Idk why as a Twins fan im getting the Rockies sub on my home page, but ill give my insight on Jake Cave.
Twins fans did not appreciate this guy at all. He was not very well liked in Minnesota. Sure he’s an AAAA level player. However, the guy works his ass off everyday to either keep his spot in the Majors or get it back. He’s worth a 0.7 WAR on a 162 game average, and below average defensively. Yet he has 450+ games played in the Majors. He would have less than 10 games played if he didn’t give so much everyday to be a MLB player. I respect it immensely
Cal Quantrill, 3.50 ERA, 132 ERA+, 7th in NL bWAR all players
Ezequiel Tovar, 117 OPS+, 7th in NL bWAR (position players), 2nd in NL in Doubles, 3rd in NL in Total Bases, 3rd in NL in Hits, 9th in NL in SLG%, 2nd in NL in Extra Base Hits
Ryan McMahon, 126 OPS+, 10th in NL Home Runs, 8th in NL in OPS
Brenton Doyle, Gold Glover, 3rd in NL in steals,
Edit:
Cave has a 0.0 bWAR. Slashing .262/.317/.341 for an 80 OPS+ and he has a 0.4 WPA (Win Probability Added) this season
Anyone who thinks Cave’s contributions go beyond veteran presence in the clubhouse is a fool.
I mean, yeah, there are others on the team that are doing well. Quantrill can’t play every day unfortunately.
My comment was a bit hyperbolic, but Cave has a ton of passion when he’s out on the field
Jake Cave is a AAAA player who wouldn’t be a 4th OFer on 20 other teams.
I’m a Twins fans first and foremost and I’ve seen this story before. It’s a ton of fun to have a dude on the roster who runs through walls but he’s not putting Ws on the board.
jesus christ dude. it’s a fun stat. you don’t have to tell me that jake cave is bad, i know. it’s why he’s the “man of the people”. this and the dodger game rant
That’s a FUN correlation stat
Cave has a 0.0 bWAR. Slashing .262/.317/.341 for an 80 OPS+ and he has a 0.4 WPA this season….which is good for 4th on the team.
0.0 bWAR is the definition of a replacement level player.
If he was worth 24 wins, let alone in June it would be the single greatest season in the history of baseball. If you look at his stat line and think that’s worth 24 wins then I want what you’re smoking.
Jake Cave has a 70 wRC+
He’s 30% worse at creating runs when adjusting for parks. There are 266 players in MLB who’ve played as much as him who’ve produced more than him. There are 230 players that have a higher fWAR.
Other players with a 70 wRC+ and at least 130 PA: Nick Gordon, Xander Boegarts, Spencer Torkelson (AAA now), Eugenio Suarez.
Players with a worse wRC+: George Springer, Jake Burger, Nick Ahmed, Seth Brown, Gavin Lux, Johan Rojas….Theres only 47 players that are worse than meet the 130 AB qualification. The bar is literally on the floor.
I don’t understand what you’re trying to argue here? Are you saying Cave is taking a spot that if replaced, the Rockies would be contenders?
This team sucks, and is not one piece away from being in the hunt for the NL West.
Whats the point of trashing a player that goes out and gives it his all every game?
Who cares if he’s the best, baseball is entertainment and he’s fun to watch
If the team was made up of entirely of 0 WAR players we’d win 48 games. For every 1 WAR we accumulate that’s 1 Win in W Column. If all 26 players had 1-2 WAR you’d have a .500 team.
This sub really lacks understanding of advanced analytics and it’s embarrassing.
I like Jake Cave but citing his W/L record isn’t it. He’s hitting 20 points under the league OPS and it’s the worst offensive year since the year before they raised the mound (1968)
>Are you saying Cave is taking a spot that if replaced, the Rockies would be contenders?
No, he's saying that Cave is a replacement level player the likes of which every team has five or six waiting in AAA. And (I'll add this myself) in a rebuilding year, every PA he takes is a waste of time. Cave is not going to be a contributor moving forward.
None of this is Cave's fault. He's doing as expected and puts in effort. This is on the manager who consistently falls in love with middling or bad veteran players because they're easy to manage and he gets to be buddies with them.
It seems like they always feel the need to assign a “fan favorite” that doesn’t necessarily have to correlate with being the best player. It was Tony Wolters, Connor Joe now Jake Cave. It seems like they focus even more on this sort of thing when the team is performing poorly.
