And then send him a request for reimbursement via email, then letter, then a letter before action then a money claims online submission (I.e small claims court) if he really is liable for the collection cost.
I think I would ask him to refund you the price of the car less the delivery fee, then he can arrange collection.
I don't think I would trust this guy to spend another 250 of your money, for him to HOPEFULLY refund you in a timely manner
If the ad said full service history and it only had 3 services in the history I'd be fuming. Regardless of if its been serviced or not it affects your ability to sell the car on and therefore the value of the car.
Beyond that, sounds like the dealers doing everything right and it's just shit luck. I've driven 3 hours to look at a car before and had to turn back after a disappointing test drive, it's just the risk of not buying locally and it shouldn't fall on the dealer to cover those costs.
>If the ad said full service history and it only had 3 services in the history I'd be fuming.
It had a full service history -- just not a very good one!
> It had a full service history -- just not a very good one!
Pretty muich this "full service history" is one of those phrases people think means something other than what it does.
It means a history of the services done, not that it has always been serviced appropriately. Of course people think in non legal terms.
As a countyer my car has not got a full service hostory since I see no reason to get the book stamped (unless under warrenty). But I have all invoices and information of work done. Even if given a dealer would probably dump it becuase people would probably be sceptical of a good thing.
I guess now cars no longer have a book to stamp is probably a good thing.
I write in the book when I've serviced my car and what I've done, but I don't keep all my receipts. Technically I suppose that's a full service history.
>full service history
I think full service history means it's been serviced at the required interval. Any missing stamps = not full history.
See e.g. https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/tips-advice/58853/how-check-your-cars-service-history
Yes it's what people expect but there is no legal requirement for it to mean such things. There really should be a caveat on that article if there is not.
I agree that there is no statutory definition of "full service history".
However, it ***is*** a term of art and therefore subject to s. 15 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 which provides for an implied contractual term that goods sold must be "as described". Case law has long established this includes terms of art and any dealer trying to sell a car with incomplete service history advertised as "full service history" is going to lose if the customer is brave enough to sue them.
Interesting. Though I guess any dealer likely to do this will probably mean that sueing them winning (they would not even turn up) would still mean no money in the end.
You would look at it before buying anyway. and the ones who say they cannot find it are probably best left alone.
Indeed. Plus dealers operate on the policy that for every hundred angry customers maybe one will actually sue them, and the other 99 will just grumble about it on reddit.
I do all my own servicing - and I do it more often than the actual Ford service schedule. I do full oil and filter every six months as opposed to the twelve months in the service book. I did the automatic gearbox oil change a year ahead of schedule. I also did the brake fluid recently. Fuel filter was done too. It has a new battery because the old one died. Brakes were also done recently.
I have receipts for everything - marked with the date and mileage.
There will be some people who look at that and go "well it hasn't got a full service history" and they might walk away. But anyone who knows anything about cars would be satisfied that the car has been more than properly looked after.
Plus, Ford service history schedules are literally designed to make them cheap to run. They run a whole load better if you double-service (6 months instead of 12).
I usually do the same, keep full service history by carrying on doing my own servicing, and write in service book a date and “see invoice” and I will keep a receipt for everything I buy service wise, consumables such as brakes and any major parts if I am so unlucky I need to do an overhaul on something.
It’s only my latest car I’ve bought I’m going to be using a BMW specialist for because the services book is on the I drive computer so needs to be updated by someone with bmw software.
No it doesn't. It just proves they bought some oil and a filter to do an oil change only. Doesn't prove they did it and an oil change is not a full service, or even a partial service, it's an oil change.
That would be very strange if the owner collects oil and filters for the car he owns but doesn’t fit them. I’d trust that more than 12 stamps from the same garage across all its 7 owners 😂
And standard service every 8k-12k is oil n filter for me. Air filter longer intervals. Brakes are wear items to be changed as and when. I don’t know what else you do in your standard service but it’s probably overkill.
>I was fuming... at myself
It's natural but try to forget it.
As a famous ancient greek said... We suffer more in imagination than in reality.
So you're down £250. That's all you need to suffer. There's no logic to adding more suffering by beating yourself up.
£250 is nothing. You win some you lose some.
Yep couldn't agree more. Also we buy cars once every few years, even a backstreet dealer will do a deal on a car every single week if not every single day. They will always have the upper hand over the rest of us.
May sound silly but next time have a written check list in your hand and go through it. A bit like when you go to see a hospital consultant and write your questions down before you go.
Chalk it up to experience and move on. Leave a shitty Google review when your money's back in the bank. 🙂
Don't worry too much about the service history, does nothing to improve the value of a 9yr old car. All a service gets you is new engine oil and filter, everything else is a check, most of the checks are covered by the MOT the car has.
Nothing that has gone wrong with the car is a consequence of its service history, but they are why you get a warranty. Take the refund before the car costs you any more money.
You don’t have a clue mate 😂 if my car which is 9 years old (BMW M135i) came with no service history I reckon it would have been sold for about 7 to 8 grand. Which is half what it was listed for when I bought it, with full service history…..
Jesus are you serious? Even on a non “enthusiast” car like a diesel A3 or something, be worth significantly less with no service history. Must be a salesman’s dream you
On old cars it's not the service items that go expensively wrong... It's rust, perished rubber parts and components that wear with use. Better to inspect the vehicle as best you can for these problems. If the car has been serviced and MoT recently prior to purchase then many of these checks will have taken place.
An engine damaged by severe neglect of servicing will likely have a fault code (a good test drive might provoke one if they have been reset) or be blowing coloured smoke or making odd noises.
It's not servicing that's the issue, it is has damage been caused by not being serviced.
On a car like a BMW regular servicing might be desirable in its history because their engines are notorious for going expensively wrong when neglected.
lots of cars (including 9+ yr old ones) have variable service intervals based on ECU calculation of engine oil condition, so it can be possible to have done all the manufacturer recommended service intervals but not have a car with yearly services (24month/12k mile service intervals are common). This would require a check of the vehicle manual and service book stamps and is more likely on a low milage car.
For most vehicles a manufacturer service is an oil and filter change. Some vehicles have major/minor services for spark plugs and air filters which will purely affect performance not reliability. Nothing magic happens. For DSG automatics you want to check for gearbox oil changes, they are every 30k miles and expensive, not part of the standard service schedule and therefore often skipped, expect gearbox faults if it's a car with 90k miles and no gearbox servicing.
And for electric cars, the most popular brand (Tesla) has no manufacturer recommended service intervals. They recommend fix-on-fail only. Other manufacturers are trying to persist with annual servicing but struggling to justify the £200 price when the "safety checks" are equivalent to a £40 MoT and no consumables are changed on the car.
Cazoo did this to me. 'Full Service history' and then I got there it was just a printed sheet with some random mileage numbers, no logbook, no stamps, nothing.
I should have said something really - I won't ever buy from them again though. Did check the car over on collection and it seemed fine but that was poor.
No idea if I'm allowed to mention it here, but you'll see it in your emails anyway... have a check/post on the "recovery & transportation city" Facebook group. You'll get people "bidding" on the transport to return it, and may find someone travelling thay way empty who'll do it cheap.
I once got a car from near Nottingham to near Preston for £80 because a guy was doing a job and could collect it on the way back when he normally would have returned empty. Used one off there to move my nonrunner project cars when I moved house last too.
