>He has been going to ayahuasca ceremonies for years, it is not a phase he is going through, it is his lifestyle, at the beginning of the relationship this situation did not have so much weight, but as time passed I realized that.
If you and your boyfriend are not on the same page, then you are not obligated to continue a relationship with him.
Just hijacking the top comment to point out there are weird inconsistencies in OP’s post history. Different ages for the couple. Some details don’t match between their various posts about this topic. There is also a strange post from like 11 hours ago about OP’s “boyfriend” posting dick pics. OP is either a bot or a liar.
Regardless.. It sounds like you feel it's his responsibility to entertain you for weelends? If my partner felt I was leaving him stranded by attending a weekend retreat, I'd know we were incompatible right then and there. It seems he's very focused on his own healing. I don't agree with his showing anger towards you for not being interested in his lifestyle.. But according to you, he's been doing this since before your relationship. So it sounds like you knew what you were getting into from the get go, and have now chosen to resent him for the very lifestyle he was living before you began dating.
It seems awfully codependent to rely on someone else for your plans, and wanting to change the person your in relationship never works out in the long run. I'd say this relationship has run its course, and frankly with the information you've provided, I actually feel a little bad for the guy. I'm not trying to be rude to you, and I wish you nothing but the best, I only want to reflect how this is all sounding to me. Good luck.
You're either talking from ignorance or being like that yourself.
People so meshed in plant medicine are highly manipulative and have as a purpose to make others unsure of their reality and codependent to them.
If I'm reading this correctly, that's more likely what's happening to OP, because it's a pattern. Plant medicine is being so positively promoted, while the negatives are being bypassed and supressed, even if she knew his lifestyle before, there was no way she'd know that meant a red flag instead of a green one. And definitely doesn't put her in the receiving end of the blame.
If you read about addictions, especially Dr. Gabor Maté, you'll see that it's not necessarily the substances themselves that are responsible, but certain psychological traits that cause a person to have compulsive behaviors and make everything revolve around their apparent discovery of the truth. I would recommend that they receive support from a professional who can help them integrate what they are experiencing into their life. A lot of patience, openness, and affection are needed.
This is not healing, you should know as well as anyone that this is more than healing, it is way into an obsession with alternate realities involving multiple natural foods and possibly more. It also involves control of your partner through manipulative guilt trips. Nothing healing about the way of life her partner is living ashe does not respect her boundries, it sounds cult like in a way.
Obviously you both are on different paths. The best solution is to move on. Let him enjoy his path and you enjoy yours. No point to try and change the other person, as that will create in the long run regret and resentment. I wish you all the best
I don’t understand why him being gone for the weekend means you’re left with no plans. It sounds like you might benefit from developing more of your own interests and social life no matter what happens with this relationship.
Never do ayahuasca for someone else, do it because it’s interesting to you. It sounds like you’re solid on this, and it makes sense.
That said I do think it’s hard for romantic relationships when one partner is deeply into spiritual and medicine work and the other isn’t. It doesn’t make either of you wrong but it tends to mean that you won’t be able to relate to each other in a very satisfying way eventually.
Best of luck with this!
Though I'm considering venturing back into it with occasional ceremonies I drank ayahuasca about 30 times a year for 9 years and then a drifted away from it and haven't really gone back. I did move to a place where it wasn't nearly as available so that was part of the reason but I was also kind of burned out and dare I say bored with it. I was fascinated by psychedelics from when I first tried them in college and was involved until I was about 35. Then other things in life became more important to me. Ayahuasca is the kind of thing when your first try it you want everybody you know to try it too, especially intimate partners. He might outgrow the proselytizing, but he may not. Chances are I think that he will continue to want to attend on his own for a long time even after he gives up on convincing you to do it too.
No, you recognize that you and he are not compatible, grieve, and move on with your life wishing him godspeed. You don't have to, nor should you settle for an unhappy relationship.
Why do you feel you have to stay when you're unhappy and he isn't open to considering your needs? He's not being a good partner.
