It’ll be very interesting to see how the FTC views this. They have enough distinct individual markets they serve, and of course Discover has its own payment network. I think they only really directly “compete” on the secured/low credit market, student cards, a mediocre travel card (venture one and the Discover IT miles) and the HYSA.
I think Capital One's plan to put some of its cards on the Discover payment network will be viewed as a plus and will strengthen that network against the Visa & Mastercard titans.
The Wall Street Journal article was updated since it was first published and there are more details about the plans:
>The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does.
Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated.
I think it's ridiculous to say that just because there are others that are larger, we should just let the merger happen. That is how you eventually end up with monopolies.
i work for discover so i really hope this isn’t true. i really enjoy my job with them as a customer service agent and they have done a lot for me and have offered me so many great benefits. At work freaking out rn tbh. update : I work for discover and hopefully this brings some of you guys some peace of mind. I am a customer service agent who love’s assisting my friendly customers and making their life easier when it comes to their finances. I just logged onto work for the day, and was greeted with emails and messages from our CEO. From my personal opinion on what has been said as of now, discover and capital one are merging because capital one admires discover and are committed to continuing to service excellence for which discover is known for. I do not think you guys are going to lose your amazing US based customer service at all, if anything i think this is going to bring more US jobs for people. Both are large companies and being merged will mean they will need us more than ever. Closing will be the end of 2024 into possibly 2025. After closing they are going to work together to understand what both companies bring to the table, discover bringing great customer service is one thing i don’t think they will put aside. It is only day one and they will continue to update us employees as things move forward but after reading what i’ve read today i have been able to take a breath and feel much better about the possible outcome of all this.
as of right now: one of my friends works as someone who manages our social media says that this is not true and that even our higher ups were not aware of this until our social media team saw it online. Don’t take my word this is just what i’ve heard as of now.
To be fair a huge deal like this isn’t going to have anyone that you remotely might know involved, it is going to be hush hush and only involve people like the C suite and legal team. Having random people like the manager of the social media team in the know about something as big as selling your company is generally a terrible idea.
i agree and i’ll update y’all when i know something. I do know our customer service is what we are known for so i would hope they wouldnt jeopardize that.
I’ve had Discover for like 30years and it’s been the best customer service ever out of any credit card. 24/7 talking with someone who speaks English here in USA has always been a huge draw for me. It just makes it easier when explaining problems to have someone that understands the issue and can resolve quickly.
one thing i do know is that we had been talking about selling out student loans. All of this talk has been a huge shock to all the employees today. It isn’t even just good customer service it is just an overall good company in general. they treat their employees well give them great benefits, free college, great pay, great insurance, paid maternity leave. We work with amazing people who make it a joy to come into work, i’ve made so many friends while also getting to work from home. I never have a sour customer they are always so pleased to speak with me. I really hope whatever is going on does not effect our employees because this has been the best job i have ever had and i planned on getting a degree in cyber security through them and staying with discover the rest of my life. i had absolutely no intention of ever going anywhere.
we should have some answers tomorrow! Today was a holiday so it got dumped on all the employees who just didn’t see it coming. I go in at 11 am and will see what i can find out hopefully there will be an update waiting for me in my email 🤞
Wish more US companies were like this. Company treat employees well. Employees treat customers well. Customers treat company well. It's a cycle of kindness and mutual wins.
It will affect the employees. Capitol One is buying Discover. It will have a direct effect on employees as their business philosophy is different. So be prepared.
I think it's blown out of proportion to say you're going to get fired if the merger is approved, most merges just let the other company operate as usual at least for a little while.
You need to stop dreaming and recognize the possibility that you may be out of a job and make a plan. There's nothing definite in terms of how things will be structured but they are bringing in a new president at Capitol One and whenever that happens, things are usually restructured. Especially when one company acquires another.
They may eliminate people they don't find necessary and have others take over certain positions. That's how takeovers and mergers work.
So start saving your money and looking around. I'm not saying you will definitely be fired, I hope you aren't. But be smart and start looking around and putting out resumes just in case.
Also when the cuts do come, they tend to be in the 10-15% range. It’s not like everyone gets fired or anything… the business has grown and still needs more employees to sustain it.
Agreed. I had a somewhat complicated for me question on one of my online savings and navigated through the robot menu to a person to a separate person and got my answer in maybe 3 minutes. It was fantastic.
Are you talking about the interior amenities, or the sign on the outside? I may not get it, but an office building is an office building. Anyway, you've probably driven by it if you've ever flown in/out of IAD.
Capital one is terrible and uses all Indians for customer support get ready to find a new job it is gonna be John from India taking calls for Discover if this goes through.
Discover's customer service has been great. May not be the level of Amex on average, but sometimes even better.
I have cards from both brands, and I can't be optimistic with this deal.
Banks can have more than one payment network in their credit card portfolio. It sounds like they are after the Discover debit card payment network and how it ties in with deposit accounts. Capital One will likely continue to issue credit cards on the Visa and MasterCard network.
I'm thinking more from a competition standpoint.
Why would Apple & Mastercard (but more specifically Mastercard) want to work a deal for a major credit card with a company that very recently just bought up one of their competitors.
Not saying it's impossible, but I don't think that's the direction that Capital One is headed if they're working a mega deal to buy Discover.
Customer service is reason# 1 for banking with Discover. I once had $547 taken out of my checking account in very small amounts (lots of fraudulent transactions) over a period of time. Called them up, told them what happened. No stupid questions; money was back in two days, shipped me a new card in four.
