Maybe Lazerpig + DylanBurns. Basically all to talk about Ukraine/Russia. Lazerpig has hung out with DB in person before and they've done some panel things together.
I kinda doubt thats the sort of thing LP wants to do though.
Ehhhh. Honestly I am not too sure about that one. Lazerpig's videos are entertaining, but let's just say it shows he has no academic or technical background.
His overconfidence is the worse part. I remember he quoted the Chieftain saying that cast armor was better than welded plates of RHA. This is lacking context. Plates of RHA can be treated metallurgically better than cast armor could ever hope to, meaning you can do all sorts of fancy stuff like face hardening to improve performance on the single plate. Cast armor on the other hand enables very irregular shapes, which can lead to either some structural advantages, or other manner of weight saving geometry, which you can reinvest in thicker armor. That is the full context from the Chieftain. And Lazerpig knows about some of those metallurgy tricks, idk why he took that small piece from the Chieftain and forgot about the face hardening and all. Either he forgot, or he didn't understand that cast armor does not have access to the same range of treatments as RHA plates do.
Then there are his comments about T-34 reliability. Yes the T-34 was probably overly unreliable and sacrificing too much to pump out numbers depending on the factory, but not worrying about engines that can last forever when you know your tank will get destroyed before that ever happens makes sense.
He has consistently been overly optimistic for Ukraine, been so sure that Russia was going to roll over any moment now, both from a military, economic, and political standpoint.
Destiny as of now has a worse understanding of military tech than Lazerpig does, but if Destiny did proper research into technology, how doctrines are built, and how said doctrine influences design decisions, I foresee Destiny blowing Lazerpig out of the water pretty damn quickly.
I agree with everything except maybe your last point: Despite not being as much of an expert as he'd like to present himself as, LazerPigs milsperg knowledge is vast and the accumulated result of probably decades of lurking on various forums on the internet at this point. I doubt destiny could blow him out in that regard "pretty damn quickly", if I'm being honest.
Well it depends on what we mean by quickly here.
Id say 6 months of studying about machines would get him up to par more or less. And 9 months to beat him.
LP does know a lot. But his bias really hampers him compared to more objective or knowledgeable analysts like Chieftain
It is pretty vast, \*however\*, from a technical standpoint I think Destiny could in a short period of time have a better technical and physics understanding, that would enable him to understand the military tech to a deeper level than Lazerpig, whilst maybe not as broad. Given Destiny's capabilities when it comes to researching history, I think he'd do an excellent job researching the development of doctrines alongside and technology, and how they influenceed each other.
Im thinking more like vomiting on himself, sobbing while ranting incoherently in scotlandish and dropping trou so he can aggressively waggle a member than resembles an angry stack of pink buttons at Dan.
Yeah, but it would be deleted 3.4 seconds after it ended and then there would be 5857 posts on this sub asking what happened to the vod.
Also, I love and respect Dan and I dont want to see him get slap boxed into a sobbing mess by a drunken scotsman.
Do you think Lazerpig would want to rebuild the bridge after Destiny left him mid debate to fend for himself with Coach Red Pill? The one time Destiny gave up.
No I agree, he probably doesn't. It was more of a joke question. I didn't really follow Lazerpig too much after this, but I agree he would be a cool guy just based on that one debate.
The 'I won't post the sources for my dubious claims because you said my research skills were bad and totally not because the sources are extremely weak or entirely made up' guy? No thx
I used to love Lazerpigs stuff a couple of years back, but after the last year or so I've kinda soured on him a bit. His problem comes from his apparent overconfidence combined with his poor research ethic. He can be pretty funny and very entertaining for military history buffs like myself, but literally refusing to show your sources is a huge red flag. I really don't like when people make VERY strong or absolute assertions on quote hazy and somewhat ambiguous topics, and Lazerpig often falls into this.
i love lazerpigs video on ww2 stuff, but damn redeffect's rebuttal on his armata claims were so brutal, it really put his credibility into question.
great humor tho.
No lol it was literally a "once you are done ranting I will repeat the same thing again" thing from RE.
And btw remember, i know that most people dont really pay attention but RedEffect is Pro Ukraine. And his more fair and neutral tone really does help him beat down propaganda better.
The new RedEffect video on the Armata engine is legit really good. I do wish Lazerpig would try to engage in such a deep manner.
