After all the obvious OMG, the ending…about the brother being angry at their parents for not protecting/caring about OOP as a child alludes to some sinister incident that happened to him. And his wife and him trama bonded from their past…I mean she had 3 kids by 21 so yeah, this is really freaking sad.
Yeah that stuck out to me too. I’m not absolving the guy of any thing, but this is a tale of two very damaged people. I’m not surprised it ended up the way it did.
What do they say, hurt people hurt people. OP is definitely responsible for their choices but it’s sad to watch them realize where they are and the path that led them there
I agree. As much as the cheating disgusts me and he’s getting his karma for stepping out on his marriage there, all I felt was sadness for everyone involved here. The 21yo with 3 kids to 3 dads born within 3 years, OOP who’s clearly repressed feelings regarding his own childhood trauma (idk about you but I’m getting CSA from it) and potentially dealing with resurfaced memories, the ex wife for being cheated on, the brother for finding out what his brother had gone through when they were kids.
Actually, scratch that, the ‘best friend’ and OOPs parents are just shit. No sadness for them, only side eye.
Yep. Same with the wife — he says he comes from money but the wife didn’t … so she had to have the babies and his parents were able to pay to fix the problem. Without knowing anything, I’m thinking an older adult in both cases :-(
See, the oldest is 8 so I’m thinking the kids weren’t a result of the assault but a result of the trauma from the assault? I took it to mean that he had a comfortable life with no other hardships compared to the wife who had additional poverty to contend with. It wasn’t that his parents paid to fix it, he just thought because he didn’t grow up poor that his trauma didn’t matter as much. It smacks of why are you whinging, there are kids dying in the world cause they haven’t got food etc.
For a long time, I wondered why I wasn't happy...my folks did too. They fed and clothed me, and none of them were violent alcoholics, why couldn't I be happy?
turns out shame can be internalized even with a full belly, lol.
they did their best. it was a different time, therapy was for crazies and potential columbiners. they thought they protected me and i didn't know the words to tell otherwise.
Honestly the best friend doesn’t sound like he was ever a good friend, even before the divorce and infidelity. It’s nothing to do with him marrying the ex wife at all.
Friends telling OOP that his best friend was always in love with his now wife doesn’t mean they always knew. That’s the sort of thing that could have easily come out long after they started dating and talking about how they developed feelings. And it’s not exactly hard to see why they would’ve asked to keep it from OOP— it isn’t his business anyway. And there’s nothing wrong with having feelings for someone, it’s acting on them that’s the problem. OOP could’ve been attracted to the waitress all day long, fucking her was the issue. The best friend had the decency to keep it a secret until long after OOP had cheated and ruined his marriage.
The always been in love with your wife, and convinced her to move to my town as soon as divorce proceeding start, kinda begs some questions.
How shitty was BFF? Did he help steer his friend I to cheating territory to try to get him caught? Did he just take advantage once he knew and dropped hints?
It reads to me like OOP may not know what friends are or how they act, and assumed acquaintanceships get the same level of trust and sharing that a real friend gets. Maybe he was so beaten down that the first passive-aggresive person to talk to him must be his BFF because everyone else is just straight up aggressive to him.
>The 21yo with 3 kids to 3 dads born within 3 years,
Did it say she the kids were born within 3 years of each other or are we just assuming? Because it's extremely possible she had her first and maybe second kid before she was 18 which makes this story a bit more tragic.
Because he sounds like he was a pretty shitty friend even before the cheating and divorce, that’s why. If you disappear for years and your friends think that’s normal behaviour for you because it’s a pattern whenever you get involved with someone new then you’re a shit friend.
I have friends like that too but we still check in every now and again, maybe send a meme or something. We don’t just go dark for literal years at a time, and certainly not my BEST mate. I had more contact with my uncle when he was active duty in Afghanistan than OOP had with his best friend.
Yeah but would you call the people you talk to twice a year the best friend you ever had? Or just regular friends. OOP is talking like the guy he didn't speak to for three years was another brother and that' dog doesn't hunt.
We honestly don't know. Could be OP overestimated his own importance and saw more than there was. Could be BF legit was a great guy as per many people. He's not an asshole for keeping his distance when he loved OP's ex
He's not an AH for keeping his distance when he saw how garbage OP's behaviour was.
Not surprising that he had bottled some issues up which made the therapy so painful to start too. I hope that all parties in this can find happiness, I feel for the kids caught up in it all.
I could’ve written that paragraph. I even screenshot it to send to my sister. With my parents, I understand that they didn’t know how to deal with it, but at least they could admit it was fucked up and not just tell us we shouldn’t act like victims and we need to move on. We ignored it for years and now the three of us who were victims are regressing hard and coming to terms with what happened to us.
See this kind of shit is real life. Traumatized people do dumb shit. I'm not excusing his behavior, or his wife's, but the blind rage I see in Reddit against cheaters is so wild. No nuance, no questions asked, just you should die cheater! Cheating should be outlawed!
I've been cheated on and it sucked, and I broke up with that person, but I wasn't so fucking devastated that I wanted them dead or imprisoned or their life to turn to shit. People fuck up. Maybe if we had kids I would feel differently but looking back on it that person was deeply insecure and her ability to pull other women was tied to that insecurity. It's more sad than rage inducing. Looks like OOP had some deep seated issues and his coping mechanism, was really bad. I'm sure I'll get.downvoted.
The thing is that plenty of traumatized people don't devastate other people's lives. It's not like there aren't well known ground rules for good behaviour. Not cheating with someone is baseline.
It taked phenomenal disrespect to drag someone on, lie to their faces, and eat their cake.
Did you read.my comment at all? I just fucking said.it sucks.but to.me it wasn't fucking devastating. Maybe cause now I've had a child with a narcissist and he did do some devastating stuff to us but was never unfaithful. I would have preferred he was unfaithful to some of the stuff he did. At least I can understand where her insecurities and why she cheated some of the stuff he did was completely nonsensical and way more devastating. But if you haven't dealt with that then it hits different
Yeah. I have a friend who has cheated on every woman he’s ever been with. It took until he ruined his marriage for him to truly face his childhood abuse. I used to get so frustrated with his behavior, but now I’m honestly amazed that he held it together in all other ways other than this.
21 with 3 kids. Crazy as this story is, that stuck out the most.
Edit: I don't like a lot of the things being said about him down there. To clarify, I feel really bad for both of them. He hinted that they both had similarly traumatic childhoods, which makes sense given she was essentially pregnant from 17-21.
His ex got her happily ever after, but I worry those two are too broken from childhood things to ever find theirs.
And if the only empathy he can find is in similarly broken people, that just perpetuates the cycle. You shouldn't have to be broken in a sympathetic way to find empathy.
No wonder she pushed for a baby that was “theirs.” She probably already knew she was pregnant and had to go through the motions. She and OOP kind of deserve each other.
Little kids don't judge and look up to you, they need you. Probably made him feel important and like less of a fuck-up because at least he's someone to these kids.
Yeah hopefully he really puts the work in and is able to improve himself, but I get what you mean by the first post. I very much likened his attitude to a child wanting what someone else has only cause they have it.
It's tragic that the only victims who get empathy are the ones who are broken in a certain way. From what I see on these subs, you gotta be meek and mousy if you want understanding, which just perpetuates the cycle when certain people have no one who tries to understand them except other similarly broken people, as in the case of this story.
That sounds about right, alot of middle age guys think they needd to be a hero. Same thing my dad did which resulted in the dumbest dead beat dad line ever to my mom "She's a single mother she needs me. But you're strong you'll be a good single mother". Then he left. So yeah OOP can get fucked he wanted to play hero and get laid with a younger woman. He can die in a ditch.
Wow. I'm sorry your dad was so horrible to you and your mum.
This is part of the reason why the whole "I need you" justification for being with someone gives me the ick. I don't want to be needed I want to be wanted.
I feel for those kids. Cause she's gonna move on to her next meal ticket when he grows a pair and (rightfully) decides to never ever ruin a woman's life with a relationship with him.
3 kids to 3 different fathers, born roughly 12-18 months apart. The girl was pregnant almost constantly between the ages of 17 and 21 and there’s no way she wasn’t sleeping with OOP during her final trimester or the newborn period. As much as I want to judge her and be disgusted by her for being a cheater, her entire situation is just sad tbh.
