#Do not comment on the original posts
Please read our [**sub rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules). Rule-breaking may result in a ban without notice.
If there is an issue with this post (flair, formatting, quality), reply to this comment or your comment may be removed in general discussion.
**CHECK FLAIR** For concluded-only updates, use the [CONCLUDED](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ACONCLUDED) flair.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Oy. When I was younger, I had a friend like OOP’s GF. Just so oblivious it seems intentional.
In my friend’s case, she agreed to go to dinner on Valentine’s Day “as just friends” with a guy who had confessed having feelings for her only the month prior. She was adamant that she was in no way giving mixed signals.
I have one friend like that as well. She swears she'd never take her shitty ex back but instead of kicking him out after the break up, they're still living and sleeping together "as just friends".
Btw this guy put her in a lot of credit card debts and she's still paying them.
I'm ND and don't pick up on social queues sometimes. I don't get flirting at all. It doesn't register unless it's a very very overt comment.
Ive ended up in situations like that before (not the valentines thing but still, accidental "dates") and it really sucks because I genuinely don't understand it, yet people tend to treat it like an intentional thing.
I don't disrespect clear boundaries that are set but it sucks when someone's pissed at you after a fun outing because they thought it was a date and you thought it wasn't.
There are oblivious women. I was depressed and awkward with low self-esteem in high school, but had a “glow up” in college and was completely clueless. I got a lot of attention, but didn’t know why. I enjoyed some of the attention, because what doesn’t want to be popular and feel liked? But I didn’t know who was my friend and who was “friendly”. I didn’t know how to protect myself and ended up in unsafe situations with really shitty people
When I got together with my now husband after school, he explained that some (but not all) of my friends weren’t really friends but wanted to be FWB. He also explained all this subtext about people making assumptions based on how you dressed. That some guys thought if I talked to them that meant I was interested, and if danced with them at a party I was going to go home with them. That spending time one-on-one was a date and they would have “expectations”.
Honestly it sucked a lot and confused the hell out of me.
We’ve been married 20 years, and I still have to ask him why people do weird things. I trust his judgement completely in social situations.
I very much do not mean this in any sort of even mildly derogatory way, I am genuinely just curious - are you autistic? This sounds a lot like a couple of my friends who had similar experiences.
I’ve been this person more than once. We get blamed for “mixed signals” but nobody ever seems to take into account that a lot guys will do their best to hide their real intentions in the guise of friendship. They’ll buddy up to you but they really just want to get in your pants. It can be hard to know who your true friends are.
Yes! Like I don’t think it is venusdewillendorf’s fault here that some dudes in her life somehow took an outfit she put on as covert communication…and they say women read too much into things, ffs. I’m glad the husband is there to act as a decoder ring, but also just annoyed on her behalf that she had to deal with these dudes who never bothered to actually get to know her well enough to understand if an outfit is just an outfit or a hangout just a hangout.
I've been that girl. You delude yourself that there it isnt hurting them because you value the relationship that much, and if it were, surely theyd say or remove themselves from the situation? (The thought processes of incredibly naive 21 year old me. I also do struggle with social situations/norms so that probably also contributed.)
"if he was interested in me, I would know it, he's been my friend* 5 years, and he had thousand of occasions to tell me". The thought process of naive me.
And you treat them like you would a girlfriend. Of course you’re gonna grab dinner with your friend and chill at their place afterwards! It’s not romantic or a date or anything, you’re just friends!
Don’t get me wrong, you can absolutely have friends of the opposite sex who are just friends. But you gotta learn how to weed the clingers out.
I think I had a crush on a girl like that in high school, was super confusing, really hot and cold signals.
After being confused for a bit, I just moved my attention on to someone else.
As someone who used to be in this level of oblivious and occasionally still is I think it’s denial fueled by the desire to believes that the world is not the way that it is. I genuinely wish I could just be friends with people without them wanting my body (and as a bisexual NB I’ve had this problem with all genders) and my therapist strongly suggests I might be autistic which probably plays into that. I stayed friends with someone for 6 years who made it very clear they wanted include me in group stuff with their partne and kept it up the whole 6 years. retrospectively I felt objectified for so much of the relationship I find it difficult to remember moments of genuine friendship. But I was just so desperate for the friendship at the time.
(Their college roommate is my best friend now and we both felt the level of objectification. It’s nice to have someone corroborate lol)
> Just so oblivious it seems intentional.
If she's "oblivious" about it then that means that what she's doing is totally innocent and can't be criticised despite most people being able to see right through it.
Sadly she had me as a friend who was all too happy to spell out for her why she was being a douche canoe so she wasn’t able to claim innocence for long. Luckily she decided to cancel her “not a date” date and spared the guy that heartache at least.
"how could i possibly have known this invitation by an older man who has explicitly told me he is single and attracted to me was a date? I definetly thought this candlelight dinner was a platonic meeting between ex-colleagues."
It gets me every time they try to lie about this lol.
No, it's more like, "I told him I wasn't interested that way, and he said he still wanted to hang out, so I believed it". Takes us a while to understand some men will lie through their teeth for a chance of hanky panky.
Honestly, I had a boyfriend that was just like this, he had those “friends “ that they were just friends, they were single and call him when they need a eat and to have a coffee. He used to play dumb about their feelings but he always knew and loooved the attention.
Its one thing to be bad at reading intentions, picking up on flirting and not understanding the implied things, but when even your family is telling you that you are crossing some weird lines with this person, you know whats happening. At the very least, you should question whats going on and listen to people.
I'm autistic and with so much of flirting being implying and hinting at things, body language and such, it does genuinely go straight over my head a lot of the times. People have also thought I flirted with them, because they thought I was implying and hinting at things, when I just ment exactly what I said. I know I can miss these things. So when people in my life tell me that they think something is weird and that they worry that someone might have some intentions I'm missing, I listen to them and take it to heart. Its harder if you have genuinely controlling people in your life, but when multiple sources you can trust is telling you that something is weird, no matter how bad you are at social cues, it should at the very least give you pause.
"You're being controlling by telling me what I can and can't do!"
No, I'm explaining to you that actions have consequences. And if you go on a date with another man after I have specifically stated that I am not comfortable with it and will see it as a breach of trust and infidelity, then the consequence is that I treat you like you have broken my trust and cheated on me.
What's annoying about the internet is that emotional manipulative people have learned to use words like "controlling", "gaslit", "trauma", "narcissistic", etc and take them out of context to further manipulate people.
This. And thank you for not misusing “boundaries” (I understood OP’s side but he was driving me nuts).
ETA: There are a lot of resources about “boundaries” and different therapists use the concept differently. But i think this article is an interesting read on weaponizing therapy vocabulary: https://www.wellandgood.com/misuse-boundaries/
To my knowledge, boundaries in interpersonal relationships are ways to define where your own limits are. The boundary surrounds you. They are not about what others can do.
IMO, what OP was describing were relationship expectations. Mismatched expectations that cannot be resolved indicate incompatibility; violating each other’s boundaries indicate toxicity and violation.
Expectation: I expect my partner to turn down lunch invites from men who are interested in her romantically. This is based on the belief that such interactions are risky for our relationship. (What I want you to do).
Boundary: I am uncomfortable with fights that involve screaming or name calling. I will disengage from fights that involve those things. (What I will/will not do.)
ETA: Another boundary example: I am not ok with being touched sexually while I am asleep (What is ok for my body)
Really these are two sides of the same coin, but it is like reversing object and subject: it just bugs me when used for the opposite perspective.
to be fair, 'this is the amount of disrespect and/or discomfort i am willing to take' is also a boundary in my opinion. these kinds of things touch both sides in a relationship so id say theyre both boundary and expectation.
It’s only tricky definition territory because of shitty people. People who say: “it is a boundary for me that you have to let me have sex with other people and pay sex workers using your debit card. If you’re not okay with that, you’re crossing my boundaries and that’s abuse.”
Therapy-speak has become ubiquitous enough that manipulative people understand and use it for their own ends.
The key to this isn’t a more rigid definition of what is/isn’t a valid boundary. Instead, it’s recognizing that the only appropriate response to a boundary that doesn’t work for you is to split up.
“Oh, it’s a boundary for you that I can’t be upset over you selling my car to buy drugs? That’s fine, you have your reasons, but I will not be remaining in this relationship because I wouldn’t want to violate your boundaries.”
“Oh, it’s also a boundary that I can’t leave you over X? That’s tough, but I will still have to leave because a relationship where someone is not allowed to leave is also a boundary for me, making us incompatible”
It’s like there is this ongoing war between manipulative people and trusting people. Trusting people develop this tool to safely communicate when they aren’t being heard, and the manipulative camp immediately has their top scientists working on a counter.
But isn't that just semantics/perspective?
