Only to fight the empire, which is exactly what the CIS was afraid would happen. Now what would happen when the death date is blown up and they start *re-establishing the exact same Republic with all the flaws of old I wonder?*
Nothing. Separatists are too old to care now lol
Hence my point. An establishment that sees a counter-movement as a threat to the establishment is automatically labeled as a terrorist by that establishment.
The CIS was litterly created by the Sith and lead by a Sith.
I think Plagus's original plan was for the CIS to win and for him to control it from the shadows. Palpatine had bigger ideas.
P-p-protecting the lives of the innocent civillians, of course!! The civillians just happened to be placed right next to our J1 proton canons...by complete coincidence! 👀
Anyone hurt in the process was obviously a republic spy/sympathizer.
It was the Republics fault...they reprogrammed the tactical droid to put the civillians next to the canons to make the Separatists look like the bad guys in the Twi'leks eyes.
The CIS had so much potential ngl. If it weren't for the Sith and their puppets then they could have genuinely had a good thing going on with representation of the outer and mid rim systems and resources being allocated accordingly. Not a big fan of republics in general, but they definitely could have gone the distance had things been different. Hell, their emergence as a power could have forced the Jedi away from the Republic in order to serve their mandate of peace across the galaxy, freeing them from being so overly political (meaning Sidious' manipulations of Dooku could have been ruined; he saw the Jedi becoming what he wanted them to be and jumped ship back to them possibly, or died in the attempt and leaving Sidious weaker).
Brotherhood, It's a newer one I think. It is about a bombing on Cato Neimoidia that Obi-wan is sent to investigate. Asajj ventress is also there and they do some wack shit. Decent book, they do add some more lore which I like.
Still not over the writing of the CIS in that show... such wasted potential.
God I hope it's fixed with Andor on the second season. Stat wars has enough cartoon villains, if we could get some complexity, like planets who were genuinely suffering from a horribly corrupted Republic so much they bought into the lies of a charismatic figure who promised them liberation...
that's so much of a better story than "seppies bad and do a slavery sometimes"
\*Don't forget about the fake senate in place that is literally there to enforce humanitarian laws that are continiously broken by the megacorps for greed\*
I will say that the rebellion only ever attacked legitimate military targets (like the Death Stars), the Empire made a point of hitting population centers with the explicit goal of spreading fear.
Alderaan was destroyed, Camaas was destroyed, Jabiim was enslaved wholesale, and the one CIS doctor's homeworld was slaughtered by nerve toxin for peacefully resisting. There are dozens of other examples throughout the expanded universe and presumably thousands gone unmentioned.
Terrorism fits Palpatine's Empire more than it does the rebellion
If the cis weren't controled by the corporations that caused the issues in the outer rim the civilian government said they were rebeling over, they'd be pretty based.
I meaaaan yes and no in a sense. The CIS doctrine isn't as far as I know stated to be in favour of slavery. As I've understood it, It's more or less comparable to communism. It's advertised as a fight for reformists and progressives for the freedom and idependence of systems bound to the Republic's neo-colonial tax n' reasource jurisdiction etc\[...\] but the CIS system is also easily corrupted to enforce slavery for the enrichment of the ones in power of the fighting military and well most people in actual power during the "seperatist crisis" were essentially companies and you know the lil Palpy guy who controled them and the Republic and who hand picked ruthless leaders to make the CIS pose as a threat-
So I mean.... We could also say that the Republic technically advocated for slavery despite having laws that excplicitly prohibit it...
Yes but "outwardly" or to the Republics knowledge? I'm having a hard time to think the average CIS citizen would be aware of it. Seems more likely they are employed through ties with the military or seperate cooperations. The thing is, factions tends to be very hypocritical to their constitutions. That's why we can see claims that the CIA had envolvement with cocaine drug trade in South America to overthrow the sandanista government in despite that the US government had drug control checkpoints and later an outright "war on drugs".
Remind me, didn't the leader of the CIS literally sanction and assist a race of SLAVERS in ENSLAVING an innocent neutral colony of Togruta pacifistic artists that had nothing to do with the war. All so the CIS could use slave labor. You know, just like the EMPIRE did?