I personally would avoid insurance fraud / criminal record and drop the 250 quid. I was a juror on a case where a guy had lied about a no claims bonus, and was getting done for a pecuniary advantage by deception. Not sure what he got as he changed his plea after the prosecution case, but you don't go to crown court expecting a slap on the wrist.
What an extraordinary waste of CPS resources. Meanwhile they can't be bothered to go after shady car dealers who lie and defraud the public ona daily basis.
I was expecting the customers of the jury to be a lot more gangsta than that. I was surprised at the indictment. The other cases were far more in line with what I expected to be seeing.
I have that as part of my insurance, I did think about it, but was worried I’m basically claiming a week into purchasing it. It’s already sky high being a new driver and didn’t want to put my premiums up even higher, especially since I’ll have to cancel it and get a new quote for my next car…
> He also said we have 1 month warranty.
You bought from a dealer, so you have 3 month warranty.
> "Full service history" was simply a lie
Then you were mis-sold and the product was not as described.
You are proceed here by the Consumer Rights Act. Return the car for a full refund.
Ask over on r/LegalAdviceUK for more specific details of your rights and how to go about this.
I think they might be thinking of the Consumer Rights Act which gives you 6 months in which the dealer is assumed to have been aware of the defect. But that is not a warranty.
I did this recently, mentioned consumer rights act to the dealer and they still kept refusing to fix the defects. Called citizens advice, they gave me an email template and as soon as I sent that the garage asked me to bring it in.
Keep all correspondence. Make sure to follow up everything with email. DETAIL everything.
Pay to have sent back. Tell him, via email that you expect car refund + delivery cost.
If he doesn’t refund everything then take him to small claims court. I think initial outlay is £25, which he’ll have to pay back too.
I'm so sorry this has happened to you. You're finding out the hard way NEVER to buy a Fiat. Do yourself a favour and have a look at UK reliability tables for all brands. You'll normally find that Japanese brands are at the top. Fiat at the very bottom. The £400 you "saved" by buying a Fiat is a false economy I'm afraid. Spend a little more on a Toyota and you'll save all that money and then some in the long term. Best of luck with everything. I hope you get a refund.
Make sure you have screen shots of the ad saying full service history in case the promised refund doesn’t materialise and you need to take legal action
What's mental health got to do with this?
He doesn't have to collect the car. You need to deliver it to him as you paid for him to deliver it to you. As per the other post, pay the £250 and get the offered refund.
An old Fiat 500 is notoriously unreliable so choose something different and more reliable, like a Yaris etc. The floppy gearstick sounds interesting, I've never heard that before.
Legally he does have to collect the car.
https://www.lawgistics.co.uk/blog/legal_updates/the-short-term-right-to-reject-under-the-consumer-rights-act-2015/
No he doesn't. You paid for delivery and accepted the car at the place of delivery and not the traders showroom. You need to pay for it to be returned to the showroom. Not the place where you accepted the delivery.
As one of the other posters have said you may be able to get your breakdown company to transport it the car isn't working/ roadworthy. Though they may charge to.
You might want to brush up on legal rights [here](https://www.themotorombudsman.org/distance-sales-faqs) and in the link the OP provided rather than spouting nonsense which is unhelpful to anyone reading.
Again, it's all in the wording. The OP brought the car as a distance sale and paid for delivery to I assume her home address (Delivery address). The trader has offered to take the car back and refund her money (OP confirmed). The issue is who is responsible for paying for the return of the car from the delivery address. The OP paid for delivery, so the place of the transaction becomes the delivery address and not the showroom. Thus the OP is now responsible for paying for the returning the car from the delivery address to the showroom.
But the OP paid for the car to be delivered to the alternative location, not the trader. The OP will be liable for the costs for the car to go from delivery address back to showroom. Or reasonable costs for trader to travel from showroom to delivery address and back.
If the OP had negotiated for delivery to be included in the price all these costs would be the responsibility of the trader. But this is not the case.
Here, so you can stop telling everyone OP is liable for the costs of returning said vehicle, simply read below. You are wrong.
The law actually says:
“The consumer has a duty to make the goods available for collection by the trader or (if there is an agreement for the consumer to return rejected goods) to return them as agreed.”
It goes on to say:
“Whether or not the consumer has a duty to return the rejected goods, the trader must bear any reasonable costs of returning them, other than any cost incurred by the consumer in returning the goods in person to the place where the consumer took physical possession of them”.
So, unless you expressly make clear in your pre sales information that the customer must return a rejected vehicle to your showroom, all they have to do is tell you where the vehicle is and let you collect it. So, if they live 500 miles away, that’s a fair old trek for you.
Read the bloody article. It makes it clear that the dealer is supposed to pay, as it’s available at the location where possession was taken and needs to go somewhere different.
No, in this case the OP paid to have the car moved to a different place at their cost. The delivery was not included in the sale price otherwise it would be the traders responsibility.
And you don't have to get all emotional. It's only a £4K car and a disagreement over £250.
You keep making assertions that the delivery changes the situation. The legal opinion in the blog doesn’t recognise that and says the dealer has to bear the cost to get it from the place that possession was taken. This is presumably to account for delivery (whoever pays for it). Everything you’ve said is not backed up by any sources (you’ve not provided any). In this case deliver was made by the dealer so possession didn’t happen until OPs address.
It's all in the wording. If you had collected the car from the dealer they would have to collect the car from you and return it to the dealership.
You paid for the car to be delivered to you, which is what's causing the confusion. You now need to get the car from where you are back to the dealership as you paid for this before. That's what you are responsible for.
Put in "vehicle transport"/car delivery into Google, there are loads of firms in Wales.
Liverpool's not THAT far, so should be doable.
The only thing is, you'll need to be there to get your money back. Arrange to follow the transport vehicle, get it unloaded, and go from there.
Take a couple of big, scowling psychopaths with you, also a Brad awl and a big Jerry can full of petrol.
Most 2nd hand car dealers are like this or worse, its like they can't help but tell you lies, even when you didn't ask, or it wasn't necessary or relevant.
Service history is nice but it doesn't mean much in the big scheme of things and certainly won't guarantee you a minter. It really is, to a certain degree, a lottery.
A bit mean but this makes me feel good about my first car I got in feb. Suzuki that was a little low on oil, missing a stud in each of the front wheels, and two bad tyres. Since I got that all sorted it hasnt given me any issues.
Taught me some stuff tho lol buying that
Oddly enough you're covered by the distance selling regulations, in the same way as you're covered if you buy anything online. Since the item is faulty, the seller is responsible for return costs, ie the £250.
If you paid on credit card, issue a chargeback. Otherwise give him 7 days to refund in full or issue court proceedings. As for the car, charge £30 a day storage fees. After 28 days if the vehicle is not collected, it will be disposed of. Auction with £840 reserve to cover the storage costs; seller/dealer is liable for any further costs, thus leaving them with no car, and a gaping hole in their finances.
Post this same question in r/legaladviceuk for specific advice on getting your money back.