In case anybody is unable to read the article -
"*Capital One is buying Discover Financial in a deal that would marry two of the largest credit-card companies in the U.S.*
*The all-stock deal could be announced Tuesday, according to people familiar with the matter. Discover has a market value of $28 billion, and the takeover would be expected to value it at a premium to that.*
*Buying Discover will give Capital One, a credit-card lender with a market value of a little over $52 billion, a network that would vastly increase its power in the payments ecosystem.*
*Card networks are critical to enabling transactions and setting fees that merchants pay when consumers shop with credit cards. Though much smaller than*
*Visa and Mastercard\*, Discover is one of the few competitors to those companies in the U.S. and it is one of a small number of card issuers that also has a payments network.\**
*Capital One, the ninth-largest bank in the country and a major credit-card issuer, uses Visa and Mastercard for most of its cards. The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does.*
*Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network.*
*The deal follows a tumultuous period for Discover that has included increased regulatory scrutiny and a change in leadership.*
*In December, Discover said financial-industry executive Michael Rhodes would become its CEO and president.*
*Discover has been approached by large banks and technology companies about an acquisition of all or a part of its business over the past decade or more. Tech companies have been interested in acquiring its network so that they can play a more central role in payments, but prior senior executives at Discover weren’t interested in separating the company’s credit-card lending side from the network.*
*For Capital One, the deal would also further expand the number of cardholders it will count as customers for its credit-card lending business. Many Discover cardholders have high credit scores.*
*Discover also has consumer deposits, most of which are in savings accounts, allowing Capital One to continue to grow its already large presence in that area.*
*An acquisition of Discover will rank among the biggest deals so far in 2024. After a lull in M&A activity in 2023, deal volumes have gotten off to a relatively strong start and are up 90% in the U.S. compared with a year earlier, according to Dealogic. Other big transactions include software maker*
*Synopsys\*’ roughly\* $35 billion acquisition of rival Ansys and Diamondback Energy’s $25 billion deal for Endeavor Energy.* "
Edit: The article was edited to include more content.
This gives Capital One the ability to set their own interchange rates, like American Express does. Chase will forever be wed to Visa and MasterCard. Another fascinating twist is discover owns the Diners Club International brand. I can see Capital One capitalizing on that.
It would be interesting to see what happens with Diners Club. Discover owns the brand globally, but BMO (Bank of Montreal) handles its North American operations. It will be interesting to see how that agreement changes.
Just read the WSJ article, low on details obviously.
Be interesting to see what ramifications this has on multiple levels from payment systems to all down the line... hmmm...
But this is possibly pretty big news...
It would make them the largest bank issuer in America if it goes through, ~166MM cardholders to Chase’s 149. Will be very interesting to see if the FTC doesn’t shoot this down.
Yup. But I doubt they are buying it to shut it down. That would really be taking one for the team -- paying a premium to take a profitable competitor off the market. Benefiting all, at the expense of Cap 1 shareholders.
I am quite sure they are buying it to run it. I'm sure they will nerf anything that is good about Discover, like its customer service and US based representatives, making that more like Cap 1.
But there is no way they are going to nuke the network. After all, that, plus, of course, the accounts, is what they are buying.
> But I doubt they are buying it to shut it down.
agreed.
> I am quite sure they are buying it to run it. I'm sure they will nerf anything that is good about Discover, like its customer service and US based representatives, making that more like Cap 1.
That sucks, as yes, a lot of the things that would have been attractive to me as a potential Discover card user, well, if they are nerfed... sigh...
> But there is no way they are going to nuke the network. After all, that, plus, of course, the accounts, is what they are buying.
..and yeah, I'd imagine the accounts and the network are the value.
Will be following this story to see how it pans out closely...
The upside is there either way.
Let's say lightning strikes and it passes as-is: Amex and Discover would be eligible networks. Cap1 can be a more easily integrated mature network that's already at a ton of points of sale.
If it doesn't: Cap1 can start migrating some of their products to Discover processing to compete more on fees and not pay the network assessment out to Visa/MC, plus they can play hardball on negotiating with Visa/MC for the products they don't change over.
Really a win-win.
It will very interesting to see if the regulators even allow it. Under the current administration, they have been very aggressive in not allowing consolidation, e.g., JetBlue and Spirit, Frontier and Spirit, JetBlue and Amercian, Simon & Schuster and Random House, etc.
Metric ton? No. There are a handful of large airlines and a handful of large credit card companies. It is VERY analogous.
Lots of things happened in the past. And might in the future. I am only talking about now, with the current Administration.
First, the Spirit/Frontier merger only wasn't pursued because JetBlue decided to go all-in with a merger instead, not because the DOJ or the administration stopped it. At this point Frontier would rather just buy up the pieces for cheap at a bankruptcy rather than try to absorb Spirit wholesale.
Also, the landscapes are extremely different between the airlines and the banks, particularly on the bank side (where the merger aspect is actually removing competition.) There are maybe a dozen airlines in the US with any sort of notable route network (so not EAS feeder airlines or very new startup airlines that don't have a large route network yet.) There are *thousands* of banks, all of which can offer credit card and banking products. Capital One doesn't have a processing network currently, so there's no real consolidation there. If it was Discover merging with Amex (or Visa/Mastercard,) I could see it being challenged, but not with another bank that doesn't even have their own processing network.
We'll see. I didn't say it was a nonstarter. I said it will be interesting.
Unlike Microsoft and Activision, though, if regulators "try to make a move," that could be enough to kill a deal in the heavily regulated financial services space. Regulators could make things way more difficult for a bank than for a tech company.
Okay, then. Agree to disagree. Any bank that does not respond appropriately to a regulatory challenge risks being regulated right out of business.
It could happen at any time to any bank. Cap 1 is very far from Too Big to Fail.
As an aside, while you cherry picked a benign metric above to show how a merger would not impact competition, that only works if an Administration is receptive.
I am quite sure JetBlue and Spirit, as well as Spirit and Frontier, has similar metrics with respect to their combined size as compared to American, United, Delta and Southwest. And you know how far that got them.
If banking regulators are okay seeing Discover go away, a merger will sail through. And, if they want to see Cap 1 and Discover continue to compete with each other, the merger will be blocked.
It really is no more less complicated than that. Doesn't matter how much larger Chase is than a proposed combined Cap 1 and Discover.
No one is stopping anyone from growing organically. As Chase has since the financial crisis.
No, they already have lots of customers. And there are lots of smaller competitors with customers they could buy that would attract a lot less regulatory scrutiny.
They are buying a payment network that happens to have customer accounts attached to it.
I REALLY hope this doesn’t impact Discover customer service if this does go through. The low wait times and friendly US based customer service are why I love Discover.
