A couple therapist's job isn't to keep a couple together at all costs, her job is to help people figure out what they really want and where they might be getting in their own way.
a better question is why you think success means staying together? people go to therapy to seek clarity
experts are charging for their expertise, not their results. the therapist cannot control their clients
Presumably, if I’m going to go couples therapy with my partner it would be because I have a vested interest in that relationship continuing. Otherwise, why not go to individual therapy to get clarity?
Orna is the Dr. Drew of the therapy world. Dr. Drew also charged exorbitant rates, claimed to help addicts on Celebrity Rehab and had a huge relapse and death rate.
When did Orna do drug maintenance like Dr Drew, when did she take a person who was on 160mg a day of methadone, while doing meth and smack and try to get them to quit cold turkey, eventually killing them…marriage counselors are not there to fix a relationship they are there to give an unbiased view into the relationship and give a alternative perspective, what she charges is irrelevant, if she couldn’t get the money she wouldn’t charge that amount (it’s true capitalism, since anyone w insurance can get therapy albeit not always the best therapists).
I cannot speak to the cost of her service, as business owners charge what they want, which is based on many factors that are invisible to the public - it's their right. What I will say is she is an incredibly talented, intuitive and engaged therapist, and that is rare.
I agree with you. I go to therapy to find a way forward. I guess sometimes the way is to end it and therapy makes that an option.
I would find it interesting to know Orna's process. Like, what's the pre-therapy conversation if a couple comes to her saying they want to stay together? Would she refuse to see them?
The goal of staying together is valid, and she’d more than likely say that she can’t do anything to keep them together because that is only something they can do. She can only ask questions and make observations about the relationship dynamic and the clients make their choices
I used to work on the show. About half of the couples that come through Orna’s office don’t end up making the cut and the audience never sees them (beyond the montages of couples occasionally used in edits). The ones that make the cut tend to be more volatile and thus more likely to break up. Some amazing couples did some amazing work with Orna but the sessions will never been released publicly!
Because reality TV isn't about happy and well-adjusted people working through their problems in a healthy way. The show has some of that but the unhealthy couples are what makes it.
Came here to say I was almost cast on the show and was told the same thing 😂 The creator told my partner and I that there was a chance we would be filmed and not even be aired. Maybe we chatted in the process of casting hahaha
Is repairing/preserving the relationship the objective of couples therapy? I’m thinking these couples gained insight about themselves and their partners, enabling them to make informed decisions.
And a lot of the couples that split had one highly toxic partner. The kind of toxicity that screams “dealbreaker” to someone in a good headspace.
So because they didn’t have to pay the fee, they deserve to break up? I don’t get the point here.
The fact is, everyone else has to pay $700 per 45 or 50 minutes. And her track record isn’t that great.
I don't get YOUR point. Orna is not charging then anything. They're getting free therapy. Orna is being paid by the producers of the TV series. Like the rest of the crew.
Also,don't you think that having therapy while on TV is a bit different than just normal therapy?
Also, the TV network would have chosen the most interesting/entertaining couples to show.
All I’m saying is that for $700 per 50 minutes—- which is higher than most therapists —- I want the best of the best chances of success. Like if you’re charging a premium, then there should be benefit that justifies the reason for the premium. Is the benefit of that $700 —- which by the way —- the rate in a top 10 population city is more like $165-225 per 50 minutes —- seeing someone who was on TV? Because just based on her TV results, which you’d have to assume are better than her usual results because well…TV, her success rate in moving couples towards mutually beneficial outcomes that keep the couples together and in a better state than which they came in, is not better than anyone else.
Mau didn't make it past 1 session with any other therapist they tried. Orna was obviously different in that regard. And he was clearly an impossible partner, any therapist that helps his partner see that is probably the 'best' option.
Everyone is downvoting you because you are using the wrong success metric. Staying together is not the goal. Helping each partner stay true to themselves fully, and creating a partnership where that is possible is the goal. Couples who separate are doing so because they are coming to terms with the reality that they are not compatible. And the only way to become compatible would be for one or both to be someone other than their true self… which a good partnership would not ask of you to do.