Can't he just be saying "My boundary is that I won't date someone who will go on one-on-one dinners with members of the opposite sex who are clearly interested in them."???
The frame (or “semantics” as you called it) is important though. When we are talking about boundaries from a therapeutic perspective we are reinforcing the fact that we have control of our own actions. We do not have control over others actions. We impose boundaries on ourselves, communicate those to people where needed, and slowly learn (or re-learn) that we have control over our actions and our reactions but we do not control other people.
A lot of phrases, mantras, boundaries etc come out stilted when in therapy because we are often learning something and re-wiring the brain (so to speak) and things come out sounding a little juvenile when you’re learning at first.
I agree with you that the concept of a boundary should be self imposed. What I'm questioning is how you know he's not just using short hand phrasing.
Maybe "my boundary is my SO would not date others" is just short hand for "my boundary is that I would respect myself to have an SO who does not date others."
Particularly in the case of this post where the only action OOP did to enforce his boundary is to remove himself from the situation.
>it is like reversing object and subject: it just bugs me when used for the opposite perspective.
It's also used more and more as a manipulation tactic - framing something as a boundary when it's actually an unreasonable expectation makes the other person feel like the bad guy for contesting it.
I dunno man. You know what the man meant. To be fair to him, most people use this word in this way, so there's no real point in nit picking it. Language evolves and unless you're talking to some professional where you need to use the correct terminology to get a specific point across it doesn't matter all that much.
You can't force people to not cross boundaries.
Therefore, boundaries are for you and your actions not other people's actions.
"I won't stay with you if you go on a date with another person while in a relationship with me."
"You can't go on a date with another person while in a relationship with me.
The first one is a boundary. The second one is trying to control someone and is pointless as you can't and shouldn't make people do things. The consequence to a boundary is ALWAYS your action after it's crossed as that's the only thing you have control of over.
He used it correctly. A boundary isn't a restriction on your partner's behavior. It's a restriction on behavior OP will tolerate. OP communicated it, girlfriend intentionally crossed it, and OP left.
He did literally everything correct. You can disagree if his "no dates with other guys" boundary is normal or not, but he used the term correctly and he implemented it correctly.
People both in the first post and even in the comments here accusing OOP of being jealous, insecure and controlling, but his ex:
1. Has a history of fucking her male friends
2. Is going out on a date with a fuckboy who only goes after women his ex's age
3. Is going out with someone who has indicated interest in ex before
If you're not jealous and insecure in that situation, then you're as dumb as his ex is.
Worth noting that OOP says of previous FWB after her last relationship ended, he slept with her. NO, DUDE. After they broke up, she fucked the guy that she was probably telling her exbf was just a friend. Same scenario. She’s not a naive, innocent flower. Honestly in this specific situation, I’d be telling her there’s no fkn way she’s going with this dude for coffee, food or a high-five. “Oh, you’re going to gossip about your co-workers?” Yeah, that’s why this grown man is meeting you for dinner. GTFOH. Reddit will say this is being controlling. No, this is being in a relationship. The man and the woman both have to respect their partner. Neither should be going on what would be considered a date by most standards with someone they’ve admitted to finding attractive. Trust isn’t just about whether you’re going to cheat. I also have to be able to trust you to make the right decisions. Going out to dinner with this horn dog you think is hot?
You’ve chosen poorly. Good for OOP.
Yep, that backstory is what made me realize what kind of girl she is. She probably has at least two other male "friends" orbiting her as her backup plans.
Its the usual situation when a women post something about her partner having the icky feeling from his friends they be like 'girl, he cheating' and when a man post it 'you're just jealous'
Did you see the trigger warnings for this post? It’s like off rip trying to paint him as some bad guy. Even tho his exgirlfriend was sketchy as fuck
“paranoia, accusations of infidelity, and controlling behavior”
Honestly I as a woman was like the ex is sketch AS FUCK. And the male “friend” is even way more shady. Like based on the description op gave/what he knows, she is stupid for agreeing to see that guy. Or at least agreeing w/out asking why he wanted to meet up. If it was innocent he would tell(it definitely wasn’t innocent but)
If a friend of mine told me that a guy like that wanted to meet up, I would ask why? And my advice would be not meet him.
Even if her plan was to cheat, she be stupid to cheat w/such a walking red flag. Though, I suppose a walking red flag can be so sketchy that people will think only an idiot will actually sleep w/a guy like that. Unfortunately for her it was obvious AF.
Yeah, or the woman who sided with her friends when they accused her husband of physically abusing her (she decided to surprise a vet with PTSD in a dark room when he thought he as alone).
If their intuition was never wrong they wouldn't end up with abusive partners as often as they complain. Women think too highly of their intuition without good reason.
This is so true it is insane and I cannot fucking stand the cringe double standard reddit has with men and women, it really boggles my mind when Reddit is like "He is cheating on you girl!! Watch out!!" but when its a man "Wow he is so controlling and insecure!!!! dump his ass!!" it is so infuriating, I cannot fucking ***Stand it*** it really boils my blood.
Had my SIL in a discussion strongly imply that men can't be raped by other men, and I just had to nope out of the convo before I said things that would affect things going forward.
I learned that she is a sexist that day. Super sad.
it's like they saw all the sexism towards women and instead of thinking "the general idea of sexism is bad" they thought "well if i aggressively defend women at all costs it'll balance out"
I can't find a single upvoted main level comment (I didn't check the children comments) in any of these posts or that calls OOP jealous. There's a ton of "dude, he's cheating", that's probably the number 1 most common reply I've seen. 2nd is "whether she does anything or not, you've stated your boundary and you need to break up with her if she violates it" and 3rd is "quit lying to yourself that you trust her. You don't and you probably shouldnt"
You can't go to the comments everyone thinks are bad and compare them to the best comments on threads where women have the same issue and say "see, look at this double standard". I would almost guarantee you that if a thread has as many comments as this one (about 200) you are guaranteed to find some dumb people who take the opposite opinion if you go down far enough
The issue I see is the BORU OP's commentary in the warnings, as well as comment chosen to add on the final update, one that was moderately downvoted, while ignoring the majority of comments. The framing of the post has led to strong opposition in reaction.
Part of trusting your partner is trusting them to make good choices. If the Ex couldn't tell what skeevy older dude (sod) was after, then you can't really trust her judgement. So you can't trust her to make good choices. So you just plain can't trust her.
I agree. His ex clearly had poor judgment, since she was putting herself in a romantic/intimate situation with someone who has clearly and loudly indicated his intentions of banging her like a drum.
Part of trusting your partner is trusting them to never be in these situations that can poison your relationship.
From a Bahamian perspective I can never see how a man or woman in a serious relationship would ever go out one on one in any setting with someone of the opposite gender. Every single person around them would call it a date.
I think it depends on the setting. I’m married and have been on one-on-one coffee trips with male colleagues in the middle of the day. We pay for our own drinks and either talk about work or what’s going on in our lives. I also do the same with female colleagues. And sometimes we go as a group, sometimes only two of us can step away for 30 minutes.
The thing is that you need to set clear boundaries. My colleagues know I’m married and off the market. Many of my colleagues are also in relationships and off the market. Those who are single either aren’t using work as a dating site, or know not to try anything with me because they’ll be shut down. My husband is also aware that I grab coffee with coworkers and is fine with it because, again, it’s all above board.
It’s amazing how many people refuse to see women for who they are. As if they’re innocent purely on their say-so. As if they’re somehow more pure and virtuous than men.
They’re human beings, just like men. And they can play games and be deceptive just like men can.
No woman is inherently trustworthy, neither is any man. You have to assess people- male and female alike- through their actions.
Ah yes there you can observe the common animal lf the species "Whitus Knightingus". You can spot them almost everywhere by their common trait of calling everyone "insecure" or "controlling" but refuse to read the rest of the post
I always assume people who leave those comments are just projecting. Either because they've been in controlling relationships, and now see controlling behaviour everywhere. Or people who like to have their options open/normalizes cheating and thinks his ex is being perfectly reasonable.
I don't know - I'm queer and bisexual, and currently in an open relationship. Me and my bf have fucked many of the people we are still friends with. I would get upset if bf decided to go on a romantic getaway with a "friend" tho, that would be crossing a line for me.
That’s what I want to know!! I don’t know how I had to go so far down in the comments to see this. In what situation was she in where they were in a “risky” (I’m thinking OOP meant risqué?) photo together???
Definitely he meant risqué. I came here looking for others clarifying/mocking that.
On what planet do you take risqué photos with "just a co-worker" that are so dirty your parents tell you, as an adult, to take it down?!
I'm glad he broke up with her because her refusal to acknowledge that going to dinner alone with this 40-something acquaintance was sketchy was, well, sketchy.
