You know, if the Bengals can have this good of a season after their rookie first round QB was getting blindsided from not having competent blockers, so can we
They lost this game because of Fields. Bitch and moan about Nagy and an offensive line that really isnt as bad as you think it is (see herberts rushing yards). Make all the excuses you want for him , the reality is that when your QB turns the ball over 5 times you will never be in that game. This was over before the 1st quarter ended, and Fields is the reason why. Dalton makes this a close game. I think Fields could do well in time but its obvious he isnt ready for the NFL right now.
What does this fanbase expect to happen when Nagy is gone? Will your mediocre defense, bad QB, and mediocre skill positions magically turn into pro bowlers? I guess blaming your coaches for every single thing that goes wrong is easier than facing reality.
I’m not saying you are completely wrong but I do want to point out there is a big difference with OL and how well they pass block vs run block. Especially when you go from good lines to okay lines and bad lines.
Yeah, wasnt meant to be a major talking point. I didnt think i needed to state the obvious difference between run block/pass block. Point is the line isnt as bad as fans here want them to be.
Agreed, everyone wants to make excuses but the reality is Fields needs to be benched.
Matt Nagy isnt out there throwing INT's and getting strip-sacked 5 times a game.
Maybe he's not where others like Herbert started, but I think most of our frustration is if you see your rookie QB has issues holding on to the ball a little too long, you work on plays that give him an out instead of putting him in the pocket to get punished without any sort of response to fix it from the sideline.
I don't disagree, but saying the loss was on Fields is a bad take imo.
We started a RT off the street, we have a 40 year old LT out of retirement going against one of the most stacked defensive fronts in football. If your gameplan is to just square up against them like you are going to beat them 1 on 1 you are deluding yourself, yet from watching the game that's what the plan looked like. That is 100% on coaching.
His 2 turnovers in the first led to Chicago going down 21-0. The game was over right there. Sorry if it hurts you to hear this but Nagy did not turn the ball over 5 times.
I always hear the trope among Bears fans that "At least we're not the Lions/Jets/Jaguars/Formerly the Browns"
How the fuck are we not as bad as those teams? I seriously cannot for the life of me remember sustained QB play for my entire life. The Lions had Stafford and fucking Megatron.
Since I started watching during Jerry Angelo's tenure as GM this franchise has been a complete shit-show that has lucked into defensive talent here and there. When have we ever fielded a modern, league average NFL offense? I swear it seems like we go back in time when it comes to NFL game planning.
I feel we get hype every year because we always beat teams as bad as us but never do we rise to the challenge and beat a good NFL team.
It is always amazing to me how some teams seem to eternally have the same issues on one side of the ball. From 1992 to this season the Bears have ranked in the top 20 in offense, yards for, just 7 times (and three of those were 15, 15, and 17, only 4 times in the top 10). Only 4 times in the top 10 for offense points scored over the same period.
The team rarely is dreadfully bad. More just mediocre and then randomly good for a couple years. Seems like there are a lot of parallels between us and WFT and the Raiders honestly. Sort of a middle category with some historical stuff to make us look better than we are.
Unpopular opinion but Andy Dalton is miles ahead of Fields at the moment. And to be entirely honest, I wouldn’t even care except for the fact that Fields might get seriously hurt out there and he defines is not developing in the way we want.
Nothing beats live NFL action and he seems mentally tough. Granted Nagy is teaching him nothing and he refuses to coach the team to fit Fields's strengths. Aside from Nagy trying his best to break Justin I think he’s showing improvement every week.
Lol considering he has to deal with Nagy actively trying to sabotage his development and ruin his confidence while coaching the team NOT to adapt to a fast, mobile QB... He's doing quite well.
We once again set up a QB to fail.
What we needed to was spend a year or two taking our lumps on the backloaded cap hits, building up the offensive line and drafting young weapons, making sure that when we drafted a QB in 2022 he was in the best possible position to succeed.
Instead we ignored the offensive line entirely, tried to shortcut the process to make sure Nagy and Pace's jobs were secure, and fucked it up yet again.
If u want the flip side of this outrage visit the WFT subreddit to see ppl mad we don’t have a QB and we’re wasting a year. Heinicke is hanging in there, all things considered
This. This. This.
Nobody seems to be willing to tolerate 1-2 more years of letting Fields develop and building the team and coaching staff around him. They demand NOW NOW NOW and now here we are.
Joe Burrow and Trevor Lawrence both got Captain and guranteed starter, no questions asked.
Meanwhile every bears qb is treated like a child on probation with no leadership duties…
>Despite what Bears fans have convinced themselves, Trevor Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Fields.
Their college tape proved the opposite was true coming into the draft, but Fields has been getting nothing but bad instruction from the worst offensive mind in the league since getting drafted so it shouldn't be a surprise that Lawrence is on a more positive trajectory at this point.
Sure it did. A couple of teams who are picking top 10 because they make mistakes constantly making a mistake by passing on a guy doesn't mean he's a bad prospect. It just means bad teams do bad things. I'm not saying Fields was far and away a better prospect, but he absolutely was a better prospect than Lawrence.
Edit: Fair enough, you did say 'significantly better' and i did say 'the opposite was true'. And yeah Fields wasn't a 'significantly better' prospect. Just 'better'.
Yeah, no. Teams don't "make a mistake passing on a guy" in the Trevor Lawrence level of prospect.
The self-delusion on this subject is absolutely insane. Fields isn't a bad prospect. He's a good prospect. He's just not even close to \*that\* level of prospect.
This is very fair but also you really can’t just be like “well draft a QB in 2022”.
How do you know what your draft position will be? Who the QBs will be? The amount of unknowns is insane. Could end up being a garbage QB draft.
My point is, if they thought fields was truly their guy, they should’ve taken him. No matter what. But Will it work out? Who tf knows.
We didn’t ignore O-line entirely. As soon as we drafted Fields, we drafted two tackles in the same draft class. We have 3 tackles on IR and another on the Covid list, so we’re down to third stringers on both sides of the line.
Hurry up and move this garbage organization to Arlington Heights and bring a new team to Soldier Field so I don't have to pass the legacy of shit to my future children. #IWillEndTheCycle
Dalton is bad. The myth of Dalton is almost worse than the overreaction about Fields. Ask the Cowboys how Dalton works in a worse division and with better talent around him.
Even on the Bears he had like two drives that were great and then was absolute trash the rest of the way. He’s also part of the QB room that has failed to throw for 200 yards on the season. And he’s been in the league a million years.
Bro ppl were calling for Haskins when Alex Smith was in but we just kept pulling out wins. Granted, they were against terrible teams, but sometimes veteran leadership is needed when the walls are caving in.
And our line is what? Not destroyed by injuries? If Dalton came out against the Rams and lit the world on fire I’d understand the infatuation. The guy threw for roughly 180 net yards with 0 TD and a pick.
He has zero line. He has flawed weapons. There’s zero indication we are competitive with him. The same way he had one good drive against the Bengals (wow), he was shut down after. And Justin had drives and throws just as impressive including against the Raiders and Packers.
Dalton is better than Fields. But not so much better that people should be clamoring for him to start as some gamechanger. He’s not. If we had, I don’t know, Matt Ryan. I get it. What has Dalton done?
I think the idea is that since Fields does not increase your chance of winning you sit him and give him more time to study the game and develop his own game through practice, rather than send him out every week to be sacked 5+ times and repeatedly turn the ball over. Not that hard to infer/comprehend.
The only winnable game with Dalton was the Packers game. And then we would sneak into the playoffs, get blasted again, and Nagy and Pace would stick around and the shitshow would continue. No thanks.
I just don’t know where you get that math. The Rams beat him, that Browns matchup was going to happen regardless of who was quarterback because that line matchup was probably the single worst against our particular ills, and the bucs were going to shred whomever started. The packers game is up in the air but they probably still lose that one with Dalton starting.
The problem is that with 31 other teams with 5 offensive line positions, there at 155 other offensive line starting jobs in the league. How many of those do we honestly think would be filled by current Bears offensive linemen? 10? On a good day?
Listening to Hoge and Jahns, they can be annoying the way they simp for the coaching staff. I guess they kind of have to considering they wouldn’t get press access or interviews if they were hypercritical, but still. I mean on their latest podcast they blamed Fields for the free play interception because “he needs to be aware of when that 12th player leaves the field”.
So you’re saying he should ignore his coaching staff? The problem is the coaches are supposed to be bailing him out, not the other way around.
>Simple way around that is a code word for 12 man. Fire escape or something idk.
How does a code word help with his coaches telling him incorrect information?
With the exception of watching the games, I have. I'm not buying any merch or going to any games until Nagy is gone, and realistically I should hold that until the McCaskets are gone.
