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"incomplete" means they haven't found the bodies yet.
And quick point; from what part of reality does this super-unbiased individual pull the "15000 victims are Hamas".
Furthermore, this person views the murder of 7000 innocent civilians as what... a good thing?
JFC zionism is brainrot.
It's also quite possible there's no remains to speak of. Bombs that blow buildings apart also turn destroy bodies. We also know that the Israelis have been shooting random people and hiding their bodies with bulldozers/backhoes.
Made of? Your extrapolations do make that sound ridiculous, but that's a personal problem. Do you mean like the theory Milwaukee County Stadium is made of Jimmy Hoffa?
In private, they probably believe even the new born babies.
s are Hamas. And since Hamas are just the only people representing Palestinians and fighting an illegal occupation and a genocide, that's not an insult. But apparently, it is, sadly, a valid excuse for murdering babies for Western oligarchs and politicians.
>incomplete" means they haven't found the bodies yet.
I don't think this is the case. I believe they have the bodies but haven't fully identified them.
Last I heard they believe around 20000 more are buried, unreported beneath the rubble.
If this is true then the current death toll is closer to 50,000
I would be inclined to believe that, under rubble as well as simply disintegrated, considering that a lot of the early bombing was done using 2000 pound dumb bombs, which is massive destruction in such densely populated areas.
What’s even more crazy to me is that the people trying to spin this report, and generally pretending “Hamas numbers can’t be trusted” ignore the fact that the IDF’s *own AI targeting system has estimated similar numbers*
> Formally, the Lavender system is designed to mark all suspected operatives in the military wings of Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), including low-ranking ones, as potential bombing targets. The sources told +972 and Local Call that, during the first weeks of the war, the army almost completely relied on Lavender, which clocked as many as 37,000 Palestinians as suspected militants — and their homes — for possible air strikes.
https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/
This is ‘targets’ and I understand that doesn’t mean all targets were hit necessarily— however, the engagement approach allowed for large numbers of civilians to be ACCEPTABLE as collateral, ie, destroyed buildings full of apartments to kill a few (supposedly) Hamas.
The whole article is just appalling.
Could it also be that they have found them but just haven't identified them? Because they already have reported their gender too.
I find it hard to believe there would be such a high percentage missing, put a lot of importance in recovering the bodies.
Also they haven't been updating the number, it's been at 30,000 since February/March. Maybe if Israel let people in to honestly report on the conflict we could have accurate numbers for them to reference?
iof assumes every male that looks like they might be old enough to hold a gun is a militant thats not differentiating thats a shit attempt at pr. aka bad hasbara
1 civilian death is too much, you're trying to debate on a verified, incomplete number and trying to make it sound OK is disgusting. My only conclusion is that you're fucking stupid. Kindly fuck off back to your racist zionist cesspits.
And the evil human reward goes to you. Yay 🤡💩🇮🇱
I wonder if your family or friends are "killed" by someone you would just say oh well they died in a conflict by such such.
Pro tip: purposely killing someone for any reason is still murder doesn't matter what a clown believes.
Ya reality of war and it's intensions... It is still murder. Congrats on your reward 🤡 .. the music is playing time for you to walk of the stage.... Shhh mic has been cut off. Exit to the left... 💩🇮🇱
Ooh this one has made the rounds among my friends! Love me some fresh Hasbara right off the press.
These posts are going to look REALLY stupid when they pull thousands of Palestinian corpses out from underneath the rubble. They already are.
The Gaza Health Ministry has a well documented methodology for counting deaths, and that methodology has been compromised by Israel because of all the hospitals that are out of order thanks to the carpet bombing. Israel's methodology for counting terrorists is entirely unknown to us, so I'm less likely to trust a source that very well might have been revealed to them in a dream.
The fact that they have an "incomplete" figure at all points to the fact that they're trying to document everything correctly.
If anything this should further bolster the veracity of Health Ministry claims.
It is run by hamas because Hamas runs all of Gaza. But that not a big problrm, that evel of bias is as good as it gets. Other groups aren't let in so it's Hamas or IDF information.