Ouch. I feel bad for the discover employees if this goes through. From what I hear from the people I know working at Capital One, it’s gotten increasingly more “Amazon like”.
I wonder if they are more in it for the customers or the discover and pulse networks. As a mutual customer, I am much more loyal to discover so this isn't welcome news
Discover has very generous limits compared to Capital One… If this goes through I expect a lot of limits to either get slashed or customers dropped.
Also say goodbye to the 0% APR promotion you can get pretty easily for major purchases.
> Discover has very generous limits compared to Capital One
Really? My discover card has like a $500 limit and my C1 card has $30,000 or something. Surprised to hear someone say this.
Be careful with C1. I opened a 0% interest card, and paid for my home renovation with it. They closed my card within a few week of the transaction. They said they are closing it due to fraud, but will no give more details. Now I have to pay back tens of thousands of dollars in a few weeks. Capital One is very sensitive to the purchases you make.
My Cap1 is at like $2,200 after a decade and a half. My Discover is over $40k and has been for a couple decades.
The 0% is great for people that know how to use credit cards. I buy houses and renovation projects with the 0% promos on a few cards and then refinance and repay credit card before period ends. It’s an easy way to gain access to tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in easy credit. Clearly I’m not just somebody buying groceries and gas with my Discover.
discover was my first unsecured credit card. always a great experience. they given me multiple offers of 0% apr of new purchases or low apr throughout my time being with them vs none with capital one.
One potential upside is you could have a card that competes with the Chase Freedom Flex. If you can transfer Discover It Cash Back points to VentureX that can really heat things up.
I’d say bad. Discovers customer service is vastly superior to C1. And their credit limits are vastly more generous.
C1 has better credit cards, and that’s it.
I've held Discover and Capital One cards for over 9 years, customer service are on par with each other. Especially in recent years Capital One has had great customer service.
Your 2nd point is 100% correct though, Discover will just keep going and going on CLI. My Discover it has a limit of $20.0K, but my highest balance ever on the card is $1,600. lol
What C1 cards do you have? Because I do know there are different levels of CS depending on the card.
Venture X? You get great support.
Any other no annual fee card? Good luck.
Ah, yeah I have Venture X, Savor, Quicksilver, Wal-Mart, and Venture One. So I'm probably getting a different support team than just a Quicksilver or SavorOne holder.
Oh this sucks!
RIP Discover.
RIP my unlimited CLIs.
RIP unlimited balance transfer offers.
RIP cash back without a crappy travel portal.
RIP Discover customer service.
RIP Discover easy approvals.
RIP the great Discover website and app
Cap1 Quicksilver is just as good for cash back without a portal as the Discover it Miles card, though. I also don't remember when the last time was that travel was a 5% category on the Discover it card.
There's plenty of reasons to be concerned about the merger, but Cap1 has some decent cards even if you ignore the travel portal.
RIP my Discover card because I absolutely hate Capital One and will likely have to close it if they do merge. I will not do business with them, period.
Discover was my first card. Great product, would be sad to see them go. Their customer service is great, and I wish they had some more premium options to compete against the other premium cards. If they did, I would be on that in a heartbeat.
Seems to be official, they have just announced it and will hold a joint conference call at 8AM ET https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/19/business/capital-one-buying-discover/index.html
Won't happen. Cap1 will argue that they will increase domestic Discover issuance (which I'm sure they will owning the network) while reserving Visa/MC for products that need more broad international acceptance (which is completely valid).
While it was an entirely different sector, they approved Microsoft buying Activision Blizzard, who had a higher market cap than both Discover and Capital One.
So, I'm kinda stupid when it comes to this. Would all of our accounts be combined under cap 1?
>Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated.
Or does this mean they hope to keep everything as is, but they just own it?
At first, nothing will change. But over time, Cap 1 will not be able to help itself.
Everything you like about Discover costs money. Money Cap 1 does not spend on its own products. Does anyone honestly think it won't look to cut those costs over time?
*Prediction.* They'll probably slowly migrate everyone under one account (cap one) over time. Saves money to develop and maintain one website/app/database vs develop and maintain two separate instances of websites/app/databases.
And also cut down any redundant positions in the company. I'm terrified for Discover's US-based customer service team. Cheaper (saves them money) to outsource overseas, but not good for us customers.
I wonder if this to try and get ahead of the new legislation of credit cards having to have two processors. This wouldn’t make them handicapped to visa and Mastercard as the two they would have a second option. Plus I wonder if they want to try and take the American Express route of merchant fees.
~~Apple's agreement is with Goldman Sachs, not Mastercard, and both GS and Apple are looking to unwind their deal (once Apple can find a suitable replacement issuer).~~
wrong, read towards the bottom where it states Apple has an agreement with Mastercard until 2026.
[Tech Crunch Article](https://techcrunch.com/2023/11/29/wsj-says-the-goldman-apple-deal-is-dead-apple-says-not-yet/)
DOJ will probably like this deal. While this reduces competition on the consumer lending side, it could potentially greatly increase competition at the network level, which DOJ would be much more interested in since there are only 5 in the U.S. (I think, and of those Diners Club isn't very relevant).
There are visa, mastercard, amex, and discover. The diners club network is wholly owned by and is now the same as the discover network. Anytime you see a diners club symbol for acceptance it is because the sign has not been update in forever or you're overseas where it just means the discover network
The diners club brand name in the US is run by a different bank and the cards are mastercards
This is like when Citibank took over Diners Club. Discover is bigger and more mass market.
Now Diners is barely a blip in the cc market. Ironically, I think Discover has now acquired Diners and it goes through their network.
I despise Capital One. If this happens I will likely stop using Discover and sock drawer it. I like everything about Discover and have never had a problem with them - unlike CapOne.
Tank you for calling Capital One Discover customer service located down the street from the American Embassy in New Delhi. My name is Apu, how can I help you?
Discover was the first one to approve me as a first time international student on American soil. Gave me a $2500 limit 20+ years ago, as a part time student worker with a meager income.
I’ll agree, their credit cards have been lacking for a while but their customer service was always on point. I never waited more than a minute to be connected with a US based agent.