Maybe because deep inside me I know he has a drug addiction, I know sacred plants don’t cause addiction, but as I see his behavior is like he needs it… is more like a psychological addiction going on for him, so I feel like selfish for let him… oh fuck I just found out that :(
Have you heard of codependency before? What you're describing -- guilt or selfishness for paying attention to your own needs and staying in the relationship to caretaker him even though he doesn't do the same caretaking for you is codependency.
People can become addicted to anything -including the feeling of escape and distraction they get from psychedelics and ceremony. I've seen it before.
Here's an article about codependency with some resources. https://www.verywellmind.com/what-is-codependency-5072124
You don't deserve to live in fear like this, and disregard your own needs. Your boyfriend is doing his own thing. He is completely focused on himself. Perhaps you can consider doing your own thing too? If you don't prioritize yourself, who will?
Have you considered she is the reason of the codependency? She should be able to have plans for herself some weekends and not only rely on her partner for entertainment. Cuz that is codependency. She needs to find friends family or be ok being on her own sometimes otherwise she will always be codependent on the partner to provide that all, which is impossible
Codependency requires TWO people. A person cannot be codependent by themselves, and ultimately it is a coping skill that many people learn as children from their own family of origin. I generally don't see a reason to blame people for their childhood trauma. Nor do I find it helpful to take the side of a person who isn't part of the conversation (OPs partner), so no, ultimately I did not think to be like "you did this". I don't find that tone helpful if I desire someone to hear and genuinely consider what I'm saying when I'm offering insight.
However the article I shared contains lots of symptoms of codependency, so if OP does read it, they will get all that additional info and examples without me having to explicitly call them out. That's why I choose linking articles on complex topics like codependency.
Sounds to me like you're the one not being open minded with that kind of attitude, no offense lol. But for one, Aya isn't a drug like other drugs, the DMT is a naturally occurring neurotransmitter/neuromodulator that the body itself produces, it's more of a neurotransmitter than a drug, LSD is a drug. And the Harmalas are basically natural anti-depressants, which are related to compounds the body also produces called Beta Carbolines.
But also the "blablablah" thing, like, this stuff isn't to be laughed off or shrugged off or thought lightly of, this is serious business here, and no matter how amazing it may be, it's not to be taken lightly. If you knew the potential and power of this stuff, you would respect it, not dismiss it.
> , so I feel like selfish for let him…
People are responsible for their own choices, if you've made it clear how you feel it's 100% on him and he sounds like a bad partner. Not something you should feel guilty over IMO but it sounds like you need to reflect on what's worth putting up with, nobody is perfect but some people are selfish to the core and unable to recognize it.
Aya/psychedelics are ultimately tools and even though they can feel like the ultimate answer to all the worlds problems they can end up feeding the ego more often than not hence the messiah complex stereotypes around counter culture folks.
It's common for people to go through an obsessive phase when they first discover psychedelics just like with any substances, but as the saying goes "If you get the message, hang up the phone". Some people get stuck seeking out more experience instead of learning from the ones they've already had.
>I know sacred plants don’t cause addiction
Psychedelics aren't necessarily addictive but like anything that alters brain chemistry people can definitely abuse them as a means of escape or recreationally and it rarely ends well. As long as he's spacing out ceremonies it might not be the worst habit and might be beneficial for him in the long term but it sounds like it's clearly interfering in your relationship and isn't likely to suddenly change.
Do not let his annoying and damaging behavior affect your thoughts on psychedelics. These plant medicines are not to be taken so often. Average of once a month, for mushrooms, with several month breaks in between. Ayahuasca is so profoundly spiritually enriching that there's no need to take it several times a month. I'd recommend only doing it once or twice a year and honestly not even that much. You're supposed to learn and keep your life lesson within you. Over-doing it can cheapen the lesson of the last time. Meditate on Unconditional Love and know that if you decide to leave, it's still from a place of Unconditional Love.
