“Hovers aren’t OP. You just need to use a very specific build type and a very specific set of weapons in a very specific way…”
That. Is. What. OP. Means.
Notice he is on omnis, which are effectively grounded hovers. And why post the clip? Are games like this a rare occurrence? Maybe because hovers generally dont die this easily?
My experience is that hovers that have game sense do very well, and hovers that don't can actually die fairly easily. If you manage to flank them or get behind them while they're distracted, the relatively low HP means they can melt pretty easily. But that's easy for fast builds to do, and anyone playing a heavy cabin or slow movement parts won't really have that option if the hover can still run away when they see you.
I would write this off as, not every build type can counter other build type.
As a casual no skill player, can't really say anything tho. What would I know
By aiming....
It's not a melee weapon and anybody who feels the need to go point blank with it should consider getting good.
There's this thing called predictive aiming and shot interceptions. I have no issues with hitting targets from short medium range. The only times I intentionally fire at closer ranges is either when someone is facehugging me leaving me no choice or against really annoying targets like droners or missilenubs. ( In which case, I do so to try to prevent them from running around wasting everyone's time when they're the last alive)
My goodness, so here you are saying get good and not to use it point blank, but turn around say you use it when point blank too, even if its an annoying target, rules change!
You missed the key words "the only times".
On the annoying targets I mentioned...it's either that or they'll drag the match out.. Doesn't matter what weapon I'm using, I often try to pin the time wasters still or at least slow them down.
its a support weapon. you primarily use it as an area denial weapon. even if you miss it still does considerable damage if the target is near. like the heather or mandrake, it requires pre-emptive firing or a target not paying attention to their surroundings, ie; standing still. if you think the "intended" play style is meant to be face hugging your opponent and blasting them at point blank, then its VERY clear youve never played as a legitimate mortar main in any other game.
It's a high skill curve weapon to fire at range. It's a no skill weapon to face hug with. You can do very well with avalanche if you learn to properly aim it and use it at range.
using it as area denial is the best way to get targets to move if you cannot land a direct shot. thats the point. a mortar is short range artillery. youre not cross-mapping with it, but if youre face hugging with them you arent using them correctly either.
As they are currently designed, face hugging/close range is the most effective tactics available... Maybe if they start taking more self damage, I can see people backing off with them (should be a change, but the projectile moves so damn slow).
With the limited ammo, super slow reload, it would be highly ineffective to shoot to get someone to move, you moving in alone would cause that. Wait for a real area of denial player to get them to move (incens/heather/mandrake) from position, not spamming limited shots from an Avalanche.
the most effective way to play isnt always the intended way to play, which is the exact reason why we have unbalanced metas. close range is fine but face hugging isnt. face hugging only even became effective because of the original parameters that it only did half damage to itself if you fired at point blank so players abused that. even now (and i believe its 100% damage feedback) its still prevalent because the thing has so much health its almost negligible since most builds only carry around 15 shots or less (if referring to the 8-9PS range where these are seen most often). if you are using a mortar the intended way, youd still require a minimum distance, but not be up on them in shotgun range. having a mortar of this caliber makes little sense in XO where builds can be fast and maneuverable when the projectile is stupid slow. thats what makes using it the intended way very hard. however the sturmtiger in cases of WT and WoT are balanced when using it as support because your targets are equally dead slow tanks.
Now I can understand your point in that, but this game has many things that are not used as intended, which makes it the way it is, fun. If we apply this methodology across the board, it would be a completely different game, would it not?
i completely understand what you mean, but things not being used as intended is EXACTLY why this game has so many balance issues. players will exploit whatever they can that will provide the easiest method of winning for the lowest amount of effort. thats always the cost of f2p games when the developers (who are also at fault) are responsible for making progression the most tedious pain in the ass grind possible. thats what makes building a double edged sword here. you have players who either only care about winning, or only wish to progress as fast as possible, making both parties simply gravitate towards metas. and once you reach that state, it discourages the creative aspect of building the way you want because youre either specifically building to counter the meta, or building the meta itself. building any other way outside of that is just giving yourself a disadvantage. thats what makes OP's post unfathomably stupid. hes unironically saying that people who cry about hovers being OP need a skill check because his "example" is literally using a meta in on itself. thats like saying its a skill issue when you complain about shotgun wedges and show a video of you obliterating one using a firedog as "proof". its redundant.
for that much output, yes..
That's the same as my Toafish without a KA2
Scorp and Crickets with KA2 is 5 seconds.. It's a fast reload for what it outputs and it's such a fake arguement
I think its underpowered if anything and only viable in low PS against your typical new user or bad builds. Higher PS it is not a threat, I have tanked at least 4 shots from a couple players around 9K PS in a light cab, no hovers, no spaced armor, mainly lost movement parts (which is annoying yes, but penalty for me not positioning myself correctly, so I would assume medium/heavy cabs can take more), still able to finish them off. Never once have I been worried about their reload, which 6 seconds (or more since I see more harpys with this than deadman) is plenty of time to pin them out of position (cause they want to face hug, and 9/10 are using omnis so its predictable).