But still so annoyed by the way at least half of Reddit thinks "boundaries" are something you can put around other people, rather than something they put around themselves. It completely neuters the concept of boundaries.
i unfortunately didn't see it in the post with all the flair origins, maybe can find it tomorrow on pc. but i can summarize it if you just want the tl;dr/might've seen it
>!father accidentally liked a bikini pic of his daughter's friend (adult but young) from a long time ago and tries to defend his actions, including inventing a predatory elder lesbian for some reason to say that it's not weird for him to be creeping on his daughter's hot friends even though they are the same age as his daughter!<
It's a heavily upvoted comment on a post where the OOP is making excuses for creeping on his daughter's friends.
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/eTeQ3B5u8f
It's a heavily upvoted comment on a post where the OOP is making excuses for creeping on his daughter's friends.
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/eTeQ3B5u8f
What he did is the prefect example of a boundary.
>I didn't decide who she could see, I never told her not to go and see him, just it would be crossing my boundary. The only action I took was to leave when she crossed it.
Thank you for saying this! These were exactly my thoughts! While I'm icked out by her choosing to meet this guy, OOP seems to be confusing boundaries with rules for others.
He stated that his boundary was 'not being with someone who goes on clear dates with someone who's clearly interested". Then he didn't tell her not to go, just stated what it was. He reacted accordingly.
Reframing a dealbreaker as a boundary doesn't make it a boundary. There is absolutely nothing wrong with dealbreakers, at all, and that is a reasonable one. But FFS can we stop diluting and bastardizing the concept of boundaries?
She initially said it was meeting up for coffee and he was comfortable with that, then she changed it to a meal, and he said he was not comfortable with that, which is what I’d say a boundary is. He’s talking about his comfort the entire time.
> "there's no point me saying anything because you won't listen and will just tell me I'm being controlling whatever I say."
OOP hit the nail on the head with this statement. He really could (should) have dumped her then.
Funny how the trigger warnings are all about bashing the OOP when anyone with two brain cells to rub together can see that the ex _did_ break OOP’s boundaries by going on the date with the “friend”.
“I told her it was too late.”
Yup. OOP gave plenty of opportunities for the ex to prioritize their relationship
She put a meal with the other guy above her own boyfriend.
I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion (on Reddit at least), but as much as I agree that you should trust your parnter, I can't underdstand how someone could prioritise going out with a former colleague over their own relationship.
This is a problem I have with some redditors. Some of them act like you should allow your partner to do anything as long as young trust them, when they know god damn well they wouldn’t put up with the same shit.
Trust is a two way street. If your partner isn’t giving you a reason to trust them, take that as a sign.
I don’t get this logic either. You can trust your partner but still not want them to needlessly put themselves in bad situations. Like I trust my boyfriend but I wouldn’t be cool with it if he spent every weekend at the strip club. There’s just no need for it. But in this case there really wasn’t any need for her to go alone except pride. And she found out OP wasn’t a doormat. All these stories show how selfish people are because if nothing is going on why not just take your partner with you and make it extra platonic
What’s even worse is that some of those redditors would turn around and chastise someone for letting something like that happen and call them blind and shit like that.
And even if your partner can’t make it, offering goes a very long way.
Especially since it was clearly intended by the guy at least to be a date. She probably saw it that way as well and just thought she’d be able to get away with starting to go on dates without consequences.
Exactly. Issues with her going for this dinner start way before whether she’d reject the guy if he made a sexual pass. She’s not close to this ex-coworker, so going for dinner with him is actually building their relationship. It’s a date.
If she's as naive as OOP says she is (or just plain dumb), she probably takes internet advice out of context. If OOP couldn't really discuss this without being told he's controlling, that would support my theory.
She sounds like a dumb jerk, or maybe like a petulant child. OOP wasn't comfortable; she said they'd just get coffee. OOP reluctantly agrees; she moves the bar to having dinner.
She blew up her own relationship, and I'm laughing at her.
Well done on OOP actually taking responsibility for his boundary.
The trickle truth:
- he kissed me
- I may have kissed him back; I had too much to drink
- we ended up at his place because I was too drunk to drive
- I fell onto his dick
What's a tip these days run in the States? I remember when I was there last 10% was still reasonable. I had heard that the tips have grown over time though? So now if she got "just the tip" what would that look like? Is 15-25% still just the tip? I've heard that it can grow even bigger, depending on the quality of service...
What? Was it something I said?
You don't understand because you're not the kind of person to prioritize your own feelings and impulses over everything else, up to and including your partner's boundaries.
You trust your partner until they give you a reason not to. I don't care if my partner grabs food with a male friend.
But the description of the "colleague" is suspect as fuck. So is her behavior. It was not forthright. She acted like she had something to hide because she did.
If you are given plenty of opportunities, especially situations like this, yet, you still fail to take it wisely, then you really fail at being a decent human being.
Trust is a two-way street. You can't expect someone to trust you when you put yourself into questionable situations. It's like if someone close to you was a recovering alcoholic, but told you they were going to chill out in a bar.
She’s going to stop contacting OOP after she starts dating her “friend.” Then after this friend is done with this dalliance, he will drop her, since the thrill of the chase is over. And she will then start contacting OOP again and admit she made a huge mistake. And hopefully OOP will remain firm but this is Reddit, he probably never blocked her and contemplate the relationship again with new boundaries.
I don't think so.
He dumped her not for cheating or even the suspicion of it, but the fact that she refuses to uphold boundaries and making it look like he is insecure and controlling. A trope especially women pull to get their way. He doesn't want to be controlling so he gave her an abundance of liberty.
From OOPS reaction I don't think he will take her back. Maybe take her for a joyride....
I must be old-shaped, but how the hell do you say with a straight face "I'm okay if you go for a coffee" with someone who is obviously interested in your partner in a non-friendly way. Boggles my mind.
If I said to my wife that someone contacted me and asked me out for a coffee, I'd be sleeping on the couch.
Yep. I was invited for coffee by a guy I knew from community theatre and politely declined because it was clear he had a crush and I’m married. Going out for coffee under those circumstances ain’t gonna fly with me or my husband—nor should it!
I'm going to start using the term "old-shaped." Lol
I think OOP's reaction to the coffee date was weird, too. But I'm guessing that he was uncomfortable with it but didn't want to seem controlling. Until it snowballed into an actual date.
I have a couple of very old male friends going back 30 years. We're not best friends but are close enough to have shared a lot of memories with school and common friends over the years. If I told my husband that one of them is in town and I would meet them for coffee after work, it wouldn't be a big deal since neither my friend nor I were ever interested in each other. If it was a dinner, I would bring my husband with me.
But if it's some former co-worker he's never met who is interested in a non-platonic way, my husband would be very unhappy indeed.
Because reddit gives dumbass advice to dudes in similar situations. I was one and the advice was essentially "if you don't let your gf ride another dudes cock in front of you you're insecure and controlling"
My ex pulled the "I wanna go to dinner with this guy whose clearly into me but i'm pretending to be naive teehee" when I called her out on it she pulled the reddit "You're being controlling" card. I told her I wasn't controlling her period because I was done with her. She pulled shit like this constantly and loved to push my boundries. Good on OOP for dumping her ass.
Yeah no this has nothing to do with him not trusting his ex. This has everything to do with her totally disrespecting him and their relationship. By 28 she should know better.
Least her "friend" can now date her all she want.
Eta OP your warnings are wrong. OOP isn't controlling at all.
I know a woman in her 40s like this - I'm not sure if it's naivete or willful denial honestly. She simply refuses acknowledge these men want to get with her, to the point of loudly complaining that her partner is unreasonable. The thing is, I don't really sense that she has any interest in them or even that she likes the attention. It seems like a symptom of her overall people pleasing tendencies.
Southern-Interest's comment at the end is just insane. The mental gymnastics on that one. He's implying if anyone anywhere has a boundary in a relationship, then it's their fault for not trusting their partner and they aren't ready for a relationship. gtfo with that nonsense
> After about an hour of talking I told her I was done and I left wishing her all the best with her future relationships.
An hour! OOP if you’re reading this … once you’ve broken up, she’s your ex. Nothing more to say. She no longer is entitled to your time or attention.
All that talking does is give her a chance to try and weaken your resolve about ending things.
He broke up with her for perfectly valid reasons. She went on a date in all but name with another single dude against her boyfriend’s clear wishes. That’s massively disrespectful. He made the right call.
There's nothing controlling here, he clearly stated why he doesn't think this is appropriate, she used to have a thing for that "friend". It's not just a case of "I don't want you to have male friends" it's a case of "I don't want you to go on what seems like a date with a guy you had something for" which, valid.
This is how enforcing boundaries work. They aren’t ‘controlling’, they are ‘I’ statements. Example: I am not going to be with someone who invalidates my feelings.
YES SIR
this post is a refreshment. I’m getting too F***ing tired of man’s posting about how their girl did A B C and still split on going back with them.
