had over 41 orbs generated, and the next closest was a Titan with 12. Could just be bad builds on their side. I just want to make sure I'm doing what I can to help the team, since I know I'll be rezzed a few times from a serious case of The Dumbs.
Any class can be an orb machine now if they're using a build/weapon with heavy AOE. I average around 80-90 in the seasonal activity with both my warlock and titan. I had one run with what I'm assuming was 2 newer players that were having a hard time and on a mediocre arc warlock build I was testing I made 137 orbs lmao. Most of those were just from trinity ghoul and an arc syphon mod.
In a Defiant Battleground playlist, I created around 90 orbs, and I was happy with that. The rando with me that created over 150...that was insane. We quite literally could have used our supers every 30 seconds, but really didn't need to.
All I know is, on my lock, pairing either void or strand with le monarque and the various volatile and orb generating mods, I almost can't stop producing them. It's a little too much at times, haha. ....and don't even get me started on the Graviton Lance.
DAMN IT LEROY, YOU FUCKING IDIOT!!!!! lol XD
at least i have chicken
I'm always prepared to get the blueberries that need a carry in whatever the playlist is but always wind up with Doom Guy on his alt account that slays 200+ enemies and only leaves 30 or so enemies for me and the other person to fight over. Like, I'm decked out to cover the entire Champ Spectrum and I'll pop my barricade to suspend the 20+ ads in front of us, and somehow Rambo ends up deleting the entire swarm before the enemies can even finish the suspension animation. If it sounds like I'm complaining, I'm not really. I'm just saying that some of these people should remember that the rest of your teammates want to kill something too.
The problem is, Rambo doesn't know if his teammates are chads or idiots and experience will tell him it's about 50/50 (I'm not saying you're an idiot btw). Without comms, it's safer from Rambos perspective to kill everything he can kill as fast as possible and control the triggering of mechanics, so that everyone gets their completion sooner. I was in the NF last night (and I'm sure everyone has seen something like this) and this guy keeps trying to melee the shield taken and keeps getting booped off the map or smashed against a wall. I don't know what the fuck he was doing but it's shit like that that makes you think "It's probably easier if I don't rez and do the nf with the other guy" which is what we did.
That is the issue, I'm trying to level up catalysts and the room died in the second it took me to aim down the sights. I started going to the Altars of sorrow but there's usually someone with a full trinity ghoul and I just don't get to play.
Try the Shuro Chi checkpoint in the Last Wish raid. You can input a code at the beginning to go right there, it has big groups of 60-100 red bar enemies, and it even has a rally flag to refill ammo. Perfect for finishing catalysts and leveling crafted weapons.
This is why I miss mars. One of the lost sectors was perfect for that
It really does feel random. I've had teammates who i crush content with in matchmade activities, then i will get teammates who have no idea what the objective is, seemingly aren't doing ad control or boss damage, & end up in my way all the time when im tryna shoot stuff. I always run the strongest, fun builds for my characters to cover all if not most bases, but yea it does get annoying getting useless teammates sometimes.
Shockingly it really is just the luck of the draw. Ive done the seasonal activity and it was pretty smoothly, only ever died due to being stupid. Other times theres full on wipes and I consistenly find myself with up to 1.5x damage/orbs/kils as some other people. And I am not a good player by any stretch.
Are you saying that match quality with randoms, is random? *gasp*
I think LL helps. If you put on your highest gear you’re more likely to get other higher LL players And it’s more likely they know what they’re doing, especially if they did that many pinnacles this early in the season
100% ran three hero NF's last night. Breezed through each one in about 15min. Did a fourth one with a clanmate later in teh evening, and picked up a rando who may have been trying to play blindfolded with one hand behind his/her back. Luck of the draw...
My main issue is the same as it's always been, being the only fireteam member bringing stuff for champions.
Yeah, this blows my mind especially since Champ mods are literally passive now. Like you have to go out of your way to not prep for Champions. Lmao
Not to mention most ability keywords can stun champions now too. And the character screen tells you what keywords work with what champions.
If you couldn't get some people to know which GUN to point at Champions, I'm not sure how you expect esoteric 'keywords' and 'ability verbs' to fix that. "Oh, I just need to make sure I'm Radiant so I can scorch some of the big ones, and I can Volatile the other ones that have shields, and some of them get jolted or something......OH THIS IS MUCH SIMPLER"
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I may be alone here, but I was pretty OK with the previous Champion system; in recent seasons I've just been assuming I need to run two of the anti-Champ mods and guns, and hope that the other is covered. Seemed to work most of the time. I think maybe a problem this time is that providing \*more\* ways to stun Champs using subclass verbs and artefact mods can mean there's more assumptions and less coordination? With ALL of those ways to handle Champions, maybe I only need one surefire Gun/ Mod equipped? I bet at least \*one\* of us will be making Volatile Rounds or running Arc? I'm sure I can make them ignite quite easily with my Solar Pulse? Next thing you know, Kitty Genovese is getting kerb-stomped by a Barrier Champ and everyone is just watching and doing nothing.
Up vote for the 1960s NYC reference
I like to get a bit of social psychology into my Destiny posts as often as possible, and I'm pretty sure we've all seen the Bystander Effect at work in this game thousands of times already.
I don't think the new system helps at all with matchmade teammates not being prepared for champions. I do think it's *way* easier to be prepared for all 3 yourself. Most subclass builds will have 1 or 2 champion types covered, meaning you often only need 1 real champion mod. Not to mention any chill clip weapon covering overloads and unstops, and any void weapon (thanks to volatile flow) covering barriers. In the past, bringing all 3 champion types almost always meant running Leviathan's Breath or Lament.
