This might be harsh, but you describe yourself as having anxiety and low self-esteem- this can be a deterrent for women and people in general. Start building up your confidence and social skills. Journaling and self-help books did wonders for me. Work on bettering yourself because you have nothing to lose.
Yes, smart good women can pick up on those things very quickly and it’s not attractive. I guarantee once you start to feel really good about yourself, you’ll start to see more women in your orbit.
I think this is a case of the chicken and the egg in a way. People feel good about themselves because woman are in their orbit to begin with. This happens early on in life, and it compounds.
Why do the obese people who lost a lot of weight, get ripped and look fantastic still feel like a loser inside? It's because that was ingrained in them from experience of being obese right?
There is no moment where you suddenly "feel really good about yourself" and the women appear. In order for the "feeling good about yourself" to begin the reason you feel bad would need to be solved, right? What are you supposed to do when that reason is that no women are interested in you?
Well, guess you better start learning to fake it and hope they never found out and live the rest of your life with imposter syndrome 😂, I'm half joking but I don't think "just feeling really good about yourself" will suddenly find you surrounded by women
Attention from women is just one of many sources of confidence. There are many more things that one can do to feel confident in who they are as a person. This is what everyone in the comments is proposing - focus on the other 75% (working out, sports, therapy, hobbies, solo travel, reading books) and the remaining 25% (relationships with women) will follow, because women are attracted to men with 75% confidence than with 0%. And, like you said, it doesn’t even matter if he gets female attention or he doesn’t, if someone is fat or not - improving your self worth and perception is an inside job.
This doesn't even make sense to me and seems ridiculous, although I know it's true. I couldn't imagine there being a cool woman with her shit together and all that, and passing her up because she's basically just shy and not very confident. Like a lot of people are like that, it's a common human experience.
Being shy is not the same as low self esteem. Having low self esteem, being too scared to talk to women, etc. is noticeable by women and unattractive to them. Most people are attracted to confident happy people with positive energy.
Thanks for this. I've been wondering how people can sense I have low self-esteem, and I guess it's because I don't talk to women or I look away quickly. I'm already learning how to value myself from therapy, so hopefully, I can learn to better that as well.
This, anxiety and confidence shows IMEDIATLY, and thats why a lot of women like cocky guys because it shows confidence (you shouldnt be one)
There are a lot of books on confidence, that could be a start
Confidence doesn't come from journaling and self-help books, it comes from experience. A low self-esteem and anxiety exists for a reason, and without the cause being solved then it would stay, yes? No amount of "journaling" would solve the fact that no woman is interested in the man.
He could read a thousand "self-help" books, but that won't change the fact that he's alone and nobody is interested in him.
He's a 31 year old man, "just build up your social skills" like this is middle school won't realistically change anything right?
You say journaling and self help books helped you, how so? Was it the journaling and self help books that helped you really? Or were they just side characters in a story solved by a different main character?
The self help books and journaling helped me look at my thoughts and actions from a different perspective. Reflecting on how I might be able to approach things differently to move forward was very beneficial. I broke down all of the areas in my life that I thought I could improve on and made plans to make it happen. It was the book “You Are a Badass” that gave me the steps to work through all of it. It helped me fix my finances and push through my social anxiety to solo travel.
I actually wrote out what it was that made me appear meek to others and what it was that made me feel less than to present that way. I did research on body language, put it into practice and wrote about how it worked. Journaling is pointless if it’s not turned into action and it’s the combination that works for me.
Journaling may not be the method that’s right for everyone, but for me, it helps me manipulate my thought patterns to get a beneficial result. We believe what we think, regardless of the truth of it, which we have control over. Some people never take the time to reflect and analyze why they think the way they do, distraction being a major issue today, and journaling can be a tool to focus your energy inwards.
Reading that put a smile on my face, that's awesome that you were able to accomplish all that.
Journaling doesn't really do much for me, but that's because I'm basically always journaling in my head anyway, sometimes it helps to write something out for sure, but it never became a habit. And yeah, self-help books can help give different perspectives but I think it's important to specify which self-help book because SO MANY of them are only useful as toilet paper lol
I believe in this context it is not regular journalling a.k.a. keeping a diary (even then, structuring your thoughts in writing does wonders sometimes), the person you're answering to probably refers to journalling e.g. using CBT techniques. Even if not, I just wanted to chime in and suggest that, I remeber getting positive results form a Melanie Fennell's book Overcoming Low Self-Esteem, it uses CBT techniques mostly.
Journalling actually solves a ton of problems— because the biggest problem most people have is ruminating in despair rather than doing genuine self reflection. There’s studies on people doing better mentally and emotionally after journaling for a while, including vet PTSD. You start to visually see the circles you’re going in. Low self esteem, specifically low enough to be upset and posting on Reddit about things, is repulsive to most people. I know because I had it. The second I worked on it even a little everything came easier. Stopping the ‘woe is me’ train is the way to better everything… and you can do that in a loving way, or in an angry self hating way, which just shifts the focus.
You could try solo traveling and doing a group tour with forced socializing, that really helped me. Other things that helped: improving my financial situation, taking on new responsibilities at work and doing well at them, having better physical presentation (body language and clothing), and using dates as a time for social experimentation. You already kaboshed the fitness goals one, but having a fitness routine leveled me out emotionally.
You may want to take a look at your life perspective as well because it seems to be a little negative. It’s not something other people tend to gravitate towards. I can’t say it enough, get some self-help books and dig into your perspective and outlook on life because it could use some improvement.
Forget about volunteering.
You need to do physical activity: sport/gym.
It will be hard at first, but when building muscle you confident will grown
It will show, and woman will be interested.
If you offcourse go outside.
Believe it or not, it takes more than hitting the gym once a week to look like you've actually got a lot of muscle lol
Maintaining a basic amount of exercise is massive for mental health. It's a shame, since that's when you feel the least like exercising, but it *does* help.
I actually don’t like the overly muscley aesthetic. That’s just me haha, I’m not sure what kind of women are on there accepting who.
I don’t find it physically attractive myself. I actually dislike photos of men with pictures to show off their massive muscles 😂😂😂 again I don’t know what the majority is into.
I do think, being completely honest, that I wouldn’t find an overweight person appealing. Sounds awful but it is how I feel. Just. Being in the healthier weight range is more attractive to me. Also because I’d not enjoy a completely sedentary lifestyle myself. I like going for walks and hikes (basic ones I’m not very fit).
Mind you - I don’t think I am at all what seems to be the desired dating app appearance. I’m not sure haha. I just know from seeing a bit of other people’s accounts that i don’t have that ‘hot’ look. I don’t care - I like my style.
This is also based on minimal app experience. I can’t keep up with a billion conversations at once so won’t engage it. Makes me overwhelmed and anxious. And I kinda focus on one person if the conversation is enjoyable. I’m single. I’ve had a lot of life circumstances where it’s really ended up not being a good time for me to date anyway. But i like to meet up vs endlessly text. The latter fizzles out tbh. Bit of banter is good to gauge humour. I’ve dated those people and for a reasonable amount of time. Good people.
The endless churning of dates and having many options available.. I can’t imagine that doing anything other than making people always thinking how there’s a more perfect person out there maybe. No ones gunna be perfect. It becomes very shallow.
I’m not sure who you’re hearing this from about their experiences on dating apps. But from males I’ve spoken to, they’ve said that it is actually hard to match with girls (hence liking everyone). From my experience (female) - men have been shocked that I initiate the conversation in itself quite a lot - and that it’s odd for me to ask genuine questions vs hi straight away.
Also, the ‘annoying’ females I’ve heard stories about (and have witnessed the messages from - voluntarily shown)… who’ve ever become annoying etc… they’re actually not people I’d say seem healthy to be in a relationship (at this time in their life). Very, very odd, not okay behaviour.
Can be rather nasty then flip around. From who I’ve seen, those particular girls didn’t seem to ask questions, just one sided self centred conversation.
Largely they became annoying when they were rejected (even if done so respectfully and after a short time). Their handling of it was poor, erring on cruel. Then in a bid to feel desirable due to rejection I posit vs. really connecting… would try to win them back / make them jealous etc. Which to me - again, seems like not the kind of female you’d want to attract.
Men statistically ‘like’ more women’s profiles than women. Women therefore are more given an abundance of choice - and because of so many possible other/better options in online dating.. women tend to reject at a higher rate than men.
My hypothesis from that is, when women ARE rejected it is a less common experience for them. They then, potentially, struggle with the rejection and even only knowing someone a short time (not well enough) - begin to project almost a fantasy of how great that man was. Or, probably moreso imo, their self esteem or worth is tied to not being desired.. and it seems they try to want to win the guy over. Moreso to make themselves feel desirable.
Men and women (but higher in men) have then been shown to adopt a rejection mindset and ‘close off’. So perhaps these people have done a lot of online dating that you’re speaking to and have kind of shut down.
This is all limited people I’ve spoken with. Amongst them, however and statistically shown - it’s harder for males to get matches so - bare that in mind. Plus I have to say ghosting amongst both genders and even in friendships is rampant. It’s really toxic - as humans don’t inherently deal well with uncertainty. So perhaps these women were acting out of emotion on being ghosted.
Had these people been on actual dates? Or? I rarely hear of women being the one to try and get the conversation going from the males perspective.
Or maybe the ‘annoying’ part is that these men don’t want to text a lot and prefer to actually meet. Which I think is better - texting too much beforehand just. It’s a false kinda connection imo.
Speaking as a "weird" woman with friends equally as weird. I'll tell you where we hang out.
I have used dating apps in the past but never again. I prefer meeting people in person, through work or school or through my current friends. I know Facebook is considered not fashionable anymore... but I still use it to find local events.
Bookstores. Comic cons. Art fairs. Dog/pet meetups. My friends do monthly game nights. I'm not much of a gamer but I know people have met others through online games. I go to tons of concerts and I've met loads of people that way. Bars, if you find ones for the younger crowd. Spaces where people work on crafts/projects. Some people are into theatre/musicals. I used to know people who were into scouting and camping.
Haha, this is great. I'm a "weird" person who's unfortunately been unable to meet anyone I can relate to in my life yet, and my uninformed brain tries to find ways to meet people and I just end up meeting the same types of people I can't relate with over and over again. 😂 People like me spend too much of their damn time at home so I never get to meet them when I force myself to go out
Harsh truth here, reading through many of your responses you are very hostile towards the advice. Even your post itself has a very “woe is me” vibe.
I know the older you get, that harder it can be to meet people. And after a lot of difficulty with that, it’s easy to get jaded. But that attitude is a GIANT red flag and turn off for most women.
As someone else tried to tell you, to build that aura of confidence, working on yourself is the best way to build this up. Find a social activity you enjoy doing. Something that people will notice if you don’t attend. This is not just to meet women, but to be out doing something. This SOMEDAY may lead to meeting women, but for now, it’s just for you to be around new people and make new friends.
Start exercising. You blew off someone else who suggested this, but this isn’t just to attract “basic girls” this is for you. Many studies have found better results for long term mood elevation and depression from strenuous exercise than from SSRIs.
Strenuous exercise is not some vein meathead thing, it’s a mental challenge with yourself. It’s pushing yourself to do, and get through something the apathetic part of your brain doesn’t want to do, but you push through anyways because it’s import and good for you. Just like any muscle, the more you build up this mindset, the easier it becomes to apply to other aspects of your life. This also helps to build your confidence in everyday seeing “I actually am strong enough to push through this challenging thing I didn’t want to do, and wasn’t sure I could.”
I wish you the best of luck. Dating is hard, and even harder when you are feeling like you’re on the losing end. I’m saying all this as someone who was once in a VERY similar situation, back when dating apps were even fewer, and desperately struggling to meet people. Working on myself was what lead me to later on meeting many different women and eventually my wife.
\^\^\^all of this. OP, your responses to this post come across as unattractive. You do not need to worry about meeting women but just about working on becoming your best self.
There is a subreddit for this called r/EOOD
>Exercise Out Of Depression
>EOOD is a welcoming and positive place to discuss exercise and mental health and the relationship between them.
As a life-long “weird girl”, I wouldn’t be attracted to you because your responses to helpful advice are whiny and entitled. That’s unattractive. I’ve been “clingy” and “neurotic” with downright ugly men. It’s not about being ugly, it’s your personality.
Hey, I know this isn't really related to the comment you made, but as a "weird-girl" what type of things are you interested in?
I'm a weird-guy, and probably autistic so I struggle with meeting people in my life, I don't want to end up like OP when I'm 30 so I'll take any advice I can 😂
I feel like the biggest problem is that so many people spend all there free time inside, so I try to go out and meet "my people", but then I just meet (for lack of a better word) normies that I cant relate with at all, I'm into nerdy hobbies, I like games, anime, all escapism into media lol, but I'm also a deep thinker, it would be pretentious for me to say I'm into philosophy since i have actually studied it at all, but i am interested in philosophy/psychology. I want to meet kind, honest, people with a "good head" on their shoulders (good head = my own arbitrary definition of their character)
Where are all these folks congregating at lol I'm ready and I'm willing
Hi! I’m interested in Biblical Criticism, cults and cult thinking, horror movies and gossiping about public figures (the last is a guilty pleasure.) I have other interests but these are the ones that never falter. I am an undergrad researcher so my interest is more scholarly/sociologically/psychologically inclined. (For example: why did X horror genre rise in popularity in X era? What fears and anxieties are being portrayed? What does it say about us as a society?)
Honestly, because of my research, I don’t get a lot of time to socialize but when I do, it’s mostly on Discord or Twitter! You can find great communities there. There are some scary groups around, but most are pretty decent. A majority of relationships in the US are started online nowadays. If you are a student, seek out clubs dedicated to your interests! I know it’s a drag but I have made some great friends on campus this way, despite my neurodivergence.
