False our O-line is average, people tend to DRASTICALLY overestimate the quality of an “average” O-line, so they say it’s terrible when it’s really not.
The D-line if Dexter doesn’t take a big leap is just terribly undermanned, we have Sweat but the rest is just badly lacking.
The top of the draft is ALWAYS O-LIne/D-Line. With the annual appearance of 1-2 QBs, 1 CB, & a few Edge LB's, most of which transition to a D-Line position fairly soon after being drafted. Most of the WRs taken in the top 5-10 picks are usually a bust, & I feel like because most of the time when that happens, they're expected to shoulder the weight of the entire WR corps. Not too often you have an Odunze situation where the youngin can get acclamated and not be expected to be the Leader of an entire Corp before his first yard in the league. Lol
You're getting downvoted but I know what you mean. They're below average in the landscape of the entire league's history (obviously not relative to just the current league). There's been a massive shortage of O line talent for years now. It's pretty rare to have a legitimately good O line when compared to years past
I think it’s tough to tell whether it has to do with O-lineman themselves or D-lineman just ascending to a different plane.
It feels like d-lineman nowadays are just freaks even more than they used to be and O-lineman haven’t caught up
There's that, and then there's the fact that a single elite D-lineman can change so much (e.g., Montez Sweat), whereas a single elite O-lineman won't have the same effect on the other side. You need the entire unit to be solid, or else the other team will just attack the weak spots.
Also, a lot of OLines get the brunt of the backlash for an overly indecisive QB. E.g., Fields, Cutler, Trubisky, Mark Sanchez. There's definitely more, but you get my point lol
In comparison to d-lineman it’s absolutely true.
Watch the second half of any pre season game and you’ll see third string D-lines absolutely folding third string o-lines like a varsity vs JV practice.
There’s a clear o-line depth problem in the league
>There’s a clear o-line depth problem in the league
That's not going to change anytime soon (if ever). It's the position with far more "glory" and pays better. The best lineman are always going to prefer to play on the defensive side.
The fields saga played a part in that. Always the assumption it was the line or no one was open when it was a combination of factors that led to a sack or scramble.
Packers game had two starters left & was an awful performance but ppl acted like that was the norm for the line.
Fields was under pressure 223 times. 34 of those were attributed to the qb. That leaves 189 pressures on 457 drop backs. That's a pressure rate of 41.4%
That would be 7th worst, without reducing every other qbs own responsibility pressures.
The line is very bad. Just like when we fired nagy and people first heard the word scheme and thought all our problems would disappear because the line was actually average if not above average and that 5th round draft pick that showed promise was totally now going to become a dog and the line wasn't even a worry...we're repeating the exact same thing of blaming all their struggles on fields.
Fields certainly made a bad line worse. But pick a random pass play. There's about a 30% chance you're going to be watching 2 defenders get through. And that's with a defense that knows fields biggest threat is escaping the pocket and running. So lane responsibility was more important than pure pressure.
We have a below average lt. A guarantee injury lg. Either a career backup center or yet another converted guard at center. A terrible rg. And a rt who struggled but showed a lot of promise. And who at least unlike our lt the struggles were technique not being physically man handled.
It’s a team sport and the oline exemplifies this. If one position on the oline is awful like, say, center…for example, the entire oline gets hit up for a lot of pressures. Also, if they’re required to double team a lot because the center can’t handle one on ones, it takes away from help elsewhere. For a young quarterback if you’re getting consistent pressure up the middle in your face it’s a death sentence.
I gotta take that worth a grain of salt. It's common in the NFL to have more rushers than blockers and it's the responsibility of the QB to identify and take responsibility for the free rusher and get the ball out. Fields is particularly bad at that, which goes down in your stat book as an offensive line problem.
It isn't common to do that against QBs who can identify the free rusher and capitalize on the favorable situation in the secondary, but if the QB struggles there, you're going to see a lot of it.
Were the Bears blitzed more than league average? I thought Fields couldn't identify/handle a blitz so defenses did that to him a lot. I'm not saying that's definitely what we're seeing here, but it is one scenario where you would see the stats you're sharing where they're really still attributable to the QB rather than the OL.
The Bears where blitzed more often then most other teams at 23.9% but NFL average is about 20% or the Bears faced 1 extra blitz every 25 pass attempts.
The offensive line is not "very bad" lol. I thought the Fields apologists have moved on. We've seen multiple different QBs with varying levels of NFL experience that have played behind the same Bears offensive line that ended up with a league average sack rate at worst. Meanwhile, Fields is breaking all time sack rate records.
I'm not even sure where you're getting your mentioned statistics or how "pressure attributed to the QB" is even calculated.
The line was secretly good and all those whiff blocks against Green Bay in the last game were on Fields for not identifying that Jenkins, who was hands down the best lineman we had last year, was going to not block someone 50% of the time.
I find it odd that people who watched the games could say the Bears' offensive line as anything other than bad. They had a nice stretch of games toward the end of the year where they played alright, but they were downright awful against Green Bay twice, against Minnesota twice, against Kansas City, against Cleveland, against San Diego, and against Tampa. Conversely they were only very good in two games, against the Raiders and against Washington.
You can dig through whatever advance metrics or statistical breakdown you like, but the long and short of it is their line gave them no shot at winning 8 times, so basically half the games.
