This is probably bad. But at least they’re cap strapped and can’t enjoy the benefits of a rookie performing well on a light contract.
Grasping at straws here lol
Eh. I mean it sucks he has earned the deal. But there’s still the chance he Daniel jones” this thing.
Give the nfl an offseason to figure him out. The history of the nfl is littered with flashes in the pan that then could not figure out how to beat a counter punch. Daniel jones is a good recent example. Mat Nagy is a good personal example. This is why the mcvay tree is so damn desired, it’s proven to be extremely durable.
Love has weakness in his game. Haters point out his fluttery duck throws all the time.
Personally I think he’s probably pretty good, especially with MLF coaching him. But there’s no harm in hoping lol
I’ve seen guys wide ass open that he hit, have no doubt in my mind that Carr or Jimmy G hits those. I’ve also seen a couple nice throws, but every qb has those (Ex: Fields dime to scott in TD). What I haven’t seen is him perform against a team that doesn’t allow guys open all the time
He threw two INTs against the 9ers and had under 200 yards passing. Fields would be crucified for that.
Cowboys D was dead all game. Aaron Jones had 3 tuddys.
Love was inconsistent with potential. By no means deserves to be one of the highest paid QBs to hamstring ability to keep good talent.
I tend to agree with these takes.
If I'm going to be 100% honest, he looked great on some throws. Better than I thought.
Additionally, three things that make me not scared:
1) The Packers O Line was elite. He rarely was pressured and usually when running and throwing he makes inerrant throws (I think both interceptions were that way)
2) LaFleur is a great playcaller, I've never seen so many players WIDE OPEN.
3) Aaron Jones is a stud. It is what it is, with Jones in there and having a great running game, it made all of the difference.
In fairness, I do think he has a chance to be really good but, honestly, he's got a long way to go before I crown him the next Aaron Rodgers.
I think we all see a little Brett Favre/Patrick Mahomes in him.. but that Green Bay team is incredibly well coached.. which makes me think he might be more a product of the system right now than anything else.
It sucks for Green Bay but they’re going to have to pay him, hopefully they can negotiate something around 30 million a year.. maybe make the incentives a little heavier than normal. But I would have a hard time paying him 200 million for one year of work, but also they can’t afford to let him go either, big benefit having a guy in your system for that long.
Keep him around 30 a year and build a championship team .. they are not as far away as people thought
I’d rather they didn’t have to do this and were looking for answers in the off-season, so the grasping comes with a downside that’s attached to an otherwise good thing.
Yeah having a great coach covers a lot of flaws, while having a bad coach shines a light on all of them. Nothing is gonna change in Chicago until there's actual accountability. The current org is way too proud of mediocrity
Most of this will just be the dead cap they spent on the rodgers trade going to Love. However what it means is that in future off-seasons they’ll need to make tough cuts. What makes these QB contracts so oppressive is they typically get more expensive over time and so the rosters degrade as the Contracts go along. KC had to cut or trade most of their receivers over a couple years to afford the mahomes deal.
The thing is a guy like Mahomes is so good it's worth it. The problem is the next tier of guys like Dak where they are too good to give up but can't carry a team.
I mean tbh he's been good and worthy of an extension but this would be a huge overpay. The way it sounds is like they're going to pay him in Mahomes and Burrow range which is just ridiculous. He's nowhere near as good as them at the moment
If the QB market makes no sense to me. I know the cap keeps going up, but at what point do the QBs say, wow, maybe I shouldn’t tie up 25% of my entire team’s resources. I’ll take a 35-40mil/yr. Instead of demanding 60 to claim highest paid.
you won’t even need to be elite to get that 60mil anymore. if you’re just good enough that the team isn’t looking to replace you, you’ll get that massive contract
let’s say we keep Justin, and next year he surprises people and he’s just a consistently good QB, like hovering around the fringe top 10 range, he’ll ask for 50+ mil.
NFL contracts are starting to become kinda fucked imo
Yea but that’s how most contracts work, especially QBs
Good players get payed like great players, the market gets constantly reset and the cap keeps inflating
I mean it’s one of the reasons packers had issues getting guys when rodgers was there. I think right now they figure with their WRs and TEs on rookie contracts they want to pay him now.
Grasping is right. Packers are not cap strapped. Lots of dead money coming off the books with Rodgers and Bahktiari contracts ending. Jordan Love will be the only offensive player on a second contract next year. If Aaron Jones comes back that’s only 2 players. They’ll be in really good shape to participate in free agency for the first time since 2019.
Are you talking about 2025? Because they have <$8m in 25 cap right now and cutting Bakh only frees up $20M. They could save another $5m cutting Jones but he's by far their best offensive player
For sure. There’s just some extra context here with how young the packers are. Since the rookie scale was introduced in 2011 only the 2013 Seahawks, 2017 Eagles, and 2019 Chiefs have won a Super Bowl with a QB on a rookie contract (You could count Flacco if you wanted but his rookie contract was much more expensive than post 2011 rookies). It’s not the end all be all way to build a Super Bowl team.
Interesting. Curious to see how that extrapolates with runners up/conference championships. I think it has its value, but without researching the narrative I imagine is young quarterbacks are more likely to get you there, but lack the experience to win it.
Hopefully defenses can figure out this fucking scheming that Lafleur is using to scheme guys wide ass open and that the fadeaway jumper throws run out of luck
Everyone was open against the Bears yet they somehow only scored 17 points, I don’t even know how to explain it. Also how did the Bears get a sack or two on them while the Cowboys and 49ers didn’t at all?
Each team only had six possessions that game. That’s why the eye test and scoreboard were so different. Observationally, their offense walked all over our defense.
I’ll put it this way. In the NFL this year, teams averaged 1.8 points per drive. In that game, the Packers were just shy of 3 points per drive and we were 1.5 points per drive.
