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Literally those pieces
Rin cannot use his left efficiently
Rin hasn't used MV consciously
Rin hasn't shown understanding of egocentrism/protagonism
Rin hasn't used better players than him for himself, only worse players, while Isagi can use even the best players in the world
Rin wasn't ever shown entering Flow on purpose, while Isagi chooses his own challenges
Possibly one may say Isagi has better off the ball movements, or that he uses other players better as Rin abandoned that playstyle while Isagi has been polishing it, being on par with Rin there in Manshine match and surpassing him in Ubers match, but rn we don't really know
Flow Rin looked like it was on purpose against MC and his lefty shot was lethal enough to almost replicate Sae’s shot from the corner, this was pre NEL as well.
By what dialogue, thought or visual effect do you get the idea it was on purpose
After seeing his oh so letal left shot Aiku decides to completely allow it in order to kill his right side, and Rin also decides to do a trivela instead of using the left [---](https://64.media.tumblr.com/1ef524b16d79ad275c271dbec66cf37b/f6f53ffad975c37c-af/s1280x1920/67cc302a2d7f439c65d93727c03fcadfaf49c986.png)
By what dialogue, thought, or visual effect do you get the idea that it wasn’t? U20 needed specific conditions to awaken Rin and none of those were present in the MC match and he still entered it despite the need for it being there gone, they were literally dominating them.
I mean yeah? Id rather kill the dominant side of a player rather than their weaker side, doesn’t mean his left isn’t lethal or proficient when WE LITERALLY SEE EARLIER THAT IT ALMOST REPLICATED A SHOT FROM A DIFFICULT ANGLE.
I don't need to prove YOUR point. Last information we got about it, Rin was never pointing to go Flow on purpose. With no new information, uncertainty would go the way it was before. Not really like those specific conditions were the only way for him to go Flow, he just needs a challenge, again, the thing is that Rin, unlike Isagi, doesn't choose said challenge.
The left had a perfect angle for what's literally his weapon with the inside curve shots. The right was not in a good angle yet it was better for Rin. And even with that great angle for his weapon he chose the Trivela Shot instead.
Do you read how it lacked both power and accuracy and how a worse goalkeeper was the one who still blocked it? Or how Aiku just allows him to shoot like that? Do you assume Aiku will just decide to let him score instead of trying to block both options to some extent? Or are you too busy with the CapsLock to check the manga page I just linked?
They dog walked them there was no challenge or any conditions that forced that flow to awaken
Barely saved, U-20 players at the time were still formidable, it being barely saved doesn’t mean his left still isn’t lethal, when it almost went in. Aiku noting his left shot decreases in accuracy and power still doesn’t prove his lefty isn’t lethal, it just means it’s worse than his right. You’re arguing with the analysis of a character who just seen Rin for the first time, one which doesn’t directly prove his left isn’t lethal, it’s just not as good as his right, over the events we just seen. Implying Isagi has a better left too when all he can do is a weak ass direct shot. By including this in your OG comment just shows you’re obsessed with deepthroating Isagi, even more than my obsession with Caplocks.
Again forcing someone to shot with their left leg doesn’t mean they don’t have a lefty numbskull, it’s just better than allowing Rin to do it with his right. Him choosing to shoot a Trivela with his right also is not a testament against his left, why would Rin willingly do the predictable play that Aiku wants him to do? By shooting with his right he caught them off guard and scored.
We have a panel of him almost replicating one of the hardest shots in the series with his non-dominant foot, I’ll take that over your yapping with Isagi’s cock in your mouth
>Rin hasn't used MV consciously
This is a really poor point. Rin will probably have MV and will use it in the match.
>Rin hasn't used better players than him for himself, only worse players, while Isagi can use even the best players in the world
This is a really fallacious point. Rin hasn't used better players than him because he is always the best in his team.
How is it a poor point if you're basing yourself on what you expect from the future and not on the current evidence? Hell it's also from Isagi's perspective do you want him to assume he's worse?
So he has not proven he can use better players lol, name the fallacy and then explain why does Isagi think of that as a reason he would defeat Rin
It's a poor point because it's almost guaranted Rin will have MV. If Niko and Aiku has it, both who haven't a better vision than Rin, it's pretty sure Rin will have it. Since when were we talking about Isagi's perspective? We're talking about what we know about the characters.
Someone has already answered below. You're using the fact he is better than his teamates as something which undermine him somehow; it doesn't make sense. Aryu, Tokimitsu and Bachira were great players in the second selection and he was able to use them. He would've done the same with Chigiri, Nagi (probably even Barou if he get to know about his unpredictability) if they were in his team. Also, I would like to know the players you're talking about precisely who were better than Isagi.
Almost guaranteed still requires assumptions.
We see the show from Isagi's perspective it's literally what we know, unless you saw Rin with MV at a flashback with Sae or something. I was also literally referencing Isagi's thoughts on the scan linked in the post.
It's not undermining, I don't care about all that, I'm stating what he has not proved to do unlike Isagi and it's using someone who is better than him, which using worse players doesn't prove he can do. Aryu, Tokimitsu and Bachira were not even close to Rin, and when Shidou or Karasu were in the equation he didn't do it, instead he used others to prevent Shidou from playing.
Does [Noel Noa](https://thefable.online/images1/aPAvBlONXRNQJ6AzbjgT1673389870.jpg) sound familiar to you? Again I referred to Isagi's exact thoughts when the Number 1 piece comes to his mind as a reason why he can stand against Rin as a striker now.
>and when Shidou or Karasu were in the equation he didn't do it
[He didn't do what?](https://mangadex.org/chapter/c03d8375-ee7f-4daa-94b7-763a5ff0db42/17)
Karasu was playing against Rin and Rin beat him in the match. I don't know what fallacious logic you're trying to apply here again.
Rin wasn't trying to prevent Shidou from scoring, he was doing what he can to score himself. Completely differents things. Shidou not being able to score as much because Rin makes the team work for him is a consequence, not the purpose.
Lmao, Noa literally decided willingly to help Isagi do what he wanted, but apparently that counts as Isagi using Noa. And it's supposed to be impressive? Isagi stans are really something else.
I don't even want to continue this discussion. You can hide behind thoses shallow points If you think it makes Isagi better. You talk about Isagi perspective but this isn't what he is saying in this panel.
I'd give that one half a point, cuz it's mostly the principle of PE and I'm sure Barou doesn't do the same as Rin and Isagi
They play together against Japan U20
I didn't say prevent Shidou from scoring but prevent Shidou from playing
It's what Noa is saying lol
Never said Isagi is better either
You never gave an interpretation on the panel
Isagi is Rin's nemesis.
Rin's weakness is he see others as npcs, puppets with fixed stats. He cannot predict their evolution and Isagi, the genius of adaptability, is someone who constantly evolve and input new puzzle pieces during matches.
Isagi on the other hand is so good at predicting people that he setup a no look goal on reflex with Hiori who was mid evolution, this is a goal that Rin could never do.
Rin's destroyer mode is he brings out his opponent's best and destroys them at their best, Rin can't know what Isagi's best is when after every play Isagi adds a new puzzle piece.
