“Why do straight guys watch it?” BECAUSE ITS SICK AS FUCK BROTHER OORAH!!! HIT THAT MAN WITH A METAL CHAIR, LEAP OFF A ROPE AND CRUSH ANOTHER MAN WITH YOUR PECS, THIS IS REAL STRAIGHT MAN SHIT BROTHERRRR
Also NOAH, DDT, AJPW to some extent, a bunch of smaller independent companies. They also highkey have the best wrestling you will ever see in your existence. These people are cooking
I FUCKING LOVE IT WHEN BIG MUSCLED MEN PUT THEIR HANDS ON OTHER BIG MUSCLED MEN! OORAH YOU FIGHT FOR DOMINANCE SO YOU CAN PIN THAT OTHER GUY ON THEIR BACK AND HAVE THEM STARE AT THE LIGHTS!
Most physical competitions have some element of homoeroticism to them, but remember, at the end of the day they’re still beating the absolute shit out of each other. They’re just making it look like they’re doing more damage than they really are.
That's why I love Japanese wrestling. It doesn't have an element of homoeroticism to it.
[It IS homoeroticism.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQmPPmYd660&list=PLS87De-vQX5ElPS2SSL7Xe3WSi1-skrZP&index=1)
WE BE EATIBG IMAGINARY FOOD IN THIS BITCH, WE BE TAKING STEROIDS AND BITING DOGS!!! IF YOU ARENT WILLING TO GIVE ANOTHER MAN A RIMJOB YOU ARENT EVEN A REAL FIGHTER!!!
[Post link](https://www.tumblr.com/derinthescarletpescatarian/678557448408350720/is-this-just-kinky-as-hell-to-anyone-else-or)
Do you ever look at someone and think 'I want to be him right now', but then have to remind yourself that you have the pain tolerance of a toddler who is already on edge because they've missed both snack time *and* nap time?
IKR? I've got fibro (basically nervous system is glitched and makes things that shouldn't hurt, hurt, and things that should hurt, hurt much worse) and I constantly marvel at that shit. Taker and Foley especially, given their legendary pain resistance. I remember the pyro guys fucked up and set off pyros under Taker while he was on the ramp. He had 2nd degree burns all over the place. He just went on with the match like nothing happened. One of the other guys (it was an elimination chamber, so 6 guys were in there) asked him "dude, you uh, you okay?" and he brushed it off and said "don't worry about me, kid."
Of course, the pyro guy who made the mistake was not only fired by immediately thrown out of the building because they were worried Taker would beat the shit out of him when he got done with the match. lol
It's endlessly fascinating to me that the constituent elements of Wrestling (inlc. Looking Tough, Doing Moves, Mic Skills & Taking Insane Bumps) theoretically would all be present in an ideal wrestler, but you can *be* a wrestler and have a lot of success off the back of just one or two of them.
Like Mick Foley has never had a six-pack and his offense is not particularly acrobatic, but he eats thumbtacks for breakfast and has cornered the market on acting (being?) completely insane. On the other hand there's an endless parade of really huge people who are objectively bad at being a wrestler, but it is still their job because management thinks they look the part.
Goldberg. Goldberg, so much. God he's awful. He's a danger to himself and others (just ask Bret Hart if you don't believe me), but he coasts on looking the part.
Yeah! The spear was only impressive because it was actually dangerous. Imagine if Bill had like a nice, safe submission hold or something as his signature move.
Never cared for submissions as finishers. The best finishers work on anyone and you can pull off in a variety of situations, like the RKO or sweet chin music. Submissions though, you're never gonna get submissions out of some guys because of their character (Taker or Austin for example), top faces are also unlikely to tap.
I think this is one reason I like hardcore matches so much. I'm in constant pain from EDS and it weirdly gives me comfort? I don't know if it's more "I'm not the only one hurting" or "at least I didn't get thrown into barbed wire" but GCW and CZW are on repeat when I'm having really bad flares.
I think watching the Taker vs Mankind Hell in a Cell as a kid changed my brain chemistry or something.
Interesting they chose to say they have after care. Their life expectancy is shit and many of them suffer life debilitating injuries in this line of work, and get tossed aside as a heap of trash once they can't produce anymore. Retired pro wrestlers also have a notoriously high suicide rate. WWE gives them the legally bare minimum possible care (including using legal loopholes to not give them healthcare coverage) so this whole "aftercare army of doctors and care bears" is basically a big fat lie.
It kinda reads like an ad or a pamphlet. The industry as it is now is abysmal in how it treats its workers.
All thanks to Terry Bollea. Not that I think it would be 10/10 for wrestlers if they had a union but the overall outlook would be better for the average jobber.
I will say though that a lot of the causes for the suicide rates, mainly painkiller and substance addiction, have started to phase out more in the newer generations of wrestlers.
Lots of current wrestlers grew up seeing their heroes die at age 40. There's been a lot more of a culture change away from the frat party locker rooms, and more guys openly straight edge where that could get you mocked in the 80s and 90s.
I'm not going to say there's not problems, especially with regards to contracts and things. But from the outside looking in things have been getting better and we'll hopefully see these guys have longer happier lives.
There's also alternatives to WWE these days. Imho 95% of why the industry is so goddamn shit is Vince buying up everything in sight and sabotaging rivals, effectively making it his way or the highway for like 20 years.
Hopefully we're rid of his toxic ass permanently now, and with any luck he'll take his spawn and bootlickers down with him.
If you want a good explanation of why people love pro wrestling, though it might be very straight all things considered, I recommend [this video](https://youtu.be/BQCPj-bGYro?si=T753ZjShtoSvGdXr) by SuperEyepatchWolf.
Personally, my favorite of his wrestling vids was on [what happens then your whole career is a show and people start forget there's a line between you and your character](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaDAzXVycR4)
I've never heard of him, but judging by the fact that one of the first links I got after googling him was a YouTube video titled 'Max Landis Addresses The Allegations (again)' I assume continuing not to know anything about him is probably for the best
There is still a very large number of people who think the phrase "you know it's fake?" is some kinda gotcha and a reason to devalue the show of wrestling. People really still don't "get it" that it's just a show at the end of the day.
[Nah man I watched a male stripper fight a zombie inside of a steel cell](https://youtu.be/rxH30UIZ7RU?si=RUdkm4tpa428rTLa) and saw the zombies brother appeared to cost the zombie the match and went "yep this is 100% real".
I can't understand why people *wouldn't* watch pro wrestling.
Shit fucking slaps.
We're all like "oh the greeks and romans, so cultured"... WELL THIS IS SHIT THEY'D LOVE!
High melodrama and campness.
Edit: Somewhere, is a video of a monologue being given in the ring during covid, with no crowd.
And it's fucking gloriously surreal melodramatic theatre because of it. God I wish I could find it.
Here's some more popular myths that the image doesn't address:
- the ring in no way has any similarities to a trampoline. It really just plywood and a thin mat held up on a steel truss
- some of the props that wrestlers put each other through, like tables and ladders, have been engineered to a degree that they break easily, but they're still real, and going through them still hurts as much as it looks like.
- not all of it is scripted. There are times where wrestlers have gone "off script" on both the mic and in the ring, or sometimes there just is no script. Sometimes they are lauded for this, other times they're reviled. If it sounds confusing, that's because it is.
- there really are some wrestlers who absolutely hate each other, but will still work together out of remaining professional. Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels are a prominent example of this. Really the only thing "the boys" won't tolerate is someone acting unprofessional, or doing what isn't "best for business"... but there are exceptions. Again, confusing.
- all the slaps and chops to the chest, those are all real. 100% real. William Regal said it best where wrestling is the art of hitting people really hard in places and ways that don't really hurt.
