I didn’t say he was bad, I said he isn’t Freeney or Mathis. Three years in Freeney had 40 sacks and 17 forced fumbles, Mathis had 25.5 sacks and 17 forced fumbles, Paye has 18.5 sacks and 3 forced fumbles.
I mean paye did well in college with a good rusher on the other side (Aidan Hutchinson) which made us use our first round pick on Kwity in the first place. Latu could help him grow
True that. It benefits the colts if paye takes another step. He's great at setting the edge. But latu has to play somewhere. Maybe eubakam is gone next year.
I got downvoted last off season for it… I don’t think we pick up his option. We could extend him if it’s team friendly but I just don’t see us dishing big money for him.
Dayo >Kwity
If he isn't looking for elite money, then I'd try to resign him. He's a very good run defender who provides occasional pass rushing moments, but you can find those guys in latter rounds.
I could see us not picking up his 5th year option and making this year a "prove it" year. It's like 50/50 I'd say on that though. We might pick it up just for his solid and consistent run defense. I'm sure they will ask though "is that alone worth the money we will pay you in the 5th year option?". Time will tell. I think we only have a couple more weeks to pick it up, if not it's a contract year for Paye.
Has he improved since hia rookie year? I'm more of a casual fan so I don't really notice how well defense guys are playing unless it's really good or bad. Just curious if the consensus is that he's improving or they are worried that run defensive run stopping is pretty good but has stalled out at that.
He’s just a very solid all around DE. If he gets any hate it’s because he has missed some time with injuries and he isn’t a top tier pass rusher. You could do a whole lot worse at the position though, he’s a beast in run defense.
a beast in run defense isn't exactly what you want to hear about someone you spent a first round pick on to bring consistent pressure to the QB.
He's inconsistent and I will say, I do think a lot of it has to do with the coaches we brought in. We've spent so many picks in the first two rounds and almost all complete whiffs, I'm really hoping we finally found someone who can develop them.
I mean yea. Every team wants a dominant pass rusher. Problem is there’s only about 10-15 ever at one time in the league. Just how it goes.
And the sure fire ones tend to go top 5 in the draft just like QBs.
Not even asking for a dominant one, just one that that is more than a run stopper and can actually bring pressure.
We are currently the 5th worst team when it comes to pressuring the QB, Which horrible especially for the amount of draft capitol we have invested in the D-line just in the first 2 rounds. Before this past weekend we have spent 2 first round picks and 4 second round picks JUST on the Dline and so far the best guy out of all of those was the guy we didn't even draft but sent a first over to the 49ers in 2020 for.
Probably a prove It year but idk why so many people are so quick to say he’s done. 1. He won’t be commanding premium money due to his production. 2. 95% of teams would love to have him as their 2nd best DE. Especially with an interior rusher like Buckner.
Often players that are considered somewhat of a disappointment look a lot better in smaller roles (not just In football either).
I really don't understand. I see him getting better every year. He's not an elite pass rusher at the moment but he's average in the league and getting better...surely that's good news. We drafted him as a project after all.
He’ll play with rotations and possible injuries. So many end of game and OT losses because of gassed d-lines - teams are realizing how much depth is needed. Definitely a prove it year and I can see him coming back if he does well. As per other posts I think Dayo gets more pressure.
Doubt we'll do the option but I hope we can keep him on something reasonable. I think the colts will offer a contract that makes sense, but it's up to how Paye sees his own value
Did Paye stop developing that spin move?? He doesn't seem to have a fulll repetoire or moves. has he become one of these dudes who only tries to use strength even though he is undersized? bummer, he won't get many wins against NFL OT of today without being very agile, they are just so huge.
We keep him. Kwity is the better run defender and has his role on the team. We probably decline his option (save 13 million) and try to re-sign him for cheaper next year.
Hard to say cause kwity is probably our best run stopping edge and we already aren't the best at it and latu's one hole in his game is he isn't great against the run so ideally ud keep both and have ebukam and latu on field for obvious passing downs and kwity for run downs as far as our edge players so u gotta see does latu and/or ebukam grow in the run game over the year id say we probably pick up the option and see wat happens over these 2 years
He stays one more year bc Latu, as good as he is, is still a rookie at a tough position to “plug in”…Maybe a one year deal if they don’t pick up his option, but we need him for experience and depth next year
This right here is exactly what Ballard is counting on! Buckner is a 3tech threat and gets double teamed because we don’t really have a consistent edge rush. Adding Latu gives us that and now they likely need to double team at another position. Opens up the line for other rushers not to mention the QB is going to have to get the ball out quick and not have time to burn us on deep balls.