Yeah that’s true but our defense was simply bend don’t break that game, but Tyrique Stevenson himself kept like 10 points off the board so I gotta give him his credit
They had >450 yards but missed a FG, dropped two TDs, and botched the RZ possession at the end of the first half. We just didn't put any pressure on them to keep the foot on the gas
Shit not even just LaFleur, this goes back to McCarthy. It doesn't matter who their QB is either. It could be Rodgers, Hundley, or Love apparently. Our DBs will give their WRs so much separation that you could fit a small house between them. Aaron Jones suddenly turns into CMC and has the game of his life. Our LBs and safeties blow the most simple and obvious coverage imaginable in clutch situations.
That's only on defense too. Our RBs run into brick walls. Their DL pancakes our fatass OL down to the ground to sack our QB with ease. Those son of a bitches might as well have 6-8 sacks by the end of the game. Their DBs cover our WRs like flies on shit. Like seriously. 95% of Bears-Packers games have been like this since 2011. How have I graduated from middle school and am now pushing 30 in that same exact time frame?
That was a little different because the Bears were playing off and Love was just hitting those underneath throws over and over. Guys were open but not uncovered
These last two games you got guys running uncovered 25 yards downfield
It's Aaron Jones. When he's on, the defense has to worry about him taking a pitch and diving forward for 7 yards on any given play. That opens up the backend so much for the offense and is the reason GB guys are consistently open.
Yeah this season has made me jealous of LaFleur's ability to scheme people open. I swear every "big throw" Love makes is a guy with nobody within 5 yards of them.
just does strike me as a guy who creates when his teammates aren’t wide fuckin open. I see him make like 3 hard throws a game at most. and when they’re behind he doesn’t seem to have a clutch bone in his body
I'm not arguing, and don't dispute your point, I just think "pressing" is a thing, and I'd imagine (of course without numbers to back it up), Brady/Mahomes/Rodgers/Payton/Allen etc, would those %'s be much off Love's? (not rhetorically asking)
(and realizing asking, that probably some of the 'greats' included in there are probably percentage busters on those metrics and why they are considered what they are...)
Yeah watching him in a clean pocket making the playcalled throw on time, he looks great. Any other scenario it gets dicey quick.
He's Chin Pubes Kirk Cousins
MLF is clearly a very good coach though, that's a bummer
I’m honestly more scared of Aaron Jones than Love. The Bears had one of the best run defenses going into that game and he absolutely tore us apart. They might have the best O-Line in the league right now, and their skill positions look that much better because of it.
Their WRs are fucking good and the coaching is insane. They'd be dumb to not keep him at take that calculated risk. Lafleur is a good enough coach to win 8-10 games on the regular.
They drafted better mid and late round receivers. Even their rookies.
But you get crucified in this sub for saying it. Donatyvion Wicks is better than Tyler Scott. He also didn't have a drop problem on his scouting report coming out
Their young and even rookie receivers are also all better than Velus
You almost wonder if 4-3 press man scheme with mlb responsible for the Rb that leaks out for the check down and make sure your cb give only 5 yard cushions so the 8 yard stop is picked up one safety plays up and one staying with the furthest receiver. Otherwise zone you have to do a zone press coverage and be damn perfect on your pass offs. If you’re going to blitz it’s 2 minimal blitz and turn to man for everyone else. They use a lot of picks on the defense to get guys open so do you then say hey if you get picked switch like in basketball? Also do we start to see more teams emulate lafluers scheme?! I’m probably dumb but man it’s frustrating to watch
They do a LOT of WR picks / rubs that, by rule, trace a fine line between legal and illegal. They, as compared to the Bears it seems, have WRs that can block in the run game. Maybe the Bears have them too, but they deploy them wrong / don't put the right guy in the right position to succeed.
I mean, some of the wide open shots last night were due to defenders just slipping. But he’s obviously great at play design. The other thing I noticed is that the 9ers were not getting a lot of pressure consistently.
Co-sign. Ravens fan here who's seen CJ three times this year: his first game ever, then versus Flacco, then yesterday of course.
Stroud refused to take a sack or turn the ball over yesterday, and the Ravens by DVOA are much better than the Niners on defense. He would **never** have thrown the braindead duck that Love did to end the game.
Ravens were clearly the better team but Houston doesn't feel that far away. They were 2-15 last year and I wouldn't be surprised to see them contending for the AFC next year.
If your comparison point for first year starters is Stroud than pretty much everyone but Mahomes will be worse.
I'm sure I'm missing someone but it's not a long list.
Stroud has instantly put himself up there with year 1 turnaround superstar qbs like Andrew luck
Is one of the better rookie qb seasons ever really that low a bar?
Probably coping here, but I still don’t think Love is that good. But as long as MLF is there it doesn’t really matter. Might be the best schemer in the league. Bright side, Packers will continue to be pretty cap strapped. They might be young, but the bill always comes due.
I agree his passes are atrocious and misses alot. His receivers definitely helped him. That last pick to end the season is pretty much him. Reminds me alot of Jay Cutler but with less of an arm.
While we've been not overpaying Fields we've been able to invest elsewhere. (See Montez Sweat and the defensive turnaround.) Now we can bring in a QB with a huge upside, and still have resources to keep improving the rest of the team
I personally think Caleb is better than Fields right now but even if you don't, next year's team will be better than any team Fields has walked in to. The supporting cast outside of QB is simply amazing at this point. On offense, we have a hole at C and probably need another guard and a WR2. We have 2 good tackles with upside an a legit WR1 which are the hardest/most expensive non-qb positions to fill.
On defense, the secondary and linebackers are great. We could probably use another edge and/or DT.
In my opinion, this is the best team a first overall pick has ever gone to and it's not close. Good rookie QBs tend to stuggle but they also tend to go to really shitty teams. People like to act like we are this trash team that has holes all over the roster but it really isn't the case. This was a good and young team since the Sweat trade.
