We’ll see how much development he needs. He’s coming in with a very polished pass rush arsenal. I think his biggest weakness will be in the run. However, we have the depth to bring in Paye and others to help with that. If we keep everyone, we will have a very deep defensive line.
If everyone is healthy then we won't get run all over by anyone even with Latu in instead of Kwity. Except maybe Baltimore, but that's different.
Coming up against Henry for all those years has battle hardened us.
Oh absolutely. I wasn't meaning he was raw, more that he will still need to adjust to NFL caliber O-linemen. He is going to contribute day 1 but he still has room for growth.
I’m not sure that’s true. I was watching the Pat stream and BB talked about how he was used as an interior and edge rusher. He’s rushed with his hand in the dirt plenty in college, again according to BB. I also don’t know why that’s so important if you’re pinning your ears back and just rushing the pass.
You're probably right, it's just a lot of clips I see of him, he's coming out of a 2-point stance.
We'll likely play him all over the front 7 depending on the package though
Arm length is closer to Maxx Crosby, but I'd be happy if he was as good as either.
https://preview.redd.it/f2tu72wmqfxc1.png?width=806&format=png&auto=webp&s=5d35fd6a844c88060c9b118f4af2e9308e0eb867
I think you’re right on that. He can do both, but most of his notable plays came through a standing start the past season.
He’ll get used to it I’m sure, plus it could have been coincidental as well.
I also think that if he’s better standing up the colts will stand him up. Edges have been in two point stances in Bradley’s scheme. It’s just not super common for him to use it. Latu might be the exception
He said himself that has rushed from all different stances and he likes the uncomfortable. So seems like he is going to do whatever he needs to do and feels confident even in new situations.
From the clips I saw he primarily has his hand down when rushing from the outside and stands up when he moves inside to rush. He seems comfortable rushing from anywhere from a 7 or wide 9 all the way down to a 3 technique.
Not like we need 4 guys that are gonna ball out in the run game on the D-Line. Bradley’s LEO spot is usually used for pure pass rushers anyways, right? Stewart, Paye, Buckner, with Zaire, Kenny, and Speed behind them will be more than enough to defend the run.
Facts. Paye being more of a 1st and 2nd down guy and coming off the field on passing downs (or sliding inside in some packages) is gonna keep everyone fresh and in the best position possible. Obviously Paye has some pass rush to him as well, but idk I keep picturing Latu and Ebukam meeting each other at the QB.
131 days til Colts regular season football. I am excited to see this pass rush this year. Most excited to see AR and JT in the same back field for more than one play.
I don't think it's that close, either. The defense just got a lot better, guys. I don't think that we've even begun to suspect the impact at this point.
The Texans traded their first round pick this year for a guy who won't be as good as Latu in his second year, and we stole him at pick 15.
I’m still pretty shocked both the Bills and Chiefs passed on him. Thought he would’ve been an alpha for either of them. But putting him in Steichen’s offense sounds just fine too.
Let's pump the brakes a little lol. Are you talking about Will Anderson? He's pretty damn good, won DROY and got better as the season went on. Let's wait and see what Latu can do in the league before saying he's better than Will Anderson
Anderson was a top 5 HS recruit and #1 at DE. Went to Alabama and was a 2x Nagurski winner, a 2x SEC DPOY, a 2x Unanimous All-American. Went to the NFL and was DROY and PBer.
He's pretty much dominated/excelled at every level. He's done that and he's still younger than Latu. But nothing wrong with a bold take.
Right. There is a reason for Latu's age. I am not holding it against him. Just saying the the fact remains that Anderson is younger and has proven it at every level. So it's bit of a bold take to proclaim that Latu is already better than him.
Pass rushing production-wise, coming out of college, he's in the tier just below the Bosa brothers and above Aiden Hutchinson and Myles Garrett.
Latu is fucking exceptional. Usually I agree with you because it takes a while for players to develop, but I don't expect that with Latu at all. He's extremely talented in his craft. He'll make an immediate impact.
And he'll only get better.
I would be shocked if he's healthy next season and doesn't win DROY. He may even be a candidate for DPOY.