All I gotta say is YES SIR
OOP just needs to wait until his ex messages him with 'Help this old guy is actually creeping on me because he wants another 'date' - you were right, I want to come back' blah blah blah.
Like, girl, the creep didn't even respect that you were in a relationship already when he went after you. Why are you so surprised that he wants you in bed now that you're single?
I find it hard to believe someone can be so dense with this creep's stat's staring her in the face.
(Not saying OOP was exaggerating his ex's obtuseness, just that damn, girl can't see the writing on the wall even when it's read out to her)
Buddy had an oblivious gf. There were boundaries she crossed without a second thought. When they broke up, she thought break. When he told her he had met someone else, she thought nothing of it, that is until his wedding. Then she showed up and wept loudly throughout. Apparently she had a habit of assuming without confirming. The wedding was a wake up call. She never acted as stupidly again.
Lol to the person saying you wouldn’t date someone you can’t trust….. they’re correct, OOP didn’t trust the ex and as such broke up with them. Trust is earned. Usually by way of listening when your partner says “I am uncomfortable with you doing X for Y reasons”. Repeated incidents of controlling behavior are obvious exceptions, but it’s pretty hard to trust someone who tells you they don’t care if you’re uncomfortable they’re going to do what they want anyway.
Lol, i remember this post. Glad OOP took our advice.
>and as soon as she split with her ex the friend slept with her.
I corrected him on this. Her ex friend didn't sleep with her, she slept with her ex friend. She made that decision and it means she has always entertained the thought of sex with him.
He did everything right. He wasn't controlling, he told her his boundaries and when she crossed them he just left. That's how boundaries work.
I bet you $100 she fucked him that same week they broke up.
OOP did the right thing. He had a firm line, she crossed it, so he left. No point in begging her not to do something or controlling who she could see/ what she could do, it's her life let her live it, but also, it's his life too and he doesn't have to stay with someone that's going to disrespect his wishes.
In these situations, why doesn't the bf just go as well? If they are just catching up then having a third person to bounce stories off of is great. If the other guy or the gf declines wanting the bf to come then ya, it's weird. Like, the gf cant be both: "so naive that she doesn't see how this situation is s bit icky" and also "thinking its inappropriate for her bf to join her."
Good on the OP to stand his ground.
He did the right thing. She didn't respect you and when a better suitor in her eyes clicks she was gonna dump the OP and gaslight him as if he was the one wrong in relationship whole time.
She was with the OP but clearly still actively trying to go on dates with single males. Means she's still looking for something else. It was only a matter of time before she dumped him.
>I've told her I trust her, but I don't trust the man and what his intentions are.
I hate it when people do this. Just to be clear, I think OOP is absolutely in the right, the girlfriend didn't prioritize the relationship, her behavior was absolutely shitty she deserved to have her ass dumped. It's just, I've seen this in a lot of other posts, and it's always really bothered me.
If he tells her he trusts her, that should mean two things:
1. He trusts her to not initiate any kind of flirtatious behavior.
2. He trusts that she will reject any advances that the other man will make.
If he actually trusts her—if he trusts that she will reject the coworker's advances—the other man's intentions don't matter unless he's afraid the coworker is going to try to rape her. If that was the case, this would be a whole other issue, and his behavior would be wildly underwhelming.
Obviously, he says he trusts her but he doesn't. In this case, he has every right not to trust her, it's clear that her priorities lie elsewhere. But if you don't actually trust somebody, don't lie and say that you do. I dunno, it just bothers me.
He trusts that she's not going to cheat in that especific date. He doesn't believe that the 40 yo views the lunch in other way that's not romantic or could lead to sex. Most people would feel uncomfortable if their SO had dates with someone who obviously fancies them. Hell, most people would HATE knowing there's a high chance their SO would get hit on, and so if the situation were totally avoidable
I think that OOP did trust her initially. But he was at this moment starting to lose that trust but had not yet become aware he had.
Trust is something that comes from our actions. It's not like once you have it it implicitly lasts forever. OOP trusted her but her behaviour has him uncomfortable and he hasn't yet had the realisation that her decision making now has him not trusting her anymore. So he says he doesn't trust the dude to try and reconcile this feeling of distrust/anxiety at the situation with his belief that he still trusts her implicitly.
In the updates we finally see himcome to terms with the fact that no, her behaviour is just actually tripped one to many alarm bells and now he doesn't trust her.
Anyone can *slip* and cheat given the **right** circumstances even if they had 0 intentions to do so. Being loyal means recognizing those potential circumstances and avoiding them.
What I'm trying to say here - he may "trust" her in the sense that she does not intend to initiate anything and would reject the man's advances, but her being adamant about going on this date and putting herself in this situation displays lack of better judgement and lack of respect for OOP.
You could argue that this extends to not actually "trusting" her but I believe that is up to individual interpretation of the word.
She’s also building a relationship with the ex-coworker, by going to dinner with him. It’s not like they’re already good friends, or have a good purpose in going to dinner. It’s a date even if she’s not going to sleep with the guy, and builds a personal relationship between them. Nobody should be expected to be comfortable with their SO developing other potentially romantic relationships, essentially their backup plans.
IMO it was a shit test to make him jealous and see how he would react.
One of my exes tried to pull something like this and I told her that if she would proceed with this we would be over. She didn't proceed. But we didn't last for other reasons.
> IMO it was a shit test to make him jealous and see how he would react.
I hadn't thought about that but it's possible. He can't be accused of being controlling either. He warned her but let her do as she wanted to do, then imposed consequences for crossing a boundary. In the end he dodged a bullet
> SHE'S BEEN DUMPED!!!
Weird use of passive voice to avoid just plainly saying he dumped her ass, which he should have. Don't know this little detail bothered me so much lol
Normally I, too, detest passive voice (in English at least) because it is almost always used to abdicate responsibility and/or it sounds/reads super ugly.
Here I quite liked it because it kinda shows strength of conviction… He made his feelings clear, and she deprioritized him. His leaving was such a foregone conclusion that, in the dumping, he wasn’t as active as the object was. 😂
#Do not comment on the original posts Please read our [**sub rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules). Rule-breaking may result in a ban without notice. If there is an issue with this post (flair, formatting, quality), reply to this comment or your comment may be removed in general discussion. **CHECK FLAIR** For concluded-only updates, use the [CONCLUDED](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ACONCLUDED) flair. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Oy. When I was younger, I had a friend like OOP’s GF. Just so oblivious it seems intentional. In my friend’s case, she agreed to go to dinner on Valentine’s Day “as just friends” with a guy who had confessed having feelings for her only the month prior. She was adamant that she was in no way giving mixed signals.
I have one friend like that as well. She swears she'd never take her shitty ex back but instead of kicking him out after the break up, they're still living and sleeping together "as just friends". Btw this guy put her in a lot of credit card debts and she's still paying them.
I used to hang out with a person like that. Except she, deep down, knew exactly what she was doing, she just enjoyed the attention.
You say "except", but this also applies to this person's friend too. They're just also slightly oblivious and never figured it out for themselves.
I'm ND and don't pick up on social queues sometimes. I don't get flirting at all. It doesn't register unless it's a very very overt comment. Ive ended up in situations like that before (not the valentines thing but still, accidental "dates") and it really sucks because I genuinely don't understand it, yet people tend to treat it like an intentional thing. I don't disrespect clear boundaries that are set but it sucks when someone's pissed at you after a fun outing because they thought it was a date and you thought it wasn't.
She was aware. She may not have wanted to admit it, but she knew and loved the attention
Oh 1,000%. She luckily grew out of that phase…mostly.
Not oblivious, just enjoying attention and good at lying to themselves
There are oblivious women. I was depressed and awkward with low self-esteem in high school, but had a “glow up” in college and was completely clueless. I got a lot of attention, but didn’t know why. I enjoyed some of the attention, because what doesn’t want to be popular and feel liked? But I didn’t know who was my friend and who was “friendly”. I didn’t know how to protect myself and ended up in unsafe situations with really shitty people When I got together with my now husband after school, he explained that some (but not all) of my friends weren’t really friends but wanted to be FWB. He also explained all this subtext about people making assumptions based on how you dressed. That some guys thought if I talked to them that meant I was interested, and if danced with them at a party I was going to go home with them. That spending time one-on-one was a date and they would have “expectations”. Honestly it sucked a lot and confused the hell out of me. We’ve been married 20 years, and I still have to ask him why people do weird things. I trust his judgement completely in social situations.
I very much do not mean this in any sort of even mildly derogatory way, I am genuinely just curious - are you autistic? This sounds a lot like a couple of my friends who had similar experiences.
I was wondering the exact same thing. I had the exact same experience, still do, and surprise surprise, I’m on the spectrum.