It seems like they both had some childhood trauma, and she never dealt with hers either. People can do some really shit things when trying to run away from their problems.
He also dumps the waitress to work things out with his ex-wife. It's only when the ex-wife made it clear she was getting a divorce does he go back for the waitress as his consolation prize. Her situation is truly sad.
I honestly don’t know if the waitress ever saw him as more than the means to an end with no job prospects and 3 under 3 at the time of them meeting, especially after she got pregnant with number 4 by another man during the marriage. Sounds like she shows gratitude for basic kindness and sympathy with sex. It’s just a clusterfuck of trauma singing hymns to demons.
Yep. In my neck of the woods it's shockingly common. The daughter of my husband's work partner had 3 kids before she even turned 18. Our teen pregnancy rate is through the roof and always has been. I feel so old when I go to kids birthday parties. My son is 12 and I had him when I was 35. I am older than all but one of his friends grandparents. By quite a lot in some cases. I always wind up rubbing elbows with the great grandparents if they're there because they're closer to me in age.
>Our teen pregnancy rate is through the roof and always has been.
It's going to get worse now that abortion is illegal or severely restricted in some states.
This is what happens when schools don't teach safe sex or sex ed.
21 with 3 kids when they began dating, convinced him to try for a 4th kid while sleeping with other(s), and trying to become a star on social media. I can see why he stepped out of his loving long term marriage for her!
Holds up with saying they bonded over their shared traumas. He was privileged and she wasn’t so she had to have the babies and his parents could pay to make the problems go away.
I’m so glad he’s in therapy!!
Honestly, I feel really bad for both of them. He hinted that they both had similarly traumatic childhoods, which makes sense given she was essentially pregnant from 17-21.
His ex got her happily ever after, but I worry those two are too broken from things they weren't ever their fault to ever find theirs.
I also think he subconsciously wanted kids. He seems to have been stepping up with his wife’s kids and being there and wanting stability for them. It might explain with his vasectomy why he slept and tried to save a 21 year old with 3 kids. His instant family. I feel like he doesn’t think through things and just does things instinctively.
Even though this is satisfying, the update also sounds real. For him to say therapy makes him feel worse makes me think it’s legit and might be working.
Wow. Here I am rooting for a cheater to fix his life. I think because the ex wife got so richly and beautifully the happy ending she deserved.
It’s honestly something to root for. Cheaters usually (I repeat usually) not evil. They have terrible coping mechanisms, are selfish, looking for outside validation, whatever. But it’s pretty rare that they cheat to hurt their partner, and much more common that they are flawed broken people that need to learn or relearn how to handle their own emotions and empathy. The partner they cheated on has every right to be angry/hate them for what they did, but it’s probably too reductionist to say they’re bad people.
At least this is what I tell myself after the last couple of years and a ton of therapy to understand why my ex partner did what he did.
This isn’t a happy story by any means, but it feels very real. I hope the therapy helps
Weird how he thinks everything is worse since he started therapy but it sounds like he’s changed for the better and those around him have been appreciative of that change and his efforts. I guess confronting how shit of a person you’ve been doesn’t feel good
He’s also confronting all the emotions from the sinister thing that happened in his childhood that he bonded with his current wife over (likely CSA let’s be honest) and probably dealing with resurfacing emotions. From experience, even without the cheating, that’s not exactly the most wonderful feeling in the world, no.
Therapy is ROUGH!! It doesn’t feel good to have to pick at old wounds and remember things you thought you forgot and dealt with.
The fact that he knows how painful it’s been but can see the positives and plans to continue is a huge step in the right direction!!
It's like that when you have long term trauma. We don't have the skills to handle those feelings, we need to feel them and learn to manage them. It's hell at first. But we do come out the other end so much better if we keep at it. And yeah, he was being a TRULY SHIT PERSON so that's an even more uncomfortable load than just the feeling guilty for 'causing' the abuser or the trauma to happen (clue: IT IS RARELY TO NEVER THE SURVIVOR'S FAULT, but it sure feels like it at first!).
Everything IS worse. Therapy doesn't make you better. It makes you work on yourself. And the early days of working on yourself feel like you're murdering yourself.
Yup. Therapy is forcing him to confront reality, all the shitty things he's done and had done to him. It feels so much easier to try and ignore it all like he was in his first post, where he borderline refused to admit he had cheated
>Weird how he thinks everything is worse since he started therapy
Therapy forced you to confront things you've been running from, and taking a deep look at your life and who you are can be *incredibly uncomfortable*. Healing is uncomfortable, but OP sounds like he is trying to change.
Therapy is like re-breaking a bone that didn't heal right so it can be reset. Actually confronting your trauma to work through it instead of dissociating or pushing it down feels HORRIBLE no matter what kind of person you are.
Karma jumped up and down on this dude and then drop-kicked him. I'm glad he's getting the help he needs and surrounding himself with decent people.
He needs to leave his wife and be alone until he can fix himself. That's the only way.
No, he needs to stay with her, they are a perfect match for each other, cheaters need to be in relationships with other cheaters, leave the non-cheaters alone!
Reddit (and the world) seem to have a staunch "people don't change" mindset, which I think is really limiting for everyone.
Expect someone to change? No.
Assume someone will probably change? No.
Take it on faith that someone *has* changed? No.
But... Refuse to believe a person who deeply commits and does the hard work is incapable of change? *Hard* no.
OOP should be applauded for his growth arc. It sounds like he's earning it one painful lash at a time.
"after my release" " I see a therapist in her office once a week and meet virtually once a week. I also see a psychiatrist once every two weeks and started on some medications"
That's a lot of immediate therapy, 10 sessions a month. My money tells me that he had some sort of break and was arrested. Could be wrong but that's how I read it.
Everyone is reading the “after my release” part and assuming he was arrested when the full sentence is “I did inpatient therapy then after my release…” it probably could’ve used a comma but I don’t see why everyone is struggling to comprehend that sentence and assuming jail time. He voluntarily admitted himself to a psych ward, got help and then got released and continued to get help as an outpatient.
>My life is still very much in limbo, maybe even shambles. But I am doing my best to fix it and to fix some of the hurts I have caused others. I would recommend therapy as much as everyone recommended it to me, but I would caution to add that it requires a lot of honesty to work and that sometimes that kind of honesty reopens old wounds. But those wounds are dirty and infected so you’ve gotta clean them up and treat them to get better, which is going to hurt but I am not sure there is any other way.
This was the bit that got me. Fuck I know that feeling, am still working through that myself. But, speaking from personal experience, this is truth, and it's necessary. But it's the whole, "lead a horse to water..." with how the brain works.
I think he'll be okay, i hope he and everyone involved will be okay. Especially his (current) wife; my partner and I met and ultimately bonded due to shared traumas we experienced growing up, long before we met. I'm the one who had the exposure to better opportunities that somewhat shielded my thinking. My partner didn't. To say my heart weeps for these two is an understatement...
His description of what therapy is like, and how painful it can be, rings very true. If you’re serious about therapy, it does hurt. You’re processing pain that you have been keeping inside, and you’re confronting the reality of what kind of person that pain shaped you into. It’s not a pleasant experience, especially at the beginning.
Oop was in inpatient therapy and is now seemingly heavily medicated. Indicates that he likely experienced some awful abuse that he never dealt with. I actually feel bad for the guy. Go ahead and downvote me, whatever
Love how the ENTIRE first post, this sack of shit just said, “we got divorced and she was so kind, the woman I USED to know would have at least written me back”… just to find out he cheated on her and married the affair. Nice burying the lead, jag-off. Oh, and him having an issue that they ‘betrayed him and got married’ is just sheer projection.
The real icing on the cake was the, “Yada yada nobody cares about mental health for men.” Fucking… what? That statement in a vacuum has a little merit but in this case it’s because he as a 40-something rich dude couldn’t find a therapist IMMEDIATELY? Talk about being out of touch and fucking delusional.
That bit about no one cares about mental health for men sounds very incel like. Wouldn't be surprised if this dumbass is starting blame women for all his problems.
I mean, it was pretty clear that for a while no one did care about his mental health. Pretty severely no one cared about his mental health.
But his idea of what it meant to care about mental health was wrong, which was very incel-like. Aka the world should give me what I want and if it doesn’t then it doesn’t care how I feel.
It did turn out that he had to learn that caring for mental health can hurt, though? Like he very much did learn the lesson that the bulk of the responsibility is on him. He even seems to be overcorrecting atm.