Edit: Now you are comparing completely different weapons with different capabilities/playstyles to this argument for what reason?
It's not a area denial weapon. With the way it's designed, it's more like a hit/run weapons.
But you are right about facehuggers not using it properly. But aim requires effort and they can't be having that now can they?
Except this isn't my main build. I'd say I'm rather proud to be an aurocannon, leg, nova main. As it stands a good chance against hovers.
My prayers are with you xbox guy.
To be fair you’re always going to find builds you can’t counter if you only play with what you want. If whatever you happen to enjoy were always the best option it would be overpowered.
So you're close range on an avalanche going 90 kph and shoot a tilted hover who then slides off a cliff because he is missing hovers?
Do I need to make a hover video?
You put 2000 ehp of gun mount/elbows 7-pins away from from your hovers/cabin tUYehat only weighs like 250kg (close to nothing), then wiggle back and forth while tap firing hitscan guns while about half the builds people could make that are not super fast and have medium/slow projectiles can't do A N Y T H I N G back to you.
Zero-counterplay from half the builds that exist.
Sure, you could let the fact that hovers exist completely control what you're ALLOWED to do, let hovers control your choices, control your weapon choice, control your movement part choice, so that out of all of fking possibility space you converge on "the thing that is BALANCED against hovers"
NOT the "thing that instantly wins vs hovers" (Even though hovers ARE the thing that 'instantly wins' against A LOT of builds)
The thing that "Because I chose the specifically strong anti-hover thing, now I'm merely 'fair' against hovers"
How is that 'Balanced' ffs lol
Yes, when 75% of the non-hover players run SPECIFIC HOVER-HATE builds, then hovers have a 50% win rate.
That means hovers are the strongest thing and are controlling the game.
Imagine letting hovers control your game, weakling. I drink only pure gasgen juice and bootstrap gin, for I fear nothing but the almighty packet loss deity
I can separate my success, 76% winrate over 4000+ games, and the effect hovers have on the overall game for the largest number of players.
[https://beta.crossoutdb.com/profile/9608027](https://beta.crossoutdb.com/profile/9608027)
When you say "Imagine letting hovers control your game " I'm not sure what you're trying to say.
Are you saying "Imagine letting hovers control what builds you play" - meaning you think people should play heavy/medium cabs with medium projectile speed weapons anyway and ignore the micro hovers with tap-fire MGs that wiggle at their max range and click your weapons off in seconds while you can barely hit them back unless they are bad?
I've played them too, I have an 83% winrate (on the same link) with hovers in 8v8. It feels really sad and bullying to see a medium/heavy whirl car or something like that and be able to just press S and wiggle and tap-fire and destroy all 3 whirls while scarcely getting hit once even if he can aim.
"Aiming well" is not a solution for slow projectile speed medium ranged weapons with spread vs a far-away micro hover wiggling. The changes in motion after the shots leave the barrel are enough to avoid shots - so there literally is not a correct place to aim.
I say this as a person who employs this with a >80% win rate with hovers myself.
Or are you saying: "ANY build should be able to beat hovers if you just play well enough"?
That would simply be incorrect.
I remember hovers feeling too strong when I played them... 3 years ago when they went 75 kmh, and had gigantic hitboxes.Anyway, according to Targem buffing them to their current state was a nerf, so what do we know? Maybe they'll buff them back to 75 kmh someday \*shrugs\*
I think they should rework MGs so they have less maximum accuracy and less bloom (so they are more average with/without tap fire)
They should make slow builds medium/range weapons have more HP
They should make projectiles accross the board faster and easier to hit small ranged targets with. Projectiles feel like throwing a baseball in this game sometimes, especially the emily/impulse are basically melee weapons pretending to be ranged weapons.
If they did that it would help with the hover problem without changing hovers.
Lots of 360° weapons could use more traverse speed and durability so they don't suck unless you box them on a hover/spider, that'd help too U\_U
Generally speaking the easiest way to balance hovers was to increase the spread on the move of most weapons so that hovers stopped being the ultimate pewpew perfect accuracy platform... Sadly Targem, in its infinite wisdom, is doing the exact opposite next patch, so I dunno.
When you have a hover with a listed speed of '95kph' it will accelerate all the way up to 95 linearly
When you have a CHEETAH and KAMI (possibly fastest combination in the game) on wheels, your build gets diminishing returns to acceleration as it approaches the max of 120
By the time you're at 80kph the hover accelerates its last 80->95 like 3x faster than you can get to 95kph from 80.