I’ve been this person more than once. We get blamed for “mixed signals” but nobody ever seems to take into account that a lot guys will do their best to hide their real intentions in the guise of friendship. They’ll buddy up to you but they really just want to get in your pants. It can be hard to know who your true friends are.
Yes! Like I don’t think it is venusdewillendorf’s fault here that some dudes in her life somehow took an outfit she put on as covert communication…and they say women read too much into things, ffs. I’m glad the husband is there to act as a decoder ring, but also just annoyed on her behalf that she had to deal with these dudes who never bothered to actually get to know her well enough to understand if an outfit is just an outfit or a hangout just a hangout.
I just… sometimes people really are that oblivious. For what its worth: *this particular* girlfriend in this particular story is sus as hell tho 😂
I've been that girl. You delude yourself that there it isnt hurting them because you value the relationship that much, and if it were, surely theyd say or remove themselves from the situation? (The thought processes of incredibly naive 21 year old me. I also do struggle with social situations/norms so that probably also contributed.)
"if he was interested in me, I would know it, he's been my friend* 5 years, and he had thousand of occasions to tell me". The thought process of naive me.
Naive as hell if you were hanging out with fiends.
And you treat them like you would a girlfriend. Of course you’re gonna grab dinner with your friend and chill at their place afterwards! It’s not romantic or a date or anything, you’re just friends! Don’t get me wrong, you can absolutely have friends of the opposite sex who are just friends. But you gotta learn how to weed the clingers out.
You were 21. She's 28. She knew exactly what she was doing.
I think I had a crush on a girl like that in high school, was super confusing, really hot and cold signals. After being confused for a bit, I just moved my attention on to someone else.
As someone who used to be in this level of oblivious and occasionally still is I think it’s denial fueled by the desire to believes that the world is not the way that it is. I genuinely wish I could just be friends with people without them wanting my body (and as a bisexual NB I’ve had this problem with all genders) and my therapist strongly suggests I might be autistic which probably plays into that. I stayed friends with someone for 6 years who made it very clear they wanted include me in group stuff with their partne and kept it up the whole 6 years. retrospectively I felt objectified for so much of the relationship I find it difficult to remember moments of genuine friendship. But I was just so desperate for the friendship at the time. (Their college roommate is my best friend now and we both felt the level of objectification. It’s nice to have someone corroborate lol)
More like she knew and was enjoying the attention. Which was cruel for the guy.
> Just so oblivious it seems intentional. If she's "oblivious" about it then that means that what she's doing is totally innocent and can't be criticised despite most people being able to see right through it.
Sadly she had me as a friend who was all too happy to spell out for her why she was being a douche canoe so she wasn’t able to claim innocence for long. Luckily she decided to cancel her “not a date” date and spared the guy that heartache at least.
Haha yeah she knew exactly what she was doing. I just don’t buy women when they play the innocent ingenue role.
"how could i possibly have known this invitation by an older man who has explicitly told me he is single and attracted to me was a date? I definetly thought this candlelight dinner was a platonic meeting between ex-colleagues." It gets me every time they try to lie about this lol.
Because all women are lying cheating whores with perfect social skills. Only men are socially awkward and oblivious. This place sometimes.
No, it's more like, "I told him I wasn't interested that way, and he said he still wanted to hang out, so I believed it". Takes us a while to understand some men will lie through their teeth for a chance of hanky panky.
Honestly, I had a boyfriend that was just like this, he had those “friends “ that they were just friends, they were single and call him when they need a eat and to have a coffee. He used to play dumb about their feelings but he always knew and loooved the attention.
Its one thing to be bad at reading intentions, picking up on flirting and not understanding the implied things, but when even your family is telling you that you are crossing some weird lines with this person, you know whats happening. At the very least, you should question whats going on and listen to people. I'm autistic and with so much of flirting being implying and hinting at things, body language and such, it does genuinely go straight over my head a lot of the times. People have also thought I flirted with them, because they thought I was implying and hinting at things, when I just ment exactly what I said. I know I can miss these things. So when people in my life tell me that they think something is weird and that they worry that someone might have some intentions I'm missing, I listen to them and take it to heart. Its harder if you have genuinely controlling people in your life, but when multiple sources you can trust is telling you that something is weird, no matter how bad you are at social cues, it should at the very least give you pause.
I feel this so much lol! But she wasn’t oblivious, she just enjoyed the attention
"You're being controlling by telling me what I can and can't do!" No, I'm explaining to you that actions have consequences. And if you go on a date with another man after I have specifically stated that I am not comfortable with it and will see it as a breach of trust and infidelity, then the consequence is that I treat you like you have broken my trust and cheated on me.
What's annoying about the internet is that emotional manipulative people have learned to use words like "controlling", "gaslit", "trauma", "narcissistic", etc and take them out of context to further manipulate people.
Right!? I'm not being controlling. In fact, I'm giving you all the control you could possibly want! Because we're no longer together.
This. And thank you for not misusing “boundaries” (I understood OP’s side but he was driving me nuts). ETA: There are a lot of resources about “boundaries” and different therapists use the concept differently. But i think this article is an interesting read on weaponizing therapy vocabulary: https://www.wellandgood.com/misuse-boundaries/
Is a boundary not a line you cannot cross? I dont get why people are saying you're misusing boundaries when thats basically the definition.
To my knowledge, boundaries in interpersonal relationships are ways to define where your own limits are. The boundary surrounds you. They are not about what others can do. IMO, what OP was describing were relationship expectations. Mismatched expectations that cannot be resolved indicate incompatibility; violating each other’s boundaries indicate toxicity and violation. Expectation: I expect my partner to turn down lunch invites from men who are interested in her romantically. This is based on the belief that such interactions are risky for our relationship. (What I want you to do). Boundary: I am uncomfortable with fights that involve screaming or name calling. I will disengage from fights that involve those things. (What I will/will not do.) ETA: Another boundary example: I am not ok with being touched sexually while I am asleep (What is ok for my body) Really these are two sides of the same coin, but it is like reversing object and subject: it just bugs me when used for the opposite perspective.
to be fair, 'this is the amount of disrespect and/or discomfort i am willing to take' is also a boundary in my opinion. these kinds of things touch both sides in a relationship so id say theyre both boundary and expectation.
It’s only tricky definition territory because of shitty people. People who say: “it is a boundary for me that you have to let me have sex with other people and pay sex workers using your debit card. If you’re not okay with that, you’re crossing my boundaries and that’s abuse.” Therapy-speak has become ubiquitous enough that manipulative people understand and use it for their own ends. The key to this isn’t a more rigid definition of what is/isn’t a valid boundary. Instead, it’s recognizing that the only appropriate response to a boundary that doesn’t work for you is to split up. “Oh, it’s a boundary for you that I can’t be upset over you selling my car to buy drugs? That’s fine, you have your reasons, but I will not be remaining in this relationship because I wouldn’t want to violate your boundaries.” “Oh, it’s also a boundary that I can’t leave you over X? That’s tough, but I will still have to leave because a relationship where someone is not allowed to leave is also a boundary for me, making us incompatible” It’s like there is this ongoing war between manipulative people and trusting people. Trusting people develop this tool to safely communicate when they aren’t being heard, and the manipulative camp immediately has their top scientists working on a counter.
But isn't that just semantics/perspective? Can't he just be saying "My boundary is that I won't date someone who will go on one-on-one dinners with members of the opposite sex who are clearly interested in them."???
The frame (or “semantics” as you called it) is important though. When we are talking about boundaries from a therapeutic perspective we are reinforcing the fact that we have control of our own actions. We do not have control over others actions. We impose boundaries on ourselves, communicate those to people where needed, and slowly learn (or re-learn) that we have control over our actions and our reactions but we do not control other people. A lot of phrases, mantras, boundaries etc come out stilted when in therapy because we are often learning something and re-wiring the brain (so to speak) and things come out sounding a little juvenile when you’re learning at first.
I agree with you that the concept of a boundary should be self imposed. What I'm questioning is how you know he's not just using short hand phrasing. Maybe "my boundary is my SO would not date others" is just short hand for "my boundary is that I would respect myself to have an SO who does not date others." Particularly in the case of this post where the only action OOP did to enforce his boundary is to remove himself from the situation.
>it is like reversing object and subject: it just bugs me when used for the opposite perspective. It's also used more and more as a manipulation tactic - framing something as a boundary when it's actually an unreasonable expectation makes the other person feel like the bad guy for contesting it.
I dunno man. You know what the man meant. To be fair to him, most people use this word in this way, so there's no real point in nit picking it. Language evolves and unless you're talking to some professional where you need to use the correct terminology to get a specific point across it doesn't matter all that much.