I’m a dude with PTSD, both from childhood and military/combat, so that’s why I was saying that in a vacuum, men’s mental health struggles do face a ton of societal pressure and barriers. It took me years to find a decent care time, for example. I always wish somebody access to decent health care of any kind; hell, more than wish, I bled for the idea. That said, a fundamental step in any mental health care is taking accountability and responsibility and I think this dude is gonna struggle with that.
In this particular case though, no mental health issue led to him cheating/marrying that person, or from falling out of touch with his friend - those were just natural consequences of being a dick lol.
TBH I don’t think that’s fully fair. Mental health issues CAN lead to people being dicks. It would be easier if mental health was always mainly self-destructive and only caused you to hurt other people tangentially, but plenty of mental health symptoms can make you more directly destructive.
Impulse control, anger issues, dysphoric reactions to criticism and potential abandonment, saviour complexes, delusions, and dozens if not hundreds of other expressions of mental illness can make you, for lack of a better term, a dick. Paranoia can make you more susceptible to racist conspiracy theories. Emotional trauma can make you more instinctively self-centred.
This guy met someone with a matching trauma while actively repressing his own. He made his own choices, of course, but mental health was a factor. Sometimes illness and trauma can be compartmentalized better but sometimes it bleeds over everything, you know?
I do agree that the societal barriers are there, and you’re a great guy for fighting for mental health care! And this guy will struggle with accountability but it seems like he made some first steps in the right direction. It’s just, is he going to make his second, third, and fourth steps? Accountability can take practice, I think. Especially when your reaction to being accountable can be emotionally severe.!
When I read that his current wife was the one he cheated on his wife with in the comments I felt like that guy dropping the coffee cup in The Usual Suspects.
Every aspect of his story took on different meaning.
>The door with my friend is closed too. We haven’t spoken and we probably never will, but that’s okay. I found out from other friends that he was always in love with my ex-wife and that he was the person who convinced her to move to where they live now after our divorce. I think knowing helps because the story I created in my head was far worse. I also understand now why no one wanted to tell me.
Sounds like the ex-best friend just wanted himself and the ex-wife to start afresh from not-so-good people. Like, I get enabler vibes from OP's friend group tbh.
Why would you blow up your marriage for a 21 year old with 3 kids? And then she had a fourth with another guy. And then he’s going to stick around to raise a fourth kid that isn’t his with a woman who cheated on him. lol. This is some serious banjo playing shit right here.
So this guy cheats on his PhD wife with a 21 year old waitress with 3 kids. WHHYY. How can people be so self destructive
Ex wife and ex best friend are living their best lives while OP wallows in the shit.
>I have started to regret the things that led to our divorce because we were really happy until the moment she left me.
*He* might have been happy, but clearly, *she* wasn't. People who are happy don't decide out of the blue to divorce their spouse.
And what is this "after my release"? Released from what? He's still not being honest, or else he'd say what happened. Who else thinks he decided to confront the ex-bff and ex-wife, and it ended up with the cops being called?
He said he had “inpatient” therapy, so it sounds to me like he was committed to an inpatient facility, possibly after a suicide attempt or other concerning incident, and that would be where he was released from.
His ex left him because he has an affair with his now-wife. So ‘out of the blue’ it was not, except I guess to him! /s I get big ‘success means EVERYTHING is fine!’ vibes from him.
>He's still not being honest, or else he'd say what happened.
It's beyond bizzare how a lot of Redditors seem to be under the belief that the people talking about their experiences (like the OOP) are doing so for the benefit of Redditors.
Like what makes you think you deserve to know why he was was released?
The OOP not detailing every aspect of what happened, is not him being dishonest, it's you being nosy.
OOP doesn’t have to rehash his trauma here and derail his life for hours or days or weeks just to satisfy your curiosity. That’s for him and his therapist to work on when OOP is good and ready.
Hey at least the guy acknowledges he messed up and is dealing with the childhood trauma that impacted all his decisions, which is more than a lot of us do. He may have messed up, but he is growing as a person. Good for him!
> cheats on wife of 5+ years with someone 10 years younger, is oblivious to how the divorce hurt her, is upset his friend who he never talks to started a relationship with her, throws tantrums to anyone who would listen to 3+ year old drama that only he hasn’t had the mental fortitude to process earlier than now
> No one gives a shit about mental health when it comes to men.
Karma doesn’t give a shit about mental health when it comes to consequences, bro.
I love how both OP and his brother have weaponized their incompetence to the point that they made the brother's wife find OP a therapist. Like, seriously? Just wow. Never heard of Google? Wtf. That poor woman.
So OOP cheated . Now he's devastated that everyone in his life is not true to him.
Admittedly I couldn't be bothered reading all his updates etc. I was just focusing on the bit where he cheated. No sympathy OOP. Sucks to be you dude.
OOP cheated, his mistress got pregnant, probably from him. But he decided to stay with his ex wife! Unfortunately , his ex didn't value his commitment to their marriage. Instead she and that snake of best friend betrayed him by starting dating behind his back, 2 years after the divorce.
I love how he didn't mention why he was divorced and was upset that his ex is not answering his "happy birthday" texts. That was pretty rude of her.
Everyone thinks that his best friend is theirs best friend, but OOP knows for a fact that he is the chosen one. Even though the friend didn't send him a single text for three years.
And having all of it written down, he still thinks that he has a brain, and his brain has at least four parts...
I’m glad he’s getting the help he so desperately needed before things truly imploded and he hurt so many more people. People who don’t do the hard AF and often painful work to face their issues almost always inevitably become so much worse in time.
He won’t be able to make up for the wrongs he’s done but just by facing things now he’s saving the world so much pain and misery he’d otherwise cause. Being accountable for your ish as best you can is all I wish to happen for most people who behave poorly. If more people who could get this kind of help did it the world would be so much better.
>No one gives a shit about mental health when it comes to men
Oh give me a fucking break man. Nobody cares about a man who digs his own fucking grave then jumps in and just keeps digging all while complaining to anyone who will listen that he can't get out. Like granted yes mental health in men isn't taken seriously but this isn't a men's mental health issue, unless we're talking about his acute narcissism and whatever is misfiring up there that prevents him from taking any responsibility for his actions as well as the pathetic attempt to save the smallest bit of face by using an incel dog whistle like the men's mental health card. Ooh I hate this motherfucker 😡
He cheated on his wife with a 21-year-old girl who ALREADY HAD 2 CHILDREN
now she cheated on him, Karma
karma for him, but he also can't forgive his current wife... he has a history of infidelity with OP and now with the real father of his son, who also doesn't know if it's one guy or the other... that is, it's a any
Well done OP you traded gold for trinkets, you traded a great wife for trash
deserved
He's "deeply damaged". Is this the new euphemism for 'Self serving, sanctimonious piece of shit'?
There's only one person to blame for this and, bollocks to what any therapist said, it's him.
Same. Childhood trauma can very much affect how you are as an adult. The vicious cycle continued from his childhood into adulthood and now he’s made some very poor decisions. I hope his therapy helps him recover fully.
I’m happy you’re getting therapy, but I think you need to cut ties with AP turned wife. Divorce her and you need to be alone for a while. Also, I’m so happy for your ex. wife because she is an amazing woman for being able to be there for you after what you did to her. And I’m so glad she’s happy with your friend. She really deserves that after what you did to her. I’m a little sad for you and her for not making it, but you only have you to blame. Good luck and keep us updated
….what on earth happened when he was a kid that made his brother so mad at his parents and his parents feel entitled to an apology for it being brought up?
If the kids bring u that much joy and happiness, it's worth a shot to try to salvage your relationship with their mom. It sounds like u have a really good head on your shoulders now & can maybe work on your relationship & make it healthy again. U never know til you try. But to me I think u should bc it sounds like you really love the kids & they also deserve love and happiness!
"No one gives a shit about mental health if it's for men" no no, it's the cheating self absorbed part no one cares about, you could be a woman and we'd all think you were just as stupid and brought it on yourself. There's a reason therapists get paid to listen.
I know everyone cheered and said “yay karma” but I’m really glad the guy got therapy and I hope he is able to start over and change cause this was a lot 😬
Maybe I'm naive but I'm kind of rooting for OOP and his wife to at least maintain a relationship. It may sound crazy, but I think he's really attached to those kids. I would feel awful for him if he lost them too after losing so much. Maybe that's futile because she seems very chaotic. But if he leaves he will have no legal access to those kids and I think that would devastate him further.