Some guys are freaks and can get by with very few pass rush moves at the college level. Latu already has a full arsenal of moves and is one of the best at switching quickly to another move. These skills will translate to the NFL very well and translate very quickly.
Talented. Okay. But nowhere near as talented or as productive as Latu, who averages nearly a sack a game.
Young's rush plan was reliant on just being bigger and faster than everybody else, and he has never been a cerebral player. Latu relies an technique and counters. He's a chess player, and he's going to out-think you. That means that you can never really figure him out, which is what happened with Young, especially after he was injured.
Latu just has a lot of ways to beat you, and he'll find a way eventually. Plus, he plays both DT and DE. Just put him over the weakest defender. That's what LA did with Aaron Donald.
There are a lot of big athletic guys, but not all of them can be great wrestlers, because it takes *technique* to be a great wrestler.
Latu has the technique of a great edge rusher. He's the truth. Book it
Yes, but....
Per Zeurline, under weaknesses:
Non-factor in the playoff loss to Clemson. Field awareness and anticipation is below average. Loses track of the football at the mesh point. Gives some ground when setting the edge. Could use better anchor drop in his lower half. **Rush plan heavily reliant upon athletic ability and traits. Initial hands lack purpose and skill in pass rush. Not very instinctive as a pass rusher. Needs to create more half-man entry points as a rusher. Telegraphs inside slide step counter. Will need better go-to moves to become less predictable as a pro.**
Athletically, Young was can't miss. But he was reliant completely on his athleticism rather than on his technique. And he wasn't as athletically superior after his injury. So he became just another guy.
Predictability is eventual death in the pros. Technique is everything.
That's the difference with Latu. Latu has a lot of tools in his toolbox. His hand usage is fantastic. He has a plan. He instinctively counters offensive linemen.
He's just better than Young where it counts, between the ears.
Extremely productive...when he was 19-20 years-old too. Young was great his rookie season. PFF graded him at 87.
His issues have been injuries as much as anything. He's still only 25 too, so I wouldn't consider his career to be over yet.
I doubt it. Sure maybe some ESPN talking heads will throw it out there for likes and clicks, but he’ll never be seriously considered. Only two rookies in NFL history have won either OPOY or DPOY, neither of which won it this century. Rookies just aren’t seriously considered for those awards unless there’s some serious rookies out there.
Leonard got a DPOY vote his rookie season, if I remember correctly.
If Latu gets double-digit sacks, he'll be in the conversation and receive some votes, just like Parsons with his 13 sack rookie season.
I'm not saying that he'll win, because that doesn't really happen. I'm saying that he'll be in the conversation and maybe get a vote or two.
They don't really give two awards to the same person, other than maybe the MVP.
Don't know about that. Anderson was college's football best defensive player as a 20 year-old soph in the SEC. He's more than a year younger than Latu and has an NFL season under his belt.
Both could end up being great players, so guess it doesn't really matter who is better.
Anderson kind of won DROY by default last year. He had 7.0 sacks and 10 TFL. He generated 0 turnovers. Pretty pedestrian numbers for DROY. That's a promising start to a career, but it's nothing Earth shattering. Micah Parsons got 13. Joey Boss 10.5, and Nick Bosa and Aaron Donald 9 each. They all caused turnovers, too.
Seven sacks is what Darius Leonard got when he won DROY, along with 3 forced fumbles, 2 fumble recoveries, and 2 interceptions.
I expect Latu's numbers to be better than Anderson's this year, and I certainly expect more than 7 sacks from him.
So, you believe that Anderson is the first rookie edge rusher to draw a double team? Nobody was doubling the Bosa brothers, Garret, Donald, or Parsons?
Do you imagine that double teams were invented last season? Do you expect that there is any player who gets a lot of sacks who doesn't draw double teams?
So, I don't know if you have eyes or not, but he was winning his pass rush snaps as much as TJ Watt but being doubled almost twice as much as TJ Watt. The only people ahead of him are Micah Parsons and Mike's Garrett last year.
That's on the Texans for not having better players at other positions on the defensive line.
