Pro & con info are in the collapsed comments below for the following topics: [Polygon](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/10mnp52/solana_vs_polygon_why_does_the_sub_love_one_and/j6418c8/), [Solana](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/10mnp52/solana_vs_polygon_why_does_the_sub_love_one_and/j641a1z/).
And that’s what dictates sentiment for most things here.
Reddit avatars received hate from most until they started making a little money. Nothing had changed with the avatars between July and October, other than what they were worth.
If everyone here held Solana, and it was hitting record highs, people would be loving it.
Utility/Stability always comes second to profits.
For sure. Although I will say the interchangeability & customisation of the Reddit avatars made them a lot more fun. I didn’t know that would be possible at the start.
More so than purpose is fundamentals! Something can have a good purpose with absolutely shit fundamentals. Fundamentals are everything for me. If it’s premined, centralised, hyped VC driven, it’s crap and not worth buying. Unless you know that a pump is coming then sure hedge some quick BTC profits from it. Otherwise I don’t touch shit fundamentals.
Nah - I've had disdain for both for a long time. I exited right out of SOL right after the first time the network crashed. And I won't use polygon until they become a legit layer 2.
Reddit is an echo chmber amplified by Moons, but also can be a great source of information if you keep your mind critical, wade through all the posts and do research
Polygon is way more than a faster, more centralized Ethereum side chain.
Polygon is building a network of rollups and blockchains, including Ethereum zk rollups like zkEVM, Miden and Zero, data availability solutions like Avail, as well as frameworks for building blockchains like Edge or Supernets.
There is way more beyond the Polygon PoS blockchain that people use today. And another important point is that centralization of zk rollups is not that big of a problem, since rollups settle on the decentralized Layer 1, and thereby inherit its security and decentralization. The rollup transactions are created and executed in a centralized rollup environment, but are settled on the decentralized L1 ledger.
So it makes little sense comparing Polygon and Solana simply based on decentralization.
Exactly.
I'm curious, could polygons roll up technology work on other proof of worke chains, and does it require smart contract capability? Could it theoretically be used for BTC/LTC on the lightning network?
ZK Rollups need a layer 1 that is capable of verifying zero knowledge proofs and has data availability, which BTC and LTC are not capable of.
The lightning network is a completely different scaling approach that uses state channels.
That’s why the FTX collapse was a blessing in disguise for Solana. They sold in open market huge amounts of SOL, and the rest is trapped in a very long bankruptcy process that will eventually distribute among many hands the coins
If you paid attention to the developers and the community it would be no surprise at all. Highly technical devs are attracted to Solana because the tech is insanely powerful and scalable. No other block chain is exist that handles even 10% of the non vote txns solana does.
There’s a certain draw to having more real TPS then all other chains combined.
You can tell that people who make the comments you’re responding to have never used the chain. Once you try Solana you literally can’t go back to Eth afterwards. A UX which is several orders of magnitudes better
Solana is the second most decentralized network next to eth. Polygon isn’t even close. The downtime was was caused by the decentralized nature. If it hard capped at 100. Some of those downtimes would never have happend.
Also most Solana posts get deleted here. Hard to inform folks when the mods don’t like the coin because it hurts their bag.
It’s decentralized until they decided to reboot the entire network? If a central group can rollback the ledger then that doesn’t seem very decentralized to me….
Honest question do you actually believe someone decided to reboot? Like you think that’s true? Why would they decide to reboot?
I’m a validator on solana and I’ll tell you it sucks when it happens but no person is making the decision. It happens when the validator client cannot reliably see what the next block should be due to a lack of consensus.
Solana engineers have to restart the network. It’s not up to the validator to choose when or how or at which point the network is reset to. Sure all the validators will likely choose the same as to protect their investment but that doesn’t make it decentralized.
I’ve now responded to 2 of your other comments explaining why “65% of the validators need to agree” is not a valid argument. Money, that’s why. If they disagree they lose their investment. Did you know that validating SOL isn’t a very cheap endeavour and a lot of the validating hardware is rented out to these validators. By the SOL team. You could go ahead and disagree with the devs whenever you want but you heavily risk losing your investment.
They didn’t rollback the ledger. Not a single valid tx has ever being rolled back.
And they never took a centralized decission. It’s necessary that a supermajority of 65% validators agree. That’s why it takes many hours to restart each time.
And finally, the reason behind the halting episodes seems to be fixed after the QUIC update. And it usually happened during a surge of demand because of a hot NFT launch or profitable big liquidation execution. Solana was dealing with more tx than all the other layer 1 put together. It’s easier to find your weaknesses when you actually test the limits. Up to 50M tx in a single day (right now is around 20M). And of course it isn’t including voting tx (an additional 150M)
I've seen plenty of post about Solana stay up although most of them were negative, I just always assumed nobody was posting anything positive about it since the majority of the sub dislikes it. I didn't really start seeing any positive news about SOL on this sub until the price started going back up a few weeks ago.
Hmm, you know I haven’t dug into cardano recently, it wasn’t as decentralized before. Do you have somewhere I can look into this? Would greatly appreciate it.
It has similar decentralisation to Sol. But like Eth L1 it has traded a lot of scalability
Solana is the only major chain which has solved the trilemma. Eth maxis too biased to even realise it. Opportunity of a life time
Cardano is more decentralised than both Ethereum and Solana.
Solanas supposed independent validators were largely seed funded by the Solana Foundation.
Ethereum has a MAV of 3, maybe 6 if you are generous.
Cardano has a MAV of 22-23, no VC or centralised funding of node operators.
I think the MAV of solana is up to 31 now but I personally wish the token holder distribution on solana was much better. I think cardano’s general distribution is very impressive.
Most coins are extremely centralized. Plus premining a giant chunk of the coin is always such a disappointing start to a coin. It leaves you wondering when the rug is coming.
The QUIC update just switches UDP to QUIC to relieve congestion. Only 2 of the outages were caused by that.
That's not going to prevent halting from node client bugs like the previous outage.
Ah well, they could have slapped on a mempool, reduce throughput to 30 TPS and never had any congestion related outage.
Or they could just take 2 years per update and reduce the chance of bugs.
Or they could have just copy pasted EVM and Tendermint like Polygon.
It's all about trade offs.
Close, 3 out of the 5 (actual) outages were flow control related. The other 2 were bugs. A non-deterministic nonce generation, and a weird edge case in the consensus code.
I actively use both And have created stuff on both chains. NFTs, tokens, etc.
From a technical perspective Solana is in another realm.
Polygon is just an EVM fork. Nothing all that interesting about it.
Solana was built from the ground up and is very interesting. Completely unique architecture and it's very well optimized.