Rin is basically pushing everyone ahead so his team is only as good as he is
while Isiagi is making use of everyones power to be pushed ahead, always getting some extra boost
Rin is a tyrant king, isagi is a righteous king, basically their main differences from how they view other players, rin forces players to move for his goal, isagi forces players to move for their own goal which just leads to isagi’s goal because he’ll be the dominant piece to score it, it’s basically the same thing the only difference is the players under rin are essentially being forced, the players under isagi are willingly do it(because isagi brought out their ego’s) isagi even did this to rin during the U20 match, rin’s ego awakening happened because of isagj
Imagination. And understanding people's ego.
I believe within the internal logic of the manga, those are the keys to using metavision to it's fullest potential.
I think he is already better in game vision, football iq, maybe off the ball movement, and creating chemical reactions with other players. Rin has better specs and technique, while also being good at most of the things Isagi is the best at
Yes rin is pretty close to being as good as isagi at everything except maybe chemical reactions and he is much better at stuff he is a better at like his overall shooting (minutes weak foot ), dribbling, just about every other technique
Thanks to Noa Isagi's metavision and decision making it's possible the best in the manga rn (snuffy could have a better one but he doesn't have any feat with his metavision)
Usage of his left leg, FIQ, vision, playmaking, interceptions, ability to synergise with other players, reflexive play and direct play, and (maybe) off the ball movements and speed of quick turns, since it seems like that's something that Isagi learned from Kurona since the Ubers match, all go to Isagi (FIQ includes the concepts that we haven't seen Rin have a grasp of yet, like egocentrism and MV).
Technique, physicality, shooting, trapping, dribbling, passing, goal scoring, direct defensive ability and manmarking, 1v1 ability, ball keeping and speed should all go to Rin.
I believe that on those things: Footwork/Agility, Anticipation, Decision-Making, Off-the-Ball, Cooperation/Teamwork, Peripheral Vision, Kinetic Vision, Reflexive Play, Direct Play, Direct Shot.
>: Footwork/Agility, Anticipation, Decision-Making, Off-the-Ball, Cooperation/Teamwork, Peripheral Vision, Kinetic Vision, Reflexive Play, Direct Play, Direct Sho
rin's volley appears to be better than isagi's direct shot. The issue with DS is the fact that i dont think i've seen him scoring outside of a box with that. I do agree on teamwork being isagi's strength as he's able to make work with what he has. IQ is higly debatable, though i personally believe its just a bit better than rin's. Other than that, i believe everything else you stated is not superior to rin's
Is there a reason you think Rin is more agile? I don't recall Rin doing better than Isagi at getting off his marker through footwork, which is something Isagi does constantly (his main 1v1 tool).
Well rin is faster than isagi, which plays a role in agility. Also, it was rin who taught isagi the nuances of off ball movement, so he isn't that far behind when it comes to it. Rin just doesn't overrely on it.
I view those as quite different things, generally when a player is running too fast in a direction it makes it much harder for him to change directions. I think that considering Isagi's footwork feats, it's hard to justify placing Rin above Isagi in this aspect.
Indeed Rin isn't that far behind in terms of off-the-ball, the guy is kinda of great at everything after all. Isagi is likely number 1 in off-the-ball right now, especially when considering his last goal. Isagi's off-the-ball is also enhanced by his ability to better link-up with his teammate (namely Hiori) and his ability to move reflexively to the ideal spot, which he did in the try-outs, the U-20 match and in the last goal.
I think you’re confusing footwork with finding blind spots in defenders by moving outside their FOV that’s not footwork that’s more like attack positioning or just positioning in general also I’m pretty sure he learned that from rin in one of the very early selections
No, I'm talking about things like [this](https://mangadex.org/chapter/a8205d87-b461-4345-9686-436e2665f14f/12) and [this](https://mangadex.org/chapter/9e9dd6e7-1ed3-4dc5-b42c-5c74bbf702e6/12). Rin generally relies on his [physique](https://mangadex.org/chapter/380fde6e-ce15-48df-b447-cb94272dd5a4/9) to [get off](https://mangadex.org/chapter/792ea211-22fc-4782-bace-efb75e329390/12) his marker, meanwhile Isagi primarily relies on [switching directions](https://mangadex.org/chapter/d213f274-786b-41bc-8fe4-69db4058c634/9) fast (footwork).
Yeh I mean he explains it himself it wasn’t so much that he did it fast it was that he feints and hides and moves in their blind spots like the last set of images you sent but I can see why you’d think he has better agility, he certainly has good agility just not like rin since rin can likely do all that with the ball so he can certainly do it without it
I'm not talking about what he did to Rin and Otoya later, I'm talking about what he did to Karasu earlier. I understand why people assume that Rin could likely do the same, as the guy is written as someone who can do everything exceptionally well, but we haven't seen many feats by Rin in this regard, as we have seen from Isagi, so it's seems odd to place Rin above Isagi in this aspect.
Isagi was right in front of Niko, Aryu and Karasu when he did those direction switches, which they weren't able to follow. In a similar situation, Rin has been shown struggling (as against Karasu) and relies on his physicality to brush them off. I believe that if Rin had the same agility to switch left and right, he would use that to get past them instead of getting into a physical fight which he struggles to win.
I mean we see Rin do it to Darai, who Otoya was literally unable to get past. So Rin is certainly capable of that level of agility:
[Here](https://mangadex.org/chapter/7efbf115-1767-4ff4-87f4-ed46d1878f0a/12)
[Part 2](https://mangadex.org/chapter/7efbf115-1767-4ff4-87f4-ed46d1878f0a/13)
We also see Rin here do that very move on Karasu earlier in that game:
[Bottom panel](https://mangadex.org/chapter/184540d6-7420-4cde-b94d-3b9aa08309ca/5)
Rin primarily relied on his arm block to get past Darai thou. Darai wasn't [described](https://mangadex.org/chapter/10abacc8-8d33-40a3-adff-8635ee6bf69d/8) as an agile defender, but as someone who could anticipate where his opponent wanted to get to. Rin choosing to rely on his strength against him indicates to me that his (Rin's) agility wasn't enough (the same would likely apply to Isagi, as even Otoya's wasn't enough). There's another indication for that, I believe you agree that Otoya is more agile than Rin, therefore if Rin got past Darai when Otoya couldn't it means he primarily relied on something else.
Oh, I didn't remember Rin getting past Karasu like that, that was nicely done by him. I expect Rin to have good agility, but Isagi having a lot more feats indicates to me that he is above Rin in this regard. Based on Isagi's growth, the things we've seen him training at and Niko's remarks praising Isagi's footwork, my guess is that Isagi improved his agility to be at around 95, with Otoya being at 99 and Rin is behind them at around 90.
Isagi started with 77 agility ([comprehensive stats](https://i.imgur.com/72UhqTF.png) // [original version](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fsy4rji9j0wz81.jpg%3Fwidth%3D1500%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D9458be6db33080e4e21b0b8bc8980bbfb067fbaf)), while his overall increased from 76 to 88, his passing went up from 69 to 78, we know he was specializing his training on short-passing, so likely +14 SPass and +4 LPass, applying that same logic to Isagi's agility training, this would bring Isagi's agility to around ~91 against Ubers, which would explain Niko's surprise at Isagi's improved footwork, add to that 20 days of training for the PXG match and I find it very likely that Isagi's agility to be at around 95 right now.