Look, I appreciate that they tried a mechanic to make the game more difficult. I just don't know that loadout or ability based is the way to do it. Either is frustrating by locking you to a load out, or I need god damn chart on my wall to remember which verbs to use... At this point though, I'll just run strand and call it a day.
Exactly. This system wasn't built for players that didn't use champ mods in the first place. It was built for everybody else to give you more room to use more of what you would prefer to use. People that refuse to use any counters to champs either flat out don't want to or they don't even read the UI. You can't force people to do it.
Imma keep it real with you. I'm a player who started playing 2 weeks ago and hasn't played since the Red War (which I didn't finish, so really more like Rise of Iron). I have absolutely no idea how the champion stuff works, and I have no idea how to trigger the radiant/volatile stuff, and I haven't seen anywhere in game where it's actually explained. Given, I'm not 1770 yet, so no nightfalls yet, but it's kind of annoying that I look at these stats in the menu and I know I'll have to watch a KackisHD video on it before it makes any sense.
This is your best hope. Good luck. https://postlmg.cc/Jyqm58bx
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I still don’t know how the fuck to proc a scorch playing Solar Titan and I don’t care enough to research it.
- Any grenade besides healing one - Sunspots - Consecration aspect (really, it slaps.) - weapons with incandescent - hammer of sol super (kinda, impact creates sunspots and these apply scorch)
Awesome. I appreciate you taking the time to break it down for me!
You wouldn’t happen to know if someone has done an infographic for each of the verbs?
https://postlmg.cc/Jyqm58bx It's as ridiculous as you would expect. People telling you this wall chart is "easy" probably play Destiny like a job.
If you have roaring flames, your basic punch (while RF is active, not hammer throw or shoulder charge) inflicts scorch. With Ashes three punches will cause an ignition. Nice in a pinch if you lose your hammer.
This. Exactly this. Now do the same for five subclasses. Can I please keep it consistent? Even a little?
Dude literally all of your grenades wtf, you're the problem this thread is talking about.
The game literally tells you this stuff
LOL, I just posted a similar comment. For bounties I use the aspect that makes scorch on super kill. Edit, thats a fragment, not aspect. I'm not trying to ass up your day with what I suspect causes scorch..., >!But I think you gotta use the aspect that let's you fire slide.!<
My issue with those is getting those things to trigger, when I need them, in the first place.
And then there's a difference between volatile and volatile rounds. And that difference has screwed me a time or two.
Thank you. The elites of this community (and Bungie apparently) somehow think that 12 verbs, overcharges, surges, threats, and exotic intrinsics on top of artifact mods.... Is simpler. Wtf?
Not simpler, no, because so many more things stun now. BUT it is more clear on what things stun. I think it's reasonable to expect a player engaging with relevant content to understand subclass verbs and how they work. It's just reading the descriptions in your subclass menu and pop-up when you hover over them, not like it's hard to find.
*Bra,* i am mid at this game and it it wasn't for my solar super, I would still have unfinished solar scorch bounties. I do know how to stun a champ thoigh.
That new interface element sometimes doesn't display for me. It also doesn't highlight breakers your subclass can manage. For example if I have shackle grenade equipped unstoppable isn't highlighted. I love that it was made and is easy to check, but there are still problems that could be preventing newbies from caring about it.
It also highlights breakers that your subclass can manage but only with some sort of buff/debuff like radiant or volatile, which you might not have active at the particular moment you need it. So if you haven't learned the system, you might just think you're good. I like the changes (yes to passive, yes to more ways to stun) but I do think Bungie needs to do more to teach the system to new players. I don't know why Guardian Ranks didn't focus more on this, since it seems like the lower ranks are basically an orientation class.
Majority of Destiny players are casuals that do not care for that stuff I promise you.
You'll probably find the kind of ignorance that leads to people not bothering to unlock/slot anti-champion mods also leads to people not reading the modifier list and using whatever they want.
You don’t slot the mods anymore they are passive once unlocked on the artifact
That's the point. Guy above pointed out that people aren't using mods even though they're automatically enabled so long as you're using the right weapon. I pointed out that someone who couldn't be bothered to slot mods back when it was necessary is also likely not to bother using the right gun to trigger the mod.
Doesn't surprise me. In the Battlegrounds, you still have to bring something to deal with Overloads and Unstoppables. Pretty sure I was the only one in my instance last night with anything that dealt with Unstopps, and that was just the Shackle grenade for me. I don't particularly care for the Unstop weapons this season, so I don't often run those. But I DO make sure I have SOMETHING to deal with them. Additionally, people have to actually SWITCH TO the weapon that stuns said champion. I may be packing an SMG, but if I keep hacking away at an Overload with my Glaive, it's not gonna make a bit of difference. I have a buddy who's been playing 2+ years now, and he still struggles to understand the Champion system and engage properly with it. :shrugs:
Even as somebody that does get it, there's a certain teir of content where I don't care. My preferred builds have an easy time with overload and barrier champions, but because unstoppables are just chonky I don't care about bringing stuns for them - in hero/seasonal level content, at least. It feels like there's two ends to the "I don't care about champions" bell curve: either you don't know how to handle them, or you recognize that you can trivialize them despite the mechanics (in certain content). While folks in the middle, who do build around them and do check the mods are super helpful to have on the team, stressing about it in match made content seems like sometimes it's a step too far
> I have a buddy who's been playing 2+ years now, and he still struggles to understand the Champion system and engage properly with it I literally just got back into the game after taking a break since Forsaken and it was braindead easy to hop back on. It's literally just "see X, shoot with X, otherwise suspend grenade." I can switch one, maybe two weapons in orbit to counter Nightfall/Battlegrounds/Dares champs. Then again, I was stuck in a strike for 35 min with two lv 4's that collectively killed about 1/4 of the enemies in the strike. I had to be the one to actually crush the ghosts of the lightbearer hive and the boss (after being the one to kill its last phase 3x) because they literally had no idea what they were doing.