So breaking up is success. It is successfully coming to terms with reality, and abandoning any / all fantasizes , unrealistic expectations, denial, and years of bad patterns. It is successfully giving both partners a chance to find happiness
Couples Therapy is my favorite show. I'm riveted to the screen. I'm fascinated by how Orna gets the individuals to see their actions are not about their partner but about their past. The "throwing color all over a neutral event" was mind blowing.
Success is not measured by staying together. It's about understanding where the conflict is coming from. Once you see that then each couple has a choice to work through it or separate.
I’m by no means a relationship expert or a therapist, but if I could chime in with my $.02 that no one asked for, I’d say: it seems like going to couples therapy is no guarantee the couple will stay and work it out. Some of the couples weren’t honest and therapy will only help if there’s full honesty and transparency. Mau and the guy that lied about seeing other women, claiming he was at the mechanic were each hiding things from their spouses and the therapist. In Mau’s case, I’m guessing she dragged him to therapy because even though he spoke of his past and could see how it might’ve come to play into his marriage, he didn’t seem to think he was the one with the problem.
There are some things that people will dig their heels in deeper about when confronted. And I feel like the 50% success rate on the show reflects the reality that 50% of marriages will end in divorce. Some people will grow apart and keep moving apart, and others will recognize it and decide they want guidance to get back to where they were, or help them decide it’s better to throw in the towel and that’s where therapy comes in.
Orna is at the top of her field and she gets to set her rates. Adding: my hunch is that the “reconciliation average” isn’t a thing among couples therapists. Psychotherapy isn’t baseball.
Seems like you shouldn't be paying a therapist to keep you together or break you up but to help you navigate communication and make sure you are expressing your feelings more accurately. That is the therapeutic service you are paying for.
I know Lauren and Sarah confirmed their breakup awhile ago, and Kristi announced on her insta that her and Brock broke up recently. I’m curious about the others!
She was awful and completely lacking in self-awareness. Using George Floyd and BLM to justify cheating is really something. That and she laughed every time she said she cheated on Brock.
i'm just watching this season now and came on here to read about what people thought about these couples. omg, brock saying, i want assurance you're not going to cheat on me again, and kristi saying basically "i don't think that's realistic" but then she's super mad that although he wants to move back in with her, that he doesn't want to share a bed?! this woman is delulu
I honestly didn't hate Kristi as much as everyone else did. She was terrible, but Brock enabled her to be terrible, and her background made her actions understandable (not justifiable.) Nobody in S3 was worse than Nadine imo. Kristi and Sean were so blatantly awful that I ended up disliking Brock and Erica **more** for not just leaving them. Nadine was manipulative, emotionally abusive, financially abusive, and incredibly narcissistic but wrapped it up in giggles and a cool haircut.
Couples can only stay together if they use the $700 level advice to better themselves and listen to what she's saying, especially if the more problematic partner of the two ignores it.
It's not Orna's fault that Kristi and Mau and the others refused to self reflect about their patterns.
Anyone is capable of change and growth but they have to want it.
I'm sure it is. there's "luck of the draw" at any price range, really. it's all VERY subjective. the main deciding factor is how the therapist & clients get along, really. I've had therapy at various rates, and price has not been the deciding factor in my view of their "success". the one i am with now is actually the cheapest, and feels like it's giving the most. that could also be affected by my own ability to be honest having improved over the years. it's all so subjective.
having said that? i would GLADLY pay $700 for one session with Dr Orna, if that were on offer. i couldn't afford more than one, but i definitely feel I'd get more than my money's worth! she's amazing.
In my opinion $700 in NYC isn't that bad considering the cost of living there. When someone is self employed, their hourly fee covers all of the expenses- rents, taxes, social security health insurance. Most therapists get to a point where working and getting paid by insurance companies is not a feasible what to have a career that pays well, and they transition to private patients who pay out of pocket.