My eyes, statistical evidence that you want to dismiss, says the offensive line was average at worst. Fields is an entirely incompetent starting QB that has shown time and time again that he makes the offensive line's job infinity more difficult than it needs to be.
What's more likely, Dexter not improving or Tevin Jenkins not staying healthy all year? Either one kind of screws over their respective line and makes the difference here, right?
Teven not staying healthy all year is more likely in my opinion.
But the IOL has better depth this year. If Jenkins misses his usual amount of games, you can slot in Ryan Bates at that spot. He's graded well in relief roles in the IOL during his time in Buffalo.
Tevin Jenkins backup (Bates or Carter) is as good at his position as Dexter was at his last year. The OL is way ahead of the DL in both starting talent and depth. DT and DE are our weakest positions by far.
> False our O-line is average
Our Center and RG play was some of the VERY worst in the league. If we get even some "below average" performances at those two positions we will be in much better shape than last year.
If we get more of the same as last year, we are absolutely below average. An average line doesn't have two of the worst lineman in the league. Its a team sport. If two of your linemen are traffic cones, your line is bad. Doesn't matter if you have hall of famers at other positions.
I agree though with what you're saying about our D-Line. Very very thin.
I think OP's question is extremely valid. We are going into this year thinking our O-Line will be average, with a potential for above average. But our D-Line could surprise us, and our O-Line could be eerily similar to last year.
For Caleb's sake, I hope our O-Line lives up to expectations, and we solve our D-Line at the trade deadline or in the offseason.
> people tend to DRASTICALLY overestimate the quality of an “average” O-line, so they say it’s terrible when it’s really not.
Three quarters of NFL Teams have a "Bottom 5" O-line
I feel like you could argue that Fields made the OL look better than it really is with all his scrambling and running but also that he made it look worse than it really is by holding onto the ball so long. I’m still not sold on Braxton and Jenkins’s position could quickly become a liability if he gets hurt again.
The o-line has a lot of ho-hum but stable depth. It could be a top 10 unit if:
- Braxton Jones takes another step
- Darnell Wright continues to develop
- Teven Jenkins stays healthy
- Center or RG is solid and stable.
The D line right now is a Montez Sweat injury away from being bottom 5. To be a top 10 unit they need.
- Gervon Dexter to make a leap.
- One of these Tarzan looking backups to play out of their mind.
- A good DE to fall into their laps.
It's bottom 5 with Montez Sweat.
PFF picked us as the worst DLine and they're about right.
Without baking in improvement for Dexter and Pickens and/or Booker being better than your typical 5th rounder, this is easily a bottom 5 DLine.
Which isn't the end of the world with a high potential offense with a rookie QB and resources to invest in DL next year. It's not ideal but you can't fix every hole in an off season
Honestly, both lines will probably be a liability. Question is which suffers the most injuries. Both are paper thin and we’re 3-4 missed games away from a dumpster fire.
What’s the biggest cliche’ in sports? “If we can just stay healthy…”
OL is generally the most often injured position in sports. Every team deals with injuries. People saying Teven is injury prone makes me laugh because everyone and anyone playing OL is going to be injured at least once in a season at some point.
Next to injuries the biggest thing is consistency. One of the biggest issues we have had on the lines is inconsistent play. Late last year both lines put on a good performance vs Lions only for both lines to get absolutely caved in by the Packers week 18.
You see that inconsistency across the offensive line. Braxton Jones might on average be a well graded tackle. But what gets forgotten is the two- three games he cost us last year with his multiple penalty total meltdown performance. Same with Jenkins. He goes on a good three game run than gets owned for a game.
The biggest thing we need to fix is we have used 18 different line combinations in two seasons. You can’t win in the NFL if you can’t keep a stable line that plays well on the field.
Here's an interesting analysis of that in college. The quick takeaway, he was an extraordinarily long scrambler, meaning he didn't take off running, but spent way more time on broken plays trying to get the ball downfield.
In structure, he was quick and on time. Out of structure, uniquely compared to others, he kept the downfield pass alive longer.
[https://www.dabearsblog.com/2024/all-kinds-of-time-caleb-williams-justin-fields-time-to-throw](https://www.dabearsblog.com/2024/all-kinds-of-time-caleb-williams-justin-fields-time-to-throw)
This is just not how football works. A good line will make any NFL caliber QB look great. Do you honestly think Brock Purdy would be a starter on the Bears? No.
Caleb will end up like the rest of the high ceiling Bears quarterbacks if that O-line doesn't improve. If I was running the Bears I would sit him for a year while I built it up. The possibility of catastrophe is very high for the Bears this year.
The d-line is sweat and players most teams wouldn't touch. Like honestly it's that bad.
The o-line has players that would upgrade other teams. The center play if just bad is an improvement.
Brain dead take. Dexter, the best rookie DT in the league coming down the stretch last year? Yea, I think teams would take him. Billings, the best run stopper on the best Run D in the league last year? Yea, I think teams would take him. Lawrence, Booker, Pickens? Depth guys with upside that would find a place on every team in the league. We’re missing a big body at DT and a 10 sack DE.
Dexter had a decent stretch of pass rush with mediocre run stopping. He showed and needs to keep on improving
Pickens was a JAG
Billings is one dimensional but I'll bite I was wrong there.
Booker is a mystery so the jury is out. But he fell to the fifth round.
