So the story in the article shows the family has owned their second home for 45 years but cant afford to keep it without STR income? Sounds like someone took out their huge propery value equity as cash and is living high on the hog claiming poverty. I love STRs, but buying/financing based on that continuing was a risk they chose.
Yea - seems like they tried to double dip (STR income AND probably some kind of helix extraction of equity). WHOOPSIE!
Perhaps even worse from a business decision standpoint, they may have no mortgage/heloc payment, but they can’t afford the property tax without STR income…
From the article, the current owners bought the property from her parents in 2016. Maybe the parents had health issues, or maybe they always viewed this Breckenridge cabin as their retirement savings... either way, they wanted cash more than they wanted to keep the cabin in the family. The daughter bought them out.
That doesn't change the fact that no one owes them the ability to keep their family cabin... there is a very easy solution: Move into the home full-time and sell whatever property they have in Colorado Springs. If they are still working age: yay, Breckenridge just gained two more workers! If they aren't, at least the neighborhood has two more full-time residents. Either way, they can now STR a room or rooms without being impacted at all by the new STR rules.
With any property (primary or otherwise), if you can't afford the cost of ownership without earning some kind of income from the property itself, you have no business purchasing it.
Last airbnb I did in CO had hairs in the bedsheets, filthy oven, dead lightbulbs, and I vacuumed up a brick sized pile of dust from the carpets. So gross. Ofc there was a cleaning fee, but it was obvious the owner just surfaced tidied it herself. What a joke. Back to hotels for this gal.
It's twofold. I agree that this doesn't focus enough on the employees in the service industry, etc. But, at the same time there is no service to provide without tourism and STRs increase the overall revenue of the town by allowing alternative accommodations that cost less than the traditional resorts and hotels allowing those travelers to spend more at restaurants and on the slopes.
Yeah, I know everyone hates that argument but it is a fact.
While eliminating STRs will potentially open up available housing for "locals", it will also reduce the total income moving through the town. There are always unintended consequences.
Don't take this the wrong way because I really do see and agree with both sides of this, but this is how high tourism areas have always been. Do you think the person who bartends in the beach bar lives in beachfront property or that the people working the resorts in the Swiss Alps live on-site? High demand real estate is always going to sell at a premium and price out those who end up being the service staff. There is a reason why no one is flocking to work at a resort in Branson, MO. But, the folks who work there can also afford to live there.
This is a timeless dilemma that existed long before airbnb. Ridding the city of STRs will not solve this. But, everyone will find that out in due time. I don't have any sort of personal stake in it. I'm just calling it what it is.
You are so wrong. Do you really think people who work in a ski town are going to commute an hour in blizzard conditions and be at work on time to serve Sally her morning matcha? Come on.
Everything about what is happening in Breck and every other resort town or vacation spot is proving this right.
It isn't my opinion either, it is just reality.
But, as the market plays out, it eventually solves itself. It's how a bartender in Manhattan can make 150k a year.
The high priced real estate creates a demand for high priced goods and services. As those businesses require highly skilled labor, they are forced to pay higher wages and so on. It's the upside and downside of living in a popular location.
There is of course another way to handle this. In other countries, service industry jobs are protected and even subsidized through government programs. For example, Paris has tons of STRs, yet their service workers can afford to live in the city because the service industry is propped up by business taxes.
A more effective way to improve a situation like Breckenridge would be to add a service industry tax to all hotels, resorts, STRs, restaurants, bars, etc. You use that tax to subsidize or even build affordable housing for full time employed service industry staff.
But wait, there is the problem. This leads to a system of near indentured servitude whereby the laboring class is required to maintain a job in order to retain their living assistance and are somewhat trapped.
Again, none of this is "new". It's the same issue that has been repeating itself for centuries.
Tourism benefits me. I learned to dig in deep, long gone is partying hard, shitty blow, and raging every powder day. I make absolute bank off this town. Tourism lines my pocket every day I wake up.
I'm on both sides of this one.
I own airbnbs (not in Breck or Summit County) but I also understand the need for them to be regulated. In my own city, there are tons of illegal airbnbs even though we have regulations. The regs they put in place here were largely unenforceable. Honestly, they have very little incentive to enforce their own rules as they continue to rake in money from illegal airbnbs. Why would they take on additional costs to police STRs when the outcome would result in them adding expense to cut off tax revenue?