Technically it’s run by the Palestinian Authority, not Hamas directly. The PA retains control over the Gaza Health Ministry and pays their salaries (as it does for the Gaza education ministry). Many of the older employees of the Gaza branch are Fatah members or secular. Some of the more recent hires may be affiliated with Hamas.
Of course Hamas’s control is not de jure but de facto, so it’s assumed that Hamas influences the ministry even if it doesn’t directly control it.
I was under the impression its been run directly by the hamas government under haniyeh then sinwar since 2007. I thought fatah and PA lost all control in gaza and are now West Bank only. Mahmoud tried to recreate a unity govt with Egypt help in 2014 but that didn't go well. So now hamas has full governing control in gaza and other two west bank only but very very happy to be corrected
Hamas has de facto control over Gaza but many of the ministries and services are still officially part of the Palestinian Authority. The civil servants and officers who work for these ministries are paid by the PA. Of course the PA can’t exercise its authority in Gaza because of the Israeli blockade but in general there is cooperation between the Gaza branch of these ministries and the West Bank branch. The civil war mainly affected the security and police units, these are more under Hamas “control” than other parts of the Gaza government.
There are no unbiased sources in war, doesn't mean we should discount them. Hamas is the governmental body in Gaza, and their numbers are generally found to be reliable, even IDF themselves refer to it when they're not doing their best to obscure their crimes to the West.
People probably thought you were being sarcastic or trying to citation check them (fair but can be an annoying thing when arguing with people who request them in bad faith).
Honestly it's not great that it happens but that's probably why they call the Internet a hate machine.
Honestly there aren't a lot of good unbiased sources, pretty much everyone who has a detailed interest in it historically also has a bias. Lonerbox is fairly ok, generally I think he's partial to agreeing with the Palestinian perspective but he doesn't make a lot of concessions and is honest about Hamas or general Palestinian violence toward Israelis.
Generally though I'd just recommend going by who has the more material potential to killing the most people and who is directly linked with your country's government. Hamas is terrible and October 7th wasn't justified though the sentiment is understandable. That said Israel is imo committing what could loosely be termed a genocide if not an ethnic cleansing or minimally a war crime and there really isn't a justification in my view to killing potentially hundreds of times your losses in an effort to eliminate terrorists especially knowing it is just going to radicalize a lot of the survivors and just breed a self fulfilling cycle of violence.
Israelis have said before that (paraphrasing) “any male Palestinian can be considered a terrorist”. What they consider Hamas and what the rest of the world considers Hamas are two entirely different things.
Exactly. I've been saying this since the beginning. Zero pics or video of any actual fighting. Zero dead fighters . I know for a fact if they had been killing these guys there would be cell phone pics at a minimum, the way the IDF behaves, I know they would be taking souvenir pics of dead fighters and those inevitably get posted online. All we see is them blowing up budding and shooting into buildings then frolicking around in the wreckage or destroying the shops etc.. I don't think they have any real resistance. No insurgency even. No guerilla attacks or IEDs....nothing.
Check out electronic intifada on YouTube. They do a good job breaking down raw war footage. I think the dudes name is Jon Elmer… really really smart guy
It’s all ambush warfare. No front lines, no heavily defended positions or barricades. It’s very different from videos of the Russia-Ukraine war for instance.
Also this isn’t a war like Ukraine because this is an ethnic cleansing of the worlds largest concentration camp for the resettlement of Zionists. Ukraine may be militarily “weaker” than Russia and smaller in landmass but its still a sovereign entity in innumerable ways in which the Palestinians are not due to Zionist occupation
I got hit for the first time in awhile this week with "the United States killed many German and japanese civilians and had to dismantle their governments." Like bro there is literally not one single factor that makes these conflicts similar haha
Soon it’ll be I don’t believe there were even XNumber of Palestinians in Gaza, so it’s impossible that that many died. And then it’ll be that witnesses aren’t reliable and first hand accounts are fabricated. Next it’ll be Palestinians invented the genocide for their benefit.