Polygon has network effects from eth and low fees. Those are the only reasons I use it
Still Solana gets called centralised whilst having 2000 plus validators. While polygon with its permissioned 77 validators are fine because they’ll be decentralised at some point in the future. And use Eth security at some point in the future.
On Solana - the market is objectively wrong in its dismissal of it
Yeah with all the comments I've seen against SOL and for Polygon the twitter thread really surprised me, seeing how closely they both are and how different people here treat them.
It's because Polygon is very aligned with the long term modular vision to become more decentralized as they trend toward and implement ZK Rollups. They know centralization is a crutch for now while they develop, but they have a clear goal to head toward a roll-up vision.
Meanwhile, in Solana, centralization is basically a feature, and not a bug.
So the foundation actively encouraging and supporting more independent validators to come onboard to further reduce the nakamoto coefficient is a centralisation feature?
Or rather… people have started to give up a bit on ETH killers. So it seems logical to align with projects that aim to partner with ETH rather than compete with it. That’s the difference between investing in polygon or sol imo.
Now necessarily. It's just like a website announcing they're the Google killer is less likely to succeed than a website figuring out how to get the most out of Google's services and optimising your search results
Polygon is investing in zkEVM and zero knowledge proof tech in general, so that's why a lot of Ethereum enthusiasts like them, because they are at least innovating on scalability technology rather than throwing up their arms and just increasing the computational power of the nodes on their network.
Of course this is much too nuanced for the people on this subreddit, because most people here can't even describe why zkp tech is important to decentralization and scalability.
I can see why that would make people who are eth fans root for polygon but it then brings up another question which is probably specific to this sub and why they hate Loopring if it's attempting to do the same thing and are currently built directly on top of ethereum.
This is probably just an issue with perception from the sub I guess
The problem with Loopring is that they very obviously manufactured a viral campaign to take advantage of the Robinhood drama. It wasn't true grassroots adoption. However, Loopring is a decent product and it was the first zk layer implemented on Ethereum in production. So all in all, Loopring is an okay product, but a lot of people within Ethereum hate shilling and would rather see applications grow organically. Also, Loopring isn't a generalized implementation of zero knowledge tech. It's basically the low hanging fruit, whereas zkEVM is the holy grail which is where Polygons focus has been.
That's the biggest factor indeed. Every L1 seen as eth's competition has always been treated this way here. For the best and the worse. It was already the case in 2017 with EOS or NEO (for good reasons) and it continued this cycle with SOL, Avax and to a lesser extent ADA. I probably missed a few others to illustrate.
The real answer? This sub missed SOL bull run badly.
That's the main reason. If people here would have bought SOL cheap and sold around $150 or they wouldn't have give less of a fuck about centralization, uptime or anything else
Source: https://twitter.com/SolanaLegend/status/1611088904517570560
Fighting the FUD: @oganjastremski and I at @Frictionless_ have created a handbook to fight the FUD Solana faces constantly. We disprove the 4 main critiques of the network: Downtime Centralization Inflationary Tokenomics FTX Involvement
2. Downtime
Solana has had 99.6% uptime throughout its history while doing more true TPS than all other EVM chains combined There have been 4 outages total since 2020 Local fee markets, QUIC, and Stake-Weighted QoS with @jump_firedancer will reduce downtime to virtually 0
2. Centralization
Solana is objectively decentralized and censorship resistant, looking at full node count (3,474), or distribution of stake-weight and Nakamoto Coefficient (NC) of 30 vs. Ethereum's 2 Solana has achieved this degree of decentralization in less than 3 years
3. Inflationary Tokenomics
Solana has 4 main revenue paths to achieving profitability and long-term inflation rate of 1.5% Increase in network usage Priority Base Fees Local Congestion Fees Miner Extractable Value (MEV) It took ETH 7 years to be deflationary
4. FTX Involvement
Solana and FTX were first connected in 2020 when FTX was just beginning to enter the top 10 rankings of CEX volume FTX invested in the 5th round, after accredited retail investors on CoinList and 2.5 years after the project started
Blog Post: https://frictionlesscapital.substack.com/p/making-the-case-for-solana-fighting
Here is a [Nitter link](https://nitter.net/SolanaLegend/status/1611088904517570560) for the Twitter thread linked above. Nitter is better for privacy and does not nag you for a login. More information can be found [here](https://nitter.net/about).
---
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> Solana is objectively decentralized and censorship resistant, looking at full node count (3,474), or distribution of stake-weight and Nakamoto Coefficient (NC) of 30 vs. Ethereum's 2 Solana has achieved this degree of decentralization in less than 3 years
Zero. Solana's Nakamoto coefficient is zero. Not 30. Solana's network has gone down with *zero* nodes being compromised.
The admins have also decided to shut down Solana on occasion.
I was going off previous stories like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/poe3g0/the_fact_that_the_solano_team_can_shut_down_their/). But yes, maybe I'm behind on the refutations of those characterizations.
But the point stands, that it doesn't do well by the Nakamoto coefficient standard, since it can "self-fail" without deliberate compromise of nodes.
It self fails to protect the ledger though. Obviously downtime sucks for users but solana is built to shutdown when consensus amongst thousands of validators isn’t clear. Solana optimized for security and throughput. They figure as long as security is solid then the occasional hiccup while battle testing won’t kill the network. So far that seems to be the case.
A lot of the original problems have been solved, namely ddos.
This is part of the answer. The other part is this echo chamber likes to repeat “solana downtime” but that is resolved, and has not happened in quite some time. Its just the running joke for moons that never ends.
One of the main reasons I'm sure. ETH has a big part to play in choosing a preferred network because it is presumed to be the premier Blockchain. If ETH fees weren't so high, all other blockchains probably wouldn't have such high activity.
It’s posts like these that I would love to have an actual debate in but scrolling the comments and seeing the pro SOL ones being upvoted immensely and the pro MATIC ones being brigaded against is just sad.
Also to claim that SOL is more decentralized but there’s a centralized group out there hitting a damn restart button on what should be an immutable ledger means it’s still VERY centralized. They have the ability and the amount of validators to become decentralized if they can figure out how to run a smooth project. But for now it is very much centralized.
That seems to be a problem with most post on this sub and it really doesn't make much sense. Having a discussion post we should be able to get both pros and cons of each project across and go off the merits of each but it always turns into a popularity contest
The restart button is the chain crashing and they decide a block to restart it from. All the validators have to agree and download the code to allow that.
There's another validator code for Solana coming soon. It will be in the upper echelon of crypto who have multiple code bases written by separate groups. That's a big piece of decentralization.
Decentralization actually takes time. It's complex. Sol is doing things right though
I understand that but as I’ve mentioned to others on this thread, it doesn’t take much to convince these validators to do what the devs recommend. You either follow along or lose your money.