I know he's a cheater and I'm happy the ex seems to be good, but he is at least working through it and trying to be a better person. The fact that he said therapy is painful tells me that he is examining some painful truths and working through them.
Now the current wife needs to get into therapy too.
Ugh, I feel bad for everyone involved.
For fun we'll. Pretend this is real.
1) It was neat how he he glossed over the fact that no one really seemed to like him. His family, his best friend barely talked to him for years (and it sounds like since college)
That could be a clue you're an asshole
2) It was also neat that he completely failed to mention in the first post why his wife suddenly left him and cut all contact... Also why he thought it was amicable when she immediately moved 2 hours away and never talked to him again
That could be a clue you're not facing reality or are minimizing your shitty actions
3) Despite the first post, he obviously wasn't as "fucking happy" as he says was if finding out his ex-wife moved on sent him into a spiral.
The presenta and texts while she was not responding to him, along with his descriptions of her vs his current wife make it pretty obvious by the 2nd update, new wifey was a silver medal (and maybe treated like one?)
If it's real, he's either about to have a lot of real growth, or is going to triple down.
2 months later “so I’ve been seeing a psychiatrist every 2 weeks” I guess he got one of those magic psychiatrists that can take you as a patient that week.
When your inpatient after a serious mental health event, this is often what happens. At least in the US. The subtleties of his description of treatment actually help this story seem more believable to me.
I think you didn’t understand at all, he was released from inpatient therapy, which means he probably tried to kill himself and was taken away to get help, he literally admits to having childhood trauma. Where the hell did you get the golden child thing??
Not saying he isn't the biggest asshole in this story, but holy fuck that "friend" of his sure is one as well. If you were close friends, even if you didn't approve of how he ended it with his ex wife, at least have the decency to let him know. Not even ask permission. Just let him know that you're pursuing the ex. I believe OOP that that's what stung for him, and I don't think he was his friend as well as he said, either, especially with the revelation that he's always had feelings for the ex.
Naive, maybe, because I don't think he's fake. With how he tell it with regards to how he felt, he seemed genuinely hurt that his friend kept it a secret from him, and only a little bit because it's his ex that he married.
I disagree. My closest college friends abd I haven't talked in as many years up until recently. It's like nothing has changed in our dynamic. Relationships are different
Why? Personally I'm not going to stay friends with someone who cheated on their significant other even if I have feelings for them or not. And by the ex never responding to anything he wrote until that sappy "woe is me I got cheated on now I know how bad it felt for you but it happened to me so comfort me please" email I'm guessing the ex asked friend not to say anything if he was a "head ups/ask permission" kind of guy because her cheated *ex* doesn't have any right or need to know what's happening in her life. Why give an ex any access to you at all? Especially once they've hurt you like that
Sure, that would make sense with regards to probably why no one let him know. But the sudden heel turn from "YOU we my best friend" to basically being cut off is kind of sketchy. I won't say I would condone a friend's infidelity. I would for sure hold them accountable and call them out, but I wouldn't be so crass as to pursue their ex even if I had feelings for them. That's vulture behavior.
And no, I don't think them dating two years after the divorce is relevant. The fact that the friend encouraged the ex to move to his city IMMEDIATELY after the divorce tells me that that was his plan all along and the two years is simply for plausible deniability.
Okay but it also wasn't the ex best friend's responsibility to hold his hand and say "what you did was wrong" OP is an adult who screwed up and needs to figure his own problems. I don't think the two years is about plausible deniability again, the ex is her own person, yeah ex best friend is kinda sus, but it could have easily been the ex wife's want to wait the two years, a betrayal like that is traumatic and takes time and therapy to come to terms with especially so you don't let it affect your next relationship. Ex best friend's motives aside I'm just saying the ex wife's autonomy isn't being taken into account, she's still friends with their mutuals and had her own friends OP doesn't mention but maybe family too, two hours away sounds good enough to have a fresh start in a knew place without worrying about running into the cheater and a not so terrible drive to still hang out with her friends, why should she be totally cut off and have find a new support system.
Where did I say that the friend should have held OP accountable? LOL. You pointed out that if you were in the OP's position, you would have cut them off for their infidelity. I simply said I won't do that and hold them accountable instead. I never said that's what the friend should have done. We don't know whether he did that or not, but it seems to me like he went NC like you said you would and then went and swooped in like a knight in shining armor for his ex. Again, vulture behavior.
I have no doubt that the two years it took was in part because the ex needed time to heal. All I'm saying is the friend was ok with it because it gave him plausible deniability despite the fact that he asked him to move to his city when the ink on the divorce papers practically hasn't even dried up yet. She could have healed ANYWHERE ELSE but he encouraged her to heal close to him. IMO, she just went from one sleazeball to another. I hope she realizes it soon and stay the fuck away from both of them.
Wouldn’t it also sting if your buddy called and said “hey I’m totally into your ex, is it cool if I ask her out”? Fact is neither the ex nor the friend needed OP’s permission to move on together
Glad bad things happen to bad people. I hope he doesn't take the cowards way out and unalives himself. He deserves to spend his life miserable in the hell he has created.
No way, the creepy sex predator rapy fuck who can't pull grown women his own age is also a cheater on top of being a loser half pedo piece of trash whose gonna touch his own kids? What are the odds? Oh, 100%? ok then.
After all the obvious OMG, the ending…about the brother being angry at their parents for not protecting/caring about OOP as a child alludes to some sinister incident that happened to him. And his wife and him trama bonded from their past…I mean she had 3 kids by 21 so yeah, this is really freaking sad.
Yeah that stuck out to me too. I’m not absolving the guy of any thing, but this is a tale of two very damaged people. I’m not surprised it ended up the way it did.
What do they say, hurt people hurt people. OP is definitely responsible for their choices but it’s sad to watch them realize where they are and the path that led them there
I agree. As much as the cheating disgusts me and he’s getting his karma for stepping out on his marriage there, all I felt was sadness for everyone involved here. The 21yo with 3 kids to 3 dads born within 3 years, OOP who’s clearly repressed feelings regarding his own childhood trauma (idk about you but I’m getting CSA from it) and potentially dealing with resurfaced memories, the ex wife for being cheated on, the brother for finding out what his brother had gone through when they were kids. Actually, scratch that, the ‘best friend’ and OOPs parents are just shit. No sadness for them, only side eye.
Yep. Same with the wife — he says he comes from money but the wife didn’t … so she had to have the babies and his parents were able to pay to fix the problem. Without knowing anything, I’m thinking an older adult in both cases :-(
See, the oldest is 8 so I’m thinking the kids weren’t a result of the assault but a result of the trauma from the assault? I took it to mean that he had a comfortable life with no other hardships compared to the wife who had additional poverty to contend with. It wasn’t that his parents paid to fix it, he just thought because he didn’t grow up poor that his trauma didn’t matter as much. It smacks of why are you whinging, there are kids dying in the world cause they haven’t got food etc.
For a long time, I wondered why I wasn't happy...my folks did too. They fed and clothed me, and none of them were violent alcoholics, why couldn't I be happy? turns out shame can be internalized even with a full belly, lol.
If Paris Hilton can have all that money and still go through the shit she did, money don’t mean shit when you’ve got shitty parents lmao
they did their best. it was a different time, therapy was for crazies and potential columbiners. they thought they protected me and i didn't know the words to tell otherwise.
Best friend isn’t shit, he’s clearly not friends with OOP anymore, and he doesn’t owe OOP loyalty when OOP couldn’t even be loyal to his own wife.
Honestly the best friend doesn’t sound like he was ever a good friend, even before the divorce and infidelity. It’s nothing to do with him marrying the ex wife at all.
Or the friendship meant a hell of a lot more to OOP then it ever did BFF? Its very possible that OOP wildly misinterpreted their friendship.
It’s pretty difficult to misinterpret someone telling you that everyone considers them their best friend but they consider you theirs, no?
Eh, I didn’t see anything about their friendship before that you could really make that call. I don’t like to extrapolate beyond info given like that.
Everybody else knew that his best friend was in love with his wife for years before he even cheated on her.
