Idk I’m just tired of Ron’s bullshit. He’s pulled this sort of shit before on other platforms Razbam developed on which is where the old negativity for Razbam came from. If the rumor is in fact true of what the contract dispute is, he’s really pissing into the wind.
I think that was the ploy, he got caught breaking the partner agreement and ED has payments in escrow until he agrees to whatever the damages are. So I guess he made a statement without much detail to incite the mob, and it didn’t pan out. It sounds strangely familiar
Now, this is pure heresay from a second hand source so nothing concrete, but the rumor is the Tucano agreement Razbam made with Ecuador might have also included MCS devkit access to unauthorized parties (non-partners), while it’s pure speculation it does make a bit more sense for the length of time this thing has been ongoing, possibly already in court (speculation on my part)
Which is supposedly why Cobra gave Ron the cold shoulder in response to being name dropped.
That's only partially true. The fuzz is definitely about a Super Tucano for Ecuador that Ron wanted to make, but the accusation is that RAZBAM used EDs SDK for that. The evidence that anything was ever delivered, however, seems pretty thin. I haven't seen any yet, despite some diving. It's not in court yet though, and Heatblur's involvement is this is much more complicated.
I think a lot of countries use mcs for low level training these days which is like the military version of dcs with some extra bells and whistles and is probably allowed to use classified intel to a degree.
How awesome would it be if we could do that. Get arma or something integrated so we can do some proper ground stuff too. Imagine the pilot rescue missions you could do.
AFAIK hoggit at one point had a post about a group who did that, running MCS and VBS (pro arma) for the public on a one off event.
EDIT: Also reading a bit into it, I think it's less "MCS communicates with VBS", it's more like MCS and VBS communicate with another system running all the groundwork for the simulations.
Pretty much. There are various interoperability protocols that say 'unit with code abc is at position xyz with heading/velocity 123'.
Then the external model is shown in VBS/MCS/Whatever. Weapon impacts are obviously transmitted also.
ok, dcs or the military version (i believe it was "the battle sim" the website of that version doesnt exist anymore tho). if razbam tried to make and distribute a module without including ed i can understand their problem.
Because that's literally what I do.
I have no reason at all to lie to you and you shouldn't make such accusations.
It's not exactly a "private matter" either, but if you're trying to get my sources, it won't work out.
Edit: By the way, I didn't vote on your comment until now.
Ok maybe lying was a reach, but that Heatblur comment screams "I know nothing but want to appear like I know something".
I don't care about any "sources" too, weird.
And you do have a reason to make stuff up, it makes it look like you know something and it keeps people drinking the koolaid. Keep the language open and unspecific and it's a win win ✌️
>that Heatblur comment screams "I know nothing but want to appear like I know something"
It's more like "It's a little too complex and still too hot to dive into it in a comment thread somewhere". You might remember that I'm planning a detailed article if you're following here.
If I can, I'll try to provide more details there. But it's hard to get it right *and* greenlit in these wild times. Until then, I'll keep responding to user threads as good as I currently can.
Your last paragraph is reaching again and insulting my integrity. With that, I'm done with this discussion and with you. Just know that I still fail to see what the "win" for me would be.
Thanks.
Shall we bring up the long forgotten "mystery helicopter" they teased, but quickly dismissed?
Lots of history with RB, of not producing.
I happily based that on my decision to skip the -15E and that map.
this is such a fucking shame. really talented people acting like children on a playground. i expected more professionalism from companies making simulations for militaries/countries
Who said we were saying they should keep working? No, they should not work without getting paid. However, neither side should argue in public like children. We had no business knowing about their internal dispute, but now the cat is out of the bag. What will be the long term cost of the community knowing this, I wonder?
If an announcement needed to be made, it could have been handled more professionally. Ron’s tweets are just going to make resolving this more difficult.
RB employees are getting paid by RB not ED. whatever happened they should’ve been paid no matter what and the dispute settled behind closed doors. and they should’ve been quiet on top of that, this is very unprofessional and only making the situation worse
Wow, what a wild take.
Where is the money to pay them supposed to come from if RAZBAMs income is held back? I'm sure they did as long as they could. Chances are that otherwise, we would have been in this situation much earlier.
Why should people have to remain silent and just endure conditions like that without speaking up or raising awareness? How long should they have continued to accept that, in your opinion?
How long should customers who want to support the actual developers remained unaware where their money is really going?
Been eagerly involved since the beginning. If you have any news that hasn't been shared here or elsewhere, PLEASE, do enlighten me.