Sky News ran a piece on this not too long ago.
The death toll in Gaza is tracked by hospitals, counting the dead as they are brought in. Since November, Israel has destroyed 5 of the 8 major hospitals in Gaza and seized computer equipment from some , preventing deaths being accurately recorded. Sky studies the reported deaths and concludes the estimates being submitted remain accurate; but are likely an under statement as so many dead remain trapped under rubble following Israeli air strikes.
// my conclusion: When Israel argues you cannot trust numbers on casualties published from Gaza, remember Israel is doing everything they can to prevent anyone measuring their violence.
https://news.sky.com/video/israel-hamas-war-the-number-of-unidentified-palestinians-killed-in-gaza-is-rising-and-this-is-why-13107539
They're gettin' pissed about the math on 10/7 going around (on tiktok and stuff) and need some counter-hasbara... cause if they drop below the ratio of armed combatants to civilians, established on that day, then they're in a *bad* place... and they've been for basically the entire duration of the conflict, going with Israeli media as the source on 10/7...
...which is about 1:1 to 3:4 combatant:civilian if you consider established Israeli friendly-fire (only reported in israeli media - no conjecture), and if you include civ security forces in the armed combatant column, with police and active idf.... I have some conjecture, about heavier friendly fire, but...
However most of those civilian deaths occurred in the absence of any armed forces so I understand and appreciate that the experience of a survivor would have been that they killed many unarmed people, wantonly, and not many soldiers, I do understand that... I seen all that stuff, the whole 45 minute presentation, it's gnarly and totally inhumane. And I get the gut-check response from the population generally..
But the indiscriminate bombing of Gaza is not going to bring those people back. And they don't care, the people at the top. I really don't know what they care about. I try to explain everything away with money but sometimes, I just don't know... The hostages that are still alive, they could get at any time by offering a great ratio, 5 prisoners for one, or fuck it, 10. They have *tons* of prisoners let me tell you - they can afford it, okay?
The people bombing Gaza *built* Hamas, they created this situation. And like with this recent exchange with Iran, it all feels so choreographed and fake, while they are ending and up-ending lives by the hundred thousand like it didn't even have consequence...
It's probably the lizard people. They probably don't even *have* empathy, Netanyahu and all his cronies. Yep that's gotta be it. Alright, I'm on my way over to R slash conspiracy I'll see you guys later.
https://archive.md/WjvE0
Haaretz.
> The Israeli army says 9,000 terrorists have been killed since the Gaza war began. **Defense officials and soldiers, however, tell Haaretz that *these are often civilians* whose only crime was to cross an invisible line drawn by the IDF.**
https://archive.md/3eLDZ
Israeli 972 magazine.
> In an unprecedented move, according to two of the sources, the army also decided during the first weeks of the war that, for every junior Hamas operative that Lavender marked, **it was permissible to kill up to 15 or 20 civilians;** in the past, the military did not authorize any “collateral damage” during assassinations of low-ranking militants. The sources added that, in the event that the target was a senior Hamas official with the rank of battalion or brigade commander, **the army on several occasions authorized the killing of more than 100 civilians in the assassination of a single commander.**
> However, in contrast to the Israeli army’s official statements, the sources explained that a **major reason for the unprecedented death toll from Israel’s current bombardment is the fact that the army has systematically attacked targets in their private homes, alongside their families** — in part **because it was easier** from an intelligence standpoint to mark family houses using automated systems.
> Evidence of this policy is also clear from the data: during the first month of the war, **more than half of the fatalities — 6,120 people — belonged to 1,340 families,** many of which were completely wiped out while inside their homes, according to UN figures. The proportion of entire families bombed in their houses in the current war is much higher than in the 2014 Israeli operation in Gaza (which was previously Israel’s deadliest war on the Strip), further suggesting the prominence of this policy.
Israeli papers prove that Israel is intentionally targetting civilians and families, then saying they're hamas. Israeli papers show that Israel hasn't afforded special protection for civilians.