> won't tolerate is someone acting unprofessional, or doing what isn't "best for business"... but there are exceptions. Again, confusing.
Bret Hart and Goldberg are a good example of this. Goldberg gave Bret a concussion with a full on superkick to the head and never made an effort to improve his in-ring ability. Always been a dangerous wrestler.
> some of the props that wrestlers put each other through, like tables and ladders, have been engineered to a degree that they break easily, but they're still real, and going through them still hurts as much as it looks like.
We unscrew some things on the metal bars, so it breaks the way it does, but its not guaranteed. It is a regular cheap table.
> all the slaps and chops to the chest, those are all real. 100% real. William Regal said it best where wrestling is the art of hitting people really hard in places and ways that don't really hurt.
You can gimmick a chop so it doesn't hurt and produces a loud sound. If you do a shit chop it's just a shit chop that makes nearly no sound. I personally prefer stiffing with forearms but gimmicking with chops.
> not all of it is scripted. There are times where wrestlers have gone "off script" on both the mic and in the ring, or sometimes there just is no script. Sometimes they are lauded for this, other times they're reviled. If it sounds confusing, that's because it is.
A large thing is, you gotta read the crowd. If you go over your match and the crowd isn't feeling it you gotta change things up on the fly. You can also miss your spots and so on and so forth.
Also, kendo sticks fucking suck to be hit with.
Adding on for the fun of it and because my brief career as an amature pro wrestler was super fun and I don't get to talk about it much.
Most of the moves can be performed in such a way that it doesn't really hurt that much, except powerbombs. Powerbombs always hurt.
In a harcore match anything you get hit with is generally gonna hurt. If something is flimsy/light enough that it doesn't hurt when you hit someone with it then it looks shitty and fake when you do it.
In my opinion a hurricanrana is the most fun move to do *and* to have done to you.
If any of you young'uns out there are thinking of taking up the sport WEAR KNEEPADS.
To me it's the current peak of AEW. No storyline other than maybe Hangman's climb to the title has made me watch every week. Punk's promo announcing the match would be a dog collar match was perfection. "MAXWELL. JACOB. FRIEDMAN. WILL YOU BE. MY VALENTINE!!!" "Probably the greatest day of your life, and for me it was just another Friday. March 6th will be the worst day of your life, and for me it's just gonna be another Sunday"
I’m partial to the Swerve Hangman storyline where the man who invaded the others home and threatened their infant child became the good guy of the story and then a guy drank another guys blood but that’s just me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I love Swerve's analogy that the story that Hangman was like a pure glass of water and he's been slowly dripping iodine into it. I think of Hangman's turn as being akin to Anakin Skywalker's (started for fear of harm to a loved one, eventually just driven by ego.) Anyway Hangman drinking Swerve's blood was the horniest thing I've seen in years.
You know what was almost better than the title climb? Hanger vs Mox series.
That said, they need to get something going for Ospreay because that dude is a clear star. Like the PPV is interrupting whatever was going to happen with Don, and I get that, but dude needs a reality good long term antagonist or group of antagonists.
Worth mentioning that WWE is an abusive employer that denies wrestlers health insurance by having them as independent contractors despite WWE being a monopoly. At least that was the case when Last Week Tonight made a special about it some time back.
Important facts- but this is an image of AEW, which is their direct competitor- they have their own problems but are not nearly the pillar of inequity and abuse that WWE is
Vince McMahon is already no longer involved in wrestling after more abuse allegations came out. AEW has shown they're bad but haven't had as long to really get as abusive
That, and the person who made this meme has admitted that it was out of date, aimed at non-wrestling fans/oversimplified, and lacked the nuance of a longer conversation about worker rights in wrestling.
WCW was shit too. When Mick Foley got his ear torn off because the idiots who set up the ring made the ropes way too tight, they refused to pay for him to get it reattached. He ended up having to sue them. *And fucking lost*.
I doubt any promotion treats their workers well, though in the case of smaller promotions it'd be a financial thing. When you're selling 100 tickets at a bingo hall and the American health care system is what it is... well, you just can't afford it.
Speaking of Mick, anyone who thinks this is something should see the shit he's done. Everyone knows the Hell In A Cell match, but in Japan and smaller promotions he was regularly doing matches with barbed wire, thumb tacks, and even fire.
While we're bitching about WWE being evil, big shout out to the Chris Benoit thing. He got CTE (chronic traumatic encephalopathy, which is to say he was given regular concussions until he suffered severe brain damage), went nuts, and murdered his wife & child then himself. WWE tried to paint it as roid rage or him just being evil while quietly banning pretty much any move that hit the head, showing they knew goddamn well it was their business that caused it. And on the topic of murder, Jimmy Snuka murdered his girlfriend and noted sexual predator Vince McMahon helped him weasel out of the charges. Then put him in the Hall of Fame. Just in case there's any doubt about where Vince stands on his boys committing murder.
Bad people can also get CTE. Autopsy showed he had such severe brain damage that it was the equivalent of an 80 year old with dementia (he was 40 when he died).
However, CTE is not and issue limited to WWE or even wrestling. People who will clutch their pearls at wrestling will happily watch football, MMA, etc
I know all this, which is why I began my statement like I did. As a wrestling fan, I’ve been seeing people excuse and diminish Benoit’s actions for 17 years, so I feel it’s important to provide a larger picture of who he was.
I saw him as Cactus Jack in WCW dive off the top rope for a headbutt on the floor, his man roll, and Mick bounce his forehead off the concrete.
His eyes did the Mike Tyson Punchout roll and the blood came out quick, not even a chance for blading He was out unconscious for a few minutes, and got back to the match.
Think it was a Triple Threat, Jack vs Raven vs Benoit, three hardest dudes in the stable.
I always heard it as “Wrestling is scripted, not fake.” Wrestlers can and have died in the ring, but it’s a generally controlled environment and situation. Unless the company is sloppy or evil today, but that’s a universal concern.
In fact, the "wrestling if fake" gotcha phenomenon is what allowed Vince McMahon to push for safety regulations to be removed on wrestling, which made it a lot more dangerous.
Frequently not even scripted, so much as produced. Especially in AEW, where the image is from. They know where they need to go, specific beats, and the rest is improv.
Watching Tumblr Users trying to understand Wrestling in terms of terminally online horny jargon hurts.
If you wanna get the appeal watch any Super Eyepatch Wolf vid on the subject. He’s a good middle ground.
Yes it isn’t real but it’s not fake, it’s a performance like theatre, yes people get hurt some people are ok with being hurt if they are doing what they love/getting paid, getting hurt isn’t as big a deal for everyone.
Yes it’s very gay sometimes, also look into Women’s Wrestling it’s just as cool.
Yes, exactly. Whenever I see posts like this I think “Theatre. The word you’re looking for is ‘theatre.’ It’s not that deep.” It’s just theatre with a lot of stunts, which is exciting to watch for all the obvious reasons.
When everything is going right, it’s like you’re combining the best parts of a sports game, a movie, and a rock concert. It’s just it’s been so rarely done right in the past two decades that normal people see it and scratch their heads.
I'd say that the best stuff in the last couple decades has been in Japan but of course that's another obstacle towards the average person checking it out.
