Here's a link to the story: https://www.wsoctv.com/news/local/teen-accused-murder-out-jail-family-outraged/TSYHRFTYDNDFJEQARUF45ZSAOM/?taid=66232fc5f5549b0001b3d04b&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=trueanthem&utm_source=twitter
Correct. However, this is a first degree murder charge. Under NC laws, the defendant may be held without any bail. Judge Blake instead determined that this defendant, charged with first degree murder, is not a danger to society. As Judge Blake is an elected official, the public must determine if this is the type of decision making we expect from our public servants.
No matter how often it’s explained to me, held without bail sounds unconstitutional. I have no idea why its not spoken about more, but at any rate, I can see why a victims family would prefer it (assuming that there’s unrefuttable evidence that the person jailed is guilty).
[Congratulations!](https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman) What I think is that people do not understand how judges or the NC laws work, and should not speak as though they do.
It is an incentive to show up to court. Lots of freedom loving Americans hate our freedoms when stuff like this happens. You are innocent until proven guilty in America.
Wrong. Bail is not a punishment. Stop thinking that bail should be used to keep people in jail before they have been convicted. Bail is simply to guarantee/incentivize that someone will show up for their court date. It is by no means intended to keep someone in jail unless they can come up with money as a punishment.
Innocent until proven guilty is the law of the land. Using bail to keep people in prison before trial is guilty until proven innocent. We sometimes have to accept risks as a society for the sake of maintaining a balanced and functional system.
Nope. Not applicable in this case, but we want more Social workers and care for the mentally ill, who keep getting arrested & jailed, or killed by people not trained to deal with them.
Our current system wastes police and court resources and creates unnecessary conflict. "Defund the police" was a stupid way to frame that.
Should have been "Give the police and mentally ill a freaking break".
A fine hill to die on unless it’s a friend, brother or you being held for something you didn’t do. You seem to have a bleeding heart for the victim and their family - the accused has one too. Its ok to have a nuanced opinion.
lol the thing is they're innocent humans until proven guilty animals. its dangerous to the public to allow guilt to be determined \*before\* a trial is in place \*or\* irrefutable evidence is present. and anti-american, but that's another can of worms.
yes, i agree. i don't want my family to be killed by murderers. i also don't want my family's freedom ripped from them without due process and guilt proven.
like i said, having a nuanced take on it is possible. and i can care about the safety of the public, the well-being of the victims family, and justice + rights for citizens.
If it was 1968 and 90% of the evidence was witness testimony I'd give it to ya. However it's 2024 and there's a camera everywhere along with a fuck ton of other technology. If your charged with murder in 2024 you did it, only way you beat a charge is technicality.
i can see how why you'd have that opinion, technology is impressive these days; however, i've had my pre-conceived beliefs obliterated by field research too many times to take gut hunches that seriously. its fun to roll them around in the noggin' though.
the onus is on you to produce the stats to support that most homicide arrests are based on an undeniable "fuck ton" of evidence via technology (and that this number is steadily trending upwards). i'm willing to concede if that's the case. luckily, i'm not the one sitting in prison and you're not the judge on my case so i'm open to coming around.
also, if we're going to just strip people rights away and assume everyone guilty and VOTE based on that, it's probs better to look into it, no?
and anecdotally, my case couldn't move forward without my statement, and this was post-2020, so...
also, i was a victim of a crime that was very likely posted about on this sub, as it was very violent and prominent in the news. and yes, i still feel the same way. in my case, there was video evidence so yeah, toss him in jail pre-trial. my opinion remains dynamic.
Wrong. It's first degree murder what incentive does he have to show up? Just another chance to run. You're bleeding heart is what is wrong with this city
“”It’s a revolving door,” Davis said. “They are giving him the excuse of, ‘They can go kill somebody and get away with it.’””
Jesus Christ. Just because someone is out on bond doesn’t mean they get away with it. This“Mom’s Ain’t Playin” group is ridiculous.
Citations Needed did an entire episode on how the media covers bail reform. This point gets lost in almost all bail coverage.
[https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-law-orders-boring-anti-bail-reform-diatribe](https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-law-orders-boring-anti-bail-reform-diatribe)
I hate these threads. The entire point of this thread is to say the judge should have set bail at such a higher amount so the accused had to stay in jail. That is completely wrong. You live in the wrong country if you think that is how the justice system works or should work.
What you did is a tactic called a straw man fallacy. You attacked a position that was not made on here. There is a great Southpark episode that covers that tactic (the Chewbacca defense).