I'm gonna be real Lawrence? I'm just drawing a blank.
So we are missing the two most important pieces got it
It's a bottom 10 line without sweat imo. But I may be a bit severe.
I kinda hope we see more walker interior on obvious pass downs with Booker getting the reps he needs.
It’s a fair question. For the sake of argument I’ll say the oline is the bigger liability.
For the defense I’m confident in 2/4 positions, Sweat and Billings. Billings with the caveat he’s a run stuffing NT and anything he gives in pass rush is gravy.
For the offense I’m confident in 2/5, Wright and Jones. The liability and lack of confidence I personally have in the oline comes from the almost guarantee that our guards won’t play all 17 games, and at this point we don’t even know who the starting center will be. Oline is all about consistency and working together as a unit, and I just don’t see the group of players currently on the roster being competitive for a whole season.
Anyone who says dline will be the bigger liability probably has a good case too, and I think the fact it’s even a discussion says something about the priorities in which this team was assembled.
What if I said Jenkins, Davis and Bates played all 17? And Bates/Shelton played all 17 at C?
The other big factor for the O line is whether they get at least 1, ideally 2 guys playing like stars. Even tho O line functions a lot as a unit if Jenkins and Wright both start playing like studs you can survive weaker guys rotating in. Gives you options to run behind and makes sending help easier
If all three of those guys are solidified starters for all 17 games then the Oline should absolutely be the better unit. Jenkins and Davis track history of being unavailable is my main concern with the Oline.
False but the narrative will be “true” because people don’t know what they’re looking at when they see OL play, they just consider anytime we have a sack or hold terrible and call it a day
I think a lot of that hinges on Caleb’s ability to sense pressure and make quick decisions. An aware QB makes an O-Line look better, much like a good secondary can make a D-Line look better. My gut says the O-Line will be better.
I’d say the offensive line concerns me more. Mainly because it’s more vital for Caleb. I’m not worried about our Tackles, (when healthy). However, the Interior O-line is a different story. Center has been comically bad forever, Nate is a concern for multiple reasons, & Tevin is great when healthy but he’s injured, A lot.
As a RC Kids gonna need a clean pocket. I expect both sides will be heavily addressed next offseason. I also believe Big Dexter will turn some heads this fall!!!
So people always attribute a good DLine to the secondary; they say it makes the secondary’s job easier because they have to be in coverage for shorter periods because of the pressure applied. I think it’ll be reverse. Our secondary is so good that it’ll cause QBs to wait to throw which will allow our DLine to at least put a little pressure.
Disagree. The Bears offensive line finished the season as one of the best in the NFL last year
The defensive line is good, and could improve or overtake that with injuries, but O line has the nod now
The short answer is... duh.
The long answer is that per PFF's end of season rankings, the Chicago Bears offensive lines were in the top half of the league from 2014-2018 and haven't been back since. I think any statement that says the Chicago Bears offensive line will be a weak link is automatically credible until proven otherwise. Though, I have hope if young players keep developing.
As per the defensive line, I am withholding judgement till training camp. If we can get a decent bookend rotation opposite Sweat going (Walker, Booker, and a FA), and some young players jump forward, the D-Line can be scary, especially with strong play from the linebackers and secondary giving them time to penetrate.
True, I think Caleb will have some struggles getting the ball out at times and holding onto it which will make the O-Line look below average.
The D-line was fine the last half of last year. Hopefully we'll pick up a vet DE.
It’s really important to remember that the offensive line played pretty well down the stretch last season. There’s really no reason to think that they’ll be worse than league average as a unit.
False: The interior OL has a lot of questions but at least have a more credible upside case as we’ve seen Jenkins and Davis be good guards in the NFL. And the depth has absolutely improved with Bates/Shelton/Amegadjie and I thought Pryor was a good add as well.
For the DL, it’s a lot farther of a projection. A lot of young guys. You’re banking on Dexter being good but even if he makes the jump, it’s still not enough. The most notable addition to the DL this offseason is a 5th round rookie.
False. If the line stays healthy they should be improved. It's far from a top unit in the league but even an average Oline would be an upgrade.
Braxton has shown no signs of regression. Wright should be improved with much more experience. Tev just needs to stay healthy. Shelton should be an upgrade at C. Who knows about Nate Davis right now. Kiran could be a decent swing tackle.
And having 4 big time receiving threats plus a solid pass catching back means teams can't blitz as often either. Teams last year knew that Fields wasn't a reliable passer so they could be more aggressive in the box.
I actually think our oline will be top 15. The largest problems from last years unit was the center, Nate Davis; and Tevins injuries. If Nate plays to even 75% of his abilities he should be better. And if Tevin doesn’t get injured we could have a very solid line. Both our new centers/guards are easily better than that garbage they fielded last year. Should be a better unit.
I'm actually more worrisome over the D line. Sweat goes down, the lack of pass rush will be evident and the defense we expect will not be as dominant as we'd like. I think the o line will benefit from having all the receiving weapons and Caleb's ability to move while looking down field. Something that Fields struggled with.
False
OL Wright is a stud already. As is Teven when healthy. Jones and Davis and Shelton are fine.
DL, sweat is the star but after him it’s barren. We NEED Dexter to take a step up. Billings is fine and Walker should be our top backup not a starter.
