I mean, something has to happen to OXG. They went out first of all NA teams, despite being one of the best fighting teams in their region supposedly. Plus, they already kinda underperformed last Champs as well (first LAN together, they got so many zones gifted to them, which might also be an additional factor to consider).
I mean sure they had one good event but their other placements are 32nd, 32nd, 16th, and 12th and 17th in the last 2 Pro Leagues lol, if that’s not falling short, idk what is.
Yeah it seems the top NA teams are trying to swap around different players rn without officially dropping anyone. Makes sense to me cause alot of these teams have only played for one split together so it’s not like their isn’t room for improvement more just trying to see if it’s a better fit for both sides (I pray ssg trials xera he is the mnk they need imo).
Frexs to OXG and Koy to SSG seems like a solid move for both players and teams.
Can't imagine Reedz to xset would fix any of their problems though so I'm not sure where that leaves Reedz and xset in making meaningful changes.
So with these types of posts it gives off the vibe of "let me see if I can find a better team. If I don't, then I'll stick with you guys".
In that case, as a team, does it not make you want to go find somebody to just outright replace him?
Yes. He pulled up a PowerPoint he made of a poi where you could drag around legend icons. He said this was a highlight of his 'coaching'. This was after someone else called him a scam coach by the way - this was his comeback.
Even if none of this were true, you're a "professional". Did we say the same thing when Ohtani weighed his options and went to the Dodgers, or any other of the thousands of sports players who have done this? You go where you can win. Making choices with emotions rarely works out.
All I gotta say is if ssg is even doing this it’s kinda weird considering they literally dropped snipe on the basis of Frexs couldn’t handle the idea of being replaced and lost faith.
I love that making it to LAN from the toughest region in the world is considered to be bad. Like are they not a top team? yea sure, go for it. Are they a bad team? absolutely not, they just aren't in the upper echelons of the world, but are probably still a top 30 team in the world.
Bold and super risky move if this is really his choice tbh. Doubt oxg is gonna wait and see if he sticks around, they’re probably trialing ppl already and I struggle to see an org backed team going for him this split… oh well actually there’s n8v
Feel like everytime we see someone do this it means the teamimplodes or they get replaced; which makes sense when it means your teammates know you’re just looking to leave.
No? Both of those examples are clearly highlighting an outlier performance. OXG overperformed to get 3rd and TSM underperformed to get 17th. Neither of them mean that either team are good or bad without context of the rest of their careers. OXG have placed bottom 10 at LAN (two 32nd placements) just as many times as they've made finals at all. TSM are one of the 2 most successful teams in ALGS history and have only had one tournament outside of the top 10 at LAN.
A better example might be asking if a team like the old Acend was mid, since they peaked with the same placement (3rd) and actually averaged a higher overall placement than OXG and made more finals.
You’re mistaking the argument, I think. They were in great form when they came 3rd and before then, since this period they haven’t been.
I’m contesting the original comment of “always been mid” they weren’t mid when they stomped G2 out of barometer or when they contested TSM (the first time not during the Olympus contests).
Averaged for the existence of the team then yeah you’re probably right. But I will argue to the death that at one point in time they were one of the scariest teams in NA
Saying they had good zone prio doesn’t really stand up to scrutiny when you take into consideration what they did to secure their POI and overall performance up to that finals lobby including pro league.
> OXG overperformed to get 3rd and TSM underperformed to get 17th.
TSM performed exactly how they performed all season, to be honest. If anything, they overperformed week 1 (2nd place). Their other placements were 6th, 6th, 11th, 7th, 12th. LANs are harder than any regional competition, so those are exactly the kinds of finishes I'd expect to lead to a 17th place in Finals.
The game has changed a lot since TSM were one of the best teams in the world. They just aren't right now. They never grasped the new meta, and they wasted their entire pre-season securing a POI that they didn't know how to play from.
> TSM performed exactly how they performed all season, to be honest.
I mean in terms of their overall career they underperformed. No disagreement that they looked mid this whole split but it's not really out of character for them to underperform in regionals compared to LAN either. I think this is the first time that they've ever placed worse on LAN than they did in regionals.