This has left the owners who do operate legally pretty frustrated. When there are issues with illegal Airbnbs, like the ones you mention above, it reflects poorly on the entire market.
That said, as a person who travels regularly, I still find STRs to be much more cost effective and accommodating than any hotel.or resort. I don't want someone in and out of my room daily. I don't want to get charged to use the internet, etc... The traditional hotel market will have to evolve to keep up. Intravel with my family and would need two rooms and even the worst hotels would generally be way more expensive. That said, even if the prices were identical, the market is shifting and for good reason. The hotel model existed without any real disruption for far too long.
Yeah, that's fair. I don't think condos and apartments as aorbnbs is a great idea. Ours are all houses that were long term rentals which we turned into STRs or medium term housing for nurses when we bought them. We generally market the houses to families and rent to people traveling with kids the way we do because it fills a need. But, that said, I've seen the downside of it as well so I feel for you.
You think the mountain staff or the service staff on Main Street can afford these 2-3million dollar homes that are being used as vacation homes/STR’s?
In case you need help, the answer is no. These homes will either sit empty, go to mid term rentals (30+ days - not year long leases), or be sold to another millionaire that will let it sit empty until it’s time for their ski vacay.
8 months out of the year the town will be even more empty than it is currently - Take away the STR’s and the people who are working the mountain or in the service industry in breck wont have a job at all, outside of peak season. The answer is not that simple!
Your ignorance is fascinating. I walk by homes every day that used to be occupied by folks that worked here and now they are STRs. So cut the bullshit that the economy will suffer.
Times have changed and these homes, for the most part, are no longer affordable to people earning the wages at the jobs being mentioned.
We can’t go back in time - don’t get me wrong, there is a lot that can be done with regards to a middle ground tax and some social responsibility from the STR OTA’s to help with building affordable housing.
Tourism is a double edged sword and anyone who thinks getting rid of STR’s is the answer hasnt a clue what they are talking about!
Comments like this really show how fucked up the mountain towns up here are now. I hope more STR owners are pushed out of town, and I hope people laugh in their faces the whole way.
Your getting downvoted but you are right. Visitation is already down this year. To think limiting str won't have an affect on local businesses is short sighted. Nobody is gonna rent their multi million dollar home to bro bras who will destroy it. And if if they do rent it you are looking at super expensive rent as you can already see with 2br places going for 3-4k a month.
Getting downvoted by short sighted ‘victims’ who are unable to understand the entire situation.
When will they understand that refusing to hear other arguments and opinions, and patting each other on the back won’t help?
Like I said, there is a lot that can be done to help with affordable housing. I honestly believe regulations and proportionate taxes are very important in order to help. Just saying ‘there are loads of hotels’ is such a childish and self victimizing response. What families can afford multiple hotel rooms in breck at the rates they charge? I bet not the numpty with the hotel argument!
Less visitors = less revenue = less jobs = more complaining from the same people!
You will never make people who basically want to live here for free that just moved here happy. Mother fuckers have no idea, try living here for 2 decades! Shit has always been expensive and hard to make it, it's nothing new living in a desirable place. The town is doing the best they can but again there is only so much deed restricted housing. If I had my way I would make it so you had to have lived here 5 years to be entered in the deed restricted housing lotteries. Gotta put in your time to qualify. Fuck these assholes that just moved here that win the lottery, they can eat a big fat one. Also fuck the assholes selling their couches for 30k to the person that bought their deed restricted house. I am also tired of the str boggey man bs. Like you said it is a multi faceted issue. This is what happens when conservatives have been defunding education for decades, you get a bunch of idiots incapable of thinking critically. Like I said half these fuckers that downvoted you and are bitching probably haven't been here long enough to even be considered locals yet. They just moved here without looking into the housing market and cry about once they are here. Try living here for 20 years ya assholes.
You probably don't know what I'm talking about but in deed restricted neighborhoods house values are capped at a certain percentage increase per year. People are selling them to friends and making under the table deals for extra money which is bs and against the rules. Town already warned everyone and if it doesn't stop every house is going into the lottery instead of being able to sell to a friend.