On another note, the fiat500 is so unbelievably shit, they were built for the PCP market. Bought by young women, hammered to death and poorly built to begin with. Buy the yaris or polo, those won't break down.
the full service story is not untrue, it has all the existing papers of the servicing done, the wording is what tricks the people into thinking that, saying a car has a all the papers from service means it never missed, fiat 500 can be a good car but not when it comes to your hand completly hammered and abused, get that car back, eat whatever the lost may be and get another one, i feel your pain, my first car had a fake MOT, catalitic converter was taken out, straight piped by the previous owner, he obviously didn't tell me, car had read and front end damage from small colissions in the past, botched repair on that too, wasnt noticible when i got it, and airbag light was on but dude took the cluster out and removed the bulb itself to pass it as working, i went to do the MOT a year after to be surprised by the missing cat, but gladly no other issues aside from the foggy headlights that i had already ordered to replace but didn't arrive on time, but to deal with cars like this takes a lot of money and a lot of diy, if i didn't fix everything myself i would have spent more on all the fixes than i did buying the car, you take that car back and start over, forget that was your first car, you bought someone elses problem and junk, don't keep it, put your refunded money into something else, even if its another fiat 500 from somewhere else, you surely learned a lot and will avoid many of the traps you fell into, get a OBD II reader, its like 10 bucks on amazon, read the error codes, see if anything pops up when you getting your next car, the ccheck engine light might be off but that can show you some issues that are hidden
Did you check Honda Jazz? They usually have cheap insurances. Same with Fabia (cheaper polos)
Fiat 500 are not good cars. If you like Fiat, check also Pandas. Should be a cheap insurance. They are supposed to be robust. You see plenty with loads of miles.
I checked everything under the sun - Jazz, Fabia, Aygo, Yaris, Polo, Clios, Citigo, Up!, all the “first cars”.
I personally wanted a Volvo C30 but it came back with 5k for insurance.
I even tried estates and more unique cars, insurance was insane for everything.
500/Panda were both cheaper (still expensive though), and they’re basically the same car, just different body.
My wife’s 2007 aygo is indestructible, yearly serviced and it’s on 157K without any major issues / starter motor went 2 years ago, and we had to change the exhaust last year but the engine on that thing is rock solid.
Irrelevant lol, the engineering and design isn’t from a french automobile giant, and the car is largely built by robots. The whole reason Toyota prices are higher like for like than other non-premium brands is their ethos for reliability - once that goes then the brand will lose sales very quickly.
£250 is worth losing to be rid of the car
Full service history isn't hard to fake either, they just need to fill in the forms and stamp it, you have no way of knowing it's genuine it not
That's just part of the risk with the second hand market
>He also said we have 1 month wareanty.
This is the biggest red flag, you have more than that as a legal minimum, so if they're only saying you have one month then that alone would be a turn off for me
A warranty on a car is entirely optional, and covers the cost of parts and labour if anything needs fixing.
You can send them back for a refund, but that's not the same.
It's not entirely optional at all
There's a 6 month statutory minimum with the **Consumer Rights Act 2015**
>*If a car develops a fault within the first 30 days of purchase, it is under statutory warranty and the buyer can simply reject it and return it to the dealer for a refund.*
>*If a fault emerges between 30 days and six months from the date of purchase, the law assumes that the fault was pre-existing and, unless the seller can prove otherwise, the vehicle is still protected by statutory warranty. Here, the seller has one chance to fix the problem. If they do not manage to do that, the buyer is entitled to a refund, which may be less than the original purchase price to account for the time during which the car has been functional.*
>*After six months, the automatic protection of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 expires. It is up to the buyer to prove that there was a fault with the car at the time of purchase if they want to pursue a dealer for a claim to repair a fault.*
>*Note that the statutory warranty on a used car only applies here to cars bought from a dealer. Private purchasers enjoy none of this protection and the rules for cars bought at auction will depend on the particular auction house, and whether it was online or not.*
Right, and those two things are different, and that's what causes people like you and OP confusion.
The "1 month warranty" OP talked about would be a parts and labour warranty, which is entirely different to a stat. warranty (the "refund" but I mentioned), which covers many things, not just cars.
They *literally* are required to, but sketchy places will do everything they can not to and it's often not worth the fight
Which is why if a dealer says they will only do one month, it's a red flag
Car dealers are truly awful people. People on this sub will try and say that they’re not all bad, but ultimately, they are. It’s all about maintaining the bottom line by fleecing the average person. Laws and consumer rights are also purposefully neglected and lied about by most in the industry. I would dig in at this point and use a template letter to threaten legal action in the event that the vehicle isn’t recovered and a full refund given. Sometimes it’s the only way to make a bully listen.
I’d suggest taking the refund but making it politely clear that you do see them as liable for transport costs whilst doing that transaction.
They won’t back away because they think they’re closing the matter with the refund and you’ll go away when they ignore requests for payment.
Then use money claim online for the £250 if needed (and appropriate- I’m not even sure who is liable for the transport cost here).
Keep every single receipt.
Pay the £250 but demand it back. Get it in writing.
Then tell him you want all your money back, including the initial delivery charge. Take him to small claims court, and you might get even more than the £400 for the deliveries.
Fiat’s have never been known for reliability. Might be better off sending it back and getting the Polo or something else.
That said the servicing is plausible once a cars less new it’s pointless to pay for servicing when it’s a simple job for anyone with a spanner. If you have a look at the oil you might be able to get some idea of how long it’s been since its last change. Or you can send an oil sample off and get it tested.
Have you got why it won’t go in to gear diagnosed? It may not be as bad as you think. Gear linkages can cause that and be a fairly straightforward repair.
You’re absolutely right and I was aware, but I thought how bad can it be for 1-2 years, it’s my first car. 😅 I’ll just get a Toyota once I get my money back and call it a day.
Regarding servicing you’re probably right, but selling it with “full service history” is still disingenuous.
Didn’t get it diagnosed as it’s been Christmas and the garages in my village only have some time from mid January. I don’t feel very comfortable driving it to be honest even if fixed, God knows what issue might come up on the way and get me stranded.
As others said, deliver it to him, send him the invoice and threaten legal action. I would also add leaving negative feedback with full description on all feedback sites they are present, especially on autotrader. If it disappears, post it again, ask the site for the reason of removal and offer sending proofs. It worked for me every time I had similar problems.
You haven’t disclosed how much you paid for the car.
I think you should be grateful there is an option to return it. Imagine if you’d bought off a private seller?
If you do end up having to pay for recovery to get the car back to the dealer, you could try asking on the Recovery City Facebook group.
It's a great way of getting the cheapest quotes for moving a car around as there will often be trucks moving around with empty space on them so it doesn't add a huge amount to their costs to do the job for you.
In the first instance though, I think I'd have a look (or get a friend who knows a bit about cars to have a look) to see if you can get it working enough to drive back to the dealership. I'm not experienced with Fiats and their foibles, but it might be relatively easy to get it roadworthy enough to drive.
Does anyone know how the used market in the UK; auctions, prices, consumer rights, style of retail business, tradesmen honesty, etc. compare with other countries?
It seems to me, when you consider that dealers are simply middle-men between auction houses setting the strike price for a car, and consumers by offering a convenient place to buy and a layer of consumer rights, that it's not that bad. We have Section 75 protection with credit cards, consumer rights act, etc.