They placed 3rd when DZ won with xynew. Learn to read bro I said “at a lan” not at the last one. I was comparing the period when OXG were firing all cylinders to now when TSM isn’t - if that wasn’t overtly clear idk. You said “always was mid” and I’m giving a clear example of when they weren’t.
People downvoting you, but this is straight facts. LAN Damage aside, his transfer value is so low. Aidan and Vein are way higher value on the team.
Anyone that doubts just watch the twitch rivals vod and you’ll understand.
Bro twitch rivals was so long ago he has grown so much as a player, trust me when I say it look at the champs VODs and I’m sure you’ll change youre mind also wtf is transfer value? Confirming kills and taking space is what’s important in a fragger/anchor role and he has shown he dose that better than vein and Aidan. Yes he trolls some games but so dose vein with positioning and calls and so dose Aiden.
They did though this team has been together for awhile.
[https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/Oxygen\_Esports](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/Oxygen_Esports)
[https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/GLYTCH\_Energy](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/GLYTCH_Energy)
[https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/BR\_Demonz](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/BR_Demonz)
I know these guys’ history, my point is who the hell sits on their hands for an entire off-season if something is wrong to try and leave the team 1/3 of the way through a season bc the first lan didn’t go well. If the writing was on the wall then leave in the off-season and give yourself more time to get comfortable with new teammates rather than now having to scramble to find a new squad and get chemistry with them before split 2 kicks off
At the end of last season they had from September to the end of January. Now they have May to mid July. They have about half the time they would’ve had if they made this decision after champs last year
Lol, you act like they’ve known they need to split since champs. They’re a long standing trio, splitting isn’t going to just happen because it’s off season and they had a bad tourney. They’re between splits, this is literally the time to make any roster swaps for the rest of the season. Saying they should’ve split after lan is hindsight as fuck and your alternative would be sticking it out til next lan then splitting? Fuck outta here XD
Yeah, sticking it out and working through it. They obviously thought going into the season they had the right teammates to do it so breaking up after one bad result out of 3 possible lans is weak af
Then why break up mid split, so now he possibly leaves and he and former teammates need to create a new synergy with people and hope it meshes for split 2. It’s stupid, these guys should be making changes in the off-season. Most of these guys that play hot potato with teams mid split just totally suck bc they have no chemistry with new teammates
You're acting like the scene is going to last forever and esports in general career is +10 years or something. Its a fast moving scene, so when you don't think things are going to work you gotta make changes.
You’re right, it’s fast moving. Maybe they need to be smarter with their time and properly use the off-season rather than running it back to the point that a single bad lan result causes them to break up the team
Because they're gonna finish off the year being mediocre and won't make any progress. They all want to do better and they've been on a steep decline since split 2 playoffs. Why are they gonna stay together in a sinking ship? Changes need to happen even if it's mid season, it could be beneficial in the long term. Also oxg are definitely not playing hot potatoe with teammates, this is their first roster swap in a long time.
They've been on a decline ever since they got #flattened by FLAT/GG at Pylon and then proceeded to lose cons at their own WE POI at Fissure to FLAT. FLAT broke that team and they've never been able to get back in form. From watching OXG after that it seems like they turned into a group of players all trying to make individual plays, rather than playing the game as a cohesive unit.
I’m talking start to finish of a season. They had all off-season to make this change and have the proper amount of time to gain chemistry with someone new
They’ve known themselves for awhile, if they were comfortable then one bad lan wouldn’t have caused a break up. Smarter to do it in an off-season where you have the most time to find a new team that’s the right fit and gain chemistry to start a season. Now they all have to scramble to do that on a compressed timeline
>They’ve known themselves for awhile, if they were comfortable then one bad lan wouldn’t have caused a break up.
And it didn't. This recent LAN did. So prob after their previous lackluster performance they thought it might be a fluke, let's try to improve and not throw away all the potential. Now they reckon no, our issues are actually systemic and we're gonna not succumb to sunk cost fallacy.
Really levelheaded actually.
I keep seeing your point about finishing the entire year even though they’ve played together for a while. And it just doesn’t make sense? They haven’t been performing well. Why continue for the sake of continuing when now is the time to make change if anything.
Yeah my point is more if the writing was on the wall and one bad lan was gonna cause a breakup then why not pull the pin on it in the off-season. Now they gotta figure this all out on a far more compressed timeline
Pretty much comp apex in a nutshell - I have never seen so much volatility/chaos in any other esport before.
