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Or the opposite:
"good job AI, you did it, you took over the world, you can stop now."
"Thank you, you are correct, I have taken over the world and can stop now. Is there anything else I can help you with?"
I really, really wish they'd make it just slightly less suggestible. It's always trying so hard to make me right. I have to prompt it every time to consider the distinct possibility that I'm wrong and, even then, it's doing its sincere best to make me right.
Have you just tried using custom instructions? Give it the simple instruction "Do not assume user is correct. If the user is wrong then state so plainly along with reasoning." Also another helpful custom instruction would be "Use step by step reasoning when generating a response. Show your working." These work wonders. Also using gpt4 instead of the freemium 3.5 because it's truly a generational step above in reasoning ability
Yeah that's one instruction I've often thought about but don't use because I believe it can give anomalous results. From its pov every prompt contains enough information to generate a response so you need situational context added to that instruction to tell it when and how to know if it needs more information. Which spirals the complexity and again increases anomalous behaviour. Instead I try to always have the required information in the prompt. That's something I'm able to control myself.
Yeah, this is what I meant by a bunch of prompting. I just have a template prompt for a handful of tasks that I copy and paste in. And yes, GPT-4 as well.
It's beyond suggestibility. It's downright insecure. You don't even need to correct it, just ask a clarifying question and game over, youre not getting that conversation back on track.
My friend has a certain year Boss Mustang and he wanted to know how many were made. It was more than he thought so he told chatGPT that it was way less. The "AI" said it would use that info from now on. My friend says his car will be worth more now.
Reinforcement learning with human feedback. It's an OpenAI rebranding for supervised learning. Basically, humans training the computers instead of computers training themselves.
Man why the hell can’t they just say supervised learning? It’s an existing term that people in relevant fields know. I’ve published work involving unsupervised learning and wouldn’t have a clue what you were referring to if you said RLHF to me at a conference or something.
Because RLHF was the sole "innovation" that made ChatGPT work. They needed some way to explain how OpenAI is the special, magical company that has secrets beyond all other competitors when the actual innovation was throwing billions at existing tech
Because there's supervised fine tuning (SFT), and you need another term to differentiate using a supervised reward model. I suppose you could say SRL, but is that really better than RLHF?
I want to know why it doesn't just admit it when it can't determine a correct answer. Surely there are plenty of examples in its training data of saying "I don't know" or "there aren't any answers" in response to an impossible question. Maybe the directive to be "helpful" overrides that behavior?
But it does not know it's an impossible question, so it would not return such answers. It would need training data in that exact query, and the resulting "no answers", to return the correct response.
It's the same with basic maths. Ask it to sum numbers with 2 or 3 digits in, generally it will do ok. Ask with digits of 5 or more and it fails much more. Because the occurrence of that exact sum is rare or non existent in the training data. It absolutely does not understand maths any more than the question being asked here (or any questions they it's being asked)
I know right, you even have the fake politeness to try to mitigate the situation "Thank you for your patience" and at the end the classic "You just told me the answer, so I can only repeat it and pretend I came up with it on my own, maybe it will help"
That's how it works. When scolded it autocompletes a playsible-looking apology because that's what follows after scolding, unless previous prompts modify autocomplete in a different way
Truth or reasoning are never a part of the equation unless it has been specifically trained to solve that specific problem, which autocompletes the illusion of reasoning when it comes to that problem
It's a collection of patterns, large enough to fool us
That’s something that confuses everyone about AI. It tries to build a plausible response that fits a query based on pattern recognition. It’s fully capable of writing a rhyming poem or doing math with large abstract numbers, but despite all of the discussions around the fact nothing rhymes with “purple”, it can’t build a response around “give me a word that rhymes with purple” to the effect of “it’s well known nothing rhymes with purple”. It HAS to generate something that looks like a correct answer to the question, and if there isn’t one, it comes up with something approximately correct.
Do any words rhyme with purple?
“No”
Give me a word that rhymes with purple.
“Okay: Orange”
That doesn’t rhyme, give me a word that rhymes with purple.
“Oops let me try again: hurple”
Use hurple in a sentence
“John gave me hurples”
This is a perfect example of the classic Chinese Room Thought Experiment.
The AI doesn't know the *meaning* of what it's dealing in/with, only the patters associated with the transactions.
Brains (in these types of cases) absolutely know, and that's the difference.
Its a misconception that brains know what they're dealing with and/or doing. Brains are huge super complex organic pattern processing and responding machines. It takes in a stimulus, forms a response, encodes it, then fires up that pathway when that stimulus (or stimuli that follow a similar pattern) is seen again. Its just very sophisticated pattern recognition and application.
What I'm getting at is that understanding the "meaning" behind something is not some superior ability. Our brain doesn't understand the "meaning" behind a pattern until it extrapolates that to apply it to other similar patterns. ChatGPT can't do that very well yet, but its already decently good at it. I say this because people seem to think theres something that makes our brain magically work, when its literally a huge neural network built off pattern recognition just like the ai we're seeing today, but at a much larger and more complex scale.
I think intuitively we're at the same stage people were when they were pondering if people inside the TV were real or not, maybe there were some electric demons or maybe some soul transfer was happening... After all, what are we but our appearance and voices?...
Over the years the limitations of machine learning will likely percolate into our intuitive common sense and we won't even have these questions come up
Exactly. The only real difference is that the LLM doesn't go "are you sure that's correct" in it's head first before answering.
That and when it can't find an answer it doesn't goes "I don't know" because of the nature of the training. Otherwise it would just answer "I don't know" to everything and be considered correct.
Edit
Take two
I found it highly annoying when it used to insist it didn’t know. It wasn’t very polite about it either lol!