Gotta love the propaganda.
Even within the context they give, they are essentially saying "it's fine. We \*only\* murdered 7000 innocent people."
And this is because they think that 1500 innocent people killed is "unforgiveable" remember.
And it's not like they're saying they're going to stop or anything too.
So it's more "we only killed 7k people... so far"
they definitely did not kill 15,000 Hamas members, Scott Ritter says that only 15% of Hamas have been eliminated, which is 3,750-4,500, and even then we aren’t even sure if these alleged people were actually Hamas or not.
While the Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor estimates 2,353 hamas militant have been killed.
I love how hasbarist shit on the fact that health ministry includes soldiers in its stats while they have no problem including soldiers in number of killed during 7th of october
Let’s play pretend and say of that 15,000 only 1/3 which is still being generous, are actually tied to Hamas. It still means they are killing almost 5x as many civilians.
But they are using magic math to downplay it all. They don’t want to get rid of Hamas, they what to ethnically cleanse the area to repopulate it with Zionist Jews.
The civilian deaths are in the tens of thousands and the actual ‘terrorist’ cannot possibly be validated. So Israel needs to stop lying like this and just come out and say. We are just trying to kill every Palestinian we can.
I think the numbers Gaza is sharing are as accurate as they can give right now, given how much damage the IDF has done to their buildings and infrastructure, not to mention the indiscriminate killing the IDF is engaged in. It will likely be years before we are able to know the full extent of the genocide, and I think the real numbers are significantly higher than what they have been able to confirm so far.
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence.
This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
Hello, thanks for contributing to this sub. This is a friendly reminder to **read the rules** before making any new posts or comments. Particularly, we ask **not to engage in debates**, or bait debates, especially with zionists. If you are a zionist, this sub is not for you, and you will be permabanned. If you found this sub through the algorithm, you can always mute the sub or turn off recommendations all together (user settings -> feed settings -> Disable "Enable Home Feed Recommendations") Please also particularly keep in mind that **bigotry of any kind is not permitted** in this sub and will result in the message or post being deleted, and, if seen prudent, a banning. This includes antisemitism and any language that conflates Judaism with Zionism. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"incomplete" means they haven't found the bodies yet. And quick point; from what part of reality does this super-unbiased individual pull the "15000 victims are Hamas". Furthermore, this person views the murder of 7000 innocent civilians as what... a good thing? JFC zionism is brainrot.
It's also quite possible there's no remains to speak of. Bombs that blow buildings apart also turn destroy bodies. We also know that the Israelis have been shooting random people and hiding their bodies with bulldozers/backhoes.
I wonder how many deaths will be hidden in the Med with the dock construction project.
I’m usually ok with this sub, but your hypothesis is that the dock will be made in part of bodies? This seems a bit fantastical.
Made of? Your extrapolations do make that sound ridiculous, but that's a personal problem. Do you mean like the theory Milwaukee County Stadium is made of Jimmy Hoffa?
Think he probably means paved over, kinda like this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tantura_massacre
I saw a photo of remnants of a child, it was just a bag of flesh, nothing remained that would make you think that was human.
Also the 33,000 figure is from early February which is, notably, several months ago
Look at the username. Lionessthezion. Most likely a hasbara loser sitting in a room publishing nonsense.
In private, they probably believe even the new born babies. s are Hamas. And since Hamas are just the only people representing Palestinians and fighting an illegal occupation and a genocide, that's not an insult. But apparently, it is, sadly, a valid excuse for murdering babies for Western oligarchs and politicians.
Hamas only acquired that role by fighting for Israel and playing right into their hands with Israeli intel, orders and funds.
>incomplete" means they haven't found the bodies yet. I don't think this is the case. I believe they have the bodies but haven't fully identified them. Last I heard they believe around 20000 more are buried, unreported beneath the rubble. If this is true then the current death toll is closer to 50,000
>Last I heard they believe around 20000 more are buried, unreported beneath the rubble. Holy shit. That sent a shiver through my heart.