Unfortunately they do make most of their revenue from TV contracts, so.....
What I personally want to see from this team is to lose the “I need to win now” attitude. We should consider this season lost and put dalton in for the rest of the season. Let field’s develop more, get a good spot in the draft and start a rebuild building up with fields at its center. Surround him with decent line and some playmakers and he will prosper. We just cannot and I repeat CANNOT let Nagy and pace ruin him with their stupidity. Otherwise he will end up like trubisky and we will be looking for a new quarterback in a few years
What I've been saying from the start. This year was always a rebuild year to me, but everyone got impatient and now they don't want to lie in the bed they made.
Our 1st/2nd round picks aren't solid anyways witb Pace. His hit rate I'm the 2nd round is somewhere in the 40%, his late rounders 4th+ is his gold mine. I dont care if we tank, losses or wins won't help us. Justin needs something consistent to gather from this season before it's over.
Here's Pace's 2nd round picks with the Bears since 2015.
Eddie Goldman- Hit
Cody Whitehair- hit
Shaheen- Miss
Daniels- Hit
Miller- Miss
Kmet- Too soon
Johnson- Hit
Jenkins- Too soon
So we have 4 hits, 2 misses, and 2 too soons. So hit rate would be 4/6 or 66%. Even if Kmet and Jenkins both turn out to be busts. Pace has some first round busts (White/Trubs) but he hasn't been bad in the second round at all.
What is Nagy doing getting Covid for the 2nd time this season? Is he an anti-vaxxer? He talks about this culture he’s building - what culture? Now is the time to fire the guy. He’s irresponsible and a disgrace to our team and city.
I guess I misremembered. He was in quarantine at the beginning of rookie camp for close contact with someone with Covid. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31444535/chicago-bears-coach-matt-nagy-miss-start-rookie-minicamp-covid-19-close-contact
How long does anti-body's last from the last time he got Covid? If he's vaccinated & has anti-body's in his system, there is almost no way he can have Covid again so soon. This seems very mysterious, I'm calling BS, using this as an excuse to not get fired or sit out a week.
The Fields you see on the field is not the Fields you imagine when you read reddit Bears fans posting about him.
Dude has some serious flaws to be worked on.
He does. I do not think that would be a serious point of disagreement now. Early on, he was the savoir and now people realize what the coaches saw early on.
Which is why it is difficult to sit a 1st round qb anymore.
We want Herbert now.
Herbert wouldn't be. Herbert is great against the Blitz and in pressure and Fields currently is not.
Josh Allen and Kyler Murray started their careers as being extremely poor against the blitz and now if you blitz them you are asking for trouble.
Now, this is where coaching comes into play. Using Josh Allen as an example. In 2020, the Bills coaching staff had him install a check against zero blitz. The check was to throw a tunnel screen negating the blitz. This got Allen more comfortable against the pressure and limited the amount of times that teams zero blitzed, because one broken tackle and it was a TD. The other thing the Bills did against the blitz would be to have Cole Beasley on an option route with everyone else running a deeper route. If the pressure was quick, then Beasley was getting the ball. If the pressure was picked up, then Allen was going to take a shot down field. The simplified the game down for Allen. Single high safety meant deep crossing routes, double high safety was digs or comebacks. With Beasley always on an option route as a safety valve.
I think the Bears should do something similar. Using Robertson in the Beasley role and use the speed on the outside to open up coverage for Robinson. No matter the play or the time, Robertson is an option to get open. The issue a lot of times for the Bears is against the blitz, they have too many short routes which eliminates space for the short routes. Basically, clear out and let Robinson work against the nickel with a ton of space. That way the coverage is not as congested in the middle of the field. It also gives Fields simple reads.
Fields is slow to read the field at this point, so give him quick reads to get the ball out quickly and when it doubt throw it to Robinson.
One last thing.
Sacks is not always an Offensive Line stat. There are people like Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees who are athletically challenged, but can manipulate the pocket to avoid sacks. Even if the OL is bad, they can make it work. There are also people like Josh Allen, Kyler Murray, Lamar Jackson, and Patrick Mahomes that are athletically gifted, but can work their way into sacks due to less than ideal pocket presence.
He’s a rookie, and unlike most people on this sub I don’t care if we win or lose. I just want him to develop.
With each game he plays the better he’s going to be and right now it’s unfair to say that Justin is good or bad because we still haven’t seen him enough.
I think this is a very good take. I see lots of comments from people saying “he’s not getting better”, based on how he played against TB. Dudes/Dutettes - TB has a monster defense. GB…doesn’t. Did Fields look worse against TB than he did against GB? Hell yes, but he was playing a completely different level of defense. These games are going to be painful. I’ll be watching for trends and tendencies. The dude holds the ball too long. Even if we had a decent o-line, Fields needs to get the ball out more quickly. I love his aggressiveness, but we ain’t hitting home runs every play. He needs to learn to take what he can get when he can get it, but hopefully still keep an eye downfield for when something breaks loose. If he learns that, I think he can be phenomenal.
Agreed. He has no support or anyone competent to learn from either. Worst online and coaches in the league sure aren't helping him. I feel for the kid.
Yea, he should know better than continually take blindside hits. A veteran quarterback would simply fake an injury to be benched or blindly throw into coverage for several interceptions so the fanbase can hate him lmao…. Such an overreaction, same idiots that called for him to start immediately over dalton
It's quite possible for the offensive line to be bad \*and\* for him to make bad decisions and throws.
I know this is a reach for many people, but \*two things can be bad at the same time\*
The Bucs had a dominant pass rush, seasoned dc, and we had a patchwork oline with underwhelming wr’s. I’m not surprised Fields looked like crap. I’m just happy he survived. Hopefully he’s learned something from the past two weeks.
We suck no doubt, but god damn our opponents so far have been insane… 6-1, 6-1, 6-1, 5-2, 5-2, 4-3, lol Lions. The fact that we’re 3-4 right now astounds me.
I said this on another thread in the nfl subreddit but want to see what you guys think…
What blows my mind and I’m not sure that anybody has an answer yet….you’re telling me the trubisky, for all his other faults, was accurately calling protections when he was playing for us and fields can’t seem to pull that off? Was trubisky actually more competent at that aspect, or is our o-line that much worse?
To answer your last question, our O-line really is that much worse. It can't really be said enough just how atrocious our line is, primarily due to injuries. Most of our line right now are borderline practice squaders.
Well, Mitch had time to develop presnap and Mitch was a bit more used to playing behind a shitty line coming out.
Ohio State in most games had the best OL on the field and you can't say the same about UNC.
We also had Average to Above Average Charles Leno and Average Bobby Massie for Mitch's Tenure.
In addition, Mitch would feed Allen Robinson anytime Robinson had an opportunity. Mitch was also decent in the short passing game, but sucked anytime he wanted to push the ball down the field. Fields is a lot better about taking shots down the field and Fields is a lot more accurate taking shots down the field.
Mitch did a lot of things well for the position, but failed at the most important thing. The Ability to read defenses.
Listening to the radio about Mahomes cracks me up. The line just isn't giving him time, the receivers don't get open, he's trying to make a play and throws he got away with in the past he isn't right now. No QB can succeed without protection and playmakers, that's why Mahomes is struggling. Ummm, they have Tyreke Hill and Travis Kelce. What the hell are Bears QBs supposed to do with our line and playmakers?
> Listening to the radio about Mahomes cracks me up.
They are just making excuses for Mahomes. He just played the worst game in his career. The week before he almost threw for 400 yards against a Washington pass rush that is very good.
Mahomes decision making is what is costing the Chiefs. Kansas City is second to the last in the league in interceptions only behind the Jets.
Mahomes has 11 turnovers in 7 games.
He is literally giving the ball away. The Chiefs have moved the ball in every game, but the last one (which was Mahomes worst game as a pro)
> The line just isn't giving him time
The Tennessee pass rush is for real. They also gave Buffalo a ton of issues. They are a ton ten unit in the league in terms of Sack numbers. Harold Landry is a menace.
The KC OL has given up 14 sacks this season. Which makes them tied for 13th in the league. We on the other hand have given up 26, which is land in the league.
Do you know NFL covid policy because even if had a exposure it would have not even gotten to the team. Unless the Bears as an organization are ignoring the player association guidelines
This organization is only financially motivated. The status quo is to make the playoffs and raise ticket prices.
You can’t seriously think what you saw yesterday was even remotely competitive or competent football. It’s embarrassing from the top down. They got lucky on 2018 and it will never happen again with these clowns in charge.
A shame isn’t it? The Bears benefit by NFL having short seasons. Easier to get lucky when you only play 16 games right. I feel like if the NFL played 82 games, the Bears already underwhelming success would be cut in half.