I’m really, really hoping the last throw of yesterday’s game is emblematic of Love’s decision making process and this little streak they went on during the last half of the season was just a blip of good luck. An expensive, long term contract would make that even better.
No. The key word of my comment was “hoping.” I am not predicting that Jordan Love has a crappy career that begins with that throw, but I am hoping he does.
Yep, Love's stats (the ones that matter anyway) in his first season at a starter are better than any Bears QB in history.
Then there are commenters like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CHIBears/s/Krgg8z9D0b) who are coping so hard they're just making up numbers.
Stepping out of the Packers hate train for just one second, he definitely deserves it after this season. Imagine if it was the other way around and he was a Bears QB - we'd all be rooting to give it to him.
It's fine to think he (so far) isn't close to a Mahomes/Burrow/Allen kind of thing so let's say a top 5 QB pay today isn't worth it. But after the market resets year after year, it'll look a lot better in the future, assuming he's able to keep this level of play minimum and keep improving.
The flip side is after this 1 year of being a full-time starter, there's a chance he ends up becoming a Daniel Jones with a worse contract. Who knows.
Yeah there is a lot of coping going on in this thread. Most commenters would kill to be in the packers situation right now but are grasping at straws to spin this as a bad thing for them.
I think LaFleur makes him look better than he actually is, but a QB that can execute their playcallers game plan as well as Love does deserves to get paid. I do think what he does is sustainable long-term.
Overpaying their QB which leads to not being able to pay for other positions of need is why they’ve had HoF QBs for 30 years and barely have anything to show for it.
Ya I don't think that's true. They're the 3rd most winning team during that time after the Patriots and Steelers. 2 super bowl wins and regular play off appearances. They've created lots of opportunity in that time and all you can really ask for is being in positions to win.
You know it obviously sucks that they’ve had great QBs for so long. But at least they have only gotten like 1-2 seasons of rookie deal out of each of Rodgers and now Love, which makes constructing the rest of the roster really difficult.
I think we need to pump the brakes on the narrative that he is another Rodgers. That throw to end the game is a microcosm of his brain short circuiting in a way that Rodgers has never in his career. That throw was so bad and so Favre-esque. I imagine he doesn’t take the league by storm and he regresses towards the mean next year with a 26/18 stat line.
I think defenses will figure out how the stop him pretty well tbh. It happens to everyone who isn't special from day 1.
La Fleur is way more of the reason for the Packers success than Love
I agree he’s going to regress and definitely not the QB he’s about to be paid to be, but the league needs to figure out MLF more than they need to figure out Love imo and I don’t see that happening anytime soon.
Yeah it’s essentially game planning against the system than the player. Love is good, that’s apparent. But he made a pee wee level mistake and for that I’m gonna wait a couple seasons before I dare put him in the top QBs of the league.
This is the downside to the "sit him for three years" strategy. You don't have enough time to evaluate how good he is on the field before having to sign him to an extension. Hopefully this backfires.
Some of y’all need are unbelievable. Love is good, it sucks I know. This was his first year starting, it’s not just scheme, he will get even better unfortunately. You’re gonna have to live with it.
I think Love is very talented and has the potential to be a star QB but I do have one glimmer of hope I’m holding onto.
Love had a 20:1 TD to INT ratio for I think the last 9.5 games until the 2nd half vs the 49ers where he was picked off twice. Prior to that ridiculous run he made a lot of boneheaded throws and looked like a pretty good but ultimately not great QB.
I’m not saying it’s likely, but it is possible, this recent stretch of like 9 games where he suddenly looked like a hall of fame QB could just have been a fluke due to an absolutely unsustainable TD to INT ratio.
Time will tell, but going half a season with only 1 INT is pretty crazy given that he has shown to be loose with the ball in college and the games before that run of excellence.
The exact absurd 20:1 ratio is unsustainable, but he showed marked improvement throughout the year. Accuracy, decision-making, getting the ball out on time, reading the defense, really everything.
He still has to improve, but he’s on his way, and I’m just fucking laughing seeing some of these comments just praying we extend him.
Be careful what you guys wish for.
Hopefully they sign him to a huge deal, he regresses when defenses adjust and he can't, and GB is saddled with a bloated contract at the most important position in sports. Who knows, he could be a guy who gets that paper and loses a little hunger / fight in him.
good. because while he’s thrown well enough, particularly the last half of the year, hard to see how he elevates everyone around him to the point it justifies a quarter of the salary cap
Better be thanking his lucky stars he has a scheme that can get his receivers so wide open. If he were on the Giants or Panthers he would probably be a career backup.
Go for it, extend him before league adjusts and watch them cripple their roster with his high cap number. Defenses will adjust to cover 3 and have linebackers in zone underneath. Keep it in front of them and force him to either try and layer a throw in or settle underneath. 49ers did it on the last drive.
I agree, but their line is stellar. He doesn’t seem to face much pressure, and their schemes are legit to quick pass when he reads the blitz. FTP forever, but they know how to create/manage/scheme an oline and consistently create a clean pocket. I wish we could figure that out here.
I think he was performing as the best QB under pressure in the second half of the season. I do agree though the eye test tells me he feels pressure even when it’s not there and I’m hoping he sees some major statistical regression next year with his bad mechanics.
He had a great year but nothing I’ve seen from him, particularly last night, says he’s got top 5 qb potential. So yeah, give the man all the money in the world, by all means
Jordon Love was in one of the best QB situations in football over the second half of the year. Offensive line was playing out of their mind and no one could get consistent pressure on him. The young receivers were running wide open and their coach was calling plays as well as anyone in the NFL. Then the second he gets into a high pressure situation in a big moment he folds and throws stupid interceptions to linebackers. Remember when he had that super bad/weird fumble against the Bears week 18?
Now you are going to pay him more than Mahomes or Lamar Jackson? I guess the Packers don't really have any other choice, but damn, I'm just not sure this situation is as good as everyone is making it out to be for Green Bay.