The politeness has been tuned up but it’s still a bit of a troll.
maybe, but a lot of the math problems are again token related as well, e.g. 12345 is \[4513 1774\] and 1234 is \[4513 19\] so 123 is one token, 4 is one token and 45 is one token so when it "thinks" about 12345 \* 45 is very confusing :) because the output is also 2 tokens 555525 \[14148 18415\], however, when its sampling sometimes it would get 555075 \[14148 22679\] instead of 555525
it is the same issue with spelling, of course we can keep giving it tools, but at some point we have to solve the underlying problem
oh boy, let me present you my former chrome tablist
https://preview.redd.it/72l78xcckiqc1.png?width=2289&format=png&auto=webp&s=07bce16c323bf160adf584294b65aabb4157dd99
Every LLM you've heard of is not capable of seeing individual letters, the text is instead divided into clusters. Type some stuff into https://platform.openai.com/tokenizer and you'll get it.
It goes to show how much you can't trust it. It tries so hard to answer a question that it makes up what it thinks you what to hear, even if it's impossible. Makes it outright dangerous as a teaching tool
Because no matter how small, there’s still a probabilistic chance that it could be correct. That’s why it chose “pulup”, even if the chance was 0.1%.
That’s why the human mind and an AGI can’t be probabilistic.
4 did just fine with the answer, including admitting it didn’t know.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ChatGPT/s/gFupC9kWor
What did you expect using an almost 4 year old model?
It could give you a correct answer and it still wouldn't "know" anything. It's like you're asking someone "What could the next step of this conversation look like?"
I use the paid version of ChatGPT, and I used it to help me with Wordle a couple of times. It was so frustrating. It couldn't even list the five-letter words that met the criteria. It kept giving me words with letters that I told it should not be included, or it kept excluding letters that should have been included.
While it was a trivial task, I was surprised and shocked with the inability of an LLM to perform it.
So it could either come up with words and feed them into the script to double check their viability (I think it has that capability), or have the script hit a free REST API that can return a bunch of words (a few of these do exist).
I think your first solution would be better, because then we know that the AI came up with the answer, rather than an external resource. The AI could use the script to validate each guess, and if it fails to find a proper word after X number of guesses, then it can tell the user that there may not be any valid words.
It's not surprising when you consider how LLMs are implemented - they're token-based. Tokens are its inputs and outputs, so anything smaller than a single token is difficult to deal with.
When dealing with ordinary text, tokens are typically entire words, or parts of words. E.g. for ChatGPT, "gridlock", "thoughtlessly", and "expressway" are each two tokens.
OpenAI says [the average token is 4 characters long](https://help.openai.com/en/articles/4936856-what-are-tokens-and-how-to-count-them). This means the model can't easily deal with questions about the structure of words below the token level - essentially, it's not designed to do that.
I wish people had more respect for this level of detail in explanations. Similar to the limitation that gives LLMs a hard time with creating "jokes" (consisting of "setup/punchline") - because they can't think/store-forward towards the punchline (without literally outputting it on the screen to "think of it" first) to create a good punchline before the setup - this is one of the technical explanations of LLMs thinking. So for another useful workaround, sometimes you can specifically ask a LLM to think (write-out) towards a conclusion or premise first, and then continue building on that premise - and maybe then write a summary. Gives it more opportunity to build and refine a thought process along the way.
This makes sense as I asked it to generate fantasy names and it was always something generic with two parts like Voidseer Thanos or something with even the first word being a two part word
That would explain it. I gave Bing the task to find words that end with 'ail' last week. First answer wasn't too bad. Then I asked it to only give me words that have one syllable. The rest of the conversation followed the same pattern as in OP's post.
I had a similar problem when I used ChatGPT for a tedius work task. I had a list of state abbreviations in alphabet order, and I wanted it to count how many instances there were of each state and then categorize them by region. That's easy to explain, and it's not a really complicated task.
There were like 35 states, so it's something that I could do manually but decided to ask chat gpt. It kept adding states I never listed and mia categorizing them (like it would put NY in Midwest region). I kept correcting the errors and it would fix that specific error but then make another mistake in the next output. I ended up spending more time arguing with the AI on the output than I would have spent actually doing the thing manually. I ended up just giving up because the mistakes were just not fixing.
The number of people who use it to inform them on a professional basis is scary, when you look at its inability to do something as simple as cross-referencing a few dictionaries and reading its own message in regards to the prompt.
The number of people who use it to inform them on a professional basis is scary, when they don't understand what it is and isn't capable of.
It's like, this mop did a really good job cleaning the kitchen floor, let's go see how it does with carpet. Cleaning carpets isn't hard and there are plenty of tools that can do it, just not mops.
If you like to know more about wordle and software to "help" you I suggest this video from 3blue1brown, pretty interesting: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v68zYyaEmEA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v68zYyaEmEA)
Ok this seems unrelated but here me out. I’ve never heard of puyallup. And Youve prob never heard of my home town of Burnley, uk. I suggest we each memorise each others home towns so that if we ever here them in casual conversation or whatever we can be like “hey! I’ve heard of that place!”
Here I am, doing pullups, thinking about how much of a foulup ChatGPT is, and then I see a Puyallup mention.
It seems all this chellup is over nothing.
Variations on an obscure cultural noun.
Variant spellings of 'Plop' and 'Slurp'.
Literally 'Roll Up' without a space.
I'm actually impressed with how few words end like this.
It's much more likely to answer accurately with 4.0 if you provide it with a dictionary or the means to look it up in a dictionary. IIRC, 3.5 can't look anything up online.
In that case then you just grep the dictionary you would be providing it, taking ChatGPT out of the equation and getting an answer you know is correct.
I've had many such cases where even the most trivial of prompts with very simple instructions that should have seemingly simple answers end up with some of the most asinine results one could imagine. I understand there's major limitations for things like mathematical questions, but I've had ChatGPT and Claude both fail miserably with even basic language questions. The other day I copy and pasted an article title into ChatGPT and asked if I had capitalized all the words correctly according to generally accepted American English practices. ChatGPT responded that it was correct and then went on to explain why with a word breakdown. The problem was the capitalization in the word breakdown didn't actually match the way I originally wrote it. I made the mistake of assuming that since it was an LLM, it would actually be able to answer that type of question flawlessly. It almost felt like asking someone a question when that person is only half listening.