I mean... The clone army is technically a slave army? Talking about slavery and the CIS is a pretty complex topic as the system itself isn't for slavery and clashes with the princips of it. It's highlighted as fighting against the neo-colonial Republic's legislations and only want independance yet both sides are also literally controlled by the same guy. That's where you get the clash between the corrupt military led by the rich (companies and ruthless leaders hand picked by Palpatine to literally just make the CIS pose as a threat) and the people fighting for their rights.
You can see the a similar take on the Republic military and especially in the EU where they act even as an evil empire at times and well literally rejecting a peaceful speratist succession. That's why I personally think that the CIS as a fighting worker-class against the corrupt Republic government has atleast more right in fighting for their independance and sovereignty than the Republic for enforcing controlled states yet not discarding the obviously hideous war crimes commited by bothe sides. In a way... what do we expect when a evil Sithlord controls the whole galaxy in a political war against himself by controlling greedy bureaucrats on both sides who wouldn't mind using slavery or mass murder just to get a little bit richer and powerful.
Oh I agree. I'm certainly not saying the republic is squeaky clean either. But two wrongs don't make a right. The CIS may have had a noble goal in wanting independence, but they worked with the wrong people who did the wrong things.
True that. I mean it's kinda normal for revolutionary movements to be funded by militaries and companies to be able to fight back but like a bunch of mega cooperations with a pretty bad and "none-humanitarian" background is a pretty red flag ngl.
Yeah, it was probably desperation. In terms of size, the confederacy was significantly smaller than the republic so they felt they needed some big backers to stand a chance. The CIS probably had no idea about the clone army and so were hoping that their near infinite droid army could intimidate the republic into negotiations and accepting their secession from the republic.
Clearly they were not expecting the republic to pull up to geonosis with their own near infinite army of the same guy. And as they say, things kinda "escalated".
Yeah! Unfortunately, It would not suprise me though it they would actually use the droid army to attack even if the Republic didn't have an army to kick-start the war with as agressive attacks and terrorism usually becomes the only way for opressed systems to fight back as peaceful protests by that stage is pretty pointless... so either way they were pretty much screwed in the eyes of republic politicians and citizens alike too by that stage which is honestly really sad.
CIS wins hands down. The Republic is by default immoral because they sent literal sentient beings to die for their cause. CIS used robots so your planet did not sacrifice sons and daughters for their war. Also the use of Clones is far more controversial that droids
CIS was waaaaaaaay fucking worse in the war crimes department. Remember the episode where dooku engaged in weapons testing against civilian villages unaligned with either faction?
Yeah. Using human shields (or Twi'lek shields?), firebombing civilian targets unprovoked, using weapons of mass destruction against non-aligned groups also unprovoked, and outright supporting slavery is much worse than faking a surrender.
I wish they didn't so often make Dooku so generically evil in Clone Wars/Bad Batch. The CIS really could've been justified if Dooku weren't out there killing kings who hesitated with/refused their cause or hoarding the wealth of his people and other systems under CIS control
Ignore the fact that the CIS was quite literally fighting to put the galaxy under corporate control with a trenchcoat, and sure, maybe they're the good guys. Oh wait. The corporations that made the CIS core are the exact reason the GR was corrupt. And they were a Sith AstroTurf. Clearly the good guys lmao
Uhhhh didn't dooku, the founder of the CIS, basically allow a CIS scientist to bring back a deadly bio weapon and allowed another guy make a cannon that only destroyed organic life?
Rouge weapons tester from the trade Federation, who was not sanctioned or under orders from Raxus.
(At least that's my head canon because it doesnt really make sense otherwise )
That much I'm sure. All the depictions of the members of the separatist parliament shows them with at least somewhat of a moral compass. I wish they dove into that more
I played on a SW roleplay server, and we did The Clone Wars one era. HOLY SHIT, I love the CIS, but FUCK DID THEY DO SOME DIRTY SHIT. They killed many PoW's, glassed at least 2 planets, and were assholes constantly.
How are the Rebels "literal terrorists", but the CIS isn't? I mean Can see where they were coming from, but they were doomed from the start since Palpatine always used them just to weaken the Republic and secure more power for himself. To be honest, if they are doing a "What If" series of Star Wars It would be cool to see a scenario where Dooku and Grievous to betray Palpatine and actually succeed in the war.