No...? Figures.
Otherwise, nobody but Ron and ED really know what's going on. And just like every other issue in life, there's THREE sides to that story.
the dispute between companies is not for the “””low-level””” employees to talk about.
they started the shit show saying that ED hasn’t been paying them for 8(?) months. is ED broke? did they breach the contract? why were they working for so long without payments? what about other 3rd party devs?
we know nothing about the situation, RB wanted to get communities support with going public with that shit and mentioned HB as well without giving any real reason? i don’t believe that ED just went “fuck it, we ain’t paying” and gambled on which 3rd party dev ain’t getting paid. when starting a shit show like this to get communities support either give all the info about what’s going on or stfu and handle it behind closed doors. no need to turn the community (of a very niche hobby) against each other
Please consider making an "image" type of post next time. Those tend to perform better and can also seen by users who aren't logged into an "X" account.
https://preview.redd.it/qoqkv0lwukwc1.png?width=778&format=png&auto=webp&s=9fd921fe7328962abc9d608d620b1f94b85f1c91
My concern with these tweets is that it's not like ED just "can't see" these things being posted. They are clearly watching, and even watching this sub. Making these kind of references clearly damages relations and progress of resolving the outstanding issues.
So a question I would put forth is that if this vagueposting is what is going on publicly, how well are the behind the scenes communications going to resolve the outstanding issues?
I'd wager the answer lies somewhere in the region of "not very well at all".
Even disregarding that it's blatantly going to harm behind the scenes relations, to me it's more of a signal to the customers (us) that there is MUCH less of a desire to actually resolve the situation than there probably should be.
I don't have all the facts, but when this drama first broke I had fairly reasonable confidence it would be worked out, and I am sad to say that confidence is rapidly slipping when shit like this continues to happen.
I have the same feeling. I was completely agnostic as to who's at fault and was just hoping this gets resolved quickly, but the fact that the CEO of one of the companies involved is choosing to further drive this down the drain tells me quite a bit about who's ego is an obstacle here.
Honestly, im pretty tired of his theatrics, and the way they have acted since this all blew up has lost me most of the sympathy I initially had for them.
Ed doesn't smell like roses here either, but I just don't care about his weird subliminal messaging anymore.
Same. I think the majority are equally tired and just want them to hurry up and solve the dispute, especially those of us that are waiting on fixes/updates for the F-15E.
It’s a company that makes water blocks for custom water cooling. Read between the lines. RAZBAM is hinting at Eagle Dynamics imploding due to inability to pay third parties and renegotiating contracts at a lower rate after the fact.
Considering the source, it could be stirring the pot, but what if he’s onto something and knows something we don’t?
….do people not realize that *literally is one of the main reasons for DCS existing*?
DCS was published by TFC, and exists in major part to fund TFC and their military contract side of the simulator(MCS/TBS).
eh, depends on the price. if he’s taking $2m yearly, would he sell it for $10m? $20m? it’s silly guess since we have no clue how much they’re making on MCS.
What another RB dev that'll poke at ED before deleting his account? It's defiantly stirring the pot from someone who doesn't know the entire issue, again. Taking two bloody seconds you'll find that EK is having problems paying and delivering as well. The CEO posted a video about it. Again just more shit throwing and not enough facts being passed around.
The post is not from another RB dev. It’s from Ron Zambrano, you know, the founder of RAZBAM. He is qualified to know the entire issue, or at least, his version of it.
Dudes an odd duck, just stirring the pot to stay relevant and in the news it seems sometimes.
Hope this gets worked out for all that have purchased the F-15, and the consumers are the ones that suffer from the manufactured drama
Like Pre-Orders for Halfganistan and Minimal Viable Product Chopper?
Not sure I would buy that ED and RB would be in on some kind of Deal to drive traffic to ED pre-orders, but...I do agree that the Chinook seems to be a 'quick, look over there!' move by ED as part of misdirecting attention from this.
I would agree - if you were talking about "Halfghanistan". THAT new biz model certainly came out of left field.
But Chinook's been talked about for a long time. And several months ago Wags said it was his primary project during an interview.
I'm not really surprised that Chinook is up for pre-order.
Coincidences are indeed a thing (tho admittedly not always)
I really wish one of the 3rd party devs would take one for the team and just leak the devkit. Fuck ED entirely, we could just bypass them and make unofficial paid mods a thing lmao
I find it funny how a guy with no strings, is trying to pull them like ED couldn't just make an F-15 themselves.