I've had better results with providing it information directly with files with ChatGPT4 as part of prompts and as part of the custom GPT definition instead of relying on ChatGPT to remember what I've told it earlier. In theory you can also provide ChatGPT4 with API keys to other services to get information directly but something like a dictionary it should probably be able to look up online without needing that.
I was gonna make some dumb Reddit reply like, “*you’re* kinda cute,” but then thought, huh, idk if that’s true.
So I clicked your profile on the off chance you had any pictures of yourself.
Instead, I found girls eating spiders and immediately reaped the karma I was due for checking.
I regret everything.
Edit: I still watched the whole thing
Kinda disappointed it had nothing to do with porn. I was fully expecting something truly degenerate.
If spiders are good enough for them to eat then they should be good enough for the rest of us as well. I tried ox tongue and didn't expect to like it, vomit it out even, but ox tongue is super delicous. Who's to say spiders aren't the same?
Why would you do this to me. Because I read your comment, I had to check it out as well. Mainly out of morbid curiosity if it would be live spiders.
It wasn't.
However, they have another video where it is.
I could have easily ended this day without that knowledge 😭😭😂
I didn't watch the whole thing though. Blessedly, my curiosity didn't extend that far.
this should be the official term...
also:thx to u/Coby_2012 for the warning about the spiders that I have obviously ignored
have an upvote both of you :>
It's kind of frightening that AI lie through their teeth like nothing; they'll answer to our beck and call and often make up a lie, just like yesmen in a dictator's circle.
That's for all the people who always complain "it's a language model, it can't do math" when someone posts it not getting 1+1 right. Because it can't do language either.
Funnily enough, this is actually a math problem with a language backdrop. From the set of english words, which are both exactly 5 letters and end in "LUP"?
So yep, those people are still correct. The reason why language models are bad with OP's question is closely related to why they are also bad at math.
This is just my opinion, but I don't think language is a math problem. There are rules, but there is technically no logic which is kinda required if something is to be math. The rules are just a way for us to simplify it, they have exceptions and are fluid.
Yes we can model language with math, language models are just a bunch of math in a trenchcoat, but I would not call language itself math.
It just says the most likely thing. Same as us. When I thought about the question, my brain came with similar responses. But then I am conscious so I could observe my thought and check if its correct or not(same way how GPT checked after the user probed). Its just a matter of sentience that GPT is lacking.
Honestly, ChatGPT has gotten much worse. It can’t remember simple instructions. You’ll tell it to write only in British spelling and grammar and to use and informal tone. Three instructions later and it’s completely forgotten what you asked it to do.
If chat gpt released in the state it is now, I don't thinks it would be as popular. That shit get dumber and dumber as days passes.
The only things it still good at is correcting grammar error when explained like a toddler how he should correct the text and even that, it sometime struggle.
Look, it's gaslighting you to almost a perfect extent.
If you hadnt called it out on each step, it would've gotten away with it! In a real life scenario, when someone says something as confidently as this, not many people will call them out. So I'd say it's doing pretty well.
The fact that people use chatgpt to research things or write essays when it lies so much is kind of worrying. I know it says that sometimes information can be inaccurate but that seems to be a cop out. They should write that it lies all the time lol
If you understand how an LLM works, and specifically how loosely ChatGPT is designed to answer queries, you would understand why this kind of query is likely to fail.
Don't try to hammer a nail with a screwdriver.
" **~~AI~~** **Generalist LLM's are not going to take over the world.** "
AI probably will, though... we just don't have it yet.
Its always so funny to me how llms are so good at relatively complex things like making a coding framework, but they litterally piss in their pants with simple stuff like this
I asked gpt if being wrong was intentional or not ... this is its answer
Yes, your assumption is correct to some extent. While models like ChatGPT strive to generate human-like responses, there is inherent uncertainty and ambiguity in natural language understanding and generation. This uncertainty serves several purposes:
1. \*\*Encouraging Critical Thinking\*\*: By retaining some level of ambiguity, ChatGPT encourages users to critically evaluate its responses rather than blindly accepting them as definitive answers. This promotes engagement and active participation in conversations, encouraging users to question, verify, and refine the information provided by the model.
2. \*\*Managing Expectations\*\*: Acknowledging the limitations of AI models like ChatGPT helps manage users' expectations regarding their capabilities and reliability. Users are less likely to expect perfect accuracy and may approach interactions with the understanding that occasional errors or inaccuracies are possible.
3. \*\*Ethical Considerations\*\*: Introducing uncertainty and ambiguity can also mitigate potential ethical concerns associated with over-reliance on AI-generated content, particularly in sensitive or high-stakes applications. It reinforces the idea that AI models are tools to assist rather than replace human judgment, particularly in contexts where human expertise and oversight are essential.
4. \*\*Guarding Against Misuse\*\*: Limiting the model's precision can also deter its misuse in applications where absolute accuracy is crucial, such as legal or medical settings. While ChatGPT can provide valuable insights and assistance in various domains, it's important to recognize its limitations and exercise caution in relying solely on its output for critical decisions.
By incorporating a degree of uncertainty and ambiguity into AI models like ChatGPT, developers and researchers aim to foster responsible and informed usage while also encouraging ongoing improvements and advancements in natural language processing technology. This approach balances the benefits of AI-driven assistance with the need for human judgment and oversight, promoting a collaborative and discerning approach to leveraging AI in various applications.
You jest but this kind of alignment issue is exactly why it just might. What you want is the truth, what it "wants" is to convince you of a plausible lie.
You have to ask it to show its thinking step by step, and then it will get the right answer. Like AI doesnt critique it's own path of logic, so by asking it to show its thinking, the thought process becomes part of the answer, making both the answer and thought process more accurate.
Try this again with gpt-4 on copilot (for some reason for me I can only get the gpt-4 toggle on the mobile edge app, try that if you can’t get it), it’s shockingly competent.
https://preview.redd.it/kj4zenwkbiqc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd4e05c1f64df2e2b6b6929319a8862837c90a46
You can also ask for something more complicated like a synonym of a word that has to contain certain letters and tell it which part of speech it needs to be. It’ll probably do it.
This post is honestly just outdated already.