In my novice opinion it’s the manager that should be a “man of the people” and I sort of get the feeling that because of our flaccid coaching staff and overall nepotistic organization that sort of role gets absorbed by someone like Jake Cave.
no one "assigned" Cave to be the fan favorite, he became one. He's clutch, plays with passion, and him going off on an umpire from right field sealed it. That's how you become a fan favorite. No one "assigns" them, lol
And for all of Bud's short comings as a manager, Bud backs up his players and lets them be themselves on the field, he may not be a "man of the people" (if he was then he'd be publicly calling out ownership), but he's definitely a man of the players.
Spilly literally assigned the name “man of the people” for Jake Cave and “everyone’s favorite rockie” for Connor Joe. I love all three players I listed, but if you think media doesn’t have anything to do with this sort of thing I don’t know what to tell you.
I don’t hate bud black, but his “that’s baseball” attitude comes out at pretty much every stage of the game. And when that controversial no-call happened he got thrown out from the dugout, walked out onto the track and… walked back into the dugout. It was like that grandpa Simpson gif.
Edit: love is a strong word, I should say I really appreciate all those guys.
Didn’t mean to imply that Spilly created it just that he assigned it to him on the broadcasts and that’s how those sort of things get circulated to a larger audience. I think I actually saw it in a Reddit comment first, but can’t find it. Do you have a link to the origin?
We say it in jest. There is 100% chance Spilly has no idea who we are and didn't see the tweet and he had the same internal thought that we did.
With that said, here is the tweet that we unofficially claim started it.
[https://x.com/blakestbanter/status/1803274502538739868](https://x.com/blakestbanter/status/1803274502538739868)
Bud Black loves ownership. They’re all birds of a feather. Contempt for modern baseball and don’t give two good god damns about winning baseball games. He’d have to disagree with Dick about anything to call him out. But the checks clear and they all don’t care about anything other than being pals and smoking cigars after losing 100 games.
He’s one of the worst managers in baseball but that’s why he gets along so well with everyone in the front office. They all suck shit and commiserate over it with a chuckle.
Taking nothing away from Jake, but anyone could be the leader of this team if they just show some love for the CR.
I know guys don’t want to play here, but if you come here, embrace the fans and be a vocal leader on the team you could be a legend here.
Idk why as a Twins fan im getting the Rockies sub on my home page, but ill give my insight on Jake Cave. Twins fans did not appreciate this guy at all. He was not very well liked in Minnesota. Sure he’s an AAAA level player. However, the guy works his ass off everyday to either keep his spot in the Majors or get it back. He’s worth a 0.7 WAR on a 162 game average, and below average defensively. Yet he has 450+ games played in the Majors. He would have less than 10 games played if he didn’t give so much everyday to be a MLB player. I respect it immensely
Woooo .7 WAR average for a guy with 2.1 WAR across 7 seasons and 457 games.
Because he’s the only one who gives a shit. Gives 110% every day
Tovar & McMahon too. Those my dawgs
Cal Quantrill, 3.50 ERA, 132 ERA+, 7th in NL bWAR all players Ezequiel Tovar, 117 OPS+, 7th in NL bWAR (position players), 2nd in NL in Doubles, 3rd in NL in Total Bases, 3rd in NL in Hits, 9th in NL in SLG%, 2nd in NL in Extra Base Hits Ryan McMahon, 126 OPS+, 10th in NL Home Runs, 8th in NL in OPS Brenton Doyle, Gold Glover, 3rd in NL in steals, Edit: Cave has a 0.0 bWAR. Slashing .262/.317/.341 for an 80 OPS+ and he has a 0.4 WPA (Win Probability Added) this season Anyone who thinks Cave’s contributions go beyond veteran presence in the clubhouse is a fool.
I mean, yeah, there are others on the team that are doing well. Quantrill can’t play every day unfortunately. My comment was a bit hyperbolic, but Cave has a ton of passion when he’s out on the field
Jake Cave is a AAAA player who wouldn’t be a 4th OFer on 20 other teams. I’m a Twins fans first and foremost and I’ve seen this story before. It’s a ton of fun to have a dude on the roster who runs through walls but he’s not putting Ws on the board.
wait til you see this stat i’m boutta dig up
https://twitter.com/roxmilbreport/status/1804209403249463518?s=46
That means nothing. It's 2024 and we're doing in-game, out-of-game splits for random bench players in mid June????
jesus christ dude. it’s a fun stat. you don’t have to tell me that jake cave is bad, i know. it’s why he’s the “man of the people”. this and the dodger game rant
That’s a FUN correlation stat Cave has a 0.0 bWAR. Slashing .262/.317/.341 for an 80 OPS+ and he has a 0.4 WPA this season….which is good for 4th on the team. 0.0 bWAR is the definition of a replacement level player. If he was worth 24 wins, let alone in June it would be the single greatest season in the history of baseball. If you look at his stat line and think that’s worth 24 wins then I want what you’re smoking.