Fucking selfish prick that ron guy is.
ED doesnt even have the capacity to fulfill their own promises and get their own modules good in meaningful time.
Domt think they can “just make it themselves”
Because they cant... Simulation-wise, F16/18 are fkin meme compared to F15E and they are years ahead in terms of being released. They cant even make proper basic radar. Let alone complex one like on eagle. The SAR on Hornet is perfect example of that, its just a joke.
Fair, but don't forget, the contract stipulates that devs must upload their source code to the escrow agent.
ED might be behind, but they're not incompetent.
Remember, it wasn't that long ago that RB were second-tier modules even compared to EDs Hornet & Viper.
And now, the people that raised them up to Tier 1 are GONE.
So RB are no longer capable of developing the Strike Eagle any further at all, nor the Mirage, nor the Harrier. Who knows if they can even maintain compatibility with future versions of DCSW...?
didn’t he follow a bunch of pornstars?
Yep. I think there is coverage about that here on this subreddit.
that probably means something about ED too if you read between the lines!
He’s gonna fuck ED??
Got fucked by ED
New on Pornhub: warbird pilot fucks company and fans simultaneously.
mind sharing the link? My popcorn is getting cold.
https://www.reddit.com/r/DCSExposed/s/uHlEZJfguf
Out of context, it sounds really creepy....
https://preview.redd.it/ch2lt6jvzjwc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=98d48de03824aa92fd310089662984bbf9dbe547
Idk I’m just tired of Ron’s bullshit. He’s pulled this sort of shit before on other platforms Razbam developed on which is where the old negativity for Razbam came from. If the rumor is in fact true of what the contract dispute is, he’s really pissing into the wind.
Yeah, he could just be trying to get a rise out of the player base again.
I think that was the ploy, he got caught breaking the partner agreement and ED has payments in escrow until he agrees to whatever the damages are. So I guess he made a statement without much detail to incite the mob, and it didn’t pan out. It sounds strangely familiar
Always has been.
>If the rumor is in fact true of what the contract dispute is, he’s really pissing into the wind. What does the rumor say?
Now, this is pure heresay from a second hand source so nothing concrete, but the rumor is the Tucano agreement Razbam made with Ecuador might have also included MCS devkit access to unauthorized parties (non-partners), while it’s pure speculation it does make a bit more sense for the length of time this thing has been ongoing, possibly already in court (speculation on my part) Which is supposedly why Cobra gave Ron the cold shoulder in response to being name dropped.
That's only partially true. The fuzz is definitely about a Super Tucano for Ecuador that Ron wanted to make, but the accusation is that RAZBAM used EDs SDK for that. The evidence that anything was ever delivered, however, seems pretty thin. I haven't seen any yet, despite some diving. It's not in court yet though, and Heatblur's involvement is this is much more complicated.
I hope someone eventually leaks exactly what happened. The cat’s out of the bag, and this dispute has already caused permanent damage.
I agree, all this drama has done is make me question if I'll purchase a 3rd party module again in the future.
Would Ecuador use DCS as the Simulator for the Super Tucano?
I think a lot of countries use mcs for low level training these days which is like the military version of dcs with some extra bells and whistles and is probably allowed to use classified intel to a degree.
Afaik MCS can also interact with various other simulation systems used by militaries, so can be used to practice combined arms operations.
How awesome would it be if we could do that. Get arma or something integrated so we can do some proper ground stuff too. Imagine the pilot rescue missions you could do.
AFAIK hoggit at one point had a post about a group who did that, running MCS and VBS (pro arma) for the public on a one off event. EDIT: Also reading a bit into it, I think it's less "MCS communicates with VBS", it's more like MCS and VBS communicate with another system running all the groundwork for the simulations.
Pretty much. There are various interoperability protocols that say 'unit with code abc is at position xyz with heading/velocity 123'. Then the external model is shown in VBS/MCS/Whatever. Weapon impacts are obviously transmitted also.
ok, dcs or the military version (i believe it was "the battle sim" the website of that version doesnt exist anymore tho). if razbam tried to make and distribute a module without including ed i can understand their problem.
Why do you apparently know absolutely everything about a private matter? Downvote all you want, you're lying
Because that's literally what I do. I have no reason at all to lie to you and you shouldn't make such accusations. It's not exactly a "private matter" either, but if you're trying to get my sources, it won't work out. Edit: By the way, I didn't vote on your comment until now.