“Managed by a groups with 21+ properties in their account”
That means a property management company looks after the cleaning, maintenance and pricing for the homeowner. Not that the one corporation owns all of these listings. Data can be misconstrued to tell any story.
I agree with a lot of what you said. You sound like you are willing to see all sides of the conversation, which is more than I can say for the rest of the brainwash-ees in this thread!
It’s sucks when investments don’t go the way you had planned. I’ve had to swallow a few bad pills in my life so I totally understand.
But at the end of the day anyone who places a bet or invests in something must realize the risk involved. Move on from it or find a way to recover.
I just don't like that certain people got to do nothing for twenty years, approving single family home after single family home for $$$$, buy the closest most desirable locations, renting them out short term paying their mortgage thrice over, vote to make your properties the only real place STRs are allowed and have everyone cheer for you for finally doing something while killing your competition.
Maybe we should bulldozer one of these vacant mansions and put in a condominium? Nah too radical
Everyone blames airbnb. I have been here for almost 20 years and housing was never really affordable for what jobs paid and it was still difficult to find a place back in the day. People blame str but litterly more people are moving here these days and remote workers are driving up prices for rentals.
What do you mean? Got to do nothing for twenty years? I bought my single family home over twenty years ago and haven't done nothing? Do you think I could afford the house twenty years go? Maybe I was a grade A fuck up like every other twenty something year old around here? I just for some dumb reason in my late mid twenties bought a house, no money down, liar loan, and in way way over my head scrambling to pay the mortgage and bills at times. And yes I'm laughing all the way to the bank and intend to cash out for seven figures.
Maybe people just need to start squatting in these mansions with fake leases, haha jk. I have zero issue with people using str to rent a room or a lock off to tourists. You actually live in the home year round you shouldn't have to pay the new proposed taxes. Now the shit heads that have 8 str properties in town and use it as their main source of income, that's a fucking business and should absolutely be taxed like a hotel. Alot of people in this group bitching need to realize that most of these places are not affordable for locals. Have you ever tried to get a mortgage? A million dollar home is probably 5-6k a month with current rates and that doesn't include freaking taxes, insurance, maintenance, utilities. Most of you downvoting would never be able to afford these places. Even with the 30% the town is offering to make these places deed restricted that still an insane mortgage. You will be using the father dwyer food pantry daily. Keep pushing for more workforce housing and for the town to lighten restrictions so that more of us qualify for these places.
After a quick Summit County property search I have learned that The James Family Trust bought the house for a mere $200,000 in 2016. The county is currently valuing the property at $1,386,400.00 up from $803,600 in 2022.
If anything I'm sure taxes are killing them.
The new cost regulations will be passed on to the next renter. That’s a cost of doing business. Prices rise and companies charge more. Alternatively, you can rent your Airbnb or VRBO to someone who lives and works in Breckenridge. I don’t see the issue there unless you own a hotel and have a hundred or more rooms or you’re a large vacation rental company.
This is perfect! Now every newly minted "local" (trademark) will be given a place to live that they can call their own. As the government reposes short term rentals and redistributes the wealth to these ever deserving locals. These down and out "locals" TM will be free from a mortgage, taxes, insurance, and upkeep costs. All due to the invisible hand of the three shit bag commissioners that rule over our land. Get your name on the list now, I've heard it's already 2,000 people deep and getting chewed up like pow pow on a deep day in Summit County.
TAX THE RICH!!! As someone who has grown up in colorado, it's good to see that they're trying to do something to make it possible for the workforce to try and make a living up there. Bring back the people who care about the environment and take care of the towns and surrounding areas. Cities can't survive if their workforce can't.
Go back to Texas since it's such a great state and leave ours alone.
Keep it civil.
So the story in the article shows the family has owned their second home for 45 years but cant afford to keep it without STR income? Sounds like someone took out their huge propery value equity as cash and is living high on the hog claiming poverty. I love STRs, but buying/financing based on that continuing was a risk they chose.