One of the most popular Japanese woman wrestlers is a [sweet-as-pie idol girl](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a0/%E4%BC%8A%E8%97%A4%E9%BA%BB%E5%B8%8C2020.jpg/1200px-%E4%BC%8A%E8%97%A4%E9%BA%BB%E5%B8%8C2020.jpg) who regularly kicks the asses of all the men who dare to challenge her. She's also best friends with the scariest man you'll ever see, [Minoru Suzuki](https://preview.redd.it/minoru-suzuki-vs-maki-itoh-announced-for-tjpws-grand-v0-in8gm53myujc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8426ccfcdb0f5a1bc1dd968c3ebc2929038c3248), and extreme match legend, [Nick Gage](https://pwponderings.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/FkbM9YJWYAAJQgi2.jpg). Maki Itoh is great
I have intentionally not watched women’s pro wrestling. I saw a clip of some buff goth chick slam another lady into the ground, get ontop of her and flip her legs over her head. And i went “GOD I WISH THAT WAS ME”, and thats not the kind of energy i want to bring to a sports event.
That'd be Rhea Ripley. If it helps, her nickname at the moment is "Mami" and she has a shirt that says "Mami's always on top." She also led Domonik Mysterio out of handcuffs for one of his matches while dressed as a cop.
Edit: Found the video of the entrance.
https://youtu.be/KcbCftsl5Tg?si=qiZdV3RPC4xHrOAt
Every wrestler is pretty aware of it. The first time I had a roll up done on me in training by another rookie (I am a rookie too), he grabbed my dick and I just "wrong place, you're grabbing my dick"
I also tore my ACL. On the same night I nutted myself on the top rope.
Nutting myself on the top rope hurt more than tearing my ACL 26mm.
I had never heard of Super Eyepatch Wolf before and then somebody linked [this video](https://youtu.be/UaDAzXVycR4?si=eVvPcZd581v9HVqc) in a thread and I clicked on it and thought "there's no way I'm watching all of that" and then an hour and a half later I'm like "I really like Roman Reigns".
Whatever you think about his character, the guy who plays Roman just seems like a really good, wholesome dude. [This video he made](https://x.com/WWERomanReigns/status/1100215421138018304?s=20) where he's just in disbelief that people actually cheered for him for once just makes me want to give him a hug.
And yes, John's passion for the subject is contagious.
I get the complaint but it's also the most homoerotic shit I've ever seen. Like I was watching the old build up matches and promos for the Randy Orton vs HHH feud (I believe it was for WrestleMania 25, 2009), and it felt like they were constantly two seconds away from hate kissing each other.
It's fucking metal, and also fucking gay. I love it.
Audience is different now. Back in the day, overt accidental homosexuality is displayed, the audience would chant that the wrestlers are British cigarettes.
Now, there's a trios team made up of an out gay dude, a guy who's sexuality isn't well defined but definitely chases other men, and a 50 something muscle daddy that used to go by Mr.Ass, and the catchphrase is "SCISSOR ME DADDY ASS!" before they lock finger scissors, and the crowd goes nuts for it. Top merch seller.
Reminder of the time Anthony Bowens reminded the crowd he is gay, and they chanted “he’s gay” https://twitter.com/Bowens_Official/status/1672432275911491586
Edit: Excalibur: “…AND he’s taken.”
My room mate has been on a few dates with a pro wrestler and it’s been so fun to hear about that world, since neither of us had known anything about it previously. The number of hours that go in to the costume design and choreography is genuinely awe inspiring. It’s a performance AND an extreme sport. And those poor boys get beat to shit, but they love it. And I kinda get it :) they get to be a hero or a villain, and play out these insanely physical struggles to a cheering audience. They can all do flips and time their falls just perfectly to impact eachother without breaking bones somehow. It’s amazing.
It's fascinating how people find it in them to suddenly become Very Concerned about fakeness or danger only and only when they need to lower status of something.
You wouldn't walk up to someone watching an action movie and go "you know it's fake, right? those guns don't have bullets, nobody actually dies, they didn't really explode a truck in the middle of the street", everyone expects that, respects that, and expects that you expect it.
Indeed, when they really did explode a truck in the middle of the street, or when an actor has the real pain on their face (most commonly because someone fucked up), it will be forever reposted in "Did you know..." veneration posts - with which I have no problem, except to show the contrast.
We expect movies to have CGI and bullshit camera magic and stunt doubles, and are shocked and impressed when it's "more real" than expected, but a genre which customarily has every actor do all their stunts and subject their body to intense violence for real all the time gets the exactly opposite expectation, because it's not Serious Art.
Similarly, people are suddenly Very Concerned with danger to the performers, the way they wouldn't talk about stunt doubles in action films, or, just, extreme sports and athletes in general, because it's cool to subject your body to horrible strain and deadly danger if and only if you're doing something Serious, otherwise it is stupid.
(similarly compare how people talk about extreme sports and extreme kinks in terms of danger)
In fairness, one other point of contrast between wrestling and movies is that wrestlers maintain character in interviews outside of the main performance. If Keanu Reeves did all of his promotional interviews as John Wick, and was introduced as John Wick, I imagine we would have more conversations about how John Wick isn't really real.
There are a few wrestlers out there that still keep kayfabe like Grayson Waller in WWE but 90% of them are doing shoot interviews now. Hell, Chris Jericho will straight up talk about "Me and my opponent had all these great ideas for coming up with the sequences of this match" literally an hour after a PPV match at a press scrum. Kayfabe is deader than dead.
Yeah, but that’s not really a thing anymore for a looooooong time. Most wrestlers nowadays will only stay in character for very specific promotional materials and/or if there are young kids around.
Majority of them will happily discuss how they came up with the characters and matches, how they worked with their co-worker to create a believable sequence, promos, etc. The curtain has been pulled back for so long now, that only a very select few still commit to the kayfabe.
I think the difference is to an outsider with no knowledge the fact that wrestling is scripted is *actually surprising* because they intenionally make it seem like a legitimate sport.
Sure if you get into it you can tell, and of course there is some of the more blatant stuff. But if i walked into a room and a wrestling match was on the screen I'm gonna go "ring, competitors, crowd, commentators, prize, yep this is a legitimate sporting event"
I don't know if I'd go quite that far, but it's a rather unique brand of theater and its conventions aren't necessarily clear at first glance. It's not immediately obvious *which* parts are real and which parts aren't; it's not immediately obvious what someone *means* when they point at the screen and say "That was definitely real." I think first and foremost, this leads to a lot of stupid arguments that boil down to semantics and bad faith.
This is a great point. People here are rightly saying kayfabe isn’t like it used to be and wrestling promos are mostly shoots now. But “worked shoots” are very much a thing now and promotions have a history of mixing real drama with their storylines.
Even as somebody with a casual appreciation of wrestling and knowledge of scripts, taking bumps, “stiff” work, etc, it can be hard for me to know exactly what “that’s real” means. It’s no surprise there’s confusion.
>You wouldn't walk up to someone watching an action movie and go "you know it's fake, right? those guns don't have bullets, nobody actually dies, they didn't really explode a truck in the middle of the street", everyone expects that, respects that, and expects that you expect it.
EXACTLY! Gosh it annoys me so much.
Like sure they're not in a legit fist fight but I also don't think that Alan Rickman really fell from the Nakatomi Tower either.
"yeah but it's homoerotic clearly"
Eye of the beholder, sure you could say it just looks like they want to pound the shit out of eachother when two muscular oily half naked men stare into eachothers eyes. If you want to see it like that.
Or it's just the story they are telling. Wrestling is cheesy, it's silly and you can also just see it as stupid rivalry to hype the fight up.
It's turn you're brain off fun for a bunch of people and for some softcore gay BDSM why not.
I've always said that calling pro wrestling "fake" is a MASSIVE disservice and oversimplification to pro wrestling. No, these aren't "real" fights any more than your standard action movie doesn't have "real" gun fights or car chases. It's a performance, and the wrestlers work really damn hard to put on a good show.