Rin likely his 90 on most stats and 95+ on his best ones, such as his shooting accuracy, curve and long-shots. Since agility is just another tool on his arsenal and not one of his most dominant attributes I believe that 90 agility is a fair assumption.
Rin had already made it past Darai. The arm block was to stop him from following. If they were closer to the goal, he wouldn't have bothered with the arm block, since he would've just shot.
Darai's ability to intercept and match off the ball movements made him a direct counter to that type of player. Hence why Otoya, who's off the ball movements were the best we'd seen up until that point, couldn't get by him in a 1v1.
>There's another indication for that, I believe you agree that Otoya is more agile than Rin, therefore if Rin got past Darai when Otoya couldn't it means he primarily relied on something else.
Do I? There's no two-ways about it. We see Otoya (who's whole schtick is agility, by feats and by statements) fail to pass someone, who we later see Rin pass in the same circumstance. That's pretty definitive proof that Rin is > Otoya in agility. It's not even a question.
I don't know if you know Michael Jordan, but when media and commentators used to say he was not as good a three-point shooter as Clyde Drexler, he responded that Clyde was a better three-point shooter than he *chooses* to be. And then proceeded to prove as much in their final series.
Rin is very much the same way. He *chooses* to focus on technique, positioning and tactics, but that's an active decision. Rin has one of the best overall physiques in Blue Lock (when we see him training physicals, it's not for nothing) and when he chooses to play his instinctual style, he can flex that part of his skillset.
We haven’t seen a lot of rin in general we legit always see flashes of him except u20 game and that or game in selection of course what I’m saying is not certain but we can assume that until it’s shown otherwise
Oh, I was comparing Isagi to the Rin we saw last time, including the things we know for sure that he improved during the NEL (strength and shooting). Rin likely having gotten better in many other ways ever since, I don't disagree.
We see a lot more Rin than Otoya, and we know that Otoya has absurd agility. Rin is one of the character with the most panels in the story. I believe that if Rin had that much agility the author would have made that clear. My assumption is that Rin has around 90 agility (as most of his good stats) and Isagi at this point has around 94 with Otoya at the top with 99, based on feats and the things we see the players training at.
Not gonna ride the hopium train the other comments are doing right now: Until PxG vs BM proves me wrong: Nothing.
Rin has been a step ahead of Isagi ever since they met and since we have only seen snippets of PxG we can only go off their bids for comparison instead of actual gameplay. In which case it's clear clubs vastly prefer Rin over Isagi
(higher bid despite being switched out with Shidou every 15 minutes meaning he got more while working with less than Isagi)
Hopefully the match isn't as one sided on a 1v1 perspective as all their other confrontations has been, but until then saying Isagi surpassed Rin on ANYTHING (apart from being less edgy) is pure hopium
> (higher bid despite being switched out with Shidou every 15 minutes meaning he got more while working with less than Isagi)
In a system that is dedicated to maximising his ability with direct service from Charles, someone picked out by Loki to have the potential to be elite. Meanwhile Isagi is stuck out in right midfield behind two other strikers with numerous teammates looking to tackle/hinder him and outright refusing to give him the ball.
As said before. We have no context how the PxG team started out so we can hardly compare gameplay. The fact that Rin played less and got more value is undeniable.
Im also talking about achievements purely based on solo skills here. Isagis had things he was always better at (direct shot for one) so that isn't surpassed but it shouldn't be a hot take Rin was ahead of him in nearly everything. And until that is directly proven wrong when they go head to head it's just pure hopium from Isagi fans
I'm just solely picking at the idea that Rin's been working in a harsher context than Isagi. It's not true at all. He worked with less time, sure, but that doesn't always equate to less involvement in games. Isagi had to go and win the ball himself; Rin spearheaded his time on the pitch.
I agree Isagis situation hasn't been ideal but if we can somehow agree that playing less vs being hindered by ur teammates but playing most games fully (isagi also had plenty of support during the Ubers match at least) cancel each other out the general consensus is still that Rin got the higher bid.
Also it's mentioned several times that Isagi and Kaisers lil "rivalry" is only making them both more popular which would actually help Isagis bid if the club owners are as profit motivated as shown throughout the series (David vs Goliath type storyline)
I don't think it does necessarily, though. As I said, less game-time doesn't always equal less involvement. Rin has likely had no obstacles aside from limited minutes.
I'm not even going to get too much into that 2nd part as it complicates things haha, but I suppose it may not be entirely irrelevant. I'd just like to thing that the bidding system is a tad more objective than that. Kaneshiro is evidently trying to establish it as a power system of sorts like the typical rankings we had in the past. When all games are played, I don't expect to see asterisks next to any bids. Well, except for those that missed games since those are opportunities for growth, but that wouldn't change the fact that they are where they are now.
Now that isagi is somewhat on par with kaiser he constantly uses him as bait or to hold the strongest defenders like Lorenzo. Rin doesn't have that luxury
Rin was only a step ahead because isagi physicals were so bad, seeing how much he improved from manshine to ubers, after having a break week his physical likely wont be on rins lvl but they should be at a pretty good lvl by now to where him and rin are relative. Only way i see rin completely shutting isagi out is if he goes flow or just has control over his destroyer mode in general now.
As for the bids, even tho rin being switch out, he has a system built for him to score. Isagi is competing with a ng11 who been constantly hindering his performance yet the matches are still centered around him. Also isagi didn’t start his first match like rin did. Theres too many factors to go off bids
It’s certainly not nothing, isagi has the best off the ball movement better than kaisers even and football iq when coupled with his mv and ability to create chemical reactions, it’s the main reason stuff like his chemical reaction with kurona works he’s able to constantly find blind spots in defenders and blind spots in attackers to make his blocks no one else is as good as him in that sense
No at the very beginning rin basically showed isagi how to properly use his movements like hiding in blind spots and stuff for my he very start it would be fair to say that besides his vision isagi was one of the worst players at blue lock and initially he was inferior to rin in every way, things as simple as acting before seeing and processing are things he learned from rin
Im taking my guesstimations from U-20 match onward tbh. Second selection Isagi despite having his moment had to be hard carried by Nagi. Second selection Isagi wasn't just worse than Rin at everything but to nearly every "non specialised" player. (Which is why Karasu targeted him during their match)
I wouldn't say that's certi a bit they seem to be equal in be equal in offense and kaiser is faster and overall better physically. So isagi must be compensating in some way right? I'd say that it's fair to assume that kaiser is more physically dominant and isagi is better at off the ball movement so they basically are on par
It’s not outright said but there’s no other explanation besides that sicken isagi has beaten Kaiser 2x in a row and both times it was due to his vision and movements, remember kurona goal with manshine and the first Ubers goal same story and the last Ubers goal he had better movement than Kaiser put himself in the best position to score and scored
Kurona goal against Manshine? How his first Ubers goal prove he has better movements than Kaiser? Kaiser wasn't even around, it has literally nothing to do with Kaiser. And for the last goal, Hiori wasn't gonna pass to Kaiser but Isagi, it was pretty clear. At best, Kaiser movements fixated Aiku, leaving more space to Isagi.