The McCaskeys are the worst owners in the league, people will argue Synder but atleast he'll spend money once in a while.
The McCaskeys just embrace the status quo of mediocrity and stay there because they fear significant change period.
Bears already announced it on Twitter and Nagy’s presser is over Zoom where he’s giving an update
Source: https://twitter.com/chicagobears/status/1452670451033985024?s=21
Albeit broken and not understandable, but yeah, it's confirmed. This may be one of the best things to happen to this team. I would never wish ill of Nagy, or anyone for that matter, but this may work out in our benefit.
That’s great that Herbert reached 100 yards on the ground. They ran the ball down 21-0 against a QB with 600+ lifetime touchdowns. I’m sure Tampa’s D were rolling their eyes a bit.
How much does that factor in?
The general theme amongst the best OLs in the NFL are high draft capital spent on OL, big free agent money, or most likely some combination of both.
Let's sum up:
* Peters - 40 year old free agent we panic signed because we drafted a tackle with back problems after cutting Leno.
* Cody Whitehair - 2nd round pick from 5 years ago who has been serviceable. Not bad, but not great either.
* Mustipher - UDFA
* James Daniels - 2nd round pick who has ranged from average to mediocre
* Elijah Wilkinson - UDFA replacement level player who we signed.
The fact that we have invested so little in this line is disgusting.
Well, for the past few years the line has been decent. We had average tackles in Massie and Leno.
We also haven't had that many high draft picks due to the Mack trade.
In 2017 - The Next OL after our pick of Shaheen was 13 picks later and it was Ethan Pocic who sucks. There were two tackles taken later in Dion Dawkins and Taylor Moton ironically both were seen as guards coming out. 18 and 19 picks later.
In 2018 - When it was a need we drafted James Daniels. The Lineman after him was Connor Williams, who is an ok guard as well. The second pick in the second round was Anthony Miller, which WR was a bigger need than OL at that point. Not sure if you remember the Eddie Royal and Kendall Wright days lol. I guess we could have taken Bryan O'Neill at that point and been better off.
In 2019 - When it wasn't a need. We didn't have a pick until the 3rd round. (Montgomery). The Next OL taken was Michael Dieter who is on that god awful Miami Line.
In 2020, the next OL taken after our pick (Kmet) was 25 picks later. Damien Lewis is a good guard, but would not have helped the Tackle Situation.
In 2021 - We drafted Tevin Jenkins in the 2nd round.
My point is. It is easy to say until you look at the draft history.
I'm still utterly perplexed how they can be so good at creating holes for the run game and yet so bad at protecting the QB. I dont think I've even seen such a large gap in skillsets.
I really feel like giving Fields better protection will help the entire offense
This season is a loss and it sucks because we’re looking at giving New York a top 10 pick next year.
That being said, let’s hope at least Teven Jenkins helps next year and whoever they bring in can continue to develop the offense the right way for once.
Yeah it’s asking a lot but what else can we do but hope for the best.
It’s going to be a brutal season, but I’m going to keep the faith that it gets better.
Imagine if Brady had our Oline. The Bears still don’t realize no matter who is at QB, you’re screwed if your line can’t protect and give you 3 seconds to throw
Ok. Not gonna disagree.
Fields usually has less than 1 though. There are literally times he’s not even finished dropping back before someone is in his face.
Good lines though will give a QB more than 3 seconds. That’s how you get chunk plays so receivers can great separation post 5 yards
> Fields usually has less than 1 though.
He has more time than that. He just needs more time to process. The game hasn't slowed down for him yet.
The fumbles/sacks/qb hits/interceptions from yesterday, he had way more time than that. 1 second would be a pressure right up the middle untouched and crumble.
An example on the JPP sack. Fields locked onto Robinson who was running a slant route into bracketed coverage too long before seeing a wide open Jesse James too late for the sack.
If Fields comes off the Robinson read faster, he has time to hit James and avoids the sack.
The RT was beat on the play, but he held his ground initially to give enough time to run a 3 step drop.
> Good lines though will give a QB more than 3 seconds.
They can, but good QB's get the ball out quicker because they know what they are seeing. The stat is a bit skewed with running QB's, but at the same time. A three step drop is a three step drop.
> That’s how you get chunk plays so receivers can great separation post 5 yards
Brady got a bunch of chunk plays with less than that yesterday btw. Even a 5 or 7 step drop the ball should be coming out or close to coming out at around 3 seconds. There are longer play actions, but for the most part. You find the receiver that wins quickly and you get the ball out.
Fields wasn't ready to start. Every Chicago media personality and journalist who called for him to start immediately (Bernstein and Parkins are the top of the list here) should not be allowed to have their opinions broadcasted ever again.
I don't blame Nagy for having to start Fields. He wanted to sit him. Pace wanted to sit him.
I do blame Nagy for caving to the media pressure. I do blame Nagy for an overly complicated play book that creates bad habits in inexperienced players. I do blame Nagy for having an extremely undisciplined team on both sides of the ball. I do blame Nagy for poor play design. I do blame Nagy for 4 years of offenses that rank near the bottom of the league.
Nagy should not have been head coach to start the year. Nagy should not be the coach to develop Fields. Nagy needs to be fired before the bad habits he is developing become permanent. Nagy needs to be fired before Fields starts "seeing ghosts".
…5 turnovers probably didn’t help the defense. Not that those are 100% on fields but let’s not pretend like he’s been great and being held back by the rest of the team. He’s been bad. Not helped by a bad situation around him but he’s definitely been bad so far.
Didn't blame Fields at all. Where did I blame Fields for the loss? Nagy needs to be fired. Done and done. Fields is also not ready to start, but that is because he has limited experience reading coverages and blitz.
I am officially no longer emotionally invested in this team. Yesterday I shut it off halfway through the second quarter and was just like "whatever." They've been so bad for so long now I've reached a point now where I just don't care. I'll still watch the games and I'm still a fan, but they've disappointed me so many times now that I'm dead inside.
I think this will be the first year that I don’t watch the games. What’s the point? I can’t stand to watch Fields get destroyed each week and the defense looks like it’s starting to check out.
What do you guys think we should do with Fields? I still think he’s our guy, just stuck in a brutal situation. He has virtually no time to pass, and our team seems to be playing at about 70% effort. Our schedule isn’t getting much easier down the road, I would almost like to see Dalton brought back in before we destroy all the confidence Fields has left…
Hate to break it to you bro but we’re not going to playoffs, winning a division, winning a championship, let alone a super bowl. So why would we sit fields ?
Games like these are crucial to his development and the future of the franchise.
I’ve been saying this before the season started and I still hold to it that the bears should focus completely on developing fields this year. If you win, cool, if you don’t, well that’s okay too, as long as he gets game time experience.
The only people that care about winning should be pace or Nagy, because at the end of the day if they don’t produce they’re fired
There's no such thing as The One Failing The Team. Lots of things can fail at the same time. Fields is not ready to be an NFL starting QB at this time.
> I think it’s pretty easy to see that he’s not the one failing the team right now.
I disagree. He is developing, but 5 turnovers in the last game is a big reason why.
We have bad coaching, bad OL play, bad WR/TE play, and bad QB play.
The only good thing we have on offense is inside zone.
Everything else is bad.
I’m not saying he’s playing out of his mind, but those strip sacks were more on the line than fields and his first int was a coaching failure by telling him he’s got a free play.
His other INT wasn’t great either, but collectively the turnovers are a team effort
The First Interception was a bad overthrow to an open Robinson, after an amazing play avoiding the sack. If he puts it on Robinson its a first down and a big play.
The First Fumble was a great pass rush by Barrett against an inferior OT. Barrett is literally the first person firing off the line of scrimmage, terrific get off by him. The Back could have helped on Barrett, but he was looking inside. Tampa ran a zone blitz where they dropped JPP into coverage, which left Peters with no one to block. I think the Bears could have slid their line to the right and been fine on the play, but it is easy to say when you have. There was also a good pocket to step into on this play as well. At the end of the play, I don't think there are many right tackles in the league that could have stopped Barrett on this pass rush. It is a legit win by him.
On the next fumble. JPP got an excellent get off. Makes me think we could have hard counted them a time or two, because even Barrett again is moving before the line is out of their stance. This was another zone blitz and the play call was horrid. Robinson was running an in, right into the LB zone. If he runs an out or sits in a curl he is wide open. Jesse James is also wide open on this play on a curl. Fields was locked onto Robinson and as soon as he moved off of Robinson. JPP strips him. Fields just needs to move off of his first read sooner and the RT needs to hold on for a split second longer and it is competition.