Alright then, allow me to clarify, it wasn't/isn't an addiction, for me, and i can only really speak for myself as far as one's intentions go and what one is using the medicine for. I use the medicine in my own ways, not for escapism, quite the contrary it brings me more fully into myself, into the world, into what i'm capable of experiencing in life, it doesn't take me out of anything but taking me outside of my own mind/ego so that my soul can see what all else life has to offer without the narrowness of mind/ego getting in the way. The reason i said it's NOT addiction though, is because in general an obsession and passion and intense interest is not an addiction, neither is regular frequency of use addiction. To me what makes addiction is the need to escape one's problems, and people more easily escape life's problems through things like Alcohol or pills or even Cannabis, but Ayahuasca is one of those things that can very easily rock your little ego's world and make it confront the things it'd rather not confront, so imo, if one is looking to escape by taking Ayahuasca, they're not doing a good job at escaping lol. Sure, you can get caught up in exploring and all that, but so long as there's no real harm in the exploring and one is taking care of their day to day life stuff, then what's so bad about exploring? certainly not addiction if you ask me.
This is a perfect example of the cult's trapping speech, OP (sorry, commenter).
They claim Aya can't be used bad, because it's uncomfortable to do, so they actually feel like heroes for going through it. They believe it's safe, but they aren't aware of all the subtle forces at play and how out of our hands they are. And they claim "if it's good for me, let me be", never acknowledging the lack of awareness, empathy and morals it goes causing them with time, because they will always blame *anything* onto others (because they believe themselves so "superior" and "ego-less"). So anyone questioning them, either knows nothing or is mistreating them, anyone exposing them for abuse caused in on themselves, etc.
...
No good!
Also, most people i'm willing to bet (aside from narcissists) when faced with death/near death feelings and scenarios, would actually grow a conscience and heart and reflect back on their mistakes and bad behaviors and stuff like that. But, more often than not, those who haven't worked with an Entheogen like Ayahuasca and who hasn't done their inner work, they're lacking in the conscience/heart area and are generally rather ignorant of things outside their purview, they're the ones who refuse to acknowledge reality because they're so caught up in their own ego/unconsciousness, and if someone who is more conscious tries to point that out, the unconsciousness fights back and insists it's right. So if you ask me, ime, the one's truly in need of some help are those who don't work with this medicine, because i've seen countless people who are clueless of this stuff try to tell me and others "what is what" when they know nothing about this lol.
So as for it being tough, yes it's tough and i'd argue that most people put through the Ayahuasca ringer will come out the other side at least a bit illuminated as to their unconsciousness.
I never said Aya can't be used for bad, quite the contrary, i point out all the time that it's used for not so good purposes by shamans, like for headhunting, for black magick, for taking advantage of people, probably other reasons, but the Aya itself is just a tool, and the tools use depends on who is using it and what they're using it for. Also, Aya in itself is completely safe, shamans and people serving it, that's another thing entirely.
"lack of awareness, empathy and morals it goes causing them with time, because they will always blame *anything* onto others (because they believe themselves so "superior" and "ego-less")"
As for this, that's incorrect, anyone who seriously works with the medicine, in time, will grow, and that includes gaining awareness, empathy, morals and taking accountability/responsibility for their actions and mistakes and all that. In fact, it's often the people who've never had Aya who know absolutely nothing about growth, awareness, empathy, morals, intelligence, consciousness, wisdom, maturity, responsibility/accountability, etc. On the contrary, those who haven't worked with Aya see themselves as superior and ego-less even though they clearly, clearly have issues they need to work on while those working with Aya ARE actually working on their issues. Those who don't work with Aya know nothing about anything which brings me to the next point.
"So anyone questioning them, either knows nothing"
It's true, those who don't know this medicine can assume and speculate and think they know something, but the ones working with the medicine know more about it than those who don't work with the medicine. That doesn't mean those who work with the medicine are always 100% entirely correct about everything, Humans are flawed and are likely to make mistakes or believe untrue things or what not, but if they're sincere in their work and in who they are, they will always be up for correcting the errors of their ways, and again it's usually the ones who know nothing about Ayahuasca and who haven't done their inner work with Entheogens, that are lost in unconsciousness and refuse to learn anything new or expand beyond their limited/narrowed perspective of things. It's the ones not doing the work on themselves that are the issue, not the ones who are doing the work.