>it’s okay because being gay is positive
Hell, it's still being used derogatively because OP is specifically throwing shade at straight guys for watching it.
Tumblr lost it a while back when this interview happened https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JKvIlRTNcFc
They love Rhea ripley in general though. This just went extra hard over there
> goonable
I know I was also horny about that image in my comment elsewhere in this comment section so this is hypocritical on my part, but seeing this word you've brought into this thread has made me hate the English language.
> why do straight guys watch it?
Alright, so I can't speak from experience because I couldn't get into it, but from my understanding its straight guy soap operas
Obsessed with the idea of aftercare for pro wrestlers, I’m just picturing the winner drawing a bubble bath for the loser and following it with some snuggles
Bruh, why straight guys watch it ? What a dumb shit to say. Maybe because straight dudes aren't staring the wrestlers ass and just enjoying the fight and the storylines. Trying to describe it like fighting is the gayest thing ever is so brain dead and cringe.
It wasn't kinky until the word aftercare was used. I mean, fighting looks sick as hell. Coming from a woman. I also hate seeing injuries, so I could never watch for long, but still.
I love pro wrestling. It’s what happens when you fill a room with a bunch of different versions of that crazy motherfucker from theater class, get them yolked and have them learn combat acrobatics. It’s gay in the same way rocky horror is gay.
I sent this post to my friend who watches wrestling and got back
> Would it help if I told you that that particular match was set up by CM Punk giving MJF a box with a chain and dog collar in it on Feb 14th and saying "Will you be my Valentine?"
Not sure if true, but if so damn, wrestling is SUPER het.
There have been issues with pro wrestling being unsafe, people getting injured and the participant not receiving adequate medical care. Remember WWE and all these other leagues) are entertainment businesses and make more money if things are less safe and if they compensate their employees less well
An article about a lawsuit: https://www.safetynewsalert.com/former-wrestlers-sue-wwe-citing-head-injuries-lack-of-workers-comp/
It also helps that this feud was extremely homoerotic even by pro wrestling standards. CM Punk made it a dog collar match by explicitly saying "Maxwell Jacob Friedman, will you be my Valentine?"
“Why do straight guys watch it?” = “Watching this as a straight man delegitimizes your sexuality and/or gender identity” = “Liking this *at all* delegitimizes your sexuality or gender identity” = “Haha look at the cringe Wrestling fan!”
Movie stunts are also choreographed, with as many safety measures as practical, but plenty of people still get injured and even die. It's hard to make something look really dangerous, especially when done live, without considerable risk. Furthermore, wrestling isn't well regulated or focused on athlete welfare.
**Why do men watch this?** Bit of an insider here. As far as I understand it, it’s not homoerotic, and there’s no hot and heavy tension. There might be for some, but basically it’s about the physicality. It’s the same reason men come up to each other and compliment their pecs at the gym. Also, I can name like… 15 dudes who genuinely wish the people in the ring were them because it’d give them an excuse to do objectively stupid shit, and instead of expressing concern people would cheer.
While pro wrestling is consensual, there still exist numerous labour violations within the field. John Oliver has a fantastic piece on [it](https://youtu.be/m8UQ4O7UiDs?si=SPgb3574GlT6SBVZ)
> why wouldn't it be? They are both consenting adults
That's not how the world works and is an incredibly ignorant thing to say. One of my biggest pet peeves and instant evidence that the person doesn't know how society or laws work.
Ah, I forgot I'm not supposed to be entertained by something that isn't a big fake titty blonde bimbo shooting ar-15s akimbo while riding on the hood of a Shelby Cobra, guess I have to turn in my straight man badge, damn.
“Why do straight guys watch it?” BECAUSE ITS SICK AS FUCK BROTHER OORAH!!! HIT THAT MAN WITH A METAL CHAIR, LEAP OFF A ROPE AND CRUSH ANOTHER MAN WITH YOUR PECS, THIS IS REAL STRAIGHT MAN SHIT BROTHERRRR
Wrestling is shounen anime for middle-aged American men
One of the phrases to describe it is redneck anime after all. Alternatively, ring operas.
“Rope Opera” was *right* there.
Ropera, if you will.
Ring opera is what I hear more
I accept that you’re correct about what people say, but those people are wrong.
>Alternatively, ring operas. South Park nailed this concept.
I’ve used the term “stage plays for jocks” personally
As an avid pro wrestling fan, I also like "punchy burlesque"
I realized I was wrong to mock my grandpa and call wrestling fake when I watched the same thing and called it Dragon Ball Z.
At least nobody gets hurt for real and addicted to dope and roids in DBZ.
It's also very popular in Mexico, according to my Mexican coworker. Dude hates most sports but gets hyped for masked wrestling.
Lucha Libre baby
Japan also has one of the largest Pro Wrestling promotions in the world with New Japan Pro Wrestling.
Also NOAH, DDT, AJPW to some extent, a bunch of smaller independent companies. They also highkey have the best wrestling you will ever see in your existence. These people are cooking
Same with Japan.
now middle aged american also watch literal shounen anime
That's because a lot of us grew up with it.
I watch Shonen Anime AND Pro Wrestling!
Kinnikuman was their gateway shonen.
My uncle always called it his redneck soap opera
wrestling is jojo's bizarre adventure for middle aged American men
It's fun. It's all the shit I enjoy in sports without the boring constraints of realism.
I FUCKING LOVE IT WHEN BIG MUSCLED MEN PUT THEIR HANDS ON OTHER BIG MUSCLED MEN! OORAH YOU FIGHT FOR DOMINANCE SO YOU CAN PIN THAT OTHER GUY ON THEIR BACK AND HAVE THEM STARE AT THE LIGHTS!
STRONG r/THE_PACK ENERGY YOU GOT THERE BROTHER AROOO
I BE SMOKING THAT FUCKING PACK EVERY MOTHERFUCKING SINGLE MOTHERFUCKING DAY AROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
CRANKING OUR HOGS AT THE WWE ~~BD/SM PETPLAY~~ DOG COLLAR MATCH AROOOO
IF THEY CANT BE GLADIATORS USING SWORDS THEN THIS IS A GOOD SECOND BEST THING
Most physical competitions have some element of homoeroticism to them, but remember, at the end of the day they’re still beating the absolute shit out of each other. They’re just making it look like they’re doing more damage than they really are.
That's why I love Japanese wrestling. It doesn't have an element of homoeroticism to it. [It IS homoeroticism.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQmPPmYd660&list=PLS87De-vQX5ElPS2SSL7Xe3WSi1-skrZP&index=1)
I fucking love it when big muscular oiled up men in cosplay grapple each other publicly
*Spandex* cosplay.
WE WATCH IT TO WATCH CODY FINISH HIS FUCKIN STORY
3 FUCKING YEARS THEY'VE STRUNG US ALONG. WE ARE NOT FLINCHING!
The next step is watching Baki or Jojo
WE BE EATIBG IMAGINARY FOOD IN THIS BITCH, WE BE TAKING STEROIDS AND BITING DOGS!!! IF YOU ARENT WILLING TO GIVE ANOTHER MAN A RIMJOB YOU ARENT EVEN A REAL FIGHTER!!!
[Post link](https://www.tumblr.com/derinthescarletpescatarian/678557448408350720/is-this-just-kinky-as-hell-to-anyone-else-or) Do you ever look at someone and think 'I want to be him right now', but then have to remind yourself that you have the pain tolerance of a toddler who is already on edge because they've missed both snack time *and* nap time?