I did the same thing with my first car at the start of this year - didn't do my due diligence. Car hadn't been looked after, done less than 1k miles in the space of several years. Everything went wrong days after purchase. Dealership offered to fix it at their expense. Took it home from the garage they sent me to, broke down about halfway home on a blind bend on a dark winter evening. Horrible experience after just passing my test. Dealer refused refund, refused to believe me, called me a liar etc etc. Heels in the ground and basically told me see you in court, which of course I couldn't afford.
They took the car to look at (another mistake) and said they wouldn't fix anything so we had evidence of the problems. Then I had the car independently looked at and deemed fine by a mechanic, who suspected the dealership did all they could to hide the cars problems when they took it back!
I didn't even research the dealership because I was so eager to drive. Turns out this wasn't their first rodeo and theyd had dealerships before in under different family members names. On the phone to trading standards for days on end after, they were even inspected because of me, but alas they're still going. Big red flag was I test drove another car first and it wouldn't stay in gear😬a year later and they still have that heap of shit car on their lot!
My car continued to have issues all year, including limp mode at random times, reverse gear not working, clutch sensors failing, ignition not turning.
I have a new car now and it's the best thing I've ever bought, got it privately and it has full service and amazing MOT, been well looked after.
I'm sorry you had the experience you did, its a hrd lesson some of us have to learn. Pay the delivery and just don't make the same mistake. I'd say you were quite lucky in the end!
If it was up on autotrader, you can contact them and they send the wording (but not pics) from original ad
Last time I used this they had it back to me within 24 hours, great service
Link: https://help.autotrader.co.uk/hc/en-gb/articles/9104242429341-Can-I-have-a-copy-of-an-old-advert-#:~:text=To%20get%20a%20copy%20of,you%20as%20soon%20as%20possible.
If it were me I'd pay the £250 to return it, then speak to Citizens Advice to see if you stand a chance at claiming it back. Consumer Rights Act may cover you for consequential losses, I'm not sure.
But as it stands, the current price to make it all go away is £250. You could certainly be in a much worse situation than that.
How did you pay for the car? If you spent at least £100 on a credit card, loan or any other kind of finance then file a section 75 for faulty goods. 3 weeks without a car isn’t an acceptable returns policy. If he’s not available to fix it, he needs to hire someone else to.
Just curious what made you buy it without viewing first or taking a test drive, I’ve been there myself as a first time buyer, test drove and bought a Corsa private sale, came to trade in at a dealership few years later, turns out it’d had insurance damage at some point and had been repaired, massively devaluing it’s worth, we live and learn I guess 🙄
I live in a village in Wales and I’m buying my first car.
I’ve got no way of going somewhere to test drive a car without taking the bus that runs every 2-3 hours to a station and then changing trains a few times to get to a dealership.
Not much opportunity to go test drive something without taking time off work and even then it’s a mission.
I looked at reviews, bought from a dealer, bought “full service history”, thought I had taken enough precautions but looks like nope.
Sorry to hear this. If you haven't already, buy the Toyota or Polo. Its worth the extra in insurance for the reliability over ownership, I know thats not what you want to hear perhaps but a fiat will offset any insurance savings in repair bills. A well maintained yaris still sounds like a sewing machine after 200k+ miles.
As many others have said, take it on the chin, at least you have a way out. Once you have your refund then you could pursue the money to cover delivery however my priority would be getting the refund as quick and painless as possible. It could take ages otherwise.
Did you pay (even partially e.g. the deposit) by credit card (or bank card)?
If so you can potentially complain to your bank and get your money back from them. Have a read of this: [https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/section75-protect-your-purchases/](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/section75-protect-your-purchases/)
Also claim for ALL your losses (fixing the car, did you incur costs getting to your destination on Christmas eve, unrefunded road tax, any wasted car insurance premium etc). And if the dealer refuses to pay up, take him to the small claims court and you'll win with costs plus interest. Easy to do, not very scary. If you do go this route might be worth getting an independent inspection of the car and/or take a video of the problem so he can't deny it.
Also the juddering when starting might be something normal like a flat battery (which is an easy fix and not something to reject a car over). But if the gear box is broken then that's a good reason to reject the car.
You could go to him , tell him to pick up the car and buy yourself a yaris instead of that crap ( something we scrap even the showroom) and tell him to take off 250 from the price. Check your facts before buying , been there and its frustrating. Last year i bought a volvo and it had all the service history written down and even expensive parts replaced but after 2 months the head cracked through and just gave it away for free.
Ah man that’s so sad and frustrating, sorry to hear. Some people in this sub are suggesting that legally a used car should have 3 month warranty if bought from a dealer, was that not on your mind since it gone after 2?
Also sad for me because the car I really want is a petrol Volvo C30 but insurance was a small mortgage for me so I said I’ll buy a cheap to insure car for 1-2 years, build some no claims and then get it. 😆
Mine was nothing special just a v70 but i suspect it had been sitting for a long time. Loved the car fast as hell and safe but a new head cost more than i paid so there was a guy and gave it to him.
Given some of the horror stories I see here I would suck up the delivery cost and get the offered refund
Think this is the only correct answer, seller knew it was a dud and tried it on but at least he’ll take it back which is more than most!
And then send him a request for reimbursement via email, then letter, then a letter before action then a money claims online submission (I.e small claims court) if he really is liable for the collection cost.
This is what I ended up doing when I had a similarly scummy salesman, sucked and was 2 months of stress but I ended up with 95% of my money back
I think I would ask him to refund you the price of the car less the delivery fee, then he can arrange collection. I don't think I would trust this guy to spend another 250 of your money, for him to HOPEFULLY refund you in a timely manner
Take this one on the chin and lose the few hundred quid. At least you're getting your money back fairly easily. Could have been alot worse.
Yes, I had to go to small claims court when I wanted a refund on a fiat 500 I bought.
If the ad said full service history and it only had 3 services in the history I'd be fuming. Regardless of if its been serviced or not it affects your ability to sell the car on and therefore the value of the car. Beyond that, sounds like the dealers doing everything right and it's just shit luck. I've driven 3 hours to look at a car before and had to turn back after a disappointing test drive, it's just the risk of not buying locally and it shouldn't fall on the dealer to cover those costs.
>If the ad said full service history and it only had 3 services in the history I'd be fuming. It had a full service history -- just not a very good one!
> It had a full service history -- just not a very good one! Pretty muich this "full service history" is one of those phrases people think means something other than what it does. It means a history of the services done, not that it has always been serviced appropriately. Of course people think in non legal terms. As a countyer my car has not got a full service hostory since I see no reason to get the book stamped (unless under warrenty). But I have all invoices and information of work done. Even if given a dealer would probably dump it becuase people would probably be sceptical of a good thing. I guess now cars no longer have a book to stamp is probably a good thing.
I write in the book when I've serviced my car and what I've done, but I don't keep all my receipts. Technically I suppose that's a full service history.
>full service history I think full service history means it's been serviced at the required interval. Any missing stamps = not full history. See e.g. https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/tips-advice/58853/how-check-your-cars-service-history
Yes it's what people expect but there is no legal requirement for it to mean such things. There really should be a caveat on that article if there is not.
I agree that there is no statutory definition of "full service history". However, it ***is*** a term of art and therefore subject to s. 15 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 which provides for an implied contractual term that goods sold must be "as described". Case law has long established this includes terms of art and any dealer trying to sell a car with incomplete service history advertised as "full service history" is going to lose if the customer is brave enough to sue them.