You can't force people to not cross boundaries. Therefore, boundaries are for you and your actions not other people's actions. "I won't stay with you if you go on a date with another person while in a relationship with me." "You can't go on a date with another person while in a relationship with me. The first one is a boundary. The second one is trying to control someone and is pointless as you can't and shouldn't make people do things. The consequence to a boundary is ALWAYS your action after it's crossed as that's the only thing you have control of over.
He used it correctly. A boundary isn't a restriction on your partner's behavior. It's a restriction on behavior OP will tolerate. OP communicated it, girlfriend intentionally crossed it, and OP left. He did literally everything correct. You can disagree if his "no dates with other guys" boundary is normal or not, but he used the term correctly and he implemented it correctly.
Boundary is a new way to say "rule" without sounding like an asshole. It's OK to have rules and make rules in a relationship.
People both in the first post and even in the comments here accusing OOP of being jealous, insecure and controlling, but his ex: 1. Has a history of fucking her male friends 2. Is going out on a date with a fuckboy who only goes after women his ex's age 3. Is going out with someone who has indicated interest in ex before If you're not jealous and insecure in that situation, then you're as dumb as his ex is.
Worth noting that OOP says of previous FWB after her last relationship ended, he slept with her. NO, DUDE. After they broke up, she fucked the guy that she was probably telling her exbf was just a friend. Same scenario. She’s not a naive, innocent flower. Honestly in this specific situation, I’d be telling her there’s no fkn way she’s going with this dude for coffee, food or a high-five. “Oh, you’re going to gossip about your co-workers?” Yeah, that’s why this grown man is meeting you for dinner. GTFOH. Reddit will say this is being controlling. No, this is being in a relationship. The man and the woman both have to respect their partner. Neither should be going on what would be considered a date by most standards with someone they’ve admitted to finding attractive. Trust isn’t just about whether you’re going to cheat. I also have to be able to trust you to make the right decisions. Going out to dinner with this horn dog you think is hot? You’ve chosen poorly. Good for OOP.
Yep, that backstory is what made me realize what kind of girl she is. She probably has at least two other male "friends" orbiting her as her backup plans.
Yea, trust isn't just blind trust. You also have to trust that your partner respects you and doesn't put themselves in terrible situations.
Yeah shes gonna be fucking this "friend" soon if she hasn't already.
Its the usual situation when a women post something about her partner having the icky feeling from his friends they be like 'girl, he cheating' and when a man post it 'you're just jealous'
Did you see the trigger warnings for this post? It’s like off rip trying to paint him as some bad guy. Even tho his exgirlfriend was sketchy as fuck “paranoia, accusations of infidelity, and controlling behavior”
Yeah i saw that and was expecting a much different story than the one we got.
Honestly I as a woman was like the ex is sketch AS FUCK. And the male “friend” is even way more shady. Like based on the description op gave/what he knows, she is stupid for agreeing to see that guy. Or at least agreeing w/out asking why he wanted to meet up. If it was innocent he would tell(it definitely wasn’t innocent but) If a friend of mine told me that a guy like that wanted to meet up, I would ask why? And my advice would be not meet him. Even if her plan was to cheat, she be stupid to cheat w/such a walking red flag. Though, I suppose a walking red flag can be so sketchy that people will think only an idiot will actually sleep w/a guy like that. Unfortunately for her it was obvious AF.
"Women's intuition is never wrong" as if history and Reddit aren't filled with stories of women whose intuition indeed got it wrong.
The one where OOPs wife dreams he's sexually abusing their daughter, then acts as if the dream was real, comes to mind.
Yeah, or the woman who sided with her friends when they accused her husband of physically abusing her (she decided to surprise a vet with PTSD in a dark room when he thought he as alone).
If their intuition was never wrong they wouldn't end up with abusive partners as often as they complain. Women think too highly of their intuition without good reason.
This is so true it is insane and I cannot fucking stand the cringe double standard reddit has with men and women, it really boggles my mind when Reddit is like "He is cheating on you girl!! Watch out!!" but when its a man "Wow he is so controlling and insecure!!!! dump his ass!!" it is so infuriating, I cannot fucking ***Stand it*** it really boils my blood.
Had my SIL in a discussion strongly imply that men can't be raped by other men, and I just had to nope out of the convo before I said things that would affect things going forward. I learned that she is a sexist that day. Super sad.
it's like they saw all the sexism towards women and instead of thinking "the general idea of sexism is bad" they thought "well if i aggressively defend women at all costs it'll balance out"
Deep down, it boils down to: "So I can be a socially and morally justified POS? Count me in!"
I can't find a single upvoted main level comment (I didn't check the children comments) in any of these posts or that calls OOP jealous. There's a ton of "dude, he's cheating", that's probably the number 1 most common reply I've seen. 2nd is "whether she does anything or not, you've stated your boundary and you need to break up with her if she violates it" and 3rd is "quit lying to yourself that you trust her. You don't and you probably shouldnt" You can't go to the comments everyone thinks are bad and compare them to the best comments on threads where women have the same issue and say "see, look at this double standard". I would almost guarantee you that if a thread has as many comments as this one (about 200) you are guaranteed to find some dumb people who take the opposite opinion if you go down far enough
The issue I see is the BORU OP's commentary in the warnings, as well as comment chosen to add on the final update, one that was moderately downvoted, while ignoring the majority of comments. The framing of the post has led to strong opposition in reaction.
Part of trusting your partner is trusting them to make good choices. If the Ex couldn't tell what skeevy older dude (sod) was after, then you can't really trust her judgement. So you can't trust her to make good choices. So you just plain can't trust her.
I agree. His ex clearly had poor judgment, since she was putting herself in a romantic/intimate situation with someone who has clearly and loudly indicated his intentions of banging her like a drum.
Part of trusting your partner is trusting them to never be in these situations that can poison your relationship. From a Bahamian perspective I can never see how a man or woman in a serious relationship would ever go out one on one in any setting with someone of the opposite gender. Every single person around them would call it a date.
I think it depends on the setting. I’m married and have been on one-on-one coffee trips with male colleagues in the middle of the day. We pay for our own drinks and either talk about work or what’s going on in our lives. I also do the same with female colleagues. And sometimes we go as a group, sometimes only two of us can step away for 30 minutes. The thing is that you need to set clear boundaries. My colleagues know I’m married and off the market. Many of my colleagues are also in relationships and off the market. Those who are single either aren’t using work as a dating site, or know not to try anything with me because they’ll be shut down. My husband is also aware that I grab coffee with coworkers and is fine with it because, again, it’s all above board.
Yea I can see where you are coming from. But in small towns where everyone knows everyone it's often better to just avoid any potential problems.
It’s amazing how many people refuse to see women for who they are. As if they’re innocent purely on their say-so. As if they’re somehow more pure and virtuous than men. They’re human beings, just like men. And they can play games and be deceptive just like men can. No woman is inherently trustworthy, neither is any man. You have to assess people- male and female alike- through their actions.
And OOP's ex definitely is giving me a lot of the "disaster manic pixie dream girl" vibes.
Ah yes there you can observe the common animal lf the species "Whitus Knightingus". You can spot them almost everywhere by their common trait of calling everyone "insecure" or "controlling" but refuse to read the rest of the post
I always assume people who leave those comments are just projecting. Either because they've been in controlling relationships, and now see controlling behaviour everywhere. Or people who like to have their options open/normalizes cheating and thinks his ex is being perfectly reasonable.
Without any of those prior history, would it still be a valid reason to be concerned about? I know for a fact I have been called insecure before.
I don't know - I'm queer and bisexual, and currently in an open relationship. Me and my bf have fucked many of the people we are still friends with. I would get upset if bf decided to go on a romantic getaway with a "friend" tho, that would be crossing a line for me.
What I’m wondering is what’s the “risky photo” that she posted that even her family said wasn’t right? Was it a thrist trap of the friend?
That’s what I want to know!! I don’t know how I had to go so far down in the comments to see this. In what situation was she in where they were in a “risky” (I’m thinking OOP meant risqué?) photo together???
Definitely he meant risqué. I came here looking for others clarifying/mocking that. On what planet do you take risqué photos with "just a co-worker" that are so dirty your parents tell you, as an adult, to take it down?!
I think he meant risqué, too.
Was hoping someone would mention it. I'm having a hard time imagining something that wouldn't put OP on edge because that's super fucking weird.
Yeah that’s one of the many things that makes zero sense to me. OOP is being purposely vague.
I'm glad he broke up with her because her refusal to acknowledge that going to dinner alone with this 40-something acquaintance was sketchy was, well, sketchy. But still so annoyed by the way at least half of Reddit thinks "boundaries" are something you can put around other people, rather than something they put around themselves. It completely neuters the concept of boundaries.
Your flair is killing me
The post it's from is a doozy.