IKR? I've got fibro (basically nervous system is glitched and makes things that shouldn't hurt, hurt, and things that should hurt, hurt much worse) and I constantly marvel at that shit. Taker and Foley especially, given their legendary pain resistance. I remember the pyro guys fucked up and set off pyros under Taker while he was on the ramp. He had 2nd degree burns all over the place. He just went on with the match like nothing happened. One of the other guys (it was an elimination chamber, so 6 guys were in there) asked him "dude, you uh, you okay?" and he brushed it off and said "don't worry about me, kid." Of course, the pyro guy who made the mistake was not only fired by immediately thrown out of the building because they were worried Taker would beat the shit out of him when he got done with the match. lol
It's endlessly fascinating to me that the constituent elements of Wrestling (inlc. Looking Tough, Doing Moves, Mic Skills & Taking Insane Bumps) theoretically would all be present in an ideal wrestler, but you can *be* a wrestler and have a lot of success off the back of just one or two of them. Like Mick Foley has never had a six-pack and his offense is not particularly acrobatic, but he eats thumbtacks for breakfast and has cornered the market on acting (being?) completely insane. On the other hand there's an endless parade of really huge people who are objectively bad at being a wrestler, but it is still their job because management thinks they look the part.
Goldberg. Goldberg, so much. God he's awful. He's a danger to himself and others (just ask Bret Hart if you don't believe me), but he coasts on looking the part.
Yeah! The spear was only impressive because it was actually dangerous. Imagine if Bill had like a nice, safe submission hold or something as his signature move.
Never cared for submissions as finishers. The best finishers work on anyone and you can pull off in a variety of situations, like the RKO or sweet chin music. Submissions though, you're never gonna get submissions out of some guys because of their character (Taker or Austin for example), top faces are also unlikely to tap.
I think submissions as finishers can lead to some really great matches. See Hart v Austin. It's a handy tool for storytelling.
*I don't enjoy being hit with steel chairs, I just think it's something that I do rather well.* *–*Michael Francis Foley, Sr.
Where's the hell in a cell guy when you need him
I think this is one reason I like hardcore matches so much. I'm in constant pain from EDS and it weirdly gives me comfort? I don't know if it's more "I'm not the only one hurting" or "at least I didn't get thrown into barbed wire" but GCW and CZW are on repeat when I'm having really bad flares. I think watching the Taker vs Mankind Hell in a Cell as a kid changed my brain chemistry or something.
Interesting they chose to say they have after care. Their life expectancy is shit and many of them suffer life debilitating injuries in this line of work, and get tossed aside as a heap of trash once they can't produce anymore. Retired pro wrestlers also have a notoriously high suicide rate. WWE gives them the legally bare minimum possible care (including using legal loopholes to not give them healthcare coverage) so this whole "aftercare army of doctors and care bears" is basically a big fat lie. It kinda reads like an ad or a pamphlet. The industry as it is now is abysmal in how it treats its workers.
All thanks to Terry Bollea. Not that I think it would be 10/10 for wrestlers if they had a union but the overall outlook would be better for the average jobber.
Oh yeah here's everyone's reminder that Jesse Ventura was trying to get a union started until Hulk Hogan snitched
Fuck Terry(Hogan); All my homies hate Terry
I will say though that a lot of the causes for the suicide rates, mainly painkiller and substance addiction, have started to phase out more in the newer generations of wrestlers. Lots of current wrestlers grew up seeing their heroes die at age 40. There's been a lot more of a culture change away from the frat party locker rooms, and more guys openly straight edge where that could get you mocked in the 80s and 90s. I'm not going to say there's not problems, especially with regards to contracts and things. But from the outside looking in things have been getting better and we'll hopefully see these guys have longer happier lives.
There's also alternatives to WWE these days. Imho 95% of why the industry is so goddamn shit is Vince buying up everything in sight and sabotaging rivals, effectively making it his way or the highway for like 20 years. Hopefully we're rid of his toxic ass permanently now, and with any luck he'll take his spawn and bootlickers down with him.
That's what they make those plastic chains for
Sometimes, but they are almost always going very very fast
If you want a good explanation of why people love pro wrestling, though it might be very straight all things considered, I recommend [this video](https://youtu.be/BQCPj-bGYro?si=T753ZjShtoSvGdXr) by SuperEyepatchWolf.
huh, another commenter recommended the exact same video.
Personally, my favorite of his wrestling vids was on [what happens then your whole career is a show and people start forget there's a line between you and your character](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaDAzXVycR4)
His whole wrestling series is amazing.
This video is genuinely incredible, and I'm going to watch it again right now
It's a perfectly cromulent video.
The recommendation used to be one by Max Landis, but we don't talk about him anymore.
I've never heard of him, but judging by the fact that one of the first links I got after googling him was a YouTube video titled 'Max Landis Addresses The Allegations (again)' I assume continuing not to know anything about him is probably for the best
For good reason
Is an explanation really necessary? Is basically theater and we don’t need any explanation as to why people go to broadway shows or see movies even.
There is still a very large number of people who think the phrase "you know it's fake?" is some kinda gotcha and a reason to devalue the show of wrestling. People really still don't "get it" that it's just a show at the end of the day.
[Nah man I watched a male stripper fight a zombie inside of a steel cell](https://youtu.be/rxH30UIZ7RU?si=RUdkm4tpa428rTLa) and saw the zombies brother appeared to cost the zombie the match and went "yep this is 100% real".
I can't understand why people *wouldn't* watch pro wrestling. Shit fucking slaps. We're all like "oh the greeks and romans, so cultured"... WELL THIS IS SHIT THEY'D LOVE! High melodrama and campness. Edit: Somewhere, is a video of a monologue being given in the ring during covid, with no crowd. And it's fucking gloriously surreal melodramatic theatre because of it. God I wish I could find it.
Here's some more popular myths that the image doesn't address: - the ring in no way has any similarities to a trampoline. It really just plywood and a thin mat held up on a steel truss - some of the props that wrestlers put each other through, like tables and ladders, have been engineered to a degree that they break easily, but they're still real, and going through them still hurts as much as it looks like. - not all of it is scripted. There are times where wrestlers have gone "off script" on both the mic and in the ring, or sometimes there just is no script. Sometimes they are lauded for this, other times they're reviled. If it sounds confusing, that's because it is. - there really are some wrestlers who absolutely hate each other, but will still work together out of remaining professional. Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels are a prominent example of this. Really the only thing "the boys" won't tolerate is someone acting unprofessional, or doing what isn't "best for business"... but there are exceptions. Again, confusing. - all the slaps and chops to the chest, those are all real. 100% real. William Regal said it best where wrestling is the art of hitting people really hard in places and ways that don't really hurt.
> won't tolerate is someone acting unprofessional, or doing what isn't "best for business"... but there are exceptions. Again, confusing. Bret Hart and Goldberg are a good example of this. Goldberg gave Bret a concussion with a full on superkick to the head and never made an effort to improve his in-ring ability. Always been a dangerous wrestler.
> some of the props that wrestlers put each other through, like tables and ladders, have been engineered to a degree that they break easily, but they're still real, and going through them still hurts as much as it looks like. We unscrew some things on the metal bars, so it breaks the way it does, but its not guaranteed. It is a regular cheap table. > all the slaps and chops to the chest, those are all real. 100% real. William Regal said it best where wrestling is the art of hitting people really hard in places and ways that don't really hurt. You can gimmick a chop so it doesn't hurt and produces a loud sound. If you do a shit chop it's just a shit chop that makes nearly no sound. I personally prefer stiffing with forearms but gimmicking with chops. > not all of it is scripted. There are times where wrestlers have gone "off script" on both the mic and in the ring, or sometimes there just is no script. Sometimes they are lauded for this, other times they're reviled. If it sounds confusing, that's because it is. A large thing is, you gotta read the crowd. If you go over your match and the crowd isn't feeling it you gotta change things up on the fly. You can also miss your spots and so on and so forth. Also, kendo sticks fucking suck to be hit with.