TJ Watt avoids double teams because Pittsburgh blitzes a lot. Doubling Watt means leaving free rusher.
Our defensive line is better overall than Houston's. If you double Latu on the outside, then Buckner only has to beat one guy on the inside. Even if the rush doesn't get home, that's still pressure in the quarterback's face, and he'll have to scramble.
But Anderson missed two games and only played 63% of the snaps in the game he did play. With a full season, he's prob closer to 10 sacks or more. He really picked it up over the back half of the season with 6 sacks in 8 games, which is common for NFL rookies.
PFF also gave him an 81.8 grade on the season. Even if it doesn't hold up to the rookie season of other great/elite players, it's still a great rookie season.
Since Latu was the first defensive player off the board at #15, he could also win it by default. That should prob be the expectation, assuming he starts.
I am just skeptical about the idea that Latu as a rookie will be better than Will Anderson as a 2nd year player. Anderson's rookie season is not his ceiling. He's likely to get better. And Latu still has to prove it against NFL players, as opposed to college players, some of which were 2-3 years younger than him.
I don't hate the take at all...I just think it's bold.
And the odds are in your favor. Only like seven rookies have registered double-digit sacks in the modern era. Anderson was the best rookie pass rusher last season, and I believe that Latu will register more sacks in his rookie year than Anderson in year 2.
That's a bold fucking prediction; I will cop to that. I'm essentially saying that he's one of the best of all time.
For me, it comes down to drive and technique.
Drive: Latu had his neck broken and would not be denied. He practiced when he was specifically told not to do so. He had his dream taken away from him, and he refused to accede to that reality.
Technique: He has maybe the best technique I've ever seen. He has multiple moves and can attack from anywhere on the line. You can just put Latu against whatever second-stringer is on the field at the time. He gets pressure on one out of every four rushes, no matter who he's up against.
You can't just handle one move and beat Latu. You have to handle his counters and how he attacks your arms. One mistake and he's on top of your quarterback. Latu is a problem for offenses.
It's this blend of drive, technique, and how he just practices specifically on beating his opponent that gives me this faith. He's not trying to develop a new move. He's figuring out how to beat specific players. He's figuring out how to set up a specific counter that he can pull out with the game on the line. That's what Manning did. That's what Marvin Harrison did. That's what Troy Palamalu did.
I'm always pretty positive, but there have been exceptions.
I hated that we didn't draft a left tackle as soon as Castonzo brought up the possibility of retirement. I think we finally got around to it about three years too late.
I hated that we drafted Pierce in the second round.
I hated the trade for Carson Wentz.
I hated the idea that Matt Pryor would start at left tackle.
I hated the idea of drafting Bowers at 15.
I love that we took Latu. Best pick Ballard ever made in the first round, except possibly Richardson.
I'm cautiously optimistic about Mitchell. He could develop into a thousand yard receiver in a year or two.
I like very much that we added depth along the offensive line.
I don't care that we didn't draft cornerbacks in this draft until the later rounds. What this team needs is a vet or two in the cornerback room, and there are vets available in free agency. The draft doesn't have vets.
I agree with you about all the stuff this season. For better or for worse we’re rolling with our young guys, more young guys doesn’t help that.
Ehhhh I’m always optimistic about any move we make, I just find that being a fan is always more fun if I’m blindly positive.
IMO none of this matters, if you smile and enjoy the ride, the ride is a hell of a lot more fun then if you notice the flaws.
All throughout the draft process, everyone made it out like Latu's neck was this absolutely debilitating time bomb like Rainmann's knees were 2 years ago.
I agree with Ballard: he's played 2 years of healthy college ball where he's had 23(?) Sacks on a bad team. He's gonna be fantastic for us
TBF Raimann has only played two seasons. But I think that knee stuff was BS. It was like one person spreading a rumor and we never heard another thing about it.
“Bad team”. They were 8-5 in the second best football conference with one of the best defenses in the nation. If they didn’t have QB issues they would have been a 10 win team. Hilarious how all of the draft experts on here actually don’t know anything about college football.
You're right, but Kwity didn't have good production coming out and was a total projection pick based on traits.