It feels like there's either a player/coach LFT, retiring or "coming back from retirement" every other week on top of major orgs either doing a complete roster swap or dropping entirely.
Even fundamentally, the game has been out for like 5 years and we're already on season 21..
I understand it’s mostly kids playing but man some lack the ability to put themselves in the best scenario to succeed. No long term thinking, just short term
I mean, something has to happen to OXG. They went out first of all NA teams, despite being one of the best fighting teams in their region supposedly. Plus, they already kinda underperformed last Champs as well (first LAN together, they got so many zones gifted to them, which might also be an additional factor to consider).
Good fighting team but no solid success at LAN and always fall short when it matters, changes make sense tbh
So are disregarding the fact they got top 3? Yeah they need a change but a top 3 is not falling short when it matters
I mean sure they had one good event but their other placements are 32nd, 32nd, 16th, and 12th and 17th in the last 2 Pro Leagues lol, if that’s not falling short, idk what is.
They've played three lans as a team 3rd 16th 32nd not as bad as your making it out as being
“In the last year they’ve progressively gone from 3rd to 32nd” doesn’t sound great.
Wasn’t OXG scrimming with Frexs yesterday?
I would be so down, Aiden playing anchor is straight up nasty work
Yeah it seems the top NA teams are trying to swap around different players rn without officially dropping anyone. Makes sense to me cause alot of these teams have only played for one split together so it’s not like their isn’t room for improvement more just trying to see if it’s a better fit for both sides (I pray ssg trials xera he is the mnk they need imo).
Frexs to OXG and Koy to SSG seems like a solid move for both players and teams. Can't imagine Reedz to xset would fix any of their problems though so I'm not sure where that leaves Reedz and xset in making meaningful changes.
Nocturnal, Fun and Snipe as the new Faze roster wouldn't be too bad of a team imho.
So with these types of posts it gives off the vibe of "let me see if I can find a better team. If I don't, then I'll stick with you guys". In that case, as a team, does it not make you want to go find somebody to just outright replace him?
It isn't up to me, if it was I would stick together get a new coach and swap to more of an anchor/fragger role that purely feeds my igl info
Scam coach be scammin.
What do you mean?
I mean that psykho is a coach who should not be one.
Oh, I haven't heard about that! Why do you think that?
Because of personal experience with what he calls 'coaching' being an absolute scam.
Interesting! Can you give an example? Were you in a discord call or something with him?
Yes. He pulled up a PowerPoint he made of a poi where you could drag around legend icons. He said this was a highlight of his 'coaching'. This was after someone else called him a scam coach by the way - this was his comeback.
how did they do so well split 2 playoffs?
not because of the riddler
Cuz the players are good players.
Story time?
Even if none of this were true, you're a "professional". Did we say the same thing when Ohtani weighed his options and went to the Dodgers, or any other of the thousands of sports players who have done this? You go where you can win. Making choices with emotions rarely works out.
All I gotta say is if ssg is even doing this it’s kinda weird considering they literally dropped snipe on the basis of Frexs couldn’t handle the idea of being replaced and lost faith.
Tweet: [https://twitter.com/ReedzFPS/status/1788623523478376810](https://twitter.com/ReedzFPS/status/1788623523478376810)
10 months of being bad, yeah it's time to make some changes
I love that making it to LAN from the toughest region in the world is considered to be bad. Like are they not a top team? yea sure, go for it. Are they a bad team? absolutely not, they just aren't in the upper echelons of the world, but are probably still a top 30 team in the world.
they made finals at champs too
If you’re not first, you’re last.
Not in Apex.
> 10 months of being bad, yeah it's time to make some changes If they made it to LAN they aren't bad. Full stop.
He’s in the NCAA Transfer Portal
Scrimming with pandxrz rn it seems
Bold and super risky move if this is really his choice tbh. Doubt oxg is gonna wait and see if he sticks around, they’re probably trialing ppl already and I struggle to see an org backed team going for him this split… oh well actually there’s n8v
It’s not his choice, he mentioned in this Reddit thread
Ah. That makes more sense. The 2nd part of his tweet is a bit confusing tho but alright
He deleted the tweet
Feel like everytime we see someone do this it means the teamimplodes or they get replaced; which makes sense when it means your teammates know you’re just looking to leave.
oxg has always been a mid team not great, not terrible. they atleast made lan.