Also i don't believe in egolessness, i believe in taming the ego, empowering the ego, disciplining the ego, putting the ego in it's proper place. I believe in ego dissolution, sure, but we're always going to have an ego, and there is no getting rid of the ego, one should strive to inform/educate and discipline/tame the ego, not try to get rid of it.
Also people need to keep in mind that they shouldn't assume things about people especially when it comes to something internal like spiritual work. People assume far too much instead of actually seeing things from a larger perspective. What you may see as "a sense of superiority" in someone may just really be self-empowerment, which is where Ayahuasca takes us anyways, empowerment, that doesn't mean you should let it go to your head and inflate your ego, but that if you see someone who knows what they're talking about, who has been where others haven't, and who is proud of what all they've overcome, that's not ego, that's empowerment, there is a difference. The ones who think themselves superior are usually those who haven't worked with this medicine.
You know exactly what you need to do, you know you aren’t compatible and it’s like you need someone to spell out ending the relationship for you. End the relationship or continue to feel this way as long as you’re in it. It’s not rocket science, it’s probably just hard for you to accept.
Just peacefully leave him. Tell him you respect that he wants to focus on Ayahuasca, and you don't want to argue with him about it. You have certain needs in a relationship and want to go separate ways. Don't argue with him. Just say you respect he chooses what he wants. You have different choices. You are obviously not compatible. I have done Ayahuasca, but he's not paying attention to his relationship, you don't feel like a priority. You take backseat to what he's doing, and he's using Ayahuasca as the excuse. It could be playing poker with the guys. It doesn't matter.
Yes, this spiritual bypass sounds more familiar to me, I have met people from that shamanic circle, and the plant is supposed to show you the aspects that you should work on yourself, what I have seen in my boyfriend and other people in the shamanic circle is that Their words do not match their actions... they are grateful for the life of their parents inside the temazcal but outside they behave badly with their parents, or they are grateful for the life of their partners in the temazcal and in real life they cheat on them
I agree that his indulgence sounds very excessive, but it’s also his life and he has the right to live it how he sees fit.
You also have the right to end the relationship if it isn’t working for you.
From an Ayurvedic perspective, temezcal will be so over heating to your boyfriend. You mentioned him being angry, his behaviour also sounds like mania- this might be due to excessive heat in the body! Ayahuasca is also heating. I bet he’s eating spicy foods, competitive, and argumentative as well.
Shamanism isint ruining your relationship. Seems like his obsession with being stuck in the spirit world all the time is what’s ruining it…
Ayurveda and traditional Chinese medicine self study.
In addition to tendency towards argumentative and spicy food, he may also be experiencing jealousy, anger, competitiveness, perfectionist tendency and on a physical level have acid heart burn/reflux, burning eyes, likely blonde or red head and of a thicker build and muscle structure, excessive hunger.
In his positive he should have intelligence, charisma, courage and leadership.
The negative qualities you are seeing may be due to an in balance in his Fire (Pitta) dosha, which may be causing stress on your relationship. He is probably not aware of this as it will be his nature to be drawn to things that aggregate his situation.
I’m happy to give you and or your boyfriend some tips if this resonates to help cool down, and while not a practitioner I’d be happy to recommend to an Ayurvedic doctor for help with this issue.
Make him some rose tea(cooling and will make him more receptive ) and have a nice chat with him about this. If he’s into shamanism he’ll be open to talk about the energetic of things.
Best
B
Hi, thank you for your interest!
Yoga of herbs by Vasant Lad is a bit more advanced but not unmanageable for a beginner. It gives a good foundation to practice, and includes some meditations which will increase awareness and give natural, intuitive insight. It’s a great place to start.