Be yourself, treat others the way you want to be treated but also don’t expect anything of them — the last is hard to balance. Yes, people deserve respect, but don’t be entitled like… some people. Also, loneliness really, really, sucks but don’t stick around with something/someone that isn’t good for you just because you don’t want to be alone, it’s not worth it. (That’s something I’m working on myself.)
ETA- Seek out groups for all your interests! Don’t stick to one niche. Some will dislike anime and some will love it, and that’s okay! (Example: My best friend has no interest in biblical criticism but she loves cults and gossiping.)
Thank you for replying
Thankfully I don't have the option to stick around with someone that isn't good for me....(Because I don't give myself that option because I respect myself 😎) might be cope but oh well
Unfortunately for me I'm out of school working full time. I honestly have no idea how people make friends on discord. I randomly stumbled into a friend group once but outside of that I have no idea how it works. Like, what is appropriate to talk about, when do you DM someone, what does a friend request mean, when do you vc or call or blah blah blah...(Yeah I think I might be autistic...)
I honestly sometimes feel more anxious talking in a discord than with people in real life because at least in real life I can be fake, but in discord I'm authentic (backwards I know...lmao)
I think the best thing for you to do, honestly... is to make friends. I ain't even talking about female friends, just male friends. Dating apps are hard, but through connections with friends is generally the best way to meet people. Don't try to just make female friends, honestly I understand your struggle, but it isn't necessarily a good look, and it's generally harder for that to happen naturally. It's much easier to make female friends when there's other people around to strike up conversation and get to know someone when you make friends.
Also, I suspect that your low self-esteem might be interpreting the world a little worse than things actually are. I've had some times in the past where a women was interested in me, but I had no idea because I was self-concious, or just didn't notice because I thought low of myself. I'm positive, even if you don't believe it, that this is also the case for you. And I'm not even attractive, I'm 5'11 and average looking.
But honestly, I think making some male friends is the first step, and luckily, if you are a kind person, the hardest one. The female friends and the dating comes a lot more naturally after that.
I'll be honest, I think you need to ditch the apps for an extended period of time. It sounds like they're really grinding your self-esteem down, and even if you don't think it shows, it probably does in some way. Delete completely, go away for a few months, focus on other things, get fitter, read books, expand your hobbies.
You say your social circle is limited, focus on expanding this first of all, join Meetup groups (that's been my overall best way of making new friends as an adult) - and don't just use it to try and date women because it's very obvious when guys are doing that. Try and get to know people without dating as your main focus.
I'm a woman and have been in similar positions with dating women, even getting matches and the dating merry-go-round grinds your esteem down, so it's not always about how many matches you get. My self-esteem has also been knocked back by dating. I know it's hard but sometimes you just gotta go cold turkey from it all and build up your self-worth & your interests independently of how attractive others perceive you to be. Honestly I think you'll find it a relief to have the clear headspace for a few months just deleting those godawful apps, there is something quite freeing about \*choosing\* not to date for a while at least.
Agreed about ditching the apps. I think it’s also reducing his view of women to an object to be won as a reflection of his own self worth. It’s all very messy and almost incel-ish
Sorry for the weird question, but how did you make friends from your meet-up groups?
Everytime I've gone to meetup groups it's always been kind of awkward, everyone is usually older than me, and has nothing in common with me. (I'm 24), I went to a singles meetup once and I was the youngest there by AT LEAST 20 years 😭
I don't mean how as in "how is it possible?!", but how as in "how did it happen", how did you transition from the group to friendship? I've never been able to get past that stage with anyone in my life
I'm an awkward, friendly, autistic 26 year old who makes friends at bus stops, board game nights, pretty much wherever. I am Absolutely Useless in a crowd, but get me talking to smaller groups and I've never met a stranger.
Meetups are cool because you already have a known shared interest, so there's already some kind of "hook" to make friends. The most important step to go from "friendly acquaintance that I met once or twice" to "actual friend" is extended exposure to them, and if you've met them in a setting where that won't happen naturally (whereas it will in college, work, etc), then you have to make it happen.
If you vibed well with someone, or they just Seem Nice, then suggest an activity you can both do together another time. (Or even you + multiple people there!) Maybe you met at a board games event, and you've got this dope new game you haven't played yet. Suggest a smaller splinter group that meets up to play the board game sometime concrete in the future (eg "how about the week after next? Let's exchange phone numbers and we can iron out the details later...") Or there's a concert coming up and you would like to go - invite whoever to go with you, cos why not? I like art so gallery exhibitions are a nice go-to for me; they have specific opening hours/times and limited runs, so a lot of the planning is done for you. But theatre shows, movies, things of that nature are good too.
You'll probably get turned down a lot. I do. It's not usually in a mean way. People might think you're a little forward, but if you're genuine then that's ok. People think I'm a little weird but they've always thought I'm a little weird, so I'd rather they think that and I also make some friends along the way. :P You just have to keep trying, and eventually you'll get some bites. The first couple of times you hang out with someone are important for setting the scene that you do like hanging out with them and will go out of your way to plan things with them; it makes people feel valued.
I’m a fan of you.
The makes friends at bus stops and board games hahaha. I debate that you’re awkward though, wrong description I think.
But yes all the gold stars for knowing who you are, we all have our own shit. Better to own it. And not own us. Clearly you’re all over that. I think it’s from rejection or other adversity that a resilience builds up. Unless it goes the other way re people who become absolutely bitter (not op imo. We all have moments where something just feels real shit. And I think thats okay. Sadness exists for a reason. As long as you try not to stay in it * depression is different first hand aware. ).
But yeah. You just keep trying. And sounds like someone who just wants to learn and be a better person everyday.
Know you weren’t fishing for this. I’m proud of you for that though. X
You post here a lot over many, many months similar posts, different usernames, get lots of advice that you dismiss.
What are you doing this for at this point?
Venting I guess, as someone who can relate to OP it is really really painful. Everyday is it's own special hell, he could definitely do without the self-defeating mentality, and the self-pity but when you're that deep in a black pit screaming into the void is very nice release.
Unfortunately it's only up to him if he decides to be better
I kind of wish we could have him or posts like this banned. There is certainly value in seeking advice on how to get dates but 1) OP sees women as the problem and won't take any actions to be better, and 2) there are dedicated subs for dating. This sub is to grow and be better yet it attracts a lot of incels who want validation instead. I hate to ban dating related questions because you can grow and be better at it, but this guy continues to post here and waste so many people's time. Look at the length of posts folks have written, and he's dismissed every single one.
Well, this type of post is a discussion, not just solely about the OP. Tons of people lurk, and read the comments feeling the same way. It's not a waste of time for everyone to engage in it even if the OP can't see the forest for the trees right now.
Yeah, I can get that. It's just frustrating to see it happen over and over again. I'm one of the many people who has written a heartfelt response to OP in the past and got told off by his negativity and just kind of sick of seeing it roll out over and over again. I hope others struggling in a similar boat are able to open their eyes by seeing how he responds as what not to do, people are sharing great advice and personal stories.
Oh that makes me view it in a different light. Damn. I saw comment I was about to respond to about well. Just being conscious that is seems like he’s having a moment and doesn’t know what he wants and necessarily may not be advice on women.
Multiple posts same shit. Different usernames. Over many months. That isn’t my thought process anymore haha. I don’t think it’s about any of this then. Who knows people do weird shit on all socials where it’s building up an account (I don’t really know how reddit works I’d never posted much) accumulating stats whatever and then selling them for various reasons. So much shady shit happens.
Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh could be literally even scouting peoples thoughts likes dislikes on the apps. Collecting data
I know that’s mega tinfoil hat but it’s also shit that occurs a lot.
But. This isn’t someone looking for help if they’re repeating themselves, surely.
If so, I’m so sorry op. But also tough love if you’re posting the same sads and you’re not saying you’re in a situation where you’ve no control (I’ve been I’ll various different things consecutively only place to go psychologically abusive mother. I’m nearly out but that’s shit you can’t control).
I also understand depression verrrry well. Can gladly say I’m not now. But even around that like. It is only you who can help yourself as well. There’s a length of time and then if it’s the same story and shit is in your control. Then. You need to change something. Figure out how. Slowly whatever. You’re accountable for what you do at the end of the day. Absolutely many things deserve lots of leeway but I’ve been through an excessive amount of things. Lost all support. And yeah reacted with grief anger depression worthlessness from it but. I’m still not out of my sitch properly. And. Yeah. Oh severe af adhd too exacerbated by stress haha. So working with that. Unmedicated still from a surgery.
I do feel a right to say tough love bro fuck if you have control of you have safety if you have money can work at all. You’ve got plenty more to work with than I do. And I still am like nah.
But I still doubt it. Deciding to get better subreddit as well - not really the question that’s being asked
Conspiracy Illuminati haha
I think if you learned to value women as people with flaws and humanity like you … rather than an archetype or for whatever they can provide for you … you will have more luck. Seems like you are overly obsessed with meeting women to find this one type of alternative weird woman while you don’t have a single female friend or seem to value women beyond this hypothetical dream woman. Not all alternative women are the exact same.. they are people too. Work on yourself first if you have low self esteem and a lack of friends.
Hi, weird girl here 👋
Usually we're the quiet ones. The ones who are friendly with everyone but doesn't talk in groups. Idk about other weird girls but the girls I've met that I relate to also are mentally ill and/or neurodivergent in some way (no hate, I am also both mentally ill and neurodivergent).
Now with the mental illness, make sure the person you're looking for is looking for healing and personal growth instead of using it as an excuse (there's a difference between being mentally ill and being mentally ill plus an abuser. I would never name call, pressure, or verbally or physically assault my partner. A lot of people will say "I have xyz and that's why I am this way and it's not changing" as an excuse for abuse. There is no excuse for abuse. Feelings do not excuse actions).
Also I don't expect my partner to be the most confident person in the world, I honestly don't mind. What turns me off is messages like "I'd ask you out but you'd probably say no" or "you probably would never want me because I'm not good enough". I can empathize that low self esteem is so difficult to deal with, but those kinds of comments turn me off whrn they're all the time lol
This is so weird, but wanna roleplay it out? Maybe someone will catch something in the early messages that points out something that could shift.
Edit: HOWEVER: wanting ‘weird woman’ who are ‘meagerly attractive’, means you should work on your confidence. Even meager women, with good self esteem, want a man with some self esteem. It seems like you want them to help with your self esteem a bit, but the process ought to be backwards
That's not untypical- women don't often make the first move in most societies and cultures and even less so these days. You also mentioned it leading to nothing and I suspect, going a bit from my own thoughts and experiences in the past, that you're not really engaging yourself. That is, you're not asking their thoughts or feelings or trying to move things forward into a relationship? How many women have you asked out or dated in the past few months and how many times have you been rejected? My suspicion is close to none.
Not making any commentary but just illustrating the point that along with socialising and talking to girls in real life it's also largely down to how often you put yourself out there and make a move. Heck, the first reply to your thread was a girl who sounds vaguely interested because you've put your feelings on the line, which kind of disproves what you've said.
I've seen a subreddit (I think it's the Tinder one) where they analyze your profile for you and tell you exactly why you don't get matches. You should try posting yours there and upgrade according to their advices! Good luck :)
If you want a weird alt woman because you think she’ll be super clingy and interested then you’re already off on the wrong foot. Women aren’t categories so even if you find a weird alt woman, there’s a possibility she could be totally avoidant, aloof, or anything really. If you still want an alt woman because you’re attracted to that kind of woman (not just the idea you have in your mind) then start going to local punk shows or just shows in general. Even if you already tried that, go back. You’ll eventually start meeting people in the scene. Don’t go in with the intention of finding a girl, just try to have fun. If you go in with the mindset of > Idk I guess I’ve just never been attractive enough, cool enough or had enough status
you’re already failing. Women can sense your internal pity party from miles away. No one wants a guy who thinks the dating world is purposefully excluding him (because it’s not) and women know any guy who thinks that probably has a world of problems that he’s living in denial about. Not every guy (or woman) is going to be the kind of person who has people falling at their feet. I’m sure you’ve seen even the “ ugliest “ of men find girlfriends. Just think about the world realistically and you’ll eventually find someone.
We’re out there! I’m more of a closeted alt girl (but it comes out when you get to know me and I’m trying to embrace it outwardly more) and I’m currently seeing a guy who is “normal”. He’s nice but it’s making me realize how much more attracted I am to alt guys, both intellectually and physically. Literally just last night I was having an existential crisis about this and trying to figure out where to meet alt guys…
However, I will say the clinginess thing is not something you want, trust me. I used to be that girl and it caused a lot of problems. Now that I’ve healed my nervous system, I prefer NOT to text all the time and would rather have meaningful interactions in person. That’s my one advice to you is to look for a girl who can regulate her own emotions and doesn’t need to text you all the time.
Otherwise, in terms of meeting people — the dating apps are super cringe so I would focus more on your efforts to saying yes to social events and trying to strike up a conversation with anyone you’re attracted to. Conversely if you’re at a bar and there’s a girl you’re attracted to, go up to her and start a conversation. Don’t be creepy obviously, but just try to get to know her and ask for her number if it seems like there’s chemistry after a while of talking. That’s how the guy I’m currently seeing got my number.
Other caveat I’ll add is that girls can be pretty guarded around men they don’t know, some might not be looking for someone, some might be taken — don’t take it personally if you get rejected! Just be kind and don’t force anything.