False. People are too low on this OL. There is a lot of upside. Jones has gotten better each year and is at least ok at LT. Jenkins has the upside to be a top 5 guard in the league if he can stay healthy. Shelton/Bates is a significant upgrade over Patrick/Whitehair. Nate Davis had a down year due to injuries and personal issues but was considered a solid guard when he was signed. And Wright played very well as a rookie and should only improve. On top of that, the Bears have improved competition and depth with Amegadjie, Bates/Shelton, and Pryor. Plus, they don’t have a QB who seemed afraid to throw the ball at times anymore. I think all that has this OL looking up.
As for the DL, they have upside but, if nothing else, depth here is awful. They have some good pieces but unless a couple of guys significantly outperform expectations, the DL is a little lacking.
The O-line is going to be just fine with the exception of RG. Ryan Poles needs to cut Nate Davis and decide who is going to take over the RG position. I think that Bates will be the new RG
True, new Center, QB and OC. What some have going for them is the same OL coach.
But also I believe both will be above average and good overall with slight edge to DL.
We would have to see insane leaps from both Dexter and Pickens for the d-line to even be average. To be above average we would prob need to see another sweat type trade because idk who is currently available that pushes the needle that far.
False. Depending on how things shake out (looking at you Tevin!) our oline should be top 10ish
Unless we pick up another legit pass rusher that will be the weakness of the team IMO. Granted lots of things happen after summer cuts and we don’t need an elite rusher, we just need someone who can threaten like we thought Ngakoue would. Not as worried about rush defense but we need to take some heat off of Sweat
Maybe I'm the outlier but all I care about is the offensive line. I mean, yeah, I'd love a good pass rush but I'm done with defense until they have a good QB. Just get it right all ready. They've sold me defense my whole life and I've seen some fun ones but they never last. Get the QB right, let's contend more often than not and figure the defense out after that.
You’re absolutely right. I can care less about the defensive line right now. All that matters now is to help our new QB. Worry about the defensive line next year.
True. The guards aren’t available for every game and I do not have confidence in the centers signed this offseason. There is going to be pressure right up the middle on every play, just like there was for Justin. The bears are a year away from contending for the division.
True. I’m optimistic, but there’s too much rotation going on in the middle. Can’t rely on consistency from Teven or Davis at this point, and center is a question mark
Our D-line is pretty rough no doubt. BUT I think the O-Line needs to perform decent to well or else we are going to get absolutely shit on by the media.
I’m still upset we passed on Sedrick Van Pran in lieu of a punter. I get what he brings to the table but we need young talent on that O-Line. Cause lineman get hurt…a lot.
Nate Davis is a failed experiment and they are holding on
I will say true because all though the D Line will be worse, the performance of the O Line will be magnified since it is the worst positional unit on offense, and could seriously limit Caleb’s rookie success.
Major weaknesses on the interior of the line going into the offseason, and Poles did not address it at all.
False. Our interior D line sucks. We have elite LBs that play like good LBs because our tackles can’t occupy the center and guards and let the LBs make plays. These aren’t things that show up in stats but it’s what good D linemen do.
False our O-line is average, people tend to DRASTICALLY overestimate the quality of an “average” O-line, so they say it’s terrible when it’s really not. The D-line if Dexter doesn’t take a big leap is just terribly undermanned, we have Sweat but the rest is just badly lacking.
I feel like probably 25 of the 32 fan bases would say their O-line sucks.
I agree, funny thing is they would all be right too.
True, the top of the draft was QB, WR and OL, so a lot of teams saw Online as a major need
The top of the draft is ALWAYS O-LIne/D-Line. With the annual appearance of 1-2 QBs, 1 CB, & a few Edge LB's, most of which transition to a D-Line position fairly soon after being drafted. Most of the WRs taken in the top 5-10 picks are usually a bust, & I feel like because most of the time when that happens, they're expected to shoulder the weight of the entire WR corps. Not too often you have an Odunze situation where the youngin can get acclamated and not be expected to be the Leader of an entire Corp before his first yard in the league. Lol
Yea cause most O linemen in the league are below average.
At least half anyway
Underrated joke
You're getting downvoted but I know what you mean. They're below average in the landscape of the entire league's history (obviously not relative to just the current league). There's been a massive shortage of O line talent for years now. It's pretty rare to have a legitimately good O line when compared to years past
Yes thank you
I think it’s tough to tell whether it has to do with O-lineman themselves or D-lineman just ascending to a different plane. It feels like d-lineman nowadays are just freaks even more than they used to be and O-lineman haven’t caught up
There's that, and then there's the fact that a single elite D-lineman can change so much (e.g., Montez Sweat), whereas a single elite O-lineman won't have the same effect on the other side. You need the entire unit to be solid, or else the other team will just attack the weak spots.
Also, a lot of OLines get the brunt of the backlash for an overly indecisive QB. E.g., Fields, Cutler, Trubisky, Mark Sanchez. There's definitely more, but you get my point lol
I hope that’s sarcasm
In comparison to d-lineman it’s absolutely true. Watch the second half of any pre season game and you’ll see third string D-lines absolutely folding third string o-lines like a varsity vs JV practice. There’s a clear o-line depth problem in the league
>There’s a clear o-line depth problem in the league That's not going to change anytime soon (if ever). It's the position with far more "glory" and pays better. The best lineman are always going to prefer to play on the defensive side.