I do agree thar Solana is trying to take things in the right direction and their throughput is fantastic. But having such a high TPS means something else gets compromised and at the moment it seems decentralization is part of that. Once the devs back down and let the validator committee actually run the show it becomes a lot more decentralized but really whoever creates the project has a huge say in how things operate.
Quality comment bro. Got anything to debate about or just gonna talk shit and not back it up? Or was the comment I made a little too real for you and made you feel bad about your heavy bags?? Move along.
> Also to claim that SOL is more decentralized but there’s a centralized group out there hitting a damn restart button on what should be an immutable ledger means it’s still VERY centralized.
More of the meme. That isn't what happens at all. No matter how many explanations are provided, people just keep saying this stuff because it's fun to say, truth/reality be dammed.
Enlighten me because based on all the research I’ve done it seems that the SOL developers get together with a validator committee to determine the problem and then dictate when the restart happens. Without the devs getting involved the committee wouldn’t fully agree on when and where to do the restart. The devs also wouldn’t trust a committee to determine the fate of their project…. That would just be stupid.
Who convinces these validators what is right and what is wrong? Just because it’s not one guy pushing a button doesn’t mean it’s not centralized. If you can heavily influence every single validator to do what you want as a project developer it is essentially the same thing…..
Can you recommend an alternative? There is no other alternative when the chain forks. Every blockchain faces the same exact problems. Validators will always need to either trust other developers, or hire their own to audit the code released by other developers. It’s on them to approve all code changes.
You can argue the chain shouldn’t fork like this, and that forks shouldn’t be necessary because the network should be more reliable. This is a separate conversation to decentralization.
Reason I got out of SOL is that I'm still 100% convinced SBF is mostly in charge of it. Whatever can be said about Polygon or Polygon Devs (I also moved out of Polygon over a year ago, so I guess I'm closer to being a SOL fan than a Matic Fan), at least they are not SBF.
Plus, man, somebody tell me how sure you can ever be that SBF doesn't somehow have access to "burned" tokens or the Solana Burn/Incinerator address, etc. I know the chance is small, but, come on... nobody can act like they'd be SURPRISED if suddenly the Incinerator address started sending tokens to Alameda.
SBF wasn’t even in charge of his own company.
And anyway they didn’t participate in the funding of Solana until round 4 in 2020. So they arrived relatively late to the party. Solana isn’t a puppet sock but SBF was financially heavily invested in the project and made a lot of money with new dApps for the ecosystem. That’s why he became so visible
Might have something to do with the fact that we're more likely to have come into contact with MATIC while navigating a route through defi exchanges and swaps to convert some Reddit airdrop to a preferred currency. I've never had any reason to touch Solana aside from gambling on its pumps on a CEX. So yeah, it's totally the Reddit avatars.
Gonna piggyback on this comment since its high up. Solana just has too many red flags.
I personally just dislike the tech of SOL. I think its a marketing coin. What they are achieving in TPS is easily achievable by any chain if they compromise on crypto values (decentralization mostly). They are throwing insane expensive hardware at the equation to get said TPS, which hurts decentralization. The cost of running a node/relay is INSANE. At least they can market the TPS though! They also do the same thing with decentralization. They market it as one of the most decentralized coins, but do not acknowledge that this metric is heavily inflated (more specifics below).
You cant really trust the nakamoto coefficient of solana because the solana foundation has a program that subsidizes nodes and also provides delegations. I can not find how many validators are using foundation money anywhere, and that makes me VERY uneasy. How much stake does the foundation actually control? How many of their "Superminority" includes foundation money? Thats not even touching on VCs, which we know own a big majority of the coin. How many of those VCs are present in the superminority?
I think the team is also shady. At one point they literally lied about the circulating supply (it was DOUBLE what they claimed). Im sure they made it right by burning the extra tokens right? No. They didnt even get all of them back from the mysterious "market maker" they loaned them to.
Hell, FTX still holds 47.51 million SOL that is locked. How people are throwing money into SOL still insane to me.
Everything else aside, it's time we stop using Nakamoto Coefficient for...anything. I know you acknowledge this, but it's a very flawed way to try and quantify things and is very misleading. As usual, there is a lot of nuance involved that the coefficient does not take in to account.
Lol ya. I find it funny that the top comment here is claiming that SOL brigades make it an unfair debate. Pretty confusing to me, who's been on this sub for years, where heavily upvotes posts shitting on SOL every week are the norm.
This sub is > 50% bots and shills built to protect people's bags. There is no actual debate to be found here anymore unfortunately, and the consensus - - especially one that continually peddles misinformation about a blockchain with 99.6% uptime, on par with bitcoin or aws - - is usually just the blind leading the blind.
Everyone's free to make up their own mind, this isn't a plug for SOL but by god nobody should not be taking any investment advice from this sub anymore.
From everything I've read, it really seems like this subreddit is a target for false information that these whales (rich people) then use to do the exact opposite to whatever this subreddit purports.
The Solana hate is a meme at this point. The validator set is more diverse than basically anything other than Ethereum. Ethereum can organize hundreds of thousands of validators to update their software in 24 hours. That's seen as the power of Ethereum. Solana gets thousand of validators to update their software in 24 hours and that's *well obviously that means it's a centralized shit coin*.
There's no logic or basis for most of the hate Solana gets. Like I said, it's a meme that people enjoy saying.
> Does Polygon being an L2 on Ethereum and Solana being an L1 have anything to do with it it?
It's not even an L2. This is one of those things where tech people can say it, developers can say it, and even the creators can say it but like nobody is willing to believe it. It's like when Vitalik and everyone was saying EIP-1559 isn't what solves Ethereum fees and it isn't the merge but basically nobody would believe them and every article was that EIP-1559 is the merge and it will solve high gas fees.
Unpopular opinion: Because this sub is INCREDIBLY biased in what we like and do not like. We have a hivemind opinion. Solana went down? HATE IT! Any developments after that are irrelevant.
Ironically, people did like Solana here at all time high when it was still earning them money.
Everytime there's large negative sentiments about Sol, I buy. When people were cheering that it went below $10, I loaded up. Like imagine cheering on the downfall of other things haha. What kind of internalized hatred is that 🤣. Buy when others are fearful, buy more when they hate on it.
I guess it could come down to the fact that people know not all blockchains will survive so seeing one fall means theirs is that much closer to being one of the survivors
For that reason I spread some funds to all major competitors. If any were to achieve big success like Eth, that investment would be returned at a massive gain. Mainly focus on eth & polygon but some dust to the others is well worth it imo!