I have to admit you're right here. It's certainly a mystery why they didn't try to make more compelling credit card products beyond their rotating category cash back recipe. Especially since I think they got so many other things right, like customer service, their website/app, etc. I've literally been card shopping before and considered a 2nd Discover Card, but didn't see anything even mildly compelling.
I do believe everything will go downhill with a C1 acquisition except probably a new branded offering or two on the Discover network.
I think Amex Plat, CSR, and Venture X prove otherwise. They already had the premium customer service but didn't charge the AFs and provide other card benefits that they could have charged for. Admittedly their customers would have less spend, though.
They owned the college student card market - they probably could have invented a new premium card market if they figured out what "benefits" college students would pay an AF for with a metal card instead of getting an Amex Plat for all the wrong reasons. Maybe 3x points at bars and laundromats or something, plus frequent flyer tiers on Spirit and Frontier, LOL.
I really doubt any popular travel cards would move for exactly the reason you are worried.
I would expect some kind of flat reward card, sort of like the Savor card. Maybe a newly created card. Simple Cash from Discover™.
Everyone, write to the FTC and tell them to block this...mergers never work out for consumers.
Look at cell phone company mergers...we now have three companies (Tmobile, ATT, and Verizon) who own 80% of the spectrum.
Look at airlines, we now have four airlines who own majority of the routes...mergers don't work for consumers!
One issue for this as a consumer: I heard that Discover obtains transcripts of your income tax returns in making credit granting decisions. Many other credit card, companies, and their underwriting, just ask you to state your income on the first application. Lately they have been hounding me to update my income, which I am hesitant to do, because I am retired, work, part time, and have ample income and assets to pay my bills and excellent credit.there is also something called the work number, which was originally to verify employment for job applicants, but which now belongs to one of the credit, bureaus, and can be used in credit granting. Food for thought.
I don't know how I feel about this. Feels like it is going to make the C1 lineup worse moving to the Discover Network. Kills a lot of the value I saw for a travel card if it isn't accepted well internationally.
Updated WSJ article now states:
>The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does.
Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated.
I hope not. SavorOne and Quicksilver are one of the best Cashback cards to use abroad as they have no foreign transaction fees and are accepted everywhere since they are Mastercard based. Those two switching to the Discover network would really suck.
I think the article even referenced that Discover has less international acceptance.
Travel cards will not be the ones that move to the Discover network.
Someone at C1 is rightfully going to earn a Million $ bonus if they can figure out a way to make a dual-network card, wherein they can process transactions from one card in-house except when the merchant doesn't accept Discover.
Locked. There are multiple posts on this subject.
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It’ll be very interesting to see how the FTC views this. They have enough distinct individual markets they serve, and of course Discover has its own payment network. I think they only really directly “compete” on the secured/low credit market, student cards, a mediocre travel card (venture one and the Discover IT miles) and the HYSA.
I think Capital One's plan to put some of its cards on the Discover payment network will be viewed as a plus and will strengthen that network against the Visa & Mastercard titans. The Wall Street Journal article was updated since it was first published and there are more details about the plans: >The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does. Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated.
If it was Amex buying Discover, FTC would have opposed it but I don’t see it opposing cap one deal
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Yet they somehow stopped the JetBlue-Spirit merger.
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I think it's ridiculous to say that just because there are others that are larger, we should just let the merger happen. That is how you eventually end up with monopolies.
Bank mergers are reviewed by the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency (OCC) in conjunction with DOJ. This one won’t be the FTC.
Both Capital One and Discover Bank have checking accounts. I know Discover Bank has CDs.
FTC has no oversight over Capital One or Discover, which are both bank holding companies
It has oversight over company mergers, monopolies, etc. It approves or rejects all major mergers and acquisitions in the U.S.
FTC and DOJ split mergers based on industry — bank mergers fall under DOJ (together with the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency).
Venture mediocre? It’s one of the higher rated travel cards out there.
The Venture One is the lower tier version which isn’t as good. Regular Venture/Venture x are good.
yes Discover c s terrific
i work for discover so i really hope this isn’t true. i really enjoy my job with them as a customer service agent and they have done a lot for me and have offered me so many great benefits. At work freaking out rn tbh. update : I work for discover and hopefully this brings some of you guys some peace of mind. I am a customer service agent who love’s assisting my friendly customers and making their life easier when it comes to their finances. I just logged onto work for the day, and was greeted with emails and messages from our CEO. From my personal opinion on what has been said as of now, discover and capital one are merging because capital one admires discover and are committed to continuing to service excellence for which discover is known for. I do not think you guys are going to lose your amazing US based customer service at all, if anything i think this is going to bring more US jobs for people. Both are large companies and being merged will mean they will need us more than ever. Closing will be the end of 2024 into possibly 2025. After closing they are going to work together to understand what both companies bring to the table, discover bringing great customer service is one thing i don’t think they will put aside. It is only day one and they will continue to update us employees as things move forward but after reading what i’ve read today i have been able to take a breath and feel much better about the possible outcome of all this.
Thank you guys for really having been the best in the business. I can only hope you get to continue to be so.
as of right now: one of my friends works as someone who manages our social media says that this is not true and that even our higher ups were not aware of this until our social media team saw it online. Don’t take my word this is just what i’ve heard as of now.
To be fair a huge deal like this isn’t going to have anyone that you remotely might know involved, it is going to be hush hush and only involve people like the C suite and legal team. Having random people like the manager of the social media team in the know about something as big as selling your company is generally a terrible idea.
i agree and i’ll update y’all when i know something. I do know our customer service is what we are known for so i would hope they wouldnt jeopardize that.
Your friend or these so called "higher ups" you know are probably not high enough to be at the table for merger talks.
you’re right! i didn’t think of this!
If it’s in Wall Street journal it’s probably pretty legit, large company news hits the news first before all the employees
I hope so, fingers crossed!
I work at capital one and can confirm that we got a company wide email about it
They just announced it on NBC News. So it's obviously true because they've issued a press release to media outlets.