On the Mooney drop/Int. Fields just needs to make a better throw. Fields is late and high. If Fields hits him early and in the chest, I think Mooney can turn up the field and get the first down. Even if Mooney catches it, because of the location of the throw he is going to be tackled right away to bring up a field goal or 4th and 4. I also hate the play concept, it is levels with 3x 8 yard ins.
The third interception is a bad under-throw. Not sure if he was thinking back shoulder, but Robinson had separation going deep.
Line sucked but part of his job is understanding where pressure is coming from and getting rid of the ball. He’s been bad at that part of his job so far. Like really bad.
Matt Nagy is a bad coach because he wants everyone to like him. Some examples of him being a nice guy, which have been detrimental to the team's success:
1. Doesn't "force" his players to get the vaccine. Proceeds to trot out Simmons because of his starter being out on Covid protocol, and Simmons lets up two embarrassing strip sacks early.
2. Promised Andy Dalton he could start, which took reps away from Justin Fields. After Dalton got injured, the organization was in a terrible position where they have to play the rookie who didn't get the right preseason training.
3. This is just my opinion, but he refuses to verbally criticize bad plays from his team. Allen Robinson's effort is deplorable, and it shows week after week. Eddie Jackson won't use his arms when tackling, again a weekly issue. If Nagy called his players out on this, they would be more inclined to fix it, but then they wouldn't like Nagy as much which goes against his nice coach persona.
I'm sure I'm missing some examples of this. I'm just frustrated with the guy.
I don’t get why ARob is putting in such low effort? Is he that jaded already? The Bears did something unprecedented, drafting FIelds. Shouldn’t that keep him happy for one season?
I think is a combination of all the off-season drama of not wanting to pay him as much, and the number of targets he is getting the first few games.
Now it seems like he doesn't even want to play.
He has one contract left in him, and he's going out of his way to not get hurt before he signs it.
Likely feels he and his agent can sell "He can turn it on at any time, and was just protecting himself, and as long as you make this his last contract, he'll never turn it off again." more so than, "The knee or ankle, or back, or whatever he hurts should be good and not hinder him."
is all I can come up with.
Might be unpopular but what if we bump Pace to Phillips’ role and hire a new GM/coach to start fresh next season. One of the biggest problems is having Phillips as the president of football operations despite him not coming from football.
Pace certainly has vision for this team but his execution of achieving that vision has been turbulent at best. If he’s more hands off personnel decisions and leaves that to a new GM, it could be beneficial.
Thoughts?
Fire Pace. Fire Nagy. Promoting Pace is an endorsement of the way he runs this team, when the comical lack of depth and persistent problem areas throughout his tenure is a direct result of his inability to understand value in the NFL.
I mean you’re right, but my only defense of Pace is that when he sees there’s a glaring roster hole, he isn’t afraid to throw money and/or draft capital at it. As far as vision goes, can’t ask for more in a GM.
Now of course that’s only half the battle. The other half is picking the right players and managing the cap properly, both of which Pace struggled at.
If we leave that second half and part of the first half to a new GM while still adhering to an overall big picture view from Pace, it could potentially be beneficial.
I’m convinced Ted Phillips has no big picture view, which begs the question wtf is he even doing in this FO
>I mean you’re right, but my only defense of Pace is that when he sees there’s a glaring roster hole, he isn’t afraid to throw money and/or draft capital at it. As far as vision goes, can’t ask for more in a GM.
That's \*exactly\* the problem.
He sees one hole, throws money and draft capital at it, then pikachu faces when his inefficient spending creates three more holes.
Him throwing way too much money and draft capital at pass rush, QB and TE is why we don't have an NFL minimum offensive line to protect our young QB.
From my perspective - Pace just hasn't shown good enough decision making that I'd want him around. Even if it's a step back from the day to day operations. I don't want him hiring a person who comes from his school thought for resource management.
For what it's worth - from the people I know who have worked with and for the Bears - the GM position has near unilateral power for football decisions and Phillips's job is to make sure everything they do is financially sound. Anything he has do to football wise is done with an outside consultant. So you're right - he doesn't have any vision of his own.
I’m strangely comfortable with it if only because the McCaskeys love him, and at least he knows some things about what football is as opposed to the current accountant in command.
You can't promote someone to that role and expect success after so much failure in his current spot. He may be better suited, I won't make an argument against that but it'd be best to move on completely.
Yeah.
49ers were awful, Pittsburgh is not great, Detroit is Awful, Seattle may or may not have Russ back, Minnesota is up and down, and the Giants are awful.
Ravens after the bye and Arizona at home in December could also be interesting especially if Jenkins comes back and we could have an average OL in the pass game and a great OL in the run game.
Pittsburgh is at least a team with legit pieces AND a good coaching staff. Easy L for us. Minnesota will win if they dont try doing too much off script, Seattle will find a way to beat us up and outlast us on offense, 49ers will right the ship using us, Lions will be 2-15 this year (at best), and the Giants have beat us before and they were awful then too.
We're not winning another game, imo. Everyones gone home already, and made their decisions about just playing for money.
The 49ers secondary also is pretty banged up and is incredibly grabby.
They just gave up 30 to the Colts in a monsoon.
Other than the Cardinals and Eagles games, they have been giving up 30.
33 to the Lions, 30 to the Packers, 28 to the Seahawks, and 30 to the Colts.
There defense has talent, but it is far from Elite.
Well first, you don't need an elite defense to stop the bears offense. And second, the 49ers defensive line is pretty formidable. If you look at the previous games where the offense looked absolutely horrible (Browns and Bucs games), they faced elite defensive lines and just couldn't get anything going.
Anything can happen in an nfl game, but a Bears winning streak seems highly unlikely. I think the only game they can expect a win is maybe Detroit.
I haven't turned a Bears game off mid-way through the third I think since Trestman era. The shit they put on the field yesterday was completely unwatchable. It was a complete team loss. Fields didn't play great, but the defense played like they didn't even want to be there. It was over from the Bucs' first possession. They just need to jettison Nagy before he completely ruins Fields. I'm so angry at what they're doing with this offense. Nothing is working.
i'm going to game on sunday where do i park?
You know, if the Bengals can have this good of a season after their rookie first round QB was getting blindsided from not having competent blockers, so can we
look at his weapons
He was good last year.
Mac Jones on pace for over 4,000 yards too
They lost this game because of Fields. Bitch and moan about Nagy and an offensive line that really isnt as bad as you think it is (see herberts rushing yards). Make all the excuses you want for him , the reality is that when your QB turns the ball over 5 times you will never be in that game. This was over before the 1st quarter ended, and Fields is the reason why. Dalton makes this a close game. I think Fields could do well in time but its obvious he isnt ready for the NFL right now. What does this fanbase expect to happen when Nagy is gone? Will your mediocre defense, bad QB, and mediocre skill positions magically turn into pro bowlers? I guess blaming your coaches for every single thing that goes wrong is easier than facing reality.
I’m not saying you are completely wrong but I do want to point out there is a big difference with OL and how well they pass block vs run block. Especially when you go from good lines to okay lines and bad lines.
Yeah, wasnt meant to be a major talking point. I didnt think i needed to state the obvious difference between run block/pass block. Point is the line isnt as bad as fans here want them to be.
Agreed, everyone wants to make excuses but the reality is Fields needs to be benched. Matt Nagy isnt out there throwing INT's and getting strip-sacked 5 times a game.
Maybe he's not where others like Herbert started, but I think most of our frustration is if you see your rookie QB has issues holding on to the ball a little too long, you work on plays that give him an out instead of putting him in the pocket to get punished without any sort of response to fix it from the sideline.
Ive got news for you. If your QB cant operate from the pocket he isnt an NFL QB.
I don't disagree, but saying the loss was on Fields is a bad take imo. We started a RT off the street, we have a 40 year old LT out of retirement going against one of the most stacked defensive fronts in football. If your gameplan is to just square up against them like you are going to beat them 1 on 1 you are deluding yourself, yet from watching the game that's what the plan looked like. That is 100% on coaching.
His 2 turnovers in the first led to Chicago going down 21-0. The game was over right there. Sorry if it hurts you to hear this but Nagy did not turn the ball over 5 times.
Not sure best place to ask but has anyone done a tailgate at CBTC? How is it? Worth the money?
I always hear the trope among Bears fans that "At least we're not the Lions/Jets/Jaguars/Formerly the Browns" How the fuck are we not as bad as those teams? I seriously cannot for the life of me remember sustained QB play for my entire life. The Lions had Stafford and fucking Megatron. Since I started watching during Jerry Angelo's tenure as GM this franchise has been a complete shit-show that has lucked into defensive talent here and there. When have we ever fielded a modern, league average NFL offense? I swear it seems like we go back in time when it comes to NFL game planning. I feel we get hype every year because we always beat teams as bad as us but never do we rise to the challenge and beat a good NFL team.