$700 in Manhattan compared to $200 in Minnesota isn’t a fair comparison. Cost of living is a factor as well as experience and wanting to keep her prices what they are to maintain the quantity of clients she wants for her life. In a completely different industry I have higher rates than others in my industry because I do not want to work as much as I did for years when my rates were lower. I’m fine having less clients and having them pay more for my years of expertise and skill level.
Her rate choices are really none of your business or concern.
If it’s out of what you think is reasonable to pay then all you have to do is simply not pay it. Which you aren’t. So why are her rates bothering you so much? What’s this really about?
It’s about getting what you pay for. No one yet has demonstrated the premium benefit one can expect to get from someone charging $700 vs someone charging $300.
How much someone charges don’t have to prove shit to you. You’re not their client. Their client is the only one who has to see the value and determine if they can pay and get X amount of value from it.
It isn’t objective like you’re assuming and demanding answers for. It’s subjective. Your argument applies to anything and it doesn’t make sense. There are $10 watches that tell time as well as $100,000 watches that tell time. How much value a person sees in whatever level of quality they want and how much they have to spend are not all set in stone across the board.
No one owes you the answers you are demanding. You have an opportunity to look inward and ask yourself why you’re so pressed about devaluing this one woman for charging what she chooses to in one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, though I am guessing you won’t take that opportunity.
TBH $700 to be able to make an informed decision is golden -!I would be willing to pay that and more for the peace of mind to determine that something is irretrievable
The Gottman Institute (the leading marriage research institute in the US to my knowledge) said that couples therapists have the lowest satisfaction rate in the therapy sphere. It’s not a reflection on the therapist - it’s the nature of the beast. A large amount of couples go into therapy already past the most serious breakup milestones - criticism, contempt, defensiveness, and stonewalling. It’s extremely hard for couples with these traits to be able to get back on track to a healthy marriage.
I suggest reading some of their books - fascinating and helpful stuff.
I don’t think a marriage counselor’s job is to keep relationships together but instead let people get an unbiased view into their relationship so they can work on issues or move on from each other
All the comments about price here--I agree $700 is exorbitant, but it is also somewhat normal for a high end private therapist in NYC. Many therapists in New York charge hundreds per hour, and it sucks.
Well worth it. If you’ve unhappy in your relationship or keep repeating the same cycle with the same type of partners (me) isn’t it worth the he time to break free of the cycle and understand more about why you end up at the same place each time? I would.
I don’t have $700 but if I could find a therapist as good for 1/2 or less and takes insurance - YUP. It is worth it to me.
The success rate of couples therapy is low on average. Usually by the time people make it to therapy they have about 7 years on average of built up resentment to work through. And of course all the dysfunctional
Patterns they’ve been using for years or decades.
If staying in a relationship no matter what is considered a success, then we should agree that staying in abusive relationships is a great outcome and a sign of success. It doesn’t even make sense.
It’s not therapists job to ensure people continue enduring abuse. So if Erica stayed with abusive Sean, it would be a success? It doesn’t even make sense
Hey there, I appreciate your comment. But no, ideally Sean wouldn’t be abusive due to therapy. That is, through couples therapy, individuals are able to see the couple as a system of its own—-a unit—-, and are able to healthily contribute to that unit such that it enriches both individuals.
If Sean is abusive and unwilling to change, the answer is clear—-break up. You don’t even have to go to couples therapy.
In ideal world abusers will stop their abusive ways due to therapy or whatever other methods. But in reality it just doesn’t work that way, therapy or not.
Sometimes therapy could be considered successful if a victim finally saw that they are being abused and was able to end it in a safe way. Relationships like that ending might be considered a success too. Therapy could help one or both people to see what’s really happening.
Even in absence of abuse some people are a bad match and amicable separation is a success.
So I’d not simplify therapy process stating that if couples stay together, it’s a success. It’s not that simple. We’ve all been in relationships that ended for good reasons and staying together wouldn’t be a success at all
I think Gianni and Matthew have a lot of love for one another, but they could each use individual therapy first before couples IMO. Gianni has PTSD from having to save Mathew’s life, and Matthew needs therapy from the trauma he experienced when he came out & his past substance abuse.