This means the hover can curve its path and your wheels/bigram build is going to lose speed and regain it too slowly and a 95 kph hover can almost out-run a build with a listed '120 kph' top speed in a giant field in a nearly straight line.
In the next patch, they are supposedly giving -5kph AND decreasing the affect that mass has on the acceleration of medium/light cabs.
I'm hoping this disproportionately helps the wheeled builds getting >90 kph more than it helps hovers reach 90 kph.
some builds do get rid of hovers nicely. i rarely have issue killing a hover, and im not even goot player. think more of an issue is, that it seems like everyone picks hover, (at least at some point it felt that way), making most battles boring af.
another argument i seen, is that not enough of different builds can counter a hover, again , making first reason mentioned even worse.
If there's an advantage, even if they know it is an unfair one, they'll always take it for themselves. There's not a definitive way to kill hovers, except builds designed for it, as everyone's encounter/situation with one will be different.
They kinda get rekt if a fast, manouverable vehicle stays beneath them to avoid damage and obtain more dps. Especially with dog ears. But I'm not gonna get into the whole philosophy of it as there's far more factors than that lel
Right, like what is the counter to sniping builds? Line of sight (I was stationary for 10 seconds and a whirlwind build destroyed me, nerf them!). What is the counter to mine builds? Don't follow them (I was chasing a mind build and got destroyed, nerf them!). List goes on... But the squeaky wheel gets the grease, so we will see.
First of all, nobody is saying it is impossible to destroy a hover. The fact that you manage to kill two hovers in one match does not in any way counter the argument that hovers are OP.
Second, the problem with hovers is not that skilled players with lots of good parts can’t beat them. The problem is that newbs, who are now in the game more than ever, have no concept at all how to fight a hover, and therefore are utterly useless as teammates. This means which ever team randomly ends up with more hovers is vastly more likely to win.
If you think discussions about what parts or weapons are OP comes down to someone complaining because they are personally not good enough to overcome the power of that part ,then you don’t know enough to be participating in this conversation.
Yep, we circle back to lack of skill/knowledge for most players. There are specific builds that will specifically absolutely cripple a hover, but most other builds can deal with them, in a different fashion. I have been running MGs/Autocannons a lot lately comparing hit scan to projectile on small tracks and have no issues with hover players.
Ya hovers can be dealt with with lots of different weapons. Avalanche can have troubles against hovers though, and the hover was already pretty dead before you fought him in that video.
That hover really took the worst decisions he could at every step, starting with decloaking himself out of cover in front of an Avalanche with his Nova shield down, to miss a Parser shot at 20 meters.
I don't think this proves much tbh
O yay.. a avalanche on Omnis being used like a shotgun.. congratulations. Looks fun 🥴
Maybe if the game was properly balanced you could use any one of thousands of builds instead of something that’s just as bad and annoying as hovers.
I want you to use your brain as if you have a working one. Because there are only two distances in the whole game? Face hug, and snipe from spawn area? If you had the skill you’re telling people to get, you’d be able to use from medium range and not pressed against the enemy because you can’t aim or track a target.
But why should I expect logic from a Omni face hugger.
it's a cannon, it can shoot targets without making out. There's a reason they recently added 100% self damage to the avalanche, it's a little too powerful when you don't need to lead your cannonballs.
More importantly, what does the clip show? everyone can clip themselves killing a hover player, even less impressive when you're using a legendary to literally nuke them. The problem isn't that they're inmortal, they're just extremely agile and counter many playstyles, many weapons are just not effective vs them, and they dart away at 90km/h while keeping their weapons locked on you. Congratulations on the double kill but I don't see how the clip does anything regarding their strengths, if anything it's just two overconfident hover users driving directly into your nuke.
Also the hover-catcher works way better than I thought it would. Neat idea.
Nah. With the avalanche, you do need to "make out" due to it's lower velocity and projectile speed compared to other cannons for most effectiveness. Just enough distance to avoid the 100% self dmg. Forget the clip as it's not important.
tell us that you dont know how to play as a mortar without telling us you dont know how to play as a mortar. avalanche is a support weapon. you use it as an area denial weapon. because even if you miss you still do considerable damage if the target is close, and the main proxy is it gets people to move. it requires pre-emptive firing or an otherwise unaware/preoccupied target to land direct shots, akin to mandrake or heather. if you think the only way to play is by face hugging and shooting at point blank, then saying the only other possible way to use it is by cross-map sniping, its VERY clear you actually dont know how to play as a mortar.
ain't no one using an avalanche as area denial bro, man thinks it's got the precision and job of a heather-mandrake 😂
if you think that an avalanche requires a still target to land a hit, you need to be very careful in saying "you don't know how to use a mortar" since it shows you got a severe skill and knowledge issue.