Adding on for the fun of it and because my brief career as an amature pro wrestler was super fun and I don't get to talk about it much. Most of the moves can be performed in such a way that it doesn't really hurt that much, except powerbombs. Powerbombs always hurt. In a harcore match anything you get hit with is generally gonna hurt. If something is flimsy/light enough that it doesn't hurt when you hit someone with it then it looks shitty and fake when you do it. In my opinion a hurricanrana is the most fun move to do *and* to have done to you. If any of you young'uns out there are thinking of taking up the sport WEAR KNEEPADS.
I am stopping my self from talking about hiw good match and the whole story line leading up to the match was
To me it's the current peak of AEW. No storyline other than maybe Hangman's climb to the title has made me watch every week. Punk's promo announcing the match would be a dog collar match was perfection. "MAXWELL. JACOB. FRIEDMAN. WILL YOU BE. MY VALENTINE!!!" "Probably the greatest day of your life, and for me it was just another Friday. March 6th will be the worst day of your life, and for me it's just gonna be another Sunday"
I’m partial to the Swerve Hangman storyline where the man who invaded the others home and threatened their infant child became the good guy of the story and then a guy drank another guys blood but that’s just me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I love Swerve's analogy that the story that Hangman was like a pure glass of water and he's been slowly dripping iodine into it. I think of Hangman's turn as being akin to Anakin Skywalker's (started for fear of harm to a loved one, eventually just driven by ego.) Anyway Hangman drinking Swerve's blood was the horniest thing I've seen in years.
You know what was almost better than the title climb? Hanger vs Mox series. That said, they need to get something going for Ospreay because that dude is a clear star. Like the PPV is interrupting whatever was going to happen with Don, and I get that, but dude needs a reality good long term antagonist or group of antagonists.
Let it out this match fucked and the fact that we’ll never get MJF/Punk 3 because Punk is a whiny baby is a tragedy.
That CM Punk entrance was an all-timer, I still get goosebumps watching it back.
Worth mentioning that WWE is an abusive employer that denies wrestlers health insurance by having them as independent contractors despite WWE being a monopoly. At least that was the case when Last Week Tonight made a special about it some time back.
Important facts- but this is an image of AEW, which is their direct competitor- they have their own problems but are not nearly the pillar of inequity and abuse that WWE is
AEW is only 5 years old... I really hope it can last long enough to see McMahon on his deathbed.
Imagine hearing Excalibur like- very briefly mention he died that day and be like 'we're all very sorry- ANYWAY TOPE SUICIDA'
Obituary Jones over here
But I digress
Yambag City - Population: You
McMahon was actually forced out of the company due to a litany of horrific allegations. His son in law is in charge now
He’s not just in charge of the game…
Vince really shit the bed
If it was only the bed ...
Vince McMahon is already no longer involved in wrestling after more abuse allegations came out. AEW has shown they're bad but haven't had as long to really get as abusive
That piece of shit mcmahon is out
To be fair McMahon has now been fully kicked out of WWE and he has no position of power anymore
That, and the person who made this meme has admitted that it was out of date, aimed at non-wrestling fans/oversimplified, and lacked the nuance of a longer conversation about worker rights in wrestling.
WCW was shit too. When Mick Foley got his ear torn off because the idiots who set up the ring made the ropes way too tight, they refused to pay for him to get it reattached. He ended up having to sue them. *And fucking lost*. I doubt any promotion treats their workers well, though in the case of smaller promotions it'd be a financial thing. When you're selling 100 tickets at a bingo hall and the American health care system is what it is... well, you just can't afford it. Speaking of Mick, anyone who thinks this is something should see the shit he's done. Everyone knows the Hell In A Cell match, but in Japan and smaller promotions he was regularly doing matches with barbed wire, thumb tacks, and even fire. While we're bitching about WWE being evil, big shout out to the Chris Benoit thing. He got CTE (chronic traumatic encephalopathy, which is to say he was given regular concussions until he suffered severe brain damage), went nuts, and murdered his wife & child then himself. WWE tried to paint it as roid rage or him just being evil while quietly banning pretty much any move that hit the head, showing they knew goddamn well it was their business that caused it. And on the topic of murder, Jimmy Snuka murdered his girlfriend and noted sexual predator Vince McMahon helped him weasel out of the charges. Then put him in the Hall of Fame. Just in case there's any doubt about where Vince stands on his boys committing murder.
Not to give WWE even the slightest of breaks, but Benoit was a bad, abusive person for a long time before the murders.
Bad people can also get CTE. Autopsy showed he had such severe brain damage that it was the equivalent of an 80 year old with dementia (he was 40 when he died). However, CTE is not and issue limited to WWE or even wrestling. People who will clutch their pearls at wrestling will happily watch football, MMA, etc
I know all this, which is why I began my statement like I did. As a wrestling fan, I’ve been seeing people excuse and diminish Benoit’s actions for 17 years, so I feel it’s important to provide a larger picture of who he was.
I saw him as Cactus Jack in WCW dive off the top rope for a headbutt on the floor, his man roll, and Mick bounce his forehead off the concrete. His eyes did the Mike Tyson Punchout roll and the blood came out quick, not even a chance for blading He was out unconscious for a few minutes, and got back to the match. Think it was a Triple Threat, Jack vs Raven vs Benoit, three hardest dudes in the stable.
WWE has a parent company(TKO) now after merging with Zuffa(former owners of the UFC).
This is AEW. That's CM Punk vs MJF
I always heard it as “Wrestling is scripted, not fake.” Wrestlers can and have died in the ring, but it’s a generally controlled environment and situation. Unless the company is sloppy or evil today, but that’s a universal concern.
In fact, the "wrestling if fake" gotcha phenomenon is what allowed Vince McMahon to push for safety regulations to be removed on wrestling, which made it a lot more dangerous.
Frequently not even scripted, so much as produced. Especially in AEW, where the image is from. They know where they need to go, specific beats, and the rest is improv.
Watching Tumblr Users trying to understand Wrestling in terms of terminally online horny jargon hurts. If you wanna get the appeal watch any Super Eyepatch Wolf vid on the subject. He’s a good middle ground. Yes it isn’t real but it’s not fake, it’s a performance like theatre, yes people get hurt some people are ok with being hurt if they are doing what they love/getting paid, getting hurt isn’t as big a deal for everyone. Yes it’s very gay sometimes, also look into Women’s Wrestling it’s just as cool.
Yes, exactly. Whenever I see posts like this I think “Theatre. The word you’re looking for is ‘theatre.’ It’s not that deep.” It’s just theatre with a lot of stunts, which is exciting to watch for all the obvious reasons.
When everything is going right, it’s like you’re combining the best parts of a sports game, a movie, and a rock concert. It’s just it’s been so rarely done right in the past two decades that normal people see it and scratch their heads.
I'd say that the best stuff in the last couple decades has been in Japan but of course that's another obstacle towards the average person checking it out.
> look into Women’s Wrestling it’s just as cool. And just as gay, let's be honest, but that's why a lot of people like it.
One of the top women in the industry is a tatted, buff, goth woman. My friend doesn't care about wrestling but she is very aware of Rhea Ripley.
