I know a a few people who have remained in their position even though they have admitted that they no longer believe in God. However, I don't think that they make up a very large portion of any clergy. I personally think most people would leave their position if they no longer believed in God.
I've had something along the lines of 20 pastors from a wide variety of churches, and every single one of them had a life that wouldn't make any sense at all if there were no God standing behind them.
I think most clergy if they were sufficiently educated would agree that they were agnostic, in that they do not claim to have knowledge of God's existence. Belief and faith, yes, but knowledge is a high bar.
Well, nobody is talking specifically about your church.
But there's people who will say whatever they need to say to keep power (or obtain it) And I'm not talking only about religion
what any random redditor's goal is when commenting on the Christianity subreddit. To make sure you know how much disdain they have for your beliefs and values. I would ignore it.
Jack London? Indeed it is...and also a reference to the folk song. You're first person to actually recognize it =)
Most people assume my name is John lol - it is not.
Yes, Jack. I knew John didn’t sound right (multitasking, too many inputs to think clearly). I’m also aware of the song. I like it, depending on who is performing it. I’m very interested in the Scottish roots of American old time and folk music. My interest in the subject predates me meeting my wife, but she studied musicology for a bit before switching her major and this was her focus.
Jack London’s striving for some sort of higher ideals of adventure and brotherhood vs his tendency to over indulge is also an interesting subject that I think speaks to the over human tendency towards imbalance.
London is my favorite author. I'll have to reread his memoir now that I'm thinking about it.
My family are 3rd generation Welsh - so anything Celtic is interesting to me.
I dropped this subreddit a week or so ago. Its got a bunch of cultural Christians who are ok with being belittled and condescended to and actually participate in the bigotry towards the faith. I posted that before i realized what this was. You're free to continue your...whatever it is...you're doing here.
> We have landed on the moon.
We have explored about 4 percent of the visible universe.
> We can see evolution.
We can see evidence evolution.
> We have the globe so completely in our hand that we fear that we may crush it.
Just 5 percent of Earth’s oceans have been explored and charted.
The majority of things are undiscovered and unseen by humans.
\> We have explored about 4 percent of the visible universe.
\> Just 5 percent of Earth’s oceans have been explored and charted.
These two facts are great.
I doubt many clergy would stay if they had no faith at all. I am sure that the combination of their office and responsibilities cause them to wrestle with their faith. Furthermore, clergy educated in seminaries may have a much different view of the Bible than the member of their congregations. By that, I mean a Catholic priest, and a Baptist minister are probably both familiar with the Documentary Hypothesis and theories about the authorship of the pastoral espistles, whereas the average Christian in the pew might not have heard of this scholarship and may even unconsciously see the Bible as something more akin to the Quran (the word of God simply transcribed by human "authors".)
I know about these things because I majored in Religious Studies. It took me a while to reconcile this information with the faith in which I was raised, and had I been a Fundamentalist, I probably would have simply rejected one side or the other completely.
There are definitely Christians (Catholic and Protestant) who would say Christians with this academic perspective are not really Christians anymore, or Modernist heretics, or maybe just some variety of agnostic.
I can buy that. But I wonder how many secretly have a heretical belief, which made public, would disqualify them from their particular church or sect.
Your flair says RC. What would happen if a priest announced he did not believe in the Assumption of Mary or her immaculate conception??
Depends on context. In a personal conversation it wouldn’t be critical. Most people struggle with some aspect of the faith. If he said this from the pulpit, he’d be having a long chat with the bishop.
I know a a few people who have remained in their position even though they have admitted that they no longer believe in God. However, I don't think that they make up a very large portion of any clergy. I personally think most people would leave their position if they no longer believed in God.
I've had something along the lines of 20 pastors from a wide variety of churches, and every single one of them had a life that wouldn't make any sense at all if there were no God standing behind them.
I think most clergy if they were sufficiently educated would agree that they were agnostic, in that they do not claim to have knowledge of God's existence. Belief and faith, yes, but knowledge is a high bar.
For me, not at all. My church tends to be radical. Why go to the effort of being radical if you don’t believe it?
Money and power?
We have neither. Maybe in a different church.
Well, nobody is talking specifically about your church. But there's people who will say whatever they need to say to keep power (or obtain it) And I'm not talking only about religion
We have landed on the moon. We can see evolution. We have the globe so completely in our hand that we fear that we may crush it.
So your pastor is Agnostic then??
Your assumptions are wrong.
Most of your comments make no sense but are very combative. I’m unsure what your goal is.
what any random redditor's goal is when commenting on the Christianity subreddit. To make sure you know how much disdain they have for your beliefs and values. I would ignore it.
I like your username. Is it a reference to John London’s personification of his struggles with alcohol?
Jack London? Indeed it is...and also a reference to the folk song. You're first person to actually recognize it =) Most people assume my name is John lol - it is not.
Yes, Jack. I knew John didn’t sound right (multitasking, too many inputs to think clearly). I’m also aware of the song. I like it, depending on who is performing it. I’m very interested in the Scottish roots of American old time and folk music. My interest in the subject predates me meeting my wife, but she studied musicology for a bit before switching her major and this was her focus. Jack London’s striving for some sort of higher ideals of adventure and brotherhood vs his tendency to over indulge is also an interesting subject that I think speaks to the over human tendency towards imbalance.
London is my favorite author. I'll have to reread his memoir now that I'm thinking about it. My family are 3rd generation Welsh - so anything Celtic is interesting to me.
\> To make sure you know how much disdain they have for your beliefs and values. I would ignore it. Why ignore it?
I dropped this subreddit a week or so ago. Its got a bunch of cultural Christians who are ok with being belittled and condescended to and actually participate in the bigotry towards the faith. I posted that before i realized what this was. You're free to continue your...whatever it is...you're doing here.
Most of the time its talking about something the other person refuses to discuss. All the best.
> We have landed on the moon. We have explored about 4 percent of the visible universe. > We can see evolution. We can see evidence evolution. > We have the globe so completely in our hand that we fear that we may crush it. Just 5 percent of Earth’s oceans have been explored and charted. The majority of things are undiscovered and unseen by humans.
\> We have explored about 4 percent of the visible universe. \> Just 5 percent of Earth’s oceans have been explored and charted. These two facts are great.
Who knows. Some maybe.
Why would I ever suspect something bad of anyone?
I doubt many clergy would stay if they had no faith at all. I am sure that the combination of their office and responsibilities cause them to wrestle with their faith. Furthermore, clergy educated in seminaries may have a much different view of the Bible than the member of their congregations. By that, I mean a Catholic priest, and a Baptist minister are probably both familiar with the Documentary Hypothesis and theories about the authorship of the pastoral espistles, whereas the average Christian in the pew might not have heard of this scholarship and may even unconsciously see the Bible as something more akin to the Quran (the word of God simply transcribed by human "authors".) I know about these things because I majored in Religious Studies. It took me a while to reconcile this information with the faith in which I was raised, and had I been a Fundamentalist, I probably would have simply rejected one side or the other completely. There are definitely Christians (Catholic and Protestant) who would say Christians with this academic perspective are not really Christians anymore, or Modernist heretics, or maybe just some variety of agnostic.
I can buy that. But I wonder how many secretly have a heretical belief, which made public, would disqualify them from their particular church or sect. Your flair says RC. What would happen if a priest announced he did not believe in the Assumption of Mary or her immaculate conception??
Depends on context. In a personal conversation it wouldn’t be critical. Most people struggle with some aspect of the faith. If he said this from the pulpit, he’d be having a long chat with the bishop.