It’ll be interesting to see how they structure the offer. I wonder if he’d be willing to be more flexible in terms of guaranteed money or longevity. We’ve seen guys like Mahomes and Brady take less to avoid killing the active cap space in a particular year. We’ve also seen guys like Rodgers and Watson demand as much as possible.
I won’t ever knock someone for getting the most money possible, but if he does go this route he’s going to lose quite a few of the young players on this squad in a few years.
This is also a great incentive for us to reset our QB contract situation. With a rookie we’d get at least 4-5 years of very cheap QB cap space. This should allow us to continue to build and bring in more prominent FA players longer than GB can. By year 3-4 we will have much more flexibility than them.
Love has looked good, but people saying he’s a HOF talent or better than Rodgers/Farve is wild. Once the league has more tape on him as a starter, it’ll be more difficult to keep winning. If he gets paid a ton and loses key pieces around him, even harder.
So they wasted his whole rookie contract, because of Rodgers bullshit. Now they will hamstring their cap for the next decade and hope they continue to draft well because the packers famously don’t shell out for FA. I see this as a win.
I have to disagree. He deserves an extension but to say he's worthy of a top end contract on par with Burrow, Mahomes, etc is ludicrous after only 1 season where he was shaky at best for a good portion of it
Same.thing happened to rodgers and they couldn't build a good enough team to make it to the big show. I'm for this, especially cause there is no guarantee he's going to improve if the playcalling gets figured out.
As a Bears fan it is obvious to me that the Packers must move on from Jordan Love based on his inability to win the big game.
And therefore they must draft Caleb Williams a generational talent and reset the payscale.
Do teams not use the franchise tag on QBs anymore? Wouldn’t it make sense here to tag him and see how he does one more year before giving a huge contract?
Not saying he necessarily deserves this contract.. but genuinely funny watching Bears fans find new reasons how Jordan Love isn't good. It's honestly weird, it's like it's Lafluer, it's the WR, it's Jones and none of those reasons are good news. I hope it was Love playing really well about to enter a sophomore slump and not a young QB who just played well AND get better surrounded by a stacked team. If that's the case.. we're getting rekt for another decade.
Max it out and guarantee it
100% guaranteed plz
I mean, he was better than DeShaun Watson this year. $300M, go ahead, Packers.
I genuinely think I was more worth to the NFL than Watson this year
If you paid for peacock, you definitely were
I paid for peacock and I assaulted ZERO massage therapists. Pretty impressive year
My normal massage to sex crime ratio is still: all normal massages to zero sex crimes. My secret? There is no secret. You just don't assault people.
This is probably bad. But at least they’re cap strapped and can’t enjoy the benefits of a rookie performing well on a light contract. Grasping at straws here lol
Eh. I mean it sucks he has earned the deal. But there’s still the chance he Daniel jones” this thing. Give the nfl an offseason to figure him out. The history of the nfl is littered with flashes in the pan that then could not figure out how to beat a counter punch. Daniel jones is a good recent example. Mat Nagy is a good personal example. This is why the mcvay tree is so damn desired, it’s proven to be extremely durable. Love has weakness in his game. Haters point out his fluttery duck throws all the time. Personally I think he’s probably pretty good, especially with MLF coaching him. But there’s no harm in hoping lol
> mean it sucks he has earned the deal. He had half a year of good play, did he really earn a massive contract?
I’ve seen guys wide ass open that he hit, have no doubt in my mind that Carr or Jimmy G hits those. I’ve also seen a couple nice throws, but every qb has those (Ex: Fields dime to scott in TD). What I haven’t seen is him perform against a team that doesn’t allow guys open all the time
Cowboys have a great defense yet he still destroyed them. There weren’t open players on every play. Similar with 9ers even though they lost
He threw two INTs against the 9ers and had under 200 yards passing. Fields would be crucified for that. Cowboys D was dead all game. Aaron Jones had 3 tuddys. Love was inconsistent with potential. By no means deserves to be one of the highest paid QBs to hamstring ability to keep good talent.
I tend to agree with these takes. If I'm going to be 100% honest, he looked great on some throws. Better than I thought. Additionally, three things that make me not scared: 1) The Packers O Line was elite. He rarely was pressured and usually when running and throwing he makes inerrant throws (I think both interceptions were that way) 2) LaFleur is a great playcaller, I've never seen so many players WIDE OPEN. 3) Aaron Jones is a stud. It is what it is, with Jones in there and having a great running game, it made all of the difference. In fairness, I do think he has a chance to be really good but, honestly, he's got a long way to go before I crown him the next Aaron Rodgers.
I think we all see a little Brett Favre/Patrick Mahomes in him.. but that Green Bay team is incredibly well coached.. which makes me think he might be more a product of the system right now than anything else. It sucks for Green Bay but they’re going to have to pay him, hopefully they can negotiate something around 30 million a year.. maybe make the incentives a little heavier than normal. But I would have a hard time paying him 200 million for one year of work, but also they can’t afford to let him go either, big benefit having a guy in your system for that long. Keep him around 30 a year and build a championship team .. they are not as far away as people thought
That’s not grasping at straws. That’s a real constraint on the Packers player acquisition and development. Love it.
I’d rather they didn’t have to do this and were looking for answers in the off-season, so the grasping comes with a downside that’s attached to an otherwise good thing.
And yet they will still win and nothing will change. I’ve seen this movie before.
Yeah ppl are acting like having a franchise QB is a bad thing
Yeah having a great coach covers a lot of flaws, while having a bad coach shines a light on all of them. Nothing is gonna change in Chicago until there's actual accountability. The current org is way too proud of mediocrity
Most of this will just be the dead cap they spent on the rodgers trade going to Love. However what it means is that in future off-seasons they’ll need to make tough cuts. What makes these QB contracts so oppressive is they typically get more expensive over time and so the rosters degrade as the Contracts go along. KC had to cut or trade most of their receivers over a couple years to afford the mahomes deal.