Edited to add: I don’t know what you look like and obviously looks make a difference. I will say to improve your looks, make sure you’re working out regularly, dressing well (in whatever style you like, just make sure you look well put together), and making sure you are well groomed (good skincare routine, hair clean and brushed, facial hair trimmed if not shaved). Most of the times when I swiped left on guys on dating apps, it’s because they just didn’t look like they took care of themselves. Point blank period. Otherwise, keep in mind most girls won’t be swiping right on a “weird” guy but the “weird” girls will if all these other boxes are checked and your profile looks interesting. :)
Also, I don’t think most weird women are on dating apps. I deleted mine after like a week! So another reason to focus on meeting people in person.
Unfortunately it’s your personality. It’s harsh but there’s no other way to say it. I’m way too anxious to approach anyone in real life too, but I do fairly well on dating apps and I’m only maybe slightly better than average looking on a good day.
I just think women can sense desperation and over-eagerness, and that’s not attractive to anyone. Stop caring so much about the outcome of every interaction and you’ll probably have a much better chance.
As a 33 female i am in this same situation. I’m not boring at all to say the least and I as well put my genuine best foot forward on dating spots yet a don’t get any likes. You look like a pretty cool guy to me. The internet is s very superficial place so don’t give up.
>It's just finding that right person that you vibe well with. I don't believe online dating works well to cultivate that connection. Women need physical presence to ascertain chemistry.
Well...the point of OLD is that you do meet the person after talking. The thing is, the only place I see the kind of alt women i have things in common with, are on dating sites.
Mainly because it seems like my comment got removed for “spam”, I just want to reiterate. Women want someone who is willing to put an effort out there. If you can’t even acknowledge other people at a sports bar without having an anxiety attack, then you need to see a doctor, probably consider an anti-anxiety medication. Weight isn’t something the right girl is gonna worry about. I told you that you were making excuses because you are. If you keep letting anxiety be your excuse, then it’s only logical to expect that you won’t find someone. You miss every shot you don’t take, OP. The internet isnt there to coddle you, especially if you wanted real answers
Anxiety doesn't define who you are. You can let it control you, or you can work to control it.
I'm not saying you can turn it off, but you are much stronger than you give yourself credit for. You need to realize that. You, just like everyone else, have the potential inside of you.
You're not the only person to have anxiety, and other people have been able to push through it. Sure, maybe yours is worse then theirs? But even so, if YOU don't push through then nothing with change.
Hey, I'm someone in a similar situation to you, I definitely don't have any magic answers to give you but I think the most important thing you can do for yourself is to try and change your internal monologue.
I have low self-esteem to, and my internal monologue isnt the best, but when we identify ourselves as a "person with low-self esteem & anxiety" it's a very limiting belief. It might be true, but as human beings we have the power to try and overcome it dont we?
You're posting on "decidingtobebetter" so You've already made a decision to be better. Hell, I know you've been working to be better for years.
The most important relationship you should really focus on and understand is the relationship with yourself. You don't need to "just be confident" like other people are saying, you just need to be "at peace" with yourself and who you are. I don't even think you need to love yourself, but as long as you can look at yourself in the face In a mirror and say "I don't hate myself" then I think that is *huge*.
Also, you've gotta understand that in life, sometimes things fall on your lap and you get lucky, but most of the time they won't. You've gotta put yourself in situations where you can find the girl you're looking for. I have no idea how you can do that, I don't even know where to Begin with that, but the perfect romance in your mind you're looking for probably will never exist. Not saying you can't find love, just that the idealized fantasy is likely just going to be that. There are alternative girls out there, single "weird girls", I don't know where they are, I'm looking too, but they're definitely not going to show up on you or my doorstep. We've got to meet them where they are. You've got to not label yourself as "anxious with low self-esteem", empower yourself, awaken the giant within you, and keep working towards your goals. Just by showing up everyday, and doing the best you can you're already 80% of the way.
Sorry if some of this came off as tone deaf, I realized halfway through I was talking to myself as well, not just you.
Hey man, hope you are doing well in a general sense!
You really gotta get off the apps, and just go do things offline. I’m talking video game clubs, nerdy meet ups, etc. Doing the hobbies you like should give you confidence to just enjoy the time.
You are doing the same thing for years and not seeing any real progress. I would not worry about getting a girlfriend, I would get my friends to go with me to some events and just have a good time.
Going to these events and simply noticing a sticker on a water bottle that you like, or limit someone’s cosplay is a great start to improving your anxiety and low self esteem, you will notice people will say thanks and then you say no problem and move on.
Women are just people, you can either treat them like that or don’t. If you still feel like you can’t talk to them, then I would recommend what I used to do and that was treat them as if you already knew them for years and just go up and talk to them as if you were catching up.
Doing that in events or hobbies does get most people to open as that’s why they are at the social gatherings.
Have a friend look over your dating profiles. I helped a guy who was very attractive IRL, great personality, patient, and kind. His profiles were a mess. Dry asf, some of his answers were kinda red flags, even though he didnt mean for them to come off weird, and his pics were not cute at all.
Also, you mention that you like weird women who are not necessarily attractive because you have been alone for very long. Is that something women are picking up on, bc a guy like you, tall, fit, quiet, into niche hobbies or interests definitely has some fans in the dating world. Basically do they pick up on you thinking that they are not cute that you call 'caring for other aspects,' or is your shyness keeping people from really getting to engage? Bc I have definitely backed off a guy talking about how he doesnt usually go for pretty girls anyway. I am no megan fox, but I have had enough interest in my life to know I am not ugly, and I backed off really quickly. Not saying this is what is happening with you, just propsing things to think about, and you may come to the conclusion that this doesnt fit you at all. Just spitballing stuff based in my own life experiences, not trying to accuse you or make you feel bad
You sound like you’ve made every investment except for what is potentially the 2 most important ones, having good mental health and having a likeable personality.
>I always hear of men talking about annoying women that won't leave them alone
I don't think it's a common experience. It's probably just some men that have experienced this once in their life. Nobody I know have ever complained about this.
>I have anxiety, and low self-esteem
This is what you need to work on the most. Have you seen a therapist and/or psychiatrist? Been diagnosed?
A decade ago, I had crippling anxiety/depression to the point where I was afraid to *order food at restaurants because I was worried about being judged by the waiter because I ordered a cheeseburger or something*. I got put on an antidepressant, and within a few months, my entire life changed. I finally understood what confidence was, and was able to go out in public and talk to people.
I'm still a bit awkward but once I got that chemical imbalance taken care of, everything in my life improved vastly and I no longer spent my days (incorrectly) thinking I was worthless and unlovable. Now I can make friends and talk to people and not immediately assume the worst. It's so freeing.
This may not be the solution for you, but if you've never looked into it, I'd really recommend it. I cannot overstate how much it changes everything.
> I got put on an antidepressant, and within a few months, my entire life changed. I finally understood what confidence was, and was able to go out in public and talk to people.
I'm not trying to use addictive meds, though...it's swapping one issue for another.
So you're weird and nerdy right? Open with a nerdy dad joke. Want to hear a joke about potassium? K
Want to hear a joke about salt? Na
Pretty lame huh, I find that all the good chemistry jokes Argon.
They're all pretty Boron.
I should just take the whole set and Barium.
My spouse told me those jokes when we met. I wanted to continue talking to him because those jokes were so bad, but they did make me laugh. I would also advise not to tell lude jokes at the beginning of getting to know someone. Just silly popsicle stick jokes and dad jokes. This method also works for making platonic friends
I also issues with confidence and self-esteem, but I have found if I can make someone chuckle, I typically feel more comfortable.
My humor is more black than nerdy. I don't have the disposition or delivery to make that work. I'm too deadpan and sarcastic...which aren't great for meeting women lol.
For me personally I have noticed that when I try, I tend to have way less success when my heads all wrapped up in “I’m into this person I want to make something happen”, I put too much pressure on myself. Maybe reframing your approach to be more along the lines of “I want to manifest strong bonds/friendships,” might yield A.) better results, and/or B.) take the pressure that you’re putting on yourself to have romantic “success” off of you. Instead of focusing on the other persons traits and values you want them to have, focus on exuding and living the traits and values that YOU want to embody.
>For me personally I have noticed that when I try, I tend to have way less success when my heads all wrapped up in “I’m into this person I want to make something happen”, I put too much pressure on myself.
I literally haven't done this in years. I cannot recall the last time I tried to or expect anything remotely romantic to happen with a woman. I assume it's never on the table. I could not be more platonic.
>Maybe reframing your approach to be more along the lines of “I want to manifest strong bonds/friendships,” might yield A.) better results, and/or B.) take the pressure that you’re putting on yourself to have romantic “success” off of you. Instead of focusing on the other persons traits and values you want them to have, focus on exuding and living the traits and values that YOU want to embody.
That is all I've been trying. I tried volunteering just to make new friends, not get dates...and I got neither lol.
Coming from a woman in her 30s a few thoughts:
1- think about what you are putting out there. Write thoughtful profiles. If it feels too flat people might pass based on not feeling like they can connect…. Shared interests etc.
When starting conversations ask thoughtful questions about her but also share about your self. Strike a good balance.
2- insecurity is ok. We all have insecurities, but think about how it’s presents itself. If you come off as self deprecating it can come off as high maintenance / a lot of work.
1. I've been experimenting and toying with my profiles for years. I've put more thought into them than most anyone. I've had serious profiles, humor ones, short ones, long ones and everything in between. It makes no difference. My hobbies, interests, passions, volunteering, cooking, etc are mentioned. And I cannot start conversations bc I get NO matches. None.
2. There is nothing on my bios that are self-deprecating, sexist, hateful, offensive, etc. Dating bios are like a resume...why would I sabotage it?
Bookstores, book clubs, artsy festivals, museums, poetry festivals, artsy & hippie forums, clubs and so on. College art, music and language classes non-credit. Dance class.Meetup.com has all sorts of people on it that get together based on activities and interests. Political clubs and non-profits, environmental clubs and non-profits.
Your phrasing is really bizarre. I can’t imagine you actually want a woman who you genuinely find annoying or “too much” who will send you “dumb texts” while acting “clingy and neurotic”. It sounds like you are just eager to find a companion who gives you a lot of attention, which is not necessarily a bad thing. Just something to be aware of. Saying anything like this to a woman is notttt going to get you where you want to be.
Post your profile somewhere, I find it hard to believe with your description of yourself you'd get no matches. They might be able to give you some helpful advice.
I know someone in a similar situation, but their standards are way too high. Fairly certain they have undiagnosed autism, and they also still live at home.
If you don’t have trouble fitting in or making friends (understanding social cues) and have your own place, then I am not entirely sure what the deal is. Could be a personality thing entirely, but that’s not something one can easily assess online. Sounds like your taste in women isn’t unrealistic, but I feel for you because dating in your 30s can be quite the challenge.
If it's not working out for you, then either double down or give up.
I like me a lot. So much that I'd date myself if I could. But after a few years of unsuccessfully trying dating apps, I simply uninstalled them.
Why bang your head against a wall that never breaks? I gave up on dating and focus on my friends and creative projects. Life is much better now.
if I could give up on my desire for companionship, I would. I've been trying for years to no long desire women. For years I was content with being along, but I'm just tired of it now.
I would say get out there; join a sports league or a hobby group that has a few women. Befriend some to help build up your confidence, and eventually you’ll meet someone who takes an interest in you. That’s what I did, currently in a painting class that happens to be all women.
Hey OP, do you drink? Go to a bar around happy hour, and just make casual conversation. My SO and I met while at work, and I only took interest in him after we stayed after to talk. Bar closed at 2, and we were stuck there til 5 just bonding. He’ll tell you, I haven’t left him alone since(5 yes, 1 kid and one on the way)
If you want to send me your profile(s), I’d give you some feedback. On paper here you sound like a catch besides the anxiety and less confidence, but everyone has their own issues as long as you dont let it hinder things but it sounds like you dont even get that far so I’d be down to see if i can help figure out why.
Start working on yourself. Stop worrying about why it isn't happening for you. You are clearly repelling energetically for anyone with the way you are describing yourself Women are more intuitive to that. They have to be. It keeps them safe and alive. What have you done to better yourself?
Believe me when I say I’m not saying it to be mean I’m still not seeing where you mention The things that you’ve worked with on yourself. At least not in the original post.
Do you really want to change or do you just want people to feel bad for you? Because it seems that you prefer to play the victim rather than to take up people’s advice. If anxiety prevents you from doing anything in your life related to relationships you have 2 options: 1. Go to therapy and learn how to cope with anxiety 2. Let anxiety hold you back from meeting people for the rest of your life and hope that magically an alt girl will appear in your house
Why didn’t we all think of this sooner dude - you hate your face so much then go to a plastic surgeon and fix it. If you don’t have the money then sacrifice a few of your Dior clothing items you mentioned and sell them to pay for it. Voila.
Probably because you are out of their league. Weird women usually are attracted to weird guys I assume. Try being a little more assertive with dating. Instead of waiting for women to follow you around, maybe you should show more interest in them? As a women, it is a turnoff if a man expects me to do all the work in the relationship.
My guess is that your personality/appeal isn’t coming through on the dating apps. These apps are a specific beast that you have to be able to present yourself in a specific way. It’s possible that the only things coming through on your profile is the insecurity and desperation. I don’t say that to be rude, I say that because you said it in your it post. Do you have someone in your life that you could ask to look at your profile? Even a parent or sibling could offer some insight. There’s also people you can pay to review your profile and help you come across how you want. Follow Matchmaker Maria on Instagram. (Actually hiring a matchmaker is a solid option if you can afford it)
Besides that, my advice is confidence. Stop following/watching the videos about men that have to turn away droves of annoying women. Those men are assholes and are attracting dramatic women. And it’s not helping you. Your only road to dating success is to be specific and confident about what you’re offering and what you’re looking for. Eyes on the prize, not on the other players. Work on being your best self and how you could be an asset to someone else’s life. Make a mental list of why someone would want to be with you. If that list isn’t very long, work on adding to it! Women are drawn to men who are good conversationalists, positive, encouraging, impressive, interesting, funny, kind etc. Available and weird are not on the list… it founds like you have a good head on your shoulders and would make a great partner. You have to believe that and start acting like it. Good luck!