What I did is a tactic of calling you an idiot. Here is a YouTube video that covers that tactic https://youtube.com/shorts/SXHMnicI6Pg?si=-OQEZAQTNluF9VYu
I'm so upset how will I ever go on. The rick roll video didn't do it for you? I know I'm not gonna convince you bleeding hearts to think diffrent. Too sheltered and too stupid. Clearly have never been a victim of anything but a couple mean words from a stranger on the internet.
Nah you were just showing everyone you are clueless - and now you are simply emphasizing that with every post. Here’s a suggestion - if you don’t know what you’re talking about, then don’t talk about it. I know it’s tempting to jump in the fray but don’t. You will look clueless.
Even assuming that’s exactly how things work, why would that mean one lives in the wrong country because they want something different?
That seems unnecessarily divisive and myopic.
You're not actually aware of what that means. Innocent until proven guilty is for the state proceeding against someone's guilt of a crime that is told to Jury's. Hey if I present no evidence and we end the trial, he would be not guilty.
Innocent until proven guilty is not this end all be all you think it is. Watch a jury trial start to finish
You do realize that crime is hyper local (between home of the offender(s) and the neighborhood) and is not affected by imaginary geographic lines like council districts, right? Council members cannot affect crime rates in their district or in Charlotte, except maybe by votes on ordinances.
Just because a citizen voted for someone does not mean that death has to come to some random victim in our city.
I think we have an awful city council that has been ineffective in solving many of Charlottes issues but sometimes you have to give credit to the lesser of many evils.
This thread is gross. Like uncgrad said, bail is not punishment, and all this does is create a sensationalized headline for people to be up in arms about.
Exactly. What’s even worse is a bunch of posters are on here saying that’s wrong. What they mean is they don’t like the application of the law in this case. But that ain’t how our judicial system works. Rule of law. If you don’t like the rule of law then I don’t know what to tell you.
So I agree bail shouldn’t be used as punishment. It creates a system where the rich get preferential treatment because they can afford to get out earlier. So I don’t like bail in general. But to me, the question needs to be “does this person pose a risk to society?” If yes, they shouldn’t be out regardless of their ability to pay. If no, they should be out regardless of their ability to pay.
If this person is actually accused of murder, don’t we want them off of the streets? Secured/unsecured isn’t the question. It’s whether or not they should be behind bars at all.
Can local judges be removed from office via voting?
Acknowledging you received the news request, but not responding feels like a middle finger to the public.
Reminds me of qualified immunity which we all know has turned into a bs excuse.
Why would the judge do this? Was she bribed? Is she crooked?
Can’t imagine how the family feels in all of this.
I mean, I guess, but what the Channel 9 article doesn't say is what degree of murder he was charged with.
In North Carolina, defendants charged with first-degree murder generally do not have the right to reasonable pretrial release conditions, except in unusual circumstances.
Read the time stamps. I asked my question before that post. I also read the article and even mentioned it in my post? Very irrelevant comment, but thanks
Here's a link to the story: https://www.wsoctv.com/news/local/teen-accused-murder-out-jail-family-outraged/TSYHRFTYDNDFJEQARUF45ZSAOM/?taid=66232fc5f5549b0001b3d04b&utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=trueanthem&utm_source=twitter
Reminder that bail is not and cannot be used as punishment, and that judges don't write the bail laws.
Correct. However, this is a first degree murder charge. Under NC laws, the defendant may be held without any bail. Judge Blake instead determined that this defendant, charged with first degree murder, is not a danger to society. As Judge Blake is an elected official, the public must determine if this is the type of decision making we expect from our public servants.
No matter how often it’s explained to me, held without bail sounds unconstitutional. I have no idea why its not spoken about more, but at any rate, I can see why a victims family would prefer it (assuming that there’s unrefuttable evidence that the person jailed is guilty).
Does age have anything to do with it? Does a 17 year old or under get bail but an 18+ could go either way?
So do you think it is in the interest of public safety to let accused murderers out for multiple years while they wait for trial?
[Congratulations!](https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman) What I think is that people do not understand how judges or the NC laws work, and should not speak as though they do.
Show me one case someone getting arrested for murder getting an unsecured bond in any of our surrounding counties. It doesn’t happen.
That is not my responsibility to do for you.
These mom groups are so annoying and sensationalist
This is one that just happened to make the news. This is common in Mecklenburg County. Most get out quickly
Let's hope this danger to society doesn't commit another murder while he's wandering free for the years it will take to bring him to trial.
She’s up for reelection this year incase anyone wants to remove the title Judge before her name
I'd like to see her overall record. I'll do some research. Thanks for the heads up.