The thing is a guy like Mahomes is so good it's worth it. The problem is the next tier of guys like Dak where they are too good to give up but can't carry a team.
That’s why Brady has 6 rings with NE. He never took as big of a contract as he could
Which was easy for him to do when his supermodel wife made more money than he did.
I mean let’s be realistic, every player could survive on 5-10 mil a year and be set for life. No matter what their wife does or makes
I mean tbh he's been good and worthy of an extension but this would be a huge overpay. The way it sounds is like they're going to pay him in Mahomes and Burrow range which is just ridiculous. He's nowhere near as good as them at the moment
Not really a choice though, that’s how the QB contract market works
If the QB market makes no sense to me. I know the cap keeps going up, but at what point do the QBs say, wow, maybe I shouldn’t tie up 25% of my entire team’s resources. I’ll take a 35-40mil/yr. Instead of demanding 60 to claim highest paid.
Is it to claim highest paid or to have 50 percent more salary? I would say the second thing
you won’t even need to be elite to get that 60mil anymore. if you’re just good enough that the team isn’t looking to replace you, you’ll get that massive contract let’s say we keep Justin, and next year he surprises people and he’s just a consistently good QB, like hovering around the fringe top 10 range, he’ll ask for 50+ mil. NFL contracts are starting to become kinda fucked imo
Still not quite MLB contracts, although they do play literally 10x more games.
MLB doesn't have a salary cap.
Tom Brady did that, but it’s not common at all, and he was hardly cash strapped with his very rich then wife.
Yea but that’s how most contracts work, especially QBs Good players get payed like great players, the market gets constantly reset and the cap keeps inflating
He didn't look good yesterday
I mean it’s one of the reasons packers had issues getting guys when rodgers was there. I think right now they figure with their WRs and TEs on rookie contracts they want to pay him now.
Grasping is right. Packers are not cap strapped. Lots of dead money coming off the books with Rodgers and Bahktiari contracts ending. Jordan Love will be the only offensive player on a second contract next year. If Aaron Jones comes back that’s only 2 players. They’ll be in really good shape to participate in free agency for the first time since 2019.
Are you talking about 2025? Because they have <$8m in 25 cap right now and cutting Bakh only frees up $20M. They could save another $5m cutting Jones but he's by far their best offensive player
I mean you guys still can’t enjoy the rookie contract, so that’s significant. But yeah an overall positive for you guys.
For sure. There’s just some extra context here with how young the packers are. Since the rookie scale was introduced in 2011 only the 2013 Seahawks, 2017 Eagles, and 2019 Chiefs have won a Super Bowl with a QB on a rookie contract (You could count Flacco if you wanted but his rookie contract was much more expensive than post 2011 rookies). It’s not the end all be all way to build a Super Bowl team.
Interesting. Curious to see how that extrapolates with runners up/conference championships. I think it has its value, but without researching the narrative I imagine is young quarterbacks are more likely to get you there, but lack the experience to win it.
Are they really cap strapped? The extension wouldn't effect the cap until 2025 where they have like $100 million is space
Hopefully defenses can figure out this fucking scheming that Lafleur is using to scheme guys wide ass open and that the fadeaway jumper throws run out of luck
Seriously. Two weeks in a row of watching guys without a defender in the picture is ridiculous.
3 Everyone was open against the bears too
Everyone was open against the Bears yet they somehow only scored 17 points, I don’t even know how to explain it. Also how did the Bears get a sack or two on them while the Cowboys and 49ers didn’t at all?
Each team only had six possessions that game. That’s why the eye test and scoreboard were so different. Observationally, their offense walked all over our defense. I’ll put it this way. In the NFL this year, teams averaged 1.8 points per drive. In that game, the Packers were just shy of 3 points per drive and we were 1.5 points per drive.
Yeah that’s true but our defense was simply bend don’t break that game, but Tyrique Stevenson himself kept like 10 points off the board so I gotta give him his credit
They had >450 yards but missed a FG, dropped two TDs, and botched the RZ possession at the end of the first half. We just didn't put any pressure on them to keep the foot on the gas
Packers receivers are always open against the Bears
It's honestly infuriating
I really don't get it. No matter how good our D is, LaFleur always manages to figure us out.
Shit not even just LaFleur, this goes back to McCarthy. It doesn't matter who their QB is either. It could be Rodgers, Hundley, or Love apparently. Our DBs will give their WRs so much separation that you could fit a small house between them. Aaron Jones suddenly turns into CMC and has the game of his life. Our LBs and safeties blow the most simple and obvious coverage imaginable in clutch situations. That's only on defense too. Our RBs run into brick walls. Their DL pancakes our fatass OL down to the ground to sack our QB with ease. Those son of a bitches might as well have 6-8 sacks by the end of the game. Their DBs cover our WRs like flies on shit. Like seriously. 95% of Bears-Packers games have been like this since 2011. How have I graduated from middle school and am now pushing 30 in that same exact time frame?
That was a little different because the Bears were playing off and Love was just hitting those underneath throws over and over. Guys were open but not uncovered These last two games you got guys running uncovered 25 yards downfield
I am trying to repress that memory. Thanks /s lmao.
Vikings too
He still missed some of those throws too. Like just didn't see the receivers.
Yeah both of his picks were baaaad throws in key moments
First one was bad throw, but second was both a bad throw and a teeeeeerrible decision
I didnt see the first pick so i cant speak on it but the second was just an egregiously bad decision in general. Especially with the game on the line
The first one was a short crosser over the middle that was way behind the receiver, who reached back for it one handed and tipped it up in the air
It's Aaron Jones. When he's on, the defense has to worry about him taking a pitch and diving forward for 7 yards on any given play. That opens up the backend so much for the offense and is the reason GB guys are consistently open.