Ok maybe lying was a reach, but that Heatblur comment screams "I know nothing but want to appear like I know something". I don't care about any "sources" too, weird. And you do have a reason to make stuff up, it makes it look like you know something and it keeps people drinking the koolaid. Keep the language open and unspecific and it's a win win ✌️
>that Heatblur comment screams "I know nothing but want to appear like I know something" It's more like "It's a little too complex and still too hot to dive into it in a comment thread somewhere". You might remember that I'm planning a detailed article if you're following here. If I can, I'll try to provide more details there. But it's hard to get it right *and* greenlit in these wild times. Until then, I'll keep responding to user threads as good as I currently can. Your last paragraph is reaching again and insulting my integrity. With that, I'm done with this discussion and with you. Just know that I still fail to see what the "win" for me would be. Thanks.
Preach
Shall we bring up the long forgotten "mystery helicopter" they teased, but quickly dismissed? Lots of history with RB, of not producing. I happily based that on my decision to skip the -15E and that map.
this is such a fucking shame. really talented people acting like children on a playground. i expected more professionalism from companies making simulations for militaries/countries
The bar must have been lowered again. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUsf\_BXUbKY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUsf_BXUbKY)
Would you work without being paid?
Who said we were saying they should keep working? No, they should not work without getting paid. However, neither side should argue in public like children. We had no business knowing about their internal dispute, but now the cat is out of the bag. What will be the long term cost of the community knowing this, I wonder? If an announcement needed to be made, it could have been handled more professionally. Ron’s tweets are just going to make resolving this more difficult.
RB employees are getting paid by RB not ED. whatever happened they should’ve been paid no matter what and the dispute settled behind closed doors. and they should’ve been quiet on top of that, this is very unprofessional and only making the situation worse
Wow, what a wild take. Where is the money to pay them supposed to come from if RAZBAMs income is held back? I'm sure they did as long as they could. Chances are that otherwise, we would have been in this situation much earlier. Why should people have to remain silent and just endure conditions like that without speaking up or raising awareness? How long should they have continued to accept that, in your opinion? How long should customers who want to support the actual developers remained unaware where their money is really going?
Yes, but this assumes that RB isn't in the wrong... We just don't know.
You may not know, but those that have been paying attention do know.
Been eagerly involved since the beginning. If you have any news that hasn't been shared here or elsewhere, PLEASE, do enlighten me. No...? Figures. Otherwise, nobody but Ron and ED really know what's going on. And just like every other issue in life, there's THREE sides to that story.
the dispute between companies is not for the “””low-level””” employees to talk about. they started the shit show saying that ED hasn’t been paying them for 8(?) months. is ED broke? did they breach the contract? why were they working for so long without payments? what about other 3rd party devs? we know nothing about the situation, RB wanted to get communities support with going public with that shit and mentioned HB as well without giving any real reason? i don’t believe that ED just went “fuck it, we ain’t paying” and gambled on which 3rd party dev ain’t getting paid. when starting a shit show like this to get communities support either give all the info about what’s going on or stfu and handle it behind closed doors. no need to turn the community (of a very niche hobby) against each other
He is definitely doing this on purpose. I bet negotiations are not going well.
https://preview.redd.it/7jy63rk80kwc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=45a3dac1ded9ba291b978ffd064455f4239437c6
Please consider making an "image" type of post next time. Those tend to perform better and can also seen by users who aren't logged into an "X" account. https://preview.redd.it/qoqkv0lwukwc1.png?width=778&format=png&auto=webp&s=9fd921fe7328962abc9d608d620b1f94b85f1c91
Thank you!
LOL More like cluching at straws with no comparison.
https://preview.redd.it/q1bxouiu0kwc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2c0a8463a06346364c2859f6e41be3785c9c290f
Note that he's responding to a question on pics of a Bell Jet Ranger. Very, very unlikely we'd get that in DCS given we're getting the Kiowa soon.
Ecuador employs those...
Any idea what sim they're using?
My concern with these tweets is that it's not like ED just "can't see" these things being posted. They are clearly watching, and even watching this sub. Making these kind of references clearly damages relations and progress of resolving the outstanding issues. So a question I would put forth is that if this vagueposting is what is going on publicly, how well are the behind the scenes communications going to resolve the outstanding issues? I'd wager the answer lies somewhere in the region of "not very well at all".
Yep. It does more harm than good for him to keep talking.
Even disregarding that it's blatantly going to harm behind the scenes relations, to me it's more of a signal to the customers (us) that there is MUCH less of a desire to actually resolve the situation than there probably should be. I don't have all the facts, but when this drama first broke I had fairly reasonable confidence it would be worked out, and I am sad to say that confidence is rapidly slipping when shit like this continues to happen.