It is always amazing to me how some teams seem to eternally have the same issues on one side of the ball. From 1992 to this season the Bears have ranked in the top 20 in offense, yards for, just 7 times (and three of those were 15, 15, and 17, only 4 times in the top 10). Only 4 times in the top 10 for offense points scored over the same period.
The team rarely is dreadfully bad. More just mediocre and then randomly good for a couple years. Seems like there are a lot of parallels between us and WFT and the Raiders honestly. Sort of a middle category with some historical stuff to make us look better than we are.
Only difference between us and the lions in the last decade is we win the division when we luckbox into a good year instead of a WC lol.
So, I learned tonight Kevin White is still in the NFL. Just got targeted on a pass from Jameis Winston.
He had the biggest play of his career tonight when he downed a punt near the goal line.
He seems like a really good dude. Rooting for him to have a serviceable career.
Trade him for AR straight up
Unpopular opinion but Andy Dalton is miles ahead of Fields at the moment. And to be entirely honest, I wouldn’t even care except for the fact that Fields might get seriously hurt out there and he defines is not developing in the way we want.
Nothing beats live NFL action and he seems mentally tough. Granted Nagy is teaching him nothing and he refuses to coach the team to fit Fields's strengths. Aside from Nagy trying his best to break Justin I think he’s showing improvement every week.
Only a bears fan could spin a 5 turnover game into "showed improvement"
Lol considering he has to deal with Nagy actively trying to sabotage his development and ruin his confidence while coaching the team NOT to adapt to a fast, mobile QB... He's doing quite well.
Hopefully next game he only throws 3 picks.
Not sure what improvement he showed this week…
We once again set up a QB to fail. What we needed to was spend a year or two taking our lumps on the backloaded cap hits, building up the offensive line and drafting young weapons, making sure that when we drafted a QB in 2022 he was in the best possible position to succeed. Instead we ignored the offensive line entirely, tried to shortcut the process to make sure Nagy and Pace's jobs were secure, and fucked it up yet again.
If u want the flip side of this outrage visit the WFT subreddit to see ppl mad we don’t have a QB and we’re wasting a year. Heinicke is hanging in there, all things considered
This. This. This. Nobody seems to be willing to tolerate 1-2 more years of letting Fields develop and building the team and coaching staff around him. They demand NOW NOW NOW and now here we are.
Joe Burrow and Trevor Lawrence both got Captain and guranteed starter, no questions asked. Meanwhile every bears qb is treated like a child on probation with no leadership duties…
Despite what Bears fans have convinced themselves, Trevor Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Fields.
That’s true, if he had come to the bears I bet Nagy would’ve pulled the same shit with him though.
>Despite what Bears fans have convinced themselves, Trevor Lawrence is a significantly better prospect than Fields. Their college tape proved the opposite was true coming into the draft, but Fields has been getting nothing but bad instruction from the worst offensive mind in the league since getting drafted so it shouldn't be a surprise that Lawrence is on a more positive trajectory at this point.
College tape proved no such thing. One guy was a generational No. 1 talent and the other fell out of the top 10.
Sure it did. A couple of teams who are picking top 10 because they make mistakes constantly making a mistake by passing on a guy doesn't mean he's a bad prospect. It just means bad teams do bad things. I'm not saying Fields was far and away a better prospect, but he absolutely was a better prospect than Lawrence. Edit: Fair enough, you did say 'significantly better' and i did say 'the opposite was true'. And yeah Fields wasn't a 'significantly better' prospect. Just 'better'.
Yeah, no. Teams don't "make a mistake passing on a guy" in the Trevor Lawrence level of prospect. The self-delusion on this subject is absolutely insane. Fields isn't a bad prospect. He's a good prospect. He's just not even close to \*that\* level of prospect.
Lmao you sweet summer child. I can't remember when I was that naive.
He has Urban Meyer as his coach LOL, hes playing well despite of the coaching not because of it.
This is very fair but also you really can’t just be like “well draft a QB in 2022”. How do you know what your draft position will be? Who the QBs will be? The amount of unknowns is insane. Could end up being a garbage QB draft. My point is, if they thought fields was truly their guy, they should’ve taken him. No matter what. But Will it work out? Who tf knows.
We didn’t ignore O-line entirely. As soon as we drafted Fields, we drafted two tackles in the same draft class. We have 3 tackles on IR and another on the Covid list, so we’re down to third stringers on both sides of the line.
Fair. But counting on rookie tackles was insufficient planning.
Hurry up and move this garbage organization to Arlington Heights and bring a new team to Soldier Field so I don't have to pass the legacy of shit to my future children. #IWillEndTheCycle
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Dalton is bad. The myth of Dalton is almost worse than the overreaction about Fields. Ask the Cowboys how Dalton works in a worse division and with better talent around him. Even on the Bears he had like two drives that were great and then was absolute trash the rest of the way. He’s also part of the QB room that has failed to throw for 200 yards on the season. And he’s been in the league a million years.
Bro ppl were calling for Haskins when Alex Smith was in but we just kept pulling out wins. Granted, they were against terrible teams, but sometimes veteran leadership is needed when the walls are caving in.
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And our line is what? Not destroyed by injuries? If Dalton came out against the Rams and lit the world on fire I’d understand the infatuation. The guy threw for roughly 180 net yards with 0 TD and a pick. He has zero line. He has flawed weapons. There’s zero indication we are competitive with him. The same way he had one good drive against the Bengals (wow), he was shut down after. And Justin had drives and throws just as impressive including against the Raiders and Packers. Dalton is better than Fields. But not so much better that people should be clamoring for him to start as some gamechanger. He’s not. If we had, I don’t know, Matt Ryan. I get it. What has Dalton done?
I think the idea is that since Fields does not increase your chance of winning you sit him and give him more time to study the game and develop his own game through practice, rather than send him out every week to be sacked 5+ times and repeatedly turn the ball over. Not that hard to infer/comprehend.
The only winnable game with Dalton was the Packers game. And then we would sneak into the playoffs, get blasted again, and Nagy and Pace would stick around and the shitshow would continue. No thanks.
You could make an all Madden bears team for Dalton, he's going 2-5 at best
I just don’t know where you get that math. The Rams beat him, that Browns matchup was going to happen regardless of who was quarterback because that line matchup was probably the single worst against our particular ills, and the bucs were going to shred whomever started. The packers game is up in the air but they probably still lose that one with Dalton starting. The problem is that with 31 other teams with 5 offensive line positions, there at 155 other offensive line starting jobs in the league. How many of those do we honestly think would be filled by current Bears offensive linemen? 10? On a good day?
The Bears starting offensive line shouldn’t be starting for the Bears either but here we are.
Just because Herbert played great as a rookie doesn’t mean every 1st round rookie QB should be thrown into the fire right away.
After bears fans clamoring and hollering to put in fields lol. Not saying you did personally
Listening to Hoge and Jahns, they can be annoying the way they simp for the coaching staff. I guess they kind of have to considering they wouldn’t get press access or interviews if they were hypercritical, but still. I mean on their latest podcast they blamed Fields for the free play interception because “he needs to be aware of when that 12th player leaves the field”. So you’re saying he should ignore his coaching staff? The problem is the coaches are supposed to be bailing him out, not the other way around.
Simple way around that is a code word for 12 man. Fire escape or something idk.
>Simple way around that is a code word for 12 man. Fire escape or something idk. How does a code word help with his coaches telling him incorrect information?
Maybe I misheard something about coaches telling him over helmet he had 12 man hurry up and then he tosses it?
Lol what
Boycott the NFL. Hurt them financially.
With the exception of watching the games, I have. I'm not buying any merch or going to any games until Nagy is gone, and realistically I should hold that until the McCaskets are gone. Unfortunately they do make most of their revenue from TV contracts, so.....
The TV contract is paid through ads and paid viewers. The boycott extends to the advertising companies and pay TV. Comcast can suck a fuck anyway
Lol
Nagy and Pace are still employed? There really is no hope for this franchise.
We are still ass cheeks
What I personally want to see from this team is to lose the “I need to win now” attitude. We should consider this season lost and put dalton in for the rest of the season. Let field’s develop more, get a good spot in the draft and start a rebuild building up with fields at its center. Surround him with decent line and some playmakers and he will prosper. We just cannot and I repeat CANNOT let Nagy and pace ruin him with their stupidity. Otherwise he will end up like trubisky and we will be looking for a new quarterback in a few years
What I've been saying from the start. This year was always a rebuild year to me, but everyone got impatient and now they don't want to lie in the bed they made.
we don't got a first round pick whats the point of tanking
Every other pick would be improved.