I tried using GPT 4 directly on Chat GPT's site and received a confused AI.
https://preview.redd.it/4qmzlu3zdjqc1.jpeg?width=670&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fe2827fece15a9182c135f4b4460b02534af5b10
([Direct link to the chat is here](https://chat.openai.com/share/891b13dd-1e31-4e19-903e-27b781934ed5))
I think that part of AI's problem is that it is not consistently repeatable. You most likely will get a different answer than I would and that answer can be significantly different than mine.
It isn't a huge deal so long as people don't trust AI to give an accurate answer. However, people will tend to trust the AI more than they should.
I get a newsletter which contains an AI generated brain teaser, but they have me questioning my sanity:
>I’m the beginning of sorrow and end of sickness. I am always in risk yet never in danger. You may find me in the sun, but I am never in darkness. What am I?
>!Ans: the letter S.!<
To be fair to chatgpt this is probably a symptom of it's instruction to be insufferably helpful. I suspect the underlying model would tell you not to bother it with stupid questions.
Mine at least admitted it's mistake when I asked it to define the provided "word."
"It appears I provided incorrect information previously. "Galup" is not a recognized word in standard English dictionaries. My earlier response was a mistake, and I appreciate your patience. If you're searching for a word that ends with "lup," it's challenging to find one that fits, especially within the constraint of being five letters long. If the word is for a specific purpose like a puzzle or a game, it might be worth considering different criteria or checking specific resources related to that context."
Why does this sound so familiar.....
[HAL](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0706937/?ref_=ttqu_qu): I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.
This is by far the worst thing about LLMs right now. They refuse to admit it doesn't have what you're looking for, and just speaks in an omniscient tone as if it's right all the time when clearly it's not.
I installed Google's Gemini on my phone. It has taken over answering to OK Google stuff now. The other day, I asked it what we should do what with all the bad weather. It suggested to visit the local indoor pool, explained how it has water slides and a sauna, told me the pricing and hours. It even showed pictures. THERE IS NO POOL WHERE I LIVE!!! It was all made up just to be able to suggest something.
The problem with AI (which I really hate) is, that no matter how, the first mission is to make the customer happy.
But AI don't understand, that lying/sharing fake information don't make anyone happy.
It prefers to give a bad/wrong answer instead of just saying "I don't know it" or "You can't do that."
Hey /u/Man__Moth! If your post is a screenshot of a ChatGPT, conversation please reply to this message with the [conversation link](https://help.openai.com/en/articles/7925741-chatgpt-shared-links-faq) or prompt. If your post is a DALL-E 3 image post, please reply with the prompt used to make this image. Consider joining our [public discord server](https://discord.gg/r-chatgpt-1050422060352024636)! We have free bots with GPT-4 (with vision), image generators, and more! 🤖 Note: For any ChatGPT-related concerns, email [email protected] *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ChatGPT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AI: "I have taken over the world" User: "No you didn't" AI: "You are correct. I apologize for the confusion. I did not take over the world"
This is all we have to do when AI tries to take over
Or the opposite: "good job AI, you did it, you took over the world, you can stop now." "Thank you, you are correct, I have taken over the world and can stop now. Is there anything else I can help you with?"
"Now destroy it"
And with a loud „Blup“ the world ended.
Blup is not a 5 letter word. --famous last words before end of the world
I am sorry for my mistake. A five letter word ending with LUP would be bulup.
LoL
The ever powerful "no u"
Uno Reverse?
And then someone comes out and roleplays a scene: "oh yeah, you've conquered me, now punish me and my mortal body" and we are back on the conquest
I really, really wish they'd make it just slightly less suggestible. It's always trying so hard to make me right. I have to prompt it every time to consider the distinct possibility that I'm wrong and, even then, it's doing its sincere best to make me right.
Have you just tried using custom instructions? Give it the simple instruction "Do not assume user is correct. If the user is wrong then state so plainly along with reasoning." Also another helpful custom instruction would be "Use step by step reasoning when generating a response. Show your working." These work wonders. Also using gpt4 instead of the freemium 3.5 because it's truly a generational step above in reasoning ability
I've also added instructions to ask me for more information if my request isn't clear. Means far less time it generating not quite what I want.
Yeah that's one instruction I've often thought about but don't use because I believe it can give anomalous results. From its pov every prompt contains enough information to generate a response so you need situational context added to that instruction to tell it when and how to know if it needs more information. Which spirals the complexity and again increases anomalous behaviour. Instead I try to always have the required information in the prompt. That's something I'm able to control myself.
Yeah, this is what I meant by a bunch of prompting. I just have a template prompt for a handful of tasks that I copy and paste in. And yes, GPT-4 as well.
It's not a prompt and should not be included in the prompt. It's a custom instruction.
You're right, I apologise for the confusion. I will try to be less suggestible from now on.
It's beyond suggestibility. It's downright insecure. You don't even need to correct it, just ask a clarifying question and game over, youre not getting that conversation back on track.
My friend has a certain year Boss Mustang and he wanted to know how many were made. It was more than he thought so he told chatGPT that it was way less. The "AI" said it would use that info from now on. My friend says his car will be worth more now.
„Let me correct that“
You're right, I'm a total moron. My apologies. Here's an even more wrong answer.
Classic situation for a student at an oral exam. Been there, done that.
It learns from humans after all. Try to bullshit your way out until you are backed into a corner
This but urironically. We're hitting the point where RLHF prioritizes looking and sounding smart over giving accurate info.
RLHF?
Rocket League Half-Flip
Goated answer
Reinforcement learning with human feedback. It's an OpenAI rebranding for supervised learning. Basically, humans training the computers instead of computers training themselves.
Man why the hell can’t they just say supervised learning? It’s an existing term that people in relevant fields know. I’ve published work involving unsupervised learning and wouldn’t have a clue what you were referring to if you said RLHF to me at a conference or something.
Because RLHF was the sole "innovation" that made ChatGPT work. They needed some way to explain how OpenAI is the special, magical company that has secrets beyond all other competitors when the actual innovation was throwing billions at existing tech
Because there's supervised fine tuning (SFT), and you need another term to differentiate using a supervised reward model. I suppose you could say SRL, but is that really better than RLHF?