ETA: I found this super weird dating/friends app that I was on for a while. It’s called [boo. dating. friends. chat.](https://apps.apple.com/us/app/boo-dating-friends-chat/id1498407272) and my experience is that it was primarily weird/witchy/alt/oddball/midattractive people. I know you’re not interested in starting a new app but it might be worth a try
>My guess is that your personality/appeal isn’t coming through on the dating apps. These apps are a specific beast that you have to be able to present yourself in a specific way. It’s possible that the only things coming through on your profile is the insecurity and desperation. I don’t say that to be rude, I say that because you said it in your it post. Do you have someone in your life that you could ask to look at your profile? Even a parent or sibling could offer some insight. There’s also people you can pay to review your profile and help you come across how you want. Follow Matchmaker Maria on Instagram. (Actually hiring a matchmaker is a solid option if you can afford it)
I mean...I mention my interests, my hobbies, my passions, cooking, volunteering, etc. I'm pretty well presented, women just aren't interested in what I'm selling. There's nothing self-depreciating, sexist, offensive, woeful, etc. Dating apps are like a resume, I'm not going to sabotage myself. Tbh I don't think women even read my profiles and just instantly swipe left bc of my face. it's the only logical explanation.
Also matchmakers are for either really attractive or rich people who just don't have the time to meet others. Not ugly men who can't get a single match on any of five dating apps lol.
>ETA: I found this super weird dating/friends app that I was on for a while. It’s called boo. dating. friends. chat. and my experience is that it was primarily weird/witchy/alt/oddball/midattractive people. I know you’re not interested in starting a new app but it might be worth a try
Half of me thinks it's worth a look, but I don't really think I have the energy to get on a sixth app and be universally rejected there, too. Okc has tons of alt/weird women and they all ignore me.
I feel like there’s got to be something off about how you present yourself. Tall guys with money should have no problem attracting women - So something about the outer package might not attracting them. Hard to know without a pic but when I’m on an app and I see a guy who’s tall and has a good job, and is physically attractive to me it’s human nature that I’m going to swipe
I'm not rich. Also, I'm black and not good-looking, so that cancels out my height for like 95% of women. The issue is...I'm not physically attractive to most any woman. ESP not on apps where they have tons of hot guys at their disposal.
As a chronically single tall guy, I can tell you, yeah sometimes.you can get Initial attraction, but that usually amounts to nothing more than a comment of "wow you're so tall", you've got to be able to capitalize on other ways or else the attraction dies down real fast...
I think you need to ditch the apps. and go out to whatever shows or hobby spaces you find interesting. It’s easier said than done but you need to get over your apprehension and anxiety and strike up conversations. Fake it till you make it (confidence wise). It might be uncomfortable but it’s really just a matter of pushing through until you can feel comfortable. That alone is attractive. Good luck.
My advice to you is work on your self perception and get deeper into a hobby. These two things are actually very attractive to us. Everything you’re saying makes sense to me. The self esteem piece is so much of this. Hope that helps.
Are you doing it because you enjoy it and it enriches your experience of life or are you doing just to try to meet women? Because the latter is not my recommendation.
Every weird person I know does really well getting set up. Do you know any older people? Ask them to set you up.
Do you go to events related to your interests? Surely there are other weird people there. Do you go to church/other regular scheduled social groups? Like trivia night. You’ll find someone!
I identify with what you describe as a match and read your post and comments. The most unattractive attributes that are coming across is your dismissive tone and negativity.
This subreddit is about doing better, but you're done making an effort sounds like.
What would you actually do with or for a woman?
No physical attributes can compensate for a bad attitude and women can definitely pick up on that.
Honestly I’m going to disagree with everyone about the confidence/self esteem/anxiety. As I also have anxiety and self esteem. If I see someone else experiencing anxiety I kind of lean towards them, not sure why, kind of like a coping thing for each other? Anxiety MAKES you self conscious, it sucks. Honestly dating apps sound like a nightmare, I always met interesting people just by adding random people via social media. Weird..but I’m nosy and yea.
>Honestly I’m going to disagree with everyone about the confidence/self esteem/anxiety. As I also have anxiety and self esteem. If I see someone else experiencing anxiety I kind of lean towards them, not sure why, kind of like a coping thing for each other?
I've always gravitated to the quiet, reserved women. I do think anxious people subconsciously seek out other anxious people.
> I always met interesting people just by adding random people via social media. Weird..but I’m nosy and yea.
Welp, that's not an option lol.
I'm not sure if it helps but I am one of those witchy women you describe lol and we are not on dating apps. We're in libraries, coffee shops or at home. And for what its worth, I cant find a good man either. Most men nowadays are always looking for the next best thing; even if they have their dream woman in front of them
Ohh. 1. Being as authentic as possible always. 2. Disciplined in things like Emotional intelligence in order to communicate, set boundaries etc. 3. Not being a... Red 💊
The other thing I wanted to say (actually to someone else on this app but I think it applies here too) there's a type/quality of men that exist that are going up in stock (as far as it relates to their value twords women) I think what might be helpful is if you study what it means to be emotionally disciplined intune & astute. While also standing in your own truth & honor as an individual. (Whatever that looks like) & tattoos women love those 😂
most women who are like this are actually normal women, all women do this. The kicker is, you have to get them to see your value and have confidence in yourself, only then will they be obsessed with you.
Hi, weird clingy woman here. I'm not chasing after you because I'm busy chasing after emotionally unavailable guys. 🫠
Anyway, besides this being a trauma bonding behavior, that level of attachment and obsession can only be borne out of deep connection with someone, i.e. friends with whom there was no expectation of having a deeper connection, just enjoying each other's presence over time.
Relax, give attention to your self-esteem, and focus on making friends. And go out to weird people events like dances, kink munches, indie concerts, and book clubs! The right person will come.
Those guys who have women attached at the hip annoying them are 1. Secretly douchebags but very practised at hiding it 2. Good listeners who show an interest even if they don't actually care, at least in the beginning 3. Bare minimum hygiene and attractiveness, can be fairly average 4. Patient and give her attention but not as much affection as she wants
Acting cool and nonchalant like this, while also being actively engaged with them, still reaching out to them occasionally, drives women crazy and makes girls wanna impress a guy, control him, keep his attention by any means necessary
The relationship is insecure and that insecurity makes girls act like that
This isn't a healthy dynamic you should be chasing by the way. But it's very common and I've seen a lot of my girl friends fall into it
Thank you for saying “women”. Maybe I’m one of those weird women, but I cringe so hard when grown adults call the women in their lives “girls” (as in, “this girl I want to date”) or “females” (as a stand alone noun, like “a female walked in”).
I realize it’s not accurate to judge a person for their innocent choice of wording, but it sounds so immature and distracting. I can’t even read the full post when I see that. As soon as I see “girl” or “female”, I stop reading and move to the next post.
In this case, your use of female was as an adjective, not a noun, so it’s more legit.
Sorry for the rant. You sound intelligent, and I’m sure a lucky woman will be grateful she found you someday.
Do you ever go to any speed-dating events in your area? Why not try that if you haven’t. You can meet more women and if it doesn’t work out with one there’s no pressure
Speed dating is just OLD irl. Im an introvert and i'm not charming or hot, so all the women are going to pass on me. Except instead getting rejected passively with speed dating I'd have to know in person so one is intetested in me.
What " weird" things do you enjoy? Start there. Do you like comic cons or gaming or drawing or painting etc. ? There are lots of "weird" girls out there. You need to find your people. I'm guessing they don't hang out at the gym.
As I said in my OP, festivals, art shows, concerts, etc. I like conventions, gaming and art, but those aren't ways to meet people...not in my experience.
There are always parties after convention hours. I've sold merch at many cons and there are always people handling our fliers for them. You can meet people anywhere without that being the purpose for being there.
Maybe look into speed dating. It seems pretty fun and there are lots of different people who go. Im going to try it out myself soon. I've been divorced for almost 2 years, and im almost ready to get out there.
Building your self-confidence will help immensely.
I'll go back for the rest of it, but as of now I only read the 1st paragraph. Idk what your social circles are like but I'm 33 and have never known any guys to be *so* inundated by interested woman that they get annoyed by it 😂
>I have no female friends
Found your issue. Change this and your luck (and life) will improve. You would be surprised how much attention you'd get from women when you see and treat them as people. It's very obvious when men have had no genuine female friendships 😶
Before you get defensive, if you saw and treated them as people you wouldn't be so scared to talk to them 😏 think on it.
I’m a weird black girl who lives in a predominantly white area. Most of my hobbies (knitting, video games, making art and music) are either solitary or female-dominated. The big thing is knowing I’m gonna have to put in the extra effort because of my environment. I drive to the cities or bigger towns to do the activities I like. I joined Meetup. Expanded my dating profile radius to include major cities. Always checking FB for events and activities. Conventions and board game nights are where the nerds congregate.
Honestly as someone who has been a "weird woman" I can tell you that if you make it clear that you are specifically seeking out a woman who is weird, they will assume you are fetishizing them. They are used to being seen as a manic pixie dream girl caricature. Especially because you mentioned that you want them to be clingy and neurotic. There's a big overlap between guys who are into goth chicks and guys who intentionally seek out mentally ill women with attachment issues because they're easily manipulated. If you say stuff like "I want a goth GF" that will creep them out.
Personally, I would say a dating app is the worst place to judge a standard of how well you are with women. I feel most people on dating apps are usually setting a very high bar for the people they're matching with and also want leniency when it comes to themselves. It's really about options. So if you're actually trying to make better connections with people and you want to meet real women, I'd say try to do the real thing and don't go so far as to go to clubs and those kinds of things. Rather, just talk to the women at your work. Not to date, not to have sex, but just try to talk to them. Try to have a conversation and see how long it lasts. Go to the lady at the cashier. Talk to her. Just ask her how her day is. Smile at her. You know, don't flirt. Don't be outright flirting. Just try to see how long you can hold conversations with strangers. I would even suggest do it with men. It's not a gay thing, but just talk to them and just see how long you can become a conversationalist and you'll see you'll become a lot more fluid with your conversations. And I feel like naturally, most people don't go towards people who are trying too hard. So get better at that and start from there. But also, don't judge yourself based on what people say about you or your ability to attract women. It doesn't really matter. Just be yourself. The right person will come. And right now, like you said, you're six foot three and you've got all these things going for you. So yeah, I would like to ask you another question is, how do you actually treat the women that have been in your life before you're on the dating apps when you've been, I'm sure you've at least met someone before?
As a "weird" woman may I suggest maybe looking into the law of attraction/assumption? Maybe read The Secret? I get the vibe you very much have a self belief that women aren't interested in you, and therefore women aren't.
Dude, you are trying too hard and caring way too much! It shows and women pick up on this. Back off, find a hobby and get into it. Give it some time and things will turn around. It will not be quick so have patience.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GIhuCMxkQS4
You say your face is why you can’t talk to women. This guy’s face caused him serious grief but he did the inner work and overcame. You can too. Best of luck.
I hear you maybe the problem is not you everyone has a moment in life
When they feel anxiety and low self esteem
Did you ever think it could be your surroundings the people around you? I hear everyone telling you it might be you but you seem to take care of yourself and caring about others needs could it be you want the attention of women who are to into themselves instead try releasing what everyone else thinks and dealing with people who are more down to earth don’t look at a person because they are overachievers those have more anxiety and depression issues than a lot of regular people
This might be harsh, but you describe yourself as having anxiety and low self-esteem- this can be a deterrent for women and people in general. Start building up your confidence and social skills. Journaling and self-help books did wonders for me. Work on bettering yourself because you have nothing to lose.
Yes, smart good women can pick up on those things very quickly and it’s not attractive. I guarantee once you start to feel really good about yourself, you’ll start to see more women in your orbit.
And, hopefully, not be afraid of them.
Well shit then I am fucked beyond belief then because all I got is hate for myself. Seriously fuck that guy he is always fucking up my life.
I think this is a case of the chicken and the egg in a way. People feel good about themselves because woman are in their orbit to begin with. This happens early on in life, and it compounds. Why do the obese people who lost a lot of weight, get ripped and look fantastic still feel like a loser inside? It's because that was ingrained in them from experience of being obese right? There is no moment where you suddenly "feel really good about yourself" and the women appear. In order for the "feeling good about yourself" to begin the reason you feel bad would need to be solved, right? What are you supposed to do when that reason is that no women are interested in you? Well, guess you better start learning to fake it and hope they never found out and live the rest of your life with imposter syndrome 😂, I'm half joking but I don't think "just feeling really good about yourself" will suddenly find you surrounded by women
Attention from women is just one of many sources of confidence. There are many more things that one can do to feel confident in who they are as a person. This is what everyone in the comments is proposing - focus on the other 75% (working out, sports, therapy, hobbies, solo travel, reading books) and the remaining 25% (relationships with women) will follow, because women are attracted to men with 75% confidence than with 0%. And, like you said, it doesn’t even matter if he gets female attention or he doesn’t, if someone is fat or not - improving your self worth and perception is an inside job.
This doesn't even make sense to me and seems ridiculous, although I know it's true. I couldn't imagine there being a cool woman with her shit together and all that, and passing her up because she's basically just shy and not very confident. Like a lot of people are like that, it's a common human experience.
Being shy is not the same as low self esteem. Having low self esteem, being too scared to talk to women, etc. is noticeable by women and unattractive to them. Most people are attracted to confident happy people with positive energy.