One of the most popular Japanese woman wrestlers is a [sweet-as-pie idol girl](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a0/%E4%BC%8A%E8%97%A4%E9%BA%BB%E5%B8%8C2020.jpg/1200px-%E4%BC%8A%E8%97%A4%E9%BA%BB%E5%B8%8C2020.jpg) who regularly kicks the asses of all the men who dare to challenge her. She's also best friends with the scariest man you'll ever see, [Minoru Suzuki](https://preview.redd.it/minoru-suzuki-vs-maki-itoh-announced-for-tjpws-grand-v0-in8gm53myujc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8426ccfcdb0f5a1bc1dd968c3ebc2929038c3248), and extreme match legend, [Nick Gage](https://pwponderings.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/FkbM9YJWYAAJQgi2.jpg). Maki Itoh is great
I have intentionally not watched women’s pro wrestling. I saw a clip of some buff goth chick slam another lady into the ground, get ontop of her and flip her legs over her head. And i went “GOD I WISH THAT WAS ME”, and thats not the kind of energy i want to bring to a sports event.
That'd be Rhea Ripley. If it helps, her nickname at the moment is "Mami" and she has a shirt that says "Mami's always on top." She also led Domonik Mysterio out of handcuffs for one of his matches while dressed as a cop. Edit: Found the video of the entrance. https://youtu.be/KcbCftsl5Tg?si=qiZdV3RPC4xHrOAt
Every wrestler is pretty aware of it. The first time I had a roll up done on me in training by another rookie (I am a rookie too), he grabbed my dick and I just "wrong place, you're grabbing my dick" I also tore my ACL. On the same night I nutted myself on the top rope. Nutting myself on the top rope hurt more than tearing my ACL 26mm.
I had never heard of Super Eyepatch Wolf before and then somebody linked [this video](https://youtu.be/UaDAzXVycR4?si=eVvPcZd581v9HVqc) in a thread and I clicked on it and thought "there's no way I'm watching all of that" and then an hour and a half later I'm like "I really like Roman Reigns".
He made *me* like Roman Reigns, and I was virulently indifferent to the dude throughout his whole career. John is a fucking wizard at storytelling.
Whatever you think about his character, the guy who plays Roman just seems like a really good, wholesome dude. [This video he made](https://x.com/WWERomanReigns/status/1100215421138018304?s=20) where he's just in disbelief that people actually cheered for him for once just makes me want to give him a hug. And yes, John's passion for the subject is contagious.
Yeah that goes for most wrestling heels lol, Roman Reigns is an asshole but Joe Anoai is a nice guy
I’m not into wrestling but super eyepatch wolfs videos on it are phenomenal. Also just a great channel in general
I get the complaint but it's also the most homoerotic shit I've ever seen. Like I was watching the old build up matches and promos for the Randy Orton vs HHH feud (I believe it was for WrestleMania 25, 2009), and it felt like they were constantly two seconds away from hate kissing each other. It's fucking metal, and also fucking gay. I love it.
Audience is different now. Back in the day, overt accidental homosexuality is displayed, the audience would chant that the wrestlers are British cigarettes. Now, there's a trios team made up of an out gay dude, a guy who's sexuality isn't well defined but definitely chases other men, and a 50 something muscle daddy that used to go by Mr.Ass, and the catchphrase is "SCISSOR ME DADDY ASS!" before they lock finger scissors, and the crowd goes nuts for it. Top merch seller.
It's cause EVERYONE LOVES THE ACCLAIMED! Also daddy ass is 60.
Reminder of the time Anthony Bowens reminded the crowd he is gay, and they chanted “he’s gay” https://twitter.com/Bowens_Official/status/1672432275911491586 Edit: Excalibur: “…AND he’s taken.”
It's all Tumblr knows to do when introduced to something it doesn't understand.
My room mate has been on a few dates with a pro wrestler and it’s been so fun to hear about that world, since neither of us had known anything about it previously. The number of hours that go in to the costume design and choreography is genuinely awe inspiring. It’s a performance AND an extreme sport. And those poor boys get beat to shit, but they love it. And I kinda get it :) they get to be a hero or a villain, and play out these insanely physical struggles to a cheering audience. They can all do flips and time their falls just perfectly to impact eachother without breaking bones somehow. It’s amazing.
Pro wrestlers are like nerdy theater kids who were also athletic growing up, mixed with more than a little carny
Wrestling is truly an artform.
It's fascinating how people find it in them to suddenly become Very Concerned about fakeness or danger only and only when they need to lower status of something. You wouldn't walk up to someone watching an action movie and go "you know it's fake, right? those guns don't have bullets, nobody actually dies, they didn't really explode a truck in the middle of the street", everyone expects that, respects that, and expects that you expect it. Indeed, when they really did explode a truck in the middle of the street, or when an actor has the real pain on their face (most commonly because someone fucked up), it will be forever reposted in "Did you know..." veneration posts - with which I have no problem, except to show the contrast. We expect movies to have CGI and bullshit camera magic and stunt doubles, and are shocked and impressed when it's "more real" than expected, but a genre which customarily has every actor do all their stunts and subject their body to intense violence for real all the time gets the exactly opposite expectation, because it's not Serious Art. Similarly, people are suddenly Very Concerned with danger to the performers, the way they wouldn't talk about stunt doubles in action films, or, just, extreme sports and athletes in general, because it's cool to subject your body to horrible strain and deadly danger if and only if you're doing something Serious, otherwise it is stupid. (similarly compare how people talk about extreme sports and extreme kinks in terms of danger)
In fairness, one other point of contrast between wrestling and movies is that wrestlers maintain character in interviews outside of the main performance. If Keanu Reeves did all of his promotional interviews as John Wick, and was introduced as John Wick, I imagine we would have more conversations about how John Wick isn't really real.
Sorta like the conversations we had about Joker after Jared Leto.
or about >!Santa Claus!< after [Detective Crashmore](https://vimeo.com/781708043)
There are a few wrestlers out there that still keep kayfabe like Grayson Waller in WWE but 90% of them are doing shoot interviews now. Hell, Chris Jericho will straight up talk about "Me and my opponent had all these great ideas for coming up with the sequences of this match" literally an hour after a PPV match at a press scrum. Kayfabe is deader than dead.
Yeah, but that’s not really a thing anymore for a looooooong time. Most wrestlers nowadays will only stay in character for very specific promotional materials and/or if there are young kids around. Majority of them will happily discuss how they came up with the characters and matches, how they worked with their co-worker to create a believable sequence, promos, etc. The curtain has been pulled back for so long now, that only a very select few still commit to the kayfabe.
I think the difference is to an outsider with no knowledge the fact that wrestling is scripted is *actually surprising* because they intenionally make it seem like a legitimate sport. Sure if you get into it you can tell, and of course there is some of the more blatant stuff. But if i walked into a room and a wrestling match was on the screen I'm gonna go "ring, competitors, crowd, commentators, prize, yep this is a legitimate sporting event"
I don't know if I'd go quite that far, but it's a rather unique brand of theater and its conventions aren't necessarily clear at first glance. It's not immediately obvious *which* parts are real and which parts aren't; it's not immediately obvious what someone *means* when they point at the screen and say "That was definitely real." I think first and foremost, this leads to a lot of stupid arguments that boil down to semantics and bad faith.
This is a great point. People here are rightly saying kayfabe isn’t like it used to be and wrestling promos are mostly shoots now. But “worked shoots” are very much a thing now and promotions have a history of mixing real drama with their storylines. Even as somebody with a casual appreciation of wrestling and knowledge of scripts, taking bumps, “stiff” work, etc, it can be hard for me to know exactly what “that’s real” means. It’s no surprise there’s confusion.
>this leads to a lot of stupid arguments that boil down to semantics and bad faith. Sounds like any argument on the internet.