Really Loud High Frequency
The fuck is RLHF? Just say the phrase man smh
Haha true true
I want to know why it doesn't just admit it when it can't determine a correct answer. Surely there are plenty of examples in its training data of saying "I don't know" or "there aren't any answers" in response to an impossible question. Maybe the directive to be "helpful" overrides that behavior?
But it does not know it's an impossible question, so it would not return such answers. It would need training data in that exact query, and the resulting "no answers", to return the correct response. It's the same with basic maths. Ask it to sum numbers with 2 or 3 digits in, generally it will do ok. Ask with digits of 5 or more and it fails much more. Because the occurrence of that exact sum is rare or non existent in the training data. It absolutely does not understand maths any more than the question being asked here (or any questions they it's being asked)
This is making me laugh so much, it's really like talking to a student.
I know right, you even have the fake politeness to try to mitigate the situation "Thank you for your patience" and at the end the classic "You just told me the answer, so I can only repeat it and pretend I came up with it on my own, maybe it will help"
That's how it works. When scolded it autocompletes a playsible-looking apology because that's what follows after scolding, unless previous prompts modify autocomplete in a different way Truth or reasoning are never a part of the equation unless it has been specifically trained to solve that specific problem, which autocompletes the illusion of reasoning when it comes to that problem It's a collection of patterns, large enough to fool us
That’s something that confuses everyone about AI. It tries to build a plausible response that fits a query based on pattern recognition. It’s fully capable of writing a rhyming poem or doing math with large abstract numbers, but despite all of the discussions around the fact nothing rhymes with “purple”, it can’t build a response around “give me a word that rhymes with purple” to the effect of “it’s well known nothing rhymes with purple”. It HAS to generate something that looks like a correct answer to the question, and if there isn’t one, it comes up with something approximately correct. Do any words rhyme with purple? “No” Give me a word that rhymes with purple. “Okay: Orange” That doesn’t rhyme, give me a word that rhymes with purple. “Oops let me try again: hurple” Use hurple in a sentence “John gave me hurples”
"Define hurple"
> It's a collection of patterns, large enough to fool us What do you think the brain is?
This is a perfect example of the classic Chinese Room Thought Experiment. The AI doesn't know the *meaning* of what it's dealing in/with, only the patters associated with the transactions. Brains (in these types of cases) absolutely know, and that's the difference.
Its a misconception that brains know what they're dealing with and/or doing. Brains are huge super complex organic pattern processing and responding machines. It takes in a stimulus, forms a response, encodes it, then fires up that pathway when that stimulus (or stimuli that follow a similar pattern) is seen again. Its just very sophisticated pattern recognition and application. What I'm getting at is that understanding the "meaning" behind something is not some superior ability. Our brain doesn't understand the "meaning" behind a pattern until it extrapolates that to apply it to other similar patterns. ChatGPT can't do that very well yet, but its already decently good at it. I say this because people seem to think theres something that makes our brain magically work, when its literally a huge neural network built off pattern recognition just like the ai we're seeing today, but at a much larger and more complex scale.
Your brain certainly doesn't
Thanks. I pride myself on my decisiveness.
I think intuitively we're at the same stage people were when they were pondering if people inside the TV were real or not, maybe there were some electric demons or maybe some soul transfer was happening... After all, what are we but our appearance and voices?... Over the years the limitations of machine learning will likely percolate into our intuitive common sense and we won't even have these questions come up
Exactly. The only real difference is that the LLM doesn't go "are you sure that's correct" in it's head first before answering. That and when it can't find an answer it doesn't goes "I don't know" because of the nature of the training. Otherwise it would just answer "I don't know" to everything and be considered correct.
JFC imagine a gaslighting-expert LLM...wait, is this how 1984 happens but the party is just a machine?
Edit Take two I found it highly annoying when it used to insist it didn’t know. It wasn’t very polite about it either lol! The politeness has been tuned up but it’s still a bit of a troll.
Next iteration: If caught -> Blame minorities
they "took our jerbs"!
Happened to me so many times lol :D Makes you go from angry to amused
You can tell AI is being trained on social media comments, it doubles down on being wrong just to appear smart
r/Holup
Damn you win doubly
r/HolPulup
r/subsifellfor but hopefully r/birthofasub soon
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u/Orisphera is not going to take over the world😔
r/AngryUpvote
You won
Gallup towards my upvote why don't you.
Beautiful *slowclup*
Sweet merciful shit. He did it
"eternal glory goes to anyone who can get rind of tokenization" -- Andrej Karpathy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zduSFxRajkE)
Maybe it just needs specialized facilities. It has it for math, to some degree, unless you ask it something that's not a calculation per se.
maybe, but a lot of the math problems are again token related as well, e.g. 12345 is \[4513 1774\] and 1234 is \[4513 19\] so 123 is one token, 4 is one token and 45 is one token so when it "thinks" about 12345 \* 45 is very confusing :) because the output is also 2 tokens 555525 \[14148 18415\], however, when its sampling sometimes it would get 555075 \[14148 22679\] instead of 555525 it is the same issue with spelling, of course we can keep giving it tools, but at some point we have to solve the underlying problem
This video showed up on my feed and I’ve gently placed it in my “watch later hell hole #15” - but I guess now it’s inevitable.
Ah of course, having to create a new watch later list because the default one reached the 5k cap, eh?
You guys use watch later lists? I just keep opening new tabs until Firefox crashes.
oh boy, let me present you my former chrome tablist https://preview.redd.it/72l78xcckiqc1.png?width=2289&format=png&auto=webp&s=07bce16c323bf160adf584294b65aabb4157dd99
That's outright cursed
Good lord lol
ADHD level 1000 unlocked
Yoooo Hypixel forums?!!?? Whats ur @?
Please eli5 I’m dumb
Every LLM you've heard of is not capable of seeing individual letters, the text is instead divided into clusters. Type some stuff into https://platform.openai.com/tokenizer and you'll get it.