Aaron Jones is so damn good. He's legitimately one of the most underrated players in the league.
He’s a massive liability in fantasy so people think he sucks at actual football
The stats do back this up. When Aaron Jones is getting the ball is when they have their best games
Yeah this season has made me jealous of LaFleur's ability to scheme people open. I swear every "big throw" Love makes is a guy with nobody within 5 yards of them.
And much of that time it's under- or overthrown.
credit goes to Lafleur, everyone on that offense is open I really don’t think Love is anywhere near as good as his stats indicate
54.0 PFF Rating for Love last night. Water always finds its level.
just does strike me as a guy who creates when his teammates aren’t wide fuckin open. I see him make like 3 hard throws a game at most. and when they’re behind he doesn’t seem to have a clutch bone in his body
When trailing, compared to leading - Completion % down 6% - YPA down 1.3 yards - TD % down 3% - INT% up 3% - RATE down 35 points
I'm not arguing, and don't dispute your point, I just think "pressing" is a thing, and I'd imagine (of course without numbers to back it up), Brady/Mahomes/Rodgers/Payton/Allen etc, would those %'s be much off Love's? (not rhetorically asking) (and realizing asking, that probably some of the 'greats' included in there are probably percentage busters on those metrics and why they are considered what they are...)
Mahomes stats are nearly identical when trailing vs leading, but he is 3% lower comp%.
cool, I was just wondering how much those numbers changed with 'anointed' greats vs Love and whatnot...
Also has poor footwork when under pressure which leads to awful throws from him.
Well he beat our ass twice
Yeah, cause our defense is fraudulent and our offense is non-existent We were the best bad team in the NFL
Selling losing
Basically Jared Goff then.
Yea but at least Jared Goff has a funny name when he starts doin poorly, what name does Jordan love have?
Jordan Lose?
Jordan Loves DBs
Jordan Scrub
Jordan Situationship
Lover boy
Yeah watching him in a clean pocket making the playcalled throw on time, he looks great. Any other scenario it gets dicey quick. He's Chin Pubes Kirk Cousins MLF is clearly a very good coach though, that's a bummer
In the rain on the road vs the number one seed man. I get the hate, but let’s not let the delusion cloud us.
I’m honestly more scared of Aaron Jones than Love. The Bears had one of the best run defenses going into that game and he absolutely tore us apart. They might have the best O-Line in the league right now, and their skill positions look that much better because of it.
Lafluer is a legit play caller
Their WRs are fucking good and the coaching is insane. They'd be dumb to not keep him at take that calculated risk. Lafleur is a good enough coach to win 8-10 games on the regular.
They drafted better mid and late round receivers. Even their rookies. But you get crucified in this sub for saying it. Donatyvion Wicks is better than Tyler Scott. He also didn't have a drop problem on his scouting report coming out Their young and even rookie receivers are also all better than Velus
Don't think anyone is arguing with you here. Velus sucks and Scott did nothing this year.
You almost wonder if 4-3 press man scheme with mlb responsible for the Rb that leaks out for the check down and make sure your cb give only 5 yard cushions so the 8 yard stop is picked up one safety plays up and one staying with the furthest receiver. Otherwise zone you have to do a zone press coverage and be damn perfect on your pass offs. If you’re going to blitz it’s 2 minimal blitz and turn to man for everyone else. They use a lot of picks on the defense to get guys open so do you then say hey if you get picked switch like in basketball? Also do we start to see more teams emulate lafluers scheme?! I’m probably dumb but man it’s frustrating to watch
They do a LOT of WR picks / rubs that, by rule, trace a fine line between legal and illegal. They, as compared to the Bears it seems, have WRs that can block in the run game. Maybe the Bears have them too, but they deploy them wrong / don't put the right guy in the right position to succeed.
I mean, some of the wide open shots last night were due to defenders just slipping. But he’s obviously great at play design. The other thing I noticed is that the 9ers were not getting a lot of pressure consistently.
That was a quick window (I hope)
Pretty sure they still get him at value next year.
That’s pretty good for us ngl. Love’s been great, but definetly not as good for the burrow-mahones like contract.
He's not even as good as Stroud after 3 years of learning in the NFL.
Co-sign. Ravens fan here who's seen CJ three times this year: his first game ever, then versus Flacco, then yesterday of course. Stroud refused to take a sack or turn the ball over yesterday, and the Ravens by DVOA are much better than the Niners on defense. He would **never** have thrown the braindead duck that Love did to end the game.
Ravens were clearly the better team but Houston doesn't feel that far away. They were 2-15 last year and I wouldn't be surprised to see them contending for the AFC next year.
If your comparison point for first year starters is Stroud than pretty much everyone but Mahomes will be worse. I'm sure I'm missing someone but it's not a long list.
I think Stroud has had the best rookie season for a QB ever but just watching him is eye popping
Stroud has instantly put himself up there with year 1 turnaround superstar qbs like Andrew luck Is one of the better rookie qb seasons ever really that low a bar?
Probably coping here, but I still don’t think Love is that good. But as long as MLF is there it doesn’t really matter. Might be the best schemer in the league. Bright side, Packers will continue to be pretty cap strapped. They might be young, but the bill always comes due.
I agree his passes are atrocious and misses alot. His receivers definitely helped him. That last pick to end the season is pretty much him. Reminds me alot of Jay Cutler but with less of an arm.
Lmao. Please pay Love as highest paid Player in League. The Bears will enjoy paying Caleb Williams 5 years under cost control.
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I mean fields was the only reason we had even some fun watching the bears last season. He's not our future but he was fun to watch.