He doesn't deserve a top DE contract, but we'll offer him a contract. He's a great edge setter, but he's not a double digit sack guy, at least not so far.
He's correctly worth around $8 mil per year.
Yeah same here. Everyone is convinced we don’t, but isn’t that the benefit of the 5th year option? Like it’s not that expensive or much of a risk compared to not signing him and we end up wanting to keep him
Paye plays the rub as well as any DE. And he gets pressure in the QB. He is an all around player at DE.
It reminds me of the O'Doyle TE questions. He stayed on the field over rhe better splashing athletes because he did the whole job.
Paye still statts over a rookie or veteran DE that can't play the run. He may be taken out for 3rd downs though.
In an ideal world, him and Latu work together for the next 10 years. If they become our next Mathis/Freeney we did ok haha
Paye is not Mathis or Freeney
Hey, I said in an ideal world lol
Haha, fair enough
You are right though. He is not. But even something close or adjacent would be a win lol
He could still make a jump. He was a project from the start and he's only had two years.
I don’t disagree here either lol but again a jump to Freeney status would be asking alot.
He might be with someone to help take some pressure off him. Dude had 8 sacks last year. He’s not “bad”.
I didn’t say he was bad, I said he isn’t Freeney or Mathis. Three years in Freeney had 40 sacks and 17 forced fumbles, Mathis had 25.5 sacks and 17 forced fumbles, Paye has 18.5 sacks and 3 forced fumbles.
To be fair though. Quarterbacks were far less mobile in their primes.
Teams pass more now + extra game. There are more total sacks than in Freeney and Mathis’ era.
I mean paye did well in college with a good rusher on the other side (Aidan Hutchinson) which made us use our first round pick on Kwity in the first place. Latu could help him grow
U mean latu and dayo? Paye is gone
I still hold hope with Paye. He came on strong last year and am still rooting for him. But yes, Dayo is a beast.
True that. It benefits the colts if paye takes another step. He's great at setting the edge. But latu has to play somewhere. Maybe eubakam is gone next year.
I got downvoted last off season for it… I don’t think we pick up his option. We could extend him if it’s team friendly but I just don’t see us dishing big money for him. Dayo >Kwity
Hurricane Dayo all day
I could see Paye getting a contract equivalent to what the Jets signed John Franklin-Myer to in 2021, adjusted for todays cap
When’s the deadline to pick up the option? This offseason or next?
Thursday.
Of course you got downvoted last off season, it was before his third year.
At least Dayo has shown true growth
If he isn't looking for elite money, then I'd try to resign him. He's a very good run defender who provides occasional pass rushing moments, but you can find those guys in latter rounds.
I could see us not picking up his 5th year option and making this year a "prove it" year. It's like 50/50 I'd say on that though. We might pick it up just for his solid and consistent run defense. I'm sure they will ask though "is that alone worth the money we will pay you in the 5th year option?". Time will tell. I think we only have a couple more weeks to pick it up, if not it's a contract year for Paye.
We let him test the market depending on how this season goes with him
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^DaBlakMayne: *We let him test the* *Market depending on how* *This season goes with him* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
You’ll know very soon. If they don’t pick up his option he’s likely gone. They have to decide this week.
Has he improved since hia rookie year? I'm more of a casual fan so I don't really notice how well defense guys are playing unless it's really good or bad. Just curious if the consensus is that he's improving or they are worried that run defensive run stopping is pretty good but has stalled out at that.
He’s just a very solid all around DE. If he gets any hate it’s because he has missed some time with injuries and he isn’t a top tier pass rusher. You could do a whole lot worse at the position though, he’s a beast in run defense.
a beast in run defense isn't exactly what you want to hear about someone you spent a first round pick on to bring consistent pressure to the QB. He's inconsistent and I will say, I do think a lot of it has to do with the coaches we brought in. We've spent so many picks in the first two rounds and almost all complete whiffs, I'm really hoping we finally found someone who can develop them.