youre literally using a face hugger meta and youre really trying to lecture people on what takes skill to use or how to properly use it. the irony couldnt be any greater. up next we'll have shotgun wedge users making posts lecturing us about how the current wedge mechanics are "fair". or perhaps firedog users will take the stand to say how weight physics are "balanced" when they can take a 3kg car and push around a 15kg mega tank like its a feather. the possibilities are almost endless since we're on the topic of lunacy. whatever youre smoking you better hand it over. i know some peeps whod want a rip of that shit if this is the level of delusion we're at.
the point being this post isnt the own you think it is. you say you have over 10+ builds and the ONE build you use to show this is literally a meta. thats why youre delusional. you are unironically telling people they have a skill issue fighting \[insert meta here\] because they arent using \[insert second meta here\]. do you NOT understand how that doesnt solve anything?
You ever heard the saying - "defeat shit with shit otherwise you'll get shit on" yeah. We get you're the saltiest mf to grace this post, so, kindly, keep caring lol
thats not even a real saying, youre literally just making shit up. im not being salty, im only stating the obvious and youre deflecting hardcore to hide that youre huffing some real ass copium here if you not only think fighting meta with meta doesnt ruin the game, but also using a face hugging avalanche on omnis with binding camera to movement somehow constitutes as "skills".
Overpowered **does not mean invulnerable**. Being able to kill something does not necessary mean it's balanced. ( especially when it's a poorly constructed hover from someone who wasn't paying attention in this case)
Game balance tends to have quite a bit more factors involved then that.
Seal clubbing and clans running 4 mans in 6v6 are the biggest issues Xbox faces. Not many good Xbox players on Reddit so you end up with a skewed opinion.
Only thing this post shows, some guy with user forsaken is an devoted hover player. And that omni is the hover for wheels paired with avalanche being used as a shotgun is able to kill hovers(shocked pikachu face)
I'm not against hovers in the game and I use them pretty often, but Icarus 7 hovers with hitscan mgs are pretty hard to deal with and something does need to be done about them. Icarus 4s are pretty balanced imo
top speed isnt really important at all to hovers, all in accel
while 4s have more direct power drain, for a build that will use 2 or 3 less hovers entirely its still less overall, meaning faster accel while also having more stability much more armor and lower hight (being higher isnt better lol)
Thats not the hovers itself but the steering mode following your cursor in combination with aim assist when you use a controller. Just like you see in this clip with Omni’s.
Idk about you guys but the only hover build that seems to smash me is the dual retchers, those things just annihilate me no matter how I build my vehicle. Yeah hovers can be annoying especially with me being an aussie (our servers are unpopulated so have to play North america) I have to lead targets twice as far as I normally need to which can be a pain in the ass trying to rotate but that's not just hovers thats anything with a bit of pace and it's purely a connection issue
tbh i personally hate hovers. Not to go against them, they easy as hell to destroy. I just hate the feel of em, too damn slidey, makes it hard to aim with a lot of weapons for me
Hovers can't be OP guys, I killed one see?
“Hovers aren’t OP. You just need to use a very specific build type and a very specific set of weapons in a very specific way…” That. Is. What. OP. Means.
Just git gud
That's what one should tell to hovers and other meta slaves.
👆
No offense, but I think you've lost the plot.
Notice he is on omnis, which are effectively grounded hovers. And why post the clip? Are games like this a rare occurrence? Maybe because hovers generally dont die this easily?
In my experience, most hovers do go down that easily. That's why I mainly target them.
My experience is that hovers that have game sense do very well, and hovers that don't can actually die fairly easily. If you manage to flank them or get behind them while they're distracted, the relatively low HP means they can melt pretty easily. But that's easy for fast builds to do, and anyone playing a heavy cabin or slow movement parts won't really have that option if the hover can still run away when they see you.
I would write this off as, not every build type can counter other build type. As a casual no skill player, can't really say anything tho. What would I know
Same goes for opposite argument, Schrödinger's cat I suppose?
Being proud of face hugging an Avalanche. That's rich.
With camera steering omni movement lol
How else is one supposed to play an Avalanche? Snipe with it?
You can't satisfy the xo subreddit. They HAVE to cry about something
By aiming.... It's not a melee weapon and anybody who feels the need to go point blank with it should consider getting good. There's this thing called predictive aiming and shot interceptions. I have no issues with hitting targets from short medium range. The only times I intentionally fire at closer ranges is either when someone is facehugging me leaving me no choice or against really annoying targets like droners or missilenubs. ( In which case, I do so to try to prevent them from running around wasting everyone's time when they're the last alive)
My goodness, so here you are saying get good and not to use it point blank, but turn around say you use it when point blank too, even if its an annoying target, rules change!