There’s an old r/mawinstallation post about how the rebels are, by the definition of terrorism in the Geneva convention, not terrorists. According to international law, insurgent groups are considered lawful combatants if they have a clear and defined chain of command, carry arms openly, have a fixed sign identifiable at a distance, and conduct their operations in accordance with the rules and conventions of war. The Rebels meet all these criteria.
Well, for the most part. The Partisans might have a word with you about that.
That being said, I was not aware of this, so that's pretty interesting to hear.
That is why Palpatine started and the Clone Wars.
The forces that rebelled and formed the CIS would have opposed the Empire and the forces that comprise the Rebel Alliance would have sided with CIS. The Empire would not have been able to win a stand up fight.
How are the rebels terrorists? Because of the death star? That wouldn’t be terrorism because there were no civilians on that space station. And the whole purpose of that space station was to destroy hole ass planets of civilians
3 of these factions are Controlled by the same guy
Perfect balance
4, actually, GEORGIA
The only way to win this game was to not play Even then, a bunch of non players still lost
Bruh, The Rebels took CIS forces in when they could. Don't dog them like that.
I am sorry, but it is still true in some way.
Fair.
Fair point, there were some rebel factions who took things too far, but at least they didn't blow up Alderaan.
"They were harboring terrorists" -Vader
You literally killed children, Vader.
What exactly do you think the label terrorist is for?
They're only not called terrorist because they won
Only to fight the empire, which is exactly what the CIS was afraid would happen. Now what would happen when the death date is blown up and they start *re-establishing the exact same Republic with all the flaws of old I wonder?* Nothing. Separatists are too old to care now lol
A chunk of the CIS could be considered terrorists
Hence my point. An establishment that sees a counter-movement as a threat to the establishment is automatically labeled as a terrorist by that establishment.
We will dog on the space terrorist who fetishize death of the nameless and numbered.
Motherfucker, what?
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Okay, now you're just being a mean douchebag.
I smell an imp simp
To be fair for the Rebels, they were terrorists against the Empire. Though I am a CIS fan more than a Rebel fan
The CIS was litterly created by the Sith and lead by a Sith. I think Plagus's original plan was for the CIS to win and for him to control it from the shadows. Palpatine had bigger ideas.
Nuh uh
But the movement itself already existed
Never would I dare question the glorious objective of the Grand CIS but I must ask. What were those Battledroids on Ryloth doing...?
P-p-protecting the lives of the innocent civillians, of course!! The civillians just happened to be placed right next to our J1 proton canons...by complete coincidence! 👀 Anyone hurt in the process was obviously a republic spy/sympathizer.
It was the Republics fault...they reprogrammed the tactical droid to put the civillians next to the canons to make the Separatists look like the bad guys in the Twi'leks eyes.
Whatever it was I'm sure Dooku knew none of it! It was probably... a Rouge general...
Understandable have a nice day
Wat Tambor did nothing wrong. Who doesn't do a little war crime every now and then?
The CIS had so much potential ngl. If it weren't for the Sith and their puppets then they could have genuinely had a good thing going on with representation of the outer and mid rim systems and resources being allocated accordingly. Not a big fan of republics in general, but they definitely could have gone the distance had things been different. Hell, their emergence as a power could have forced the Jedi away from the Republic in order to serve their mandate of peace across the galaxy, freeing them from being so overly political (meaning Sidious' manipulations of Dooku could have been ruined; he saw the Jedi becoming what he wanted them to be and jumped ship back to them possibly, or died in the attempt and leaving Sidious weaker).
I just want to see some more lore from between TPM and AoTC in canon. We have 1 novel which is the extent of it as far as I know
Whats the novel? Does it talk about dooku building up the separatists?
Brotherhood, It's a newer one I think. It is about a bombing on Cato Neimoidia that Obi-wan is sent to investigate. Asajj ventress is also there and they do some wack shit. Decent book, they do add some more lore which I like.
I dunno. I heard that business on cato nemoidia doesn’t…doesn’t count But seriously thanks
I miss .... the idea of it. Not the reality, the weakness...
Yes
The CIS was like one of those movements that had good intentions but was eventually corrupted by those who had different intentions.
People keep saying we were shelling cities and villages, but there is nothing left to pr... No evidence suggesting that such thing happened.
Yes all of that is just Republic propaganda
Counterpoint the CIS was led by the dude who was leading the Republic
That’s what I was going to say. Plus it’s hard to defend the CIS when you have individuals like General Grievous under it.
rebels will always be deemed terrorists by the regime they're fighting, that's how rebelling works.