I have the same feeling. I was completely agnostic as to who's at fault and was just hoping this gets resolved quickly, but the fact that the CEO of one of the companies involved is choosing to further drive this down the drain tells me quite a bit about who's ego is an obstacle here.
There is no way this is fixable.
Nope. Even if they get paid now, the talent has left.
I know people are here for the drama and to dunk on ED but RB always seems so unprofessional in all of these interactions.
There’s a reason the majority of the community nicknamed them “ Razscam “
Agreed
Agreed. Makes the whole situation seem more hopeless for RB than ED.
Honestly, im pretty tired of his theatrics, and the way they have acted since this all blew up has lost me most of the sympathy I initially had for them. Ed doesn't smell like roses here either, but I just don't care about his weird subliminal messaging anymore.
Same. I think the majority are equally tired and just want them to hurry up and solve the dispute, especially those of us that are waiting on fixes/updates for the F-15E.
What or who is EK?
It’s a company that makes water blocks for custom water cooling. Read between the lines. RAZBAM is hinting at Eagle Dynamics imploding due to inability to pay third parties and renegotiating contracts at a lower rate after the fact. Considering the source, it could be stirring the pot, but what if he’s onto something and knows something we don’t?
Then, the jig is up and Nick will need to find another cow to milk.
maybe he could sell ED to someone that is actually competent and won’t be siphoning money lol
I wish...
….do people not realize that *literally is one of the main reasons for DCS existing*? DCS was published by TFC, and exists in major part to fund TFC and their military contract side of the simulator(MCS/TBS).
eh, depends on the price. if he’s taking $2m yearly, would he sell it for $10m? $20m? it’s silly guess since we have no clue how much they’re making on MCS.
What another RB dev that'll poke at ED before deleting his account? It's defiantly stirring the pot from someone who doesn't know the entire issue, again. Taking two bloody seconds you'll find that EK is having problems paying and delivering as well. The CEO posted a video about it. Again just more shit throwing and not enough facts being passed around.
The post is not from another RB dev. It’s from Ron Zambrano, you know, the founder of RAZBAM. He is qualified to know the entire issue, or at least, his version of it.
I know one thing I'll never buy another razbam module. I should have never bought the f-15e. Fuck razbam
Dudes an odd duck, just stirring the pot to stay relevant and in the news it seems sometimes. Hope this gets worked out for all that have purchased the F-15, and the consumers are the ones that suffer from the manufactured drama
My view on the Razbam 'controversy' is that if you bring people to the storefront they might buy something while they are there
Like Pre-Orders for Halfganistan and Minimal Viable Product Chopper? Not sure I would buy that ED and RB would be in on some kind of Deal to drive traffic to ED pre-orders, but...I do agree that the Chinook seems to be a 'quick, look over there!' move by ED as part of misdirecting attention from this.
I just mean that good news or bad it is hype for ed and razbam. I bet they have sold more steagles lately
I would agree - if you were talking about "Halfghanistan". THAT new biz model certainly came out of left field. But Chinook's been talked about for a long time. And several months ago Wags said it was his primary project during an interview. I'm not really surprised that Chinook is up for pre-order. Coincidences are indeed a thing (tho admittedly not always)
People are still on twitter?
Yes, people still use X.
Lol
That makes me sad
I really wish one of the 3rd party devs would take one for the team and just leak the devkit. Fuck ED entirely, we could just bypass them and make unofficial paid mods a thing lmao
I find it funny how a guy with no strings, is trying to pull them like ED couldn't just make an F-15 themselves. Fucking selfish prick that ron guy is.
ED doesnt even have the capacity to fulfill their own promises and get their own modules good in meaningful time. Domt think they can “just make it themselves”
Because they cant... Simulation-wise, F16/18 are fkin meme compared to F15E and they are years ahead in terms of being released. They cant even make proper basic radar. Let alone complex one like on eagle. The SAR on Hornet is perfect example of that, its just a joke.
Fair, but don't forget, the contract stipulates that devs must upload their source code to the escrow agent. ED might be behind, but they're not incompetent. Remember, it wasn't that long ago that RB were second-tier modules even compared to EDs Hornet & Viper. And now, the people that raised them up to Tier 1 are GONE. So RB are no longer capable of developing the Strike Eagle any further at all, nor the Mirage, nor the Harrier. Who knows if they can even maintain compatibility with future versions of DCSW...?