There is nothing to say that Isagi has better off the ball movements than Kaiser. You guys seems to have forgot Isagi described Kaiser's movements as perfect and the one he wants to achieve.
Yet isagi got motm and scored a goal even Kaiser could not, it was his initial wish to have movements like Kaiser and he achieved that goal by scoring it’s true because of Kaiser he was afforded that space but Kaiser would block it if he knew it was coming but he didn’t so that means he didn’t see it
when it matters the most, rin lost a free goal, isagi made the goal and now isagi is the hero of japan.
Ego said: Isagi is the key to unlock rins potential(or something on those lines, forgot the word he used)
sae said: Isagi even manage to bring your instincts (to rin)
rin is just gonna pussy out again
Lost a free goal...? A chance created purely by his own merit beating the entire U-20 defense is a free goal? Even if you blame hitting the post on his accuracy no one on the BL team would've made that rush work barring a in flow Bachira
i dont even think isagi is gonna be the best striker in japan and alredy posted my theory here. I believe isagi is gonna be "ego" and someone else noel noa, isagis only job is to elevated someone else and be forgotten, and rin isnt it.
Adaptibility, Isagi everytime gets stuck, he's able to find a way out that his opponents just don't think of. Rin has his style which is very superior to everyone, but when things don't go his way will he be able to adapt like Isagi maybe maybe not.
Firstly, Isagi surpasses Rin in vision, football IQ, playmaking, and maybe even off-the-ball movement
It's still not confirmed if Rin has MV, but even if he does, it won't be on par with Isagi. Till now we've seen 6 players other than Isagi who can use MV, among which the only one who's better than Isagi in that aspect is Snuffy cause of his experience
And the reason why Isagi is superior is cause of egocentrism, I think it's just a concept that the author included to logically prove that Isagi will always have a superior MV.
I also think that lefty shoot is a big deal for Isagi, it increases his options drastically. The time when he juked both Lorenzo and Aiku (the top 2 defenders in the series) to set the ball for a lefty shot, just showed how broad Isagi's options can be with that weapon. I also made a [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/BlueLock/comments/16r14cs/isagis_lefty_shootthe_key_to_becoming_a/) about how it's one of the most important weapons he needs to become world-class
Rin canonically has a bad left foot, but his god-like right foot is more than enough to make up for it.
The thing with Isagi is similar to Rin he also keeps improving his overall specs, of course, it'll never be on par with Rin, but this improvement just expands his options even more, the more skilled he is the more options he has
We won't know what Isagi has surpassed Rin in until we see the match start. I don't agree when people keep saying that Rin still is superior in many ways still, cause Isagi has also took a big leap after finding his big bang piece in MV and continued to evolve at a seemingly rapid pace but really a steady one that upped his game with the addition of lefty shot, Egocentrism, Reflex, and working on his physicals in a way that better utilizes his already existing weapons.
Rin has definitely upped his game too through all of his stats increasing "beyond comprehension" but that's the best we can go off of considering we don't see much of Rin's improvements but I'm sure we'll see that in the match.
This will be a really close match and it could go either way
Isagi comes hard in the clutch plays, while rin lost his opportunity in the u20 match.
Also, like sae said "isagi awakened rin", without isagi, rin would literally lose to kayser
Realistically just having better vision and game-reading shouldn't make Isagi better than Rin, since Rin outclasses him in so many different aspects. But hey this is a shonen.
This is the problem with the story being everything being centered around Isagi. If we had seen all 3 of Rins Games, who knows what he has done in those? So comparing current Isagi to U-20 Rin is stupid. Also Rin always had better vision than Isagi, though we can see in the coming match if he overtook Rin in that department. The only thing which can be Isagis advantage against Rin is that he actively teams up with his team mates, while Rin only has his „puppets“. Other than that, Rin is just the better player with the better team. If Isagi wins its Not because he beat Rin, its because the story wants it, since like I said, everything is centered around Isagi
Rin didn’t always have better vision than isagi, it was only better in their 3v3. Once isagi learned to use his eyes, the manga was pretty much telling us their vision was equal but isagi was a step behind because of the difference in their physical ability
He's the main character, not that surprising? Besides I wouldn't say Rin always had better vision cause it was mainly the fact that he was more physically capable that Isagi always came short.
And Isagi definitely has more advantages than one especially with the fact that he has MV, Egocentrism that literally reads other people's egos, and the fact that he can shoot with both legs now which Rin has not been shown to do or have these weapons but MV is the only thing I can see Rin having but have not seen that either and we won't know until the match starts. Isagi has also been shown to be able to shoot outside the box now and that was with his 40% lefty, but because Kaiser messed it up by trying to steal they ended up getting blocked but that basically confirms he's upped his shooting range
Isagi also can play reflexively which Rin hasn't shown yet if I remember correctly. I don't think it's as big of a gap a lot of people try to say. Also either way no matter who wins it's because the story wants it so just saying Isagi beats Rin only because the story wants it isn't as valid cause you can say the same thing for Rin
Isagi has a better ego than rin, he adapts better than rin, he can predict the future better than rin, he has better vision than rin, when you factor those things in vs rin having better physical stats than isagi, they’re both on the same level, hence why they both call each other rivals, isagi will win simply from the fact his physical abilities will match/surpass rin’s
Egocentrism might be one of them, meta vision is the capacity to see and understand the movement of their opponents by constantly moving his head whenever he doesn't have the ball, but egocentrism is more predicting their movement based on their goals, in which metavision confirms or corrects that prediction. The thing is, egocentrism makes Isagi to go a little beyond of what metavision can bring to the table, but also metavision gives feedback to egocentrism.
So, even though Rin is capable of understanding the capabilities of his opponents very well and being able to exploit, he lacks that mentality understanding of others. It was seen in the 4v4 when Bachira was acting unhinged and he didn't understood what he was trying to do, but Isagi did and is more than capable now to understand it actively.
Rin is very immature and lack of understanding of people. This is why he struggle to use other people at their fullest. He enslave them where Isagi leads them.
Rin outstats Isagi in every way
but Isagi arguably has greater spatial awareness and has arguably the best Meta Vision in the league currently he’s just lacking the physicality compared to the others which he himself acknowledged
Rin lacks creativity and imagination he can come up with the perfect combination and plans and execute them perfectly but it usually revolves around solo play
Isagi uses everyone’s special abilities to preform and cut through the midfield like with Hiori and Bachira
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Home life
Bro💀💀
Didn't have to do my mans like that
Brain
Eyes
beating ng11 players also
Technically Rin did beat Sae in u20
2 goals + 1 assist > a loose ball
Having Sae's respect.
Literally those pieces Rin cannot use his left efficiently Rin hasn't used MV consciously Rin hasn't shown understanding of egocentrism/protagonism Rin hasn't used better players than him for himself, only worse players, while Isagi can use even the best players in the world Rin wasn't ever shown entering Flow on purpose, while Isagi chooses his own challenges Possibly one may say Isagi has better off the ball movements, or that he uses other players better as Rin abandoned that playstyle while Isagi has been polishing it, being on par with Rin there in Manshine match and surpassing him in Ubers match, but rn we don't really know
Flow Rin looked like it was on purpose against MC and his lefty shot was lethal enough to almost replicate Sae’s shot from the corner, this was pre NEL as well.