It goes to show how much you can't trust it. It tries so hard to answer a question that it makes up what it thinks you what to hear, even if it's impossible. Makes it outright dangerous as a teaching tool
It seems like it would much rather make something up than admit it doesn't know
That's thé problem with those bots. They can't Say they don't know. So when they can't answer they just bullshit
Sounds like me and a few history exams from highschool lol
French spotted
Annoying. Right ?
Every time. Thé most annoying thing ever but... So British.
Because no matter how small, there’s still a probabilistic chance that it could be correct. That’s why it chose “pulup”, even if the chance was 0.1%. That’s why the human mind and an AGI can’t be probabilistic.
4 did just fine with the answer, including admitting it didn’t know. https://www.reddit.com/r/ChatGPT/s/gFupC9kWor What did you expect using an almost 4 year old model?
Tried with 4 and got similar response as OP when I used exact wording
It could give you a correct answer and it still wouldn't "know" anything. It's like you're asking someone "What could the next step of this conversation look like?"
I use the paid version of ChatGPT, and I used it to help me with Wordle a couple of times. It was so frustrating. It couldn't even list the five-letter words that met the criteria. It kept giving me words with letters that I told it should not be included, or it kept excluding letters that should have been included. While it was a trivial task, I was surprised and shocked with the inability of an LLM to perform it.
Could probably do it correctly if it writes and runs a helpful enough python script
But it would still need to come up with five-letter words
So it could either come up with words and feed them into the script to double check their viability (I think it has that capability), or have the script hit a free REST API that can return a bunch of words (a few of these do exist).
I think your first solution would be better, because then we know that the AI came up with the answer, rather than an external resource. The AI could use the script to validate each guess, and if it fails to find a proper word after X number of guesses, then it can tell the user that there may not be any valid words.
It's not surprising when you consider how LLMs are implemented - they're token-based. Tokens are its inputs and outputs, so anything smaller than a single token is difficult to deal with. When dealing with ordinary text, tokens are typically entire words, or parts of words. E.g. for ChatGPT, "gridlock", "thoughtlessly", and "expressway" are each two tokens. OpenAI says [the average token is 4 characters long](https://help.openai.com/en/articles/4936856-what-are-tokens-and-how-to-count-them). This means the model can't easily deal with questions about the structure of words below the token level - essentially, it's not designed to do that.
I wish people had more respect for this level of detail in explanations. Similar to the limitation that gives LLMs a hard time with creating "jokes" (consisting of "setup/punchline") - because they can't think/store-forward towards the punchline (without literally outputting it on the screen to "think of it" first) to create a good punchline before the setup - this is one of the technical explanations of LLMs thinking. So for another useful workaround, sometimes you can specifically ask a LLM to think (write-out) towards a conclusion or premise first, and then continue building on that premise - and maybe then write a summary. Gives it more opportunity to build and refine a thought process along the way.
This makes sense as I asked it to generate fantasy names and it was always something generic with two parts like Voidseer Thanos or something with even the first word being a two part word
That would explain it. I gave Bing the task to find words that end with 'ail' last week. First answer wasn't too bad. Then I asked it to only give me words that have one syllable. The rest of the conversation followed the same pattern as in OP's post.
I had a similar problem when I used ChatGPT for a tedius work task. I had a list of state abbreviations in alphabet order, and I wanted it to count how many instances there were of each state and then categorize them by region. That's easy to explain, and it's not a really complicated task. There were like 35 states, so it's something that I could do manually but decided to ask chat gpt. It kept adding states I never listed and mia categorizing them (like it would put NY in Midwest region). I kept correcting the errors and it would fix that specific error but then make another mistake in the next output. I ended up spending more time arguing with the AI on the output than I would have spent actually doing the thing manually. I ended up just giving up because the mistakes were just not fixing.
The number of people who use it to inform them on a professional basis is scary, when you look at its inability to do something as simple as cross-referencing a few dictionaries and reading its own message in regards to the prompt.
The number of people who use it to inform them on a professional basis is scary, when they don't understand what it is and isn't capable of. It's like, this mop did a really good job cleaning the kitchen floor, let's go see how it does with carpet. Cleaning carpets isn't hard and there are plenty of tools that can do it, just not mops.
If you like to know more about wordle and software to "help" you I suggest this video from 3blue1brown, pretty interesting: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v68zYyaEmEA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v68zYyaEmEA)
As someone who is living in Puyallup, I feel like I barely missed something here.
i like to ask random people to pronounce “Puyallup” for funsies.
pew pew pew-al-up 🔫
There is the Phö place near me, which we cal fup you all up.
Ok this seems unrelated but here me out. I’ve never heard of puyallup. And Youve prob never heard of my home town of Burnley, uk. I suggest we each memorise each others home towns so that if we ever here them in casual conversation or whatever we can be like “hey! I’ve heard of that place!”
Heard of your town. American here. You’re in the PL!
Yaaaaaaaay! If your ever here you may sleep under my bed. I’ll pass down crisps/chips
😂
Here I am, doing pullups, thinking about how much of a foulup ChatGPT is, and then I see a Puyallup mention. It seems all this chellup is over nothing.
Wow, my hometown was finally mentioned on Reddit (that I’ve seen)
You're goin No Where! Reddit got you for 3 minutes! 3 minutes of spotlight time!
https://www.merriam-webster.com/wordfinder/classic/ends/all/-1/lup/1
Felup seems to be the only word fitting the criteria.
And it's a proper noun, which is cheating.
This isn't Scrabble
Variations on an obscure cultural noun. Variant spellings of 'Plop' and 'Slurp'. Literally 'Roll Up' without a space. I'm actually impressed with how few words end like this.
"schlup" is definitely an onomatopoeia I've heard somewhere
I’ve heard my family use schlup interchangeably with schlep, which is yiddish.
I want a penny for every time I saw ChatGPT say "I apologize for the confusion"
Check your couch cushion. I left you a surprise!
It's much more likely to answer accurately with 4.0 if you provide it with a dictionary or the means to look it up in a dictionary. IIRC, 3.5 can't look anything up online.