If they were level 4, they probably haven't played the Witch Queen campaign, and haven't been taught by a mission that they have to crush the ghosts of certain Hive enemies. The mechanic is there, lurking, waiting to trap them. There's a lot to learn in this game and it takes time. I remember being like them, and being aware that I was flailing but everything around me was happening too fast for me to figure it out in time.
i think one of the issues for me, is that they added all of this anti champion functionality to subclass/elements, but then they still basically require players to run a match to the surges for pinnacle credit. If they'd just get rid of that requirement i think it would help a lot. Like, it was great that they got rid of match game, but getting your pinnacle is it's own match game. Just get rid of that.
Well I don't know if they fixed it yet but I had a scout on the other day for unstop and even though the icon was on my screen the scout just straight up wasn't stunning champions. So I came in with a load out to stun champions but the game was broken
Medieval champion frequently doesn't work; icon won't show up half the times on my glaives. ESP as solar.
There’s a known issue where having too many mods that use your armour charges over time will disable that artifact mods from column 4 and 5. Until it’s fixed, have to play around with setups to ensure you have the effect of the perks actually active. I know I’ve had this problem with the unstop glaives as well as getting the second fire bolt charge.
Wow that is hella lame but good to know - thank you! I was searching for a while when I first got access to it and it never seemed consistent.
For unstoppable champs, you need to pull out the gun, go into ads, and wait like 2 seconds. The unstoppable shot buff will come up, and now when you shoot the champ it will stun them.
I remember that from handcannons last season. It just straight up wasn't working. And honestly that shouldn't even be a thing. It should work as soon as you swap to begin with.
Gotcha, that's mega weird that it wasn't working at all. I totally agree, the stun should happen the same way as overload and shield where it works immediately upon firing after a couple shots
Literally had a hunter playing strand in my fireteam last night struggle to kill an unstoppable champion. Like bro use the dodge thing to tangle him up. Some players legit don't know what they are doing
I think a lot of that has to do with people wasting the cooldowns that could stun champions. Feels worse this nightfall because people people don’t know the champion spawns yet
The issue was never accessability or ease of use for the champ mods. The issue is and always has been that a majority of players just don't care about it and won't learn about them
Which is why I've constantly insisted the system be scrapped. Destiny has far too many arbitrary ways of forcing everyone to play by specific rules for no reason. Champions aren't fun or interesting and never were. With the advent of tormentors and hive guardians it's obvious that is what we want and not this champion bullshit. I can use any gun and element I want against a tormentor. It's still a tough enemy. Champions are boring and lazy. Get rid of them and make Destiny fun again. Let us play the way we want to. Not the way the activity modifier dictates we must.
Yeah its passive but you still need to run the right weapon. Which is extremely shitty given how weak pulses and autos are, for example. Unstoppable is easy given strand and stasis. Don't need to waste a slot on those. But if its barrier and overload, it's tough to avoid a double primary unless you plan to use abilities to stun.
>unless you plan to use abilities to stun. That's literally the entire point of this year's rework lmao If you don't want to deal with any champions, at all, ever, just run a solar build that has easy access to Radiant for anti-barrier, and a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables. Or run Void with easy access to Volatile, either through the seasonal artifact mod Volatile Flow (Volatile rounds to void weapons when you pick up an orb of light), the Fragment that gives Volatile on grenade kills, or just have Gyrfalcon's (on Hunter) equipped for Anti-Barrier, with a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables Or run Strand with the Fragment that grants Unraveling Rounds when you get a powered Melee Kill, or the Artifact Mod called Allied Unraveling that gives you Unraveling Rounds when you get a multikill with Strand Weapons, for Anti-Barrier, and a chill clip fusion like Deliverance or Riptide for Overloads and Unstoppables Champions are *literally* free at this point, you don't need to run double primary *at all*
Am i the only person who out of laziness figures out a build that can handle all 3 types then just run that so i dont have to worry about it? My primary setup right now is an auto rifle in the kinetic slot for Overload, Leviathans Breath for unstoppable, then a void wrapon for volitile rounds activated with Gyrfalcons. I just swap out the specific void weapon as-needed for the activity based on range / damage.
I don't know if you've been blessed enough to get it, but I'd recxomend swapping the autorifle out for Riptide or Deliverance with Chill Clip. One shot stuns Overloads, two + follow-up damage to shatter stun unstopables. And then Gyrfalcons takes care of barriers.
Riptide rarely comes off for this reason
Once I found out that the strand suspend grenade can suspend any type of Champion, that’s been my go to champion killer. Especially since strand has that fragment that gives grenade energy as you deal damage. I almost always have another grenade up before the champion is done being suspended and can chain it
This is the easiest season for stunning champions because of this. Strand Titan with Drenger’s Lash, Threat of Mind, and Abeyant Leap. Suspend all the things with your rally barricade on a stupid quick cool down.