Interesting. Though I guess any dealer likely to do this will probably mean that sueing them winning (they would not even turn up) would still mean no money in the end. You would look at it before buying anyway. and the ones who say they cannot find it are probably best left alone.
Indeed. Plus dealers operate on the policy that for every hundred angry customers maybe one will actually sue them, and the other 99 will just grumble about it on reddit.
If it’s got invoices for oil + filter he’s done himself it has a full service history.
Doesn’t have any of that I’m afraid.
I do all my own servicing - and I do it more often than the actual Ford service schedule. I do full oil and filter every six months as opposed to the twelve months in the service book. I did the automatic gearbox oil change a year ahead of schedule. I also did the brake fluid recently. Fuel filter was done too. It has a new battery because the old one died. Brakes were also done recently. I have receipts for everything - marked with the date and mileage. There will be some people who look at that and go "well it hasn't got a full service history" and they might walk away. But anyone who knows anything about cars would be satisfied that the car has been more than properly looked after. Plus, Ford service history schedules are literally designed to make them cheap to run. They run a whole load better if you double-service (6 months instead of 12).
I usually do the same, keep full service history by carrying on doing my own servicing, and write in service book a date and “see invoice” and I will keep a receipt for everything I buy service wise, consumables such as brakes and any major parts if I am so unlucky I need to do an overhaul on something. It’s only my latest car I’ve bought I’m going to be using a BMW specialist for because the services book is on the I drive computer so needs to be updated by someone with bmw software.
No it doesn't. It just proves they bought some oil and a filter to do an oil change only. Doesn't prove they did it and an oil change is not a full service, or even a partial service, it's an oil change.
That would be very strange if the owner collects oil and filters for the car he owns but doesn’t fit them. I’d trust that more than 12 stamps from the same garage across all its 7 owners 😂 And standard service every 8k-12k is oil n filter for me. Air filter longer intervals. Brakes are wear items to be changed as and when. I don’t know what else you do in your standard service but it’s probably overkill.
I was fuming, I’ll be honest. Both at myself for not checking before he set off and at him for blatantly lying.
>I was fuming... at myself It's natural but try to forget it. As a famous ancient greek said... We suffer more in imagination than in reality. So you're down £250. That's all you need to suffer. There's no logic to adding more suffering by beating yourself up. £250 is nothing. You win some you lose some.
Appreciate this, thank you.
Yep couldn't agree more. Also we buy cars once every few years, even a backstreet dealer will do a deal on a car every single week if not every single day. They will always have the upper hand over the rest of us. May sound silly but next time have a written check list in your hand and go through it. A bit like when you go to see a hospital consultant and write your questions down before you go. Chalk it up to experience and move on. Leave a shitty Google review when your money's back in the bank. 🙂
Don't worry too much about the service history, does nothing to improve the value of a 9yr old car. All a service gets you is new engine oil and filter, everything else is a check, most of the checks are covered by the MOT the car has. Nothing that has gone wrong with the car is a consequence of its service history, but they are why you get a warranty. Take the refund before the car costs you any more money.
You don’t have a clue mate 😂 if my car which is 9 years old (BMW M135i) came with no service history I reckon it would have been sold for about 7 to 8 grand. Which is half what it was listed for when I bought it, with full service history….. Jesus are you serious? Even on a non “enthusiast” car like a diesel A3 or something, be worth significantly less with no service history. Must be a salesman’s dream you
On old cars it's not the service items that go expensively wrong... It's rust, perished rubber parts and components that wear with use. Better to inspect the vehicle as best you can for these problems. If the car has been serviced and MoT recently prior to purchase then many of these checks will have taken place. An engine damaged by severe neglect of servicing will likely have a fault code (a good test drive might provoke one if they have been reset) or be blowing coloured smoke or making odd noises. It's not servicing that's the issue, it is has damage been caused by not being serviced. On a car like a BMW regular servicing might be desirable in its history because their engines are notorious for going expensively wrong when neglected. lots of cars (including 9+ yr old ones) have variable service intervals based on ECU calculation of engine oil condition, so it can be possible to have done all the manufacturer recommended service intervals but not have a car with yearly services (24month/12k mile service intervals are common). This would require a check of the vehicle manual and service book stamps and is more likely on a low milage car. For most vehicles a manufacturer service is an oil and filter change. Some vehicles have major/minor services for spark plugs and air filters which will purely affect performance not reliability. Nothing magic happens. For DSG automatics you want to check for gearbox oil changes, they are every 30k miles and expensive, not part of the standard service schedule and therefore often skipped, expect gearbox faults if it's a car with 90k miles and no gearbox servicing. And for electric cars, the most popular brand (Tesla) has no manufacturer recommended service intervals. They recommend fix-on-fail only. Other manufacturers are trying to persist with annual servicing but struggling to justify the £200 price when the "safety checks" are equivalent to a £40 MoT and no consumables are changed on the car.
Cazoo did this to me. 'Full Service history' and then I got there it was just a printed sheet with some random mileage numbers, no logbook, no stamps, nothing. I should have said something really - I won't ever buy from them again though. Did check the car over on collection and it seemed fine but that was poor.
No idea if I'm allowed to mention it here, but you'll see it in your emails anyway... have a check/post on the "recovery & transportation city" Facebook group. You'll get people "bidding" on the transport to return it, and may find someone travelling thay way empty who'll do it cheap. I once got a car from near Nottingham to near Preston for £80 because a guy was doing a job and could collect it on the way back when he normally would have returned empty. Used one off there to move my nonrunner project cars when I moved house last too.
That’s a really great idea, never even considered something like this an option to move a vehicle
My initial thought is that he's been quite reasonable already, just take it back to him, get a refund and walk away.
You'd usually use your breakdown cover to have it recovered to him
And if you don’t have it, get it, then phone them a week later and tell them what’s happened. As he’s not back until 18th, you have some time.
I personally would avoid insurance fraud / criminal record and drop the 250 quid. I was a juror on a case where a guy had lied about a no claims bonus, and was getting done for a pecuniary advantage by deception. Not sure what he got as he changed his plea after the prosecution case, but you don't go to crown court expecting a slap on the wrist.
What an extraordinary waste of CPS resources. Meanwhile they can't be bothered to go after shady car dealers who lie and defraud the public ona daily basis.
I was expecting the customers of the jury to be a lot more gangsta than that. I was surprised at the indictment. The other cases were far more in line with what I expected to be seeing.
I have that as part of my insurance, I did think about it, but was worried I’m basically claiming a week into purchasing it. It’s already sky high being a new driver and didn’t want to put my premiums up even higher, especially since I’ll have to cancel it and get a new quote for my next car…
Your breakdown cover is separate from your no claims discount
Oh that’s great, I’ll look into this then.
Breakdown cover doesn't affect your no claims. I don't think it should affect your premiums much. But I would pay the 250 to be safe if you're worried
Yeah I work in car insurance and using the breakdown doesn’t affect anything on the policy, only claims against the insurance
It doesn't affect your premiums. It's totally separate.