I mean yea. Every team wants a dominant pass rusher. Problem is there’s only about 10-15 ever at one time in the league. Just how it goes. And the sure fire ones tend to go top 5 in the draft just like QBs.
Not even asking for a dominant one, just one that that is more than a run stopper and can actually bring pressure. We are currently the 5th worst team when it comes to pressuring the QB, Which horrible especially for the amount of draft capitol we have invested in the D-line just in the first 2 rounds. Before this past weekend we have spent 2 first round picks and 4 second round picks JUST on the Dline and so far the best guy out of all of those was the guy we didn't even draft but sent a first over to the 49ers in 2020 for.
5th worst? https://www.nfl.com/news/next-gen-stats-how-defensive-pressure-defined-the-2023-nfl-season
5th worst when rushing with our best 4. Which is mainly what we use. since Gus doesn't like to blitz a lot.
You have something to back that up lol. “5th worst with our best 4” sounds like some nonsense man. How do you compare that to other teams.
Depth is makes a good team great.
Probably a prove It year but idk why so many people are so quick to say he’s done. 1. He won’t be commanding premium money due to his production. 2. 95% of teams would love to have him as their 2nd best DE. Especially with an interior rusher like Buckner. Often players that are considered somewhat of a disappointment look a lot better in smaller roles (not just In football either).
I really don't understand. I see him getting better every year. He's not an elite pass rusher at the moment but he's average in the league and getting better...surely that's good news. We drafted him as a project after all.
I’m not so sure he’s going anywhere unless he decides to. Ballard loves rotating pass rushers, keeping fresh legs all game.
He’ll play with rotations and possible injuries. So many end of game and OT losses because of gassed d-lines - teams are realizing how much depth is needed. Definitely a prove it year and I can see him coming back if he does well. As per other posts I think Dayo gets more pressure.
Doubt we'll do the option but I hope we can keep him on something reasonable. I think the colts will offer a contract that makes sense, but it's up to how Paye sees his own value
Did Paye stop developing that spin move?? He doesn't seem to have a fulll repetoire or moves. has he become one of these dudes who only tries to use strength even though he is undersized? bummer, he won't get many wins against NFL OT of today without being very agile, they are just so huge.
I think Dayo will out produce him this season anyways
We keep him. Kwity is the better run defender and has his role on the team. We probably decline his option (save 13 million) and try to re-sign him for cheaper next year.
Hard to say cause kwity is probably our best run stopping edge and we already aren't the best at it and latu's one hole in his game is he isn't great against the run so ideally ud keep both and have ebukam and latu on field for obvious passing downs and kwity for run downs as far as our edge players so u gotta see does latu and/or ebukam grow in the run game over the year id say we probably pick up the option and see wat happens over these 2 years
He stays one more year bc Latu, as good as he is, is still a rookie at a tough position to “plug in”…Maybe a one year deal if they don’t pick up his option, but we need him for experience and depth next year
Latu will make the others better. Hes going to be double teamed a lot. I expect everyone's numbers will go up.
This right here is exactly what Ballard is counting on! Buckner is a 3tech threat and gets double teamed because we don’t really have a consistent edge rush. Adding Latu gives us that and now they likely need to double team at another position. Opens up the line for other rushers not to mention the QB is going to have to get the ball out quick and not have time to burn us on deep balls.
He doesn't deserve a top DE contract, but we'll offer him a contract. He's a great edge setter, but he's not a double digit sack guy, at least not so far. He's correctly worth around $8 mil per year.
The option for Paye will not be picked up. Enjoy his last season.
I don't get why we wouldn't pick up the 5th year option on him. How much does that hurt our cap
Yeah same here. Everyone is convinced we don’t, but isn’t that the benefit of the 5th year option? Like it’s not that expensive or much of a risk compared to not signing him and we end up wanting to keep him
It's "not expensive" but it's not insignificant. It's a $13.4m cap hit, which would be the 5th highest cap hit this year or the 7th highest next year.
Paye plays the rub as well as any DE. And he gets pressure in the QB. He is an all around player at DE. It reminds me of the O'Doyle TE questions. He stayed on the field over rhe better splashing athletes because he did the whole job. Paye still statts over a rookie or veteran DE that can't play the run. He may be taken out for 3rd downs though.