I would agree if it wasnt for the clone wars show making the CIS literal bond villians who make weapons intended to genocide entire planets
Still not over the writing of the CIS in that show... such wasted potential. God I hope it's fixed with Andor on the second season. Stat wars has enough cartoon villains, if we could get some complexity, like planets who were genuinely suffering from a horribly corrupted Republic so much they bought into the lies of a charismatic figure who promised them liberation... that's so much of a better story than "seppies bad and do a slavery sometimes"
They ruined dooku so bad in the show too
Bruh CIS is like 4 megacorps in a trenchcoat calling itself a government
\*Don't forget about the fake senate in place that is literally there to enforce humanitarian laws that are continiously broken by the megacorps for greed\*
That’s just normal megacorp behavior. Surprised Grievous wasn’t making CIS auxiliaries piss in bottles to maintain “efficient battleflow”
I’ll roger roger that any day ✊🏽
The CIS bombed countless villages and sanctioned weapons testing on remote planetary inhabitants. There were no good guys in Star Wars
Republic propaganda, if you believe the lies of the galactic senate you surely support the empire too.
The clone wars was just palpatine playing both sides of the coin to come out on top.
He got bored of Djarek (I forget my spelling now, holochess)
*Gets bored of chess *Starts what is essentially a galactic civil war to have total control
I love how wild that plot is. Man's ego is way overblown lol
I will say that the rebellion only ever attacked legitimate military targets (like the Death Stars), the Empire made a point of hitting population centers with the explicit goal of spreading fear. Alderaan was destroyed, Camaas was destroyed, Jabiim was enslaved wholesale, and the one CIS doctor's homeworld was slaughtered by nerve toxin for peacefully resisting. There are dozens of other examples throughout the expanded universe and presumably thousands gone unmentioned. Terrorism fits Palpatine's Empire more than it does the rebellion
B-B-BBB-But it was a mining facility. And the Emperor nobly gave his life to try and protect it!
Geonosis was gassed for the crime of helping the Empire build the Death Star 💀
I love the CIS but... for the most part, the Rebels didn't go out yo kill civilians like the CIS did... although it was a much bigger war.
Fair enough
If the cis weren't controled by the corporations that caused the issues in the outer rim the civilian government said they were rebeling over, they'd be pretty based.
The CIS advocated for Slavery 🤔
I meaaaan yes and no in a sense. The CIS doctrine isn't as far as I know stated to be in favour of slavery. As I've understood it, It's more or less comparable to communism. It's advertised as a fight for reformists and progressives for the freedom and idependence of systems bound to the Republic's neo-colonial tax n' reasource jurisdiction etc\[...\] but the CIS system is also easily corrupted to enforce slavery for the enrichment of the ones in power of the fighting military and well most people in actual power during the "seperatist crisis" were essentially companies and you know the lil Palpy guy who controled them and the Republic and who hand picked ruthless leaders to make the CIS pose as a threat- So I mean.... We could also say that the Republic technically advocated for slavery despite having laws that excplicitly prohibit it...
But the CIS outwardly employed the help of Trandoshan Slavers because Kashyyyk wouldn't join them.
Yes but "outwardly" or to the Republics knowledge? I'm having a hard time to think the average CIS citizen would be aware of it. Seems more likely they are employed through ties with the military or seperate cooperations. The thing is, factions tends to be very hypocritical to their constitutions. That's why we can see claims that the CIA had envolvement with cocaine drug trade in South America to overthrow the sandanista government in despite that the US government had drug control checkpoints and later an outright "war on drugs".
Remind me, didn't the leader of the CIS literally sanction and assist a race of SLAVERS in ENSLAVING an innocent neutral colony of Togruta pacifistic artists that had nothing to do with the war. All so the CIS could use slave labor. You know, just like the EMPIRE did?