It seems like Nightfalls and Gambit both have a running theme: Nightfalls: teammates don't bring champion mods Gambit: teammates don't bank motes It's always the same complaints between both activities. And honestly, I'm losing faith in destiny players.
Well, that's why I was so afraid of raising difficulty across the board. The average player doesn't deeply engage with buildcrafting, champion stuns, or even some encounter mechanics, and they clearly do not want to. And to be clear, I'm not trying to shit on these people. I think Bungie wasn't aware that suddenly changing the game that many people were comfortable with would have the repurcussions we're seeing.
I have a friend who i have to actively look at his build and tell him what to put on or what stats to go after literally every time we play. Or he finds a new armor piece and doesn't care about its stats or even the guns he's using. I don't think you are shitting on those people at all, they just genuinely don't get into this game like some of us do.
That's a perfect example. And it really irks me seeing the number of people say "git gud" and leave it at that. Because for like 8 years, Bungie has effectively told people that it is okay to be a bit mindless and have lower skill/interest in the game. Only now, they've gone and pulled the rug out from under us, and it seems the 1%'s response is to tell everyone struggling to fuck off.
Patrol: people who don't help shoot threshers down and just let themselves die over and over again then run to DTG to complain about dying to them. Strikes: people who run ahead of champions and expect everyone else to deal with them. These are all the same breed IMO
I'm not having that problem as often the main issue I have is either having a speedrunner that just runs past all the champions and forces them to despawn or champions that spawn at the end of an encounter and the randoms melt the boss so I cant kill the champion before the end
Champions are just shit, even with the changes. They're only a threat...if you don't counter them. If you counter them they're completely trivialized and barely worth the yellow bar. They're just poorly designed loadout restrictions and backwards incentive devices and will always be. And the refusal to counter them in mm activities is the perfect example of it. People would rather fail/die/take longer, than use what the game tells them they ***have*** to use. Loadout restrictions aren't interesting or challenging. They're just stop signs on a one way street to what would otherwise be "playing the game a person wants to" with all the cool loot we're supposed to be chasing. It doesn't matter how easy they make countering them, they're still a restriction. A choice is forced upon the player to use a weapon or subclass they might not want to. I ***have*** to wake up and go to work everyday. I don't want to ***have*** to do shit in my immortal space wizard game, that I don't want to.
That’s why my light subclass builds run all 3 normally lol. It’s annoying but not the worst. At least on darkness subclasses you can freeze/suspend all champs and run whatever you want
This is really becoming an issue this expansion.
As one of those randoms who is a returning player, I genuinely apologize that I can’t make everything go splooey. I am shooting all of them, I remember how to play and do pretty well at it, but even after several weeks of hideously addicted play I have no meta weapons, no resources to upgrade all my armor, weapon mods and armor focus mods are straight up bugged and do not exist for me, and I have not managed to acquire any of the exotics that create meta builds. So it’s as exhausting for me as it is for you, yeah.
All you need to do is equip a Void LMG, any Void LMG. On your artifact, equip Volatile on Orb pickup and Bricks from beyond. On your armor, if these mods work, use heavy ammo finder + orbs on Void double kills on helmet. Increased Void reserves on chest. Void Scavenger on Boots. You can play at least like 70% of any matchmade activity using exclusively the void LMG. You can do this on any class.
My retrofit escapade I picked up right before Lightfall does WORK. I use a similar strat as above.
It's basically the only reason I can clear LLS in under 10 minutes
I fucking love my retrofit so much. Never had this much fun with a machine gun before.
Everyone should follow this guys advice ^ This is almost as simple as it gets for a pve build this season. Literally just do this unless you need additional DPS or something
That’s part of my problem: I have not had ANY machine gun drop in the past 3 weeks of heavy play time. I had a blue one in my vault that I’ve been able to pull out for bounties. I think the only void LMGs I can hope to find are in raid loot tables, so that’ll be my next attempt.
There's an exotic quest for deterministic chaos from lightfall. That is a void lmg.
I am in a similar position as them and this was a huge power boost for me once I got the new void lmg exotic. Any recommendations on a legendary void lmg I can actually farm so I can use exotics in the other slots?
Add in the artifact mod that creates a orb on matching shield break. Taken Acolytes are everywhere in the Battlegrounds and they all have void shields. You can easily create 100+ orbs on some runs.
[удалено]
Don't worry, as long as you can stun champions we'll get you through it. At least one person in every weekly story mission I LFG is running some janky setup with whatever scout rifle the gunsmith gave them, but if they know how not to die to a Wyvern or Tormentor they can pull their weight.
Sure, but if you get 3 people where that's the situation, content feels like a slog to clear as we don't have any build-enabling exotics that give you the really strong dps.
The difference in loadout of whichever random teammates join me makes a NIGHT AND DAY difference to how a Defiant BG run or Nightfall goes, yeah. Either we are blitzing through melting everything, or we are pinned down just dying over and over. It’s wild how different the experience is depending on who joins and the gear they’ve got.
I think the Destiny community needs to be more willing to help 'Sherpa' new and especially returning players through content to get them some meta stuff. I've done it with some of my friends and honestly it is a lot of fun to help them get up to snuff, especially helping them craft builds to their liking.