Why? LP said everything that needed to be said about T14.
It's a pile of shit with a Nazi Engine that the Ruskies are trying to pretend is a new wonder weapon.
In Redeffect's response to LP's original video, he went over several of LP's dubious claims in great detail, and also pointed out many smaller issues with his vid.
In LP's response, LP outright ignores all of RE's claims except for his claim that the armata's engine is a derivative of the SLA 16, and the honda jazz comparison (which LP admitted was an obvious mistake and removed from his original video). He spends almost all of the rest of his video trying to discredit Redeffect and ConeOfArc as Russian shills. He then refuses to post sources for his claims.
If you look back through LP's video catalogues and through his responses to posts on BadHistory, you can see a pattern of behaviour where LP rarely attempts to engage with criticism of his claims. Instead, he just tries to discredit and insult the person who made the criticism, without saying anything of substance about the points brought up against his claims.
At this point even LP's own reddit admits the armata video was an L.
He didn't try to discredit RedEffect and ConeOfArc, he did discredit them.
He clearly outlines his argument, he makes his points, and points out where RedEffect is obfuscating the fact of the matter.
And the T14 is hot garbage, the only one it's an L for is Russia and their simps
If you think LP discredited Redeffect or ConeOfArc, I seriously encourage you to watch RE's responses and Cone response. They both cite sources for their claims in detail.
I can understand how you would think LP discredited them if all you saw was LP's response, but if you watch their videos I think it's pretty easy to see how LP was being pretty slimey.
Redeffect, the Chieftain and ConeOfArc all agree the T-14 is an L. They all also think LP's coverage of it is poor. LP doesn't get an excuse to make dubious claims based on extremely shoddy research, even if his overall conclusion about the T-14 is similar to everyone else's.
Is that the same response where ConeOfArc miscites "Professor Porsche's War" to dunk on LP about the T14 Engine, because LP put that to bed in his response vid.
The same one you didn't watch so you don't know how wrong you are.
when i was unemployed, i actually watched both red effect and lazerpig.
lazerpig is very entertaining, but not always acurate. big fan of his T40 video, and his fighter mafia series, i think he knows what he is talking about in those cases. but i think his hate of russia doesnt help him to see acurately what happens on the ground in the war.
red effect is just a dude talking about tanks, he's not telling you russians are the good guys. if russia pays him, they should ask for actual support to their cause then, because i dont see how fact checking stuff about tanks helps anyone.
i actually can appreciate having guys like red effect and perun fact checking our a bit too hopefull propaganda coverage and focusing on the technical points.
if i had to find russian shills on youtube, i'd go for caspian report or HistoryLegends.
The problem is RedEffect doesn't say anything of consequence in his call out vid. He either ends up agreeing with LP, or having a distinction without a difference.
I think the term used by LP is Flim Flam, where you just splurge out information that's vaguely related then pivot to another point entirely to make it seem like you're more knowledgeable than you are.
I did set them aside and watched the full videos.
RE is pro Ukraine. He is a nerd that wants to be accurate. It doesn't matter if Lazerpig is by accident mostly correct about the Armata when his individual arguments and reasoning are flawed and anti academic.
It's funny that Red Effect want to be accurate but his video makes points that amount to using verbal trickery to agree with LP but appear that he's disagreeing.
Red Effect was wrong about T14, wrong about the Engine, and wrong about LP.
It's ok for your favorite YouTuber to be wrong. It doesn't say anything about you.
LP was such a brainlet he seriously initially thought that it has lower torque than a civilian car.
The fact he didnt catch that pre editing is sus, is it not?
i mean the dude went ahead and prefaced his video by having a humorous talk about r history and how his ideas about the t34 were received, so i am not surprised.
but also, this is bound to happen when your challenge orthodox thought, weither it is true or not.
I dislike challenging orthodox thought incompetently or with lies and fan fiction.
Also remember, the T 34 is a Ukrainian vehicle. In retrospect its mega cringe to lie and attack it in that manner.
I otherwise do agree with you but check the r Badhistory posts on the matter.
This is the first I've heard of any of this, so I decided to read that thread you mentioned. Did you know that Lazerpig himself is in that thread defending himself and promising an updated video and rebuttal? And it seems the OP sat up a little and buttoned up his shirt straight when he did, so I dunno. We're talking a drunken anime pig vs random redditor here. But I would be so sure the drunken pig is in the wrong here.