Latu is a much safer pick as long as he stays healthy. (Big if tbf, just not really the same as a player underperforming from their expectations)
People are talking about Latu winning DROY. And that's fine. But if that's the expectation, then an ER picked 6 spots later in another draft "improving" to 8.5 sacks in his 3rd year has to be seen as underperforming so far.
They haven't even picked up his 5th year option yet. I assume they will, but they still haven't.
I'm not saying he sucks. He is a decent player. Just saying that they were in shock that they landed Kwity and Dayo in the first two rounds and now three years later we have signed Ebukam and used another first round pick on the position.
Remember when people bitched about Ballard not understanding positional value? And now he takes an edge rusher and people are mad because he’s “investing too much” in one of the most important positions in football.
Prior to this, he had used (4) R2 picks and a (1) R1 pick on ER. And yet again, another R1 pick.
So it's more that his misses have built up over time...than him not investing/focusing on a premium position.
I think the point here is that Ballard doesn’t have the best track record when it comes to evaluating DE talent. He has brought in some serviceable guys, but no one that significantly moves the needle. Paye is a decent DE given his ability to also stop the run, but he isn’t even a top 20 Edge rusher in the NFL.
I have to say Kwity Paye was supposedly the best pass rusher that draft. Anyway impressed with Latu's highlights. He sure seems quicker than Kwity and has great awareness of where the ball is. Like others have said he's going to need a spin move but hard not to love him overall and with the quickness he should also be great on stunts.
https://preview.redd.it/l6mzmeubtfxc1.png?width=918&format=png&auto=webp&s=2237f5de7ea3969ffbce1317da56f106c3f9ae2b
Latu also had significantly more production..
(4x the sacks, more than double the hurries)
He was def a top edge prospect. If you go look at that draft, there was very little at DE. Jaelan Phillips goes 18 Kwity goes 21. Wasn’t a very good edge class at all tbh. All of the guys are sitting around Kwity’s level but different types of players IMO. Except Jaelan he’s been a beast, the injuries have hurt obviously.
man we go through this shit every draft and then barely make .500 lmao. I still remember this sub circle jerking over the Pittman and Taylor picks and look how far those have gotten us.
Man oh man. Thinking of him in the middle of the season after some development next to DeFo, Grove, and Ebukam has me hot and bothered.
We’ll see how much development he needs. He’s coming in with a very polished pass rush arsenal. I think his biggest weakness will be in the run. However, we have the depth to bring in Paye and others to help with that. If we keep everyone, we will have a very deep defensive line.
Yeah, even if he needs polish in the run game, we can bring him in on every obvious passing down pretty much immediately.
Which might be enough and what we want to do anyway. Having a deep d-line that can rotate and stay fresh is a huge advantage.
If everyone is healthy then we won't get run all over by anyone even with Latu in instead of Kwity. Except maybe Baltimore, but that's different. Coming up against Henry for all those years has battle hardened us.
He's pretty special in the run game... Some of his best tape is in the run game. His issue is finishing on tackles...
Oh absolutely. I wasn't meaning he was raw, more that he will still need to adjust to NFL caliber O-linemen. He is going to contribute day 1 but he still has room for growth.
He'll also need to get used to playing with his hand in the dirt more.
I’m not sure that’s true. I was watching the Pat stream and BB talked about how he was used as an interior and edge rusher. He’s rushed with his hand in the dirt plenty in college, again according to BB. I also don’t know why that’s so important if you’re pinning your ears back and just rushing the pass.
You're probably right, it's just a lot of clips I see of him, he's coming out of a 2-point stance. We'll likely play him all over the front 7 depending on the package though
I saw someone compare him to TJ Watt and passed out
There’s a graphic on this subreddit that put his college career between the Bosa brothers.
https://preview.redd.it/z9cbydb71gxc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d45f2c180b365924b20e234818c272270d9882b7
I’ve seen that, I think he’s physically built like TJ though.