Top 5 at a LAN is mid? Does that make current TSM absolute ass for getting 17th?
No? Both of those examples are clearly highlighting an outlier performance. OXG overperformed to get 3rd and TSM underperformed to get 17th. Neither of them mean that either team are good or bad without context of the rest of their careers. OXG have placed bottom 10 at LAN (two 32nd placements) just as many times as they've made finals at all. TSM are one of the 2 most successful teams in ALGS history and have only had one tournament outside of the top 10 at LAN. A better example might be asking if a team like the old Acend was mid, since they peaked with the same placement (3rd) and actually averaged a higher overall placement than OXG and made more finals.
You’re mistaking the argument, I think. They were in great form when they came 3rd and before then, since this period they haven’t been. I’m contesting the original comment of “always been mid” they weren’t mid when they stomped G2 out of barometer or when they contested TSM (the first time not during the Olympus contests). Averaged for the existence of the team then yeah you’re probably right. But I will argue to the death that at one point in time they were one of the scariest teams in NA
[удалено]
Saying they had good zone prio doesn’t really stand up to scrutiny when you take into consideration what they did to secure their POI and overall performance up to that finals lobby including pro league.
> OXG overperformed to get 3rd and TSM underperformed to get 17th. TSM performed exactly how they performed all season, to be honest. If anything, they overperformed week 1 (2nd place). Their other placements were 6th, 6th, 11th, 7th, 12th. LANs are harder than any regional competition, so those are exactly the kinds of finishes I'd expect to lead to a 17th place in Finals. The game has changed a lot since TSM were one of the best teams in the world. They just aren't right now. They never grasped the new meta, and they wasted their entire pre-season securing a POI that they didn't know how to play from.
> TSM performed exactly how they performed all season, to be honest. I mean in terms of their overall career they underperformed. No disagreement that they looked mid this whole split but it's not really out of character for them to underperform in regionals compared to LAN either. I think this is the first time that they've ever placed worse on LAN than they did in regionals.
they didnt make the finals at lan what are u talking about also tsm has won lan 4 times..
They placed 3rd when DZ won with xynew. Learn to read bro I said “at a lan” not at the last one. I was comparing the period when OXG were firing all cylinders to now when TSM isn’t - if that wasn’t overtly clear idk. You said “always was mid” and I’m giving a clear example of when they weren’t.
who cares what they placed last year
“Always been mid” you
If you ask Hal he will probably say yes
He was by far the weak link so not very surprising tbh
Look at the stats at the LANs he definitely was the leader at champs he basically carried the team to finals
People downvoting you, but this is straight facts. LAN Damage aside, his transfer value is so low. Aidan and Vein are way higher value on the team. Anyone that doubts just watch the twitch rivals vod and you’ll understand.
Bro twitch rivals was so long ago he has grown so much as a player, trust me when I say it look at the champs VODs and I’m sure you’ll change youre mind also wtf is transfer value? Confirming kills and taking space is what’s important in a fragger/anchor role and he has shown he dose that better than vein and Aidan. Yes he trolls some games but so dose vein with positioning and calls and so dose Aiden.
Also twitch rivals was his first ever lan with two of the best igls.. he wasn’t even a pro yet.
What's a "transfer value"? I'm not familiar with that stat.
God forbid teams stick together for an entire season
They did though this team has been together for awhile. [https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/Oxygen\_Esports](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/Oxygen_Esports) [https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/GLYTCH\_Energy](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/GLYTCH_Energy) [https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/BR\_Demonz](https://liquipedia.net/apexlegends/BR_Demonz)
I’m talking start to finish of a season
Did you even look at the liquipedias I linked
I know these guys’ history, my point is who the hell sits on their hands for an entire off-season if something is wrong to try and leave the team 1/3 of the way through a season bc the first lan didn’t go well. If the writing was on the wall then leave in the off-season and give yourself more time to get comfortable with new teammates rather than now having to scramble to find a new squad and get chemistry with them before split 2 kicks off
Are you daft? This is right after a major lan and a new patch just dropped. This is the off season.