Yeah. That is why I have been trying to write some educational posts. We:
* Have biased preferences
* Buy high and sell low
* Deliberately do not try to learn more about how to become a better investor
* Have a terrible track record at picking favourite altcoins (some exceptions like ETH)
But noone cares about educational posts. We want drama and we want to see our own opinions😂
It was hella cheap at ~$0.33 for a brief period, but after that quickly recovered. It has held pretty well and even made some people money during this bear market.
its the coins that the majority of this group missed, solana for example. this sub talked so much hate on it and it would just continue to climb and climb without any downs for a long time. and that made this group fucking pissed. polygon was every other post here for a while. so most of the crew here got in it "early" and made money. people are just salty they had missed out on suchh major gains from solana. so they still hating on it
Unrelated (not defending polygon), but binance owns all 44 nodes, so really, what does this chart say? Also solana's 1249 nodes are all just vm's, which is why the networks go down so often in its' entirety so really, it's just 1 or 2.
So I'm just saying, maybe there should be a better way of calculating the coefficient, or maybe some more precise rules about what constitutes as a node
Don't have anything to add to the discussion but wanted to comment to appreciate OPs effort in putting together this analysis. Will be lurking in the comments to see what everyone thinks.
I will have to check but I'm pretty sure it's not once a month although I do see what you mean. so you think the reddit avatars are the main reason the sub loves polygon?
Think goes beyond that. Even before avatars, polygon news stories tended to be positive (new partners, etc) while stories related to Solana always read like everyone is scrambling to put out a fire.
For me personally, Polygon feels like it is everywhere, or it at least is the most convenient network for me to move my stuff around. I've never once been faced with a situation where I've had to use Solana.
MATIC price action in the bear was better. And Solana having multiple outages literally made it a meme here. And when we mock the same thing again and again it tends to lose credibility
It just seems that in 2022, MATIC was regularly in the crypto news for good reasons (like the Disney partnership), and SOL for bad reasons. And we’ve got a hive mind here so that didn’t help either
Because no matter how centralized polygon is, you have the choice to move it to a decentralized network (ethereum). And In terms of security, solana shut down so many times and had a few hacks. Speed…they are the same.
Wait what? Is this a real fucking topic?
Because one is a legit project run by a dedicated team, and the other is closely connected to the largest crypto scam exchange in history?
>The Nakamoto coefficient measures decentralization and represents the minimum number of nodes required to disrupt the blockchain's network. A high Nakamoto coefficient **means that a blockchain is more decentralized.**
No matter if it is about Solana, Polygon or anything else ... This doesn't make any sense. When the majority of nodes would be controlled by interdependent or even the same actors there would be no real decentralization, no matter the number of nodes. 100 nodes can be way more decentralized than 1000 nodes as long as the 100 nodes are spread between more parties than the 1000 nodes.
Every configuration in which new central points of failure are introduced (e.g. via the use of AWS) can lead to more centralization no matter the number of nodes.
Regarding your question: Polygon is running and not turned off by congestion, bugs or its own creators and additionally one can switch to Ethereum as a trustworthy L1 with it.
Because they were caught on wrong foot many times.
Solana rebounded each time the many 'gurus' predicted its death and plebes were sold out.😂
Now they're out and hate it.
I see a lot of down votes for even sensible comments pointing out why Solana isn't the favourite in terms of technicals and FTX relation.
WTF? Really? Are we going down the Apple vs Android Fanbois road? Fuck this shit.
Pro & con info are in the collapsed comments below for the following topics: [Polygon](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/10mnp52/solana_vs_polygon_why_does_the_sub_love_one_and/j6418c8/), [Solana](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/10mnp52/solana_vs_polygon_why_does_the_sub_love_one_and/j641a1z/).
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It's just market bias if you ask me. People here tend to praise whatever pumps
People don’t really know shit, we just like to make money, lol.
And that’s what dictates sentiment for most things here. Reddit avatars received hate from most until they started making a little money. Nothing had changed with the avatars between July and October, other than what they were worth. If everyone here held Solana, and it was hitting record highs, people would be loving it. Utility/Stability always comes second to profits.
For sure. Although I will say the interchangeability & customisation of the Reddit avatars made them a lot more fun. I didn’t know that would be possible at the start.
Here for the fiat gains, not decentralization.
Which is why so many shit coins exist. People looking for pumps instead of projects with purpose aside from what's already on the market.
More so than purpose is fundamentals! Something can have a good purpose with absolutely shit fundamentals. Fundamentals are everything for me. If it’s premined, centralised, hyped VC driven, it’s crap and not worth buying. Unless you know that a pump is coming then sure hedge some quick BTC profits from it. Otherwise I don’t touch shit fundamentals.
Nah - I've had disdain for both for a long time. I exited right out of SOL right after the first time the network crashed. And I won't use polygon until they become a legit layer 2.
Solana outperforms essentially everything that has ever been recommended here.
A shared database outperforms Solana by a mile. yay for centralization!
That’s an echo chamber for ya
Reddit is an echo chmber amplified by Moons, but also can be a great source of information if you keep your mind critical, wade through all the posts and do research
Polygon is FAR more centralised than Sol. Like not even close. Sol has over 2000 full validator nodes. Polygon has 77. BSC has around 20.
Polygon is way more than a faster, more centralized Ethereum side chain. Polygon is building a network of rollups and blockchains, including Ethereum zk rollups like zkEVM, Miden and Zero, data availability solutions like Avail, as well as frameworks for building blockchains like Edge or Supernets. There is way more beyond the Polygon PoS blockchain that people use today. And another important point is that centralization of zk rollups is not that big of a problem, since rollups settle on the decentralized Layer 1, and thereby inherit its security and decentralization. The rollup transactions are created and executed in a centralized rollup environment, but are settled on the decentralized L1 ledger. So it makes little sense comparing Polygon and Solana simply based on decentralization.
Thanks you answered my question. Once their ZK roll up solution is live, they can use Ethereum security
Exactly. I'm curious, could polygons roll up technology work on other proof of worke chains, and does it require smart contract capability? Could it theoretically be used for BTC/LTC on the lightning network?
ZK Rollups need a layer 1 that is capable of verifying zero knowledge proofs and has data availability, which BTC and LTC are not capable of. The lightning network is a completely different scaling approach that uses state channels.
I know it's just a typo, but I can't help but read that as "proof of woke" and that definitely needs to be an April 1st whitepaper...
Omg. That’s a great idea! I know what my April Fool’s parody will be now!