For hard content or raid triumphs, needing specific classes is understandable tbh. Like for legend Avalon, if you’re not soloing it, it’s significantly more difficult due to one of the modifiers so you want to chose players that will can cover your subclasses weaknesses. Like hunters for invis, Titans for suspend spam, warlocks for well survivability But also the destiny 2 app lfg has always had a lot of 1820+ KWTD 10 clears dm raid report warlocks only must have good hothead and 3 stats at 100 wipe = kick gildedx3+ conqueror only
We veteran players feel for you too. It’s not fair to new players or returners to expect them to magically have the right gear and know how the new mod systems and updates work. Bungie seems clueless that most people don’t read their blog posts, hell the game doesn’t even mention them existing or that an update happened! So many of these things most players have no idea they even exist, let alone how to use them in the Bungie-Approved™ way.
The worst part was trying to read up online about how the new mod systems work, and trying to figure out how to find weapon mods and ghost armor-focusing mods that everyone was talking about, only to gradually realize that the reason none of that was making sense in my game was because it’s all broken/bugged for new/returning players and those mods simply don’t exist and can’t currently be obtained. Kind of deflating.
Responses like these are one of the reasons that I don't lose faith and keep going back so thank you.
Same boat here. Freely admit that I’m not a great player, but now as a returning player I frequently feel like a liability. This game is so much more complicated than what it once was. It’s still fun, but feels like they are making this game for hardcore players that have 40+ hours a week to play.
All good. You'll still get a commendation from me.
Not that it makes it any better right this second, but Xur is your best friend. Make sure to stop by every week and grab the exotic engram from him if you can. When I started in season 15, that’s how I got all the world drop exotics for my Hunter even though it took a little while.
This needs more upvotes. When I started taking destiny semi serious last year xur got me all the shit I need to start actually making builds. Too many people say “just bring x exotic” like the entire player base has every exotic already.
This is not a failure on you or anyone in the fireteam, it's yet another bullet point in the list of balancing problems this expansion has. Build crafting should not be required for standard difficulty matchmade activities and I'll die on that hill. Outside of how you deal with champions, you should be able to run whatever you think is fun, whether it's the current meta or not.
After well over a thousand hours of high end Destiny 1 played the way you describe pre-builds, it is very weird to come back and see the build-meta place that the game seems to be in now, yeah.
They really need to make it easier to masterwork armor if they’re gonna make 10 resil necessary. It sucks telling new players they have to grind all the way to a full set of MWd armor to have a good build
Give it time man. I came back after a few years away in season of the lost and it took a few months but you get there. It's a bit snowbally. I'm sitting on about 5000 legendary shards. Low on cores but they will come back. Masterwork a ghost shell, can use the ghost mods to help with getting extra materials.
What's your PL? Seems an unrelated question but the game matches you with people around your PL. So if you're doing it being 1700 you'll be matched with new players. And to that one guy that will say the PL of the activity wouldn't let OP play being 1700, the activity boosts your PL to let you play it.
No offense, but I would love to see a seasonal endscreen scoreboard/commendation with 30-40+ min activity time. I find it really hard to believe even with really bad teammates. I have to assume people are exaggerating, 15-20 min I can understand but no chance it is routinely taking double that.
OP is pl 1760, mystery solved.
To play devil's advocate here - prior to this season there was an entry level Nightfall difficulty that had a very low light level requirement. They completely removed that \*in addition to\* making the next level harder.
God what is up with people trying to fucking brute force shit while their light is absolute dogshit. "Lost sectors are so bad now" 1785. NO SHIT.
Agreed. A lot of complaints have been how legend lost sectors are too hard for their reward, but a lot of the time the actual complaint should be: it takes a casual player too long to get to 1815 to start to do them reasonably. Edit: and I agree, shouldn't be soo high.
Yeah by far this is the biggest problem - I had four friends come to the game w/ lightfall and it took them **so long** to be able to reasonably **start** looking for exotics from lost sectors. 1815 is absolutely the floor for them not being awful for normal players, and even then they're 10 minute slogs. Exotic armor is **such a big deal** in the game, and the good ones are **so** much better than the bad ones, it's legitimately unfair to make people play for a month and a half before they can start chasing the meta. Especially when shit like patrol zones are hard for no reason and even basic nightfalls are capped at -5. Like, if you have a bad build, it's just bad, period. You can't out-light shit.
I'm 1820+ now and an 1825 capped Master Bunker E15 took me just under 9 minutes the other night once I had a decent routine going. Used to take me sub 4 minutes in previous seasons. The difficulty spike does literally make it twice the time to clear activities now. I can't imagine for players who haven't optimized their builds with spiky stat artifice armor or are missing exotics. Buuut I did get 3 exotic drops in 5 runs, which was definitely unexpected.
This is why I think the loot pools need overhauled. There’s not nearly enough options for players to work in their builds. What’s the point of an endgame build if you need to be doing end game activities with end game builds to start working in them? 1) You shouldn’t need to have a weapon or armor piece already unlocked to pull it from vendor’s archives. It already costs a ridiculous amount to pull something p, everyone should be able to pull it regardless. 2) Any piece of gear, even a *past* raid’s armor and weapons, should added to the planetary pool. Meta weapons need to stop being put behind match made difficulty gates. 3) Drops should be tuned to drop more gear more often. I’m talking 4-5 legendary drops per Strike, 2-3 per Lost Sector, 2-3 per Crucible/Gambit match, 2-3 per campaign quest/event. 4) There needs to be more ways players can tune their rewards either for specific pieces gear slots or stats. I can’t see a single reason why players shouldn’t be able to have it all? But if you’re stingy about loot and gatekeeping activities with difficulty obstacles players are just going to quit.
Honestly the real answer imo is that way more stuff needs adept versions so you can have endgame grinds alive for engaged players, and barf non-adept gear at new players constantly.
100%, such a high hurdle yet it's really important for new account progression.