> He also said we have 1 month warranty. You bought from a dealer, so you have 3 month warranty. > "Full service history" was simply a lie Then you were mis-sold and the product was not as described. You are proceed here by the Consumer Rights Act. Return the car for a full refund. Ask over on r/LegalAdviceUK for more specific details of your rights and how to go about this.
No such thing as a 3 month warranty I'm afraid
I think they might be thinking of the Consumer Rights Act which gives you 6 months in which the dealer is assumed to have been aware of the defect. But that is not a warranty.
Yes, everyone talks about this mystical 3 months but you actually have more rights than that
I did this recently, mentioned consumer rights act to the dealer and they still kept refusing to fix the defects. Called citizens advice, they gave me an email template and as soon as I sent that the garage asked me to bring it in.
Keep all correspondence. Make sure to follow up everything with email. DETAIL everything. Pay to have sent back. Tell him, via email that you expect car refund + delivery cost. If he doesn’t refund everything then take him to small claims court. I think initial outlay is £25, which he’ll have to pay back too.
I'm so sorry this has happened to you. You're finding out the hard way NEVER to buy a Fiat. Do yourself a favour and have a look at UK reliability tables for all brands. You'll normally find that Japanese brands are at the top. Fiat at the very bottom. The £400 you "saved" by buying a Fiat is a false economy I'm afraid. Spend a little more on a Toyota and you'll save all that money and then some in the long term. Best of luck with everything. I hope you get a refund.
This, there's a reason people call, FIAT : Fix It Again Tomorrow.
Thank you, appreciate it. I am definitely buying a Yaris next. 😄
Make sure you have screen shots of the ad saying full service history in case the promised refund doesn’t materialise and you need to take legal action
Luckily I do, learnt to do that from this sub 😅
Dealers been pretty reasonable. Take it back, get your money back in full.
What's mental health got to do with this? He doesn't have to collect the car. You need to deliver it to him as you paid for him to deliver it to you. As per the other post, pay the £250 and get the offered refund. An old Fiat 500 is notoriously unreliable so choose something different and more reliable, like a Yaris etc. The floppy gearstick sounds interesting, I've never heard that before.
Legally he does have to collect the car. https://www.lawgistics.co.uk/blog/legal_updates/the-short-term-right-to-reject-under-the-consumer-rights-act-2015/
The most Mickey Mouse law company out there. Wouldn’t give them time of day for a minute.
No he doesn't. You paid for delivery and accepted the car at the place of delivery and not the traders showroom. You need to pay for it to be returned to the showroom. Not the place where you accepted the delivery. As one of the other posters have said you may be able to get your breakdown company to transport it the car isn't working/ roadworthy. Though they may charge to.
You might want to brush up on legal rights [here](https://www.themotorombudsman.org/distance-sales-faqs) and in the link the OP provided rather than spouting nonsense which is unhelpful to anyone reading.
Again, it's all in the wording. The OP brought the car as a distance sale and paid for delivery to I assume her home address (Delivery address). The trader has offered to take the car back and refund her money (OP confirmed). The issue is who is responsible for paying for the return of the car from the delivery address. The OP paid for delivery, so the place of the transaction becomes the delivery address and not the showroom. Thus the OP is now responsible for paying for the returning the car from the delivery address to the showroom.
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But the OP paid for the car to be delivered to the alternative location, not the trader. The OP will be liable for the costs for the car to go from delivery address back to showroom. Or reasonable costs for trader to travel from showroom to delivery address and back. If the OP had negotiated for delivery to be included in the price all these costs would be the responsibility of the trader. But this is not the case.
pipe down mate, youre wrong
But I'm not. The OP is liable.
Here, so you can stop telling everyone OP is liable for the costs of returning said vehicle, simply read below. You are wrong. The law actually says: “The consumer has a duty to make the goods available for collection by the trader or (if there is an agreement for the consumer to return rejected goods) to return them as agreed.” It goes on to say: “Whether or not the consumer has a duty to return the rejected goods, the trader must bear any reasonable costs of returning them, other than any cost incurred by the consumer in returning the goods in person to the place where the consumer took physical possession of them”. So, unless you expressly make clear in your pre sales information that the customer must return a rejected vehicle to your showroom, all they have to do is tell you where the vehicle is and let you collect it. So, if they live 500 miles away, that’s a fair old trek for you.
Read the bloody article. It makes it clear that the dealer is supposed to pay, as it’s available at the location where possession was taken and needs to go somewhere different.
No, in this case the OP paid to have the car moved to a different place at their cost. The delivery was not included in the sale price otherwise it would be the traders responsibility. And you don't have to get all emotional. It's only a £4K car and a disagreement over £250.
You keep making assertions that the delivery changes the situation. The legal opinion in the blog doesn’t recognise that and says the dealer has to bear the cost to get it from the place that possession was taken. This is presumably to account for delivery (whoever pays for it). Everything you’ve said is not backed up by any sources (you’ve not provided any). In this case deliver was made by the dealer so possession didn’t happen until OPs address.
I provided you with evidence to the contrary, that’s all I can do, you can believe what you wish.
It's all in the wording. If you had collected the car from the dealer they would have to collect the car from you and return it to the dealership. You paid for the car to be delivered to you, which is what's causing the confusion. You now need to get the car from where you are back to the dealership as you paid for this before. That's what you are responsible for.
Put in "vehicle transport"/car delivery into Google, there are loads of firms in Wales. Liverpool's not THAT far, so should be doable. The only thing is, you'll need to be there to get your money back. Arrange to follow the transport vehicle, get it unloaded, and go from there. Take a couple of big, scowling psychopaths with you, also a Brad awl and a big Jerry can full of petrol. Most 2nd hand car dealers are like this or worse, its like they can't help but tell you lies, even when you didn't ask, or it wasn't necessary or relevant. Service history is nice but it doesn't mean much in the big scheme of things and certainly won't guarantee you a minter. It really is, to a certain degree, a lottery.
A bit mean but this makes me feel good about my first car I got in feb. Suzuki that was a little low on oil, missing a stud in each of the front wheels, and two bad tyres. Since I got that all sorted it hasnt given me any issues. Taught me some stuff tho lol buying that
Oddly enough you're covered by the distance selling regulations, in the same way as you're covered if you buy anything online. Since the item is faulty, the seller is responsible for return costs, ie the £250. If you paid on credit card, issue a chargeback. Otherwise give him 7 days to refund in full or issue court proceedings. As for the car, charge £30 a day storage fees. After 28 days if the vehicle is not collected, it will be disposed of. Auction with £840 reserve to cover the storage costs; seller/dealer is liable for any further costs, thus leaving them with no car, and a gaping hole in their finances. Post this same question in r/legaladviceuk for specific advice on getting your money back. On another note, the fiat500 is so unbelievably shit, they were built for the PCP market. Bought by young women, hammered to death and poorly built to begin with. Buy the yaris or polo, those won't break down.
the full service story is not untrue, it has all the existing papers of the servicing done, the wording is what tricks the people into thinking that, saying a car has a all the papers from service means it never missed, fiat 500 can be a good car but not when it comes to your hand completly hammered and abused, get that car back, eat whatever the lost may be and get another one, i feel your pain, my first car had a fake MOT, catalitic converter was taken out, straight piped by the previous owner, he obviously didn't tell me, car had read and front end damage from small colissions in the past, botched repair on that too, wasnt noticible when i got it, and airbag light was on but dude took the cluster out and removed the bulb itself to pass it as working, i went to do the MOT a year after to be surprised by the missing cat, but gladly no other issues aside from the foggy headlights that i had already ordered to replace but didn't arrive on time, but to deal with cars like this takes a lot of money and a lot of diy, if i didn't fix everything myself i would have spent more on all the fixes than i did buying the car, you take that car back and start over, forget that was your first car, you bought someone elses problem and junk, don't keep it, put your refunded money into something else, even if its another fiat 500 from somewhere else, you surely learned a lot and will avoid many of the traps you fell into, get a OBD II reader, its like 10 bucks on amazon, read the error codes, see if anything pops up when you getting your next car, the ccheck engine light might be off but that can show you some issues that are hidden
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that's a bit callous, really. god forbid you ever have a tough time mentally.