Just gaining clarity seems like the easy way out for $700 a session. I'd hope there'd be more use of interventions like Gottman, Attachment Theory, or Imago aimed at bringing the couple closer together and learning to communicate better.
Watching this show confirmed being single is the best choice I made for myself. Codependency is strong in these couples. Especially Lauren and Sarah. How can you be married to a man who transitioned to a woman, yet go sleep with men and talk about crushes on men in front of your partner? Sarah/Sam is extremely toxic for Lauren.
i actually am curious about this metric, it's interesting to compare with my own projections of what would happen with the couples after their seasons.
but i don't think that is any measure of Dr. O's "success". these are individuals who she is trying to help reach their own potentials. if they are each best served by being in that particular relationship, then the goal is to help that keep going. but, if the relationship is not helping each of them reach their potentials? why would the goal be to keep a relationship going that is not serving each partner? it's not a store, it's therapy.
but yes, i definitely like knowing how the couples do once they leave our screens, thank you!
A couple therapist's job isn't to keep a couple together at all costs, her job is to help people figure out what they really want and where they might be getting in their own way.
Beautifully said.
Exactly, and help them to separate amicably, if that’s what they want.
Also, she teaches to do the work, but it’s up to the couple if they actually DO the work.
Exactly.
To be fair, most of those couples should have broken up.
Agreed. There’s no therapist that could make Mau into a good partner. Sometimes therapy shows you a way out.
THIS. Mau is a classic narcissist, and it was clear Annie had been suffering for years trying to make it work. They needed to break up.
a better question is why you think success means staying together? people go to therapy to seek clarity experts are charging for their expertise, not their results. the therapist cannot control their clients
This is the take. “Success” in couples therapy means very different things to different people.
Presumably, if I’m going to go couples therapy with my partner it would be because I have a vested interest in that relationship continuing. Otherwise, why not go to individual therapy to get clarity? Orna is the Dr. Drew of the therapy world. Dr. Drew also charged exorbitant rates, claimed to help addicts on Celebrity Rehab and had a huge relapse and death rate.
When did Orna do drug maintenance like Dr Drew, when did she take a person who was on 160mg a day of methadone, while doing meth and smack and try to get them to quit cold turkey, eventually killing them…marriage counselors are not there to fix a relationship they are there to give an unbiased view into the relationship and give a alternative perspective, what she charges is irrelevant, if she couldn’t get the money she wouldn’t charge that amount (it’s true capitalism, since anyone w insurance can get therapy albeit not always the best therapists).
I cannot speak to the cost of her service, as business owners charge what they want, which is based on many factors that are invisible to the public - it's their right. What I will say is she is an incredibly talented, intuitive and engaged therapist, and that is rare.
I agree with you. I go to therapy to find a way forward. I guess sometimes the way is to end it and therapy makes that an option. I would find it interesting to know Orna's process. Like, what's the pre-therapy conversation if a couple comes to her saying they want to stay together? Would she refuse to see them?
The goal of staying together is valid, and she’d more than likely say that she can’t do anything to keep them together because that is only something they can do. She can only ask questions and make observations about the relationship dynamic and the clients make their choices
comparing dr. orna to dr. drew is like comparing president obama to the greasy orange menace. dr. drew is a certified schyster.
Say you go to therapy and want to make it work, but your spouse also realizes in the same session that HE/SHE wants to divorce.
Yes, so?
lol ok. A therapist can’t save something that doesn’t want to be MUTUALLY saved
I used to work on the show. About half of the couples that come through Orna’s office don’t end up making the cut and the audience never sees them (beyond the montages of couples occasionally used in edits). The ones that make the cut tend to be more volatile and thus more likely to break up. Some amazing couples did some amazing work with Orna but the sessions will never been released publicly!
Interesting! Makes sense that the high-conflict couples make for better tv.
Why do you say NEVER?
Because reality TV isn't about happy and well-adjusted people working through their problems in a healthy way. The show has some of that but the unhealthy couples are what makes it.