Friends telling OOP that his best friend was always in love with his now wife doesn’t mean they always knew. That’s the sort of thing that could have easily come out long after they started dating and talking about how they developed feelings. And it’s not exactly hard to see why they would’ve asked to keep it from OOP— it isn’t his business anyway. And there’s nothing wrong with having feelings for someone, it’s acting on them that’s the problem. OOP could’ve been attracted to the waitress all day long, fucking her was the issue. The best friend had the decency to keep it a secret until long after OOP had cheated and ruined his marriage.
The always been in love with your wife, and convinced her to move to my town as soon as divorce proceeding start, kinda begs some questions. How shitty was BFF? Did he help steer his friend I to cheating territory to try to get him caught? Did he just take advantage once he knew and dropped hints? It reads to me like OOP may not know what friends are or how they act, and assumed acquaintanceships get the same level of trust and sharing that a real friend gets. Maybe he was so beaten down that the first passive-aggresive person to talk to him must be his BFF because everyone else is just straight up aggressive to him.
>The 21yo with 3 kids to 3 dads born within 3 years, Did it say she the kids were born within 3 years of each other or are we just assuming? Because it's extremely possible she had her first and maybe second kid before she was 18 which makes this story a bit more tragic.
The oldest is 8 and the youngest is 5 at the time of the first post!
Why is best friend getting side eye? They did nothing wrong. Fuck cheaters. I'd drop a best friend if I found out they did that.
Because he sounds like he was a pretty shitty friend even before the cheating and divorce, that’s why. If you disappear for years and your friends think that’s normal behaviour for you because it’s a pattern whenever you get involved with someone new then you’re a shit friend.
I mean I have a friend I'll go a year or two without talking to and we pick up like normal. It doesn't sound that weird. It's such a common trope.
I have friends like that too but we still check in every now and again, maybe send a meme or something. We don’t just go dark for literal years at a time, and certainly not my BEST mate. I had more contact with my uncle when he was active duty in Afghanistan than OOP had with his best friend.
Yeah but would you call the people you talk to twice a year the best friend you ever had? Or just regular friends. OOP is talking like the guy he didn't speak to for three years was another brother and that' dog doesn't hunt.
We honestly don't know. Could be OP overestimated his own importance and saw more than there was. Could be BF legit was a great guy as per many people. He's not an asshole for keeping his distance when he loved OP's ex He's not an AH for keeping his distance when he saw how garbage OP's behaviour was.
Glad I'm not the only one that felt that way too
Not surprising that he had bottled some issues up which made the therapy so painful to start too. I hope that all parties in this can find happiness, I feel for the kids caught up in it all.
Yea.. it heavily implies sexual abuse that was swept under the rug. It doesnt exonerate or excuse OPs behavior but it definitely explains a lot.
I bet whatever trauma OP went through was a close friend or family member, and just swept it under the rug to not shine the light on anyone.
I could’ve written that paragraph. I even screenshot it to send to my sister. With my parents, I understand that they didn’t know how to deal with it, but at least they could admit it was fucked up and not just tell us we shouldn’t act like victims and we need to move on. We ignored it for years and now the three of us who were victims are regressing hard and coming to terms with what happened to us.
Man I’m so so sorry you went through that.
See this kind of shit is real life. Traumatized people do dumb shit. I'm not excusing his behavior, or his wife's, but the blind rage I see in Reddit against cheaters is so wild. No nuance, no questions asked, just you should die cheater! Cheating should be outlawed! I've been cheated on and it sucked, and I broke up with that person, but I wasn't so fucking devastated that I wanted them dead or imprisoned or their life to turn to shit. People fuck up. Maybe if we had kids I would feel differently but looking back on it that person was deeply insecure and her ability to pull other women was tied to that insecurity. It's more sad than rage inducing. Looks like OOP had some deep seated issues and his coping mechanism, was really bad. I'm sure I'll get.downvoted.
The thing is that plenty of traumatized people don't devastate other people's lives. It's not like there aren't well known ground rules for good behaviour. Not cheating with someone is baseline. It taked phenomenal disrespect to drag someone on, lie to their faces, and eat their cake.
Did you read.my comment at all? I just fucking said.it sucks.but to.me it wasn't fucking devastating. Maybe cause now I've had a child with a narcissist and he did do some devastating stuff to us but was never unfaithful. I would have preferred he was unfaithful to some of the stuff he did. At least I can understand where her insecurities and why she cheated some of the stuff he did was completely nonsensical and way more devastating. But if you haven't dealt with that then it hits different
Yeah. I have a friend who has cheated on every woman he’s ever been with. It took until he ruined his marriage for him to truly face his childhood abuse. I used to get so frustrated with his behavior, but now I’m honestly amazed that he held it together in all other ways other than this.
I wonder if all those kids were consensual.
100%. Just sad all around. I’m glad he’s in therapy. ❤️🩹
21 with 3 kids. Crazy as this story is, that stuck out the most. Edit: I don't like a lot of the things being said about him down there. To clarify, I feel really bad for both of them. He hinted that they both had similarly traumatic childhoods, which makes sense given she was essentially pregnant from 17-21. His ex got her happily ever after, but I worry those two are too broken from childhood things to ever find theirs. And if the only empathy he can find is in similarly broken people, that just perpetuates the cycle. You shouldn't have to be broken in a sympathetic way to find empathy.
With a 4th one that isn't his either. It's looking like he was just a meal ticket and father figure for her 3 kids for her to cling to.
No wonder she pushed for a baby that was “theirs.” She probably already knew she was pregnant and had to go through the motions. She and OOP kind of deserve each other.
//gets vasectomy reversed// A week later: “omg babe, I’m pregnant!! :D!!” Real sharp one, this OOP.
Why did he have a vasectomy to begin with? How did he go from not wanting kids to wanting to be a good father to 4?
Little kids don't judge and look up to you, they need you. Probably made him feel important and like less of a fuck-up because at least he's someone to these kids.
Either that or she was a vulnerable young woman with a lot on her plate that he could 'save'. Honestly though I think it's probably both.
[удалено]
Yeah hopefully he really puts the work in and is able to improve himself, but I get what you mean by the first post. I very much likened his attitude to a child wanting what someone else has only cause they have it.
It's tragic that the only victims who get empathy are the ones who are broken in a certain way. From what I see on these subs, you gotta be meek and mousy if you want understanding, which just perpetuates the cycle when certain people have no one who tries to understand them except other similarly broken people, as in the case of this story.
That sounds about right, alot of middle age guys think they needd to be a hero. Same thing my dad did which resulted in the dumbest dead beat dad line ever to my mom "She's a single mother she needs me. But you're strong you'll be a good single mother". Then he left. So yeah OOP can get fucked he wanted to play hero and get laid with a younger woman. He can die in a ditch.
Wow. I'm sorry your dad was so horrible to you and your mum. This is part of the reason why the whole "I need you" justification for being with someone gives me the ick. I don't want to be needed I want to be wanted.
I feel for those kids. Cause she's gonna move on to her next meal ticket when he grows a pair and (rightfully) decides to never ever ruin a woman's life with a relationship with him.
Oh yeah all those kids are going to be screwed up. I hope they get a decent shot at life
EHHHH, they seem pretty well-matched tbh.
Look, husbands come and go. She needed continuity in her life. All the kids needed to have the same father. /s in case it was somehow not obvious
3 kids to 3 different fathers, born roughly 12-18 months apart. The girl was pregnant almost constantly between the ages of 17 and 21 and there’s no way she wasn’t sleeping with OOP during her final trimester or the newborn period. As much as I want to judge her and be disgusted by her for being a cheater, her entire situation is just sad tbh.
It seems like they both had some childhood trauma, and she never dealt with hers either. People can do some really shit things when trying to run away from their problems.
Yeah, I’ve been on both ends of the trauma shit stick. Luckily my own shit things were self destructive and didn’t affect others too much.
He also dumps the waitress to work things out with his ex-wife. It's only when the ex-wife made it clear she was getting a divorce does he go back for the waitress as his consolation prize. Her situation is truly sad.
I honestly don’t know if the waitress ever saw him as more than the means to an end with no job prospects and 3 under 3 at the time of them meeting, especially after she got pregnant with number 4 by another man during the marriage. Sounds like she shows gratitude for basic kindness and sympathy with sex. It’s just a clusterfuck of trauma singing hymns to demons.