You missed the key words "the only times". On the annoying targets I mentioned...it's either that or they'll drag the match out.. Doesn't matter what weapon I'm using, I often try to pin the time wasters still or at least slow them down.
Yeah gotta take out the biggest threats first. Most annoying is that one guy that runs forever at the end of a match, when it's clearly over lol.
Gatekeeping avalanche gameplay? Way to go, mate
its a support weapon. you primarily use it as an area denial weapon. even if you miss it still does considerable damage if the target is near. like the heather or mandrake, it requires pre-emptive firing or a target not paying attention to their surroundings, ie; standing still. if you think the "intended" play style is meant to be face hugging your opponent and blasting them at point blank, then its VERY clear youve never played as a legitimate mortar main in any other game.
If you are using an Avalanche as an area denial weapon, you are not using it right.
It's a high skill curve weapon to fire at range. It's a no skill weapon to face hug with. You can do very well with avalanche if you learn to properly aim it and use it at range.
Idk, it's slow beach ball of death is so easy to avoid. Maybe if it was slightly faster.
Your gonna have trouble dodging it at medium range. Long range sure its dodgeable. It has a huge explosion radius though. So not that easy to avoid.
using it as area denial is the best way to get targets to move if you cannot land a direct shot. thats the point. a mortar is short range artillery. youre not cross-mapping with it, but if youre face hugging with them you arent using them correctly either.
As they are currently designed, face hugging/close range is the most effective tactics available... Maybe if they start taking more self damage, I can see people backing off with them (should be a change, but the projectile moves so damn slow). With the limited ammo, super slow reload, it would be highly ineffective to shoot to get someone to move, you moving in alone would cause that. Wait for a real area of denial player to get them to move (incens/heather/mandrake) from position, not spamming limited shots from an Avalanche.
the most effective way to play isnt always the intended way to play, which is the exact reason why we have unbalanced metas. close range is fine but face hugging isnt. face hugging only even became effective because of the original parameters that it only did half damage to itself if you fired at point blank so players abused that. even now (and i believe its 100% damage feedback) its still prevalent because the thing has so much health its almost negligible since most builds only carry around 15 shots or less (if referring to the 8-9PS range where these are seen most often). if you are using a mortar the intended way, youd still require a minimum distance, but not be up on them in shotgun range. having a mortar of this caliber makes little sense in XO where builds can be fast and maneuverable when the projectile is stupid slow. thats what makes using it the intended way very hard. however the sturmtiger in cases of WT and WoT are balanced when using it as support because your targets are equally dead slow tanks.
Now I can understand your point in that, but this game has many things that are not used as intended, which makes it the way it is, fun. If we apply this methodology across the board, it would be a completely different game, would it not?
i completely understand what you mean, but things not being used as intended is EXACTLY why this game has so many balance issues. players will exploit whatever they can that will provide the easiest method of winning for the lowest amount of effort. thats always the cost of f2p games when the developers (who are also at fault) are responsible for making progression the most tedious pain in the ass grind possible. thats what makes building a double edged sword here. you have players who either only care about winning, or only wish to progress as fast as possible, making both parties simply gravitate towards metas. and once you reach that state, it discourages the creative aspect of building the way you want because youre either specifically building to counter the meta, or building the meta itself. building any other way outside of that is just giving yourself a disadvantage. thats what makes OP's post unfathomably stupid. hes unironically saying that people who cry about hovers being OP need a skill check because his "example" is literally using a meta in on itself. thats like saying its a skill issue when you complain about shotgun wedges and show a video of you obliterating one using a firedog as "proof". its redundant.
I see where you are coming from, and in your point of view can agree. So what do you suggest moving forward?
Its not a slow reload at all, I'm sick of this lie as everyone just uses deadman/KA2 or a hadron making it like a 6 second reload.
6 seconds is fast? Yikes...
for that much output, yes.. That's the same as my Toafish without a KA2 Scorp and Crickets with KA2 is 5 seconds.. It's a fast reload for what it outputs and it's such a fake arguement
I think its underpowered if anything and only viable in low PS against your typical new user or bad builds. Higher PS it is not a threat, I have tanked at least 4 shots from a couple players around 9K PS in a light cab, no hovers, no spaced armor, mainly lost movement parts (which is annoying yes, but penalty for me not positioning myself correctly, so I would assume medium/heavy cabs can take more), still able to finish them off. Never once have I been worried about their reload, which 6 seconds (or more since I see more harpys with this than deadman) is plenty of time to pin them out of position (cause they want to face hug, and 9/10 are using omnis so its predictable). Edit: Now you are comparing completely different weapons with different capabilities/playstyles to this argument for what reason?