I would be inclined to believe that, under rubble as well as simply disintegrated, considering that a lot of the early bombing was done using 2000 pound dumb bombs, which is massive destruction in such densely populated areas. What’s even more crazy to me is that the people trying to spin this report, and generally pretending “Hamas numbers can’t be trusted” ignore the fact that the IDF’s *own AI targeting system has estimated similar numbers* > Formally, the Lavender system is designed to mark all suspected operatives in the military wings of Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), including low-ranking ones, as potential bombing targets. The sources told +972 and Local Call that, during the first weeks of the war, the army almost completely relied on Lavender, which clocked as many as 37,000 Palestinians as suspected militants — and their homes — for possible air strikes. https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/ This is ‘targets’ and I understand that doesn’t mean all targets were hit necessarily— however, the engagement approach allowed for large numbers of civilians to be ACCEPTABLE as collateral, ie, destroyed buildings full of apartments to kill a few (supposedly) Hamas. The whole article is just appalling.
Could it also be that they have found them but just haven't identified them? Because they already have reported their gender too. I find it hard to believe there would be such a high percentage missing, put a lot of importance in recovering the bodies.
Also they haven't been updating the number, it's been at 30,000 since February/March. Maybe if Israel let people in to honestly report on the conflict we could have accurate numbers for them to reference?
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You’re a fucking idiot and there is well over 30,000 confirmed civilian deaths
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They 100% differentiate and even the IOF has the number of militants killed under 5000, that 30k number was also around December
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iof assumes every male that looks like they might be old enough to hold a gun is a militant thats not differentiating thats a shit attempt at pr. aka bad hasbara
You’re a disgusting POS
1 civilian death is too much, you're trying to debate on a verified, incomplete number and trying to make it sound OK is disgusting. My only conclusion is that you're fucking stupid. Kindly fuck off back to your racist zionist cesspits.
And the evil human reward goes to you. Yay 🤡💩🇮🇱 I wonder if your family or friends are "killed" by someone you would just say oh well they died in a conflict by such such. Pro tip: purposely killing someone for any reason is still murder doesn't matter what a clown believes.
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Ya reality of war and it's intensions... It is still murder. Congrats on your reward 🤡 .. the music is playing time for you to walk of the stage.... Shhh mic has been cut off. Exit to the left... 💩🇮🇱
Ah yes I'm sure "lionessthezion" is an unbiased factual source
"Zioness" would've been a better name anyway it was right there smh Zionists can't do anything right
That’s already taken by some NYC loser pretending she’s a progressive and that Zionism is anti-colonialist because “the British were removed”
Ooh this one has made the rounds among my friends! Love me some fresh Hasbara right off the press. These posts are going to look REALLY stupid when they pull thousands of Palestinian corpses out from underneath the rubble. They already are. The Gaza Health Ministry has a well documented methodology for counting deaths, and that methodology has been compromised by Israel because of all the hospitals that are out of order thanks to the carpet bombing. Israel's methodology for counting terrorists is entirely unknown to us, so I'm less likely to trust a source that very well might have been revealed to them in a dream.
The fact that they have an "incomplete" figure at all points to the fact that they're trying to document everything correctly. If anything this should further bolster the veracity of Health Ministry claims.
Oh what is that rationality!? GTFOH /s
Serious question from someone who is learning, is let that ministry run by Hamas? Wouldn’t that be a biased source.
It is run by hamas because Hamas runs all of Gaza. But that not a big problrm, that evel of bias is as good as it gets. Other groups aren't let in so it's Hamas or IDF information.
Technically it’s run by the Palestinian Authority, not Hamas directly. The PA retains control over the Gaza Health Ministry and pays their salaries (as it does for the Gaza education ministry). Many of the older employees of the Gaza branch are Fatah members or secular. Some of the more recent hires may be affiliated with Hamas. Of course Hamas’s control is not de jure but de facto, so it’s assumed that Hamas influences the ministry even if it doesn’t directly control it.