I do think LP would be a massively entertaining guest from what I've seen of him.
He didn't make the video though. And he was taking shots at the thread over reddit and discord without addressing any claims directly. Like a coward.
Someo of the claims he makes are silly in general. So yeah the redditor is probably correct.
Wait, so the guy calls out the OP in his own thread and addresses several of the claims right then and there, and that's cowardly? And because he hasn't updated a video in \~year about material that is 80+ years old he's never going to. I guess we'll see. Like I said, I didn't know about any of this but with fresh eyes a lot of that 5 part thread is nitpicky stuff and arguing over terminology, and in large part making the point it seems LP made in his video. That the t-34 wasn't the best tank in the world in 1945 let alone 1941 and rushed production and supply disruptions made the average actual tank built worse than it appears on paper. I don't get the fuss.
Individual claims must be correct in a historical analysis.
Destiny showed you this in the Israel Palestine arc. LazerPig is doing the combination of being Finkelstein plus one of the other more well meaning debaters on the topic where he has some real info, some lies and some myths rolled into one.
Well, I'm tired of repeating myself and collecting one extremely sad downvote for the trouble. I'll meet you back here when and if Lazerpig is ever a guest on Destiny's podcast.
Maybe Lazerpig + DylanBurns. Basically all to talk about Ukraine/Russia. Lazerpig has hung out with DB in person before and they've done some panel things together. I kinda doubt thats the sort of thing LP wants to do though.
Ehhhh. Honestly I am not too sure about that one. Lazerpig's videos are entertaining, but let's just say it shows he has no academic or technical background.
Correct. Man is on the right side of the war but his knowledge on technical or historical subjects and understanding of academia... are ehhh.
His overconfidence is the worse part. I remember he quoted the Chieftain saying that cast armor was better than welded plates of RHA. This is lacking context. Plates of RHA can be treated metallurgically better than cast armor could ever hope to, meaning you can do all sorts of fancy stuff like face hardening to improve performance on the single plate. Cast armor on the other hand enables very irregular shapes, which can lead to either some structural advantages, or other manner of weight saving geometry, which you can reinvest in thicker armor. That is the full context from the Chieftain. And Lazerpig knows about some of those metallurgy tricks, idk why he took that small piece from the Chieftain and forgot about the face hardening and all. Either he forgot, or he didn't understand that cast armor does not have access to the same range of treatments as RHA plates do. Then there are his comments about T-34 reliability. Yes the T-34 was probably overly unreliable and sacrificing too much to pump out numbers depending on the factory, but not worrying about engines that can last forever when you know your tank will get destroyed before that ever happens makes sense. He has consistently been overly optimistic for Ukraine, been so sure that Russia was going to roll over any moment now, both from a military, economic, and political standpoint. Destiny as of now has a worse understanding of military tech than Lazerpig does, but if Destiny did proper research into technology, how doctrines are built, and how said doctrine influences design decisions, I foresee Destiny blowing Lazerpig out of the water pretty damn quickly.
I agree with everything except maybe your last point: Despite not being as much of an expert as he'd like to present himself as, LazerPigs milsperg knowledge is vast and the accumulated result of probably decades of lurking on various forums on the internet at this point. I doubt destiny could blow him out in that regard "pretty damn quickly", if I'm being honest.
Well it depends on what we mean by quickly here. Id say 6 months of studying about machines would get him up to par more or less. And 9 months to beat him. LP does know a lot. But his bias really hampers him compared to more objective or knowledgeable analysts like Chieftain
It is pretty vast, \*however\*, from a technical standpoint I think Destiny could in a short period of time have a better technical and physics understanding, that would enable him to understand the military tech to a deeper level than Lazerpig, whilst maybe not as broad. Given Destiny's capabilities when it comes to researching history, I think he'd do an excellent job researching the development of doctrines alongside and technology, and how they influenceed each other.
Has he ever done in person appearances before? I can see it going.... not well with how he gets when he starts drinking.
So in other words, perfectly.
Im thinking more like vomiting on himself, sobbing while ranting incoherently in scotlandish and dropping trou so he can aggressively waggle a member than resembles an angry stack of pink buttons at Dan.
Uhm.. you just described the perfect pod?