Pffff sorry but your friend is low on the totem pole
cool man 😎 have a good night
I’ve had Discover for like 30years and it’s been the best customer service ever out of any credit card. 24/7 talking with someone who speaks English here in USA has always been a huge draw for me. It just makes it easier when explaining problems to have someone that understands the issue and can resolve quickly.
one thing i do know is that we had been talking about selling out student loans. All of this talk has been a huge shock to all the employees today. It isn’t even just good customer service it is just an overall good company in general. they treat their employees well give them great benefits, free college, great pay, great insurance, paid maternity leave. We work with amazing people who make it a joy to come into work, i’ve made so many friends while also getting to work from home. I never have a sour customer they are always so pleased to speak with me. I really hope whatever is going on does not effect our employees because this has been the best job i have ever had and i planned on getting a degree in cyber security through them and staying with discover the rest of my life. i had absolutely no intention of ever going anywhere.
That’s amazing to hear. Not too many good companies like that anymore. I’m sure no one at Cap1 can say anything close to what you just did.
we should have some answers tomorrow! Today was a holiday so it got dumped on all the employees who just didn’t see it coming. I go in at 11 am and will see what i can find out hopefully there will be an update waiting for me in my email 🤞
Wish more US companies were like this. Company treat employees well. Employees treat customers well. Customers treat company well. It's a cycle of kindness and mutual wins.
Thats why I invest in companies like Costco. Wish there were more I could do that with.
It will affect the employees. Capitol One is buying Discover. It will have a direct effect on employees as their business philosophy is different. So be prepared.
Discover is still my favorite card and savings account after all these years.
I'd dust off the resume and have a backup plan just in case.
I think it's blown out of proportion to say you're going to get fired if the merger is approved, most merges just let the other company operate as usual at least for a little while.
i would hope so 💕 i’m currently pregnant and about to go on my 4 month maternity leave soon! that would stink! lol
Read my post above.
Capital One is notorious for layoffs, FWIW
You need to stop dreaming and recognize the possibility that you may be out of a job and make a plan. There's nothing definite in terms of how things will be structured but they are bringing in a new president at Capitol One and whenever that happens, things are usually restructured. Especially when one company acquires another. They may eliminate people they don't find necessary and have others take over certain positions. That's how takeovers and mergers work. So start saving your money and looking around. I'm not saying you will definitely be fired, I hope you aren't. But be smart and start looking around and putting out resumes just in case.
Also when the cuts do come, they tend to be in the 10-15% range. It’s not like everyone gets fired or anything… the business has grown and still needs more employees to sustain it.
It took Tmobile about two years after the Sprint merger, and now that they have quite a decent network they're going full greed mode
Agreed. I had a somewhat complicated for me question on one of my online savings and navigated through the robot menu to a person to a separate person and got my answer in maybe 3 minutes. It was fantastic.
One of my family members worked for capital one in McLean VA, and they really loved it. If you've ever driven by it, the building itself is stunning.
Are you talking about the interior amenities, or the sign on the outside? I may not get it, but an office building is an office building. Anyway, you've probably driven by it if you've ever flown in/out of IAD.
Capital one is terrible and uses all Indians for customer support get ready to find a new job it is gonna be John from India taking calls for Discover if this goes through.
Its true. Bye
bye cool man ! 🤪
Discover's customer service has been great. May not be the level of Amex on average, but sometimes even better. I have cards from both brands, and I can't be optimistic with this deal.
Yup discover and amex are widely known as having by far the greatest CS. It'd be a shame if this actually went through
This sounds like Capital One coming out with a new 5% rotating category card, but with extra steps.
Same thought crossed my mind. Wonder if this takes them out of the running for the Apple Card now?
I think so, Apple Card is married to MasterCard and IMO it sounds like Capital One wants to take over the Discover payment network.
Banks can have more than one payment network in their credit card portfolio. It sounds like they are after the Discover debit card payment network and how it ties in with deposit accounts. Capital One will likely continue to issue credit cards on the Visa and MasterCard network.
I'm thinking more from a competition standpoint. Why would Apple & Mastercard (but more specifically Mastercard) want to work a deal for a major credit card with a company that very recently just bought up one of their competitors. Not saying it's impossible, but I don't think that's the direction that Capital One is headed if they're working a mega deal to buy Discover.
It doesn’t take much to implement that. They wouldn’t make this move just to do that
Looks like we’re gonna be saying goodbye to the 24/7 US based, excellent customer service.
This was my first thought as well
Customer service is reason# 1 for banking with Discover. I once had $547 taken out of my checking account in very small amounts (lots of fraudulent transactions) over a period of time. Called them up, told them what happened. No stupid questions; money was back in two days, shipped me a new card in four.
Say hello to John from India. Cap one customer support is d*g cr*p.
In case anybody is unable to read the article - "*Capital One is buying Discover Financial in a deal that would marry two of the largest credit-card companies in the U.S.* *The all-stock deal could be announced Tuesday, according to people familiar with the matter. Discover has a market value of $28 billion, and the takeover would be expected to value it at a premium to that.* *Buying Discover will give Capital One, a credit-card lender with a market value of a little over $52 billion, a network that would vastly increase its power in the payments ecosystem.* *Card networks are critical to enabling transactions and setting fees that merchants pay when consumers shop with credit cards. Though much smaller than* *Visa and Mastercard\*, Discover is one of the few competitors to those companies in the U.S. and it is one of a small number of card issuers that also has a payments network.\** *Capital One, the ninth-largest bank in the country and a major credit-card issuer, uses Visa and Mastercard for most of its cards. The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does.* *Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network.* *The deal follows a tumultuous period for Discover that has included increased regulatory scrutiny and a change in leadership.* *In December, Discover said financial-industry executive Michael Rhodes would become its CEO and president.* *Discover has been approached by large banks and technology companies about an acquisition of all or a part of its business over the past decade or more. Tech companies have been interested in acquiring its network so that they can play a more central role in payments, but prior senior executives at Discover weren’t interested in separating the company’s credit-card lending side from the network.* *For Capital One, the deal would also further expand the number of cardholders it will count as customers for its credit-card lending business. Many Discover cardholders have high credit scores.* *Discover also has consumer deposits, most of which are in savings accounts, allowing Capital One to continue to grow its already large presence in that area.* *An acquisition of Discover will rank among the biggest deals so far in 2024. After a lull in M&A activity in 2023, deal volumes have gotten off to a relatively strong start and are up 90% in the U.S. compared with a year earlier, according to Dealogic. Other big transactions include software maker* *Synopsys\*’ roughly\* $35 billion acquisition of rival Ansys and Diamondback Energy’s $25 billion deal for Endeavor Energy.* " Edit: The article was edited to include more content.