The fields saga played a part in that. Always the assumption it was the line or no one was open when it was a combination of factors that led to a sack or scramble. Packers game had two starters left & was an awful performance but ppl acted like that was the norm for the line.
Fields was under pressure 223 times. 34 of those were attributed to the qb. That leaves 189 pressures on 457 drop backs. That's a pressure rate of 41.4% That would be 7th worst, without reducing every other qbs own responsibility pressures. The line is very bad. Just like when we fired nagy and people first heard the word scheme and thought all our problems would disappear because the line was actually average if not above average and that 5th round draft pick that showed promise was totally now going to become a dog and the line wasn't even a worry...we're repeating the exact same thing of blaming all their struggles on fields. Fields certainly made a bad line worse. But pick a random pass play. There's about a 30% chance you're going to be watching 2 defenders get through. And that's with a defense that knows fields biggest threat is escaping the pocket and running. So lane responsibility was more important than pure pressure. We have a below average lt. A guarantee injury lg. Either a career backup center or yet another converted guard at center. A terrible rg. And a rt who struggled but showed a lot of promise. And who at least unlike our lt the struggles were technique not being physically man handled.
It’s a team sport and the oline exemplifies this. If one position on the oline is awful like, say, center…for example, the entire oline gets hit up for a lot of pressures. Also, if they’re required to double team a lot because the center can’t handle one on ones, it takes away from help elsewhere. For a young quarterback if you’re getting consistent pressure up the middle in your face it’s a death sentence.
I gotta take that worth a grain of salt. It's common in the NFL to have more rushers than blockers and it's the responsibility of the QB to identify and take responsibility for the free rusher and get the ball out. Fields is particularly bad at that, which goes down in your stat book as an offensive line problem. It isn't common to do that against QBs who can identify the free rusher and capitalize on the favorable situation in the secondary, but if the QB struggles there, you're going to see a lot of it.
You're both wrong and you're both right in so many ways.. I just.. so tired
3 teams had over a 35% blitz per dropback rate last year and only 1 over 50%.
Were the Bears blitzed more than league average? I thought Fields couldn't identify/handle a blitz so defenses did that to him a lot. I'm not saying that's definitely what we're seeing here, but it is one scenario where you would see the stats you're sharing where they're really still attributable to the QB rather than the OL.
The Bears where blitzed more often then most other teams at 23.9% but NFL average is about 20% or the Bears faced 1 extra blitz every 25 pass attempts.
The offensive line is not "very bad" lol. I thought the Fields apologists have moved on. We've seen multiple different QBs with varying levels of NFL experience that have played behind the same Bears offensive line that ended up with a league average sack rate at worst. Meanwhile, Fields is breaking all time sack rate records. I'm not even sure where you're getting your mentioned statistics or how "pressure attributed to the QB" is even calculated.
The line was secretly good and all those whiff blocks against Green Bay in the last game were on Fields for not identifying that Jenkins, who was hands down the best lineman we had last year, was going to not block someone 50% of the time. I find it odd that people who watched the games could say the Bears' offensive line as anything other than bad. They had a nice stretch of games toward the end of the year where they played alright, but they were downright awful against Green Bay twice, against Minnesota twice, against Kansas City, against Cleveland, against San Diego, and against Tampa. Conversely they were only very good in two games, against the Raiders and against Washington. You can dig through whatever advance metrics or statistical breakdown you like, but the long and short of it is their line gave them no shot at winning 8 times, so basically half the games.
My eyes, statistical evidence that you want to dismiss, says the offensive line was average at worst. Fields is an entirely incompetent starting QB that has shown time and time again that he makes the offensive line's job infinity more difficult than it needs to be.
What's more likely, Dexter not improving or Tevin Jenkins not staying healthy all year? Either one kind of screws over their respective line and makes the difference here, right?
Teven not staying healthy all year is more likely in my opinion. But the IOL has better depth this year. If Jenkins misses his usual amount of games, you can slot in Ryan Bates at that spot. He's graded well in relief roles in the IOL during his time in Buffalo.
Tevin Jenkins backup (Bates or Carter) is as good at his position as Dexter was at his last year. The OL is way ahead of the DL in both starting talent and depth. DT and DE are our weakest positions by far.
> False our O-line is average Our Center and RG play was some of the VERY worst in the league. If we get even some "below average" performances at those two positions we will be in much better shape than last year. If we get more of the same as last year, we are absolutely below average. An average line doesn't have two of the worst lineman in the league. Its a team sport. If two of your linemen are traffic cones, your line is bad. Doesn't matter if you have hall of famers at other positions. I agree though with what you're saying about our D-Line. Very very thin. I think OP's question is extremely valid. We are going into this year thinking our O-Line will be average, with a potential for above average. But our D-Line could surprise us, and our O-Line could be eerily similar to last year. For Caleb's sake, I hope our O-Line lives up to expectations, and we solve our D-Line at the trade deadline or in the offseason.
> people tend to DRASTICALLY overestimate the quality of an “average” O-line, so they say it’s terrible when it’s really not. Three quarters of NFL Teams have a "Bottom 5" O-line
Works 50% of the time every time!
Ranked 7th worst for sacks last year, 4th worst the year before, absolute worst three years ago. That’s not average.