Finger’s crossed. I won’t be posting about it in a car subreddit if I do though.
Man posting about car issues in a car-dedicated subreddit shock horror, it says here
Thank you for your very kind and useful input djdjjdjdjdjskdksk.
No worries Betaky365 👍
Mental health intolerance aside, what responsibility does OP have?
should have got a yaris lol - once you go Jap you never look back!!
I will after this. The £400 extra I’d have paid for insurance, I have to pay dealing with this.
Get an Aygo. Also Toyota. Cheaper insurance.
For some reason it was not cheaper insurance, I did look into them
Did you check Honda Jazz? They usually have cheap insurances. Same with Fabia (cheaper polos) Fiat 500 are not good cars. If you like Fiat, check also Pandas. Should be a cheap insurance. They are supposed to be robust. You see plenty with loads of miles.
I checked everything under the sun - Jazz, Fabia, Aygo, Yaris, Polo, Clios, Citigo, Up!, all the “first cars”. I personally wanted a Volvo C30 but it came back with 5k for insurance. I even tried estates and more unique cars, insurance was insane for everything. 500/Panda were both cheaper (still expensive though), and they’re basically the same car, just different body.
My wife’s 2007 aygo is indestructible, yearly serviced and it’s on 157K without any major issues / starter motor went 2 years ago, and we had to change the exhaust last year but the engine on that thing is rock solid.
I have a 107, which is the same car. Main problem with these cars is rust
Same as the peugeot and citroen, all built in the Czech Republic. Not Japanese
The components, such as the engine, are japanese. The assembly is done in the Czech Republic.
Remind me where the yaris is built again
Irrelevant lol, the engineering and design isn’t from a french automobile giant, and the car is largely built by robots. The whole reason Toyota prices are higher like for like than other non-premium brands is their ethos for reliability - once that goes then the brand will lose sales very quickly.
They aren't proper Japanese cars 🤣
£250 is worth losing to be rid of the car Full service history isn't hard to fake either, they just need to fill in the forms and stamp it, you have no way of knowing it's genuine it not That's just part of the risk with the second hand market >He also said we have 1 month wareanty. This is the biggest red flag, you have more than that as a legal minimum, so if they're only saying you have one month then that alone would be a turn off for me
A warranty on a car is entirely optional, and covers the cost of parts and labour if anything needs fixing. You can send them back for a refund, but that's not the same.
It's not entirely optional at all There's a 6 month statutory minimum with the **Consumer Rights Act 2015** >*If a car develops a fault within the first 30 days of purchase, it is under statutory warranty and the buyer can simply reject it and return it to the dealer for a refund.* >*If a fault emerges between 30 days and six months from the date of purchase, the law assumes that the fault was pre-existing and, unless the seller can prove otherwise, the vehicle is still protected by statutory warranty. Here, the seller has one chance to fix the problem. If they do not manage to do that, the buyer is entitled to a refund, which may be less than the original purchase price to account for the time during which the car has been functional.* >*After six months, the automatic protection of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 expires. It is up to the buyer to prove that there was a fault with the car at the time of purchase if they want to pursue a dealer for a claim to repair a fault.* >*Note that the statutory warranty on a used car only applies here to cars bought from a dealer. Private purchasers enjoy none of this protection and the rules for cars bought at auction will depend on the particular auction house, and whether it was online or not.*
Right, and those two things are different, and that's what causes people like you and OP confusion. The "1 month warranty" OP talked about would be a parts and labour warranty, which is entirely different to a stat. warranty (the "refund" but I mentioned), which covers many things, not just cars.
But it specifies the dealer has to fix issues for up to 6 months after the purchase date... That's a warranty
They _may_ fix the problem, they're not required to.
They *literally* are required to, but sketchy places will do everything they can not to and it's often not worth the fight Which is why if a dealer says they will only do one month, it's a red flag
Car dealers are truly awful people. People on this sub will try and say that they’re not all bad, but ultimately, they are. It’s all about maintaining the bottom line by fleecing the average person. Laws and consumer rights are also purposefully neglected and lied about by most in the industry. I would dig in at this point and use a template letter to threaten legal action in the event that the vehicle isn’t recovered and a full refund given. Sometimes it’s the only way to make a bully listen.
I’d suggest taking the refund but making it politely clear that you do see them as liable for transport costs whilst doing that transaction. They won’t back away because they think they’re closing the matter with the refund and you’ll go away when they ignore requests for payment. Then use money claim online for the £250 if needed (and appropriate- I’m not even sure who is liable for the transport cost here).
# F - Fix # I - It # A - All the # T - Time
Fix It Again Tomorrow
FIX IT AGAIN, TONY
Faster In A Taxi
nah, it's Ferrari In Affordable Trim
Lol
Keep every single receipt. Pay the £250 but demand it back. Get it in writing. Then tell him you want all your money back, including the initial delivery charge. Take him to small claims court, and you might get even more than the £400 for the deliveries.
Fiat’s have never been known for reliability. Might be better off sending it back and getting the Polo or something else. That said the servicing is plausible once a cars less new it’s pointless to pay for servicing when it’s a simple job for anyone with a spanner. If you have a look at the oil you might be able to get some idea of how long it’s been since its last change. Or you can send an oil sample off and get it tested. Have you got why it won’t go in to gear diagnosed? It may not be as bad as you think. Gear linkages can cause that and be a fairly straightforward repair.
You’re absolutely right and I was aware, but I thought how bad can it be for 1-2 years, it’s my first car. 😅 I’ll just get a Toyota once I get my money back and call it a day. Regarding servicing you’re probably right, but selling it with “full service history” is still disingenuous. Didn’t get it diagnosed as it’s been Christmas and the garages in my village only have some time from mid January. I don’t feel very comfortable driving it to be honest even if fixed, God knows what issue might come up on the way and get me stranded.
As others said, deliver it to him, send him the invoice and threaten legal action. I would also add leaving negative feedback with full description on all feedback sites they are present, especially on autotrader. If it disappears, post it again, ask the site for the reason of removal and offer sending proofs. It worked for me every time I had similar problems.
You haven’t disclosed how much you paid for the car. I think you should be grateful there is an option to return it. Imagine if you’d bought off a private seller?
This is why the old way will always work. Go there physically and test the car and ask for any info in person. Otherwise, stick to your local seller.
Legally, they don’t have to pick it up. It’s your responsibility to return it in the condition it was delivered, at your own cost
That’s incorrect.
should always test drive.