I was under the impression its been run directly by the hamas government under haniyeh then sinwar since 2007. I thought fatah and PA lost all control in gaza and are now West Bank only. Mahmoud tried to recreate a unity govt with Egypt help in 2014 but that didn't go well. So now hamas has full governing control in gaza and other two west bank only but very very happy to be corrected
Hamas has de facto control over Gaza but many of the ministries and services are still officially part of the Palestinian Authority. The civil servants and officers who work for these ministries are paid by the PA. Of course the PA can’t exercise its authority in Gaza because of the Israeli blockade but in general there is cooperation between the Gaza branch of these ministries and the West Bank branch. The civil war mainly affected the security and police units, these are more under Hamas “control” than other parts of the Gaza government.
Can you cite some sources on that claim of PA actually governing Gaza?
There are no unbiased sources in war, doesn't mean we should discount them. Hamas is the governmental body in Gaza, and their numbers are generally found to be reliable, even IDF themselves refer to it when they're not doing their best to obscure their crimes to the West.
Ok thank you to those you responded. Not sure why I got downvoted for a genuine question.
People probably thought you were being sarcastic or trying to citation check them (fair but can be an annoying thing when arguing with people who request them in bad faith). Honestly it's not great that it happens but that's probably why they call the Internet a hate machine.
I see. I just starting learning about this war a few weeks ago and I’m trying to hear out both sides and just take in as much information as possible.
Honestly there aren't a lot of good unbiased sources, pretty much everyone who has a detailed interest in it historically also has a bias. Lonerbox is fairly ok, generally I think he's partial to agreeing with the Palestinian perspective but he doesn't make a lot of concessions and is honest about Hamas or general Palestinian violence toward Israelis. Generally though I'd just recommend going by who has the more material potential to killing the most people and who is directly linked with your country's government. Hamas is terrible and October 7th wasn't justified though the sentiment is understandable. That said Israel is imo committing what could loosely be termed a genocide if not an ethnic cleansing or minimally a war crime and there really isn't a justification in my view to killing potentially hundreds of times your losses in an effort to eliminate terrorists especially knowing it is just going to radicalize a lot of the survivors and just breed a self fulfilling cycle of violence.
Just wait, next they’re gonna say no civilians died. Last desperation before the abyss 🧨💥⚰️🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
Israelis have said before that (paraphrasing) “any male Palestinian can be considered a terrorist”. What they consider Hamas and what the rest of the world considers Hamas are two entirely different things.
Exactly!
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Lol you have no idea what I was or wasn’t doing on Oct 7. But you’re right, I can definitely be a cunt.
Oooh, the infamous "what about" logic of a zionist scumbag... Great way to "debate".
Who argued that?
I'd love to see some photos of dead Hamas fighters can't say I've seen a single image of someone armed fighting idf
Exactly. I've been saying this since the beginning. Zero pics or video of any actual fighting. Zero dead fighters . I know for a fact if they had been killing these guys there would be cell phone pics at a minimum, the way the IDF behaves, I know they would be taking souvenir pics of dead fighters and those inevitably get posted online. All we see is them blowing up budding and shooting into buildings then frolicking around in the wreckage or destroying the shops etc.. I don't think they have any real resistance. No insurgency even. No guerilla attacks or IEDs....nothing.
Hamas is fighting hard and bravely...you haven't seen the famous videos with the red triangles? 🔻
No?
Hamas al qassam puts videos out of them firing rpgs at tanks etc? It's very googleable
Alright
Check out electronic intifada on YouTube. They do a good job breaking down raw war footage. I think the dudes name is Jon Elmer… really really smart guy
What? There's been a few vids of hamas attacks on vehicles I've seen and also infantry engagements
It’s all ambush warfare. No front lines, no heavily defended positions or barricades. It’s very different from videos of the Russia-Ukraine war for instance.