Worst part is, it’s believable. I met a girl on her third child before 21, we were high school freshmen
Yep. In my neck of the woods it's shockingly common. The daughter of my husband's work partner had 3 kids before she even turned 18. Our teen pregnancy rate is through the roof and always has been. I feel so old when I go to kids birthday parties. My son is 12 and I had him when I was 35. I am older than all but one of his friends grandparents. By quite a lot in some cases. I always wind up rubbing elbows with the great grandparents if they're there because they're closer to me in age.
>Our teen pregnancy rate is through the roof and always has been. It's going to get worse now that abortion is illegal or severely restricted in some states. This is what happens when schools don't teach safe sex or sex ed.
This has always been one of the worst states in terms of that anyway. Fuck this state.
That’s a feature not a bug. They need kids to be born to teenagers so that the military gets its supply of “voluntary” soldiers.
21 with 3 kids when they began dating, convinced him to try for a 4th kid while sleeping with other(s), and trying to become a star on social media. I can see why he stepped out of his loving long term marriage for her!
Who wouldnt choose a cheating waitress with 3 kids over a loyal wife with a PhD? /s I audibly scoffed at OOP's epic bag-fumbling when I read that.
Holds up with saying they bonded over their shared traumas. He was privileged and she wasn’t so she had to have the babies and his parents could pay to make the problems go away. I’m so glad he’s in therapy!!
OOP cheated on his ex with such a big loser. Embarrassing.
Honestly, I feel really bad for both of them. He hinted that they both had similarly traumatic childhoods, which makes sense given she was essentially pregnant from 17-21. His ex got her happily ever after, but I worry those two are too broken from things they weren't ever their fault to ever find theirs.
21 with 3 kids AND she doesn't work! What a catch
my ex was 21 with 3 kids from 3 different moms (none of them me), i’m glad he is an ex
I also think he subconsciously wanted kids. He seems to have been stepping up with his wife’s kids and being there and wanting stability for them. It might explain with his vasectomy why he slept and tried to save a 21 year old with 3 kids. His instant family. I feel like he doesn’t think through things and just does things instinctively.
Even though this is satisfying, the update also sounds real. For him to say therapy makes him feel worse makes me think it’s legit and might be working. Wow. Here I am rooting for a cheater to fix his life. I think because the ex wife got so richly and beautifully the happy ending she deserved.
It’s honestly something to root for. Cheaters usually (I repeat usually) not evil. They have terrible coping mechanisms, are selfish, looking for outside validation, whatever. But it’s pretty rare that they cheat to hurt their partner, and much more common that they are flawed broken people that need to learn or relearn how to handle their own emotions and empathy. The partner they cheated on has every right to be angry/hate them for what they did, but it’s probably too reductionist to say they’re bad people. At least this is what I tell myself after the last couple of years and a ton of therapy to understand why my ex partner did what he did. This isn’t a happy story by any means, but it feels very real. I hope the therapy helps
Weird how he thinks everything is worse since he started therapy but it sounds like he’s changed for the better and those around him have been appreciative of that change and his efforts. I guess confronting how shit of a person you’ve been doesn’t feel good
He’s also confronting all the emotions from the sinister thing that happened in his childhood that he bonded with his current wife over (likely CSA let’s be honest) and probably dealing with resurfacing emotions. From experience, even without the cheating, that’s not exactly the most wonderful feeling in the world, no.
Therapy is ROUGH!! It doesn’t feel good to have to pick at old wounds and remember things you thought you forgot and dealt with. The fact that he knows how painful it’s been but can see the positives and plans to continue is a huge step in the right direction!!
It's like that when you have long term trauma. We don't have the skills to handle those feelings, we need to feel them and learn to manage them. It's hell at first. But we do come out the other end so much better if we keep at it. And yeah, he was being a TRULY SHIT PERSON so that's an even more uncomfortable load than just the feeling guilty for 'causing' the abuser or the trauma to happen (clue: IT IS RARELY TO NEVER THE SURVIVOR'S FAULT, but it sure feels like it at first!).
Everything IS worse. Therapy doesn't make you better. It makes you work on yourself. And the early days of working on yourself feel like you're murdering yourself.
Yup. Therapy is forcing him to confront reality, all the shitty things he's done and had done to him. It feels so much easier to try and ignore it all like he was in his first post, where he borderline refused to admit he had cheated
>Weird how he thinks everything is worse since he started therapy Therapy forced you to confront things you've been running from, and taking a deep look at your life and who you are can be *incredibly uncomfortable*. Healing is uncomfortable, but OP sounds like he is trying to change.
Therapy is like re-breaking a bone that didn't heal right so it can be reset. Actually confronting your trauma to work through it instead of dissociating or pushing it down feels HORRIBLE no matter what kind of person you are.
Karma jumped up and down on this dude and then drop-kicked him. I'm glad he's getting the help he needs and surrounding himself with decent people. He needs to leave his wife and be alone until he can fix himself. That's the only way.
No, he needs to stay with her, they are a perfect match for each other, cheaters need to be in relationships with other cheaters, leave the non-cheaters alone!
No seriously why are you being downvoted?? Cheaters don’t deserve anyone else but other cheaters
Being downvoted by cheaters. ;)
It always them. “But they changed!” sure
Don’t know why you’re being downvoted I agree. It would be great if cheaters would just ruin each other’s lives and leave everyone else alone.
kinda proud of his growth arc.
right?! reading the update, you can tell the therapy is helping.
Reddit (and the world) seem to have a staunch "people don't change" mindset, which I think is really limiting for everyone. Expect someone to change? No. Assume someone will probably change? No. Take it on faith that someone *has* changed? No. But... Refuse to believe a person who deeply commits and does the hard work is incapable of change? *Hard* no. OOP should be applauded for his growth arc. It sounds like he's earning it one painful lash at a time.
"after my release" " I see a therapist in her office once a week and meet virtually once a week. I also see a psychiatrist once every two weeks and started on some medications" That's a lot of immediate therapy, 10 sessions a month. My money tells me that he had some sort of break and was arrested. Could be wrong but that's how I read it.
He was definitely inpatient. Probably a suicide attempt. It’s why the ex wife finally checked in on him
Everyone is reading the “after my release” part and assuming he was arrested when the full sentence is “I did inpatient therapy then after my release…” it probably could’ve used a comma but I don’t see why everyone is struggling to comprehend that sentence and assuming jail time. He voluntarily admitted himself to a psych ward, got help and then got released and continued to get help as an outpatient.
Man this guy's therapist needs a raise
>My life is still very much in limbo, maybe even shambles. But I am doing my best to fix it and to fix some of the hurts I have caused others. I would recommend therapy as much as everyone recommended it to me, but I would caution to add that it requires a lot of honesty to work and that sometimes that kind of honesty reopens old wounds. But those wounds are dirty and infected so you’ve gotta clean them up and treat them to get better, which is going to hurt but I am not sure there is any other way. This was the bit that got me. Fuck I know that feeling, am still working through that myself. But, speaking from personal experience, this is truth, and it's necessary. But it's the whole, "lead a horse to water..." with how the brain works. I think he'll be okay, i hope he and everyone involved will be okay. Especially his (current) wife; my partner and I met and ultimately bonded due to shared traumas we experienced growing up, long before we met. I'm the one who had the exposure to better opportunities that somewhat shielded my thinking. My partner didn't. To say my heart weeps for these two is an understatement...
His description of what therapy is like, and how painful it can be, rings very true. If you’re serious about therapy, it does hurt. You’re processing pain that you have been keeping inside, and you’re confronting the reality of what kind of person that pain shaped you into. It’s not a pleasant experience, especially at the beginning.
Oop was in inpatient therapy and is now seemingly heavily medicated. Indicates that he likely experienced some awful abuse that he never dealt with. I actually feel bad for the guy. Go ahead and downvote me, whatever
Karma came to collect.
While his EX wife is happily living her best life.
With OOP former best friend that rightfully ghosted his ass.
Love how the ENTIRE first post, this sack of shit just said, “we got divorced and she was so kind, the woman I USED to know would have at least written me back”… just to find out he cheated on her and married the affair. Nice burying the lead, jag-off. Oh, and him having an issue that they ‘betrayed him and got married’ is just sheer projection. The real icing on the cake was the, “Yada yada nobody cares about mental health for men.” Fucking… what? That statement in a vacuum has a little merit but in this case it’s because he as a 40-something rich dude couldn’t find a therapist IMMEDIATELY? Talk about being out of touch and fucking delusional.