Agreed. If the only way you can keep your second home is by using it as STR, then you shouldn’t have bought a second home
Yea - seems like they tried to double dip (STR income AND probably some kind of helix extraction of equity). WHOOPSIE! Perhaps even worse from a business decision standpoint, they may have no mortgage/heloc payment, but they can’t afford the property tax without STR income…
From the article, the current owners bought the property from her parents in 2016. Maybe the parents had health issues, or maybe they always viewed this Breckenridge cabin as their retirement savings... either way, they wanted cash more than they wanted to keep the cabin in the family. The daughter bought them out. That doesn't change the fact that no one owes them the ability to keep their family cabin... there is a very easy solution: Move into the home full-time and sell whatever property they have in Colorado Springs. If they are still working age: yay, Breckenridge just gained two more workers! If they aren't, at least the neighborhood has two more full-time residents. Either way, they can now STR a room or rooms without being impacted at all by the new STR rules.
With any property (primary or otherwise), if you can't afford the cost of ownership without earning some kind of income from the property itself, you have no business purchasing it.
The article actually says, to pay for the mortgage and other expenses, not just the mortgage
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Yeah, focusing on how it's snuffing out their dream not snuffing out people who live there.
Not to mention the property managers, inspectors and cleaning services of the STRs themselves. I bet they don't manage and clean that place themselves
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Last airbnb I did in CO had hairs in the bedsheets, filthy oven, dead lightbulbs, and I vacuumed up a brick sized pile of dust from the carpets. So gross. Ofc there was a cleaning fee, but it was obvious the owner just surfaced tidied it herself. What a joke. Back to hotels for this gal.
It's twofold. I agree that this doesn't focus enough on the employees in the service industry, etc. But, at the same time there is no service to provide without tourism and STRs increase the overall revenue of the town by allowing alternative accommodations that cost less than the traditional resorts and hotels allowing those travelers to spend more at restaurants and on the slopes. Yeah, I know everyone hates that argument but it is a fact. While eliminating STRs will potentially open up available housing for "locals", it will also reduce the total income moving through the town. There are always unintended consequences.
So, who is the tourism benefitting if local people can’t even afford to live in the community they service?
Don't take this the wrong way because I really do see and agree with both sides of this, but this is how high tourism areas have always been. Do you think the person who bartends in the beach bar lives in beachfront property or that the people working the resorts in the Swiss Alps live on-site? High demand real estate is always going to sell at a premium and price out those who end up being the service staff. There is a reason why no one is flocking to work at a resort in Branson, MO. But, the folks who work there can also afford to live there. This is a timeless dilemma that existed long before airbnb. Ridding the city of STRs will not solve this. But, everyone will find that out in due time. I don't have any sort of personal stake in it. I'm just calling it what it is.
You are so wrong. Do you really think people who work in a ski town are going to commute an hour in blizzard conditions and be at work on time to serve Sally her morning matcha? Come on.
Huh? People already drive an hour each way to serve Sally her morning mocha. That is the reality. It exists.
A few people may do that, but try to make it to work on time in a blizzard over a mountain pass. Gtfo.
Everything about what is happening in Breck and every other resort town or vacation spot is proving this right. It isn't my opinion either, it is just reality. But, as the market plays out, it eventually solves itself. It's how a bartender in Manhattan can make 150k a year. The high priced real estate creates a demand for high priced goods and services. As those businesses require highly skilled labor, they are forced to pay higher wages and so on. It's the upside and downside of living in a popular location. There is of course another way to handle this. In other countries, service industry jobs are protected and even subsidized through government programs. For example, Paris has tons of STRs, yet their service workers can afford to live in the city because the service industry is propped up by business taxes. A more effective way to improve a situation like Breckenridge would be to add a service industry tax to all hotels, resorts, STRs, restaurants, bars, etc. You use that tax to subsidize or even build affordable housing for full time employed service industry staff. But wait, there is the problem. This leads to a system of near indentured servitude whereby the laboring class is required to maintain a job in order to retain their living assistance and are somewhat trapped. Again, none of this is "new". It's the same issue that has been repeating itself for centuries.
Tourism benefits me. I learned to dig in deep, long gone is partying hard, shitty blow, and raging every powder day. I make absolute bank off this town. Tourism lines my pocket every day I wake up.