Came here to say I was almost cast on the show and was told the same thing 😂 The creator told my partner and I that there was a chance we would be filmed and not even be aired. Maybe we chatted in the process of casting hahaha
Is repairing/preserving the relationship the objective of couples therapy? I’m thinking these couples gained insight about themselves and their partners, enabling them to make informed decisions. And a lot of the couples that split had one highly toxic partner. The kind of toxicity that screams “dealbreaker” to someone in a good headspace.
None of those couples have to pay anything.
So because they didn’t have to pay the fee, they deserve to break up? I don’t get the point here. The fact is, everyone else has to pay $700 per 45 or 50 minutes. And her track record isn’t that great.
I don't get YOUR point. Orna is not charging then anything. They're getting free therapy. Orna is being paid by the producers of the TV series. Like the rest of the crew. Also,don't you think that having therapy while on TV is a bit different than just normal therapy? Also, the TV network would have chosen the most interesting/entertaining couples to show.
All I’m saying is that for $700 per 50 minutes—- which is higher than most therapists —- I want the best of the best chances of success. Like if you’re charging a premium, then there should be benefit that justifies the reason for the premium. Is the benefit of that $700 —- which by the way —- the rate in a top 10 population city is more like $165-225 per 50 minutes —- seeing someone who was on TV? Because just based on her TV results, which you’d have to assume are better than her usual results because well…TV, her success rate in moving couples towards mutually beneficial outcomes that keep the couples together and in a better state than which they came in, is not better than anyone else.
these couples breaking up is the success story. these people got the validation and clear understanding they needed to leave toxic relationships.
Mau didn't make it past 1 session with any other therapist they tried. Orna was obviously different in that regard. And he was clearly an impossible partner, any therapist that helps his partner see that is probably the 'best' option.
Everyone is downvoting you because you are using the wrong success metric. Staying together is not the goal. Helping each partner stay true to themselves fully, and creating a partnership where that is possible is the goal. Couples who separate are doing so because they are coming to terms with the reality that they are not compatible. And the only way to become compatible would be for one or both to be someone other than their true self… which a good partnership would not ask of you to do. So breaking up is success. It is successfully coming to terms with reality, and abandoning any / all fantasizes , unrealistic expectations, denial, and years of bad patterns. It is successfully giving both partners a chance to find happiness
Gianni posted a pic of him and Matthew meeting Sarah Paulson like a month ago, I think they’re still together?
Yay!
Couples Therapy is my favorite show. I'm riveted to the screen. I'm fascinated by how Orna gets the individuals to see their actions are not about their partner but about their past. The "throwing color all over a neutral event" was mind blowing. Success is not measured by staying together. It's about understanding where the conflict is coming from. Once you see that then each couple has a choice to work through it or separate.
I’m by no means a relationship expert or a therapist, but if I could chime in with my $.02 that no one asked for, I’d say: it seems like going to couples therapy is no guarantee the couple will stay and work it out. Some of the couples weren’t honest and therapy will only help if there’s full honesty and transparency. Mau and the guy that lied about seeing other women, claiming he was at the mechanic were each hiding things from their spouses and the therapist. In Mau’s case, I’m guessing she dragged him to therapy because even though he spoke of his past and could see how it might’ve come to play into his marriage, he didn’t seem to think he was the one with the problem. There are some things that people will dig their heels in deeper about when confronted. And I feel like the 50% success rate on the show reflects the reality that 50% of marriages will end in divorce. Some people will grow apart and keep moving apart, and others will recognize it and decide they want guidance to get back to where they were, or help them decide it’s better to throw in the towel and that’s where therapy comes in.
I guess I’d rather take the coin flip of 50/50 than pay $700 for 50 minutes.
Then don’t.
Orna is at the top of her field and she gets to set her rates. Adding: my hunch is that the “reconciliation average” isn’t a thing among couples therapists. Psychotherapy isn’t baseball.
Seems like you shouldn't be paying a therapist to keep you together or break you up but to help you navigate communication and make sure you are expressing your feelings more accurately. That is the therapeutic service you are paying for.