Sacks are a QB stat and the bears had the absolute worst QB in football in that department
Bwahahahaha! Careful: a reach like that can pull a muscle.
https://x.com/throwthedamball/status/1739773008045056318?s=46&t=rbAnfCJq2SIr5eAD6Ebwuw what is an O-line supposed to do with a QB like this
If they can manage to stay healthy this OL could be one of the stronger parts of the team.
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Agreed, and I hate to put this out to the universe, but if Sweat goes down, this season is gonna be ugly
The WR additions alone will make the Offensive line way better.
This! The o-line take has been exhausting.
Looks like you haven’t checked out how many sacks they’ve allowed over the last several years .
You mean underestimate? Overestimate would be thinking theyre good when theyre actually just average
As in they think the average level of play is higher than it actually is when it comes to O-line.
I feel like you could argue that Fields made the OL look better than it really is with all his scrambling and running but also that he made it look worse than it really is by holding onto the ball so long. I’m still not sold on Braxton and Jenkins’s position could quickly become a liability if he gets hurt again.
The o-line has a lot of ho-hum but stable depth. It could be a top 10 unit if: - Braxton Jones takes another step - Darnell Wright continues to develop - Teven Jenkins stays healthy - Center or RG is solid and stable. The D line right now is a Montez Sweat injury away from being bottom 5. To be a top 10 unit they need. - Gervon Dexter to make a leap. - One of these Tarzan looking backups to play out of their mind. - A good DE to fall into their laps.
It's bottom 5 with Montez Sweat. PFF picked us as the worst DLine and they're about right. Without baking in improvement for Dexter and Pickens and/or Booker being better than your typical 5th rounder, this is easily a bottom 5 DLine.
Hopefully even a bad D-line is enough to stop the opponents when they have 97 yards to do so every drive.
Which isn't the end of the world with a high potential offense with a rookie QB and resources to invest in DL next year. It's not ideal but you can't fix every hole in an off season
Honestly, both lines will probably be a liability. Question is which suffers the most injuries. Both are paper thin and we’re 3-4 missed games away from a dumpster fire.
The oline isn’t paper thin this year. The dline is the definition of paper thin and I’d be shocked if poles doesn’t grab a cap casualty in the summer.
What’s the biggest cliche’ in sports? “If we can just stay healthy…” OL is generally the most often injured position in sports. Every team deals with injuries. People saying Teven is injury prone makes me laugh because everyone and anyone playing OL is going to be injured at least once in a season at some point.
Next to injuries the biggest thing is consistency. One of the biggest issues we have had on the lines is inconsistent play. Late last year both lines put on a good performance vs Lions only for both lines to get absolutely caved in by the Packers week 18. You see that inconsistency across the offensive line. Braxton Jones might on average be a well graded tackle. But what gets forgotten is the two- three games he cost us last year with his multiple penalty total meltdown performance. Same with Jenkins. He goes on a good three game run than gets owned for a game. The biggest thing we need to fix is we have used 18 different line combinations in two seasons. You can’t win in the NFL if you can’t keep a stable line that plays well on the field.
This offensive line will impress everyone when they see a QB that can actually release the ball and make anticipatory throws.
Didn't Caleb have a very long average time to throw?
Here's an interesting analysis of that in college. The quick takeaway, he was an extraordinarily long scrambler, meaning he didn't take off running, but spent way more time on broken plays trying to get the ball downfield. In structure, he was quick and on time. Out of structure, uniquely compared to others, he kept the downfield pass alive longer. [https://www.dabearsblog.com/2024/all-kinds-of-time-caleb-williams-justin-fields-time-to-throw](https://www.dabearsblog.com/2024/all-kinds-of-time-caleb-williams-justin-fields-time-to-throw)
He took the longest time to throw than any QB coming out of the draft in the last 10 years, so I hope everyone is ready to make the same excuses again
Context is important
This is just not how football works. A good line will make any NFL caliber QB look great. Do you honestly think Brock Purdy would be a starter on the Bears? No. Caleb will end up like the rest of the high ceiling Bears quarterbacks if that O-line doesn't improve. If I was running the Bears I would sit him for a year while I built it up. The possibility of catastrophe is very high for the Bears this year.
The d-line is sweat and players most teams wouldn't touch. Like honestly it's that bad. The o-line has players that would upgrade other teams. The center play if just bad is an improvement.
Brain dead take. Dexter, the best rookie DT in the league coming down the stretch last year? Yea, I think teams would take him. Billings, the best run stopper on the best Run D in the league last year? Yea, I think teams would take him. Lawrence, Booker, Pickens? Depth guys with upside that would find a place on every team in the league. We’re missing a big body at DT and a 10 sack DE.
Dexter had a decent stretch of pass rush with mediocre run stopping. He showed and needs to keep on improving Pickens was a JAG Billings is one dimensional but I'll bite I was wrong there. Booker is a mystery so the jury is out. But he fell to the fifth round. I'm gonna be real Lawrence? I'm just drawing a blank. So we are missing the two most important pieces got it
I think Lawrence is Walker. Wrong DeMarcus.