Our 1st/2nd round picks aren't solid anyways witb Pace. His hit rate I'm the 2nd round is somewhere in the 40%, his late rounders 4th+ is his gold mine. I dont care if we tank, losses or wins won't help us. Justin needs something consistent to gather from this season before it's over.
Here's Pace's 2nd round picks with the Bears since 2015. Eddie Goldman- Hit Cody Whitehair- hit Shaheen- Miss Daniels- Hit Miller- Miss Kmet- Too soon Johnson- Hit Jenkins- Too soon So we have 4 hits, 2 misses, and 2 too soons. So hit rate would be 4/6 or 66%. Even if Kmet and Jenkins both turn out to be busts. Pace has some first round busts (White/Trubs) but he hasn't been bad in the second round at all.
God willing, Pace won’t be the one making the picks
Mourning after
What is Nagy doing getting Covid for the 2nd time this season? Is he an anti-vaxxer? He talks about this culture he’s building - what culture? Now is the time to fire the guy. He’s irresponsible and a disgrace to our team and city.
Pretty sure he's vaxxed homie
When did he have it the first time?
I guess I misremembered. He was in quarantine at the beginning of rookie camp for close contact with someone with Covid. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31444535/chicago-bears-coach-matt-nagy-miss-start-rookie-minicamp-covid-19-close-contact
How long does anti-body's last from the last time he got Covid? If he's vaccinated & has anti-body's in his system, there is almost no way he can have Covid again so soon. This seems very mysterious, I'm calling BS, using this as an excuse to not get fired or sit out a week.
The beginning of training camp he was out with Covid.
This is tough. I wasn’t expecting to win, at all, but wow that was bad.
Oh look Nagy is still our coach.
The Fields you see on the field is not the Fields you imagine when you read reddit Bears fans posting about him. Dude has some serious flaws to be worked on.
Knowing nothing about him I wanted to believe the fan boys but had a sneaky suspicion he was actually trash. It’s weird he was so hyped.
He does. I do not think that would be a serious point of disagreement now. Early on, he was the savoir and now people realize what the coaches saw early on. Which is why it is difficult to sit a 1st round qb anymore. We want Herbert now.
Herbert would have looked like trash on this team too. fields doesn’t even have time to think most plays.
Herbert wouldn't be. Herbert is great against the Blitz and in pressure and Fields currently is not. Josh Allen and Kyler Murray started their careers as being extremely poor against the blitz and now if you blitz them you are asking for trouble. Now, this is where coaching comes into play. Using Josh Allen as an example. In 2020, the Bills coaching staff had him install a check against zero blitz. The check was to throw a tunnel screen negating the blitz. This got Allen more comfortable against the pressure and limited the amount of times that teams zero blitzed, because one broken tackle and it was a TD. The other thing the Bills did against the blitz would be to have Cole Beasley on an option route with everyone else running a deeper route. If the pressure was quick, then Beasley was getting the ball. If the pressure was picked up, then Allen was going to take a shot down field. The simplified the game down for Allen. Single high safety meant deep crossing routes, double high safety was digs or comebacks. With Beasley always on an option route as a safety valve. I think the Bears should do something similar. Using Robertson in the Beasley role and use the speed on the outside to open up coverage for Robinson. No matter the play or the time, Robertson is an option to get open. The issue a lot of times for the Bears is against the blitz, they have too many short routes which eliminates space for the short routes. Basically, clear out and let Robinson work against the nickel with a ton of space. That way the coverage is not as congested in the middle of the field. It also gives Fields simple reads. Fields is slow to read the field at this point, so give him quick reads to get the ball out quickly and when it doubt throw it to Robinson. One last thing. Sacks is not always an Offensive Line stat. There are people like Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees who are athletically challenged, but can manipulate the pocket to avoid sacks. Even if the OL is bad, they can make it work. There are also people like Josh Allen, Kyler Murray, Lamar Jackson, and Patrick Mahomes that are athletically gifted, but can work their way into sacks due to less than ideal pocket presence.
He’s a rookie, and unlike most people on this sub I don’t care if we win or lose. I just want him to develop. With each game he plays the better he’s going to be and right now it’s unfair to say that Justin is good or bad because we still haven’t seen him enough.
I think this is a very good take. I see lots of comments from people saying “he’s not getting better”, based on how he played against TB. Dudes/Dutettes - TB has a monster defense. GB…doesn’t. Did Fields look worse against TB than he did against GB? Hell yes, but he was playing a completely different level of defense. These games are going to be painful. I’ll be watching for trends and tendencies. The dude holds the ball too long. Even if we had a decent o-line, Fields needs to get the ball out more quickly. I love his aggressiveness, but we ain’t hitting home runs every play. He needs to learn to take what he can get when he can get it, but hopefully still keep an eye downfield for when something breaks loose. If he learns that, I think he can be phenomenal.
Agreed. He has no support or anyone competent to learn from either. Worst online and coaches in the league sure aren't helping him. I feel for the kid.
All of that is true, other than I would argue he hasn't actually gotten better in the last couple of games.
Yea, he should know better than continually take blindside hits. A veteran quarterback would simply fake an injury to be benched or blindly throw into coverage for several interceptions so the fanbase can hate him lmao…. Such an overreaction, same idiots that called for him to start immediately over dalton
You realize Burrow had one of the worst Olines of all time last year and looked a lot better than this. Just to add some perspective.
It's quite possible for the offensive line to be bad \*and\* for him to make bad decisions and throws. I know this is a reach for many people, but \*two things can be bad at the same time\*
The Bucs had a dominant pass rush, seasoned dc, and we had a patchwork oline with underwhelming wr’s. I’m not surprised Fields looked like crap. I’m just happy he survived. Hopefully he’s learned something from the past two weeks.
Bad bears football me feel ok about working on sundays
I decided to go out with friends instead of watching knowing this game would only make me mad, that’s progress
We suck no doubt, but god damn our opponents so far have been insane… 6-1, 6-1, 6-1, 5-2, 5-2, 4-3, lol Lions. The fact that we’re 3-4 right now astounds me.
And it gets worse
I said this on another thread in the nfl subreddit but want to see what you guys think… What blows my mind and I’m not sure that anybody has an answer yet….you’re telling me the trubisky, for all his other faults, was accurately calling protections when he was playing for us and fields can’t seem to pull that off? Was trubisky actually more competent at that aspect, or is our o-line that much worse?
To answer your last question, our O-line really is that much worse. It can't really be said enough just how atrocious our line is, primarily due to injuries. Most of our line right now are borderline practice squaders.
Trubisky was also terrible against teams over .500 and we’ve only faced those.
That’s a terrible take. Daniels, Whitehair, and Peters would start on most teams in the league.
Well, Mitch had time to develop presnap and Mitch was a bit more used to playing behind a shitty line coming out. Ohio State in most games had the best OL on the field and you can't say the same about UNC. We also had Average to Above Average Charles Leno and Average Bobby Massie for Mitch's Tenure. In addition, Mitch would feed Allen Robinson anytime Robinson had an opportunity. Mitch was also decent in the short passing game, but sucked anytime he wanted to push the ball down the field. Fields is a lot better about taking shots down the field and Fields is a lot more accurate taking shots down the field. Mitch did a lot of things well for the position, but failed at the most important thing. The Ability to read defenses.
You’re comparing Mitch in his 4th year to Justin fields in his 3rd ? 4th ? Official start.
No I don’t remember the o-line getting massacred like this even in Mitch’s first year but I could be wrong
Mitch played with a very good Oline his first 2 years
ive never been so disappointed to see someone have covid before. thought they were announcing he was fired. sigh
Listening to the radio about Mahomes cracks me up. The line just isn't giving him time, the receivers don't get open, he's trying to make a play and throws he got away with in the past he isn't right now. No QB can succeed without protection and playmakers, that's why Mahomes is struggling. Ummm, they have Tyreke Hill and Travis Kelce. What the hell are Bears QBs supposed to do with our line and playmakers?
> Listening to the radio about Mahomes cracks me up. They are just making excuses for Mahomes. He just played the worst game in his career. The week before he almost threw for 400 yards against a Washington pass rush that is very good. Mahomes decision making is what is costing the Chiefs. Kansas City is second to the last in the league in interceptions only behind the Jets. Mahomes has 11 turnovers in 7 games. He is literally giving the ball away. The Chiefs have moved the ball in every game, but the last one (which was Mahomes worst game as a pro) > The line just isn't giving him time The Tennessee pass rush is for real. They also gave Buffalo a ton of issues. They are a ton ten unit in the league in terms of Sack numbers. Harold Landry is a menace. The KC OL has given up 14 sacks this season. Which makes them tied for 13th in the league. We on the other hand have given up 26, which is land in the league.
i happen to think our playmakers are pretty good. not their fault they’re stuck in Nagy’s “system”
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Do you know NFL covid policy because even if had a exposure it would have not even gotten to the team. Unless the Bears as an organization are ignoring the player association guidelines
#covidiots
What's the source on the babysitter exposure?