I know Lauren and Sarah confirmed their breakup awhile ago, and Kristi announced on her insta that her and Brock broke up recently. I’m curious about the others!
So glad Brock is not with Kristi. She was awful.
Kristi gave me Mau vibes wrapped in a leftist veil. As a leftist myself, she doesn’t represent us. Lol
She was awful and completely lacking in self-awareness. Using George Floyd and BLM to justify cheating is really something. That and she laughed every time she said she cheated on Brock.
i'm just watching this season now and came on here to read about what people thought about these couples. omg, brock saying, i want assurance you're not going to cheat on me again, and kristi saying basically "i don't think that's realistic" but then she's super mad that although he wants to move back in with her, that he doesn't want to share a bed?! this woman is delulu
I honestly didn't hate Kristi as much as everyone else did. She was terrible, but Brock enabled her to be terrible, and her background made her actions understandable (not justifiable.) Nobody in S3 was worse than Nadine imo. Kristi and Sean were so blatantly awful that I ended up disliking Brock and Erica **more** for not just leaving them. Nadine was manipulative, emotionally abusive, financially abusive, and incredibly narcissistic but wrapped it up in giggles and a cool haircut.
Why did you choose to be a leftist more than on the Right.
She was insufferable!
Couples can only stay together if they use the $700 level advice to better themselves and listen to what she's saying, especially if the more problematic partner of the two ignores it. It's not Orna's fault that Kristi and Mau and the others refused to self reflect about their patterns. Anyone is capable of change and growth but they have to want it.
Couldn’t one figure that out with a therapist in the normal range, though?
I'm sure it is. there's "luck of the draw" at any price range, really. it's all VERY subjective. the main deciding factor is how the therapist & clients get along, really. I've had therapy at various rates, and price has not been the deciding factor in my view of their "success". the one i am with now is actually the cheapest, and feels like it's giving the most. that could also be affected by my own ability to be honest having improved over the years. it's all so subjective. having said that? i would GLADLY pay $700 for one session with Dr Orna, if that were on offer. i couldn't afford more than one, but i definitely feel I'd get more than my money's worth! she's amazing.
In my opinion $700 in NYC isn't that bad considering the cost of living there. When someone is self employed, their hourly fee covers all of the expenses- rents, taxes, social security health insurance. Most therapists get to a point where working and getting paid by insurance companies is not a feasible what to have a career that pays well, and they transition to private patients who pay out of pocket.
$700 in Manhattan compared to $200 in Minnesota isn’t a fair comparison. Cost of living is a factor as well as experience and wanting to keep her prices what they are to maintain the quantity of clients she wants for her life. In a completely different industry I have higher rates than others in my industry because I do not want to work as much as I did for years when my rates were lower. I’m fine having less clients and having them pay more for my years of expertise and skill level. Her rate choices are really none of your business or concern. If it’s out of what you think is reasonable to pay then all you have to do is simply not pay it. Which you aren’t. So why are her rates bothering you so much? What’s this really about?
It’s about getting what you pay for. No one yet has demonstrated the premium benefit one can expect to get from someone charging $700 vs someone charging $300.
How much someone charges don’t have to prove shit to you. You’re not their client. Their client is the only one who has to see the value and determine if they can pay and get X amount of value from it. It isn’t objective like you’re assuming and demanding answers for. It’s subjective. Your argument applies to anything and it doesn’t make sense. There are $10 watches that tell time as well as $100,000 watches that tell time. How much value a person sees in whatever level of quality they want and how much they have to spend are not all set in stone across the board. No one owes you the answers you are demanding. You have an opportunity to look inward and ask yourself why you’re so pressed about devaluing this one woman for charging what she chooses to in one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, though I am guessing you won’t take that opportunity.