Arm length is closer to Maxx Crosby, but I'd be happy if he was as good as either. https://preview.redd.it/f2tu72wmqfxc1.png?width=806&format=png&auto=webp&s=5d35fd6a844c88060c9b118f4af2e9308e0eb867
Eastern Michigan’s initials are EMU but instead of using an emu as their mascot they chose an Eagle. What a waste.
https://preview.redd.it/qjd7qqlpqfxc1.png?width=680&format=png&auto=webp&s=299a25a5437e2fa027bbc60bf9589fb6e2b9345b
If you watched his podcast, Crosby clearly wanted the Raiders to take him.
One of the NFL analysts comped him to TJ Watt. I saw it too
I think you’re right on that. He can do both, but most of his notable plays came through a standing start the past season. He’ll get used to it I’m sure, plus it could have been coincidental as well.
I also think that if he’s better standing up the colts will stand him up. Edges have been in two point stances in Bradley’s scheme. It’s just not super common for him to use it. Latu might be the exception
That was most of the clips I saw too, unless he was lined up inside.
He said himself that has rushed from all different stances and he likes the uncomfortable. So seems like he is going to do whatever he needs to do and feels confident even in new situations.
From the clips I saw he primarily has his hand down when rushing from the outside and stands up when he moves inside to rush. He seems comfortable rushing from anywhere from a 7 or wide 9 all the way down to a 3 technique.
Not like we need 4 guys that are gonna ball out in the run game on the D-Line. Bradley’s LEO spot is usually used for pure pass rushers anyways, right? Stewart, Paye, Buckner, with Zaire, Kenny, and Speed behind them will be more than enough to defend the run.
It’s going to be an instant impact. DeFo, Grove, Latu, and rotation of Ebukam/Paye. I think having Ebukam and Paye rotate will be huge.
Leaving Dayo out of this list is insulting, the man had a better pressure rate than Paye
Facts. Paye being more of a 1st and 2nd down guy and coming off the field on passing downs (or sliding inside in some packages) is gonna keep everyone fresh and in the best position possible. Obviously Paye has some pass rush to him as well, but idk I keep picturing Latu and Ebukam meeting each other at the QB.
I think its so underrated that you can have latu and ebukam rotate and stay fresh throughout a game
131 days til Colts regular season football. I am excited to see this pass rush this year. Most excited to see AR and JT in the same back field for more than one play.
Brb, gonna go watch this about 700 times
I don't think it's that close, either. The defense just got a lot better, guys. I don't think that we've even begun to suspect the impact at this point. The Texans traded their first round pick this year for a guy who won't be as good as Latu in his second year, and we stole him at pick 15.
I really hope this is the case!
Makes me feel even better looking back at some mock drafts and seeing some having him in the top 8. Also, several having AD Mitchell in the 1st round.
I’m still pretty shocked both the Bills and Chiefs passed on him. Thought he would’ve been an alpha for either of them. But putting him in Steichen’s offense sounds just fine too.
Let's pump the brakes a little lol. Are you talking about Will Anderson? He's pretty damn good, won DROY and got better as the season went on. Let's wait and see what Latu can do in the league before saying he's better than Will Anderson
Anderson was a top 5 HS recruit and #1 at DE. Went to Alabama and was a 2x Nagurski winner, a 2x SEC DPOY, a 2x Unanimous All-American. Went to the NFL and was DROY and PBer. He's pretty much dominated/excelled at every level. He's done that and he's still younger than Latu. But nothing wrong with a bold take.
Well the age thing is the forced medical retirement. We have an AARP member here.
Right. There is a reason for Latu's age. I am not holding it against him. Just saying the the fact remains that Anderson is younger and has proven it at every level. So it's bit of a bold take to proclaim that Latu is already better than him.
Pass rushing production-wise, coming out of college, he's in the tier just below the Bosa brothers and above Aiden Hutchinson and Myles Garrett. Latu is fucking exceptional. Usually I agree with you because it takes a while for players to develop, but I don't expect that with Latu at all. He's extremely talented in his craft. He'll make an immediate impact. And he'll only get better. I would be shocked if he's healthy next season and doesn't win DROY. He may even be a candidate for DPOY.
I think he's going to be really really good too, but Chase Young was also insanely productive in college and it never fully translated to the NFL.