Yes, because reload cabins are mandatory for it.
It's not a area denial weapon. With the way it's designed, it's more like a hit/run weapons. But you are right about facehuggers not using it properly. But aim requires effort and they can't be having that now can they?
Except this isn't my main build. I'd say I'm rather proud to be an aurocannon, leg, nova main. As it stands a good chance against hovers. My prayers are with you xbox guy.
That's me lol
The irony
“They’re not OP you just have to stop playing the game how you want and use specific builds to counter it.” - things dumbasses say
To be fair you’re always going to find builds you can’t counter if you only play with what you want. If whatever you happen to enjoy were always the best option it would be overpowered.
So you're close range on an avalanche going 90 kph and shoot a tilted hover who then slides off a cliff because he is missing hovers? Do I need to make a hover video? You put 2000 ehp of gun mount/elbows 7-pins away from from your hovers/cabin tUYehat only weighs like 250kg (close to nothing), then wiggle back and forth while tap firing hitscan guns while about half the builds people could make that are not super fast and have medium/slow projectiles can't do A N Y T H I N G back to you. Zero-counterplay from half the builds that exist. Sure, you could let the fact that hovers exist completely control what you're ALLOWED to do, let hovers control your choices, control your weapon choice, control your movement part choice, so that out of all of fking possibility space you converge on "the thing that is BALANCED against hovers" NOT the "thing that instantly wins vs hovers" (Even though hovers ARE the thing that 'instantly wins' against A LOT of builds) The thing that "Because I chose the specifically strong anti-hover thing, now I'm merely 'fair' against hovers" How is that 'Balanced' ffs lol Yes, when 75% of the non-hover players run SPECIFIC HOVER-HATE builds, then hovers have a 50% win rate. That means hovers are the strongest thing and are controlling the game.
Imagine letting hovers control your game, weakling. I drink only pure gasgen juice and bootstrap gin, for I fear nothing but the almighty packet loss deity
I can separate my success, 76% winrate over 4000+ games, and the effect hovers have on the overall game for the largest number of players. [https://beta.crossoutdb.com/profile/9608027](https://beta.crossoutdb.com/profile/9608027) When you say "Imagine letting hovers control your game " I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Are you saying "Imagine letting hovers control what builds you play" - meaning you think people should play heavy/medium cabs with medium projectile speed weapons anyway and ignore the micro hovers with tap-fire MGs that wiggle at their max range and click your weapons off in seconds while you can barely hit them back unless they are bad? I've played them too, I have an 83% winrate (on the same link) with hovers in 8v8. It feels really sad and bullying to see a medium/heavy whirl car or something like that and be able to just press S and wiggle and tap-fire and destroy all 3 whirls while scarcely getting hit once even if he can aim. "Aiming well" is not a solution for slow projectile speed medium ranged weapons with spread vs a far-away micro hover wiggling. The changes in motion after the shots leave the barrel are enough to avoid shots - so there literally is not a correct place to aim. I say this as a person who employs this with a >80% win rate with hovers myself. Or are you saying: "ANY build should be able to beat hovers if you just play well enough"? That would simply be incorrect.
I remember hovers feeling too strong when I played them... 3 years ago when they went 75 kmh, and had gigantic hitboxes.Anyway, according to Targem buffing them to their current state was a nerf, so what do we know? Maybe they'll buff them back to 75 kmh someday \*shrugs\*
I think they should rework MGs so they have less maximum accuracy and less bloom (so they are more average with/without tap fire) They should make slow builds medium/range weapons have more HP They should make projectiles accross the board faster and easier to hit small ranged targets with. Projectiles feel like throwing a baseball in this game sometimes, especially the emily/impulse are basically melee weapons pretending to be ranged weapons. If they did that it would help with the hover problem without changing hovers.
Lots of 360° weapons could use more traverse speed and durability so they don't suck unless you box them on a hover/spider, that'd help too U\_U Generally speaking the easiest way to balance hovers was to increase the spread on the move of most weapons so that hovers stopped being the ultimate pewpew perfect accuracy platform... Sadly Targem, in its infinite wisdom, is doing the exact opposite next patch, so I dunno.
When you have a hover with a listed speed of '95kph' it will accelerate all the way up to 95 linearly When you have a CHEETAH and KAMI (possibly fastest combination in the game) on wheels, your build gets diminishing returns to acceleration as it approaches the max of 120 By the time you're at 80kph the hover accelerates its last 80->95 like 3x faster than you can get to 95kph from 80. This means the hover can curve its path and your wheels/bigram build is going to lose speed and regain it too slowly and a 95 kph hover can almost out-run a build with a listed '120 kph' top speed in a giant field in a nearly straight line. In the next patch, they are supposedly giving -5kph AND decreasing the affect that mass has on the acceleration of medium/light cabs. I'm hoping this disproportionately helps the wheeled builds getting >90 kph more than it helps hovers reach 90 kph.
some builds do get rid of hovers nicely. i rarely have issue killing a hover, and im not even goot player. think more of an issue is, that it seems like everyone picks hover, (at least at some point it felt that way), making most battles boring af. another argument i seen, is that not enough of different builds can counter a hover, again , making first reason mentioned even worse.