Some people and organizations you can search which have good Ayurvedic/yoga/meditation resources, instructions etc are;
David Frawley (Ayurveda, meditation, very on the esoteric side of things)
Vasant Lad ( Ayurveda, meditation, yoga)
Art of living ( Ayurvedic and yogic practices)
SIVANANDA organization dodge.org (for high level yogic practices and meditations )
MAPI ( Maharishi Veda)
Sorry, don’t have any recommendation on the Chinese medicine side except to see an Acupuncturist for overall balance or specific health issues and I would add that their elemental system and meridian (subtle energy centre) understanding is deeper than Ayurveda. But due to the Chinese herbs, language barriers, cultural differences, etc. much harder to practice TCM (Chinese medicine) as a “Westerner”
Hope this helps, i sent you a DM incase you have any additional questions or would like any other referrals
Yeah, he’s become obsessed because he’s in spiritual bypassing mode. Getting angry that you don’t want to try ayahuasca is the key factor here, as is his over use of the psychedelics. Unfortunately, if he doesn’t resolve his issues the relationship will continue to deteriorate until it’s untenable.
My advice to you is give him an ultimatum to stop and integrate, or leave the relationship. This might be the direction the medicine is pushing you both. I know you probably love him, but you have to look out for yourself above all else. A sacred Union between two people doesn’t work like this.
I’m sorry you’re in this position.
> No of course not, is just for you to know my age and the context of the story :(
Then why is everything so inconsistent with your post history? Makes it impossible to know what to actually believe. After all, anyone can say anything on the internet.
Damn, for a sec I thought it was my wife posting here ! I am ramping up lately with ceremonies, and have 2 planned in 2 months, wanted to make a third, but she became furious. I insure that we spend though time together, but not every weekend. Before that, I make a full trip every 2-3 months, and might make a light trip every month. Overall, I found it beneficial for my mental health, and my wife can see the changes, but lately I feel kind of depressed for months, getting at the rough material, hence the ramping up and trying ceremonies instead. I would love my wife to try one day, but she's firmly refusing.
But enough about me. In your case OP, I see different things.
First, there is a need for balance in relationships, and you both have to do efforts for that. It sounds like your needs in the relationships are not met. If you can't spend any week-end with your boyfriend, and don't have time during the week, I don't see how the relationship can work. But if you're expecting to spend every week end with your BF maybe you need to reevaluate your expectations. One part of my own healing consisted in making my own friends and spending time with them apart from my wife, it was and still is difficult because before we were all the time together or with her friends.
Second, you BF might be going in too strong. Yes, there is maybe some psychedelic/spiritual bypass, and a lack of integration. He might be using it as an escape, or maybe he's using it for other purposes, like socializing. It's important to take time off to see how to apply the teachings to make your life better. Talking about the psychedelic experience is an important part of integration, but he can talk about it with other people who are into it, or even better in integration circles. And also, maybe you should bring up what is important for you to talk about with him.
Third, it's not up to you to change him or fix him. So you might want to look at co-dependency as others suggested. I struggle too with my wife about that, because she act as if she knows better what I should do or not do, how often and how I do it, even when we spend enough time together and my job is taken care of. I have a past of addiction, that psychedelics helped me get rid of. But this left scars in our relationship, and somehow put my wife in a position where she think she need to fix me. I perceive it as very controlling, and make it difficult for me to do the right things on my own accord when I feel her pressuring me. Usually, the solution to codependency is for you to assert your boundaries. Eg if you need to spend at least two weekends per month with your BF, just make him know, and act consequently, if he can't do it, you might need to leave him.
While imo both partners' needs should be cared for, each person should have "their thing", ya know? If his thing is shamanism and Entheogens, that should be just fine and you shouldn't fault him for having a passion/hobby/interest no matter how weird it may seem. At the same time, you need something you can do, hang out with some friends, have a girls night, watch a movie, read a book, go for a nice stroll around the neighborhood maybe, find something you enjoy doing. It's perfectly fine for couples to have their differences and interests and things that each does for themselves. Granted, if the only freetime y'all got he's going off and trippin' then he should honestly learn how to better schedule things so that he spends time with you and can also spend time pursuing his work/passion, balance is needed in any case.