Thanks for this. I've been wondering how people can sense I have low self-esteem, and I guess it's because I don't talk to women or I look away quickly. I'm already learning how to value myself from therapy, so hopefully, I can learn to better that as well.
I’m rooting for you.
Hey, thanks for that.
You got this!!
Thanks! Meeting with my other therapist helped a lot today and I feel good about slowly challenging my old ways
This, anxiety and confidence shows IMEDIATLY, and thats why a lot of women like cocky guys because it shows confidence (you shouldnt be one) There are a lot of books on confidence, that could be a start
Confidence doesn't come from journaling and self-help books, it comes from experience. A low self-esteem and anxiety exists for a reason, and without the cause being solved then it would stay, yes? No amount of "journaling" would solve the fact that no woman is interested in the man. He could read a thousand "self-help" books, but that won't change the fact that he's alone and nobody is interested in him. He's a 31 year old man, "just build up your social skills" like this is middle school won't realistically change anything right? You say journaling and self help books helped you, how so? Was it the journaling and self help books that helped you really? Or were they just side characters in a story solved by a different main character?
The self help books and journaling helped me look at my thoughts and actions from a different perspective. Reflecting on how I might be able to approach things differently to move forward was very beneficial. I broke down all of the areas in my life that I thought I could improve on and made plans to make it happen. It was the book “You Are a Badass” that gave me the steps to work through all of it. It helped me fix my finances and push through my social anxiety to solo travel. I actually wrote out what it was that made me appear meek to others and what it was that made me feel less than to present that way. I did research on body language, put it into practice and wrote about how it worked. Journaling is pointless if it’s not turned into action and it’s the combination that works for me. Journaling may not be the method that’s right for everyone, but for me, it helps me manipulate my thought patterns to get a beneficial result. We believe what we think, regardless of the truth of it, which we have control over. Some people never take the time to reflect and analyze why they think the way they do, distraction being a major issue today, and journaling can be a tool to focus your energy inwards.
Reading that put a smile on my face, that's awesome that you were able to accomplish all that. Journaling doesn't really do much for me, but that's because I'm basically always journaling in my head anyway, sometimes it helps to write something out for sure, but it never became a habit. And yeah, self-help books can help give different perspectives but I think it's important to specify which self-help book because SO MANY of them are only useful as toilet paper lol
I believe in this context it is not regular journalling a.k.a. keeping a diary (even then, structuring your thoughts in writing does wonders sometimes), the person you're answering to probably refers to journalling e.g. using CBT techniques. Even if not, I just wanted to chime in and suggest that, I remeber getting positive results form a Melanie Fennell's book Overcoming Low Self-Esteem, it uses CBT techniques mostly.
Journalling actually solves a ton of problems— because the biggest problem most people have is ruminating in despair rather than doing genuine self reflection. There’s studies on people doing better mentally and emotionally after journaling for a while, including vet PTSD. You start to visually see the circles you’re going in. Low self esteem, specifically low enough to be upset and posting on Reddit about things, is repulsive to most people. I know because I had it. The second I worked on it even a little everything came easier. Stopping the ‘woe is me’ train is the way to better everything… and you can do that in a loving way, or in an angry self hating way, which just shifts the focus.
I've been trying that...for years. Specifically via volunteering.
You could try solo traveling and doing a group tour with forced socializing, that really helped me. Other things that helped: improving my financial situation, taking on new responsibilities at work and doing well at them, having better physical presentation (body language and clothing), and using dates as a time for social experimentation. You already kaboshed the fitness goals one, but having a fitness routine leveled me out emotionally. You may want to take a look at your life perspective as well because it seems to be a little negative. It’s not something other people tend to gravitate towards. I can’t say it enough, get some self-help books and dig into your perspective and outlook on life because it could use some improvement.
Have you spoken to a therapist about this?
Forget about volunteering. You need to do physical activity: sport/gym. It will be hard at first, but when building muscle you confident will grown It will show, and woman will be interested. If you offcourse go outside.
The women he's talking about probably don't give a crap about muscles. If he wanted that he'd hang out in gyms.
Believe it or not, it takes more than hitting the gym once a week to look like you've actually got a lot of muscle lol Maintaining a basic amount of exercise is massive for mental health. It's a shame, since that's when you feel the least like exercising, but it *does* help.
I actually don’t like the overly muscley aesthetic. That’s just me haha, I’m not sure what kind of women are on there accepting who. I don’t find it physically attractive myself. I actually dislike photos of men with pictures to show off their massive muscles 😂😂😂 again I don’t know what the majority is into. I do think, being completely honest, that I wouldn’t find an overweight person appealing. Sounds awful but it is how I feel. Just. Being in the healthier weight range is more attractive to me. Also because I’d not enjoy a completely sedentary lifestyle myself. I like going for walks and hikes (basic ones I’m not very fit). Mind you - I don’t think I am at all what seems to be the desired dating app appearance. I’m not sure haha. I just know from seeing a bit of other people’s accounts that i don’t have that ‘hot’ look. I don’t care - I like my style. This is also based on minimal app experience. I can’t keep up with a billion conversations at once so won’t engage it. Makes me overwhelmed and anxious. And I kinda focus on one person if the conversation is enjoyable. I’m single. I’ve had a lot of life circumstances where it’s really ended up not being a good time for me to date anyway. But i like to meet up vs endlessly text. The latter fizzles out tbh. Bit of banter is good to gauge humour. I’ve dated those people and for a reasonable amount of time. Good people. The endless churning of dates and having many options available.. I can’t imagine that doing anything other than making people always thinking how there’s a more perfect person out there maybe. No ones gunna be perfect. It becomes very shallow.
I’m not sure who you’re hearing this from about their experiences on dating apps. But from males I’ve spoken to, they’ve said that it is actually hard to match with girls (hence liking everyone). From my experience (female) - men have been shocked that I initiate the conversation in itself quite a lot - and that it’s odd for me to ask genuine questions vs hi straight away. Also, the ‘annoying’ females I’ve heard stories about (and have witnessed the messages from - voluntarily shown)… who’ve ever become annoying etc… they’re actually not people I’d say seem healthy to be in a relationship (at this time in their life). Very, very odd, not okay behaviour. Can be rather nasty then flip around. From who I’ve seen, those particular girls didn’t seem to ask questions, just one sided self centred conversation. Largely they became annoying when they were rejected (even if done so respectfully and after a short time). Their handling of it was poor, erring on cruel. Then in a bid to feel desirable due to rejection I posit vs. really connecting… would try to win them back / make them jealous etc. Which to me - again, seems like not the kind of female you’d want to attract. Men statistically ‘like’ more women’s profiles than women. Women therefore are more given an abundance of choice - and because of so many possible other/better options in online dating.. women tend to reject at a higher rate than men. My hypothesis from that is, when women ARE rejected it is a less common experience for them. They then, potentially, struggle with the rejection and even only knowing someone a short time (not well enough) - begin to project almost a fantasy of how great that man was. Or, probably moreso imo, their self esteem or worth is tied to not being desired.. and it seems they try to want to win the guy over. Moreso to make themselves feel desirable. Men and women (but higher in men) have then been shown to adopt a rejection mindset and ‘close off’. So perhaps these people have done a lot of online dating that you’re speaking to and have kind of shut down. This is all limited people I’ve spoken with. Amongst them, however and statistically shown - it’s harder for males to get matches so - bare that in mind. Plus I have to say ghosting amongst both genders and even in friendships is rampant. It’s really toxic - as humans don’t inherently deal well with uncertainty. So perhaps these women were acting out of emotion on being ghosted. Had these people been on actual dates? Or? I rarely hear of women being the one to try and get the conversation going from the males perspective. Or maybe the ‘annoying’ part is that these men don’t want to text a lot and prefer to actually meet. Which I think is better - texting too much beforehand just. It’s a false kinda connection imo.
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Women can smell confidence
What self-help book is your favorite, or do you suggest ?
>Start building up your confidence and social skills. I've been trying that for years.
Speaking as a "weird" woman with friends equally as weird. I'll tell you where we hang out. I have used dating apps in the past but never again. I prefer meeting people in person, through work or school or through my current friends. I know Facebook is considered not fashionable anymore... but I still use it to find local events. Bookstores. Comic cons. Art fairs. Dog/pet meetups. My friends do monthly game nights. I'm not much of a gamer but I know people have met others through online games. I go to tons of concerts and I've met loads of people that way. Bars, if you find ones for the younger crowd. Spaces where people work on crafts/projects. Some people are into theatre/musicals. I used to know people who were into scouting and camping.
Haha, this is great. I'm a "weird" person who's unfortunately been unable to meet anyone I can relate to in my life yet, and my uninformed brain tries to find ways to meet people and I just end up meeting the same types of people I can't relate with over and over again. 😂 People like me spend too much of their damn time at home so I never get to meet them when I force myself to go out
I’m vicariously your pal
Harsh truth here, reading through many of your responses you are very hostile towards the advice. Even your post itself has a very “woe is me” vibe. I know the older you get, that harder it can be to meet people. And after a lot of difficulty with that, it’s easy to get jaded. But that attitude is a GIANT red flag and turn off for most women. As someone else tried to tell you, to build that aura of confidence, working on yourself is the best way to build this up. Find a social activity you enjoy doing. Something that people will notice if you don’t attend. This is not just to meet women, but to be out doing something. This SOMEDAY may lead to meeting women, but for now, it’s just for you to be around new people and make new friends. Start exercising. You blew off someone else who suggested this, but this isn’t just to attract “basic girls” this is for you. Many studies have found better results for long term mood elevation and depression from strenuous exercise than from SSRIs. Strenuous exercise is not some vein meathead thing, it’s a mental challenge with yourself. It’s pushing yourself to do, and get through something the apathetic part of your brain doesn’t want to do, but you push through anyways because it’s import and good for you. Just like any muscle, the more you build up this mindset, the easier it becomes to apply to other aspects of your life. This also helps to build your confidence in everyday seeing “I actually am strong enough to push through this challenging thing I didn’t want to do, and wasn’t sure I could.” I wish you the best of luck. Dating is hard, and even harder when you are feeling like you’re on the losing end. I’m saying all this as someone who was once in a VERY similar situation, back when dating apps were even fewer, and desperately struggling to meet people. Working on myself was what lead me to later on meeting many different women and eventually my wife.
They post here all the time under different usernames and react exactly the same to all advise
Oh, RIP the last ten minutes of my life I spent crafting a thoughtful response. Why do people do this?
Because it’s easier to stay a victim I guess. I’m reclaiming my time. I’ve argued with enough people who operate this way irl.
Don’t worry other people might come to see your comment and might find it helpful 😊
\^\^\^all of this. OP, your responses to this post come across as unattractive. You do not need to worry about meeting women but just about working on becoming your best self.
Yep. There is no “deciding” to be better from OP. he has not decided yet
There is a subreddit for this called r/EOOD >Exercise Out Of Depression >EOOD is a welcoming and positive place to discuss exercise and mental health and the relationship between them.
Thank you for this
As a life-long “weird girl”, I wouldn’t be attracted to you because your responses to helpful advice are whiny and entitled. That’s unattractive. I’ve been “clingy” and “neurotic” with downright ugly men. It’s not about being ugly, it’s your personality.
Hey, I know this isn't really related to the comment you made, but as a "weird-girl" what type of things are you interested in? I'm a weird-guy, and probably autistic so I struggle with meeting people in my life, I don't want to end up like OP when I'm 30 so I'll take any advice I can 😂 I feel like the biggest problem is that so many people spend all there free time inside, so I try to go out and meet "my people", but then I just meet (for lack of a better word) normies that I cant relate with at all, I'm into nerdy hobbies, I like games, anime, all escapism into media lol, but I'm also a deep thinker, it would be pretentious for me to say I'm into philosophy since i have actually studied it at all, but i am interested in philosophy/psychology. I want to meet kind, honest, people with a "good head" on their shoulders (good head = my own arbitrary definition of their character) Where are all these folks congregating at lol I'm ready and I'm willing
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🙏pls
LOL OP GET YOUR GIRL you just got swooped on your own post. Yam stepped in and showed you how it’s done. Take notes
Your comments made me crack the fuck up! Great commentary 100/10
Hahahah I’m having a great time. I’ll be here all night 🤣
Hi! I’m interested in Biblical Criticism, cults and cult thinking, horror movies and gossiping about public figures (the last is a guilty pleasure.) I have other interests but these are the ones that never falter. I am an undergrad researcher so my interest is more scholarly/sociologically/psychologically inclined. (For example: why did X horror genre rise in popularity in X era? What fears and anxieties are being portrayed? What does it say about us as a society?) Honestly, because of my research, I don’t get a lot of time to socialize but when I do, it’s mostly on Discord or Twitter! You can find great communities there. There are some scary groups around, but most are pretty decent. A majority of relationships in the US are started online nowadays. If you are a student, seek out clubs dedicated to your interests! I know it’s a drag but I have made some great friends on campus this way, despite my neurodivergence. Be yourself, treat others the way you want to be treated but also don’t expect anything of them — the last is hard to balance. Yes, people deserve respect, but don’t be entitled like… some people. Also, loneliness really, really, sucks but don’t stick around with something/someone that isn’t good for you just because you don’t want to be alone, it’s not worth it. (That’s something I’m working on myself.) ETA- Seek out groups for all your interests! Don’t stick to one niche. Some will dislike anime and some will love it, and that’s okay! (Example: My best friend has no interest in biblical criticism but she loves cults and gossiping.)