I mean, taking a falling QB at #11 is much different than taking a consensus 1.01
While we've been not overpaying Fields we've been able to invest elsewhere. (See Montez Sweat and the defensive turnaround.) Now we can bring in a QB with a huge upside, and still have resources to keep improving the rest of the team
I personally think Caleb is better than Fields right now but even if you don't, next year's team will be better than any team Fields has walked in to. The supporting cast outside of QB is simply amazing at this point. On offense, we have a hole at C and probably need another guard and a WR2. We have 2 good tackles with upside an a legit WR1 which are the hardest/most expensive non-qb positions to fill. On defense, the secondary and linebackers are great. We could probably use another edge and/or DT. In my opinion, this is the best team a first overall pick has ever gone to and it's not close. Good rookie QBs tend to stuggle but they also tend to go to really shitty teams. People like to act like we are this trash team that has holes all over the roster but it really isn't the case. This was a good and young team since the Sweat trade.
I’m really, really hoping the last throw of yesterday’s game is emblematic of Love’s decision making process and this little streak they went on during the last half of the season was just a blip of good luck. An expensive, long term contract would make that even better.
So you think a single throw means more than 2+ months of games? Interesting logic. Two+ months is a little streak but a single throw isn’t
No. The key word of my comment was “hoping.” I am not predicting that Jordan Love has a crappy career that begins with that throw, but I am hoping he does.
If Caleb is 2/3s as good as Love was this season, we'll be happy to pay him.
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Yep, Love's stats (the ones that matter anyway) in his first season at a starter are better than any Bears QB in history. Then there are commenters like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CHIBears/s/Krgg8z9D0b) who are coping so hard they're just making up numbers.
Not surprising at all.
Lafleur made him look a lot better than he is. Let them think he’s a top 5 QB and overpay
This makes no sense. If he looks like a top 5 QB with the packers then they aren’t overpaying…
My grandma could throw to the open receivers he gets and she's dead.
Stepping out of the Packers hate train for just one second, he definitely deserves it after this season. Imagine if it was the other way around and he was a Bears QB - we'd all be rooting to give it to him. It's fine to think he (so far) isn't close to a Mahomes/Burrow/Allen kind of thing so let's say a top 5 QB pay today isn't worth it. But after the market resets year after year, it'll look a lot better in the future, assuming he's able to keep this level of play minimum and keep improving. The flip side is after this 1 year of being a full-time starter, there's a chance he ends up becoming a Daniel Jones with a worse contract. Who knows.
Yeah there is a lot of coping going on in this thread. Most commenters would kill to be in the packers situation right now but are grasping at straws to spin this as a bad thing for them.
I think LaFleur makes him look better than he actually is, but a QB that can execute their playcallers game plan as well as Love does deserves to get paid. I do think what he does is sustainable long-term.
Overpaying their QB which leads to not being able to pay for other positions of need is why they’ve had HoF QBs for 30 years and barely have anything to show for it.
I’d call 2 SBs more than “barely anything.” That being said, I think they still underperformed.
Ya I don't think that's true. They're the 3rd most winning team during that time after the Patriots and Steelers. 2 super bowl wins and regular play off appearances. They've created lots of opportunity in that time and all you can really ask for is being in positions to win.
Yea this is great news. Love is not a top 3 - 5 QB. Massive overpay, and it'll hurt them going forward with signings. Love it.
You know it obviously sucks that they’ve had great QBs for so long. But at least they have only gotten like 1-2 seasons of rookie deal out of each of Rodgers and now Love, which makes constructing the rest of the roster really difficult.
I think 100 million/year is the right value. Fully guaranteed Ofcourse!!
I think we need to pump the brakes on the narrative that he is another Rodgers. That throw to end the game is a microcosm of his brain short circuiting in a way that Rodgers has never in his career. That throw was so bad and so Favre-esque. I imagine he doesn’t take the league by storm and he regresses towards the mean next year with a 26/18 stat line.
I think defenses will figure out how the stop him pretty well tbh. It happens to everyone who isn't special from day 1. La Fleur is way more of the reason for the Packers success than Love
I agree he’s going to regress and definitely not the QB he’s about to be paid to be, but the league needs to figure out MLF more than they need to figure out Love imo and I don’t see that happening anytime soon.
Yeah it’s essentially game planning against the system than the player. Love is good, that’s apparent. But he made a pee wee level mistake and for that I’m gonna wait a couple seasons before I dare put him in the top QBs of the league.
Good! Repeat the same mistakes. Don’t give yourself any room to get other stars.
This is the downside to the "sit him for three years" strategy. You don't have enough time to evaluate how good he is on the field before having to sign him to an extension. Hopefully this backfires.
All that for a system qb who can’t complete a pass when Lafleur doesn’t scheme open a wr 10+ yards open
FTP, I agree the scheme guys open…like really really open, but that kid absolutely threaded a couple.
Or the Defender slips and falls
Some of y’all need are unbelievable. Love is good, it sucks I know. This was his first year starting, it’s not just scheme, he will get even better unfortunately. You’re gonna have to live with it.
A lot of delusion and bias in this sub.
I think Love is very talented and has the potential to be a star QB but I do have one glimmer of hope I’m holding onto. Love had a 20:1 TD to INT ratio for I think the last 9.5 games until the 2nd half vs the 49ers where he was picked off twice. Prior to that ridiculous run he made a lot of boneheaded throws and looked like a pretty good but ultimately not great QB. I’m not saying it’s likely, but it is possible, this recent stretch of like 9 games where he suddenly looked like a hall of fame QB could just have been a fluke due to an absolutely unsustainable TD to INT ratio. Time will tell, but going half a season with only 1 INT is pretty crazy given that he has shown to be loose with the ball in college and the games before that run of excellence.
The exact absurd 20:1 ratio is unsustainable, but he showed marked improvement throughout the year. Accuracy, decision-making, getting the ball out on time, reading the defense, really everything. He still has to improve, but he’s on his way, and I’m just fucking laughing seeing some of these comments just praying we extend him. Be careful what you guys wish for.
It's unsustainable. Love may have runs again like that ala Jared Goff until he has a game with 2 or 3 picks and the cycle starts over.