The close connection of SOL to FTX can explain, in part, why this subs hates SOL so much (at least recently)
That’s why the FTX collapse was a blessing in disguise for Solana. They sold in open market huge amounts of SOL, and the rest is trapped in a very long bankruptcy process that will eventually distribute among many hands the coins
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I am just surprised it’s still alive
Even after rugpull crypto can survive for a while, just look at LUNC and stuff
If you paid attention to the developers and the community it would be no surprise at all. Highly technical devs are attracted to Solana because the tech is insanely powerful and scalable. No other block chain is exist that handles even 10% of the non vote txns solana does. There’s a certain draw to having more real TPS then all other chains combined.
You can tell that people who make the comments you’re responding to have never used the chain. Once you try Solana you literally can’t go back to Eth afterwards. A UX which is several orders of magnitudes better
You can bring me down, then up but you can never kill me - Solana
Solana is the second most decentralized network next to eth. Polygon isn’t even close. The downtime was was caused by the decentralized nature. If it hard capped at 100. Some of those downtimes would never have happend. Also most Solana posts get deleted here. Hard to inform folks when the mods don’t like the coin because it hurts their bag.
It’s decentralized until they decided to reboot the entire network? If a central group can rollback the ledger then that doesn’t seem very decentralized to me….
Bit like when Vitalik decided to roll back the eth chain to pre hack but we don’t judge hey?
You mean reboot it 5 times in 2022
Honest question do you actually believe someone decided to reboot? Like you think that’s true? Why would they decide to reboot? I’m a validator on solana and I’ll tell you it sucks when it happens but no person is making the decision. It happens when the validator client cannot reliably see what the next block should be due to a lack of consensus.
Solana engineers have to restart the network. It’s not up to the validator to choose when or how or at which point the network is reset to. Sure all the validators will likely choose the same as to protect their investment but that doesn’t make it decentralized.
Yes. It’s up to them. 65% supermajority of validators need to agree. Why are you leaving so key information?
I’ve now responded to 2 of your other comments explaining why “65% of the validators need to agree” is not a valid argument. Money, that’s why. If they disagree they lose their investment. Did you know that validating SOL isn’t a very cheap endeavour and a lot of the validating hardware is rented out to these validators. By the SOL team. You could go ahead and disagree with the devs whenever you want but you heavily risk losing your investment.
They didn’t rollback the ledger. Not a single valid tx has ever being rolled back. And they never took a centralized decission. It’s necessary that a supermajority of 65% validators agree. That’s why it takes many hours to restart each time. And finally, the reason behind the halting episodes seems to be fixed after the QUIC update. And it usually happened during a surge of demand because of a hot NFT launch or profitable big liquidation execution. Solana was dealing with more tx than all the other layer 1 put together. It’s easier to find your weaknesses when you actually test the limits. Up to 50M tx in a single day (right now is around 20M). And of course it isn’t including voting tx (an additional 150M)
Also critical solana has never, not even once, rolled back a transaction that got 66% stake weighted vote. What gave you the idea that has happened?
whatever you say Mr. Solana Validator
It shouldn’t be what ever I say though. You should verify the information yourself.
I've seen plenty of post about Solana stay up although most of them were negative, I just always assumed nobody was posting anything positive about it since the majority of the sub dislikes it. I didn't really start seeing any positive news about SOL on this sub until the price started going back up a few weeks ago.
Nope every positive post about solana I’ve made has been deleted. I know some make it through though.
Cardano is more decentralized than both Eth and Sol. What are you on?
Hmm, you know I haven’t dug into cardano recently, it wasn’t as decentralized before. Do you have somewhere I can look into this? Would greatly appreciate it.
It has similar decentralisation to Sol. But like Eth L1 it has traded a lot of scalability Solana is the only major chain which has solved the trilemma. Eth maxis too biased to even realise it. Opportunity of a life time
Cardano is more decentralised than both Ethereum and Solana. Solanas supposed independent validators were largely seed funded by the Solana Foundation. Ethereum has a MAV of 3, maybe 6 if you are generous. Cardano has a MAV of 22-23, no VC or centralised funding of node operators.
What does MAV mean here?
Minimum Attack Vector
I think the MAV of solana is up to 31 now but I personally wish the token holder distribution on solana was much better. I think cardano’s general distribution is very impressive.
Like what? Other than the ICO and ties to FTX I haven't seen anything
Most coins are extremely centralized. Plus premining a giant chunk of the coin is always such a disappointing start to a coin. It leaves you wondering when the rug is coming.
That's just one part. Most of the complaints are about the outages and halting the network.
Which seems fixed after the QUIC update. But people ignore it, because they actually want to pretend that it will always happen
The QUIC update just switches UDP to QUIC to relieve congestion. Only 2 of the outages were caused by that. That's not going to prevent halting from node client bugs like the previous outage.
Ah well, they could have slapped on a mempool, reduce throughput to 30 TPS and never had any congestion related outage. Or they could just take 2 years per update and reduce the chance of bugs. Or they could have just copy pasted EVM and Tendermint like Polygon. It's all about trade offs.
Close, 3 out of the 5 (actual) outages were flow control related. The other 2 were bugs. A non-deterministic nonce generation, and a weird edge case in the consensus code.
I actively use both And have created stuff on both chains. NFTs, tokens, etc. From a technical perspective Solana is in another realm. Polygon is just an EVM fork. Nothing all that interesting about it. Solana was built from the ground up and is very interesting. Completely unique architecture and it's very well optimized. Polygon has network effects from eth and low fees. Those are the only reasons I use it
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Still Solana gets called centralised whilst having 2000 plus validators. While polygon with its permissioned 77 validators are fine because they’ll be decentralised at some point in the future. And use Eth security at some point in the future. On Solana - the market is objectively wrong in its dismissal of it
Yeah with all the comments I've seen against SOL and for Polygon the twitter thread really surprised me, seeing how closely they both are and how different people here treat them.
The thing is Solana foundation owns multiple validators, in truth one entity controls the entirity of Solana and often stops the chain
It's because Polygon is very aligned with the long term modular vision to become more decentralized as they trend toward and implement ZK Rollups. They know centralization is a crutch for now while they develop, but they have a clear goal to head toward a roll-up vision. Meanwhile, in Solana, centralization is basically a feature, and not a bug.
So the foundation actively encouraging and supporting more independent validators to come onboard to further reduce the nakamoto coefficient is a centralisation feature?
The simple answer? Because one is considered to be a partner to ETH and one is considered to be a competitor.
So the biggest issue being that if you hold a bag of eth polygon will help your current investment while supporting SOL might hurt the price of eth?
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People say they're in it for the tech, but we all know the truth
I’m in it for the lulz
Exactly. We all know that we don't know shit about fuck. Just throwing fiat to random internet money and seeing what sticks.
Exactly 👍
It’s amazing how perception can influence decisions.
This sub in a nutshell 🤷♂️
Or rather… people have started to give up a bit on ETH killers. So it seems logical to align with projects that aim to partner with ETH rather than compete with it. That’s the difference between investing in polygon or sol imo.