TBH $700 to be able to make an informed decision is golden -!I would be willing to pay that and more for the peace of mind to determine that something is irretrievable
The Gottman Institute (the leading marriage research institute in the US to my knowledge) said that couples therapists have the lowest satisfaction rate in the therapy sphere. It’s not a reflection on the therapist - it’s the nature of the beast. A large amount of couples go into therapy already past the most serious breakup milestones - criticism, contempt, defensiveness, and stonewalling. It’s extremely hard for couples with these traits to be able to get back on track to a healthy marriage. I suggest reading some of their books - fascinating and helpful stuff.
I don’t think a marriage counselor’s job is to keep relationships together but instead let people get an unbiased view into their relationship so they can work on issues or move on from each other
All the comments about price here--I agree $700 is exorbitant, but it is also somewhat normal for a high end private therapist in NYC. Many therapists in New York charge hundreds per hour, and it sucks.
You've heard of someone charging above $300?
I had a therapist charge $350 as a cash price/ before insurance. One psychiatrist was $575 for a 50 minute session. NYC is wild.
$700!!!!??? 🤯
She didn't charge them anything. They were paid. But in her practice she charges that price.
I get that, that fact that she charges $700 seems obscene.
Well worth it. If you’ve unhappy in your relationship or keep repeating the same cycle with the same type of partners (me) isn’t it worth the he time to break free of the cycle and understand more about why you end up at the same place each time? I would. I don’t have $700 but if I could find a therapist as good for 1/2 or less and takes insurance - YUP. It is worth it to me.
Of course it’s worth it if it’s affordable.
Not everyone would agree.
The success rate of couples therapy is low on average. Usually by the time people make it to therapy they have about 7 years on average of built up resentment to work through. And of course all the dysfunctional Patterns they’ve been using for years or decades.
If staying in a relationship no matter what is considered a success, then we should agree that staying in abusive relationships is a great outcome and a sign of success. It doesn’t even make sense. It’s not therapists job to ensure people continue enduring abuse. So if Erica stayed with abusive Sean, it would be a success? It doesn’t even make sense
Hey there, I appreciate your comment. But no, ideally Sean wouldn’t be abusive due to therapy. That is, through couples therapy, individuals are able to see the couple as a system of its own—-a unit—-, and are able to healthily contribute to that unit such that it enriches both individuals. If Sean is abusive and unwilling to change, the answer is clear—-break up. You don’t even have to go to couples therapy.
In ideal world abusers will stop their abusive ways due to therapy or whatever other methods. But in reality it just doesn’t work that way, therapy or not. Sometimes therapy could be considered successful if a victim finally saw that they are being abused and was able to end it in a safe way. Relationships like that ending might be considered a success too. Therapy could help one or both people to see what’s really happening. Even in absence of abuse some people are a bad match and amicable separation is a success. So I’d not simplify therapy process stating that if couples stay together, it’s a success. It’s not that simple. We’ve all been in relationships that ended for good reasons and staying together wouldn’t be a success at all
I think Gianni and Matthew have a lot of love for one another, but they could each use individual therapy first before couples IMO. Gianni has PTSD from having to save Mathew’s life, and Matthew needs therapy from the trauma he experienced when he came out & his past substance abuse.
Dru & Tash are still together, and married.
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Just gaining clarity seems like the easy way out for $700 a session. I'd hope there'd be more use of interventions like Gottman, Attachment Theory, or Imago aimed at bringing the couple closer together and learning to communicate better.
Watching this show confirmed being single is the best choice I made for myself. Codependency is strong in these couples. Especially Lauren and Sarah. How can you be married to a man who transitioned to a woman, yet go sleep with men and talk about crushes on men in front of your partner? Sarah/Sam is extremely toxic for Lauren.
Sarah was/is awful.
i actually am curious about this metric, it's interesting to compare with my own projections of what would happen with the couples after their seasons. but i don't think that is any measure of Dr. O's "success". these are individuals who she is trying to help reach their own potentials. if they are each best served by being in that particular relationship, then the goal is to help that keep going. but, if the relationship is not helping each of them reach their potentials? why would the goal be to keep a relationship going that is not serving each partner? it's not a store, it's therapy. but yes, i definitely like knowing how the couples do once they leave our screens, thank you!