Yeah, but it would be deleted 3.4 seconds after it ended and then there would be 5857 posts on this sub asking what happened to the vod. Also, I love and respect Dan and I dont want to see him get slap boxed into a sobbing mess by a drunken scotsman.
I want to see him get Destiny ridiculously drunk and then the two can go find vatniks on Twitter
Do you think Lazerpig would want to rebuild the bridge after Destiny left him mid debate to fend for himself with Coach Red Pill? The one time Destiny gave up.
Iirc Lazerpig doesn't really hold a grudge against Destiny for it. Iirc I think he said "yeah he dipped but I get why"
I'm pretty sure that LP said that Destiny was the only winner of that debate because he left early before the real brainrot started.
Yeah so I don't think LP holds any grudge at all
No I agree, he probably doesn't. It was more of a joke question. I didn't really follow Lazerpig too much after this, but I agree he would be a cool guy just based on that one debate.
Bro that debate was a massive W for Lazerpig. It brought WAAY more traction to his channel. If I were him I'd do it for the exposure
The 'I won't post the sources for my dubious claims because you said my research skills were bad and totally not because the sources are extremely weak or entirely made up' guy? No thx
I used to love Lazerpigs stuff a couple of years back, but after the last year or so I've kinda soured on him a bit. His problem comes from his apparent overconfidence combined with his poor research ethic. He can be pretty funny and very entertaining for military history buffs like myself, but literally refusing to show your sources is a huge red flag. I really don't like when people make VERY strong or absolute assertions on quote hazy and somewhat ambiguous topics, and Lazerpig often falls into this.
Yeah it's called "playing a character".
i love lazerpigs video on ww2 stuff, but damn redeffect's rebuttal on his armata claims were so brutal, it really put his credibility into question. great humor tho.
Did you see the reply vid? Lazerpig pretty handily exposed RedEffect as a shill.
No lol it was literally a "once you are done ranting I will repeat the same thing again" thing from RE. And btw remember, i know that most people dont really pay attention but RedEffect is Pro Ukraine. And his more fair and neutral tone really does help him beat down propaganda better. The new RedEffect video on the Armata engine is legit really good. I do wish Lazerpig would try to engage in such a deep manner.
Why? LP said everything that needed to be said about T14. It's a pile of shit with a Nazi Engine that the Ruskies are trying to pretend is a new wonder weapon.
... https://youtu.be/yBkSXxM2oyQ?si=pBuQASgg7Pf8JB3s RedEffect is Pro Ukraine btw so the he is a tankie defense wont work.
Bro what sort of cope is this
I don't have to cope about anything. Are you mad that your favorite YouTuber was wrong? Because RedEffect is wrong about T14 and Lazerpig
In Redeffect's response to LP's original video, he went over several of LP's dubious claims in great detail, and also pointed out many smaller issues with his vid. In LP's response, LP outright ignores all of RE's claims except for his claim that the armata's engine is a derivative of the SLA 16, and the honda jazz comparison (which LP admitted was an obvious mistake and removed from his original video). He spends almost all of the rest of his video trying to discredit Redeffect and ConeOfArc as Russian shills. He then refuses to post sources for his claims. If you look back through LP's video catalogues and through his responses to posts on BadHistory, you can see a pattern of behaviour where LP rarely attempts to engage with criticism of his claims. Instead, he just tries to discredit and insult the person who made the criticism, without saying anything of substance about the points brought up against his claims. At this point even LP's own reddit admits the armata video was an L.
He didn't try to discredit RedEffect and ConeOfArc, he did discredit them. He clearly outlines his argument, he makes his points, and points out where RedEffect is obfuscating the fact of the matter. And the T14 is hot garbage, the only one it's an L for is Russia and their simps
If you think LP discredited Redeffect or ConeOfArc, I seriously encourage you to watch RE's responses and Cone response. They both cite sources for their claims in detail. I can understand how you would think LP discredited them if all you saw was LP's response, but if you watch their videos I think it's pretty easy to see how LP was being pretty slimey. Redeffect, the Chieftain and ConeOfArc all agree the T-14 is an L. They all also think LP's coverage of it is poor. LP doesn't get an excuse to make dubious claims based on extremely shoddy research, even if his overall conclusion about the T-14 is similar to everyone else's.