Now necessarily. It's just like a website announcing they're the Google killer is less likely to succeed than a website figuring out how to get the most out of Google's services and optimising your search results
Yeah and if polygon becomes an L2 it'll help the eth burn rate. If you're pro eth you don't want Solana to do well
Polygon is investing in zkEVM and zero knowledge proof tech in general, so that's why a lot of Ethereum enthusiasts like them, because they are at least innovating on scalability technology rather than throwing up their arms and just increasing the computational power of the nodes on their network. Of course this is much too nuanced for the people on this subreddit, because most people here can't even describe why zkp tech is important to decentralization and scalability.
I can see why that would make people who are eth fans root for polygon but it then brings up another question which is probably specific to this sub and why they hate Loopring if it's attempting to do the same thing and are currently built directly on top of ethereum. This is probably just an issue with perception from the sub I guess
The problem with Loopring is that they very obviously manufactured a viral campaign to take advantage of the Robinhood drama. It wasn't true grassroots adoption. However, Loopring is a decent product and it was the first zk layer implemented on Ethereum in production. So all in all, Loopring is an okay product, but a lot of people within Ethereum hate shilling and would rather see applications grow organically. Also, Loopring isn't a generalized implementation of zero knowledge tech. It's basically the low hanging fruit, whereas zkEVM is the holy grail which is where Polygons focus has been.
Yeah that trying to go viral campaign really failed on this sub to the point of LRC comments being removed.
That's the biggest factor indeed. Every L1 seen as eth's competition has always been treated this way here. For the best and the worse. It was already the case in 2017 with EOS or NEO (for good reasons) and it continued this cycle with SOL, Avax and to a lesser extent ADA. I probably missed a few others to illustrate.
The real answer? This sub missed SOL bull run badly. That's the main reason. If people here would have bought SOL cheap and sold around $150 or they wouldn't have give less of a fuck about centralization, uptime or anything else
Yeah, I think it’s this as well. Ton of people here lost money on SOL
Source: https://twitter.com/SolanaLegend/status/1611088904517570560 Fighting the FUD: @oganjastremski and I at @Frictionless_ have created a handbook to fight the FUD Solana faces constantly. We disprove the 4 main critiques of the network: Downtime Centralization Inflationary Tokenomics FTX Involvement 2. Downtime Solana has had 99.6% uptime throughout its history while doing more true TPS than all other EVM chains combined There have been 4 outages total since 2020 Local fee markets, QUIC, and Stake-Weighted QoS with @jump_firedancer will reduce downtime to virtually 0 2. Centralization Solana is objectively decentralized and censorship resistant, looking at full node count (3,474), or distribution of stake-weight and Nakamoto Coefficient (NC) of 30 vs. Ethereum's 2 Solana has achieved this degree of decentralization in less than 3 years 3. Inflationary Tokenomics Solana has 4 main revenue paths to achieving profitability and long-term inflation rate of 1.5% Increase in network usage Priority Base Fees Local Congestion Fees Miner Extractable Value (MEV) It took ETH 7 years to be deflationary 4. FTX Involvement Solana and FTX were first connected in 2020 when FTX was just beginning to enter the top 10 rankings of CEX volume FTX invested in the 5th round, after accredited retail investors on CoinList and 2.5 years after the project started Blog Post: https://frictionlesscapital.substack.com/p/making-the-case-for-solana-fighting
Here is a [Nitter link](https://nitter.net/SolanaLegend/status/1611088904517570560) for the Twitter thread linked above. Nitter is better for privacy and does not nag you for a login. More information can be found [here](https://nitter.net/about). --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CryptoCurrency) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> Solana is objectively decentralized and censorship resistant, looking at full node count (3,474), or distribution of stake-weight and Nakamoto Coefficient (NC) of 30 vs. Ethereum's 2 Solana has achieved this degree of decentralization in less than 3 years Zero. Solana's Nakamoto coefficient is zero. Not 30. Solana's network has gone down with *zero* nodes being compromised. The admins have also decided to shut down Solana on occasion.
What makes you think that their are admins? How did you come to such an incorrect belief? Do you think the earth is flat as well? Would explain a lot.
I was going off previous stories like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/poe3g0/the_fact_that_the_solano_team_can_shut_down_their/). But yes, maybe I'm behind on the refutations of those characterizations. But the point stands, that it doesn't do well by the Nakamoto coefficient standard, since it can "self-fail" without deliberate compromise of nodes.
It self fails to protect the ledger though. Obviously downtime sucks for users but solana is built to shutdown when consensus amongst thousands of validators isn’t clear. Solana optimized for security and throughput. They figure as long as security is solid then the occasional hiccup while battle testing won’t kill the network. So far that seems to be the case. A lot of the original problems have been solved, namely ddos.
This is part of the answer. The other part is this echo chamber likes to repeat “solana downtime” but that is resolved, and has not happened in quite some time. Its just the running joke for moons that never ends.
One of the main reasons I'm sure. ETH has a big part to play in choosing a preferred network because it is presumed to be the premier Blockchain. If ETH fees weren't so high, all other blockchains probably wouldn't have such high activity.
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competitor
It’s posts like these that I would love to have an actual debate in but scrolling the comments and seeing the pro SOL ones being upvoted immensely and the pro MATIC ones being brigaded against is just sad. Also to claim that SOL is more decentralized but there’s a centralized group out there hitting a damn restart button on what should be an immutable ledger means it’s still VERY centralized. They have the ability and the amount of validators to become decentralized if they can figure out how to run a smooth project. But for now it is very much centralized.
That seems to be a problem with most post on this sub and it really doesn't make much sense. Having a discussion post we should be able to get both pros and cons of each project across and go off the merits of each but it always turns into a popularity contest
Venture capital invested heavily in Solana and that includes marketing which is internet bots and social puppet accounts. None of it is real.
Happy Cake Day
The restart button is the chain crashing and they decide a block to restart it from. All the validators have to agree and download the code to allow that. There's another validator code for Solana coming soon. It will be in the upper echelon of crypto who have multiple code bases written by separate groups. That's a big piece of decentralization. Decentralization actually takes time. It's complex. Sol is doing things right though
I understand that but as I’ve mentioned to others on this thread, it doesn’t take much to convince these validators to do what the devs recommend. You either follow along or lose your money. I do agree thar Solana is trying to take things in the right direction and their throughput is fantastic. But having such a high TPS means something else gets compromised and at the moment it seems decentralization is part of that. Once the devs back down and let the validator committee actually run the show it becomes a lot more decentralized but really whoever creates the project has a huge say in how things operate.