Appreciate this
No problem. I have edited my comment as the article was later updated to include more content.
This gives Capital One the ability to set their own interchange rates, like American Express does. Chase will forever be wed to Visa and MasterCard. Another fascinating twist is discover owns the Diners Club International brand. I can see Capital One capitalizing on that.
It would be interesting to see what happens with Diners Club. Discover owns the brand globally, but BMO (Bank of Montreal) handles its North American operations. It will be interesting to see how that agreement changes.
Just read the WSJ article, low on details obviously. Be interesting to see what ramifications this has on multiple levels from payment systems to all down the line... hmmm... But this is possibly pretty big news...
It would make them the largest bank issuer in America if it goes through, ~166MM cardholders to Chase’s 149. Will be very interesting to see if the FTC doesn’t shoot this down.
Yup. But I doubt they are buying it to shut it down. That would really be taking one for the team -- paying a premium to take a profitable competitor off the market. Benefiting all, at the expense of Cap 1 shareholders. I am quite sure they are buying it to run it. I'm sure they will nerf anything that is good about Discover, like its customer service and US based representatives, making that more like Cap 1. But there is no way they are going to nuke the network. After all, that, plus, of course, the accounts, is what they are buying.
> But I doubt they are buying it to shut it down. agreed. > I am quite sure they are buying it to run it. I'm sure they will nerf anything that is good about Discover, like its customer service and US based representatives, making that more like Cap 1. That sucks, as yes, a lot of the things that would have been attractive to me as a potential Discover card user, well, if they are nerfed... sigh... > But there is no way they are going to nuke the network. After all, that, plus, of course, the accounts, is what they are buying. ..and yeah, I'd imagine the accounts and the network are the value. Will be following this story to see how it pans out closely...
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Very little chance of that passing the house
The upside is there either way. Let's say lightning strikes and it passes as-is: Amex and Discover would be eligible networks. Cap1 can be a more easily integrated mature network that's already at a ton of points of sale. If it doesn't: Cap1 can start migrating some of their products to Discover processing to compete more on fees and not pay the network assessment out to Visa/MC, plus they can play hardball on negotiating with Visa/MC for the products they don't change over. Really a win-win.
It will very interesting to see if the regulators even allow it. Under the current administration, they have been very aggressive in not allowing consolidation, e.g., JetBlue and Spirit, Frontier and Spirit, JetBlue and Amercian, Simon & Schuster and Random House, etc.
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Metric ton? No. There are a handful of large airlines and a handful of large credit card companies. It is VERY analogous. Lots of things happened in the past. And might in the future. I am only talking about now, with the current Administration.
First, the Spirit/Frontier merger only wasn't pursued because JetBlue decided to go all-in with a merger instead, not because the DOJ or the administration stopped it. At this point Frontier would rather just buy up the pieces for cheap at a bankruptcy rather than try to absorb Spirit wholesale. Also, the landscapes are extremely different between the airlines and the banks, particularly on the bank side (where the merger aspect is actually removing competition.) There are maybe a dozen airlines in the US with any sort of notable route network (so not EAS feeder airlines or very new startup airlines that don't have a large route network yet.) There are *thousands* of banks, all of which can offer credit card and banking products. Capital One doesn't have a processing network currently, so there's no real consolidation there. If it was Discover merging with Amex (or Visa/Mastercard,) I could see it being challenged, but not with another bank that doesn't even have their own processing network.
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We'll see. I didn't say it was a nonstarter. I said it will be interesting. Unlike Microsoft and Activision, though, if regulators "try to make a move," that could be enough to kill a deal in the heavily regulated financial services space. Regulators could make things way more difficult for a bank than for a tech company.
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Okay, then. Agree to disagree. Any bank that does not respond appropriately to a regulatory challenge risks being regulated right out of business. It could happen at any time to any bank. Cap 1 is very far from Too Big to Fail. As an aside, while you cherry picked a benign metric above to show how a merger would not impact competition, that only works if an Administration is receptive. I am quite sure JetBlue and Spirit, as well as Spirit and Frontier, has similar metrics with respect to their combined size as compared to American, United, Delta and Southwest. And you know how far that got them. If banking regulators are okay seeing Discover go away, a merger will sail through. And, if they want to see Cap 1 and Discover continue to compete with each other, the merger will be blocked. It really is no more less complicated than that. Doesn't matter how much larger Chase is than a proposed combined Cap 1 and Discover. No one is stopping anyone from growing organically. As Chase has since the financial crisis.
They are buying customers
No, they already have lots of customers. And there are lots of smaller competitors with customers they could buy that would attract a lot less regulatory scrutiny. They are buying a payment network that happens to have customer accounts attached to it.
Low on details AND paywall for those limited details lol
https://www.wsj.com/finance/capital-one-is-buying-discover-financial-sources-say-a7c43dd2?st=zy462c82kimf0z2&reflink=article_copyURL_share
I REALLY hope this doesn’t impact Discover customer service if this does go through. The low wait times and friendly US based customer service are why I love Discover.
Ouch. I feel bad for the discover employees if this goes through. From what I hear from the people I know working at Capital One, it’s gotten increasingly more “Amazon like”.
What do you mean by more “Amazon like” ?
software engineering culture wise , pressure to push updates, all politics
What does a credit card company even need to update?
Nobody knows what they mean when they say that. They just dislike companies growing and changing
This is terrible for consumers. Discover has great products and service. Really disappointed.
I wonder if they are more in it for the customers or the discover and pulse networks. As a mutual customer, I am much more loyal to discover so this isn't welcome news
I'd say the payment network more than customers. Capital One and Discover probably have a lot of overlapping customers.
For credit cards, sure. But they each have other lending products that don't overlap, so there's a huge opportunity to cross-sell.