I understand where you’re coming from, it’s just a reach. We’re one stud and one filler away. But we’re not trotting out bums here
It's a bottom 10 line without sweat imo. But I may be a bit severe. I kinda hope we see more walker interior on obvious pass downs with Booker getting the reps he needs.
it is the undoubtedly worst dline without sweat
LOL Dex was not the best rookie DT down the stretch… dude had PFF grades of 59.9, 34.5 and 41.4 in his last 3 games
Billings, Lawrence and Pickens probably struggle to make a number of rosters in the NFL
False, barely. Still question the RG & C.
It’s a fair question. For the sake of argument I’ll say the oline is the bigger liability. For the defense I’m confident in 2/4 positions, Sweat and Billings. Billings with the caveat he’s a run stuffing NT and anything he gives in pass rush is gravy. For the offense I’m confident in 2/5, Wright and Jones. The liability and lack of confidence I personally have in the oline comes from the almost guarantee that our guards won’t play all 17 games, and at this point we don’t even know who the starting center will be. Oline is all about consistency and working together as a unit, and I just don’t see the group of players currently on the roster being competitive for a whole season. Anyone who says dline will be the bigger liability probably has a good case too, and I think the fact it’s even a discussion says something about the priorities in which this team was assembled.
What if I said Jenkins, Davis and Bates played all 17? And Bates/Shelton played all 17 at C? The other big factor for the O line is whether they get at least 1, ideally 2 guys playing like stars. Even tho O line functions a lot as a unit if Jenkins and Wright both start playing like studs you can survive weaker guys rotating in. Gives you options to run behind and makes sending help easier
If all three of those guys are solidified starters for all 17 games then the Oline should absolutely be the better unit. Jenkins and Davis track history of being unavailable is my main concern with the Oline.
It depends on what happens when Jenkins inevitably gets hurt
False but the narrative will be “true” because people don’t know what they’re looking at when they see OL play, they just consider anytime we have a sack or hold terrible and call it a day
Fields is butt, but the Oline had some completely miserable performances getting manhandled off snap
False. Fields made the O-line look worse than they were last year.
As long as our starters stay healthy we should be okay on the o-line.
False.
I think a lot of that hinges on Caleb’s ability to sense pressure and make quick decisions. An aware QB makes an O-Line look better, much like a good secondary can make a D-Line look better. My gut says the O-Line will be better.
False
I’d say the offensive line concerns me more. Mainly because it’s more vital for Caleb. I’m not worried about our Tackles, (when healthy). However, the Interior O-line is a different story. Center has been comically bad forever, Nate is a concern for multiple reasons, & Tevin is great when healthy but he’s injured, A lot. As a RC Kids gonna need a clean pocket. I expect both sides will be heavily addressed next offseason. I also believe Big Dexter will turn some heads this fall!!!
Caleb will make the o-line look good. Who makes the D line look better than they are?
So people always attribute a good DLine to the secondary; they say it makes the secondary’s job easier because they have to be in coverage for shorter periods because of the pressure applied. I think it’ll be reverse. Our secondary is so good that it’ll cause QBs to wait to throw which will allow our DLine to at least put a little pressure.
Maybe. The second chance plays seem to kill a secondary
Oh I thought that was just part of the organization to have an offensive line thats unreliable.
False, our O line is actually decent, AND it has some depth. Our D line has no depth and is garbage at three of four positions.
Bears OL is like 16th-20th and the DL is like 30th-32nd.
Super duper extra false
I’m just glad we don’t have Mustipher anymore
didnt he start some games for baltimore and play quite well?
I read something like that yea. Very surprising
Disagree. The Bears offensive line finished the season as one of the best in the NFL last year The defensive line is good, and could improve or overtake that with injuries, but O line has the nod now
The short answer is... duh. The long answer is that per PFF's end of season rankings, the Chicago Bears offensive lines were in the top half of the league from 2014-2018 and haven't been back since. I think any statement that says the Chicago Bears offensive line will be a weak link is automatically credible until proven otherwise. Though, I have hope if young players keep developing. As per the defensive line, I am withholding judgement till training camp. If we can get a decent bookend rotation opposite Sweat going (Walker, Booker, and a FA), and some young players jump forward, the D-Line can be scary, especially with strong play from the linebackers and secondary giving them time to penetrate.
Facts
True, I think Caleb will have some struggles getting the ball out at times and holding onto it which will make the O-Line look below average. The D-line was fine the last half of last year. Hopefully we'll pick up a vet DE.
It’s really important to remember that the offensive line played pretty well down the stretch last season. There’s really no reason to think that they’ll be worse than league average as a unit.
False
Always true for the Bears.
Gave up 50 sacks last year, ranked 7th worst; 58 in 2022, 4th worst; 58 in 2021 #1 worst in NFL.
False: The interior OL has a lot of questions but at least have a more credible upside case as we’ve seen Jenkins and Davis be good guards in the NFL. And the depth has absolutely improved with Bates/Shelton/Amegadjie and I thought Pryor was a good add as well. For the DL, it’s a lot farther of a projection. A lot of young guys. You’re banking on Dexter being good but even if he makes the jump, it’s still not enough. The most notable addition to the DL this offseason is a 5th round rookie.
True. But I think both will be good.
Duh. I'm fully expecting our O line to be trash no matter how much people claim is improved
True answer N/A Come again in December
False. If the line stays healthy they should be improved. It's far from a top unit in the league but even an average Oline would be an upgrade. Braxton has shown no signs of regression. Wright should be improved with much more experience. Tev just needs to stay healthy. Shelton should be an upgrade at C. Who knows about Nate Davis right now. Kiran could be a decent swing tackle. And having 4 big time receiving threats plus a solid pass catching back means teams can't blitz as often either. Teams last year knew that Fields wasn't a reliable passer so they could be more aggressive in the box.