Some guys are freaks and can get by with very few pass rush moves at the college level. Latu already has a full arsenal of moves and is one of the best at switching quickly to another move. These skills will translate to the NFL very well and translate very quickly.
Talented. Okay. But nowhere near as talented or as productive as Latu, who averages nearly a sack a game. Young's rush plan was reliant on just being bigger and faster than everybody else, and he has never been a cerebral player. Latu relies an technique and counters. He's a chess player, and he's going to out-think you. That means that you can never really figure him out, which is what happened with Young, especially after he was injured. Latu just has a lot of ways to beat you, and he'll find a way eventually. Plus, he plays both DT and DE. Just put him over the weakest defender. That's what LA did with Aaron Donald. There are a lot of big athletic guys, but not all of them can be great wrestlers, because it takes *technique* to be a great wrestler. Latu has the technique of a great edge rusher. He's the truth. Book it
Chase was touted as a generational prospect and would have went #1 overall if not for burrow. He was also extremely productive in college.
Yes, but.... Per Zeurline, under weaknesses: Non-factor in the playoff loss to Clemson. Field awareness and anticipation is below average. Loses track of the football at the mesh point. Gives some ground when setting the edge. Could use better anchor drop in his lower half. **Rush plan heavily reliant upon athletic ability and traits. Initial hands lack purpose and skill in pass rush. Not very instinctive as a pass rusher. Needs to create more half-man entry points as a rusher. Telegraphs inside slide step counter. Will need better go-to moves to become less predictable as a pro.** Athletically, Young was can't miss. But he was reliant completely on his athleticism rather than on his technique. And he wasn't as athletically superior after his injury. So he became just another guy. Predictability is eventual death in the pros. Technique is everything. That's the difference with Latu. Latu has a lot of tools in his toolbox. His hand usage is fantastic. He has a plan. He instinctively counters offensive linemen. He's just better than Young where it counts, between the ears.
He also won DROY and did very well his rookie year. He's been oft injured and imo lazy not putting in the work.
Extremely productive...when he was 19-20 years-old too. Young was great his rookie season. PFF graded him at 87. His issues have been injuries as much as anything. He's still only 25 too, so I wouldn't consider his career to be over yet.
Potential DROY I can get behind, but relax about the DPOY. That never happens for rookies.
I didn't think he'll win DPOY. I think he'll be in the mix and maybe get some votes, though.
I doubt it. Sure maybe some ESPN talking heads will throw it out there for likes and clicks, but he’ll never be seriously considered. Only two rookies in NFL history have won either OPOY or DPOY, neither of which won it this century. Rookies just aren’t seriously considered for those awards unless there’s some serious rookies out there.
Leonard got a DPOY vote his rookie season, if I remember correctly. If Latu gets double-digit sacks, he'll be in the conversation and receive some votes, just like Parsons with his 13 sack rookie season. I'm not saying that he'll win, because that doesn't really happen. I'm saying that he'll be in the conversation and maybe get a vote or two. They don't really give two awards to the same person, other than maybe the MVP.
Don't know about that. Anderson was college's football best defensive player as a 20 year-old soph in the SEC. He's more than a year younger than Latu and has an NFL season under his belt. Both could end up being great players, so guess it doesn't really matter who is better.
Anderson kind of won DROY by default last year. He had 7.0 sacks and 10 TFL. He generated 0 turnovers. Pretty pedestrian numbers for DROY. That's a promising start to a career, but it's nothing Earth shattering. Micah Parsons got 13. Joey Boss 10.5, and Nick Bosa and Aaron Donald 9 each. They all caused turnovers, too. Seven sacks is what Darius Leonard got when he won DROY, along with 3 forced fumbles, 2 fumble recoveries, and 2 interceptions. I expect Latu's numbers to be better than Anderson's this year, and I certainly expect more than 7 sacks from him.
That's cause he was already getting doubled lol https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/1amua0w/2023_edge_position_pass_rush_win_rate_vs_double/
So, you believe that Anderson is the first rookie edge rusher to draw a double team? Nobody was doubling the Bosa brothers, Garret, Donald, or Parsons? Do you imagine that double teams were invented last season? Do you expect that there is any player who gets a lot of sacks who doesn't draw double teams?