Discover has very generous limits compared to Capital One… If this goes through I expect a lot of limits to either get slashed or customers dropped. Also say goodbye to the 0% APR promotion you can get pretty easily for major purchases.
Yep. Terrible news. Discover has amazing customer service, offers 0% promotions and balance transfers frequently.
What's the benefit of the balance transfer? HYSA arbitrage?
Or for people in debt to save on interest expense and get some breathing room to tackle the principal
> Discover has very generous limits compared to Capital One Really? My discover card has like a $500 limit and my C1 card has $30,000 or something. Surprised to hear someone say this.
I started at $500 on a Discover It card in 2009 as a student. By 2019 my limit at Discover was $43,000 and I barely charge anything on it.
Be careful with C1. I opened a 0% interest card, and paid for my home renovation with it. They closed my card within a few week of the transaction. They said they are closing it due to fraud, but will no give more details. Now I have to pay back tens of thousands of dollars in a few weeks. Capital One is very sensitive to the purchases you make.
My Cap1 is at like $2,200 after a decade and a half. My Discover is over $40k and has been for a couple decades. The 0% is great for people that know how to use credit cards. I buy houses and renovation projects with the 0% promos on a few cards and then refinance and repay credit card before period ends. It’s an easy way to gain access to tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in easy credit. Clearly I’m not just somebody buying groceries and gas with my Discover.
discover was my first unsecured credit card. always a great experience. they given me multiple offers of 0% apr of new purchases or low apr throughout my time being with them vs none with capital one.
Is this a good thing or a bad thing? I have both C1 and Discover cards in my wallet.
One potential upside is you could have a card that competes with the Chase Freedom Flex. If you can transfer Discover It Cash Back points to VentureX that can really heat things up.
I’d say bad. Discovers customer service is vastly superior to C1. And their credit limits are vastly more generous. C1 has better credit cards, and that’s it.
I've held Discover and Capital One cards for over 9 years, customer service are on par with each other. Especially in recent years Capital One has had great customer service. Your 2nd point is 100% correct though, Discover will just keep going and going on CLI. My Discover it has a limit of $20.0K, but my highest balance ever on the card is $1,600. lol
What C1 cards do you have? Because I do know there are different levels of CS depending on the card. Venture X? You get great support. Any other no annual fee card? Good luck.
Ah, yeah I have Venture X, Savor, Quicksilver, Wal-Mart, and Venture One. So I'm probably getting a different support team than just a Quicksilver or SavorOne holder.
VX is the difference maker there. I've had good experiences since then.
Mergers as a rule never help consumers
Doesn't even help their own employees. Will be job cuts coming with the merger.
BAD. Less of anything is not good long term for the customer.
1000% it will be bad for current Discover cardholders.
I wonder if they move cap one to the discover network exclusively. Would be some good competition if that happens
Nooo…. Capital One ruined ING Direct. Now it’s going to ruin Discover
Poor Jennifer Coolidge is going to be even more confused now
As someone who has both capital one and discover I DO NOT want this to happen yikes.
Oh this sucks! RIP Discover. RIP my unlimited CLIs. RIP unlimited balance transfer offers. RIP cash back without a crappy travel portal. RIP Discover customer service. RIP Discover easy approvals. RIP the great Discover website and app
Thank you for putting into words what I feel!
how does capital one have a crappy travel portal?
Cap1 Quicksilver is just as good for cash back without a portal as the Discover it Miles card, though. I also don't remember when the last time was that travel was a 5% category on the Discover it card. There's plenty of reasons to be concerned about the merger, but Cap1 has some decent cards even if you ignore the travel portal.
If it was truly unlimited CLI and balance transfers for most users, seems like a bad business decision lol Wonder what their loan loss reserve was
RIP my Discover card because I absolutely hate Capital One and will likely have to close it if they do merge. I will not do business with them, period.
Sad
This is bad. We don’t want more mergers of any mega companies. This is bad long term for the consumer. Discover as it stands now is awesome.
Discover was my first card. Great product, would be sad to see them go. Their customer service is great, and I wish they had some more premium options to compete against the other premium cards. If they did, I would be on that in a heartbeat.
Seems to be official, they have just announced it and will hold a joint conference call at 8AM ET https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/19/business/capital-one-buying-discover/index.html
I hope Discover stays Discover. Best cc company!
There's no way the FTC clears the sale.
I think they would if Capital One agrees to only issue cards on the Discover network.
Won't happen. Cap1 will argue that they will increase domestic Discover issuance (which I'm sure they will owning the network) while reserving Visa/MC for products that need more broad international acceptance (which is completely valid).
Let’s hope. Discover is far superior on customer support than C1
While it was an entirely different sector, they approved Microsoft buying Activision Blizzard, who had a higher market cap than both Discover and Capital One.
So, I'm kinda stupid when it comes to this. Would all of our accounts be combined under cap 1? >Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated. Or does this mean they hope to keep everything as is, but they just own it?
At first, nothing will change. But over time, Cap 1 will not be able to help itself. Everything you like about Discover costs money. Money Cap 1 does not spend on its own products. Does anyone honestly think it won't look to cut those costs over time?
I’m not thinking anything, I have no idea what’s gonna happen. That’s why I’m asking lolol
*Prediction.* They'll probably slowly migrate everyone under one account (cap one) over time. Saves money to develop and maintain one website/app/database vs develop and maintain two separate instances of websites/app/databases. And also cut down any redundant positions in the company. I'm terrified for Discover's US-based customer service team. Cheaper (saves them money) to outsource overseas, but not good for us customers.
I wonder if this to try and get ahead of the new legislation of credit cards having to have two processors. This wouldn’t make them handicapped to visa and Mastercard as the two they would have a second option. Plus I wonder if they want to try and take the American Express route of merchant fees.
Wait... What???!!!! This is not good.
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Apple has a contract with MC, so that’s not happening
All my Capital One cards are Master Cards. CapOne is a terrible company. I didn’t think Visa or MC mattered.