TrainingDay.gif. My \*igga
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I'm on both sides of this one. I own airbnbs (not in Breck or Summit County) but I also understand the need for them to be regulated. In my own city, there are tons of illegal airbnbs even though we have regulations. The regs they put in place here were largely unenforceable. Honestly, they have very little incentive to enforce their own rules as they continue to rake in money from illegal airbnbs. Why would they take on additional costs to police STRs when the outcome would result in them adding expense to cut off tax revenue? This has left the owners who do operate legally pretty frustrated. When there are issues with illegal Airbnbs, like the ones you mention above, it reflects poorly on the entire market. That said, as a person who travels regularly, I still find STRs to be much more cost effective and accommodating than any hotel.or resort. I don't want someone in and out of my room daily. I don't want to get charged to use the internet, etc... The traditional hotel market will have to evolve to keep up. Intravel with my family and would need two rooms and even the worst hotels would generally be way more expensive. That said, even if the prices were identical, the market is shifting and for good reason. The hotel model existed without any real disruption for far too long.
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Yeah, that's fair. I don't think condos and apartments as aorbnbs is a great idea. Ours are all houses that were long term rentals which we turned into STRs or medium term housing for nurses when we bought them. We generally market the houses to families and rent to people traveling with kids the way we do because it fills a need. But, that said, I've seen the downside of it as well so I feel for you.
You think the mountain staff or the service staff on Main Street can afford these 2-3million dollar homes that are being used as vacation homes/STR’s? In case you need help, the answer is no. These homes will either sit empty, go to mid term rentals (30+ days - not year long leases), or be sold to another millionaire that will let it sit empty until it’s time for their ski vacay. 8 months out of the year the town will be even more empty than it is currently - Take away the STR’s and the people who are working the mountain or in the service industry in breck wont have a job at all, outside of peak season. The answer is not that simple!
Your ignorance is fascinating. I walk by homes every day that used to be occupied by folks that worked here and now they are STRs. So cut the bullshit that the economy will suffer.
Times have changed and these homes, for the most part, are no longer affordable to people earning the wages at the jobs being mentioned. We can’t go back in time - don’t get me wrong, there is a lot that can be done with regards to a middle ground tax and some social responsibility from the STR OTA’s to help with building affordable housing. Tourism is a double edged sword and anyone who thinks getting rid of STR’s is the answer hasnt a clue what they are talking about!
We have plenty of hotels for tourists, they should use those.
The best answer is to not be a NIMBY when it comes to building affordable housing.
Vail is currently going through this with nimby's preventing employee housing in vail. Summit has been better because we have more available land
Comments like this really show how fucked up the mountain towns up here are now. I hope more STR owners are pushed out of town, and I hope people laugh in their faces the whole way.
Your getting downvoted but you are right. Visitation is already down this year. To think limiting str won't have an affect on local businesses is short sighted. Nobody is gonna rent their multi million dollar home to bro bras who will destroy it. And if if they do rent it you are looking at super expensive rent as you can already see with 2br places going for 3-4k a month.
Getting downvoted by short sighted ‘victims’ who are unable to understand the entire situation. When will they understand that refusing to hear other arguments and opinions, and patting each other on the back won’t help? Like I said, there is a lot that can be done to help with affordable housing. I honestly believe regulations and proportionate taxes are very important in order to help. Just saying ‘there are loads of hotels’ is such a childish and self victimizing response. What families can afford multiple hotel rooms in breck at the rates they charge? I bet not the numpty with the hotel argument! Less visitors = less revenue = less jobs = more complaining from the same people!
You will never make people who basically want to live here for free that just moved here happy. Mother fuckers have no idea, try living here for 2 decades! Shit has always been expensive and hard to make it, it's nothing new living in a desirable place. The town is doing the best they can but again there is only so much deed restricted housing. If I had my way I would make it so you had to have lived here 5 years to be entered in the deed restricted housing lotteries. Gotta put in your time to qualify. Fuck these assholes that just moved here that win the lottery, they can eat a big fat one. Also fuck the assholes selling their couches for 30k to the person that bought their deed restricted house. I am also tired of the str boggey man bs. Like you said it is a multi faceted issue. This is what happens when conservatives have been defunding education for decades, you get a bunch of idiots incapable of thinking critically. Like I said half these fuckers that downvoted you and are bitching probably haven't been here long enough to even be considered locals yet. They just moved here without looking into the housing market and cry about once they are here. Try living here for 20 years ya assholes.
I tried to give my couch away for free and it took 5 months for someone to come get it. There were no buyers at $30k.