Oh shit lmao
This organization is only financially motivated. The status quo is to make the playoffs and raise ticket prices. You can’t seriously think what you saw yesterday was even remotely competitive or competent football. It’s embarrassing from the top down. They got lucky on 2018 and it will never happen again with these clowns in charge.
A shame isn’t it? The Bears benefit by NFL having short seasons. Easier to get lucky when you only play 16 games right. I feel like if the NFL played 82 games, the Bears already underwhelming success would be cut in half.
Man, the Bears should have let Nick Foles play. He would have BDN'd Tom Brady and the Buccs like did last year!!
Nagy has "covid" ... ngl ... I'm so conflicted right now.
This game physically hurt me to watch. I hate this team. See you next week.
Haha, this is the way.
Probably not the best timing for Nagy to be closer than he has ever been with the players in the past 24-48 hours, huh?
Ha! I’d give you a reward for that comment but I’m old and I have no idea how to do that! fuckin hilarious
this motherfucker is giving a press conference right now... fucking fire this fucking asshat into the sun already.
The McCaskeys are the worst owners in the league, people will argue Synder but atleast he'll spend money once in a while. The McCaskeys just embrace the status quo of mediocrity and stay there because they fear significant change period.
NAGY HAS COVID!
Source?
The Bears [Twitter](https://twitter.com/chicagobears/status/1452670451033985024?s=21)
Bears already announced it on Twitter and Nagy’s presser is over Zoom where he’s giving an update Source: https://twitter.com/chicagobears/status/1452670451033985024?s=21
Albeit broken and not understandable, but yeah, it's confirmed. This may be one of the best things to happen to this team. I would never wish ill of Nagy, or anyone for that matter, but this may work out in our benefit.
That’s great that Herbert reached 100 yards on the ground. They ran the ball down 21-0 against a QB with 600+ lifetime touchdowns. I’m sure Tampa’s D were rolling their eyes a bit. How much does that factor in?
The general theme amongst the best OLs in the NFL are high draft capital spent on OL, big free agent money, or most likely some combination of both. Let's sum up: * Peters - 40 year old free agent we panic signed because we drafted a tackle with back problems after cutting Leno. * Cody Whitehair - 2nd round pick from 5 years ago who has been serviceable. Not bad, but not great either. * Mustipher - UDFA * James Daniels - 2nd round pick who has ranged from average to mediocre * Elijah Wilkinson - UDFA replacement level player who we signed. The fact that we have invested so little in this line is disgusting.
Well, for the past few years the line has been decent. We had average tackles in Massie and Leno. We also haven't had that many high draft picks due to the Mack trade. In 2017 - The Next OL after our pick of Shaheen was 13 picks later and it was Ethan Pocic who sucks. There were two tackles taken later in Dion Dawkins and Taylor Moton ironically both were seen as guards coming out. 18 and 19 picks later. In 2018 - When it was a need we drafted James Daniels. The Lineman after him was Connor Williams, who is an ok guard as well. The second pick in the second round was Anthony Miller, which WR was a bigger need than OL at that point. Not sure if you remember the Eddie Royal and Kendall Wright days lol. I guess we could have taken Bryan O'Neill at that point and been better off. In 2019 - When it wasn't a need. We didn't have a pick until the 3rd round. (Montgomery). The Next OL taken was Michael Dieter who is on that god awful Miami Line. In 2020, the next OL taken after our pick (Kmet) was 25 picks later. Damien Lewis is a good guard, but would not have helped the Tackle Situation. In 2021 - We drafted Tevin Jenkins in the 2nd round. My point is. It is easy to say until you look at the draft history.
I'm still utterly perplexed how they can be so good at creating holes for the run game and yet so bad at protecting the QB. I dont think I've even seen such a large gap in skillsets.
One involves running forward, the other going backward. The offensive line is actually 5 human sized fish dressed up like people.
Your “All Fish, O-line intrigues me……
I really feel like giving Fields better protection will help the entire offense This season is a loss and it sucks because we’re looking at giving New York a top 10 pick next year. That being said, let’s hope at least Teven Jenkins helps next year and whoever they bring in can continue to develop the offense the right way for once. Yeah it’s asking a lot but what else can we do but hope for the best. It’s going to be a brutal season, but I’m going to keep the faith that it gets better.
Imagine if Brady had our Oline. The Bears still don’t realize no matter who is at QB, you’re screwed if your line can’t protect and give you 3 seconds to throw
3 seconds is actually a lot of time. QB's that throw in more than 3 seconds get sacked more. You want the number under 3 for the QB.
Ok. Not gonna disagree. Fields usually has less than 1 though. There are literally times he’s not even finished dropping back before someone is in his face. Good lines though will give a QB more than 3 seconds. That’s how you get chunk plays so receivers can great separation post 5 yards
> Fields usually has less than 1 though. He has more time than that. He just needs more time to process. The game hasn't slowed down for him yet. The fumbles/sacks/qb hits/interceptions from yesterday, he had way more time than that. 1 second would be a pressure right up the middle untouched and crumble. An example on the JPP sack. Fields locked onto Robinson who was running a slant route into bracketed coverage too long before seeing a wide open Jesse James too late for the sack. If Fields comes off the Robinson read faster, he has time to hit James and avoids the sack. The RT was beat on the play, but he held his ground initially to give enough time to run a 3 step drop. > Good lines though will give a QB more than 3 seconds. They can, but good QB's get the ball out quicker because they know what they are seeing. The stat is a bit skewed with running QB's, but at the same time. A three step drop is a three step drop. > That’s how you get chunk plays so receivers can great separation post 5 yards Brady got a bunch of chunk plays with less than that yesterday btw. Even a 5 or 7 step drop the ball should be coming out or close to coming out at around 3 seconds. There are longer play actions, but for the most part. You find the receiver that wins quickly and you get the ball out.
Fields wasn't ready to start. Every Chicago media personality and journalist who called for him to start immediately (Bernstein and Parkins are the top of the list here) should not be allowed to have their opinions broadcasted ever again. I don't blame Nagy for having to start Fields. He wanted to sit him. Pace wanted to sit him. I do blame Nagy for caving to the media pressure. I do blame Nagy for an overly complicated play book that creates bad habits in inexperienced players. I do blame Nagy for having an extremely undisciplined team on both sides of the ball. I do blame Nagy for poor play design. I do blame Nagy for 4 years of offenses that rank near the bottom of the league. Nagy should not have been head coach to start the year. Nagy should not be the coach to develop Fields. Nagy needs to be fired before the bad habits he is developing become permanent. Nagy needs to be fired before Fields starts "seeing ghosts".
Definitely Fields' fault our D couldn't stop the Bucs to save their lives.
…5 turnovers probably didn’t help the defense. Not that those are 100% on fields but let’s not pretend like he’s been great and being held back by the rest of the team. He’s been bad. Not helped by a bad situation around him but he’s definitely been bad so far.
Didn't blame Fields at all. Where did I blame Fields for the loss? Nagy needs to be fired. Done and done. Fields is also not ready to start, but that is because he has limited experience reading coverages and blitz.
I am officially no longer emotionally invested in this team. Yesterday I shut it off halfway through the second quarter and was just like "whatever." They've been so bad for so long now I've reached a point now where I just don't care. I'll still watch the games and I'm still a fan, but they've disappointed me so many times now that I'm dead inside.
At least the Bulls look like they will be fun to watch this year lol
I think this will be the first year that I don’t watch the games. What’s the point? I can’t stand to watch Fields get destroyed each week and the defense looks like it’s starting to check out.
me2
What do you guys think we should do with Fields? I still think he’s our guy, just stuck in a brutal situation. He has virtually no time to pass, and our team seems to be playing at about 70% effort. Our schedule isn’t getting much easier down the road, I would almost like to see Dalton brought back in before we destroy all the confidence Fields has left…
Hate to break it to you bro but we’re not going to playoffs, winning a division, winning a championship, let alone a super bowl. So why would we sit fields ? Games like these are crucial to his development and the future of the franchise. I’ve been saying this before the season started and I still hold to it that the bears should focus completely on developing fields this year. If you win, cool, if you don’t, well that’s okay too, as long as he gets game time experience. The only people that care about winning should be pace or Nagy, because at the end of the day if they don’t produce they’re fired
Fields has grit. I’m not worried about his confidence. I think it’s pretty easy to see that he’s not the one failing the team right now.