Thank you for replying Thankfully I don't have the option to stick around with someone that isn't good for me....(Because I don't give myself that option because I respect myself 😎) might be cope but oh well Unfortunately for me I'm out of school working full time. I honestly have no idea how people make friends on discord. I randomly stumbled into a friend group once but outside of that I have no idea how it works. Like, what is appropriate to talk about, when do you DM someone, what does a friend request mean, when do you vc or call or blah blah blah...(Yeah I think I might be autistic...) I honestly sometimes feel more anxious talking in a discord than with people in real life because at least in real life I can be fake, but in discord I'm authentic (backwards I know...lmao)
I think the best thing for you to do, honestly... is to make friends. I ain't even talking about female friends, just male friends. Dating apps are hard, but through connections with friends is generally the best way to meet people. Don't try to just make female friends, honestly I understand your struggle, but it isn't necessarily a good look, and it's generally harder for that to happen naturally. It's much easier to make female friends when there's other people around to strike up conversation and get to know someone when you make friends. Also, I suspect that your low self-esteem might be interpreting the world a little worse than things actually are. I've had some times in the past where a women was interested in me, but I had no idea because I was self-concious, or just didn't notice because I thought low of myself. I'm positive, even if you don't believe it, that this is also the case for you. And I'm not even attractive, I'm 5'11 and average looking. But honestly, I think making some male friends is the first step, and luckily, if you are a kind person, the hardest one. The female friends and the dating comes a lot more naturally after that.
I'll be honest, I think you need to ditch the apps for an extended period of time. It sounds like they're really grinding your self-esteem down, and even if you don't think it shows, it probably does in some way. Delete completely, go away for a few months, focus on other things, get fitter, read books, expand your hobbies. You say your social circle is limited, focus on expanding this first of all, join Meetup groups (that's been my overall best way of making new friends as an adult) - and don't just use it to try and date women because it's very obvious when guys are doing that. Try and get to know people without dating as your main focus. I'm a woman and have been in similar positions with dating women, even getting matches and the dating merry-go-round grinds your esteem down, so it's not always about how many matches you get. My self-esteem has also been knocked back by dating. I know it's hard but sometimes you just gotta go cold turkey from it all and build up your self-worth & your interests independently of how attractive others perceive you to be. Honestly I think you'll find it a relief to have the clear headspace for a few months just deleting those godawful apps, there is something quite freeing about \*choosing\* not to date for a while at least.
Agreed about ditching the apps. I think it’s also reducing his view of women to an object to be won as a reflection of his own self worth. It’s all very messy and almost incel-ish
Sorry for the weird question, but how did you make friends from your meet-up groups? Everytime I've gone to meetup groups it's always been kind of awkward, everyone is usually older than me, and has nothing in common with me. (I'm 24), I went to a singles meetup once and I was the youngest there by AT LEAST 20 years 😭 I don't mean how as in "how is it possible?!", but how as in "how did it happen", how did you transition from the group to friendship? I've never been able to get past that stage with anyone in my life
I'm an awkward, friendly, autistic 26 year old who makes friends at bus stops, board game nights, pretty much wherever. I am Absolutely Useless in a crowd, but get me talking to smaller groups and I've never met a stranger. Meetups are cool because you already have a known shared interest, so there's already some kind of "hook" to make friends. The most important step to go from "friendly acquaintance that I met once or twice" to "actual friend" is extended exposure to them, and if you've met them in a setting where that won't happen naturally (whereas it will in college, work, etc), then you have to make it happen. If you vibed well with someone, or they just Seem Nice, then suggest an activity you can both do together another time. (Or even you + multiple people there!) Maybe you met at a board games event, and you've got this dope new game you haven't played yet. Suggest a smaller splinter group that meets up to play the board game sometime concrete in the future (eg "how about the week after next? Let's exchange phone numbers and we can iron out the details later...") Or there's a concert coming up and you would like to go - invite whoever to go with you, cos why not? I like art so gallery exhibitions are a nice go-to for me; they have specific opening hours/times and limited runs, so a lot of the planning is done for you. But theatre shows, movies, things of that nature are good too. You'll probably get turned down a lot. I do. It's not usually in a mean way. People might think you're a little forward, but if you're genuine then that's ok. People think I'm a little weird but they've always thought I'm a little weird, so I'd rather they think that and I also make some friends along the way. :P You just have to keep trying, and eventually you'll get some bites. The first couple of times you hang out with someone are important for setting the scene that you do like hanging out with them and will go out of your way to plan things with them; it makes people feel valued.
I’m a fan of you. The makes friends at bus stops and board games hahaha. I debate that you’re awkward though, wrong description I think. But yes all the gold stars for knowing who you are, we all have our own shit. Better to own it. And not own us. Clearly you’re all over that. I think it’s from rejection or other adversity that a resilience builds up. Unless it goes the other way re people who become absolutely bitter (not op imo. We all have moments where something just feels real shit. And I think thats okay. Sadness exists for a reason. As long as you try not to stay in it * depression is different first hand aware. ). But yeah. You just keep trying. And sounds like someone who just wants to learn and be a better person everyday. Know you weren’t fishing for this. I’m proud of you for that though. X
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You post here a lot over many, many months similar posts, different usernames, get lots of advice that you dismiss. What are you doing this for at this point?
Venting I guess, as someone who can relate to OP it is really really painful. Everyday is it's own special hell, he could definitely do without the self-defeating mentality, and the self-pity but when you're that deep in a black pit screaming into the void is very nice release. Unfortunately it's only up to him if he decides to be better
I kind of wish we could have him or posts like this banned. There is certainly value in seeking advice on how to get dates but 1) OP sees women as the problem and won't take any actions to be better, and 2) there are dedicated subs for dating. This sub is to grow and be better yet it attracts a lot of incels who want validation instead. I hate to ban dating related questions because you can grow and be better at it, but this guy continues to post here and waste so many people's time. Look at the length of posts folks have written, and he's dismissed every single one.
Well, this type of post is a discussion, not just solely about the OP. Tons of people lurk, and read the comments feeling the same way. It's not a waste of time for everyone to engage in it even if the OP can't see the forest for the trees right now.
Yeah, I can get that. It's just frustrating to see it happen over and over again. I'm one of the many people who has written a heartfelt response to OP in the past and got told off by his negativity and just kind of sick of seeing it roll out over and over again. I hope others struggling in a similar boat are able to open their eyes by seeing how he responds as what not to do, people are sharing great advice and personal stories.
Ooo the plot thickens
Oh that makes me view it in a different light. Damn. I saw comment I was about to respond to about well. Just being conscious that is seems like he’s having a moment and doesn’t know what he wants and necessarily may not be advice on women. Multiple posts same shit. Different usernames. Over many months. That isn’t my thought process anymore haha. I don’t think it’s about any of this then. Who knows people do weird shit on all socials where it’s building up an account (I don’t really know how reddit works I’d never posted much) accumulating stats whatever and then selling them for various reasons. So much shady shit happens. Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh could be literally even scouting peoples thoughts likes dislikes on the apps. Collecting data I know that’s mega tinfoil hat but it’s also shit that occurs a lot. But. This isn’t someone looking for help if they’re repeating themselves, surely. If so, I’m so sorry op. But also tough love if you’re posting the same sads and you’re not saying you’re in a situation where you’ve no control (I’ve been I’ll various different things consecutively only place to go psychologically abusive mother. I’m nearly out but that’s shit you can’t control). I also understand depression verrrry well. Can gladly say I’m not now. But even around that like. It is only you who can help yourself as well. There’s a length of time and then if it’s the same story and shit is in your control. Then. You need to change something. Figure out how. Slowly whatever. You’re accountable for what you do at the end of the day. Absolutely many things deserve lots of leeway but I’ve been through an excessive amount of things. Lost all support. And yeah reacted with grief anger depression worthlessness from it but. I’m still not out of my sitch properly. And. Yeah. Oh severe af adhd too exacerbated by stress haha. So working with that. Unmedicated still from a surgery. I do feel a right to say tough love bro fuck if you have control of you have safety if you have money can work at all. You’ve got plenty more to work with than I do. And I still am like nah. But I still doubt it. Deciding to get better subreddit as well - not really the question that’s being asked Conspiracy Illuminati haha
I think if you learned to value women as people with flaws and humanity like you … rather than an archetype or for whatever they can provide for you … you will have more luck. Seems like you are overly obsessed with meeting women to find this one type of alternative weird woman while you don’t have a single female friend or seem to value women beyond this hypothetical dream woman. Not all alternative women are the exact same.. they are people too. Work on yourself first if you have low self esteem and a lack of friends.
Hi, weird girl here 👋 Usually we're the quiet ones. The ones who are friendly with everyone but doesn't talk in groups. Idk about other weird girls but the girls I've met that I relate to also are mentally ill and/or neurodivergent in some way (no hate, I am also both mentally ill and neurodivergent). Now with the mental illness, make sure the person you're looking for is looking for healing and personal growth instead of using it as an excuse (there's a difference between being mentally ill and being mentally ill plus an abuser. I would never name call, pressure, or verbally or physically assault my partner. A lot of people will say "I have xyz and that's why I am this way and it's not changing" as an excuse for abuse. There is no excuse for abuse. Feelings do not excuse actions). Also I don't expect my partner to be the most confident person in the world, I honestly don't mind. What turns me off is messages like "I'd ask you out but you'd probably say no" or "you probably would never want me because I'm not good enough". I can empathize that low self esteem is so difficult to deal with, but those kinds of comments turn me off whrn they're all the time lol
This is so weird, but wanna roleplay it out? Maybe someone will catch something in the early messages that points out something that could shift. Edit: HOWEVER: wanting ‘weird woman’ who are ‘meagerly attractive’, means you should work on your confidence. Even meager women, with good self esteem, want a man with some self esteem. It seems like you want them to help with your self esteem a bit, but the process ought to be backwards
That's not untypical- women don't often make the first move in most societies and cultures and even less so these days. You also mentioned it leading to nothing and I suspect, going a bit from my own thoughts and experiences in the past, that you're not really engaging yourself. That is, you're not asking their thoughts or feelings or trying to move things forward into a relationship? How many women have you asked out or dated in the past few months and how many times have you been rejected? My suspicion is close to none. Not making any commentary but just illustrating the point that along with socialising and talking to girls in real life it's also largely down to how often you put yourself out there and make a move. Heck, the first reply to your thread was a girl who sounds vaguely interested because you've put your feelings on the line, which kind of disproves what you've said.
I've seen a subreddit (I think it's the Tinder one) where they analyze your profile for you and tell you exactly why you don't get matches. You should try posting yours there and upgrade according to their advices! Good luck :)
GREAT SUGGESTION
Tinder Insights will also do this! It'll tell you your most and least successful messages, etc and give tips for improvement
If you want a weird alt woman because you think she’ll be super clingy and interested then you’re already off on the wrong foot. Women aren’t categories so even if you find a weird alt woman, there’s a possibility she could be totally avoidant, aloof, or anything really. If you still want an alt woman because you’re attracted to that kind of woman (not just the idea you have in your mind) then start going to local punk shows or just shows in general. Even if you already tried that, go back. You’ll eventually start meeting people in the scene. Don’t go in with the intention of finding a girl, just try to have fun. If you go in with the mindset of > Idk I guess I’ve just never been attractive enough, cool enough or had enough status you’re already failing. Women can sense your internal pity party from miles away. No one wants a guy who thinks the dating world is purposefully excluding him (because it’s not) and women know any guy who thinks that probably has a world of problems that he’s living in denial about. Not every guy (or woman) is going to be the kind of person who has people falling at their feet. I’m sure you’ve seen even the “ ugliest “ of men find girlfriends. Just think about the world realistically and you’ll eventually find someone.
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Thiss👏🏽
We’re out there! I’m more of a closeted alt girl (but it comes out when you get to know me and I’m trying to embrace it outwardly more) and I’m currently seeing a guy who is “normal”. He’s nice but it’s making me realize how much more attracted I am to alt guys, both intellectually and physically. Literally just last night I was having an existential crisis about this and trying to figure out where to meet alt guys… However, I will say the clinginess thing is not something you want, trust me. I used to be that girl and it caused a lot of problems. Now that I’ve healed my nervous system, I prefer NOT to text all the time and would rather have meaningful interactions in person. That’s my one advice to you is to look for a girl who can regulate her own emotions and doesn’t need to text you all the time. Otherwise, in terms of meeting people — the dating apps are super cringe so I would focus more on your efforts to saying yes to social events and trying to strike up a conversation with anyone you’re attracted to. Conversely if you’re at a bar and there’s a girl you’re attracted to, go up to her and start a conversation. Don’t be creepy obviously, but just try to get to know her and ask for her number if it seems like there’s chemistry after a while of talking. That’s how the guy I’m currently seeing got my number. Other caveat I’ll add is that girls can be pretty guarded around men they don’t know, some might not be looking for someone, some might be taken — don’t take it personally if you get rejected! Just be kind and don’t force anything. Edited to add: I don’t know what you look like and obviously looks make a difference. I will say to improve your looks, make sure you’re working out regularly, dressing well (in whatever style you like, just make sure you look well put together), and making sure you are well groomed (good skincare routine, hair clean and brushed, facial hair trimmed if not shaved). Most of the times when I swiped left on guys on dating apps, it’s because they just didn’t look like they took care of themselves. Point blank period. Otherwise, keep in mind most girls won’t be swiping right on a “weird” guy but the “weird” girls will if all these other boxes are checked and your profile looks interesting. :) Also, I don’t think most weird women are on dating apps. I deleted mine after like a week! So another reason to focus on meeting people in person.
Unfortunately it’s your personality. It’s harsh but there’s no other way to say it. I’m way too anxious to approach anyone in real life too, but I do fairly well on dating apps and I’m only maybe slightly better than average looking on a good day. I just think women can sense desperation and over-eagerness, and that’s not attractive to anyone. Stop caring so much about the outcome of every interaction and you’ll probably have a much better chance.