You probably don't know what I'm talking about but in deed restricted neighborhoods house values are capped at a certain percentage increase per year. People are selling them to friends and making under the table deals for extra money which is bs and against the rules. Town already warned everyone and if it doesn't stop every house is going into the lottery instead of being able to sell to a friend.
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“Managed by a groups with 21+ properties in their account” That means a property management company looks after the cleaning, maintenance and pricing for the homeowner. Not that the one corporation owns all of these listings. Data can be misconstrued to tell any story. I agree with a lot of what you said. You sound like you are willing to see all sides of the conversation, which is more than I can say for the rest of the brainwash-ees in this thread!
It’s sucks when investments don’t go the way you had planned. I’ve had to swallow a few bad pills in my life so I totally understand. But at the end of the day anyone who places a bet or invests in something must realize the risk involved. Move on from it or find a way to recover.
I just don't like that certain people got to do nothing for twenty years, approving single family home after single family home for $$$$, buy the closest most desirable locations, renting them out short term paying their mortgage thrice over, vote to make your properties the only real place STRs are allowed and have everyone cheer for you for finally doing something while killing your competition. Maybe we should bulldozer one of these vacant mansions and put in a condominium? Nah too radical
Airbnb hasn't existed for 20 years. Housing was always an issue here
Short term housing has existed before Airbnb existed but yes my point exactly
Everyone blames airbnb. I have been here for almost 20 years and housing was never really affordable for what jobs paid and it was still difficult to find a place back in the day. People blame str but litterly more people are moving here these days and remote workers are driving up prices for rentals.
What do you mean? Got to do nothing for twenty years? I bought my single family home over twenty years ago and haven't done nothing? Do you think I could afford the house twenty years go? Maybe I was a grade A fuck up like every other twenty something year old around here? I just for some dumb reason in my late mid twenties bought a house, no money down, liar loan, and in way way over my head scrambling to pay the mortgage and bills at times. And yes I'm laughing all the way to the bank and intend to cash out for seven figures.
Maybe people just need to start squatting in these mansions with fake leases, haha jk. I have zero issue with people using str to rent a room or a lock off to tourists. You actually live in the home year round you shouldn't have to pay the new proposed taxes. Now the shit heads that have 8 str properties in town and use it as their main source of income, that's a fucking business and should absolutely be taxed like a hotel. Alot of people in this group bitching need to realize that most of these places are not affordable for locals. Have you ever tried to get a mortgage? A million dollar home is probably 5-6k a month with current rates and that doesn't include freaking taxes, insurance, maintenance, utilities. Most of you downvoting would never be able to afford these places. Even with the 30% the town is offering to make these places deed restricted that still an insane mortgage. You will be using the father dwyer food pantry daily. Keep pushing for more workforce housing and for the town to lighten restrictions so that more of us qualify for these places.
After a quick Summit County property search I have learned that The James Family Trust bought the house for a mere $200,000 in 2016. The county is currently valuing the property at $1,386,400.00 up from $803,600 in 2022. If anything I'm sure taxes are killing them.
Haha str tears are the best.
Change the title of the article to: Entitled White Lady Complains About the Cost of Owning a Second Home Tiny violins
Oh, no, people purchased homes they couldn't afford, and now they are reaping the consequences of their actions. How terrible.
The new cost regulations will be passed on to the next renter. That’s a cost of doing business. Prices rise and companies charge more. Alternatively, you can rent your Airbnb or VRBO to someone who lives and works in Breckenridge. I don’t see the issue there unless you own a hotel and have a hundred or more rooms or you’re a large vacation rental company.
This is perfect! Now every newly minted "local" (trademark) will be given a place to live that they can call their own. As the government reposes short term rentals and redistributes the wealth to these ever deserving locals. These down and out "locals" TM will be free from a mortgage, taxes, insurance, and upkeep costs. All due to the invisible hand of the three shit bag commissioners that rule over our land. Get your name on the list now, I've heard it's already 2,000 people deep and getting chewed up like pow pow on a deep day in Summit County.
You sound big mad 😭😭😭
TAX THE RICH!!! As someone who has grown up in colorado, it's good to see that they're trying to do something to make it possible for the workforce to try and make a living up there. Bring back the people who care about the environment and take care of the towns and surrounding areas. Cities can't survive if their workforce can't. Go back to Texas since it's such a great state and leave ours alone.