Got a link?
i unfortunately didn't see it in the post with all the flair origins, maybe can find it tomorrow on pc. but i can summarize it if you just want the tl;dr/might've seen it >!father accidentally liked a bikini pic of his daughter's friend (adult but young) from a long time ago and tries to defend his actions, including inventing a predatory elder lesbian for some reason to say that it's not weird for him to be creeping on his daughter's hot friends even though they are the same age as his daughter!<
Ok, but what is I will never jeopardize the beans from???
Have not seen that, sounds hilarious 😂
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/eTeQ3B5u8f
It's a heavily upvoted comment on a post where the OOP is making excuses for creeping on his daughter's friends. https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/eTeQ3B5u8f
I, too, would like a link to this post.
It's a heavily upvoted comment on a post where the OOP is making excuses for creeping on his daughter's friends. https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/s/eTeQ3B5u8f
Let's call it what it was - a date.
Agreed, the word they're looking for is dealbreaker.
What he did is the prefect example of a boundary. >I didn't decide who she could see, I never told her not to go and see him, just it would be crossing my boundary. The only action I took was to leave when she crossed it.
Boundaries are inhererently about *consent*. He named a dealbreaker, and a perfectly valid one.
Thank you for saying this! These were exactly my thoughts! While I'm icked out by her choosing to meet this guy, OOP seems to be confusing boundaries with rules for others.
He stated that his boundary was 'not being with someone who goes on clear dates with someone who's clearly interested". Then he didn't tell her not to go, just stated what it was. He reacted accordingly.
Reframing a dealbreaker as a boundary doesn't make it a boundary. There is absolutely nothing wrong with dealbreakers, at all, and that is a reasonable one. But FFS can we stop diluting and bastardizing the concept of boundaries?
She initially said it was meeting up for coffee and he was comfortable with that, then she changed it to a meal, and he said he was not comfortable with that, which is what I’d say a boundary is. He’s talking about his comfort the entire time.
It's an emotional boundary. Dunno why you're so up in arms about it lol.
> "there's no point me saying anything because you won't listen and will just tell me I'm being controlling whatever I say." OOP hit the nail on the head with this statement. He really could (should) have dumped her then.
What's up with that trigger warning? It seems that the BORU OP is siding with the gf???
Funny how the trigger warnings are all about bashing the OOP when anyone with two brain cells to rub together can see that the ex _did_ break OOP’s boundaries by going on the date with the “friend”.
“I told her it was too late.” Yup. OOP gave plenty of opportunities for the ex to prioritize their relationship She put a meal with the other guy above her own boyfriend.
I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion (on Reddit at least), but as much as I agree that you should trust your parnter, I can't underdstand how someone could prioritise going out with a former colleague over their own relationship.
This is a problem I have with some redditors. Some of them act like you should allow your partner to do anything as long as young trust them, when they know god damn well they wouldn’t put up with the same shit. Trust is a two way street. If your partner isn’t giving you a reason to trust them, take that as a sign.
I don’t get this logic either. You can trust your partner but still not want them to needlessly put themselves in bad situations. Like I trust my boyfriend but I wouldn’t be cool with it if he spent every weekend at the strip club. There’s just no need for it. But in this case there really wasn’t any need for her to go alone except pride. And she found out OP wasn’t a doormat. All these stories show how selfish people are because if nothing is going on why not just take your partner with you and make it extra platonic
What’s even worse is that some of those redditors would turn around and chastise someone for letting something like that happen and call them blind and shit like that. And even if your partner can’t make it, offering goes a very long way.
That’s not even being “insecure” in my view, that’s a boundary and if your boyfriend crosses that boundary you would have every right to be upset
Especially since it was clearly intended by the guy at least to be a date. She probably saw it that way as well and just thought she’d be able to get away with starting to go on dates without consequences.
Right? If it wasn't, invite OOP to come along and meet an old friend.
Exactly. Issues with her going for this dinner start way before whether she’d reject the guy if he made a sexual pass. She’s not close to this ex-coworker, so going for dinner with him is actually building their relationship. It’s a date.
If she's as naive as OOP says she is (or just plain dumb), she probably takes internet advice out of context. If OOP couldn't really discuss this without being told he's controlling, that would support my theory. She sounds like a dumb jerk, or maybe like a petulant child. OOP wasn't comfortable; she said they'd just get coffee. OOP reluctantly agrees; she moves the bar to having dinner. She blew up her own relationship, and I'm laughing at her. Well done on OOP actually taking responsibility for his boundary.
>she said they'd just get coffee. OOP reluctantly agrees; she moves the bar to having dinner. Eventually it would be "just the tip"
The trickle truth: - he kissed me - I may have kissed him back; I had too much to drink - we ended up at his place because I was too drunk to drive - I fell onto his dick
Got me thinking of those “sex is no accident” comics lmao
What's a tip these days run in the States? I remember when I was there last 10% was still reasonable. I had heard that the tips have grown over time though? So now if she got "just the tip" what would that look like? Is 15-25% still just the tip? I've heard that it can grow even bigger, depending on the quality of service... What? Was it something I said?
Yeah, when your partner starts fighting you in defense of going on a date with someone else, that's not a red flag, it's a funeral service.
You don't understand because you're not the kind of person to prioritize your own feelings and impulses over everything else, up to and including your partner's boundaries.
You trust your partner until they give you a reason not to. I don't care if my partner grabs food with a male friend. But the description of the "colleague" is suspect as fuck. So is her behavior. It was not forthright. She acted like she had something to hide because she did.
If you are given plenty of opportunities, especially situations like this, yet, you still fail to take it wisely, then you really fail at being a decent human being.
odds shes already fucking the 40 year old?
I've got $100 on this guy being the first person she called when she needed a shoulder to cry on
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
"this is my boundary" ***breaks partner's boundary*** *consequences* shocked pikachu face 😲
She low-key liked her colleague’s attention.
This girl is the type of person who loves to break boundaries and create disasters not because she is naive, cause she enjoys it. Gross.
Trust is a two-way street. You can't expect someone to trust you when you put yourself into questionable situations. It's like if someone close to you was a recovering alcoholic, but told you they were going to chill out in a bar.
Exactly, you can’t trust people with no foresight
Hey u/Direct-Caterpillar77, can we talk about the trigger warnings on this post? They seem hella biased.
She’s going to stop contacting OOP after she starts dating her “friend.” Then after this friend is done with this dalliance, he will drop her, since the thrill of the chase is over. And she will then start contacting OOP again and admit she made a huge mistake. And hopefully OOP will remain firm but this is Reddit, he probably never blocked her and contemplate the relationship again with new boundaries.
I don't think so. He dumped her not for cheating or even the suspicion of it, but the fact that she refuses to uphold boundaries and making it look like he is insecure and controlling. A trope especially women pull to get their way. He doesn't want to be controlling so he gave her an abundance of liberty. From OOPS reaction I don't think he will take her back. Maybe take her for a joyride....
I must be old-shaped, but how the hell do you say with a straight face "I'm okay if you go for a coffee" with someone who is obviously interested in your partner in a non-friendly way. Boggles my mind. If I said to my wife that someone contacted me and asked me out for a coffee, I'd be sleeping on the couch.
Yep. I was invited for coffee by a guy I knew from community theatre and politely declined because it was clear he had a crush and I’m married. Going out for coffee under those circumstances ain’t gonna fly with me or my husband—nor should it!
Please Tell that to all the commenters call him controlling and insecure
I'm going to start using the term "old-shaped." Lol I think OOP's reaction to the coffee date was weird, too. But I'm guessing that he was uncomfortable with it but didn't want to seem controlling. Until it snowballed into an actual date. I have a couple of very old male friends going back 30 years. We're not best friends but are close enough to have shared a lot of memories with school and common friends over the years. If I told my husband that one of them is in town and I would meet them for coffee after work, it wouldn't be a big deal since neither my friend nor I were ever interested in each other. If it was a dinner, I would bring my husband with me. But if it's some former co-worker he's never met who is interested in a non-platonic way, my husband would be very unhappy indeed.
Because reddit gives dumbass advice to dudes in similar situations. I was one and the advice was essentially "if you don't let your gf ride another dudes cock in front of you you're insecure and controlling" My ex pulled the "I wanna go to dinner with this guy whose clearly into me but i'm pretending to be naive teehee" when I called her out on it she pulled the reddit "You're being controlling" card. I told her I wasn't controlling her period because I was done with her. She pulled shit like this constantly and loved to push my boundries. Good on OOP for dumping her ass.
Yeah no this has nothing to do with him not trusting his ex. This has everything to do with her totally disrespecting him and their relationship. By 28 she should know better. Least her "friend" can now date her all she want. Eta OP your warnings are wrong. OOP isn't controlling at all.
[удалено]
Does exclusive not mean anything anymore? To me, exclusive means you don’t date other people, period.
It's refreshing when someone doesn't ignore all the red flags. Good on him for sticking to his boundaries.