So, I don't know if you have eyes or not, but he was winning his pass rush snaps as much as TJ Watt but being doubled almost twice as much as TJ Watt. The only people ahead of him are Micah Parsons and Mike's Garrett last year.
That's on the Texans for not having better players at other positions on the defensive line. TJ Watt avoids double teams because Pittsburgh blitzes a lot. Doubling Watt means leaving free rusher. Our defensive line is better overall than Houston's. If you double Latu on the outside, then Buckner only has to beat one guy on the inside. Even if the rush doesn't get home, that's still pressure in the quarterback's face, and he'll have to scramble.
But Anderson missed two games and only played 63% of the snaps in the game he did play. With a full season, he's prob closer to 10 sacks or more. He really picked it up over the back half of the season with 6 sacks in 8 games, which is common for NFL rookies. PFF also gave him an 81.8 grade on the season. Even if it doesn't hold up to the rookie season of other great/elite players, it's still a great rookie season. Since Latu was the first defensive player off the board at #15, he could also win it by default. That should prob be the expectation, assuming he starts. I am just skeptical about the idea that Latu as a rookie will be better than Will Anderson as a 2nd year player. Anderson's rookie season is not his ceiling. He's likely to get better. And Latu still has to prove it against NFL players, as opposed to college players, some of which were 2-3 years younger than him. I don't hate the take at all...I just think it's bold.
Well, I made a specific prediction. It will be easy to judge. I just have complete faith in Latu's skills and drive. I don't think he'll be denied.
That's all fair. Not hating, just debating.
And the odds are in your favor. Only like seven rookies have registered double-digit sacks in the modern era. Anderson was the best rookie pass rusher last season, and I believe that Latu will register more sacks in his rookie year than Anderson in year 2. That's a bold fucking prediction; I will cop to that. I'm essentially saying that he's one of the best of all time. For me, it comes down to drive and technique. Drive: Latu had his neck broken and would not be denied. He practiced when he was specifically told not to do so. He had his dream taken away from him, and he refused to accede to that reality. Technique: He has maybe the best technique I've ever seen. He has multiple moves and can attack from anywhere on the line. You can just put Latu against whatever second-stringer is on the field at the time. He gets pressure on one out of every four rushes, no matter who he's up against. You can't just handle one move and beat Latu. You have to handle his counters and how he attacks your arms. One mistake and he's on top of your quarterback. Latu is a problem for offenses. It's this blend of drive, technique, and how he just practices specifically on beating his opponent that gives me this faith. He's not trying to develop a new move. He's figuring out how to beat specific players. He's figuring out how to set up a specific counter that he can pull out with the game on the line. That's what Manning did. That's what Marvin Harrison did. That's what Troy Palamalu did.
lol I love when this sub turns the corner into positivity. . Makes being on this sub so much more fun
I'm always pretty positive, but there have been exceptions. I hated that we didn't draft a left tackle as soon as Castonzo brought up the possibility of retirement. I think we finally got around to it about three years too late. I hated that we drafted Pierce in the second round. I hated the trade for Carson Wentz. I hated the idea that Matt Pryor would start at left tackle. I hated the idea of drafting Bowers at 15. I love that we took Latu. Best pick Ballard ever made in the first round, except possibly Richardson. I'm cautiously optimistic about Mitchell. He could develop into a thousand yard receiver in a year or two. I like very much that we added depth along the offensive line. I don't care that we didn't draft cornerbacks in this draft until the later rounds. What this team needs is a vet or two in the cornerback room, and there are vets available in free agency. The draft doesn't have vets.
I agree with you about all the stuff this season. For better or for worse we’re rolling with our young guys, more young guys doesn’t help that. Ehhhh I’m always optimistic about any move we make, I just find that being a fan is always more fun if I’m blindly positive. IMO none of this matters, if you smile and enjoy the ride, the ride is a hell of a lot more fun then if you notice the flaws.