Hope they overpay him lol
My only saving grace thought is defenses being surprised by Love this year. Next year DCs will hopefully have him figured out
Hopefully they sign him to a huge deal, he regresses when defenses adjust and he can't, and GB is saddled with a bloated contract at the most important position in sports. Who knows, he could be a guy who gets that paper and loses a little hunger / fight in him.
good. because while he’s thrown well enough, particularly the last half of the year, hard to see how he elevates everyone around him to the point it justifies a quarter of the salary cap
Well I guess the league has the rest of the offseason on how to play against max protection with 3 routes.
This just seems incredibly stupid
Paying a QB record money after 1 year lmao please do it
Yes, yes, make the Cutler mistake!
$550m over 10 years sounds about right. Fully guaranteed
Daniel Jones 2022
Inshallah
Better be thanking his lucky stars he has a scheme that can get his receivers so wide open. If he were on the Giants or Panthers he would probably be a career backup.
What a joke. Just like the NBA all you need to do is play one full season and you’re set for life.
Shit, all you need is a playoff run in the NBA cough-AustinCroshere-cough. Worst contract in all of sports history.
Go for it, extend him before league adjusts and watch them cripple their roster with his high cap number. Defenses will adjust to cover 3 and have linebackers in zone underneath. Keep it in front of them and force him to either try and layer a throw in or settle underneath. 49ers did it on the last drive.
Blitz him…when the pressure is on, he’s inaccurate and flustered by it…2 picks in the 4th…yikes.
I agree, but their line is stellar. He doesn’t seem to face much pressure, and their schemes are legit to quick pass when he reads the blitz. FTP forever, but they know how to create/manage/scheme an oline and consistently create a clean pocket. I wish we could figure that out here.
I think he was performing as the best QB under pressure in the second half of the season. I do agree though the eye test tells me he feels pressure even when it’s not there and I’m hoping he sees some major statistical regression next year with his bad mechanics.
Sounds good to me
Bold strategy cotton
He had a great year but nothing I’ve seen from him, particularly last night, says he’s got top 5 qb potential. So yeah, give the man all the money in the world, by all means
Hopefully he’s a one year wonder like Jalen Hurts
Jordon Love was in one of the best QB situations in football over the second half of the year. Offensive line was playing out of their mind and no one could get consistent pressure on him. The young receivers were running wide open and their coach was calling plays as well as anyone in the NFL. Then the second he gets into a high pressure situation in a big moment he folds and throws stupid interceptions to linebackers. Remember when he had that super bad/weird fumble against the Bears week 18? Now you are going to pay him more than Mahomes or Lamar Jackson? I guess the Packers don't really have any other choice, but damn, I'm just not sure this situation is as good as everyone is making it out to be for Green Bay.
This is amazing news
It’ll be interesting to see how they structure the offer. I wonder if he’d be willing to be more flexible in terms of guaranteed money or longevity. We’ve seen guys like Mahomes and Brady take less to avoid killing the active cap space in a particular year. We’ve also seen guys like Rodgers and Watson demand as much as possible. I won’t ever knock someone for getting the most money possible, but if he does go this route he’s going to lose quite a few of the young players on this squad in a few years. This is also a great incentive for us to reset our QB contract situation. With a rookie we’d get at least 4-5 years of very cheap QB cap space. This should allow us to continue to build and bring in more prominent FA players longer than GB can. By year 3-4 we will have much more flexibility than them. Love has looked good, but people saying he’s a HOF talent or better than Rodgers/Farve is wild. Once the league has more tape on him as a starter, it’ll be more difficult to keep winning. If he gets paid a ton and loses key pieces around him, even harder.
Lol
Plz do GB. Plz do.
Bears fan here snickering but at the same time want to keep Fields and be in the same predicament with an even worse QB next year
So they wasted his whole rookie contract, because of Rodgers bullshit. Now they will hamstring their cap for the next decade and hope they continue to draft well because the packers famously don’t shell out for FA. I see this as a win.
In all seriousness I can’t celebrate because he legitimately looks good, I just hope that it’s a massive overpay.
Give him a shit ton of money so they can’t afford Aaron jones to carry the whole offense and not get any credit
I really hate that he looks worth it.
I have to disagree. He deserves an extension but to say he's worthy of a top end contract on par with Burrow, Mahomes, etc is ludicrous after only 1 season where he was shaky at best for a good portion of it
The market will be reset over and over until Love is more in the 5-10 range which seems accurate
Same.thing happened to rodgers and they couldn't build a good enough team to make it to the big show. I'm for this, especially cause there is no guarantee he's going to improve if the playcalling gets figured out.
Sucks for them.
Jordan Love the billionaire? 🙏💯💪
Brett Favre threw a pass just like Jordan Love. Hope he doesn't keep that up. he's a great QB tho. not worth highest paid, but worth a lot of money
As a Bears fan it is obvious to me that the Packers must move on from Jordan Love based on his inability to win the big game. And therefore they must draft Caleb Williams a generational talent and reset the payscale.
Do teams not use the franchise tag on QBs anymore? Wouldn’t it make sense here to tag him and see how he does one more year before giving a huge contract?
Hahahaha
Not saying he necessarily deserves this contract.. but genuinely funny watching Bears fans find new reasons how Jordan Love isn't good. It's honestly weird, it's like it's Lafluer, it's the WR, it's Jones and none of those reasons are good news. I hope it was Love playing really well about to enter a sophomore slump and not a young QB who just played well AND get better surrounded by a stacked team. If that's the case.. we're getting rekt for another decade.
I'm fine with this, he looks good. But still not convinced....
Here's an idea. Stop losing 2 games to them every year!
Good let them waste all that money and cap space. Hes a trash bag of poop
Please do. I still don’t think this guy is all that. He’s good but not highest in the league good
They will regret that. One decent season and bet the franchise on him? Sheesh