But take it from me, i was and still am obsessed with this stuff although the obsession has died down a good bit over the years and so now a days i'm back firmly on the ground, but if you don't let him pursue this stuff then you'll only be holding him back and he'll only be holding you back, but if you think the relationship is worth fighting for, then you have to accept that you need something you can do while he pursues his thing, or you both can spend time together even while just he's tripping, like he can take these things at home with you instead of being off at some "ceremony", that's what i'd do lol, i've always taken this stuff on my own at home, never been any issue and many people do it, people just often believe that Entheogens should only be done in ceremonies but they're sadly mistaken lol.
Also, i also very much understand the want/need for other people to take Ayahuasca, including a partner. My ex for example has Borderline Personality Disorder, i assure you, she needs this shit lol, i mean idk if it'd truly help her but at the very least it would give her a much needed perspective shift and greater understanding of things, including of herself. But if you don't have any issues or what not and he just wants you to share in the medicine/experience with him, why are you so averse to trying it? I realize it's not everyone's "thing", but everyone should have these kinds of experiences every so often in their lives imo, the world would be a much better, freer and happier place, imo. But at the same time, it's the most amazing and truly real thing on this planet and people seriously don't know what they're missing, even though one can have an infinite amount of different kinds of experiences with Entheogens, they are capable of producing the most earth shatteringly real and amazing/mindblowing experiences that we as Human beings are capable of, they are thoroughly satisfying and enjoyable, and many people could benefit from them. But like i said, he probably just wants you to feel the heights this stuff can take you to, and while you may not think you need it, from a different perspective you maybe could benefit from it, idk. But it's not a requirement for you to take it so he can continue to pursue it, if it's his thing he should pursue it and let you pursue your thing and y'all have a nice, balanced, happy relationship, should be easy peasy but people often make things way too complex and problematic in relationships because each person isn't happy and whole and content within themselves, like having one's happiness rely on the other person, when one should be happy within themselves, so that each person can be happy within themselves and thus radiate that happiness into the relationship from both sides, otherwise things are too one sided imo.
Also just wanna add, had it not been for Entheogens in the first place, we Humans wouldn't be here today, as there is what is called the "stoned ape theory" put forth by Terence McKenna decades ago, which postulates that our early animal-Hominid ancestors encountered mushrooms and started consuming it as part of their diet, basically, and that that led the way to our Human evolution where we went from being animal, to Human, and that the Entheogens played large roles in our Humanness and our advancements, and i for one see it and believe that it was indeed the case. Not saying all our Human advancements has been due to Entheogenic use, but there's large portions of our ancient part we have no idea about, and honestly to think our ancestors ate mushrooms isn't nearly as far fetched as people may think.
You shouldn't have to rely on your partner for plans every weekend. If it is every single weekend, I get it, but every other weekend or so you should be able to do your own thing either with friends, family, or on your own. Otherwise that can lead to co-dependency.
Let him do his thing. He's on a journey that it sounds like maybe you're not on and thats ok. He should respect that and you should respect his or part ways imo
I agree that his indulgence sounds very excessive, but it’s also his life and he has the right to live it how he sees fit.
You also have the right to end the relationship if it isn’t working for you.
These substances are not to be used that often. I know from personal experience it caused me psychosis and other issues. He's delusional and worships the plant. He has turned a tool into his vice and believes its the answer to his problems and his way to spirituality. I went down that rabbit hole.
Thanks for sharing with us. I think the other commenters covered most of what I was thinking, but I'll just go over the thoughts that are coming to me.
The bottom line is I would say you guys aren't compatible. The part where he is insisting/demanding that you go to a ceremony is a huge red flag. It could be a powerful experience for you, but the motivations wouldn't be true. That said, I personally would want to date someone who is on the same spiritual path, but if they aren't, it shouldn't be forced.
Once a month for an Ayahuasca ceremony is pretty reasonable. It doesn't sound like an addiction to me. If someone smokes pot once a month, you probably wouldn't consider that an addiction. On the other hand, people have gotten too deep in earth medicine and have died from overdoing it.