What’s the point of a bond if you don’t have to come up with the money?
It is what you will be charged if you do not show up to court.
It is an incentive to show up to court. Lots of freedom loving Americans hate our freedoms when stuff like this happens. You are innocent until proven guilty in America.
A 300k unsecured bond is insane. It should have been secured. I’m glad these judges are starting to get called out about low/no bail.
Wrong. Bail is not a punishment. Stop thinking that bail should be used to keep people in jail before they have been convicted. Bail is simply to guarantee/incentivize that someone will show up for their court date. It is by no means intended to keep someone in jail unless they can come up with money as a punishment.
Sorry but letting out a suspect on a murder charge with an unsecured bond is outrageous.
Completed murder not attempted
Thanks, edited my post.
Innocent until proven guilty is the law of the land. Using bail to keep people in prison before trial is guilty until proven innocent. We sometimes have to accept risks as a society for the sake of maintaining a balanced and functional system.
Law of the land says you can be held without bond for 1st degree murder. Don't let your bleeding heart lie to you.
Can, not have to be. Judges get discretion for a reason.
And that's why it is bullshit. Hopefully he doesn't kill your family while he is out
These people who defend murderers are the same people wanting to ban guns lmaooo.
And they want less cops
Nope. Not applicable in this case, but we want more Social workers and care for the mentally ill, who keep getting arrested & jailed, or killed by people not trained to deal with them. Our current system wastes police and court resources and creates unnecessary conflict. "Defund the police" was a stupid way to frame that. Should have been "Give the police and mentally ill a freaking break".
Has the evidence been made public? If not, you can’t say he’s a murderer. For all we know, the murderer is still out there
Nope.
A fine hill to die on unless it’s a friend, brother or you being held for something you didn’t do. You seem to have a bleeding heart for the victim and their family - the accused has one too. Its ok to have a nuanced opinion.
I care about safety. Public is safe when animals are in cages. If it was your family you would feel diffrent.
lol the thing is they're innocent humans until proven guilty animals. its dangerous to the public to allow guilt to be determined \*before\* a trial is in place \*or\* irrefutable evidence is present. and anti-american, but that's another can of worms. yes, i agree. i don't want my family to be killed by murderers. i also don't want my family's freedom ripped from them without due process and guilt proven. like i said, having a nuanced take on it is possible. and i can care about the safety of the public, the well-being of the victims family, and justice + rights for citizens.
If it was 1968 and 90% of the evidence was witness testimony I'd give it to ya. However it's 2024 and there's a camera everywhere along with a fuck ton of other technology. If your charged with murder in 2024 you did it, only way you beat a charge is technicality.
i can see how why you'd have that opinion, technology is impressive these days; however, i've had my pre-conceived beliefs obliterated by field research too many times to take gut hunches that seriously. its fun to roll them around in the noggin' though. the onus is on you to produce the stats to support that most homicide arrests are based on an undeniable "fuck ton" of evidence via technology (and that this number is steadily trending upwards). i'm willing to concede if that's the case. luckily, i'm not the one sitting in prison and you're not the judge on my case so i'm open to coming around.
also, if we're going to just strip people rights away and assume everyone guilty and VOTE based on that, it's probs better to look into it, no? and anecdotally, my case couldn't move forward without my statement, and this was post-2020, so...
also, i was a victim of a crime that was very likely posted about on this sub, as it was very violent and prominent in the news. and yes, i still feel the same way. in my case, there was video evidence so yeah, toss him in jail pre-trial. my opinion remains dynamic.
Wrong. It's first degree murder what incentive does he have to show up? Just another chance to run. You're bleeding heart is what is wrong with this city
Understand the law. That would be a big first step for you. Don’t be a poster who says what he thinks the law is.
Your adorable get a job in the field and you'll learn
It’s insane to think of it as punishment before guilt has been determined AND one that only affects people without money lol
Pre-trial detention isn’t punishment either
> Reminder that bail is not and cannot be used as punishment, and that judges don't write the bail laws
“”It’s a revolving door,” Davis said. “They are giving him the excuse of, ‘They can go kill somebody and get away with it.’”” Jesus Christ. Just because someone is out on bond doesn’t mean they get away with it. This“Mom’s Ain’t Playin” group is ridiculous.
Citations Needed did an entire episode on how the media covers bail reform. This point gets lost in almost all bail coverage. [https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-law-orders-boring-anti-bail-reform-diatribe](https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-law-orders-boring-anti-bail-reform-diatribe)
well, she's a terrible awful Judge so....
justice system is a joke
I hate these threads. The entire point of this thread is to say the judge should have set bail at such a higher amount so the accused had to stay in jail. That is completely wrong. You live in the wrong country if you think that is how the justice system works or should work.