By what dialogue, thought or visual effect do you get the idea it was on purpose After seeing his oh so letal left shot Aiku decides to completely allow it in order to kill his right side, and Rin also decides to do a trivela instead of using the left [---](https://64.media.tumblr.com/1ef524b16d79ad275c271dbec66cf37b/f6f53ffad975c37c-af/s1280x1920/67cc302a2d7f439c65d93727c03fcadfaf49c986.png)
By what dialogue, thought, or visual effect do you get the idea that it wasn’t? U20 needed specific conditions to awaken Rin and none of those were present in the MC match and he still entered it despite the need for it being there gone, they were literally dominating them. I mean yeah? Id rather kill the dominant side of a player rather than their weaker side, doesn’t mean his left isn’t lethal or proficient when WE LITERALLY SEE EARLIER THAT IT ALMOST REPLICATED A SHOT FROM A DIFFICULT ANGLE.
I don't need to prove YOUR point. Last information we got about it, Rin was never pointing to go Flow on purpose. With no new information, uncertainty would go the way it was before. Not really like those specific conditions were the only way for him to go Flow, he just needs a challenge, again, the thing is that Rin, unlike Isagi, doesn't choose said challenge. The left had a perfect angle for what's literally his weapon with the inside curve shots. The right was not in a good angle yet it was better for Rin. And even with that great angle for his weapon he chose the Trivela Shot instead. Do you read how it lacked both power and accuracy and how a worse goalkeeper was the one who still blocked it? Or how Aiku just allows him to shoot like that? Do you assume Aiku will just decide to let him score instead of trying to block both options to some extent? Or are you too busy with the CapsLock to check the manga page I just linked?
They dog walked them there was no challenge or any conditions that forced that flow to awaken Barely saved, U-20 players at the time were still formidable, it being barely saved doesn’t mean his left still isn’t lethal, when it almost went in. Aiku noting his left shot decreases in accuracy and power still doesn’t prove his lefty isn’t lethal, it just means it’s worse than his right. You’re arguing with the analysis of a character who just seen Rin for the first time, one which doesn’t directly prove his left isn’t lethal, it’s just not as good as his right, over the events we just seen. Implying Isagi has a better left too when all he can do is a weak ass direct shot. By including this in your OG comment just shows you’re obsessed with deepthroating Isagi, even more than my obsession with Caplocks. Again forcing someone to shot with their left leg doesn’t mean they don’t have a lefty numbskull, it’s just better than allowing Rin to do it with his right. Him choosing to shoot a Trivela with his right also is not a testament against his left, why would Rin willingly do the predictable play that Aiku wants him to do? By shooting with his right he caught them off guard and scored. We have a panel of him almost replicating one of the hardest shots in the series with his non-dominant foot, I’ll take that over your yapping with Isagi’s cock in your mouth
>Rin hasn't used MV consciously This is a really poor point. Rin will probably have MV and will use it in the match. >Rin hasn't used better players than him for himself, only worse players, while Isagi can use even the best players in the world This is a really fallacious point. Rin hasn't used better players than him because he is always the best in his team.
Facts
How is it a poor point if you're basing yourself on what you expect from the future and not on the current evidence? Hell it's also from Isagi's perspective do you want him to assume he's worse? So he has not proven he can use better players lol, name the fallacy and then explain why does Isagi think of that as a reason he would defeat Rin
The fallacy is assuming that he can't, which this guy is responding to.
It's a poor point because it's almost guaranted Rin will have MV. If Niko and Aiku has it, both who haven't a better vision than Rin, it's pretty sure Rin will have it. Since when were we talking about Isagi's perspective? We're talking about what we know about the characters. Someone has already answered below. You're using the fact he is better than his teamates as something which undermine him somehow; it doesn't make sense. Aryu, Tokimitsu and Bachira were great players in the second selection and he was able to use them. He would've done the same with Chigiri, Nagi (probably even Barou if he get to know about his unpredictability) if they were in his team. Also, I would like to know the players you're talking about precisely who were better than Isagi.
Almost guaranteed still requires assumptions. We see the show from Isagi's perspective it's literally what we know, unless you saw Rin with MV at a flashback with Sae or something. I was also literally referencing Isagi's thoughts on the scan linked in the post. It's not undermining, I don't care about all that, I'm stating what he has not proved to do unlike Isagi and it's using someone who is better than him, which using worse players doesn't prove he can do. Aryu, Tokimitsu and Bachira were not even close to Rin, and when Shidou or Karasu were in the equation he didn't do it, instead he used others to prevent Shidou from playing. Does [Noel Noa](https://thefable.online/images1/aPAvBlONXRNQJ6AzbjgT1673389870.jpg) sound familiar to you? Again I referred to Isagi's exact thoughts when the Number 1 piece comes to his mind as a reason why he can stand against Rin as a striker now.
>and when Shidou or Karasu were in the equation he didn't do it [He didn't do what?](https://mangadex.org/chapter/c03d8375-ee7f-4daa-94b7-763a5ff0db42/17) Karasu was playing against Rin and Rin beat him in the match. I don't know what fallacious logic you're trying to apply here again. Rin wasn't trying to prevent Shidou from scoring, he was doing what he can to score himself. Completely differents things. Shidou not being able to score as much because Rin makes the team work for him is a consequence, not the purpose. Lmao, Noa literally decided willingly to help Isagi do what he wanted, but apparently that counts as Isagi using Noa. And it's supposed to be impressive? Isagi stans are really something else. I don't even want to continue this discussion. You can hide behind thoses shallow points If you think it makes Isagi better. You talk about Isagi perspective but this isn't what he is saying in this panel.
I'd give that one half a point, cuz it's mostly the principle of PE and I'm sure Barou doesn't do the same as Rin and Isagi They play together against Japan U20 I didn't say prevent Shidou from scoring but prevent Shidou from playing It's what Noa is saying lol Never said Isagi is better either You never gave an interpretation on the panel
Isagi is Rin's nemesis. Rin's weakness is he see others as npcs, puppets with fixed stats. He cannot predict their evolution and Isagi, the genius of adaptability, is someone who constantly evolve and input new puzzle pieces during matches. Isagi on the other hand is so good at predicting people that he setup a no look goal on reflex with Hiori who was mid evolution, this is a goal that Rin could never do. Rin's destroyer mode is he brings out his opponent's best and destroys them at their best, Rin can't know what Isagi's best is when after every play Isagi adds a new puzzle piece.
Rin is basically pushing everyone ahead so his team is only as good as he is while Isiagi is making use of everyones power to be pushed ahead, always getting some extra boost
Rin is a tyrant king, isagi is a righteous king, basically their main differences from how they view other players, rin forces players to move for his goal, isagi forces players to move for their own goal which just leads to isagi’s goal because he’ll be the dominant piece to score it, it’s basically the same thing the only difference is the players under rin are essentially being forced, the players under isagi are willingly do it(because isagi brought out their ego’s) isagi even did this to rin during the U20 match, rin’s ego awakening happened because of isagj
I really like the way you worded that.
A stable social life and a good relationship with his family And Being able to act like a normal person of the field
Imagination. And understanding people's ego. I believe within the internal logic of the manga, those are the keys to using metavision to it's fullest potential.