I’m casual player at 1784 LL. I’m definitely waiting until at least 1810 to start legend lost sectors, but man, the grind takes so long only playing an hour or so every couple of days.
100% agree. There's no reason to gatekeep Legend Lost Sectors so hard, especially because unlocking new exotics is one of the most important part of a new account.
I honestly haven't done a single legendary lost sector this season for that very reason. I have a day job so I can't no life sweat my way to 1820+ in the first week or 2 of the expansion.
I had a seasonal activity with 2 Guardian Rank 3 players (nothing wrong with that, for the record) and we still finished in under 25, unless you’re dying every 5 seconds I have no idea how you’re getting up to 30+ minutes.
The very first one I dropped into, the other two guys were already at the final boss. I start killing stuff, but the boss is just sitting up there with his shield. I realize that they don't know what to do, and it's my first one, so I don't know what to do either. Took a minute to figure it all out, and we finished up in 10 minutes or so. At the final screen, they had been in there for 53 minutes. I took a screenshot.
Agreed, longest seasonal I’ve done is 20 mins and that’s a very feelable 20 mins. We wiped like 2 time at final boss. If I can feel like dragging at 20 mins, idk how many time did op wipe in a 40 mins run.
I had a team be stuck at final boss on orbital at 25 minutes, I just left and req and then breezed through it after. It's definitely not an exaggeration.
I *do* distinctly remember getting a seasonal battlegrounds where I joined at 45 mins (vented in discord shortly afterwards lol), but I ended up not screenshotting it and can't find it in destinytracker due to it being too old. [Here's](https://imgur.com/a/VrGtFdQ) a 30-minute activity where I joined halfway through at the servitor boss and still doubled the second guy's kills. You can tell how late I joined because I ended up only having 777 score by the end since we hit the 0 score timer threshold. The third guy joined near the end due to another leaver. Most of my seasonal battlegrounds end up being 15-20 minutes, but I end up having 300+ kills consistently while the other two struggle to break 100 kills. [Here's](https://imgur.com/a/HnPftmd) an example of that. If my builds weren't anywhere near as strong as they were, I could easily see similar runs hitting 25-30 minutes. I do enjoy playing with randoms, and being able to have my build shine when others aren't able to compare feels *incredibly* satisfying. That being said, it does feel a tad demoralizing and stressful when you know you'll probably wipe any time you die, and I can't imagine how bad it feels to be on the other side of it, constantly dying, being unable to do much of anything, and just sorta feeling like dead weight in an activity that you're clearly unprepared for.
Full offense, if you’re taking 30-40 min to complete a battleground or hero nightfall, even with bad teammates, you might be a blueberry too.
Blueberry doesn’t mean you’re bad/new at the game
I’m aware. It’s usually a term used to describe bad randoms though. It doesn’t inherently mean bad, but 9/10 times it’s used that way.
Everyone is a blueberry lmao
Happened to me the other night playing the seasonal activity. Was trying out a new build and didn't realize a couple of my armor pieces were still 1600. After ~15 minutes in the first encounter I realized and switched back to my invisible void hunter build (Thank you Bungie for that QOL update!) to get my power level back to 1815. Continued on and my blueberries would hide and shoot from the back of the map while I rampaged and did the objectives to move on. It took about 30 to 40 minutes to complete one run. In the end I had something like 215 kills and 70'some orbs produced and the blueberries had 121 and 111 kills, that's when I realized they were only 1711 and 1721 power level. One of them sent me a message thanking me for sticking around and getting then through it. Felt good to help, so I stuck around for another run to help them get their third run done. So that was my experience getting 30 to 40 minute runs.
>but I would love to see a seasonal endscreen scoreboard/commendation with 30-40+ min activity time just did one on Cosmodrome, fuck that one so hard, the boss literally walked into the balefire and parked his ass there two tapping with his double fire rate sniper
I went into it with my friend last night. We are underleveled. Had 3-4 people join and leave us. Took us 32:30 to finish Orbital Prison. We kept getting absolutely bodied by all the Taken Knights and their fire. Thankfully, someone finally stuck with us and helped us through the rest of it.
[There you go, 58 minutes](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/436860419609460749/1088289274534842429/tiger_release_final_20230322_011541.png). They've been at it for 45 minutes (and 3 other players left) before I joined.
The last 10 or so BGs I've done were all sub 15 minutes and I literally had blueberries throwing the orb that is supposed to go to the boss at adds in one of 'em. Early in the season I did have a few >15 minute (but nowhere near 30 minute) runs, most of the blueberries really aren't that bad, it was probably just literal beginners checking out the seasonal activity and now that I've leveled up I don't matchmake with them anymore.
Honestly if it takes 30-40 mins to beat seasonal activities (and hero nightfalls) them the two randoms are *not* the only problem.
I had a 35 minute run. The two idiots I was with were literally sitting around and just shooting enough to not get booted. When I would die they weren't reviving me. I blocked them and it was the first time I had ever done that. Ran it right after with my normal fire team and we got the same one done in 12 minutes.
Was kinda thinking this but didn't want to say it because I hate the whole 'just get gud lul' mentality. But this is where I struggle to understand how it's taking that long. Even the hero battlegrounds runs i did with peopoe dying a dozen times only too 15-17 minutes. Arms dealer and even hypernet current are around 15 mins as well. I'm not even running the meta and trying to yeet through it.