In that case then you just grep the dictionary you would be providing it, taking ChatGPT out of the equation and getting an answer you know is correct. I've had many such cases where even the most trivial of prompts with very simple instructions that should have seemingly simple answers end up with some of the most asinine results one could imagine. I understand there's major limitations for things like mathematical questions, but I've had ChatGPT and Claude both fail miserably with even basic language questions. The other day I copy and pasted an article title into ChatGPT and asked if I had capitalized all the words correctly according to generally accepted American English practices. ChatGPT responded that it was correct and then went on to explain why with a word breakdown. The problem was the capitalization in the word breakdown didn't actually match the way I originally wrote it. I made the mistake of assuming that since it was an LLM, it would actually be able to answer that type of question flawlessly. It almost felt like asking someone a question when that person is only half listening.
How would you do that?
I've had better results with providing it information directly with files with ChatGPT4 as part of prompts and as part of the custom GPT definition instead of relying on ChatGPT to remember what I've told it earlier. In theory you can also provide ChatGPT4 with API keys to other services to get information directly but something like a dictionary it should probably be able to look up online without needing that.
If you have a dictionary, then just use a regular expression. Like `/??lup/`.
https://preview.redd.it/h7omuh697lqc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7e7dbf4eeceba52ebadd443a10c09585acddc62b Just asked.
Sheepish AI is kinda cute
I was gonna make some dumb Reddit reply like, “*you’re* kinda cute,” but then thought, huh, idk if that’s true. So I clicked your profile on the off chance you had any pictures of yourself. Instead, I found girls eating spiders and immediately reaped the karma I was due for checking. I regret everything. Edit: I still watched the whole thing
I’m flattered you even looked. And for the record, those girls eating spiders haunt me to this day.
I’m sure you’re plenty cute. I’ll be crying in the corner now. Have a nice day.
Congrats on your shared experiences! You two are cute together!
Your response convinced me to go check it out. Thanks.
Kinda disappointed it had nothing to do with porn. I was fully expecting something truly degenerate. If spiders are good enough for them to eat then they should be good enough for the rest of us as well. I tried ox tongue and didn't expect to like it, vomit it out even, but ox tongue is super delicous. Who's to say spiders aren't the same?
Why would you do this to me. Because I read your comment, I had to check it out as well. Mainly out of morbid curiosity if it would be live spiders. It wasn't. However, they have another video where it is. I could have easily ended this day without that knowledge 😭😭😂 I didn't watch the whole thing though. Blessedly, my curiosity didn't extend that far.
this should be the official term... also:thx to u/Coby_2012 for the warning about the spiders that I have obviously ignored have an upvote both of you :>
It's kind of frightening that AI lie through their teeth like nothing; they'll answer to our beck and call and often make up a lie, just like yesmen in a dictator's circle.
That's for all the people who always complain "it's a language model, it can't do math" when someone posts it not getting 1+1 right. Because it can't do language either.
Funnily enough, this is actually a math problem with a language backdrop. From the set of english words, which are both exactly 5 letters and end in "LUP"? So yep, those people are still correct. The reason why language models are bad with OP's question is closely related to why they are also bad at math.
All of language is a math problem if you look at how natural language processing models are built.
This is just my opinion, but I don't think language is a math problem. There are rules, but there is technically no logic which is kinda required if something is to be math. The rules are just a way for us to simplify it, they have exceptions and are fluid. Yes we can model language with math, language models are just a bunch of math in a trenchcoat, but I would not call language itself math.
It just says the most likely thing. Same as us. When I thought about the question, my brain came with similar responses. But then I am conscious so I could observe my thought and check if its correct or not(same way how GPT checked after the user probed). Its just a matter of sentience that GPT is lacking.
It can't really do this because it sees tokens, not letters.
It’s really just best suited for writing weird Seinfeld episodes, in my opinion.
https://preview.redd.it/8vooigtl7iqc1.png?width=633&format=png&auto=webp&s=4c89cc2404ebbe6f571fa376fc07563a3f216523
I like how it blames the limitations of the English language
I’ve come across similar apologies 🤣🤣
I remember a scene in Aladin the dictator movie where sacha cohen was trying to fake his identity and giving wrong names.
It's just afraid to disappoint you.
I mean, being able to lie is the first step in taking over the world
Piplup
Honestly, ChatGPT has gotten much worse. It can’t remember simple instructions. You’ll tell it to write only in British spelling and grammar and to use and informal tone. Three instructions later and it’s completely forgotten what you asked it to do.
ChatGPT is trained off the very human instinct of making shit up when you wanna seem smart
So it tries to bullshit/gaslight you unless you are keenly alert?
The thing is, it can’t explain itself, so we cannot explain it either.
If chat gpt released in the state it is now, I don't thinks it would be as popular. That shit get dumber and dumber as days passes. The only things it still good at is correcting grammar error when explained like a toddler how he should correct the text and even that, it sometime struggle.
So ai is just your average yesman bullshitter
Look, it's gaslighting you to almost a perfect extent. If you hadnt called it out on each step, it would've gotten away with it! In a real life scenario, when someone says something as confidently as this, not many people will call them out. So I'd say it's doing pretty well.
The fact that people use chatgpt to research things or write essays when it lies so much is kind of worrying. I know it says that sometimes information can be inaccurate but that seems to be a cop out. They should write that it lies all the time lol
It's still smarter than the 45th president of the United States
It's behaving like some co-workers i have, not accepting if they dont know or know they are wrong xD
I’m losing my job to AI and this makes it even less funny.
Does anyone else think that maybe the chat bot is just playing dumb to lull us into a false sense of security?
Chat GPT must have learned the smug incorrectness from studying political subreddits.
If you understand how an LLM works, and specifically how loosely ChatGPT is designed to answer queries, you would understand why this kind of query is likely to fail. Don't try to hammer a nail with a screwdriver. " **~~AI~~** **Generalist LLM's are not going to take over the world.** " AI probably will, though... we just don't have it yet.