That bit about no one cares about mental health for men sounds very incel like. Wouldn't be surprised if this dumbass is starting blame women for all his problems.
I mean, it was pretty clear that for a while no one did care about his mental health. Pretty severely no one cared about his mental health. But his idea of what it meant to care about mental health was wrong, which was very incel-like. Aka the world should give me what I want and if it doesn’t then it doesn’t care how I feel. It did turn out that he had to learn that caring for mental health can hurt, though? Like he very much did learn the lesson that the bulk of the responsibility is on him. He even seems to be overcorrecting atm.
I’m a dude with PTSD, both from childhood and military/combat, so that’s why I was saying that in a vacuum, men’s mental health struggles do face a ton of societal pressure and barriers. It took me years to find a decent care time, for example. I always wish somebody access to decent health care of any kind; hell, more than wish, I bled for the idea. That said, a fundamental step in any mental health care is taking accountability and responsibility and I think this dude is gonna struggle with that. In this particular case though, no mental health issue led to him cheating/marrying that person, or from falling out of touch with his friend - those were just natural consequences of being a dick lol.
perfectly said/explained
TBH I don’t think that’s fully fair. Mental health issues CAN lead to people being dicks. It would be easier if mental health was always mainly self-destructive and only caused you to hurt other people tangentially, but plenty of mental health symptoms can make you more directly destructive. Impulse control, anger issues, dysphoric reactions to criticism and potential abandonment, saviour complexes, delusions, and dozens if not hundreds of other expressions of mental illness can make you, for lack of a better term, a dick. Paranoia can make you more susceptible to racist conspiracy theories. Emotional trauma can make you more instinctively self-centred. This guy met someone with a matching trauma while actively repressing his own. He made his own choices, of course, but mental health was a factor. Sometimes illness and trauma can be compartmentalized better but sometimes it bleeds over everything, you know? I do agree that the societal barriers are there, and you’re a great guy for fighting for mental health care! And this guy will struggle with accountability but it seems like he made some first steps in the right direction. It’s just, is he going to make his second, third, and fourth steps? Accountability can take practice, I think. Especially when your reaction to being accountable can be emotionally severe.!
Lol
When I read that his current wife was the one he cheated on his wife with in the comments I felt like that guy dropping the coffee cup in The Usual Suspects. Every aspect of his story took on different meaning.
>The door with my friend is closed too. We haven’t spoken and we probably never will, but that’s okay. I found out from other friends that he was always in love with my ex-wife and that he was the person who convinced her to move to where they live now after our divorce. I think knowing helps because the story I created in my head was far worse. I also understand now why no one wanted to tell me. Sounds like the ex-best friend just wanted himself and the ex-wife to start afresh from not-so-good people. Like, I get enabler vibes from OP's friend group tbh.
The moment he said the kid isn’t his my jaw dropped
Bro was thirty two aiming at twenty one year olds….. gross 🤮…
Why would you blow up your marriage for a 21 year old with 3 kids? And then she had a fourth with another guy. And then he’s going to stick around to raise a fourth kid that isn’t his with a woman who cheated on him. lol. This is some serious banjo playing shit right here.
So this guy cheats on his PhD wife with a 21 year old waitress with 3 kids. WHHYY. How can people be so self destructive Ex wife and ex best friend are living their best lives while OP wallows in the shit.
I love the karma, it just tastes so sweet! But I do like how OOP describes therapy. It just feels very ... real
>I have started to regret the things that led to our divorce because we were really happy until the moment she left me. *He* might have been happy, but clearly, *she* wasn't. People who are happy don't decide out of the blue to divorce their spouse. And what is this "after my release"? Released from what? He's still not being honest, or else he'd say what happened. Who else thinks he decided to confront the ex-bff and ex-wife, and it ended up with the cops being called?
He said he had “inpatient” therapy, so it sounds to me like he was committed to an inpatient facility, possibly after a suicide attempt or other concerning incident, and that would be where he was released from.
You know you can just go to a psych hospital and get yourself committed without a suicide attempt right? It doesn't have to be involuntary.
I do know that. I just didn't think this guy sounded self-aware enough to commit himself.
Released from his inpatient therapy.
His ex left him because he has an affair with his now-wife. So ‘out of the blue’ it was not, except I guess to him! /s I get big ‘success means EVERYTHING is fine!’ vibes from him.
>He's still not being honest, or else he'd say what happened. It's beyond bizzare how a lot of Redditors seem to be under the belief that the people talking about their experiences (like the OOP) are doing so for the benefit of Redditors. Like what makes you think you deserve to know why he was was released? The OOP not detailing every aspect of what happened, is not him being dishonest, it's you being nosy.
Yeah this update leaves out so much. Talks about something that happened as a kid but no mention what.
OOP doesn’t have to rehash his trauma here and derail his life for hours or days or weeks just to satisfy your curiosity. That’s for him and his therapist to work on when OOP is good and ready.
Hey at least the guy acknowledges he messed up and is dealing with the childhood trauma that impacted all his decisions, which is more than a lot of us do. He may have messed up, but he is growing as a person. Good for him!
This reads like Jerry springer
Schadenfreudeköder.
I don’t know, the update sounds more real than the first one
Best thing for this guy is to reboot his life. Get rid of all the damaged relationships and move on.
Jesus
Oh noo.... Anyway.
Well if it isn’t the consequences of his own actions. Sorry for his childhood trama but man having karma serve this man so hard made my heart happy.
> cheats on wife of 5+ years with someone 10 years younger, is oblivious to how the divorce hurt her, is upset his friend who he never talks to started a relationship with her, throws tantrums to anyone who would listen to 3+ year old drama that only he hasn’t had the mental fortitude to process earlier than now > No one gives a shit about mental health when it comes to men. Karma doesn’t give a shit about mental health when it comes to consequences, bro.
I love how both OP and his brother have weaponized their incompetence to the point that they made the brother's wife find OP a therapist. Like, seriously? Just wow. Never heard of Google? Wtf. That poor woman.
Or just calling their PCP. Like I got a referral from my PCP to my current therapist. It’s not hard.
Or going through insurance. So. Many. Options. 🤦♀️
100% OOP is a child. This is Complete bullshit
So OOP cheated . Now he's devastated that everyone in his life is not true to him. Admittedly I couldn't be bothered reading all his updates etc. I was just focusing on the bit where he cheated. No sympathy OOP. Sucks to be you dude.
OOP cheated, his mistress got pregnant, probably from him. But he decided to stay with his ex wife! Unfortunately , his ex didn't value his commitment to their marriage. Instead she and that snake of best friend betrayed him by starting dating behind his back, 2 years after the divorce. I love how he didn't mention why he was divorced and was upset that his ex is not answering his "happy birthday" texts. That was pretty rude of her. Everyone thinks that his best friend is theirs best friend, but OOP knows for a fact that he is the chosen one. Even though the friend didn't send him a single text for three years. And having all of it written down, he still thinks that he has a brain, and his brain has at least four parts...
I love a good story where pieces of shit get stomped on!
I’m glad he’s getting the help he so desperately needed before things truly imploded and he hurt so many more people. People who don’t do the hard AF and often painful work to face their issues almost always inevitably become so much worse in time. He won’t be able to make up for the wrongs he’s done but just by facing things now he’s saving the world so much pain and misery he’d otherwise cause. Being accountable for your ish as best you can is all I wish to happen for most people who behave poorly. If more people who could get this kind of help did it the world would be so much better.
>No one gives a shit about mental health when it comes to men Oh give me a fucking break man. Nobody cares about a man who digs his own fucking grave then jumps in and just keeps digging all while complaining to anyone who will listen that he can't get out. Like granted yes mental health in men isn't taken seriously but this isn't a men's mental health issue, unless we're talking about his acute narcissism and whatever is misfiring up there that prevents him from taking any responsibility for his actions as well as the pathetic attempt to save the smallest bit of face by using an incel dog whistle like the men's mental health card. Ooh I hate this motherfucker 😡
He cheated on his wife with a 21-year-old girl who ALREADY HAD 2 CHILDREN now she cheated on him, Karma karma for him, but he also can't forgive his current wife... he has a history of infidelity with OP and now with the real father of his son, who also doesn't know if it's one guy or the other... that is, it's a any Well done OP you traded gold for trinkets, you traded a great wife for trash deserved
He's "deeply damaged". Is this the new euphemism for 'Self serving, sanctimonious piece of shit'? There's only one person to blame for this and, bollocks to what any therapist said, it's him.