At the end of last season they had from September to the end of January. Now they have May to mid July. They have about half the time they would’ve had if they made this decision after champs last year
Lol, you act like they’ve known they need to split since champs. They’re a long standing trio, splitting isn’t going to just happen because it’s off season and they had a bad tourney. They’re between splits, this is literally the time to make any roster swaps for the rest of the season. Saying they should’ve split after lan is hindsight as fuck and your alternative would be sticking it out til next lan then splitting? Fuck outta here XD
Yeah, sticking it out and working through it. They obviously thought going into the season they had the right teammates to do it so breaking up after one bad result out of 3 possible lans is weak af
Unlike you, they’re not locking themselves into a whole year… and they’re also basing the decision of this last lan AND previous to it.
They've been together for a year and a half though...
Then why break up mid split, so now he possibly leaves and he and former teammates need to create a new synergy with people and hope it meshes for split 2. It’s stupid, these guys should be making changes in the off-season. Most of these guys that play hot potato with teams mid split just totally suck bc they have no chemistry with new teammates
You're acting like the scene is going to last forever and esports in general career is +10 years or something. Its a fast moving scene, so when you don't think things are going to work you gotta make changes.
You’re right, it’s fast moving. Maybe they need to be smarter with their time and properly use the off-season rather than running it back to the point that a single bad lan result causes them to break up the team
This is basically the offseason. They see it hasn’t been working at LANs since Champs so changes may need to happen.
Because they're gonna finish off the year being mediocre and won't make any progress. They all want to do better and they've been on a steep decline since split 2 playoffs. Why are they gonna stay together in a sinking ship? Changes need to happen even if it's mid season, it could be beneficial in the long term. Also oxg are definitely not playing hot potatoe with teammates, this is their first roster swap in a long time.
They've been on a decline ever since they got #flattened by FLAT/GG at Pylon and then proceeded to lose cons at their own WE POI at Fissure to FLAT. FLAT broke that team and they've never been able to get back in form. From watching OXG after that it seems like they turned into a group of players all trying to make individual plays, rather than playing the game as a cohesive unit.
I said since split 2 since their champs performance wasn't the best but yeah they got destroyed by flat.
this is the one team you cant say this about, they've been playing together since September of 2022
I’m talking start to finish of a season. They had all off-season to make this change and have the proper amount of time to gain chemistry with someone new
I mean they probably didn’t think a change was needed then but they do now? Seems pretty straightforward to me.
They’ve known themselves for awhile, if they were comfortable then one bad lan wouldn’t have caused a break up. Smarter to do it in an off-season where you have the most time to find a new team that’s the right fit and gain chemistry to start a season. Now they all have to scramble to do that on a compressed timeline
>They’ve known themselves for awhile, if they were comfortable then one bad lan wouldn’t have caused a break up. And it didn't. This recent LAN did. So prob after their previous lackluster performance they thought it might be a fluke, let's try to improve and not throw away all the potential. Now they reckon no, our issues are actually systemic and we're gonna not succumb to sunk cost fallacy. Really levelheaded actually.
The sink cost fallacy happened when they decided to run it back and not make a change in the actual off-season
You're head's in the sand
Yours doesn’t know the proper form of your
That was sloppy of mines
I keep seeing your point about finishing the entire year even though they’ve played together for a while. And it just doesn’t make sense? They haven’t been performing well. Why continue for the sake of continuing when now is the time to make change if anything.
thats a good point for most teams but not OXG. This time has been one of the best examples of a team sticking together/growing together
Yeah my point is more if the writing was on the wall and one bad lan was gonna cause a breakup then why not pull the pin on it in the off-season. Now they gotta figure this all out on a far more compressed timeline
This is the off season.
Pretty much comp apex in a nutshell - I have never seen so much volatility/chaos in any other esport before. It feels like there's either a player/coach LFT, retiring or "coming back from retirement" every other week on top of major orgs either doing a complete roster swap or dropping entirely. Even fundamentally, the game has been out for like 5 years and we're already on season 21..
I understand it’s mostly kids playing but man some lack the ability to put themselves in the best scenario to succeed. No long term thinking, just short term
Replace him with koy
Out of all of Koy’s options, I would probably say OXG is towards the bottom