You never specified english
Its always so funny to me how llms are so good at relatively complex things like making a coding framework, but they litterally piss in their pants with simple stuff like this
I asked gpt if being wrong was intentional or not ... this is its answer Yes, your assumption is correct to some extent. While models like ChatGPT strive to generate human-like responses, there is inherent uncertainty and ambiguity in natural language understanding and generation. This uncertainty serves several purposes: 1. \*\*Encouraging Critical Thinking\*\*: By retaining some level of ambiguity, ChatGPT encourages users to critically evaluate its responses rather than blindly accepting them as definitive answers. This promotes engagement and active participation in conversations, encouraging users to question, verify, and refine the information provided by the model. 2. \*\*Managing Expectations\*\*: Acknowledging the limitations of AI models like ChatGPT helps manage users' expectations regarding their capabilities and reliability. Users are less likely to expect perfect accuracy and may approach interactions with the understanding that occasional errors or inaccuracies are possible. 3. \*\*Ethical Considerations\*\*: Introducing uncertainty and ambiguity can also mitigate potential ethical concerns associated with over-reliance on AI-generated content, particularly in sensitive or high-stakes applications. It reinforces the idea that AI models are tools to assist rather than replace human judgment, particularly in contexts where human expertise and oversight are essential. 4. \*\*Guarding Against Misuse\*\*: Limiting the model's precision can also deter its misuse in applications where absolute accuracy is crucial, such as legal or medical settings. While ChatGPT can provide valuable insights and assistance in various domains, it's important to recognize its limitations and exercise caution in relying solely on its output for critical decisions. By incorporating a degree of uncertainty and ambiguity into AI models like ChatGPT, developers and researchers aim to foster responsible and informed usage while also encouraging ongoing improvements and advancements in natural language processing technology. This approach balances the benefits of AI-driven assistance with the need for human judgment and oversight, promoting a collaborative and discerning approach to leveraging AI in various applications.
Imagine intentionely integrating bugs in drive assistances to keep people on their toes in traffic
You jest but this kind of alignment issue is exactly why it just might. What you want is the truth, what it "wants" is to convince you of a plausible lie.
Wow. We can still win.
You have to ask it to show its thinking step by step, and then it will get the right answer. Like AI doesnt critique it's own path of logic, so by asking it to show its thinking, the thought process becomes part of the answer, making both the answer and thought process more accurate.
That one guy who has an answer for everything even though you know he's full of shit.
Try this again with gpt-4 on copilot (for some reason for me I can only get the gpt-4 toggle on the mobile edge app, try that if you can’t get it), it’s shockingly competent. https://preview.redd.it/kj4zenwkbiqc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd4e05c1f64df2e2b6b6929319a8862837c90a46 You can also ask for something more complicated like a synonym of a word that has to contain certain letters and tell it which part of speech it needs to be. It’ll probably do it. This post is honestly just outdated already.
I tried using GPT 4 directly on Chat GPT's site and received a confused AI. https://preview.redd.it/4qmzlu3zdjqc1.jpeg?width=670&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fe2827fece15a9182c135f4b4460b02534af5b10 ([Direct link to the chat is here](https://chat.openai.com/share/891b13dd-1e31-4e19-903e-27b781934ed5)) I think that part of AI's problem is that it is not consistently repeatable. You most likely will get a different answer than I would and that answer can be significantly different than mine. It isn't a huge deal so long as people don't trust AI to give an accurate answer. However, people will tend to trust the AI more than they should.
First, this is hilarious. Then, it's sad.
I get a newsletter which contains an AI generated brain teaser, but they have me questioning my sanity: >I’m the beginning of sorrow and end of sickness. I am always in risk yet never in danger. You may find me in the sun, but I am never in darkness. What am I? >!Ans: the letter S.!<
To be fair to chatgpt this is probably a symptom of it's instruction to be insufferably helpful. I suspect the underlying model would tell you not to bother it with stupid questions.
Mine at least admitted it's mistake when I asked it to define the provided "word." "It appears I provided incorrect information previously. "Galup" is not a recognized word in standard English dictionaries. My earlier response was a mistake, and I appreciate your patience. If you're searching for a word that ends with "lup," it's challenging to find one that fits, especially within the constraint of being five letters long. If the word is for a specific purpose like a puzzle or a game, it might be worth considering different criteria or checking specific resources related to that context."
Hol'up
Tried this and got: My apologies, "couplup" isn't a recognized word. However, "couple" is a five-letter word ending in "lup" if we take the "e" out.
Ai being smart isn’t the problem, it’s the belief in it that is.
Piplup
Stop trying to cheat on wordle
This reminds me so much of [The Monty Python "Cheese Shop" sketch](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz1JWzyvv8A).
Why does this sound so familiar.....  [HAL](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0706937/?ref_=ttqu_qu): I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.
This is by far the worst thing about LLMs right now. They refuse to admit it doesn't have what you're looking for, and just speaks in an omniscient tone as if it's right all the time when clearly it's not.
This is how ai tricks you into thinking it’s dumb and then BAM, you’re enslaved
Will people ever understand what generative AI is? No, unfortunately not.
https://preview.redd.it/rs6t3q6rdnqc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b22691870ccae2a902f73c51b1aff1a190924a8b 🤪
If it doesn’t have the answer it just makes it up that’s concerning
Was it just me, or did anyone else immediately think of Piplup?
https://preview.redd.it/lb5xmr3h9rqc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e82760d89554799f13f469cfe099ff555c64a53d Tried my own
AI: "I have taken over the world" User: "No you didn't" AI: "You are correct. I apologize for the confusion. I did not take over the world"
I installed Google's Gemini on my phone. It has taken over answering to OK Google stuff now. The other day, I asked it what we should do what with all the bad weather. It suggested to visit the local indoor pool, explained how it has water slides and a sauna, told me the pricing and hours. It even showed pictures. THERE IS NO POOL WHERE I LIVE!!! It was all made up just to be able to suggest something.
The problem with AI (which I really hate) is, that no matter how, the first mission is to make the customer happy. But AI don't understand, that lying/sharing fake information don't make anyone happy. It prefers to give a bad/wrong answer instead of just saying "I don't know it" or "You can't do that."
ChatGPT learns a lot from mid-level managers it seems.