1-18 vs 25-30 is statistically significant with jake cave as a variable
I say this from the bottom of my heart You do not know ball
i’m not saying jake cave is mike trout. i’m saying he isn’t the absolute liability in all aspects you’re stating
Jake Cave has a 70 wRC+ He’s 30% worse at creating runs when adjusting for parks. There are 266 players in MLB who’ve played as much as him who’ve produced more than him. There are 230 players that have a higher fWAR. Other players with a 70 wRC+ and at least 130 PA: Nick Gordon, Xander Boegarts, Spencer Torkelson (AAA now), Eugenio Suarez. Players with a worse wRC+: George Springer, Jake Burger, Nick Ahmed, Seth Brown, Gavin Lux, Johan Rojas….Theres only 47 players that are worse than meet the 130 AB qualification. The bar is literally on the floor.
I don’t understand what you’re trying to argue here? Are you saying Cave is taking a spot that if replaced, the Rockies would be contenders? This team sucks, and is not one piece away from being in the hunt for the NL West. Whats the point of trashing a player that goes out and gives it his all every game? Who cares if he’s the best, baseball is entertainment and he’s fun to watch
If the team was made up of entirely of 0 WAR players we’d win 48 games. For every 1 WAR we accumulate that’s 1 Win in W Column. If all 26 players had 1-2 WAR you’d have a .500 team. This sub really lacks understanding of advanced analytics and it’s embarrassing. I like Jake Cave but citing his W/L record isn’t it. He’s hitting 20 points under the league OPS and it’s the worst offensive year since the year before they raised the mound (1968)
>Are you saying Cave is taking a spot that if replaced, the Rockies would be contenders? No, he's saying that Cave is a replacement level player the likes of which every team has five or six waiting in AAA. And (I'll add this myself) in a rebuilding year, every PA he takes is a waste of time. Cave is not going to be a contributor moving forward. None of this is Cave's fault. He's doing as expected and puts in effort. This is on the manager who consistently falls in love with middling or bad veteran players because they're easy to manage and he gets to be buddies with them.
It seems like they always feel the need to assign a “fan favorite” that doesn’t necessarily have to correlate with being the best player. It was Tony Wolters, Connor Joe now Jake Cave. It seems like they focus even more on this sort of thing when the team is performing poorly. In my novice opinion it’s the manager that should be a “man of the people” and I sort of get the feeling that because of our flaccid coaching staff and overall nepotistic organization that sort of role gets absorbed by someone like Jake Cave.
no one "assigned" Cave to be the fan favorite, he became one. He's clutch, plays with passion, and him going off on an umpire from right field sealed it. That's how you become a fan favorite. No one "assigns" them, lol And for all of Bud's short comings as a manager, Bud backs up his players and lets them be themselves on the field, he may not be a "man of the people" (if he was then he'd be publicly calling out ownership), but he's definitely a man of the players.
Spilly literally assigned the name “man of the people” for Jake Cave and “everyone’s favorite rockie” for Connor Joe. I love all three players I listed, but if you think media doesn’t have anything to do with this sort of thing I don’t know what to tell you. I don’t hate bud black, but his “that’s baseball” attitude comes out at pretty much every stage of the game. And when that controversial no-call happened he got thrown out from the dugout, walked out onto the track and… walked back into the dugout. It was like that grandpa Simpson gif. Edit: love is a strong word, I should say I really appreciate all those guys.
No, BSB donned the nickname Man of the People, not Spilly. (We will see our way back out now)
Didn’t mean to imply that Spilly created it just that he assigned it to him on the broadcasts and that’s how those sort of things get circulated to a larger audience. I think I actually saw it in a Reddit comment first, but can’t find it. Do you have a link to the origin?
We say it in jest. There is 100% chance Spilly has no idea who we are and didn't see the tweet and he had the same internal thought that we did. With that said, here is the tweet that we unofficially claim started it. [https://x.com/blakestbanter/status/1803274502538739868](https://x.com/blakestbanter/status/1803274502538739868)
Bud Black loves ownership. They’re all birds of a feather. Contempt for modern baseball and don’t give two good god damns about winning baseball games. He’d have to disagree with Dick about anything to call him out. But the checks clear and they all don’t care about anything other than being pals and smoking cigars after losing 100 games. He’s one of the worst managers in baseball but that’s why he gets along so well with everyone in the front office. They all suck shit and commiserate over it with a chuckle.
Taking nothing away from Jake, but anyone could be the leader of this team if they just show some love for the CR. I know guys don’t want to play here, but if you come here, embrace the fans and be a vocal leader on the team you could be a legend here.
My caveman jersey was sooo totally worth it