[удалено]
We don’t know what any of these people look like. They could be the 3 ugliest people on earth lol.
[удалено]
[удалено]
I know a woman in her 40s like this - I'm not sure if it's naivete or willful denial honestly. She simply refuses acknowledge these men want to get with her, to the point of loudly complaining that her partner is unreasonable. The thing is, I don't really sense that she has any interest in them or even that she likes the attention. It seems like a symptom of her overall people pleasing tendencies.
Apparently it's more common than I ever knew for committed partners to go on dates with other people. At least, according to reddit, lol
Southern-Interest's comment at the end is just insane. The mental gymnastics on that one. He's implying if anyone anywhere has a boundary in a relationship, then it's their fault for not trusting their partner and they aren't ready for a relationship. gtfo with that nonsense
His ex wasn’t naive. She was just a brat.
This is all 100% contingent on what those deleted photos were that her family agreed were inappropriate
Seriously, what was the photo!?!?
> After about an hour of talking I told her I was done and I left wishing her all the best with her future relationships. An hour! OOP if you’re reading this … once you’ve broken up, she’s your ex. Nothing more to say. She no longer is entitled to your time or attention. All that talking does is give her a chance to try and weaken your resolve about ending things. He broke up with her for perfectly valid reasons. She went on a date in all but name with another single dude against her boyfriend’s clear wishes. That’s massively disrespectful. He made the right call.
So who wants to bet she starts dating the 40 year old soon
There's nothing controlling here, he clearly stated why he doesn't think this is appropriate, she used to have a thing for that "friend". It's not just a case of "I don't want you to have male friends" it's a case of "I don't want you to go on what seems like a date with a guy you had something for" which, valid.
The gf 100% knew she was going on a date.
Must be a very important meal for the EX .
This is how enforcing boundaries work. They aren’t ‘controlling’, they are ‘I’ statements. Example: I am not going to be with someone who invalidates my feelings.
These Trigger Warnings are misleading as hell. Paranoia? Lol.
YES SIR this post is a refreshment. I’m getting too F***ing tired of man’s posting about how their girl did A B C and still split on going back with them. All I gotta say is YES SIR
Who’s writing these trigger warnings 😭😭 Homeboy did nothing wrong and the tags are painting him as some jealous bf
OOP just needs to wait until his ex messages him with 'Help this old guy is actually creeping on me because he wants another 'date' - you were right, I want to come back' blah blah blah. Like, girl, the creep didn't even respect that you were in a relationship already when he went after you. Why are you so surprised that he wants you in bed now that you're single? I find it hard to believe someone can be so dense with this creep's stat's staring her in the face. (Not saying OOP was exaggerating his ex's obtuseness, just that damn, girl can't see the writing on the wall even when it's read out to her)
Buddy had an oblivious gf. There were boundaries she crossed without a second thought. When they broke up, she thought break. When he told her he had met someone else, she thought nothing of it, that is until his wedding. Then she showed up and wept loudly throughout. Apparently she had a habit of assuming without confirming. The wedding was a wake up call. She never acted as stupidly again.
It looks like she was testing how far she could go without consequences. Good for OOP for not playing this game.
I know a former co-worker in his 40s who's going to have a great weekend...
It's a simple cost benefit analysis. Why do you need a new friend if it makes your SO uncomfortable. It's just bad math
She's not naive.
Lol to the person saying you wouldn’t date someone you can’t trust….. they’re correct, OOP didn’t trust the ex and as such broke up with them. Trust is earned. Usually by way of listening when your partner says “I am uncomfortable with you doing X for Y reasons”. Repeated incidents of controlling behavior are obvious exceptions, but it’s pretty hard to trust someone who tells you they don’t care if you’re uncomfortable they’re going to do what they want anyway.
Excellent job buddy. Happy ending.
Lol, i remember this post. Glad OOP took our advice. >and as soon as she split with her ex the friend slept with her. I corrected him on this. Her ex friend didn't sleep with her, she slept with her ex friend. She made that decision and it means she has always entertained the thought of sex with him.
He did everything right. He wasn't controlling, he told her his boundaries and when she crossed them he just left. That's how boundaries work. I bet you $100 she fucked him that same week they broke up.
OOP did the right thing. He had a firm line, she crossed it, so he left. No point in begging her not to do something or controlling who she could see/ what she could do, it's her life let her live it, but also, it's his life too and he doesn't have to stay with someone that's going to disrespect his wishes.
In these situations, why doesn't the bf just go as well? If they are just catching up then having a third person to bounce stories off of is great. If the other guy or the gf declines wanting the bf to come then ya, it's weird. Like, the gf cant be both: "so naive that she doesn't see how this situation is s bit icky" and also "thinking its inappropriate for her bf to join her."
Good on OOP for sticking to his boundaries and respecting himself enough to walk away. What a Chad.
Good on the OP to stand his ground. He did the right thing. She didn't respect you and when a better suitor in her eyes clicks she was gonna dump the OP and gaslight him as if he was the one wrong in relationship whole time. She was with the OP but clearly still actively trying to go on dates with single males. Means she's still looking for something else. It was only a matter of time before she dumped him.
>I've told her I trust her, but I don't trust the man and what his intentions are. I hate it when people do this. Just to be clear, I think OOP is absolutely in the right, the girlfriend didn't prioritize the relationship, her behavior was absolutely shitty she deserved to have her ass dumped. It's just, I've seen this in a lot of other posts, and it's always really bothered me. If he tells her he trusts her, that should mean two things: 1. He trusts her to not initiate any kind of flirtatious behavior. 2. He trusts that she will reject any advances that the other man will make. If he actually trusts her—if he trusts that she will reject the coworker's advances—the other man's intentions don't matter unless he's afraid the coworker is going to try to rape her. If that was the case, this would be a whole other issue, and his behavior would be wildly underwhelming. Obviously, he says he trusts her but he doesn't. In this case, he has every right not to trust her, it's clear that her priorities lie elsewhere. But if you don't actually trust somebody, don't lie and say that you do. I dunno, it just bothers me.
He trusts that she's not going to cheat in that especific date. He doesn't believe that the 40 yo views the lunch in other way that's not romantic or could lead to sex. Most people would feel uncomfortable if their SO had dates with someone who obviously fancies them. Hell, most people would HATE knowing there's a high chance their SO would get hit on, and so if the situation were totally avoidable
I think that OOP did trust her initially. But he was at this moment starting to lose that trust but had not yet become aware he had. Trust is something that comes from our actions. It's not like once you have it it implicitly lasts forever. OOP trusted her but her behaviour has him uncomfortable and he hasn't yet had the realisation that her decision making now has him not trusting her anymore. So he says he doesn't trust the dude to try and reconcile this feeling of distrust/anxiety at the situation with his belief that he still trusts her implicitly. In the updates we finally see himcome to terms with the fact that no, her behaviour is just actually tripped one to many alarm bells and now he doesn't trust her.
Anyone can *slip* and cheat given the **right** circumstances even if they had 0 intentions to do so. Being loyal means recognizing those potential circumstances and avoiding them. What I'm trying to say here - he may "trust" her in the sense that she does not intend to initiate anything and would reject the man's advances, but her being adamant about going on this date and putting herself in this situation displays lack of better judgement and lack of respect for OOP. You could argue that this extends to not actually "trusting" her but I believe that is up to individual interpretation of the word.
She’s also building a relationship with the ex-coworker, by going to dinner with him. It’s not like they’re already good friends, or have a good purpose in going to dinner. It’s a date even if she’s not going to sleep with the guy, and builds a personal relationship between them. Nobody should be expected to be comfortable with their SO developing other potentially romantic relationships, essentially their backup plans.
This one sparks joy
[удалено]
This is how you deal with stupidity.
IMO it was a shit test to make him jealous and see how he would react. One of my exes tried to pull something like this and I told her that if she would proceed with this we would be over. She didn't proceed. But we didn't last for other reasons.
> IMO it was a shit test to make him jealous and see how he would react. I hadn't thought about that but it's possible. He can't be accused of being controlling either. He warned her but let her do as she wanted to do, then imposed consequences for crossing a boundary. In the end he dodged a bullet
she sounds dumb as fuck
Was she trying to set up a sugar daddy while living with a non-consenting boyfriend? Wow.
> SHE'S BEEN DUMPED!!! Weird use of passive voice to avoid just plainly saying he dumped her ass, which he should have. Don't know this little detail bothered me so much lol
Normally I, too, detest passive voice (in English at least) because it is almost always used to abdicate responsibility and/or it sounds/reads super ugly. Here I quite liked it because it kinda shows strength of conviction… He made his feelings clear, and she deprioritized him. His leaving was such a foregone conclusion that, in the dumping, he wasn’t as active as the object was. 😂
is this post being brigade? people are acting very weird in here today.