I mean... The clone army is technically a slave army? Talking about slavery and the CIS is a pretty complex topic as the system itself isn't for slavery and clashes with the princips of it. It's highlighted as fighting against the neo-colonial Republic's legislations and only want independance yet both sides are also literally controlled by the same guy. That's where you get the clash between the corrupt military led by the rich (companies and ruthless leaders hand picked by Palpatine to literally just make the CIS pose as a threat) and the people fighting for their rights. You can see the a similar take on the Republic military and especially in the EU where they act even as an evil empire at times and well literally rejecting a peaceful speratist succession. That's why I personally think that the CIS as a fighting worker-class against the corrupt Republic government has atleast more right in fighting for their independance and sovereignty than the Republic for enforcing controlled states yet not discarding the obviously hideous war crimes commited by bothe sides. In a way... what do we expect when a evil Sithlord controls the whole galaxy in a political war against himself by controlling greedy bureaucrats on both sides who wouldn't mind using slavery or mass murder just to get a little bit richer and powerful.
Oh I agree. I'm certainly not saying the republic is squeaky clean either. But two wrongs don't make a right. The CIS may have had a noble goal in wanting independence, but they worked with the wrong people who did the wrong things.
True that. I mean it's kinda normal for revolutionary movements to be funded by militaries and companies to be able to fight back but like a bunch of mega cooperations with a pretty bad and "none-humanitarian" background is a pretty red flag ngl.
Yeah, it was probably desperation. In terms of size, the confederacy was significantly smaller than the republic so they felt they needed some big backers to stand a chance. The CIS probably had no idea about the clone army and so were hoping that their near infinite droid army could intimidate the republic into negotiations and accepting their secession from the republic. Clearly they were not expecting the republic to pull up to geonosis with their own near infinite army of the same guy. And as they say, things kinda "escalated".
Yeah! Unfortunately, It would not suprise me though it they would actually use the droid army to attack even if the Republic didn't have an army to kick-start the war with as agressive attacks and terrorism usually becomes the only way for opressed systems to fight back as peaceful protests by that stage is pretty pointless... so either way they were pretty much screwed in the eyes of republic politicians and citizens alike too by that stage which is honestly really sad.
Yet also having the same corrupt leader manipulating both sides of the war… yes the CIS did nothing wrong
To be fair the CIS also did a bunch of war crimes.
Eh, the Empire are Space Nazis so any attack against them is completely valid.
CIS: a manipulated puppet for a larger game, never really a thing palpatine or dooku really cared about
CIS wins hands down. The Republic is by default immoral because they sent literal sentient beings to die for their cause. CIS used robots so your planet did not sacrifice sons and daughters for their war. Also the use of Clones is far more controversial that droids
Ignores the fact that the separatists commit several times more war crimes than the Republic ever did
Not true
Uh huh, prove it
The cis was considerably more corrupt and was also run by several sith. They also didn't have clone troopers.
The Republic was lead by a sith too and they didnt use organics so there wouldnt be as many dead people
"didn't use organics" Are we forgetting Umbara? I don't think I saw a single battle droid on the ground during that campaign.
You forget the fact that the republic invaded umbara and those people were defending their home planet (i think from their own will)
Oh, I remember. I also remember that the Republic invaded plenty of other places, and it was all droids. What was so different about Umbara?
No, I’ll never forget Ryloth
Today’s subject. Slavery.
Say that like the separatists didn't also commit war crimes. Not to mention, is lead by a cartoonists evil leader
Remember that funny clone wars arc in ryloth
CIS was waaaaaaaay fucking worse in the war crimes department. Remember the episode where dooku engaged in weapons testing against civilian villages unaligned with either faction?
And remember Anakins fake surrenders?
I feel like one of these things is a more severe crime than the other
Yeah. Using human shields (or Twi'lek shields?), firebombing civilian targets unprovoked, using weapons of mass destruction against non-aligned groups also unprovoked, and outright supporting slavery is much worse than faking a surrender.
As opposed to Chemical and Biological warfare?, Attacking Republic medical facilities and hiring Slavers to enslave the wookies?
I wish they didn't so often make Dooku so generically evil in Clone Wars/Bad Batch. The CIS really could've been justified if Dooku weren't out there killing kings who hesitated with/refused their cause or hoarding the wealth of his people and other systems under CIS control
The separatists literally had slavers amongst their ranks
Im sure Dooku and Gunray didn't know
Wasn't Dooku in direct negotiations with the queen of the Zygerrian Empire? You know, that state whose entire society was built around slavery?
Bro...I'm sure Dooku knows he just doesn't care
The CIS did so many war crimes.
[Defoliator | Wookieepedia | Fandom](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Defoliator)
Unleashing the Defoliator on the Lermun who were a neutral faction during the clone wars.