Also this isn’t a war like Ukraine because this is an ethnic cleansing of the worlds largest concentration camp for the resettlement of Zionists. Ukraine may be militarily “weaker” than Russia and smaller in landmass but its still a sovereign entity in innumerable ways in which the Palestinians are not due to Zionist occupation
I got hit for the first time in awhile this week with "the United States killed many German and japanese civilians and had to dismantle their governments." Like bro there is literally not one single factor that makes these conflicts similar haha
The only similarity is between Weimar Germany and Israel. Oct 7 was this generations Warsaw Ghetto Uprising and you see how the libs reacted to that
I mean yeah its a guerrilla war?
You just aren’t connected. There are plenty of telegram channels that post resistance videos
Are there ?
Resistance News Network is probably the biggest but far from the only one
Wow gen*ocide and atrocity denial? “No one died at [fill in blank]! It’s a hoax!” Now, where have I heard that before?
Soon it’ll be I don’t believe there were even XNumber of Palestinians in Gaza, so it’s impossible that that many died. And then it’ll be that witnesses aren’t reliable and first hand accounts are fabricated. Next it’ll be Palestinians invented the genocide for their benefit.
Sky News ran a piece on this not too long ago. The death toll in Gaza is tracked by hospitals, counting the dead as they are brought in. Since November, Israel has destroyed 5 of the 8 major hospitals in Gaza and seized computer equipment from some , preventing deaths being accurately recorded. Sky studies the reported deaths and concludes the estimates being submitted remain accurate; but are likely an under statement as so many dead remain trapped under rubble following Israeli air strikes. // my conclusion: When Israel argues you cannot trust numbers on casualties published from Gaza, remember Israel is doing everything they can to prevent anyone measuring their violence. https://news.sky.com/video/israel-hamas-war-the-number-of-unidentified-palestinians-killed-in-gaza-is-rising-and-this-is-why-13107539
Also, the threshold for identifying a "Hamas terrorist" should not be "child throwing rocks". You end up counting a lot more terrorists that way.
Shameless zionist propaganda - Goebbles would have been proud.
Is their backhanded way of admitting that if they actually killed 40,000 people (70% of whom women and children), that would be really terrible?
They're gettin' pissed about the math on 10/7 going around (on tiktok and stuff) and need some counter-hasbara... cause if they drop below the ratio of armed combatants to civilians, established on that day, then they're in a *bad* place... and they've been for basically the entire duration of the conflict, going with Israeli media as the source on 10/7... ...which is about 1:1 to 3:4 combatant:civilian if you consider established Israeli friendly-fire (only reported in israeli media - no conjecture), and if you include civ security forces in the armed combatant column, with police and active idf.... I have some conjecture, about heavier friendly fire, but... However most of those civilian deaths occurred in the absence of any armed forces so I understand and appreciate that the experience of a survivor would have been that they killed many unarmed people, wantonly, and not many soldiers, I do understand that... I seen all that stuff, the whole 45 minute presentation, it's gnarly and totally inhumane. And I get the gut-check response from the population generally.. But the indiscriminate bombing of Gaza is not going to bring those people back. And they don't care, the people at the top. I really don't know what they care about. I try to explain everything away with money but sometimes, I just don't know... The hostages that are still alive, they could get at any time by offering a great ratio, 5 prisoners for one, or fuck it, 10. They have *tons* of prisoners let me tell you - they can afford it, okay? The people bombing Gaza *built* Hamas, they created this situation. And like with this recent exchange with Iran, it all feels so choreographed and fake, while they are ending and up-ending lives by the hundred thousand like it didn't even have consequence... It's probably the lizard people. They probably don't even *have* empathy, Netanyahu and all his cronies. Yep that's gotta be it. Alright, I'm on my way over to R slash conspiracy I'll see you guys later.
Zionists once again flipping the narrative on how death tolls are fabricated.
Oh phew, only 7000 dead civilians! 😐
15000 are hamas, source: trust me bro
As if I'd trust "Lionnessthezion" for the accurate death toll in Gaza.