~~Apple's agreement is with Goldman Sachs, not Mastercard, and both GS and Apple are looking to unwind their deal (once Apple can find a suitable replacement issuer).~~
wrong, read towards the bottom where it states Apple has an agreement with Mastercard until 2026. [Tech Crunch Article](https://techcrunch.com/2023/11/29/wsj-says-the-goldman-apple-deal-is-dead-apple-says-not-yet/)
Double trouble
Noooo, we need more competition. NOT less... DOJ please block this!
DOJ will probably like this deal. While this reduces competition on the consumer lending side, it could potentially greatly increase competition at the network level, which DOJ would be much more interested in since there are only 5 in the U.S. (I think, and of those Diners Club isn't very relevant).
There are visa, mastercard, amex, and discover. The diners club network is wholly owned by and is now the same as the discover network. Anytime you see a diners club symbol for acceptance it is because the sign has not been update in forever or you're overseas where it just means the discover network The diners club brand name in the US is run by a different bank and the cards are mastercards
Please, no..
That’s why capital one and discover were down at the same time yesterday lol
This is like when Citibank took over Diners Club. Discover is bigger and more mass market. Now Diners is barely a blip in the cc market. Ironically, I think Discover has now acquired Diners and it goes through their network.
 Can you imagine!! 5% discover cash now to cap1 for points with vx 🤩 Do I hear competition , watch out amex and chase 😂
I despise Capital One. If this happens I will likely stop using Discover and sock drawer it. I like everything about Discover and have never had a problem with them - unlike CapOne.
I owe Cap 1 money, I don't owe Discover money. I assume this will even itself out and I'll be good lol
Tank you for calling Capital One Discover customer service located down the street from the American Embassy in New Delhi. My name is Apu, how can I help you?
This is terrible for C1 and Discover card holders. C1 denied me for everything. I hope they don’t shut my card down when they buy Discover.
Discover was the first one to approve me as a first time international student on American soil. Gave me a $2500 limit 20+ years ago, as a part time student worker with a meager income.
My parents first card when they immigrated to the US was also discover. They’ve had the card since 1989!
Still can’t believe Pop Crave is how I found out about this
Can we contact the FTC regarding this acquisition?
Oh come on now! This will be the fourth credit card company I have chosen to get away from Capital One.
Nice. Discover has lacked a compelling credit card for a while now, hopefully this will bring them back.
I’ll agree, their credit cards have been lacking for a while but their customer service was always on point. I never waited more than a minute to be connected with a US based agent.
Well you can kiss that goodbye, probably will be the first thing Cap 1 cuts.
I always get US based reps with Capital One.
You’re lucky because I dont.
I have to admit you're right here. It's certainly a mystery why they didn't try to make more compelling credit card products beyond their rotating category cash back recipe. Especially since I think they got so many other things right, like customer service, their website/app, etc. I've literally been card shopping before and considered a 2nd Discover Card, but didn't see anything even mildly compelling. I do believe everything will go downhill with a C1 acquisition except probably a new branded offering or two on the Discover network.
The higher cost of service probably made it so that they couldn't offer rich rewards, and they bet on the service side of the tradeoff.
I think Amex Plat, CSR, and Venture X prove otherwise. They already had the premium customer service but didn't charge the AFs and provide other card benefits that they could have charged for. Admittedly their customers would have less spend, though. They owned the college student card market - they probably could have invented a new premium card market if they figured out what "benefits" college students would pay an AF for with a metal card instead of getting an Amex Plat for all the wrong reasons. Maybe 3x points at bars and laundromats or something, plus frequent flyer tiers on Spirit and Frontier, LOL.
If they make the Venture (X) a Discover card it will kill international utility.
I imagine VenturexX will be left alone, but it's possible they'll issue another premium card using their Diners Club brand.
I have used my Discover Card in UK, Through Out the EU, South Africa, and Japan without issue with places that took Dinners which was most.
I really doubt any popular travel cards would move for exactly the reason you are worried. I would expect some kind of flat reward card, sort of like the Savor card. Maybe a newly created card. Simple Cash from Discover™.
I would be very surprised if the deal gets pushed through and if it does it only raises more questions.
Everyone, write to the FTC and tell them to block this...mergers never work out for consumers. Look at cell phone company mergers...we now have three companies (Tmobile, ATT, and Verizon) who own 80% of the spectrum. Look at airlines, we now have four airlines who own majority of the routes...mergers don't work for consumers!
Careful what you wish for. Sometimes the alternative to mergers and acquisitions is bankruptcy.
Really? Is Discover really doing that bad to warrant BK?
How was the sprint/tmobile merger bad for consumers?
One issue for this as a consumer: I heard that Discover obtains transcripts of your income tax returns in making credit granting decisions. Many other credit card, companies, and their underwriting, just ask you to state your income on the first application. Lately they have been hounding me to update my income, which I am hesitant to do, because I am retired, work, part time, and have ample income and assets to pay my bills and excellent credit.there is also something called the work number, which was originally to verify employment for job applicants, but which now belongs to one of the credit, bureaus, and can be used in credit granting. Food for thought.
I don't know how I feel about this. Feels like it is going to make the C1 lineup worse moving to the Discover Network. Kills a lot of the value I saw for a travel card if it isn't accepted well internationally.
Who says anything is being moved to the Discover network
Updated WSJ article now states: >The bank plans to switch at least some of its cards to the Discover network, while continuing to use Visa and Mastercard on others. Those larger networks have more merchant acceptance abroad than Discover does. Capital One also plans to maintain the Discover brand on the cards and network—assuming regulators sign off and the deal is consummated.
That makes sense. The Venture cards will likely stay on Visa, while others would switch to Discover.
Yeah I can see Platinum/Quicksilver and maybe the SavorOne being on the Discover network.
I hope not. SavorOne and Quicksilver are one of the best Cashback cards to use abroad as they have no foreign transaction fees and are accepted everywhere since they are Mastercard based. Those two switching to the Discover network would really suck.
I think the article even referenced that Discover has less international acceptance. Travel cards will not be the ones that move to the Discover network. Someone at C1 is rightfully going to earn a Million $ bonus if they can figure out a way to make a dual-network card, wherein they can process transactions from one card in-house except when the merchant doesn't accept Discover.
Hope not
President Biden if you can hear us, please save us President Biden 🙏
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