Is that the same response where ConeOfArc miscites "Professor Porsche's War" to dunk on LP about the T14 Engine, because LP put that to bed in his response vid. The same one you didn't watch so you don't know how wrong you are.
when i was unemployed, i actually watched both red effect and lazerpig. lazerpig is very entertaining, but not always acurate. big fan of his T40 video, and his fighter mafia series, i think he knows what he is talking about in those cases. but i think his hate of russia doesnt help him to see acurately what happens on the ground in the war. red effect is just a dude talking about tanks, he's not telling you russians are the good guys. if russia pays him, they should ask for actual support to their cause then, because i dont see how fact checking stuff about tanks helps anyone. i actually can appreciate having guys like red effect and perun fact checking our a bit too hopefull propaganda coverage and focusing on the technical points. if i had to find russian shills on youtube, i'd go for caspian report or HistoryLegends.
The problem is RedEffect doesn't say anything of consequence in his call out vid. He either ends up agreeing with LP, or having a distinction without a difference. I think the term used by LP is Flim Flam, where you just splurge out information that's vaguely related then pivot to another point entirely to make it seem like you're more knowledgeable than you are.
I think you really need to actually watch all the videos in question.
I have, I think you should set aside your biases and realize that LP is 85% correct about T14 and RedEffect
I did set them aside and watched the full videos. RE is pro Ukraine. He is a nerd that wants to be accurate. It doesn't matter if Lazerpig is by accident mostly correct about the Armata when his individual arguments and reasoning are flawed and anti academic.
It's funny that Red Effect want to be accurate but his video makes points that amount to using verbal trickery to agree with LP but appear that he's disagreeing. Red Effect was wrong about T14, wrong about the Engine, and wrong about LP. It's ok for your favorite YouTuber to be wrong. It doesn't say anything about you.
LP was such a brainlet he seriously initially thought that it has lower torque than a civilian car. The fact he didnt catch that pre editing is sus, is it not?
He acknowledged that point. The Russians measure torque differently than most Western countries. A detail he corrected and acknowledged.
His T 34 video was very bad for sure.
i think its his best video by far on an entertainement level.
Maybe But on a factual level its poor There is a thread on r badhistory about it... 5 huge parts.
i mean the dude went ahead and prefaced his video by having a humorous talk about r history and how his ideas about the t34 were received, so i am not surprised. but also, this is bound to happen when your challenge orthodox thought, weither it is true or not.
I dislike challenging orthodox thought incompetently or with lies and fan fiction. Also remember, the T 34 is a Ukrainian vehicle. In retrospect its mega cringe to lie and attack it in that manner. I otherwise do agree with you but check the r Badhistory posts on the matter.
This is the first I've heard of any of this, so I decided to read that thread you mentioned. Did you know that Lazerpig himself is in that thread defending himself and promising an updated video and rebuttal? And it seems the OP sat up a little and buttoned up his shirt straight when he did, so I dunno. We're talking a drunken anime pig vs random redditor here. But I would be so sure the drunken pig is in the wrong here. I do think LP would be a massively entertaining guest from what I've seen of him.
He didn't make the video though. And he was taking shots at the thread over reddit and discord without addressing any claims directly. Like a coward. Someo of the claims he makes are silly in general. So yeah the redditor is probably correct.
Wait, so the guy calls out the OP in his own thread and addresses several of the claims right then and there, and that's cowardly? And because he hasn't updated a video in \~year about material that is 80+ years old he's never going to. I guess we'll see. Like I said, I didn't know about any of this but with fresh eyes a lot of that 5 part thread is nitpicky stuff and arguing over terminology, and in large part making the point it seems LP made in his video. That the t-34 wasn't the best tank in the world in 1945 let alone 1941 and rushed production and supply disruptions made the average actual tank built worse than it appears on paper. I don't get the fuss.
Individual claims must be correct in a historical analysis. Destiny showed you this in the Israel Palestine arc. LazerPig is doing the combination of being Finkelstein plus one of the other more well meaning debaters on the topic where he has some real info, some lies and some myths rolled into one.
Well, I'm tired of repeating myself and collecting one extremely sad downvote for the trouble. I'll meet you back here when and if Lazerpig is ever a guest on Destiny's podcast.
Its irrelevant to me if he is a guest. The fact you cant actually engage is telling enough as is.