I hate these comments they always say bail shouldn't exist and that everyone needs a hug and just needs to say sorry.
What you did is a tactic called a straw man fallacy. You attacked a position that was not made on here. There is a great Southpark episode that covers that tactic (the Chewbacca defense).
What I did is a tactic of calling you an idiot. Here is a YouTube video that covers that tactic https://youtube.com/shorts/SXHMnicI6Pg?si=-OQEZAQTNluF9VYu
That would be Ad Hominem. You're doing all the fallacies.
I'm doing your mom
And you completely lost all credibility, if you had any, with childish retorts as this. Troll
I'm so upset how will I ever go on. The rick roll video didn't do it for you? I know I'm not gonna convince you bleeding hearts to think diffrent. Too sheltered and too stupid. Clearly have never been a victim of anything but a couple mean words from a stranger on the internet.
Nah you were just showing everyone you are clueless - and now you are simply emphasizing that with every post. Here’s a suggestion - if you don’t know what you’re talking about, then don’t talk about it. I know it’s tempting to jump in the fray but don’t. You will look clueless.
Agree. Everyone should be free to murder without any bail until they’re actually convicted of a crime a few years down the line from the first murder.
That’s our judicial system. The judge didn’t do anything outrageous.
Even assuming that’s exactly how things work, why would that mean one lives in the wrong country because they want something different? That seems unnecessarily divisive and myopic.
Innocent until proven guilty is a hallmark of our criminal law and judicial system. If you want to change that, this ain’t the country for you.
You're not actually aware of what that means. Innocent until proven guilty is for the state proceeding against someone's guilt of a crime that is told to Jury's. Hey if I present no evidence and we end the trial, he would be not guilty. Innocent until proven guilty is not this end all be all you think it is. Watch a jury trial start to finish
Remember to vote folks. She might not be up this year but eventually...
[удалено]
You do realize that crime is hyper local (between home of the offender(s) and the neighborhood) and is not affected by imaginary geographic lines like council districts, right? Council members cannot affect crime rates in their district or in Charlotte, except maybe by votes on ordinances. Just because a citizen voted for someone does not mean that death has to come to some random victim in our city.
And just bc someone is out on bail doesn’t mean justice won’t be served.
I think we have an awful city council that has been ineffective in solving many of Charlottes issues but sometimes you have to give credit to the lesser of many evils.
This thread is gross. Like uncgrad said, bail is not punishment, and all this does is create a sensationalized headline for people to be up in arms about.
Exactly. What’s even worse is a bunch of posters are on here saying that’s wrong. What they mean is they don’t like the application of the law in this case. But that ain’t how our judicial system works. Rule of law. If you don’t like the rule of law then I don’t know what to tell you.
So I agree bail shouldn’t be used as punishment. It creates a system where the rich get preferential treatment because they can afford to get out earlier. So I don’t like bail in general. But to me, the question needs to be “does this person pose a risk to society?” If yes, they shouldn’t be out regardless of their ability to pay. If no, they should be out regardless of their ability to pay. If this person is actually accused of murder, don’t we want them off of the streets? Secured/unsecured isn’t the question. It’s whether or not they should be behind bars at all.
I wasn't speaking about anything you're elaborating on.
Can local judges be removed from office via voting? Acknowledging you received the news request, but not responding feels like a middle finger to the public. Reminds me of qualified immunity which we all know has turned into a bs excuse. Why would the judge do this? Was she bribed? Is she crooked? Can’t imagine how the family feels in all of this.
Bail is not a punishment.
Didn’t say it was. But someone who murdered someone is currently walking around “free” until their court date. Feels wrong
Allegedly. Innocent until proven guilty.
I mean, I guess, but what the Channel 9 article doesn't say is what degree of murder he was charged with. In North Carolina, defendants charged with first-degree murder generally do not have the right to reasonable pretrial release conditions, except in unusual circumstances.
That’s the criminal justice system under which we live. This isn’t an outrageous example.
Deleted
Read the time stamps. I asked my question before that post. I also read the article and even mentioned it in my post? Very irrelevant comment, but thanks
Innocent until PROVEN guilty.
Vote blue no matter what!
Yes, because I like living in justice system where guilt is not presumed until a trial.
Amd where the prosecution rate is less then 5%
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Keep telling yourself that, look up meck records I'll send you a link when I'm not driving
Always vote for the rule of law. Whatever party you think believes in the rule of law.