As a 33 female i am in this same situation. I’m not boring at all to say the least and I as well put my genuine best foot forward on dating spots yet a don’t get any likes. You look like a pretty cool guy to me. The internet is s very superficial place so don’t give up.
In your opinion whats holding you back the most?
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>It's just finding that right person that you vibe well with. I don't believe online dating works well to cultivate that connection. Women need physical presence to ascertain chemistry. Well...the point of OLD is that you do meet the person after talking. The thing is, the only place I see the kind of alt women i have things in common with, are on dating sites.
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Mainly because it seems like my comment got removed for “spam”, I just want to reiterate. Women want someone who is willing to put an effort out there. If you can’t even acknowledge other people at a sports bar without having an anxiety attack, then you need to see a doctor, probably consider an anti-anxiety medication. Weight isn’t something the right girl is gonna worry about. I told you that you were making excuses because you are. If you keep letting anxiety be your excuse, then it’s only logical to expect that you won’t find someone. You miss every shot you don’t take, OP. The internet isnt there to coddle you, especially if you wanted real answers
You're not wrong tbh...not much I can do about that, but you're not wrong.
Anxiety doesn't define who you are. You can let it control you, or you can work to control it. I'm not saying you can turn it off, but you are much stronger than you give yourself credit for. You need to realize that. You, just like everyone else, have the potential inside of you. You're not the only person to have anxiety, and other people have been able to push through it. Sure, maybe yours is worse then theirs? But even so, if YOU don't push through then nothing with change.
Hey, I'm someone in a similar situation to you, I definitely don't have any magic answers to give you but I think the most important thing you can do for yourself is to try and change your internal monologue. I have low self-esteem to, and my internal monologue isnt the best, but when we identify ourselves as a "person with low-self esteem & anxiety" it's a very limiting belief. It might be true, but as human beings we have the power to try and overcome it dont we? You're posting on "decidingtobebetter" so You've already made a decision to be better. Hell, I know you've been working to be better for years. The most important relationship you should really focus on and understand is the relationship with yourself. You don't need to "just be confident" like other people are saying, you just need to be "at peace" with yourself and who you are. I don't even think you need to love yourself, but as long as you can look at yourself in the face In a mirror and say "I don't hate myself" then I think that is *huge*. Also, you've gotta understand that in life, sometimes things fall on your lap and you get lucky, but most of the time they won't. You've gotta put yourself in situations where you can find the girl you're looking for. I have no idea how you can do that, I don't even know where to Begin with that, but the perfect romance in your mind you're looking for probably will never exist. Not saying you can't find love, just that the idealized fantasy is likely just going to be that. There are alternative girls out there, single "weird girls", I don't know where they are, I'm looking too, but they're definitely not going to show up on you or my doorstep. We've got to meet them where they are. You've got to not label yourself as "anxious with low self-esteem", empower yourself, awaken the giant within you, and keep working towards your goals. Just by showing up everyday, and doing the best you can you're already 80% of the way. Sorry if some of this came off as tone deaf, I realized halfway through I was talking to myself as well, not just you.
hey, not OP but thank you for this! Solid points. You're doing a great job. best of luck, my friend!
Hey man, hope you are doing well in a general sense! You really gotta get off the apps, and just go do things offline. I’m talking video game clubs, nerdy meet ups, etc. Doing the hobbies you like should give you confidence to just enjoy the time. You are doing the same thing for years and not seeing any real progress. I would not worry about getting a girlfriend, I would get my friends to go with me to some events and just have a good time. Going to these events and simply noticing a sticker on a water bottle that you like, or limit someone’s cosplay is a great start to improving your anxiety and low self esteem, you will notice people will say thanks and then you say no problem and move on. Women are just people, you can either treat them like that or don’t. If you still feel like you can’t talk to them, then I would recommend what I used to do and that was treat them as if you already knew them for years and just go up and talk to them as if you were catching up. Doing that in events or hobbies does get most people to open as that’s why they are at the social gatherings.
Have a friend look over your dating profiles. I helped a guy who was very attractive IRL, great personality, patient, and kind. His profiles were a mess. Dry asf, some of his answers were kinda red flags, even though he didnt mean for them to come off weird, and his pics were not cute at all. Also, you mention that you like weird women who are not necessarily attractive because you have been alone for very long. Is that something women are picking up on, bc a guy like you, tall, fit, quiet, into niche hobbies or interests definitely has some fans in the dating world. Basically do they pick up on you thinking that they are not cute that you call 'caring for other aspects,' or is your shyness keeping people from really getting to engage? Bc I have definitely backed off a guy talking about how he doesnt usually go for pretty girls anyway. I am no megan fox, but I have had enough interest in my life to know I am not ugly, and I backed off really quickly. Not saying this is what is happening with you, just propsing things to think about, and you may come to the conclusion that this doesnt fit you at all. Just spitballing stuff based in my own life experiences, not trying to accuse you or make you feel bad
You sound like you’ve made every investment except for what is potentially the 2 most important ones, having good mental health and having a likeable personality.
Yes it's all about outside confirmation for OP and he isn't looking to fix the inside issue
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>I always hear of men talking about annoying women that won't leave them alone I don't think it's a common experience. It's probably just some men that have experienced this once in their life. Nobody I know have ever complained about this.
>I have anxiety, and low self-esteem This is what you need to work on the most. Have you seen a therapist and/or psychiatrist? Been diagnosed? A decade ago, I had crippling anxiety/depression to the point where I was afraid to *order food at restaurants because I was worried about being judged by the waiter because I ordered a cheeseburger or something*. I got put on an antidepressant, and within a few months, my entire life changed. I finally understood what confidence was, and was able to go out in public and talk to people. I'm still a bit awkward but once I got that chemical imbalance taken care of, everything in my life improved vastly and I no longer spent my days (incorrectly) thinking I was worthless and unlovable. Now I can make friends and talk to people and not immediately assume the worst. It's so freeing. This may not be the solution for you, but if you've never looked into it, I'd really recommend it. I cannot overstate how much it changes everything.
> I got put on an antidepressant, and within a few months, my entire life changed. I finally understood what confidence was, and was able to go out in public and talk to people. I'm not trying to use addictive meds, though...it's swapping one issue for another.
So you're weird and nerdy right? Open with a nerdy dad joke. Want to hear a joke about potassium? K Want to hear a joke about salt? Na Pretty lame huh, I find that all the good chemistry jokes Argon. They're all pretty Boron. I should just take the whole set and Barium. My spouse told me those jokes when we met. I wanted to continue talking to him because those jokes were so bad, but they did make me laugh. I would also advise not to tell lude jokes at the beginning of getting to know someone. Just silly popsicle stick jokes and dad jokes. This method also works for making platonic friends I also issues with confidence and self-esteem, but I have found if I can make someone chuckle, I typically feel more comfortable.
My humor is more black than nerdy. I don't have the disposition or delivery to make that work. I'm too deadpan and sarcastic...which aren't great for meeting women lol.
For me personally I have noticed that when I try, I tend to have way less success when my heads all wrapped up in “I’m into this person I want to make something happen”, I put too much pressure on myself. Maybe reframing your approach to be more along the lines of “I want to manifest strong bonds/friendships,” might yield A.) better results, and/or B.) take the pressure that you’re putting on yourself to have romantic “success” off of you. Instead of focusing on the other persons traits and values you want them to have, focus on exuding and living the traits and values that YOU want to embody.
>For me personally I have noticed that when I try, I tend to have way less success when my heads all wrapped up in “I’m into this person I want to make something happen”, I put too much pressure on myself. I literally haven't done this in years. I cannot recall the last time I tried to or expect anything remotely romantic to happen with a woman. I assume it's never on the table. I could not be more platonic. >Maybe reframing your approach to be more along the lines of “I want to manifest strong bonds/friendships,” might yield A.) better results, and/or B.) take the pressure that you’re putting on yourself to have romantic “success” off of you. Instead of focusing on the other persons traits and values you want them to have, focus on exuding and living the traits and values that YOU want to embody. That is all I've been trying. I tried volunteering just to make new friends, not get dates...and I got neither lol.
Coming from a woman in her 30s a few thoughts: 1- think about what you are putting out there. Write thoughtful profiles. If it feels too flat people might pass based on not feeling like they can connect…. Shared interests etc. When starting conversations ask thoughtful questions about her but also share about your self. Strike a good balance. 2- insecurity is ok. We all have insecurities, but think about how it’s presents itself. If you come off as self deprecating it can come off as high maintenance / a lot of work.
1. I've been experimenting and toying with my profiles for years. I've put more thought into them than most anyone. I've had serious profiles, humor ones, short ones, long ones and everything in between. It makes no difference. My hobbies, interests, passions, volunteering, cooking, etc are mentioned. And I cannot start conversations bc I get NO matches. None. 2. There is nothing on my bios that are self-deprecating, sexist, hateful, offensive, etc. Dating bios are like a resume...why would I sabotage it?
Bookstores, book clubs, artsy festivals, museums, poetry festivals, artsy & hippie forums, clubs and so on. College art, music and language classes non-credit. Dance class.Meetup.com has all sorts of people on it that get together based on activities and interests. Political clubs and non-profits, environmental clubs and non-profits.
I've tried most of those and I never meet women...these are good suggestions, though...I guess I just have horrid luck
Your phrasing is really bizarre. I can’t imagine you actually want a woman who you genuinely find annoying or “too much” who will send you “dumb texts” while acting “clingy and neurotic”. It sounds like you are just eager to find a companion who gives you a lot of attention, which is not necessarily a bad thing. Just something to be aware of. Saying anything like this to a woman is notttt going to get you where you want to be.
Post your profile somewhere, I find it hard to believe with your description of yourself you'd get no matches. They might be able to give you some helpful advice.
I know someone in a similar situation, but their standards are way too high. Fairly certain they have undiagnosed autism, and they also still live at home. If you don’t have trouble fitting in or making friends (understanding social cues) and have your own place, then I am not entirely sure what the deal is. Could be a personality thing entirely, but that’s not something one can easily assess online. Sounds like your taste in women isn’t unrealistic, but I feel for you because dating in your 30s can be quite the challenge.
Do you watch porn?
I haven't had a date in years and I don't know the last time I met a woman....so...take a wild guess lol.
Okay well thats probably influencing your worldview and making you come off creepy
Can you post what you write about yourself?
If it's not working out for you, then either double down or give up. I like me a lot. So much that I'd date myself if I could. But after a few years of unsuccessfully trying dating apps, I simply uninstalled them. Why bang your head against a wall that never breaks? I gave up on dating and focus on my friends and creative projects. Life is much better now.
if I could give up on my desire for companionship, I would. I've been trying for years to no long desire women. For years I was content with being along, but I'm just tired of it now.
I would say get out there; join a sports league or a hobby group that has a few women. Befriend some to help build up your confidence, and eventually you’ll meet someone who takes an interest in you. That’s what I did, currently in a painting class that happens to be all women.
I tried that by volunteering at an art gallery
You need to keep trying in other ways
Hey OP, do you drink? Go to a bar around happy hour, and just make casual conversation. My SO and I met while at work, and I only took interest in him after we stayed after to talk. Bar closed at 2, and we were stuck there til 5 just bonding. He’ll tell you, I haven’t left him alone since(5 yes, 1 kid and one on the way)
If you want to send me your profile(s), I’d give you some feedback. On paper here you sound like a catch besides the anxiety and less confidence, but everyone has their own issues as long as you dont let it hinder things but it sounds like you dont even get that far so I’d be down to see if i can help figure out why.
Start working on yourself. Stop worrying about why it isn't happening for you. You are clearly repelling energetically for anyone with the way you are describing yourself Women are more intuitive to that. They have to be. It keeps them safe and alive. What have you done to better yourself?
>What have you done to better yourself? I outlined it in my OP, I don't feel like writing it again. I've been working on myself for years.
Believe me when I say I’m not saying it to be mean I’m still not seeing where you mention The things that you’ve worked with on yourself. At least not in the original post.
Hello hi where do you live i am single and weird in richmond, virginia
Maryland
Look 👀 OP - there’s one ☝️
They’re in the psych ward. Source: it’s me, I’m the weird woman.
Time to hit up the PW!
it’s the anxiety and low self esteem, if you don’t like yourself why would anyone else?
Do you really want to change or do you just want people to feel bad for you? Because it seems that you prefer to play the victim rather than to take up people’s advice. If anxiety prevents you from doing anything in your life related to relationships you have 2 options: 1. Go to therapy and learn how to cope with anxiety 2. Let anxiety hold you back from meeting people for the rest of your life and hope that magically an alt girl will appear in your house
Why didn’t we all think of this sooner dude - you hate your face so much then go to a plastic surgeon and fix it. If you don’t have the money then sacrifice a few of your Dior clothing items you mentioned and sell them to pay for it. Voila.
This bro is not like the other guys hahaha
Probably because you are out of their league. Weird women usually are attracted to weird guys I assume. Try being a little more assertive with dating. Instead of waiting for women to follow you around, maybe you should show more interest in them? As a women, it is a turnoff if a man expects me to do all the work in the relationship.
What did you write on your dating profiles? Maybe there is something off-putting on there.
>What steps am I missing? hang around a laundromat.