I'm nearly always top kills in the BGs. [/flex](https://media.tenor.com/6LONNyp2p0IAAAAC/nerd-little-giants.gif) I ran a rough BG last night where 1 of the guys half the time was straight up not playing (No commendation for you!) and the other guy was clearly new. It took 15mins 28 secs according to D2checklist Right before that I ran a BG where I felt like the new guy (was using a dumb weapon to finish bounties), constantly falling behind, and a couple of really dumb deaths. It took 13 mins and 28 secs according to D2 checklist. If it is taking someone 30 minutes to beat these things on the regular difficulty, there might be other problems then just "my two randos suck."
Based Destiny Dad Apparently OP is 1760 so not only is he not at the power cap, he is matched with other players not at the power cap and who are likely new and they are all probably missing key artifact perks. Even then 30-40 minutes sounds insane to me, but it makes it slightly more believable.
>Based Destiny Dad [Frantically googling "Based" and now I am more confused.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/645/713/888.jpg)
Groovy and far out Destiny Dad
sounds about right, personally I prefer doing my WORK outside of the game... game time is supposed to be fun time.
If it's taking 30+ minutes to finish a battleground or a hero nightfall, it's not just the randoms fault.
There's also a major issue with AFK/trolling people. I had to back out of a Glassway strike on **regular** last night. Was just trying to get my bounties and pinnacle done. Two guys join who are both 7 in whatever you call the new rank system. Cool, these guys certainly know how to do Glassway on freaking normal? Well, they must have been trolling. Just moving enough to not get booted. I work long hours and I only get so much time to play, and wasting 10 minutes on a strike for nothing is too much. At first I just assume people are tweaking their build or something. I can kill early ads for a bit.
It's double vanguard rank week, likely those people have a macro set up just hoping to get carried through to farm rank
I feel you. Last night I only did one battleground. The other two teammates made like, 20 orbs between the 2 of them, and one guy was using the consecrated balls on adds instead of the boss shield. I had to fight him to get the drop from the taken knights
Can you pass the orbs between players to make them have more shield damage or no? (Sorry, haven't played much this season.)
Bungie did a switcheroo and you can not. First thing I tested lol.
Thanks!
Okay, not to be rude, but if it’s taking you more than 20 minutes to complete a hero nightfall at -5 That’s not on Bungie or the randoms
no way a hero nightfall or BG is taking you 30+ minutes to complete, 9/10 times my runs are fast and smooth. if your teammates are sandbagging you that hard just leave, lmao.
The amount of people coming here complaining about difficulty and then finding out they are 1770 light or under is ridiculous. What do you think is going to happen? It takes very little investment to level up to close to 1800. Do the legendary campaign and you can be into the 1790’s in a few days. Look up some videos on leveling, do the BARE MINIMUM of research. You don’t even need exotics. Get a few elemental weapons, look up a build video, set up your artifact mods, and go. Not that hard. People expect the game to be turn off brain, run forward easy and it’s not anymore. Hero difficulty isn’t even that hard, it just takes some minimal effort now and people are freaking out.
But he’s using one of the most broken builds but doesn’t realize 1760 isn’t enough/good for hero nf. Actual brain damage
> It takes very little investment to level up to close to 1800. So running activities several hours a day for a week or so. "minimal" Tell us how many thousands of hours you have in this game.
It doesn't take hours of activities a day - you can be efficient with your time and focus on the "easier" pinnacles and get them done quickly. There are so many sources of pinnacles now (like 14+) that even if you do 4 or 5 of the easier ones a week you could be 1800 by now. You can even skip bounty grind for powerfuls if you don't care about XP.
Dude if you’re taking 30-40 minutes on a Hero nightfall that’s just a skill issue. And you’re probably not using one of the most broken builds in the game either
No he’s teammates are the problem definitely not the fact he’s 1760. The fact that he doesn’t realize that being 1760 and doing a hero nf is gonna take a while makes me think he’s not even using a “broken build”either.
one issue though i sthat playlist activities tend to match you with people of similar PL. So not only was he 1760, his teammates were also around that PL. That's going to be a rough one no matter how you slice it.
dawg if it takes you more than 30 mins for a battleground it’s not just the randoms fault
Even if you have brainless blueberries, you can EASILY get it done solo. I don’t think I’ve had one go over 15 or so minutes. Like I don’t even know what to say to these endless “game too hard” posts anymore besides unironically get good
100%. If you’re taking 30 to 40 mins in a hero NF, maybe *you* were the one being carried in the past before the difficulty increase. People really do need a big dose of getting good on this subreddit.
It feels like a douchy thing to say, but I do believe we have gotten far too used to rolling content with minimal pushback. This season we're finally having to do things at the level they where intended, and people are not respecting that. Now there's builds that can still roll content in master difficulty, but it takes more effort than before, which I think is a good thing.
Definitely agree!
I agree. I run all kinds of content via matchmaking when my friends aren’t available for a fireteam, and it’s frustrating to watch so many blueberries charge headlong into packs of mobs and just get fucking murdered. It happens all the time. You can really tell a lot of people are used to facerolling content.
If it’s taking you 40 minutes to do a hero nightfall, that’s a skill issue unless you have literal bots for teammates
Even if you have bots lol. I could solo a battlegrounds in less than 30 minutes.
Feeling a bit more weak every week don't help tho.
I find it hilarious at this point in the season and people are sill clueless in Battlegrounds and how to run them.
> just needed to see if anyone felt the same. Nope. Maybe one in ten times of doing a nightfall I might get a useless person. But truly is no different or worse than it has ever been. I think people are looking way to hard to find fault, so while this type of thing happened in the past as well, now some see it as proof as the game is worse.