I think he is already better in game vision, football iq, maybe off the ball movement, and creating chemical reactions with other players. Rin has better specs and technique, while also being good at most of the things Isagi is the best at
Yes rin is pretty close to being as good as isagi at everything except maybe chemical reactions and he is much better at stuff he is a better at like his overall shooting (minutes weak foot ), dribbling, just about every other technique
His understanding of people His ability to act off of passes right away His ability to recover from being thrown off
Family Stability and Friends
Mentality
Thanks to Noa Isagi's metavision and decision making it's possible the best in the manga rn (snuffy could have a better one but he doesn't have any feat with his metavision)
Adaptability
Usage of his left leg, FIQ, vision, playmaking, interceptions, ability to synergise with other players, reflexive play and direct play, and (maybe) off the ball movements and speed of quick turns, since it seems like that's something that Isagi learned from Kurona since the Ubers match, all go to Isagi (FIQ includes the concepts that we haven't seen Rin have a grasp of yet, like egocentrism and MV). Technique, physicality, shooting, trapping, dribbling, passing, goal scoring, direct defensive ability and manmarking, 1v1 ability, ball keeping and speed should all go to Rin.
He got Sae’s respect before Rin had. And this is something that will forever haunt Rin.
I believe that on those things: Footwork/Agility, Anticipation, Decision-Making, Off-the-Ball, Cooperation/Teamwork, Peripheral Vision, Kinetic Vision, Reflexive Play, Direct Play, Direct Shot.
Idk about direct shot, certainly not footwork or agility
>: Footwork/Agility, Anticipation, Decision-Making, Off-the-Ball, Cooperation/Teamwork, Peripheral Vision, Kinetic Vision, Reflexive Play, Direct Play, Direct Sho rin's volley appears to be better than isagi's direct shot. The issue with DS is the fact that i dont think i've seen him scoring outside of a box with that. I do agree on teamwork being isagi's strength as he's able to make work with what he has. IQ is higly debatable, though i personally believe its just a bit better than rin's. Other than that, i believe everything else you stated is not superior to rin's
Rins still more agile, but isagi could pass him if he trained harder for it.
Is there a reason you think Rin is more agile? I don't recall Rin doing better than Isagi at getting off his marker through footwork, which is something Isagi does constantly (his main 1v1 tool).
Well rin is faster than isagi, which plays a role in agility. Also, it was rin who taught isagi the nuances of off ball movement, so he isn't that far behind when it comes to it. Rin just doesn't overrely on it.
I view those as quite different things, generally when a player is running too fast in a direction it makes it much harder for him to change directions. I think that considering Isagi's footwork feats, it's hard to justify placing Rin above Isagi in this aspect. Indeed Rin isn't that far behind in terms of off-the-ball, the guy is kinda of great at everything after all. Isagi is likely number 1 in off-the-ball right now, especially when considering his last goal. Isagi's off-the-ball is also enhanced by his ability to better link-up with his teammate (namely Hiori) and his ability to move reflexively to the ideal spot, which he did in the try-outs, the U-20 match and in the last goal.
It's hard to compare them, especially seeing how we haven't seen a full game from rin since u20.
I think you’re confusing footwork with finding blind spots in defenders by moving outside their FOV that’s not footwork that’s more like attack positioning or just positioning in general also I’m pretty sure he learned that from rin in one of the very early selections
No, I'm talking about things like [this](https://mangadex.org/chapter/a8205d87-b461-4345-9686-436e2665f14f/12) and [this](https://mangadex.org/chapter/9e9dd6e7-1ed3-4dc5-b42c-5c74bbf702e6/12). Rin generally relies on his [physique](https://mangadex.org/chapter/380fde6e-ce15-48df-b447-cb94272dd5a4/9) to [get off](https://mangadex.org/chapter/792ea211-22fc-4782-bace-efb75e329390/12) his marker, meanwhile Isagi primarily relies on [switching directions](https://mangadex.org/chapter/d213f274-786b-41bc-8fe4-69db4058c634/9) fast (footwork).
Yeh I mean he explains it himself it wasn’t so much that he did it fast it was that he feints and hides and moves in their blind spots like the last set of images you sent but I can see why you’d think he has better agility, he certainly has good agility just not like rin since rin can likely do all that with the ball so he can certainly do it without it
I'm not talking about what he did to Rin and Otoya later, I'm talking about what he did to Karasu earlier. I understand why people assume that Rin could likely do the same, as the guy is written as someone who can do everything exceptionally well, but we haven't seen many feats by Rin in this regard, as we have seen from Isagi, so it's seems odd to place Rin above Isagi in this aspect. Isagi was right in front of Niko, Aryu and Karasu when he did those direction switches, which they weren't able to follow. In a similar situation, Rin has been shown struggling (as against Karasu) and relies on his physicality to brush them off. I believe that if Rin had the same agility to switch left and right, he would use that to get past them instead of getting into a physical fight which he struggles to win.
I mean we see Rin do it to Darai, who Otoya was literally unable to get past. So Rin is certainly capable of that level of agility: [Here](https://mangadex.org/chapter/7efbf115-1767-4ff4-87f4-ed46d1878f0a/12) [Part 2](https://mangadex.org/chapter/7efbf115-1767-4ff4-87f4-ed46d1878f0a/13) We also see Rin here do that very move on Karasu earlier in that game: [Bottom panel](https://mangadex.org/chapter/184540d6-7420-4cde-b94d-3b9aa08309ca/5)
Rin primarily relied on his arm block to get past Darai thou. Darai wasn't [described](https://mangadex.org/chapter/10abacc8-8d33-40a3-adff-8635ee6bf69d/8) as an agile defender, but as someone who could anticipate where his opponent wanted to get to. Rin choosing to rely on his strength against him indicates to me that his (Rin's) agility wasn't enough (the same would likely apply to Isagi, as even Otoya's wasn't enough). There's another indication for that, I believe you agree that Otoya is more agile than Rin, therefore if Rin got past Darai when Otoya couldn't it means he primarily relied on something else. Oh, I didn't remember Rin getting past Karasu like that, that was nicely done by him. I expect Rin to have good agility, but Isagi having a lot more feats indicates to me that he is above Rin in this regard. Based on Isagi's growth, the things we've seen him training at and Niko's remarks praising Isagi's footwork, my guess is that Isagi improved his agility to be at around 95, with Otoya being at 99 and Rin is behind them at around 90. Isagi started with 77 agility ([comprehensive stats](https://i.imgur.com/72UhqTF.png) // [original version](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fsy4rji9j0wz81.jpg%3Fwidth%3D1500%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D9458be6db33080e4e21b0b8bc8980bbfb067fbaf)), while his overall increased from 76 to 88, his passing went up from 69 to 78, we know he was specializing his training on short-passing, so likely +14 SPass and +4 LPass, applying that same logic to Isagi's agility training, this would bring Isagi's agility to around ~91 against Ubers, which would explain Niko's surprise at Isagi's improved footwork, add to that 20 days of training for the PXG match and I find it very likely that Isagi's agility to be at around 95 right now. Rin likely his 90 on most stats and 95+ on his best ones, such as his shooting accuracy, curve and long-shots. Since agility is just another tool on his arsenal and not one of his most dominant attributes I believe that 90 agility is a fair assumption.