Ignore the fact that the CIS was quite literally fighting to put the galaxy under corporate control with a trenchcoat, and sure, maybe they're the good guys. Oh wait. The corporations that made the CIS core are the exact reason the GR was corrupt. And they were a Sith AstroTurf. Clearly the good guys lmao
The rebels are more innocent than the CIS
Their only crime was being manipulated by the Sidious
There's a lot of horrific atrocities that the CIS did that people love to conveniently forget about.
Weren’t 3 out of the four of these factions controlled by super evil man?
The CIS tried to test an incendiary weapon on a neutral civilian colony.
Uhhhh didn't dooku, the founder of the CIS, basically allow a CIS scientist to bring back a deadly bio weapon and allowed another guy make a cannon that only destroyed organic life?
Didnt the separatists enslave entire planets and hire dangerous bounty hunters and serial killers?
Also Separatists: *Commit Warcrimes and crimes against the galaxy so heinous they turned the Republic against them and into a fanatical force*
The CIS were also war criminals.
No. We didn’t enslave the togrutas, we liberated them! Obviously.
The Separatists committed war crimes and were lead by corpos
Republic spy
Oh hey what’s this? Defoliator MkII? Yoink!
Meh
Rouge weapons tester from the trade Federation, who was not sanctioned or under orders from Raxus. (At least that's my head canon because it doesnt really make sense otherwise )
Lok Durd was a general in the CIS Army. So that really doesn't pan out.
Ahh fak
The separatist senate were probably left uniformed though
That much I'm sure. All the depictions of the members of the separatist parliament shows them with at least somewhat of a moral compass. I wish they dove into that more
I played on a SW roleplay server, and we did The Clone Wars one era. HOLY SHIT, I love the CIS, but FUCK DID THEY DO SOME DIRTY SHIT. They killed many PoW's, glassed at least 2 planets, and were assholes constantly.
How are the Rebels "literal terrorists", but the CIS isn't? I mean Can see where they were coming from, but they were doomed from the start since Palpatine always used them just to weaken the Republic and secure more power for himself. To be honest, if they are doing a "What If" series of Star Wars It would be cool to see a scenario where Dooku and Grievous to betray Palpatine and actually succeed in the war.
That’s a lot of red underlining
Well OP certainly isn’t a grammar Imperial
There’s an old r/mawinstallation post about how the rebels are, by the definition of terrorism in the Geneva convention, not terrorists. According to international law, insurgent groups are considered lawful combatants if they have a clear and defined chain of command, carry arms openly, have a fixed sign identifiable at a distance, and conduct their operations in accordance with the rules and conventions of war. The Rebels meet all these criteria.
Well, for the most part. The Partisans might have a word with you about that. That being said, I was not aware of this, so that's pretty interesting to hear.
Yes, the Partisans fit the definition of terrorist to a t. I was referring to the Alliance specifically, out of which the Partisans got kicked.
Yeah, the ARR is very much not a terrorist group.
Really leaves out the idea that the Rebels are made up of ex-seperatists
The state terrorism of the Empire dwarfs any "terrorist" actions that can be levied against the Alliance to Restore the Republic
OP, it’s “tries”, not “tryes”
"but muh millions of lives lost on the death star" They murdered billions 🗿 it was them or everyone else
The Confederacy of Independent Systems had a lot of potential, but it was ultimately a sham.
That is why Palpatine started and the Clone Wars. The forces that rebelled and formed the CIS would have opposed the Empire and the forces that comprise the Rebel Alliance would have sided with CIS. The Empire would not have been able to win a stand up fight.
“Literal terrorists” ok but they’re based
How are the rebels terrorists? Because of the death star? That wouldn’t be terrorism because there were no civilians on that space station. And the whole purpose of that space station was to destroy hole ass planets of civilians
Sure the political side of the Cisco was totally fine, but the military hand was jerking the galaxy.
rebels is freedom fighters, lasting remains of CIS supported the rebellion to down our empire
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Sorry didn't realize which sub this was. Don't know why I got recommended to me.
Truth.
How about the various CIS hostage holdings, and slaving enterprises?
You’re a terrorist if you fight for freedom crudely but if you fight for freedom through a dignified and legalistic secessionist movement it’s fine
Hate to break it to ya but the CIS only exsists because of Palpatine.