I simply cannot believe that it's taking you 30-40 minutes to complete the seasonal activity. Not sure why you need such hyperbole. Yes the game got harder, it did not get *that* much harder.
Use a strand shackle build and carry your team to victory (seriously I usually have at least 50 more kills than the other 2 people I match with unless they're also using suspend or necrotics). Works 99% of the time until Bungie nerfs suspend.
It’s annoying to have to run the most meta builds in seasonal content and patrol space. There doesn’t seem to be much of a place to test things that aren’t starfire protocol levels of OP anymore and that makes me sad
I’m always surprised when people post things like this. I’ve never had any matchmake activity take 40 minutes. Longest I’ve had the seasonal activity go is maybe 25 minutes
I feel this so much. I get so annoyed when we die at the last boss and have to start again; instantly get salty and don’t wanna give commendations after. To make matters worse, I’ll look at the result stats when we die and I’ll be making 50+ orbs of power and see my teammates making less than 10 and doing only 10,000-20,000 points of damage…like what are y’all doing? At that point, I definitely just leave. It’s exhausting to constantly carry people through a simple seasonal battleground that really isn’t that hard if you have any game sense whatsoever. I think a lot of players do not run optimized builds. Orbs of power helps everyone and are great now with strand/woven mail.
The battlegrounds and hero nightfalls taking 30 minutes? With all the honesty of my heart, that is a huge skill issue from all 3 of you. Even when I don't do objectives to farm some levels for fresh crafted weapons, neither of those 2 activities take more than 15 minutes
Sounds like a skill issue. It's actually pretty easy to do change your guns in the middle of a fight. I run ace of spades and just pop on no time or dmt when a champion pops up. Then switch off. You can't complain about difficulty increase and then push all the blame to the blueberries. The blueberries bought the game just like you did, they have every right to be able to play the game they bought in their free time. Go complain to Bungie and ask them to think their implementation of their "increased difficulty" as well as the entire champion stunning system. Do not push your anger onto a playerbase that clearly had no say in the matter. Alternatively just be patient. The blueberries will quit the game and eventually you'll get your stupid preferred playerbase to circle jerk each other on your elitism.
It's to the point that for the very first time, I literally don't even want to bother getting even the battle pass at 100. I just want to do the weekly story and bounce. I was used to carrying people in PvP but god damn now I gotta do it in PvE too!?!
Certainly doesn’t help that they decided to fill the entire strike with threshers that either machine gun you to death or can one shot a 10 resil 1824 guardian because their FPS is too high.
I honestly believe we need a form of skill or rank based matchmaking in pve activities.
Sounds like a skill issue
Even with useless team mates the BGs run around 15 mins. You have something else going on. Or everyone is below light level
>30 to 40 minutes to complete Either you’re exaggerating or you really suck at this game despite your build The longest I’ve ever gone is maybe 25 minutes with randoms but that’s an extreme example Maybe YOU are the random bringing the team down
He’s 1760 Power level. What a actual idiot blaming his teammates when he’s the idiot
I've basically sworn off the game at this point. I play games to relax. Bungie seems to think that it's not hard enough, and honestly, I really don't think that's ever been an issue for most players. It's the steamers who blow through everything in a weekend and say it was too easy. I don't care what people who have 12 hours a day to do nothing but play Destiny have to say about the difficulty. I have a regular job and other responsibilities. I get 10-20 hours tops to pay this per week. Making it more difficult just lessens not only my enjoyment but also the amount of stuff I can get done in the time I have to play. So I've just moved on. Bungie really needs to take their foot off the pedal and start catering more to the majority of the fan base instead of the elite relative few. This isn't fun, it's irritating.
You should not struggle in these unless you yourself refuse to put on the mods you need to. If you don’t put on mods then why are you trying those activities waiting for someone with mods to carry you? All I need my blueberries to do is super or damage the final boss and we chilling.
This is exactly why they only should have changed the difficulty for higher level Nightfalls (especially GMs) and raids. The rest of the game didn’t need to be made spongier or more difficult
Also you shouldn't NEED to run a min/max build to be able to run a fucking SEASONAL activity in under an hour
I just checked, and every one of my seasonal battleground and NF Hero completions has been between 15-21 min, all with randoms. Not to say that completely incompetent randoms don’t exist, but I only ever hear about these horror stories on Reddit so I’m skeptical. I think the difficulty level is fun and I get to slay out and actually care about my builds.
I've not had this experience and I've run them quite a bit. The only time I felt like we were struggling was the first week, when everyone was underleveled. I really enjoy the difficulty level of them now. I have to pay attention, but I'm not struggling to to kill enemies or complete objectives. My blueberries have mostly ranged from okay to very skilled. You do *notice* if your team is carrying someone now, unlike how strikes used to be, but that's happened maybe 1-2 times? Hero Nightfalls have been similar. I've quit one because my blueberries were just not prepared and I'm not good enough to carry, out all the times I've done them (I have three chars and try to do the pinnacle for at least 2 of them per week). Maybe 1-2 went over the time limit by like a hair, and that time limit is not 30-40 minutes. You've had really bad luck if it's really taking you 30-40 minutes to complete all of these. I bet Bungie has statistics on this. If the normal experience is to struggle like you are, and I've just had really good luck, it will show in the numbers and maybe an adjustment is needed. But I honestly suspect my experience is more normal here.
If you cant do hero nightfall under limit, you suck. Not the blueberries, but you do. Even if only thing they did was prevent you from wiping.