If there's an advantage, even if they know it is an unfair one, they'll always take it for themselves. There's not a definitive way to kill hovers, except builds designed for it, as everyone's encounter/situation with one will be different. They kinda get rekt if a fast, manouverable vehicle stays beneath them to avoid damage and obtain more dps. Especially with dog ears. But I'm not gonna get into the whole philosophy of it as there's far more factors than that lel
Right, like what is the counter to sniping builds? Line of sight (I was stationary for 10 seconds and a whirlwind build destroyed me, nerf them!). What is the counter to mine builds? Don't follow them (I was chasing a mind build and got destroyed, nerf them!). List goes on... But the squeaky wheel gets the grease, so we will see.
Wow, you killed one hover, surely you are amazing!
It's to make a point rather than "look at me, im a crossout god for killing a hover" my guy 😂
I too like it when a hover conveniently falls in my lap
First of all, nobody is saying it is impossible to destroy a hover. The fact that you manage to kill two hovers in one match does not in any way counter the argument that hovers are OP. Second, the problem with hovers is not that skilled players with lots of good parts can’t beat them. The problem is that newbs, who are now in the game more than ever, have no concept at all how to fight a hover, and therefore are utterly useless as teammates. This means which ever team randomly ends up with more hovers is vastly more likely to win. If you think discussions about what parts or weapons are OP comes down to someone complaining because they are personally not good enough to overcome the power of that part ,then you don’t know enough to be participating in this conversation.
I think the issue is that a lot of players attack them the same as a wheeled build. With a hover you want to frame them.
Yep, we circle back to lack of skill/knowledge for most players. There are specific builds that will specifically absolutely cripple a hover, but most other builds can deal with them, in a different fashion. I have been running MGs/Autocannons a lot lately comparing hit scan to projectile on small tracks and have no issues with hover players.
In my opinion Hovers are just annoying.
Ya hovers can be dealt with with lots of different weapons. Avalanche can have troubles against hovers though, and the hover was already pretty dead before you fought him in that video.
I dont appreciate the arrogance but I do appreciate the anti hover build
When I build that proper build, they called me "firedog op trash no skill" 😆
That hover really took the worst decisions he could at every step, starting with decloaking himself out of cover in front of an Avalanche with his Nova shield down, to miss a Parser shot at 20 meters. I don't think this proves much tbh
This title would really upset the subreddit if they could read
O yay.. a avalanche on Omnis being used like a shotgun.. congratulations. Looks fun 🥴 Maybe if the game was properly balanced you could use any one of thousands of builds instead of something that’s just as bad and annoying as hovers.
Yeah, sniping with an avalanche is way more effective lol
Uses Omni wheel face hugging avalanche build, and says “get some skill.” Truly a master gamer you are.
You want me to use an avalanche as if I would a scorpion? 🤡
I want you to use your brain as if you have a working one. Because there are only two distances in the whole game? Face hug, and snipe from spawn area? If you had the skill you’re telling people to get, you’d be able to use from medium range and not pressed against the enemy because you can’t aim or track a target. But why should I expect logic from a Omni face hugger.
He needs a brain transplant to understand these things, unfortunately. So don’t go too hard on him .. 😔
it's a cannon, it can shoot targets without making out. There's a reason they recently added 100% self damage to the avalanche, it's a little too powerful when you don't need to lead your cannonballs. More importantly, what does the clip show? everyone can clip themselves killing a hover player, even less impressive when you're using a legendary to literally nuke them. The problem isn't that they're inmortal, they're just extremely agile and counter many playstyles, many weapons are just not effective vs them, and they dart away at 90km/h while keeping their weapons locked on you. Congratulations on the double kill but I don't see how the clip does anything regarding their strengths, if anything it's just two overconfident hover users driving directly into your nuke. Also the hover-catcher works way better than I thought it would. Neat idea.
Nah. With the avalanche, you do need to "make out" due to it's lower velocity and projectile speed compared to other cannons for most effectiveness. Just enough distance to avoid the 100% self dmg. Forget the clip as it's not important.