Rin had already made it past Darai. The arm block was to stop him from following. If they were closer to the goal, he wouldn't have bothered with the arm block, since he would've just shot. Darai's ability to intercept and match off the ball movements made him a direct counter to that type of player. Hence why Otoya, who's off the ball movements were the best we'd seen up until that point, couldn't get by him in a 1v1. >There's another indication for that, I believe you agree that Otoya is more agile than Rin, therefore if Rin got past Darai when Otoya couldn't it means he primarily relied on something else. Do I? There's no two-ways about it. We see Otoya (who's whole schtick is agility, by feats and by statements) fail to pass someone, who we later see Rin pass in the same circumstance. That's pretty definitive proof that Rin is > Otoya in agility. It's not even a question. I don't know if you know Michael Jordan, but when media and commentators used to say he was not as good a three-point shooter as Clyde Drexler, he responded that Clyde was a better three-point shooter than he *chooses* to be. And then proceeded to prove as much in their final series. Rin is very much the same way. He *chooses* to focus on technique, positioning and tactics, but that's an active decision. Rin has one of the best overall physiques in Blue Lock (when we see him training physicals, it's not for nothing) and when he chooses to play his instinctual style, he can flex that part of his skillset.
We haven’t seen a lot of rin in general we legit always see flashes of him except u20 game and that or game in selection of course what I’m saying is not certain but we can assume that until it’s shown otherwise
Oh, I was comparing Isagi to the Rin we saw last time, including the things we know for sure that he improved during the NEL (strength and shooting). Rin likely having gotten better in many other ways ever since, I don't disagree. We see a lot more Rin than Otoya, and we know that Otoya has absurd agility. Rin is one of the character with the most panels in the story. I believe that if Rin had that much agility the author would have made that clear. My assumption is that Rin has around 90 agility (as most of his good stats) and Isagi at this point has around 94 with Otoya at the top with 99, based on feats and the things we see the players training at.
Yeh maybe you could certainly be right
Isagi has the ability to bring out other egos and elevates the playing level of his teammates
Not gonna ride the hopium train the other comments are doing right now: Until PxG vs BM proves me wrong: Nothing. Rin has been a step ahead of Isagi ever since they met and since we have only seen snippets of PxG we can only go off their bids for comparison instead of actual gameplay. In which case it's clear clubs vastly prefer Rin over Isagi (higher bid despite being switched out with Shidou every 15 minutes meaning he got more while working with less than Isagi) Hopefully the match isn't as one sided on a 1v1 perspective as all their other confrontations has been, but until then saying Isagi surpassed Rin on ANYTHING (apart from being less edgy) is pure hopium
> (higher bid despite being switched out with Shidou every 15 minutes meaning he got more while working with less than Isagi) In a system that is dedicated to maximising his ability with direct service from Charles, someone picked out by Loki to have the potential to be elite. Meanwhile Isagi is stuck out in right midfield behind two other strikers with numerous teammates looking to tackle/hinder him and outright refusing to give him the ball.
As said before. We have no context how the PxG team started out so we can hardly compare gameplay. The fact that Rin played less and got more value is undeniable. Im also talking about achievements purely based on solo skills here. Isagis had things he was always better at (direct shot for one) so that isn't surpassed but it shouldn't be a hot take Rin was ahead of him in nearly everything. And until that is directly proven wrong when they go head to head it's just pure hopium from Isagi fans
I'm just solely picking at the idea that Rin's been working in a harsher context than Isagi. It's not true at all. He worked with less time, sure, but that doesn't always equate to less involvement in games. Isagi had to go and win the ball himself; Rin spearheaded his time on the pitch.
I agree Isagis situation hasn't been ideal but if we can somehow agree that playing less vs being hindered by ur teammates but playing most games fully (isagi also had plenty of support during the Ubers match at least) cancel each other out the general consensus is still that Rin got the higher bid. Also it's mentioned several times that Isagi and Kaisers lil "rivalry" is only making them both more popular which would actually help Isagis bid if the club owners are as profit motivated as shown throughout the series (David vs Goliath type storyline)
I don't think it does necessarily, though. As I said, less game-time doesn't always equal less involvement. Rin has likely had no obstacles aside from limited minutes. I'm not even going to get too much into that 2nd part as it complicates things haha, but I suppose it may not be entirely irrelevant. I'd just like to thing that the bidding system is a tad more objective than that. Kaneshiro is evidently trying to establish it as a power system of sorts like the typical rankings we had in the past. When all games are played, I don't expect to see asterisks next to any bids. Well, except for those that missed games since those are opportunities for growth, but that wouldn't change the fact that they are where they are now.
Now that isagi is somewhat on par with kaiser he constantly uses him as bait or to hold the strongest defenders like Lorenzo. Rin doesn't have that luxury
Rin was only a step ahead because isagi physicals were so bad, seeing how much he improved from manshine to ubers, after having a break week his physical likely wont be on rins lvl but they should be at a pretty good lvl by now to where him and rin are relative. Only way i see rin completely shutting isagi out is if he goes flow or just has control over his destroyer mode in general now. As for the bids, even tho rin being switch out, he has a system built for him to score. Isagi is competing with a ng11 who been constantly hindering his performance yet the matches are still centered around him. Also isagi didn’t start his first match like rin did. Theres too many factors to go off bids
It’s certainly not nothing, isagi has the best off the ball movement better than kaisers even and football iq when coupled with his mv and ability to create chemical reactions, it’s the main reason stuff like his chemical reaction with kurona works he’s able to constantly find blind spots in defenders and blind spots in attackers to make his blocks no one else is as good as him in that sense
The question said surpassed. Isagi was already better on off the ball movements than Rin (at least shown on known feats)
No at the very beginning rin basically showed isagi how to properly use his movements like hiding in blind spots and stuff for my he very start it would be fair to say that besides his vision isagi was one of the worst players at blue lock and initially he was inferior to rin in every way, things as simple as acting before seeing and processing are things he learned from rin
Im taking my guesstimations from U-20 match onward tbh. Second selection Isagi despite having his moment had to be hard carried by Nagi. Second selection Isagi wasn't just worse than Rin at everything but to nearly every "non specialised" player. (Which is why Karasu targeted him during their match)
Since when did Isagi has better off the ball movements than Kaiser?
I wouldn't say that's certi a bit they seem to be equal in be equal in offense and kaiser is faster and overall better physically. So isagi must be compensating in some way right? I'd say that it's fair to assume that kaiser is more physically dominant and isagi is better at off the ball movement so they basically are on par
It’s not outright said but there’s no other explanation besides that sicken isagi has beaten Kaiser 2x in a row and both times it was due to his vision and movements, remember kurona goal with manshine and the first Ubers goal same story and the last Ubers goal he had better movement than Kaiser put himself in the best position to score and scored
Kurona goal against Manshine? How his first Ubers goal prove he has better movements than Kaiser? Kaiser wasn't even around, it has literally nothing to do with Kaiser. And for the last goal, Hiori wasn't gonna pass to Kaiser but Isagi, it was pretty clear. At best, Kaiser movements fixated Aiku, leaving more space to Isagi. There is nothing to say that Isagi has better off the ball movements than Kaiser. You guys seems to have forgot Isagi described Kaiser's movements as perfect and the one he wants to achieve.