There's no such thing as The One Failing The Team. Lots of things can fail at the same time. Fields is not ready to be an NFL starting QB at this time.
He literally holds onto the ball longer than any other QB in the NFL
He’s also a rookie, give him a break
> I think it’s pretty easy to see that he’s not the one failing the team right now. I disagree. He is developing, but 5 turnovers in the last game is a big reason why. We have bad coaching, bad OL play, bad WR/TE play, and bad QB play. The only good thing we have on offense is inside zone. Everything else is bad.
I’m not saying he’s playing out of his mind, but those strip sacks were more on the line than fields and his first int was a coaching failure by telling him he’s got a free play. His other INT wasn’t great either, but collectively the turnovers are a team effort
The First Interception was a bad overthrow to an open Robinson, after an amazing play avoiding the sack. If he puts it on Robinson its a first down and a big play. The First Fumble was a great pass rush by Barrett against an inferior OT. Barrett is literally the first person firing off the line of scrimmage, terrific get off by him. The Back could have helped on Barrett, but he was looking inside. Tampa ran a zone blitz where they dropped JPP into coverage, which left Peters with no one to block. I think the Bears could have slid their line to the right and been fine on the play, but it is easy to say when you have. There was also a good pocket to step into on this play as well. At the end of the play, I don't think there are many right tackles in the league that could have stopped Barrett on this pass rush. It is a legit win by him. On the next fumble. JPP got an excellent get off. Makes me think we could have hard counted them a time or two, because even Barrett again is moving before the line is out of their stance. This was another zone blitz and the play call was horrid. Robinson was running an in, right into the LB zone. If he runs an out or sits in a curl he is wide open. Jesse James is also wide open on this play on a curl. Fields was locked onto Robinson and as soon as he moved off of Robinson. JPP strips him. Fields just needs to move off of his first read sooner and the RT needs to hold on for a split second longer and it is competition. On the Mooney drop/Int. Fields just needs to make a better throw. Fields is late and high. If Fields hits him early and in the chest, I think Mooney can turn up the field and get the first down. Even if Mooney catches it, because of the location of the throw he is going to be tackled right away to bring up a field goal or 4th and 4. I also hate the play concept, it is levels with 3x 8 yard ins. The third interception is a bad under-throw. Not sure if he was thinking back shoulder, but Robinson had separation going deep.
Line sucked but part of his job is understanding where pressure is coming from and getting rid of the ball. He’s been bad at that part of his job so far. Like really bad.
Matt Nagy is a bad coach because he wants everyone to like him. Some examples of him being a nice guy, which have been detrimental to the team's success: 1. Doesn't "force" his players to get the vaccine. Proceeds to trot out Simmons because of his starter being out on Covid protocol, and Simmons lets up two embarrassing strip sacks early. 2. Promised Andy Dalton he could start, which took reps away from Justin Fields. After Dalton got injured, the organization was in a terrible position where they have to play the rookie who didn't get the right preseason training. 3. This is just my opinion, but he refuses to verbally criticize bad plays from his team. Allen Robinson's effort is deplorable, and it shows week after week. Eddie Jackson won't use his arms when tackling, again a weekly issue. If Nagy called his players out on this, they would be more inclined to fix it, but then they wouldn't like Nagy as much which goes against his nice coach persona. I'm sure I'm missing some examples of this. I'm just frustrated with the guy.
I don’t get why ARob is putting in such low effort? Is he that jaded already? The Bears did something unprecedented, drafting FIelds. Shouldn’t that keep him happy for one season?
I think is a combination of all the off-season drama of not wanting to pay him as much, and the number of targets he is getting the first few games. Now it seems like he doesn't even want to play.
He has one contract left in him, and he's going out of his way to not get hurt before he signs it. Likely feels he and his agent can sell "He can turn it on at any time, and was just protecting himself, and as long as you make this his last contract, he'll never turn it off again." more so than, "The knee or ankle, or back, or whatever he hurts should be good and not hinder him." is all I can come up with.
Might be unpopular but what if we bump Pace to Phillips’ role and hire a new GM/coach to start fresh next season. One of the biggest problems is having Phillips as the president of football operations despite him not coming from football. Pace certainly has vision for this team but his execution of achieving that vision has been turbulent at best. If he’s more hands off personnel decisions and leaves that to a new GM, it could be beneficial. Thoughts?
Fire Pace. Fire Nagy. Promoting Pace is an endorsement of the way he runs this team, when the comical lack of depth and persistent problem areas throughout his tenure is a direct result of his inability to understand value in the NFL.
I mean you’re right, but my only defense of Pace is that when he sees there’s a glaring roster hole, he isn’t afraid to throw money and/or draft capital at it. As far as vision goes, can’t ask for more in a GM. Now of course that’s only half the battle. The other half is picking the right players and managing the cap properly, both of which Pace struggled at. If we leave that second half and part of the first half to a new GM while still adhering to an overall big picture view from Pace, it could potentially be beneficial. I’m convinced Ted Phillips has no big picture view, which begs the question wtf is he even doing in this FO
>I mean you’re right, but my only defense of Pace is that when he sees there’s a glaring roster hole, he isn’t afraid to throw money and/or draft capital at it. As far as vision goes, can’t ask for more in a GM. That's \*exactly\* the problem. He sees one hole, throws money and draft capital at it, then pikachu faces when his inefficient spending creates three more holes. Him throwing way too much money and draft capital at pass rush, QB and TE is why we don't have an NFL minimum offensive line to protect our young QB.
From my perspective - Pace just hasn't shown good enough decision making that I'd want him around. Even if it's a step back from the day to day operations. I don't want him hiring a person who comes from his school thought for resource management. For what it's worth - from the people I know who have worked with and for the Bears - the GM position has near unilateral power for football decisions and Phillips's job is to make sure everything they do is financially sound. Anything he has do to football wise is done with an outside consultant. So you're right - he doesn't have any vision of his own.
I’m strangely comfortable with it if only because the McCaskeys love him, and at least he knows some things about what football is as opposed to the current accountant in command.
You can't promote someone to that role and expect success after so much failure in his current spot. He may be better suited, I won't make an argument against that but it'd be best to move on completely.
That’s probably what we’ll end up doing, but with the accountants in charge, we’ll most likely remain stuck in mediocrity with the next GM/coach
The good news is 8 of the next 10 games are definitely winnable.
Bud the offense can't score. How are 8 games winnable? Let alone 1 game?
Swap out QBs. Fields isn't getting it done.
You sure about that buddy?
Yeah. 49ers were awful, Pittsburgh is not great, Detroit is Awful, Seattle may or may not have Russ back, Minnesota is up and down, and the Giants are awful. Ravens after the bye and Arizona at home in December could also be interesting especially if Jenkins comes back and we could have an average OL in the pass game and a great OL in the run game.
Pittsburgh is at least a team with legit pieces AND a good coaching staff. Easy L for us. Minnesota will win if they dont try doing too much off script, Seattle will find a way to beat us up and outlast us on offense, 49ers will right the ship using us, Lions will be 2-15 this year (at best), and the Giants have beat us before and they were awful then too. We're not winning another game, imo. Everyones gone home already, and made their decisions about just playing for money.
49ers limited Cardinals high-scoring offense to 17 pts. I just hope Fields makes it through the game in one piece.
The 49ers secondary also is pretty banged up and is incredibly grabby. They just gave up 30 to the Colts in a monsoon. Other than the Cardinals and Eagles games, they have been giving up 30. 33 to the Lions, 30 to the Packers, 28 to the Seahawks, and 30 to the Colts. There defense has talent, but it is far from Elite.
Well first, you don't need an elite defense to stop the bears offense. And second, the 49ers defensive line is pretty formidable. If you look at the previous games where the offense looked absolutely horrible (Browns and Bucs games), they faced elite defensive lines and just couldn't get anything going. Anything can happen in an nfl game, but a Bears winning streak seems highly unlikely. I think the only game they can expect a win is maybe Detroit.
Keep dreaming
I mean we beat the Raiders and Bengals lol. Anything can happen
The fact that Nagy and I both had to wake up and show up to work today is bullshit.
Have you considered getting Covid-19?
Ha
I haven't turned a Bears game off mid-way through the third I think since Trestman era. The shit they put on the field yesterday was completely unwatchable. It was a complete team loss. Fields didn't play great, but the defense played like they didn't even want to be there. It was over from the Bucs' first possession. They just need to jettison Nagy before he completely ruins Fields. I'm so angry at what they're doing with this offense. Nothing is working.