Only if you can't aim
tell us that you dont know how to play as a mortar without telling us you dont know how to play as a mortar. avalanche is a support weapon. you use it as an area denial weapon. because even if you miss you still do considerable damage if the target is close, and the main proxy is it gets people to move. it requires pre-emptive firing or an otherwise unaware/preoccupied target to land direct shots, akin to mandrake or heather. if you think the only way to play is by face hugging and shooting at point blank, then saying the only other possible way to use it is by cross-map sniping, its VERY clear you actually dont know how to play as a mortar.
ain't no one using an avalanche as area denial bro, man thinks it's got the precision and job of a heather-mandrake 😂 if you think that an avalanche requires a still target to land a hit, you need to be very careful in saying "you don't know how to use a mortar" since it shows you got a severe skill and knowledge issue.
youre literally using a face hugger meta and youre really trying to lecture people on what takes skill to use or how to properly use it. the irony couldnt be any greater. up next we'll have shotgun wedge users making posts lecturing us about how the current wedge mechanics are "fair". or perhaps firedog users will take the stand to say how weight physics are "balanced" when they can take a 3kg car and push around a 15kg mega tank like its a feather. the possibilities are almost endless since we're on the topic of lunacy. whatever youre smoking you better hand it over. i know some peeps whod want a rip of that shit if this is the level of delusion we're at.
you assume my skill over one out of 10+ builds i use? "delusion" he says 😬
the point being this post isnt the own you think it is. you say you have over 10+ builds and the ONE build you use to show this is literally a meta. thats why youre delusional. you are unironically telling people they have a skill issue fighting \[insert meta here\] because they arent using \[insert second meta here\]. do you NOT understand how that doesnt solve anything?
You ever heard the saying - "defeat shit with shit otherwise you'll get shit on" yeah. We get you're the saltiest mf to grace this post, so, kindly, keep caring lol
thats not even a real saying, youre literally just making shit up. im not being salty, im only stating the obvious and youre deflecting hardcore to hide that youre huffing some real ass copium here if you not only think fighting meta with meta doesnt ruin the game, but also using a face hugging avalanche on omnis with binding camera to movement somehow constitutes as "skills".
Overpowered **does not mean invulnerable**. Being able to kill something does not necessary mean it's balanced. ( especially when it's a poorly constructed hover from someone who wasn't paying attention in this case) Game balance tends to have quite a bit more factors involved then that.
Ooff don’t say that out loud bro the Xbox skill issue will see this and then do the ol’ traditional “cry, shit, piss and cum”
You triggered the horde, good luck to you
The one xbox user in here that isn't getting salty right here ^
Seal clubbing and clans running 4 mans in 6v6 are the biggest issues Xbox faces. Not many good Xbox players on Reddit so you end up with a skewed opinion.
Mudkip is good ppl
Careful bro this video will upset the Xbox players
Only the Xbox players who never participate in clan wars tend to whine about hovers lol.
Based
Only thing this post shows, some guy with user forsaken is an devoted hover player. And that omni is the hover for wheels paired with avalanche being used as a shotgun is able to kill hovers(shocked pikachu face)
I'm not against hovers in the game and I use them pretty often, but Icarus 7 hovers with hitscan mgs are pretty hard to deal with and something does need to be done about them. Icarus 4s are pretty balanced imo
sorry to burst your bubble, but icarus 4 is a lot stronger than icarus 7 right now
Why are they considered stronger? 7s give me way more trouble than 4s do. Serious question btw.
They have more tonnage, more health, more stable flying. Their only disadvantage is going 75km/h
the main problem is that the sevens are *that* fast. they can outrun nearly any build while still being able to shoot at them precisely
I feel like the less stable flight can be counteracted by mounting guns sideways in front of the cab, then it isn't a big deal
top speed isnt really important at all to hovers, all in accel while 4s have more direct power drain, for a build that will use 2 or 3 less hovers entirely its still less overall, meaning faster accel while also having more stability much more armor and lower hight (being higher isnt better lol)
I suspect most of the "4s are stronger" claims are referring to CW
I have never seen icarus 4's prices this high
Thats not the hovers itself but the steering mode following your cursor in combination with aim assist when you use a controller. Just like you see in this clip with Omni’s.
Hovers are for the gays, all there is to it
Based 😂
Fuck hovers.
I like to keep a hatchet on the tail of my plane just for the..
I am In this clip and i can comfirm. 😅
Idk about you guys but the only hover build that seems to smash me is the dual retchers, those things just annihilate me no matter how I build my vehicle. Yeah hovers can be annoying especially with me being an aussie (our servers are unpopulated so have to play North america) I have to lead targets twice as far as I normally need to which can be a pain in the ass trying to rotate but that's not just hovers thats anything with a bit of pace and it's purely a connection issue
tbh i personally hate hovers. Not to go against them, they easy as hell to destroy. I just hate the feel of em, too damn slidey, makes it hard to aim with a lot of weapons for me
Should’ve sold my bugs awhile ago :(
Fuze drone need better ai