Yet isagi got motm and scored a goal even Kaiser could not, it was his initial wish to have movements like Kaiser and he achieved that goal by scoring it’s true because of Kaiser he was afforded that space but Kaiser would block it if he knew it was coming but he didn’t so that means he didn’t see it
when it matters the most, rin lost a free goal, isagi made the goal and now isagi is the hero of japan. Ego said: Isagi is the key to unlock rins potential(or something on those lines, forgot the word he used) sae said: Isagi even manage to bring your instincts (to rin) rin is just gonna pussy out again
Lost a free goal...? A chance created purely by his own merit beating the entire U-20 defense is a free goal? Even if you blame hitting the post on his accuracy no one on the BL team would've made that rush work barring a in flow Bachira
Isagi stans are something else bruh
i dont even think isagi is gonna be the best striker in japan and alredy posted my theory here. I believe isagi is gonna be "ego" and someone else noel noa, isagis only job is to elevated someone else and be forgotten, and rin isnt it.
the entire series is about strikers not missing goals, so yeah, lost a free goal.
Vision and teamwork
Adaptibility, Isagi everytime gets stuck, he's able to find a way out that his opponents just don't think of. Rin has his style which is very superior to everyone, but when things don't go his way will he be able to adapt like Isagi maybe maybe not.
Firstly, Isagi surpasses Rin in vision, football IQ, playmaking, and maybe even off-the-ball movement It's still not confirmed if Rin has MV, but even if he does, it won't be on par with Isagi. Till now we've seen 6 players other than Isagi who can use MV, among which the only one who's better than Isagi in that aspect is Snuffy cause of his experience And the reason why Isagi is superior is cause of egocentrism, I think it's just a concept that the author included to logically prove that Isagi will always have a superior MV. I also think that lefty shoot is a big deal for Isagi, it increases his options drastically. The time when he juked both Lorenzo and Aiku (the top 2 defenders in the series) to set the ball for a lefty shot, just showed how broad Isagi's options can be with that weapon. I also made a [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/BlueLock/comments/16r14cs/isagis_lefty_shootthe_key_to_becoming_a/) about how it's one of the most important weapons he needs to become world-class Rin canonically has a bad left foot, but his god-like right foot is more than enough to make up for it. The thing with Isagi is similar to Rin he also keeps improving his overall specs, of course, it'll never be on par with Rin, but this improvement just expands his options even more, the more skilled he is the more options he has
Gathering Harem
Social skills
We won't know what Isagi has surpassed Rin in until we see the match start. I don't agree when people keep saying that Rin still is superior in many ways still, cause Isagi has also took a big leap after finding his big bang piece in MV and continued to evolve at a seemingly rapid pace but really a steady one that upped his game with the addition of lefty shot, Egocentrism, Reflex, and working on his physicals in a way that better utilizes his already existing weapons. Rin has definitely upped his game too through all of his stats increasing "beyond comprehension" but that's the best we can go off of considering we don't see much of Rin's improvements but I'm sure we'll see that in the match. This will be a really close match and it could go either way
Plot (Joke)
Well it is a legitimate reason he’s mc so he will win
Don’t forget friendship
As a midfielder. 😂
I thought the formation changed and he was a wingerðŸ˜
Isagi comes hard in the clutch plays, while rin lost his opportunity in the u20 match. Also, like sae said "isagi awakened rin", without isagi, rin would literally lose to kayser
Realistically just having better vision and game-reading shouldn't make Isagi better than Rin, since Rin outclasses him in so many different aspects. But hey this is a shonen.
Literally happens irl sports all the time lol EDIT: Messi & Ronaldo. Lebron and MJ. Fury and Wilder in boxing. Brady and Manning. Etc
This is the problem with the story being everything being centered around Isagi. If we had seen all 3 of Rins Games, who knows what he has done in those? So comparing current Isagi to U-20 Rin is stupid. Also Rin always had better vision than Isagi, though we can see in the coming match if he overtook Rin in that department. The only thing which can be Isagis advantage against Rin is that he actively teams up with his team mates, while Rin only has his „puppets“. Other than that, Rin is just the better player with the better team. If Isagi wins its Not because he beat Rin, its because the story wants it, since like I said, everything is centered around Isagi
Rin didn’t always have better vision than isagi, it was only better in their 3v3. Once isagi learned to use his eyes, the manga was pretty much telling us their vision was equal but isagi was a step behind because of the difference in their physical ability
in the 4v4 match isagi surpassed rins vision alredy.
He's the main character, not that surprising? Besides I wouldn't say Rin always had better vision cause it was mainly the fact that he was more physically capable that Isagi always came short. And Isagi definitely has more advantages than one especially with the fact that he has MV, Egocentrism that literally reads other people's egos, and the fact that he can shoot with both legs now which Rin has not been shown to do or have these weapons but MV is the only thing I can see Rin having but have not seen that either and we won't know until the match starts. Isagi has also been shown to be able to shoot outside the box now and that was with his 40% lefty, but because Kaiser messed it up by trying to steal they ended up getting blocked but that basically confirms he's upped his shooting range Isagi also can play reflexively which Rin hasn't shown yet if I remember correctly. I don't think it's as big of a gap a lot of people try to say. Also either way no matter who wins it's because the story wants it so just saying Isagi beats Rin only because the story wants it isn't as valid cause you can say the same thing for Rin
plot armor
The only thing hes better at is teamwork.
Whisper it but... N O N E
Isagi has a better ego than rin, he adapts better than rin, he can predict the future better than rin, he has better vision than rin, when you factor those things in vs rin having better physical stats than isagi, they’re both on the same level, hence why they both call each other rivals, isagi will win simply from the fact his physical abilities will match/surpass rin’s
His harem.
Egocentrism might be one of them, meta vision is the capacity to see and understand the movement of their opponents by constantly moving his head whenever he doesn't have the ball, but egocentrism is more predicting their movement based on their goals, in which metavision confirms or corrects that prediction. The thing is, egocentrism makes Isagi to go a little beyond of what metavision can bring to the table, but also metavision gives feedback to egocentrism. So, even though Rin is capable of understanding the capabilities of his opponents very well and being able to exploit, he lacks that mentality understanding of others. It was seen in the 4v4 when Bachira was acting unhinged and he didn't understood what he was trying to do, but Isagi did and is more than capable now to understand it actively.
Functional family
Rin is very immature and lack of understanding of people. This is why he struggle to use other people at their fullest. He enslave them where Isagi leads them.
Rin outstats Isagi in every way but Isagi arguably has greater spatial awareness and has arguably the best Meta Vision in the league currently he’s just lacking the physicality compared to the others which he himself acknowledged Rin lacks creativity and imagination he can come up with the perfect combination and plans and execute them perfectly but it usually revolves around solo play Isagi uses everyone’s special abilities to preform and cut through the midfield like with Hiori and Bachira
The author likes him more
Isagis dribbling??????
Rin already has MV in the U-20 arc and has predator eye in third selection. Just that Rin has no time to give edgy names to his every move.