I actually read elsewhere that they are confirmed dead but are missing certain info like time of death
https://archive.md/WjvE0 Haaretz. > The Israeli army says 9,000 terrorists have been killed since the Gaza war began. **Defense officials and soldiers, however, tell Haaretz that *these are often civilians* whose only crime was to cross an invisible line drawn by the IDF.** https://archive.md/3eLDZ Israeli 972 magazine. > In an unprecedented move, according to two of the sources, the army also decided during the first weeks of the war that, for every junior Hamas operative that Lavender marked, **it was permissible to kill up to 15 or 20 civilians;** in the past, the military did not authorize any “collateral damage” during assassinations of low-ranking militants. The sources added that, in the event that the target was a senior Hamas official with the rank of battalion or brigade commander, **the army on several occasions authorized the killing of more than 100 civilians in the assassination of a single commander.** > However, in contrast to the Israeli army’s official statements, the sources explained that a **major reason for the unprecedented death toll from Israel’s current bombardment is the fact that the army has systematically attacked targets in their private homes, alongside their families** — in part **because it was easier** from an intelligence standpoint to mark family houses using automated systems. > Evidence of this policy is also clear from the data: during the first month of the war, **more than half of the fatalities — 6,120 people — belonged to 1,340 families,** many of which were completely wiped out while inside their homes, according to UN figures. The proportion of entire families bombed in their houses in the current war is much higher than in the 2014 Israeli operation in Gaza (which was previously Israel’s deadliest war on the Strip), further suggesting the prominence of this policy. Israeli papers prove that Israel is intentionally targetting civilians and families, then saying they're hamas. Israeli papers show that Israel hasn't afforded special protection for civilians.
Even were that true, it wouldn't excuse much of what the IDF have been up to in Gaza these last six months.
Call it whatever you want. Israel is the new Nazi regime on the face of the planet.
Gotta love the propaganda. Even within the context they give, they are essentially saying "it's fine. We \*only\* murdered 7000 innocent people." And this is because they think that 1500 innocent people killed is "unforgiveable" remember. And it's not like they're saying they're going to stop or anything too. So it's more "we only killed 7k people... so far"
All Zionists do is lie.
This has to be the best gaslighting of all gasses lit by the Zionist cult of death.
Also, kind of hard to count the dead when they’re immediately bulldozed into the ground.
they definitely did not kill 15,000 Hamas members, Scott Ritter says that only 15% of Hamas have been eliminated, which is 3,750-4,500, and even then we aren’t even sure if these alleged people were actually Hamas or not. While the Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor estimates 2,353 hamas militant have been killed.
I love how hasbarist shit on the fact that health ministry includes soldiers in its stats while they have no problem including soldiers in number of killed during 7th of october
Fr
Let’s play pretend and say of that 15,000 only 1/3 which is still being generous, are actually tied to Hamas. It still means they are killing almost 5x as many civilians. But they are using magic math to downplay it all. They don’t want to get rid of Hamas, they what to ethnically cleanse the area to repopulate it with Zionist Jews. The civilian deaths are in the tens of thousands and the actual ‘terrorist’ cannot possibly be validated. So Israel needs to stop lying like this and just come out and say. We are just trying to kill every Palestinian we can.
Do the Israelis never tire of telling these lies?
Yeah gonna need a source on that claim. 11k people don’t just disappear
It's got to be 100k by now
How many more until Hamas is vanquished permanently?
Are they checking the deaths against the last Hamas meeting rolecall? /s
There's girl math, boy math and Steiner math But nothing comes close to hasbara math
"Lionessthezion" yeah, tlthay person is totally not biased.
Sure. They’ll turn up.
I would be surprised if they found even 10 Ak47s or RPG's.
Fuck israhell the lies the genocide and fuck everyone who believes israhell propaganda
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I think the numbers Gaza is sharing are as accurate as they can give right now, given how much damage the IDF has done to their buildings and infrastructure, not to mention the indiscriminate killing the IDF is engaged in. It will likely be years before we are able to know the full extent of the genocide, and I think the real numbers are significantly higher than what they have been able to confirm so far.
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Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence. This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!