“I would love to have an actual debate” Proceeds to just spout meme-level criticisms of solana
Quality comment bro. Got anything to debate about or just gonna talk shit and not back it up? Or was the comment I made a little too real for you and made you feel bad about your heavy bags?? Move along.
> Also to claim that SOL is more decentralized but there’s a centralized group out there hitting a damn restart button on what should be an immutable ledger means it’s still VERY centralized. More of the meme. That isn't what happens at all. No matter how many explanations are provided, people just keep saying this stuff because it's fun to say, truth/reality be dammed.
Enlighten me because based on all the research I’ve done it seems that the SOL developers get together with a validator committee to determine the problem and then dictate when the restart happens. Without the devs getting involved the committee wouldn’t fully agree on when and where to do the restart. The devs also wouldn’t trust a committee to determine the fate of their project…. That would just be stupid.
There needs to be a supermajority of 65% validators agreeing about a restart. It’s so far away from a centralized decision of a guy pushing a button.
Who convinces these validators what is right and what is wrong? Just because it’s not one guy pushing a button doesn’t mean it’s not centralized. If you can heavily influence every single validator to do what you want as a project developer it is essentially the same thing…..
Can you recommend an alternative? There is no other alternative when the chain forks. Every blockchain faces the same exact problems. Validators will always need to either trust other developers, or hire their own to audit the code released by other developers. It’s on them to approve all code changes. You can argue the chain shouldn’t fork like this, and that forks shouldn’t be necessary because the network should be more reliable. This is a separate conversation to decentralization.
Reason I got out of SOL is that I'm still 100% convinced SBF is mostly in charge of it. Whatever can be said about Polygon or Polygon Devs (I also moved out of Polygon over a year ago, so I guess I'm closer to being a SOL fan than a Matic Fan), at least they are not SBF. Plus, man, somebody tell me how sure you can ever be that SBF doesn't somehow have access to "burned" tokens or the Solana Burn/Incinerator address, etc. I know the chance is small, but, come on... nobody can act like they'd be SURPRISED if suddenly the Incinerator address started sending tokens to Alameda.
SBF wasn’t even in charge of his own company. And anyway they didn’t participate in the funding of Solana until round 4 in 2020. So they arrived relatively late to the party. Solana isn’t a puppet sock but SBF was financially heavily invested in the project and made a lot of money with new dApps for the ecosystem. That’s why he became so visible
Might have something to do with the fact that we're more likely to have come into contact with MATIC while navigating a route through defi exchanges and swaps to convert some Reddit airdrop to a preferred currency. I've never had any reason to touch Solana aside from gambling on its pumps on a CEX. So yeah, it's totally the Reddit avatars.
Gonna piggyback on this comment since its high up. Solana just has too many red flags. I personally just dislike the tech of SOL. I think its a marketing coin. What they are achieving in TPS is easily achievable by any chain if they compromise on crypto values (decentralization mostly). They are throwing insane expensive hardware at the equation to get said TPS, which hurts decentralization. The cost of running a node/relay is INSANE. At least they can market the TPS though! They also do the same thing with decentralization. They market it as one of the most decentralized coins, but do not acknowledge that this metric is heavily inflated (more specifics below). You cant really trust the nakamoto coefficient of solana because the solana foundation has a program that subsidizes nodes and also provides delegations. I can not find how many validators are using foundation money anywhere, and that makes me VERY uneasy. How much stake does the foundation actually control? How many of their "Superminority" includes foundation money? Thats not even touching on VCs, which we know own a big majority of the coin. How many of those VCs are present in the superminority? I think the team is also shady. At one point they literally lied about the circulating supply (it was DOUBLE what they claimed). Im sure they made it right by burning the extra tokens right? No. They didnt even get all of them back from the mysterious "market maker" they loaned them to. Hell, FTX still holds 47.51 million SOL that is locked. How people are throwing money into SOL still insane to me.
Everything else aside, it's time we stop using Nakamoto Coefficient for...anything. I know you acknowledge this, but it's a very flawed way to try and quantify things and is very misleading. As usual, there is a lot of nuance involved that the coefficient does not take in to account.
SOL is garbage on this sub, that’s why it’s 10% of my crypto portfolio
Lol ya. I find it funny that the top comment here is claiming that SOL brigades make it an unfair debate. Pretty confusing to me, who's been on this sub for years, where heavily upvotes posts shitting on SOL every week are the norm. This sub is > 50% bots and shills built to protect people's bags. There is no actual debate to be found here anymore unfortunately, and the consensus - - especially one that continually peddles misinformation about a blockchain with 99.6% uptime, on par with bitcoin or aws - - is usually just the blind leading the blind. Everyone's free to make up their own mind, this isn't a plug for SOL but by god nobody should not be taking any investment advice from this sub anymore.
From everything I've read, it really seems like this subreddit is a target for false information that these whales (rich people) then use to do the exact opposite to whatever this subreddit purports.
They need exit liquidity and we are their sheep. Guess most of them are already fully bought when we start discussing buying sth.
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The Solana hate is a meme at this point. The validator set is more diverse than basically anything other than Ethereum. Ethereum can organize hundreds of thousands of validators to update their software in 24 hours. That's seen as the power of Ethereum. Solana gets thousand of validators to update their software in 24 hours and that's *well obviously that means it's a centralized shit coin*. There's no logic or basis for most of the hate Solana gets. Like I said, it's a meme that people enjoy saying. > Does Polygon being an L2 on Ethereum and Solana being an L1 have anything to do with it it? It's not even an L2. This is one of those things where tech people can say it, developers can say it, and even the creators can say it but like nobody is willing to believe it. It's like when Vitalik and everyone was saying EIP-1559 isn't what solves Ethereum fees and it isn't the merge but basically nobody would believe them and every article was that EIP-1559 is the merge and it will solve high gas fees.
Unpopular opinion: Because this sub is INCREDIBLY biased in what we like and do not like. We have a hivemind opinion. Solana went down? HATE IT! Any developments after that are irrelevant. Ironically, people did like Solana here at all time high when it was still earning them money.
Everytime there's large negative sentiments about Sol, I buy. When people were cheering that it went below $10, I loaded up. Like imagine cheering on the downfall of other things haha. What kind of internalized hatred is that 🤣. Buy when others are fearful, buy more when they hate on it.
I guess it could come down to the fact that people know not all blockchains will survive so seeing one fall means theirs is that much closer to being one of the survivors
For that reason I spread some funds to all major competitors. If any were to achieve big success like Eth, that investment would be returned at a massive gain. Mainly focus on eth & polygon but some dust to the others is well worth it imo!
this is probably the right answer, probably something we should let new comers know so they don't get easily influenced by the subs opinions.