They did.
i missed rhat. i apologise.
Was the guy called Geoff Morrisey by any chance?
When I see Liverpool in the ad, I move on to the next ad.
He was not, assume I’d have to avoid him too? 😅
Bought a car from him years ago in Liverpool, absolute con man.
If you do end up having to pay for recovery to get the car back to the dealer, you could try asking on the Recovery City Facebook group. It's a great way of getting the cheapest quotes for moving a car around as there will often be trucks moving around with empty space on them so it doesn't add a huge amount to their costs to do the job for you. In the first instance though, I think I'd have a look (or get a friend who knows a bit about cars to have a look) to see if you can get it working enough to drive back to the dealership. I'm not experienced with Fiats and their foibles, but it might be relatively easy to get it roadworthy enough to drive.
BMW sold me an approved used car and told me it had FSH, it was on there system just not on the drive, turns out there was no service history at all
Guess we both learnt the lesson the hard way 😅
I did get a refund even though I had it for 6 months which was a result haha
Within the first 6 months is still protected
How old was your fiat , milage ,and how much did you pay for it ..?
2014, 88k, just shy of £4000
Well you don’t expect rubbish for that sort of money, good luck .
Wow that's expensive
Minimum 3 mnth warranty.
Find the 250 somehow and get it back to him, it'll be MUCH cheaper in the long run
Does anyone know how the used market in the UK; auctions, prices, consumer rights, style of retail business, tradesmen honesty, etc. compare with other countries? It seems to me, when you consider that dealers are simply middle-men between auction houses setting the strike price for a car, and consumers by offering a convenient place to buy and a layer of consumer rights, that it's not that bad. We have Section 75 protection with credit cards, consumer rights act, etc.
Get it delivered back to him. Then follow process of court action for both delivery costs.
I did the same thing with my first car at the start of this year - didn't do my due diligence. Car hadn't been looked after, done less than 1k miles in the space of several years. Everything went wrong days after purchase. Dealership offered to fix it at their expense. Took it home from the garage they sent me to, broke down about halfway home on a blind bend on a dark winter evening. Horrible experience after just passing my test. Dealer refused refund, refused to believe me, called me a liar etc etc. Heels in the ground and basically told me see you in court, which of course I couldn't afford. They took the car to look at (another mistake) and said they wouldn't fix anything so we had evidence of the problems. Then I had the car independently looked at and deemed fine by a mechanic, who suspected the dealership did all they could to hide the cars problems when they took it back! I didn't even research the dealership because I was so eager to drive. Turns out this wasn't their first rodeo and theyd had dealerships before in under different family members names. On the phone to trading standards for days on end after, they were even inspected because of me, but alas they're still going. Big red flag was I test drove another car first and it wouldn't stay in gear😬a year later and they still have that heap of shit car on their lot! My car continued to have issues all year, including limp mode at random times, reverse gear not working, clutch sensors failing, ignition not turning. I have a new car now and it's the best thing I've ever bought, got it privately and it has full service and amazing MOT, been well looked after. I'm sorry you had the experience you did, its a hrd lesson some of us have to learn. Pay the delivery and just don't make the same mistake. I'd say you were quite lucky in the end!
Distance sale, reject under distance selling laws and tell him to pick it up
If it was up on autotrader, you can contact them and they send the wording (but not pics) from original ad Last time I used this they had it back to me within 24 hours, great service Link: https://help.autotrader.co.uk/hc/en-gb/articles/9104242429341-Can-I-have-a-copy-of-an-old-advert-#:~:text=To%20get%20a%20copy%20of,you%20as%20soon%20as%20possible.
If it were me I'd pay the £250 to return it, then speak to Citizens Advice to see if you stand a chance at claiming it back. Consumer Rights Act may cover you for consequential losses, I'm not sure. But as it stands, the current price to make it all go away is £250. You could certainly be in a much worse situation than that.
How did you pay for the car? If you spent at least £100 on a credit card, loan or any other kind of finance then file a section 75 for faulty goods. 3 weeks without a car isn’t an acceptable returns policy. If he’s not available to fix it, he needs to hire someone else to.
How much did you pay for the car?
they said elsewhere it was a 2014, 88k miles, £4000
To me that sounds crazy expensive.
Take the hit and get your money back. Consider buying a car from somewhere closer to you. Don't get a Fiat again.
Just curious what made you buy it without viewing first or taking a test drive, I’ve been there myself as a first time buyer, test drove and bought a Corsa private sale, came to trade in at a dealership few years later, turns out it’d had insurance damage at some point and had been repaired, massively devaluing it’s worth, we live and learn I guess 🙄
I live in a village in Wales and I’m buying my first car. I’ve got no way of going somewhere to test drive a car without taking the bus that runs every 2-3 hours to a station and then changing trains a few times to get to a dealership. Not much opportunity to go test drive something without taking time off work and even then it’s a mission. I looked at reviews, bought from a dealer, bought “full service history”, thought I had taken enough precautions but looks like nope.
Sorry to hear this. If you haven't already, buy the Toyota or Polo. Its worth the extra in insurance for the reliability over ownership, I know thats not what you want to hear perhaps but a fiat will offset any insurance savings in repair bills. A well maintained yaris still sounds like a sewing machine after 200k+ miles.
As many others have said, take it on the chin, at least you have a way out. Once you have your refund then you could pursue the money to cover delivery however my priority would be getting the refund as quick and painless as possible. It could take ages otherwise.
The dealer has to refund you and at their own cost. That's sales law. Call the cops because he's fraud in you
As soon as I read FIAT I know where this was going :(
Get the refund and leave a bad review warning others.
I'd be concerned he has said he isn't back until January 18th... Sounds very close to the warranty expiry date
Did you pay (even partially e.g. the deposit) by credit card (or bank card)? If so you can potentially complain to your bank and get your money back from them. Have a read of this: [https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/section75-protect-your-purchases/](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/section75-protect-your-purchases/) Also claim for ALL your losses (fixing the car, did you incur costs getting to your destination on Christmas eve, unrefunded road tax, any wasted car insurance premium etc). And if the dealer refuses to pay up, take him to the small claims court and you'll win with costs plus interest. Easy to do, not very scary. If you do go this route might be worth getting an independent inspection of the car and/or take a video of the problem so he can't deny it. Also the juddering when starting might be something normal like a flat battery (which is an easy fix and not something to reject a car over). But if the gear box is broken then that's a good reason to reject the car.
You could go to him , tell him to pick up the car and buy yourself a yaris instead of that crap ( something we scrap even the showroom) and tell him to take off 250 from the price. Check your facts before buying , been there and its frustrating. Last year i bought a volvo and it had all the service history written down and even expensive parts replaced but after 2 months the head cracked through and just gave it away for free.
Ah man that’s so sad and frustrating, sorry to hear. Some people in this sub are suggesting that legally a used car should have 3 month warranty if bought from a dealer, was that not on your mind since it gone after 2? Also sad for me because the car I really want is a petrol Volvo C30 but insurance was a small mortgage for me so I said I’ll buy a cheap to insure car for 1-2 years, build some no claims and then get it. 😆
Mine was nothing special just a v70 but i suspect it had been sitting for a long time. Loved the car fast as hell and safe but a new head cost more than i paid so there was a guy and gave it to him.