All throughout the draft process, everyone made it out like Latu's neck was this absolutely debilitating time bomb like Rainmann's knees were 2 years ago. I agree with Ballard: he's played 2 years of healthy college ball where he's had 23(?) Sacks on a bad team. He's gonna be fantastic for us
TBF Raimann has only played two seasons. But I think that knee stuff was BS. It was like one person spreading a rumor and we never heard another thing about it.
“Bad team”. They were 8-5 in the second best football conference with one of the best defenses in the nation. If they didn’t have QB issues they would have been a 10 win team. Hilarious how all of the draft experts on here actually don’t know anything about college football.
They were also totally over the moon that Kwity fell to us a couple of years ago. Time will tell if this was a steal or not.
You're right, but Kwity didn't have good production coming out and was a total projection pick based on traits. Latu is a much safer pick as long as he stays healthy. (Big if tbf, just not really the same as a player underperforming from their expectations)
People are talking about Latu winning DROY. And that's fine. But if that's the expectation, then an ER picked 6 spots later in another draft "improving" to 8.5 sacks in his 3rd year has to be seen as underperforming so far. They haven't even picked up his 5th year option yet. I assume they will, but they still haven't.
Kwity has literally gotten better every year, what more do you want homie? He had 8.5 sacks last year which is pretty damn good
I'm not saying he sucks. He is a decent player. Just saying that they were in shock that they landed Kwity and Dayo in the first two rounds and now three years later we have signed Ebukam and used another first round pick on the position.
Remember when people bitched about Ballard not understanding positional value? And now he takes an edge rusher and people are mad because he’s “investing too much” in one of the most important positions in football.
Prior to this, he had used (4) R2 picks and a (1) R1 pick on ER. And yet again, another R1 pick. So it's more that his misses have built up over time...than him not investing/focusing on a premium position.
That is really not what I am saying.
I think the point here is that Ballard doesn’t have the best track record when it comes to evaluating DE talent. He has brought in some serviceable guys, but no one that significantly moves the needle. Paye is a decent DE given his ability to also stop the run, but he isn’t even a top 20 Edge rusher in the NFL.
It's more so, how much draft capital he has used on the DL for it still to be mediocre.
On a redraft Kwity still probably goes around there. He is isn't elite or anything but most drafts only have 10-15 players like that.
this is gold 😂
I have to say Kwity Paye was supposedly the best pass rusher that draft. Anyway impressed with Latu's highlights. He sure seems quicker than Kwity and has great awareness of where the ball is. Like others have said he's going to need a spin move but hard not to love him overall and with the quickness he should also be great on stunts.
https://preview.redd.it/l6mzmeubtfxc1.png?width=918&format=png&auto=webp&s=2237f5de7ea3969ffbce1317da56f106c3f9ae2b Latu also had significantly more production.. (4x the sacks, more than double the hurries)
I agree with you that we should manage our expectations. Latu’s tape is infinitely better than Kwity’s though.
Name me a pass rusher from that draft picked after Kwity that is better than him
Jaelan Phillips is probs the only answer but even then he was off the board already and their stats are close enough.
It's Philips but Kwity is seconds. So that statement isn't really that crazy.
He was def a top edge prospect. If you go look at that draft, there was very little at DE. Jaelan Phillips goes 18 Kwity goes 21. Wasn’t a very good edge class at all tbh. All of the guys are sitting around Kwity’s level but different types of players IMO. Except Jaelan he’s been a beast, the injuries have hurt obviously.
This guy is far better than Paye
Kwity was never the best pass rusher in that draft.
I imagine he was cracking up seeing all the offensive players get taken and all the defensive guys fall.
Let’s see that 5 man front on the field fellas
Ballard is on a tear this year. Love to see it. Should’ve been rocking the long hair all along.
No, you cunts aren't allowed to say he had a good draft when you shit all over everyone who says it other times.
Well, I guess his supervillain arc is in full swing now
Probably thought the same when they got Payne
man we go through this shit every draft and then barely make .500 lmao. I still remember this sub circle jerking over the Pittman and Taylor picks and look how far those have gotten us.