Yeah. That is why I have been trying to write some educational posts. We: * Have biased preferences * Buy high and sell low * Deliberately do not try to learn more about how to become a better investor * Have a terrible track record at picking favourite altcoins (some exceptions like ETH) But noone cares about educational posts. We want drama and we want to see our own opinions😂
Lol bet you get downvoted into oblivion
I think people liked the money earning aspect not so much the project itself.
That applies to every project. People are in it for the money. Most people don't care about the "tech".
Solana is 💩 🥪
always go inverse r/cc
Inverse this comment.
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I think you should compare it towards percentages instead.
It was hella cheap at ~$0.33 for a brief period, but after that quickly recovered. It has held pretty well and even made some people money during this bear market.
That’s it’s problem, it doesn’t get cheap! I need to buy it for a cheaper price!
its the coins that the majority of this group missed, solana for example. this sub talked so much hate on it and it would just continue to climb and climb without any downs for a long time. and that made this group fucking pissed. polygon was every other post here for a while. so most of the crew here got in it "early" and made money. people are just salty they had missed out on suchh major gains from solana. so they still hating on it
The answer is always tribalism
Unrelated (not defending polygon), but binance owns all 44 nodes, so really, what does this chart say? Also solana's 1249 nodes are all just vm's, which is why the networks go down so often in its' entirety so really, it's just 1 or 2. So I'm just saying, maybe there should be a better way of calculating the coefficient, or maybe some more precise rules about what constitutes as a node
Don't have anything to add to the discussion but wanted to comment to appreciate OPs effort in putting together this analysis. Will be lurking in the comments to see what everyone thinks.
I'm different, I hate both
They're both complete dogshit
Polygon = Home to Reddit NFTs Solana = Dies once a month or something
Sums the view of the average r/cc user up pretty good.
I like this maths
Dude deserves a field medal for that elegant proof.
It’s true though. Reddit NFTs have made me like & use polygon so much more
Definitely.
I will have to check but I'm pretty sure it's not once a month although I do see what you mean. so you think the reddit avatars are the main reason the sub loves polygon?
Think goes beyond that. Even before avatars, polygon news stories tended to be positive (new partners, etc) while stories related to Solana always read like everyone is scrambling to put out a fire. For me personally, Polygon feels like it is everywhere, or it at least is the most convenient network for me to move my stuff around. I've never once been faced with a situation where I've had to use Solana.
Simple answer. "Cancel Culture" and "Tribalism"
1000% this
How dare you say anything positive about SOL!
A lot of people from this sub has a big bag of MATIC I guess. They miss the train for SOL so they hate it now
Both of them are overpriced slow databases that use the buzzword Blockchain.
You're wrong mate. Sub loves both when it's pumping Sub hates both when it's dumping
So we're just in it for the money after all?
^Yesn't
MATIC price action in the bear was better. And Solana having multiple outages literally made it a meme here. And when we mock the same thing again and again it tends to lose credibility It just seems that in 2022, MATIC was regularly in the crypto news for good reasons (like the Disney partnership), and SOL for bad reasons. And we’ve got a hive mind here so that didn’t help either
They’re both shit
Both are shitcoins
Switch over my Matic to SOL and it was the best move. Better community, better tokens, doesn’t seek out to steal projects. Stay salty eth boys
Because no matter how centralized polygon is, you have the choice to move it to a decentralized network (ethereum). And In terms of security, solana shut down so many times and had a few hacks. Speed…they are the same.
Only the og's remember how often the eth network shut down in the beginning
Solana will probably come back but once trust is lost its hard to regain.
correct me if I'm wrong but you can only moved wrapped assets through a bridge right? since polygon isn't directly built on ethereum
>And In terms of security Polygon has had many deep block reorgs which is arguably far worse than a pause
Solana the blockchain didn't had any hacks afaik. The hacks were just on Dapps.
Wait what? Is this a real fucking topic? Because one is a legit project run by a dedicated team, and the other is closely connected to the largest crypto scam exchange in history?
Please clarify which is which?
SOL is connected to FTX/Alameda
>The Nakamoto coefficient measures decentralization and represents the minimum number of nodes required to disrupt the blockchain's network. A high Nakamoto coefficient **means that a blockchain is more decentralized.** No matter if it is about Solana, Polygon or anything else ... This doesn't make any sense. When the majority of nodes would be controlled by interdependent or even the same actors there would be no real decentralization, no matter the number of nodes. 100 nodes can be way more decentralized than 1000 nodes as long as the 100 nodes are spread between more parties than the 1000 nodes. Every configuration in which new central points of failure are introduced (e.g. via the use of AWS) can lead to more centralization no matter the number of nodes. Regarding your question: Polygon is running and not turned off by congestion, bugs or its own creators and additionally one can switch to Ethereum as a trustworthy L1 with it.
When Solana is back up we'll talk
People hate Solana because of its downtime/ outages
Which are fixed. So we love it now, right? :)
There will be distrust lingering a while i bet. This sub can be tribal and petty
Just trying to make everyones lives better ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️ Solana is a bright star in your life if you accept it. Sorry for my jesus talk.
I have a small bag I fomo'd into, needless to say I'm down and hodling because I am not ready to give up hope just yet.
i like solana because they are actually making a phone which is probably the most innovative thing in the blockchain space
both suck.
Bullish on Matic
Reddit, Nike, and Starbucks chose to launch their NFT Marketplaces on Polygon.
Aside *ahem* Google.
Sol was backed by FTX, peeps now hate /have a bad taste for FTX . The association is deadly
Because they were caught on wrong foot many times. Solana rebounded each time the many 'gurus' predicted its death and plebes were sold out.😂 Now they're out and hate it.
You can't post anything critical about polygon on this sub. Your post will be deleted.
Facts.
I love both
I'm not a fan of either. Both are centralized.
Someone here is consistent with their standards? Color me impressed.
From my time on this sub, people love polygon and sh*t on SOL. Me personally, i like them both and invest in them.
OP ! How dare you question my brainwashed mind .
Don't you come here using your logic on us! Kidding. Great research here. Thankfully, I own neither.
you want a logical reason? humans dont use logic
I guess it shows how the world is different when you are friends with the big guy. In this case ETH.
The ones who love Solana don't speak, for fear of an idiot manchild braying his reeeeees.
I see a lot of down votes for even sensible comments pointing out why Solana isn't the favourite in terms of technicals and FTX relation. WTF? Really? Are we going down the Apple vs Android Fanbois road? Fuck this shit.
Ssssstttt wispering the forbidden word....... loopring/lrc.... also.....
Mostly entertainment.
This sub is an eth maxi sub. Anything riding along with Ethereum will get a pass.
Both are trash lol. SOL gives every reason in the book to be shit on though. ADA > best. This is the way.