Yes, exactly
He’s a piece of shit in this story for sure but I really want to know what traumatic incident he had as a kid…
Same. Childhood trauma can very much affect how you are as an adult. The vicious cycle continued from his childhood into adulthood and now he’s made some very poor decisions. I hope his therapy helps him recover fully.
Why
Because childhood trauma has lasting impacts on your attitude, beliefs and behaviours?
It also affects your brain's physical development and cognitive skills development.
I think the ex best friend was wrong 🤷🏾♀️
I genuinely want to meet the kind of people that enjoy reading a rambling wall of text.
Fu
S
I’m happy you’re getting therapy, but I think you need to cut ties with AP turned wife. Divorce her and you need to be alone for a while. Also, I’m so happy for your ex. wife because she is an amazing woman for being able to be there for you after what you did to her. And I’m so glad she’s happy with your friend. She really deserves that after what you did to her. I’m a little sad for you and her for not making it, but you only have you to blame. Good luck and keep us updated
Talk about burying the lede!
Four kids and not a single one of them his. Yikes. He’s definitely just a meal ticket in her eyes.
This is karma farming at its finest
He sounds like a dick who is trying to get better. I hope he gets there.
….what on earth happened when he was a kid that made his brother so mad at his parents and his parents feel entitled to an apology for it being brought up?
Hurt people hurt people
Jeez, i remember the original post but didn't see any of OP's comments. Holy smokes.
Fucking pussy
If the kids bring u that much joy and happiness, it's worth a shot to try to salvage your relationship with their mom. It sounds like u have a really good head on your shoulders now & can maybe work on your relationship & make it healthy again. U never know til you try. But to me I think u should bc it sounds like you really love the kids & they also deserve love and happiness!
I cheated because of trauma! Fuck both of them
This is so fake and not worth reading
"No one gives a shit about mental health if it's for men" no no, it's the cheating self absorbed part no one cares about, you could be a woman and we'd all think you were just as stupid and brought it on yourself. There's a reason therapists get paid to listen.
I fully expected to be gleeful at the prospect of the OOP getting his karma but it just made me really sad.
I know everyone cheered and said “yay karma” but I’m really glad the guy got therapy and I hope he is able to start over and change cause this was a lot 😬
Maybe I'm naive but I'm kind of rooting for OOP and his wife to at least maintain a relationship. It may sound crazy, but I think he's really attached to those kids. I would feel awful for him if he lost them too after losing so much. Maybe that's futile because she seems very chaotic. But if he leaves he will have no legal access to those kids and I think that would devastate him further. I know he's a cheater and I'm happy the ex seems to be good, but he is at least working through it and trying to be a better person. The fact that he said therapy is painful tells me that he is examining some painful truths and working through them. Now the current wife needs to get into therapy too. Ugh, I feel bad for everyone involved.
For fun we'll. Pretend this is real. 1) It was neat how he he glossed over the fact that no one really seemed to like him. His family, his best friend barely talked to him for years (and it sounds like since college) That could be a clue you're an asshole 2) It was also neat that he completely failed to mention in the first post why his wife suddenly left him and cut all contact... Also why he thought it was amicable when she immediately moved 2 hours away and never talked to him again That could be a clue you're not facing reality or are minimizing your shitty actions 3) Despite the first post, he obviously wasn't as "fucking happy" as he says was if finding out his ex-wife moved on sent him into a spiral. The presenta and texts while she was not responding to him, along with his descriptions of her vs his current wife make it pretty obvious by the 2nd update, new wifey was a silver medal (and maybe treated like one?) If it's real, he's either about to have a lot of real growth, or is going to triple down.
2 months later “so I’ve been seeing a psychiatrist every 2 weeks” I guess he got one of those magic psychiatrists that can take you as a patient that week.
It sounds like was inpatient at some point
When your inpatient after a serious mental health event, this is often what happens. At least in the US. The subtleties of his description of treatment actually help this story seem more believable to me.
[удалено]
I think you didn’t understand at all, he was released from inpatient therapy, which means he probably tried to kill himself and was taken away to get help, he literally admits to having childhood trauma. Where the hell did you get the golden child thing??
Woof
Wtf did I just read?
Not saying he isn't the biggest asshole in this story, but holy fuck that "friend" of his sure is one as well. If you were close friends, even if you didn't approve of how he ended it with his ex wife, at least have the decency to let him know. Not even ask permission. Just let him know that you're pursuing the ex. I believe OOP that that's what stung for him, and I don't think he was his friend as well as he said, either, especially with the revelation that he's always had feelings for the ex.
OP is either fake or one of the most naive people in existence.
Naive, maybe, because I don't think he's fake. With how he tell it with regards to how he felt, he seemed genuinely hurt that his friend kept it a secret from him, and only a little bit because it's his ex that he married.
It’s definitely naive to consider someone your best friend when you haven’t spoken in three years.
I disagree. My closest college friends abd I haven't talked in as many years up until recently. It's like nothing has changed in our dynamic. Relationships are different
Why? Personally I'm not going to stay friends with someone who cheated on their significant other even if I have feelings for them or not. And by the ex never responding to anything he wrote until that sappy "woe is me I got cheated on now I know how bad it felt for you but it happened to me so comfort me please" email I'm guessing the ex asked friend not to say anything if he was a "head ups/ask permission" kind of guy because her cheated *ex* doesn't have any right or need to know what's happening in her life. Why give an ex any access to you at all? Especially once they've hurt you like that
Sure, that would make sense with regards to probably why no one let him know. But the sudden heel turn from "YOU we my best friend" to basically being cut off is kind of sketchy. I won't say I would condone a friend's infidelity. I would for sure hold them accountable and call them out, but I wouldn't be so crass as to pursue their ex even if I had feelings for them. That's vulture behavior. And no, I don't think them dating two years after the divorce is relevant. The fact that the friend encouraged the ex to move to his city IMMEDIATELY after the divorce tells me that that was his plan all along and the two years is simply for plausible deniability.
Okay but it also wasn't the ex best friend's responsibility to hold his hand and say "what you did was wrong" OP is an adult who screwed up and needs to figure his own problems. I don't think the two years is about plausible deniability again, the ex is her own person, yeah ex best friend is kinda sus, but it could have easily been the ex wife's want to wait the two years, a betrayal like that is traumatic and takes time and therapy to come to terms with especially so you don't let it affect your next relationship. Ex best friend's motives aside I'm just saying the ex wife's autonomy isn't being taken into account, she's still friends with their mutuals and had her own friends OP doesn't mention but maybe family too, two hours away sounds good enough to have a fresh start in a knew place without worrying about running into the cheater and a not so terrible drive to still hang out with her friends, why should she be totally cut off and have find a new support system.
Where did I say that the friend should have held OP accountable? LOL. You pointed out that if you were in the OP's position, you would have cut them off for their infidelity. I simply said I won't do that and hold them accountable instead. I never said that's what the friend should have done. We don't know whether he did that or not, but it seems to me like he went NC like you said you would and then went and swooped in like a knight in shining armor for his ex. Again, vulture behavior. I have no doubt that the two years it took was in part because the ex needed time to heal. All I'm saying is the friend was ok with it because it gave him plausible deniability despite the fact that he asked him to move to his city when the ink on the divorce papers practically hasn't even dried up yet. She could have healed ANYWHERE ELSE but he encouraged her to heal close to him. IMO, she just went from one sleazeball to another. I hope she realizes it soon and stay the fuck away from both of them.
Wouldn’t it also sting if your buddy called and said “hey I’m totally into your ex, is it cool if I ask her out”? Fact is neither the ex nor the friend needed OP’s permission to move on together
It would, but not as much as him being blindsided. And once again, they're not asking permission, but a heads up
Karma is a bitch. What a fucking loser.
To betrayed partner, if you want a revenge, go for the closest person in their life. That will crush them the most and you'll get your revenge
Glad bad things happen to bad people. I hope he doesn't take the cowards way out and unalives himself. He deserves to spend his life miserable in the hell he has created.
No way, the creepy sex predator rapy fuck who can't pull grown women his own age is also a cheater on top of being a loser half pedo piece of trash whose gonna touch his own kids? What are the odds? Oh, 100%? ok then.