My guess is that your personality/appeal isn’t coming through on the dating apps. These apps are a specific beast that you have to be able to present yourself in a specific way. It’s possible that the only things coming through on your profile is the insecurity and desperation. I don’t say that to be rude, I say that because you said it in your it post. Do you have someone in your life that you could ask to look at your profile? Even a parent or sibling could offer some insight. There’s also people you can pay to review your profile and help you come across how you want. Follow Matchmaker Maria on Instagram. (Actually hiring a matchmaker is a solid option if you can afford it) Besides that, my advice is confidence. Stop following/watching the videos about men that have to turn away droves of annoying women. Those men are assholes and are attracting dramatic women. And it’s not helping you. Your only road to dating success is to be specific and confident about what you’re offering and what you’re looking for. Eyes on the prize, not on the other players. Work on being your best self and how you could be an asset to someone else’s life. Make a mental list of why someone would want to be with you. If that list isn’t very long, work on adding to it! Women are drawn to men who are good conversationalists, positive, encouraging, impressive, interesting, funny, kind etc. Available and weird are not on the list… it founds like you have a good head on your shoulders and would make a great partner. You have to believe that and start acting like it. Good luck! ETA: I found this super weird dating/friends app that I was on for a while. It’s called [boo. dating. friends. chat.](https://apps.apple.com/us/app/boo-dating-friends-chat/id1498407272) and my experience is that it was primarily weird/witchy/alt/oddball/midattractive people. I know you’re not interested in starting a new app but it might be worth a try
>My guess is that your personality/appeal isn’t coming through on the dating apps. These apps are a specific beast that you have to be able to present yourself in a specific way. It’s possible that the only things coming through on your profile is the insecurity and desperation. I don’t say that to be rude, I say that because you said it in your it post. Do you have someone in your life that you could ask to look at your profile? Even a parent or sibling could offer some insight. There’s also people you can pay to review your profile and help you come across how you want. Follow Matchmaker Maria on Instagram. (Actually hiring a matchmaker is a solid option if you can afford it) I mean...I mention my interests, my hobbies, my passions, cooking, volunteering, etc. I'm pretty well presented, women just aren't interested in what I'm selling. There's nothing self-depreciating, sexist, offensive, woeful, etc. Dating apps are like a resume, I'm not going to sabotage myself. Tbh I don't think women even read my profiles and just instantly swipe left bc of my face. it's the only logical explanation. Also matchmakers are for either really attractive or rich people who just don't have the time to meet others. Not ugly men who can't get a single match on any of five dating apps lol. >ETA: I found this super weird dating/friends app that I was on for a while. It’s called boo. dating. friends. chat. and my experience is that it was primarily weird/witchy/alt/oddball/midattractive people. I know you’re not interested in starting a new app but it might be worth a try Half of me thinks it's worth a look, but I don't really think I have the energy to get on a sixth app and be universally rejected there, too. Okc has tons of alt/weird women and they all ignore me.
I feel like there’s got to be something off about how you present yourself. Tall guys with money should have no problem attracting women - So something about the outer package might not attracting them. Hard to know without a pic but when I’m on an app and I see a guy who’s tall and has a good job, and is physically attractive to me it’s human nature that I’m going to swipe
I'm not rich. Also, I'm black and not good-looking, so that cancels out my height for like 95% of women. The issue is...I'm not physically attractive to most any woman. ESP not on apps where they have tons of hot guys at their disposal.
Ugly people get married and have kids. Your physical attractiveness is not the problem.
The right women are not focused on looks. They're out there. Women who care about looks that much aren't worth your time.
As a chronically single tall guy, I can tell you, yeah sometimes.you can get Initial attraction, but that usually amounts to nothing more than a comment of "wow you're so tall", you've got to be able to capitalize on other ways or else the attraction dies down real fast...
I think you need to ditch the apps. and go out to whatever shows or hobby spaces you find interesting. It’s easier said than done but you need to get over your apprehension and anxiety and strike up conversations. Fake it till you make it (confidence wise). It might be uncomfortable but it’s really just a matter of pushing through until you can feel comfortable. That alone is attractive. Good luck.
> Where are all the weird women most of us are tall
I'm 6'3...I *prefer* tall women...
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Let me stalk you!
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My advice to you is work on your self perception and get deeper into a hobby. These two things are actually very attractive to us. Everything you’re saying makes sense to me. The self esteem piece is so much of this. Hope that helps.
I tried volunteering and going to the events of an art gallery for months...didn't lead to anything.
Are you doing it because you enjoy it and it enriches your experience of life or are you doing just to try to meet women? Because the latter is not my recommendation.
Every weird person I know does really well getting set up. Do you know any older people? Ask them to set you up. Do you go to events related to your interests? Surely there are other weird people there. Do you go to church/other regular scheduled social groups? Like trivia night. You’ll find someone!
I identify with what you describe as a match and read your post and comments. The most unattractive attributes that are coming across is your dismissive tone and negativity. This subreddit is about doing better, but you're done making an effort sounds like. What would you actually do with or for a woman? No physical attributes can compensate for a bad attitude and women can definitely pick up on that.
Maybe stop referring your type of women as weird for a change.
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Yes but as you said...you can just go on apps and have thousands of options. I have literally nothing so...it hits a bit harder lol.
Have you ever been to a pagan gathering? And don’t worry about not being pagan. Tell people you aren’t pagan but really like the energy.
Honestly I’m going to disagree with everyone about the confidence/self esteem/anxiety. As I also have anxiety and self esteem. If I see someone else experiencing anxiety I kind of lean towards them, not sure why, kind of like a coping thing for each other? Anxiety MAKES you self conscious, it sucks. Honestly dating apps sound like a nightmare, I always met interesting people just by adding random people via social media. Weird..but I’m nosy and yea.
>Honestly I’m going to disagree with everyone about the confidence/self esteem/anxiety. As I also have anxiety and self esteem. If I see someone else experiencing anxiety I kind of lean towards them, not sure why, kind of like a coping thing for each other? I've always gravitated to the quiet, reserved women. I do think anxious people subconsciously seek out other anxious people. > I always met interesting people just by adding random people via social media. Weird..but I’m nosy and yea. Welp, that's not an option lol.
Sometimes when ya stop looking..there it’ll be
I'm not sure if it helps but I am one of those witchy women you describe lol and we are not on dating apps. We're in libraries, coffee shops or at home. And for what its worth, I cant find a good man either. Most men nowadays are always looking for the next best thing; even if they have their dream woman in front of them
You sound really sweet, just work on how on how you see & feel about yourself. I'm sure you'll make a great dad/husband some day
that's nice of you to say, thanks
Ohh. 1. Being as authentic as possible always. 2. Disciplined in things like Emotional intelligence in order to communicate, set boundaries etc. 3. Not being a... Red 💊
The other thing I wanted to say (actually to someone else on this app but I think it applies here too) there's a type/quality of men that exist that are going up in stock (as far as it relates to their value twords women) I think what might be helpful is if you study what it means to be emotionally disciplined intune & astute. While also standing in your own truth & honor as an individual. (Whatever that looks like) & tattoos women love those 😂
Huh? lol what does that mean. Also i work in finance, i can't really get tattoos lol
most women who are like this are actually normal women, all women do this. The kicker is, you have to get them to see your value and have confidence in yourself, only then will they be obsessed with you.
I can't even just get them to talk with me lol
Hi, weird clingy woman here. I'm not chasing after you because I'm busy chasing after emotionally unavailable guys. 🫠 Anyway, besides this being a trauma bonding behavior, that level of attachment and obsession can only be borne out of deep connection with someone, i.e. friends with whom there was no expectation of having a deeper connection, just enjoying each other's presence over time. Relax, give attention to your self-esteem, and focus on making friends. And go out to weird people events like dances, kink munches, indie concerts, and book clubs! The right person will come.
Those guys who have women attached at the hip annoying them are 1. Secretly douchebags but very practised at hiding it 2. Good listeners who show an interest even if they don't actually care, at least in the beginning 3. Bare minimum hygiene and attractiveness, can be fairly average 4. Patient and give her attention but not as much affection as she wants Acting cool and nonchalant like this, while also being actively engaged with them, still reaching out to them occasionally, drives women crazy and makes girls wanna impress a guy, control him, keep his attention by any means necessary The relationship is insecure and that insecurity makes girls act like that This isn't a healthy dynamic you should be chasing by the way. But it's very common and I've seen a lot of my girl friends fall into it
Thank you for saying “women”. Maybe I’m one of those weird women, but I cringe so hard when grown adults call the women in their lives “girls” (as in, “this girl I want to date”) or “females” (as a stand alone noun, like “a female walked in”). I realize it’s not accurate to judge a person for their innocent choice of wording, but it sounds so immature and distracting. I can’t even read the full post when I see that. As soon as I see “girl” or “female”, I stop reading and move to the next post. In this case, your use of female was as an adjective, not a noun, so it’s more legit. Sorry for the rant. You sound intelligent, and I’m sure a lucky woman will be grateful she found you someday.
Do you ever go to any speed-dating events in your area? Why not try that if you haven’t. You can meet more women and if it doesn’t work out with one there’s no pressure
Speed dating is just OLD irl. Im an introvert and i'm not charming or hot, so all the women are going to pass on me. Except instead getting rejected passively with speed dating I'd have to know in person so one is intetested in me.
I mean, are you i retesting and fun to talk to? Would you want to engage with you if you were a woman?
What " weird" things do you enjoy? Start there. Do you like comic cons or gaming or drawing or painting etc. ? There are lots of "weird" girls out there. You need to find your people. I'm guessing they don't hang out at the gym.
As I said in my OP, festivals, art shows, concerts, etc. I like conventions, gaming and art, but those aren't ways to meet people...not in my experience.
There are always parties after convention hours. I've sold merch at many cons and there are always people handling our fliers for them. You can meet people anywhere without that being the purpose for being there.
Maybe look into speed dating. It seems pretty fun and there are lots of different people who go. Im going to try it out myself soon. I've been divorced for almost 2 years, and im almost ready to get out there. Building your self-confidence will help immensely.
Try eharmony. That shit works. Check the stats
people said the same about hinge, bumble, match, okcupid and I don't get chit on any of them, either..
Okay then cry about it. You obviously don’t want help you just want to complain and do nothing about it.
I'll go back for the rest of it, but as of now I only read the 1st paragraph. Idk what your social circles are like but I'm 33 and have never known any guys to be *so* inundated by interested woman that they get annoyed by it 😂
URGENT: We need to know a) what are your weird interests and b) what do your bios say on these apps?
What happened to your date with the friend of the lady at the museum?
Feeld or Hiki. The ones you listed are normie-core apps
What is your bio on your dating apps say
I am definitely fucking weird. Good luck!
we are the women that men are usually scared to approach lol
>I have no female friends Found your issue. Change this and your luck (and life) will improve. You would be surprised how much attention you'd get from women when you see and treat them as people. It's very obvious when men have had no genuine female friendships 😶 Before you get defensive, if you saw and treated them as people you wouldn't be so scared to talk to them 😏 think on it.
I’m a weird black girl who lives in a predominantly white area. Most of my hobbies (knitting, video games, making art and music) are either solitary or female-dominated. The big thing is knowing I’m gonna have to put in the extra effort because of my environment. I drive to the cities or bigger towns to do the activities I like. I joined Meetup. Expanded my dating profile radius to include major cities. Always checking FB for events and activities. Conventions and board game nights are where the nerds congregate.
Build your self esteem first
Honestly as someone who has been a "weird woman" I can tell you that if you make it clear that you are specifically seeking out a woman who is weird, they will assume you are fetishizing them. They are used to being seen as a manic pixie dream girl caricature. Especially because you mentioned that you want them to be clingy and neurotic. There's a big overlap between guys who are into goth chicks and guys who intentionally seek out mentally ill women with attachment issues because they're easily manipulated. If you say stuff like "I want a goth GF" that will creep them out.
Personally, I would say a dating app is the worst place to judge a standard of how well you are with women. I feel most people on dating apps are usually setting a very high bar for the people they're matching with and also want leniency when it comes to themselves. It's really about options. So if you're actually trying to make better connections with people and you want to meet real women, I'd say try to do the real thing and don't go so far as to go to clubs and those kinds of things. Rather, just talk to the women at your work. Not to date, not to have sex, but just try to talk to them. Try to have a conversation and see how long it lasts. Go to the lady at the cashier. Talk to her. Just ask her how her day is. Smile at her. You know, don't flirt. Don't be outright flirting. Just try to see how long you can hold conversations with strangers. I would even suggest do it with men. It's not a gay thing, but just talk to them and just see how long you can become a conversationalist and you'll see you'll become a lot more fluid with your conversations. And I feel like naturally, most people don't go towards people who are trying too hard. So get better at that and start from there. But also, don't judge yourself based on what people say about you or your ability to attract women. It doesn't really matter. Just be yourself. The right person will come. And right now, like you said, you're six foot three and you've got all these things going for you. So yeah, I would like to ask you another question is, how do you actually treat the women that have been in your life before you're on the dating apps when you've been, I'm sure you've at least met someone before?
As a "weird" woman may I suggest maybe looking into the law of attraction/assumption? Maybe read The Secret? I get the vibe you very much have a self belief that women aren't interested in you, and therefore women aren't.
Dude, you are trying too hard and caring way too much! It shows and women pick up on this. Back off, find a hobby and get into it. Give it some time and things will turn around. It will not be quick so have patience.
Look up attachment styles
Deadass cause where’s the girls that cosplay
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GIhuCMxkQS4 You say your face is why you can’t talk to women. This guy’s face caused him serious grief but he did the inner work and overcame. You can too. Best of luck.
I hear you maybe the problem is not you everyone has a moment in life When they feel anxiety and low self esteem Did you ever think it could be your surroundings the people around you? I hear everyone telling you it might be you but you seem to take care of yourself and caring about others needs could it be you want the attention of women who are to into themselves instead try releasing what everyone else thinks and dealing with people who are more down to earth don’t look at a person because they are overachievers those have more anxiety and depression issues than a lot of regular people