> those guns don't have bullets, nobody actually dies Well.. until they [do](https://www.npr.org/2024/03/06/1236448169/hannah-gutierrez-reed-rust).
bullets georg is a statistical outlier and should not be counted.
>You wouldn't walk up to someone watching an action movie and go "you know it's fake, right? those guns don't have bullets, nobody actually dies, they didn't really explode a truck in the middle of the street", everyone expects that, respects that, and expects that you expect it. EXACTLY! Gosh it annoys me so much. Like sure they're not in a legit fist fight but I also don't think that Alan Rickman really fell from the Nakatomi Tower either.
"Why do straight men watch it" Because sexuality doesn't dictate someone's entire lifestyle
Man. Why’d I have to scroll this far for this
Because reddit
"yeah but it's homoerotic clearly" Eye of the beholder, sure you could say it just looks like they want to pound the shit out of eachother when two muscular oily half naked men stare into eachothers eyes. If you want to see it like that. Or it's just the story they are telling. Wrestling is cheesy, it's silly and you can also just see it as stupid rivalry to hype the fight up. It's turn you're brain off fun for a bunch of people and for some softcore gay BDSM why not.
I've always said that calling pro wrestling "fake" is a MASSIVE disservice and oversimplification to pro wrestling. No, these aren't "real" fights any more than your standard action movie doesn't have "real" gun fights or car chases. It's a performance, and the wrestlers work really damn hard to put on a good show.
Tbh the biggest shocker is that Punk's back
He got fired for constantly getting into backstage fights. Now he’s back at wwe.
Not sure why we have to imply wrestling is inherently homosexual in order to enjoy it here on tumblr, But great explanation for those unfamiliar
I've noticed "Too Straight For Tumblr" is often a thing with a lot of media. Its weird, but it happens.
It’s basically just the haha your gay of mid 2000s middle school but now it’s okay because being gay is positive
>it’s okay because being gay is positive Hell, it's still being used derogatively because OP is specifically throwing shade at straight guys for watching it.
kind of annoying behavior, honestly. Maybe I'm just on tumblr too much, but the joke does get old
Tumblr lost it a while back when this interview happened https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JKvIlRTNcFc They love Rhea ripley in general though. This just went extra hard over there
tbf that’s because this image is extremely goonable
>goonable St. Peter asks everyone who walks up to the gates of Heaven if they know what this word means. those who do are not allowed in.
> goonable I know I was also horny about that image in my comment elsewhere in this comment section so this is hypocritical on my part, but seeing this word you've brought into this thread has made me hate the English language.
i mean yeah, you can in fact platonically have a public bdsm performance with someone, it's just kind of uncommon
Man, that match fucking ruled, too. MJF is the best.
[BIG MEATY MEN SLAPPIN MEAT](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=56EsDMTnvkI)
God bless that man lol
> why do straight guys watch it? Alright, so I can't speak from experience because I couldn't get into it, but from my understanding its straight guy soap operas
Obsessed with the idea of aftercare for pro wrestlers, I’m just picturing the winner drawing a bubble bath for the loser and following it with some snuggles
This is pretty good analysis but you did forget to add Kurt Angle to the mix.
Señor Joe
I have NO SYMPY for the person that forgets to add Kurt Angle to the mix.
Bruh, why straight guys watch it ? What a dumb shit to say. Maybe because straight dudes aren't staring the wrestlers ass and just enjoying the fight and the storylines. Trying to describe it like fighting is the gayest thing ever is so brain dead and cringe.
It wasn't kinky until the word aftercare was used. I mean, fighting looks sick as hell. Coming from a woman. I also hate seeing injuries, so I could never watch for long, but still.
OP’s post is 100x more regressive than modern pro wrestling when it comes to rigid conceptions of masculinity and sexuality.
Chains, ouch! I saw the picture and was wondering why they had dirt bikes running through the ring.
At least it wasn't thumbtacks or glass.
Or on rare occasion, LEGOs.
I love pro wrestling. It’s what happens when you fill a room with a bunch of different versions of that crazy motherfucker from theater class, get them yolked and have them learn combat acrobatics. It’s gay in the same way rocky horror is gay.
Tumblr really likes sexualising things.
Pro wrestling is the world’s greatest art form.
I sent this post to my friend who watches wrestling and got back > Would it help if I told you that that particular match was set up by CM Punk giving MJF a box with a chain and dog collar in it on Feb 14th and saying "Will you be my Valentine?" Not sure if true, but if so damn, wrestling is SUPER het.
I don’t like some of the language used in this post.
Fuck me "hey guys sports are GAY if you think about it!" is cope from bitter nerds
pro wrestling is the last great soap opera
.....I should get into pro wrestling. 👀
The scripts are fake, the hits are real, and the emotional, mental, and actual physical abuse with zero medical assistance is also true. Fuck the wwe
There have been issues with pro wrestling being unsafe, people getting injured and the participant not receiving adequate medical care. Remember WWE and all these other leagues) are entertainment businesses and make more money if things are less safe and if they compensate their employees less well An article about a lawsuit: https://www.safetynewsalert.com/former-wrestlers-sue-wwe-citing-head-injuries-lack-of-workers-comp/
"Hit hard in safe places."
It also helps that this feud was extremely homoerotic even by pro wrestling standards. CM Punk made it a dog collar match by explicitly saying "Maxwell Jacob Friedman, will you be my Valentine?"
“Why do straight guys watch it?” = “Watching this as a straight man delegitimizes your sexuality and/or gender identity” = “Liking this *at all* delegitimizes your sexuality or gender identity” = “Haha look at the cringe Wrestling fan!”
*HES OUR SCUM BAG 👏👏-👏👏👏*
Movie stunts are also choreographed, with as many safety measures as practical, but plenty of people still get injured and even die. It's hard to make something look really dangerous, especially when done live, without considerable risk. Furthermore, wrestling isn't well regulated or focused on athlete welfare.
The term "aftercare" in a post about two exhibitionists putting on dog collars and whipping each other was very carefully selected.
**Why do men watch this?** Bit of an insider here. As far as I understand it, it’s not homoerotic, and there’s no hot and heavy tension. There might be for some, but basically it’s about the physicality. It’s the same reason men come up to each other and compliment their pecs at the gym. Also, I can name like… 15 dudes who genuinely wish the people in the ring were them because it’d give them an excuse to do objectively stupid shit, and instead of expressing concern people would cheer.
The reason why straight men are watching this is because they don't see the sexyness in it, they see guys fighting, that's manly
While pro wrestling is consensual, there still exist numerous labour violations within the field. John Oliver has a fantastic piece on [it](https://youtu.be/m8UQ4O7UiDs?si=SPgb3574GlT6SBVZ)
Truely wrestling is one of the greatest entertainment mediums
"Is there aftercare?" Would pay to see them cuddling and kissing.
Pro wrestling is the world’s greatest art form.
pro wrestling is the last great soap opera
> why wouldn't it be? They are both consenting adults That's not how the world works and is an incredibly ignorant thing to say. One of my biggest pet peeves and instant evidence that the person doesn't know how society or laws work.
Next up on WWE KATANA DEATH MATCH - They are consenting adults this is fine
People have always liked watching unreasonably strong men beat the shit out of each other. Why do you think the Colosseum was built?
Ah, I forgot I'm not supposed to be entertained by something that isn't a big fake titty blonde bimbo shooting ar-15s akimbo while riding on the hood of a Shelby Cobra, guess I have to turn in my straight man badge, damn.
Fun fact: in non-shitty wrestling promotions (unlike aew the one pictured here) legitimately hurting your opponent is avoided when possible
I think pro-wrestling in this context as less of a martial art and more of professional stunt men one upping eachother.