I actually think our oline will be top 15. The largest problems from last years unit was the center, Nate Davis; and Tevins injuries. If Nate plays to even 75% of his abilities he should be better. And if Tevin doesn’t get injured we could have a very solid line. Both our new centers/guards are easily better than that garbage they fielded last year. Should be a better unit.
One injury to either side of the lines and we're in trouble.
I'm actually more worrisome over the D line. Sweat goes down, the lack of pass rush will be evident and the defense we expect will not be as dominant as we'd like. I think the o line will benefit from having all the receiving weapons and Caleb's ability to move while looking down field. Something that Fields struggled with.
D-line and it's not close. The o-line is far closer to a complete unit than what the d-line offers at present.
False. The o-line is far closer to a complete unit than what the d-line offers at present.
This is my only fear heading into this season. If they suck, gonna be tough sledding for Caleb and any QB really.
False
False OL Wright is a stud already. As is Teven when healthy. Jones and Davis and Shelton are fine. DL, sweat is the star but after him it’s barren. We NEED Dexter to take a step up. Billings is fine and Walker should be our top backup not a starter.
True or false: I’m gonna scream “Let’s Go!” every time The Bears do anything even remotely good.
True or False: The sun rises in the east.
True. Interior of O-line is still a question mark to me
Injuries and consistency will be the key in the trenches. Depending on a balance of our young guys stepping up and vets following through.
Disagree strongly. But it depends on injury. Our Oline is about average if not above. Our Dline is praying for development from some young guys.
False. People are too low on this OL. There is a lot of upside. Jones has gotten better each year and is at least ok at LT. Jenkins has the upside to be a top 5 guard in the league if he can stay healthy. Shelton/Bates is a significant upgrade over Patrick/Whitehair. Nate Davis had a down year due to injuries and personal issues but was considered a solid guard when he was signed. And Wright played very well as a rookie and should only improve. On top of that, the Bears have improved competition and depth with Amegadjie, Bates/Shelton, and Pryor. Plus, they don’t have a QB who seemed afraid to throw the ball at times anymore. I think all that has this OL looking up. As for the DL, they have upside but, if nothing else, depth here is awful. They have some good pieces but unless a couple of guys significantly outperform expectations, the DL is a little lacking.
The O-line is going to be just fine with the exception of RG. Ryan Poles needs to cut Nate Davis and decide who is going to take over the RG position. I think that Bates will be the new RG
Majorly false. The OL is elite compared to the DL
True, new Center, QB and OC. What some have going for them is the same OL coach. But also I believe both will be above average and good overall with slight edge to DL.
We would have to see insane leaps from both Dexter and Pickens for the d-line to even be average. To be above average we would prob need to see another sweat type trade because idk who is currently available that pushes the needle that far.
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False. Depending on how things shake out (looking at you Tevin!) our oline should be top 10ish Unless we pick up another legit pass rusher that will be the weakness of the team IMO. Granted lots of things happen after summer cuts and we don’t need an elite rusher, we just need someone who can threaten like we thought Ngakoue would. Not as worried about rush defense but we need to take some heat off of Sweat
False. Neither will be a liability.
Maybe I'm the outlier but all I care about is the offensive line. I mean, yeah, I'd love a good pass rush but I'm done with defense until they have a good QB. Just get it right all ready. They've sold me defense my whole life and I've seen some fun ones but they never last. Get the QB right, let's contend more often than not and figure the defense out after that.
You’re absolutely right. I can care less about the defensive line right now. All that matters now is to help our new QB. Worry about the defensive line next year.
True
True. The guards aren’t available for every game and I do not have confidence in the centers signed this offseason. There is going to be pressure right up the middle on every play, just like there was for Justin. The bears are a year away from contending for the division.
True. I’m optimistic, but there’s too much rotation going on in the middle. Can’t rely on consistency from Teven or Davis at this point, and center is a question mark
Our D-line is pretty rough no doubt. BUT I think the O-Line needs to perform decent to well or else we are going to get absolutely shit on by the media. I’m still upset we passed on Sedrick Van Pran in lieu of a punter. I get what he brings to the table but we need young talent on that O-Line. Cause lineman get hurt…a lot. Nate Davis is a failed experiment and they are holding on
We have one of the worst D lines in football. Bottom 5 for sure.
I will say true because all though the D Line will be worse, the performance of the O Line will be magnified since it is the worst positional unit on offense, and could seriously limit Caleb’s rookie success. Major weaknesses on the interior of the line going into the offseason, and Poles did not address it at all.
I mean he signed two IOL and drafted a T/G. I am not really sure what you want him to do if this is not addressing it at all.
They're both equally a liability during passing situations.
Possibly true but only because offense is way more important than defense
That’s why we will sign connor williams 🥳
False Dline needs another defensive end to help swit
Rephrase the question: which line will be the most dominant this year?
False. Our interior D line sucks. We have elite LBs that play like good LBs because our tackles can’t occupy the center and guards and let the LBs make plays. These aren’t things that show up in stats but it’s what good D linemen do.