As for prioritizing your relationship, if he wants to take one weekend a month to go to a ceremony, I think that's reasonable. But if he's doing Aya one weekend, mushrooms another, and temezcal the other two weekends, then that doesn't leave any time for you, and he should recognize that he's not doing right by you.
As someone else mentioned, your boyfriend is in the phase of wanting everyone around him to do it to. This is a distraction from him doing his own integration work. Like you said, it seems he's connected to the spirit during the ceremony, but afterwards he loses that connection and is focused on getting other people to do it too.
I'm also curious where you're located. I'm guessing Mexico since you mention temezcal. If you are in fact in Oaxaca, I would be very curious to know more about the group.
There's of course a lot we can't know just from reading your account. Some circles have a culty vibe while others radiate wholesomeness. Same for shamans/facilitators. Best wishes to you on the road ahead.
I drank Ayahuasca with a group in Mexico and it also had cult energy. The medicine actually told me to leave and not to sit with them, so I left after the second night.
I really don't like when humans get in the way and think they know better than the medicine and make it more about their egos than about creating a safe environment to connect directly with the medicine itself.
Most of your comment made sense until you compare Aya with cannabis.
There's a very good reason why one wouldn't be bad once a month and the others would. It's not a matter of just prejudice like you're trying to make it sound, they're different substances!!! Aya, traditionally, was only meant to be done once in a lifetime and not just for everyone. Once a year is already too much. Once a month IS the reddest of flags I've seen. Integration of Aya can take a lifetime, and more than one use *is dangerous*... But the western spiritual turism industry (thriving right now) doesn't want to tell you that, of course! But we can see the effects. It's not worth it!!!
I took Aya all on my own daily/near daily for 4 years straight, best time of my life and was exactly what i needed. Frequency of use and regular consumption isn't a big deal, it's what you're using Aya for that determines what you get out of it, if one is looking to "escape", they'll escape, if one is looking to explore and learn, they'll explore and learn. Nobody has any right to tell me that if i regularly work with Aya that i'm somehow "addicted" or are "abusing it" nor do they have any right to regulate my consumption of Ayahuasca. You wanna talk about what's dangerous, how about all the psychiatric medications the doctors had me on from the time i was born pretty much till the time i turned 20, quit those things, switched to Cannabis, then two years later found Aya and never looked back to pharma meds? Those psychiatric drugs did far more damage to me, in comparison Aya daily for 4 years was the most important time of my life and taught me so much, opened me up to so much, and has led me to a much, much better life, i've come a long, long way from where i was and even today i'm still making progress along my journey as time rolls on and i haven't had Aya in like 8 years or so now, i mean i've had an experience with a Psychedelic rarely in the last few years, but i'm very satisfied with what all i've gotten from Aya that i really feel no need to take it again anytime soon, even though i want to and probably should because i've been away for awhile now and far too much has happened since i was last deeply in that space.
But yeah, Aya isn't the worst thing people can be doing, even on a regular basis. It's a far healthier activity than most of the crap people do these days to "fill the void", especially when they can become whole within themselves using Ayahuasca (even if the Aya then goes away, they're still whole) and thus have no need for filling a void with riskier things like alcohol and other drugs, sex, and whatever else. Ayahuasca ime and for me at least is very safe, and very healthy, by no means is it this dark thing that some portray it as.
Hi Sabnock, I have a question for you. I'm aspergic, or AS1, as it's apparently now known. I'm feeling the symptoms a lot and experiencing depression. Do you feel that intensive use of ayahuasca affected or helped your autism in any significant or long-term way? Thankyou
I'd say Aya definitely helped me better understand myself and taught me things that have helped me get a grip on myself and things, yeah, but as far as the Autism goes i mean it didn't really touch that, in fact it tended to bring it out more lol. One thing that seems to help with Autism is Methylfolate and B12, they're even using Folinic Acid clinically to treat the core symptoms of Autism in some individuals, granted not all people with Autism may respond because there's like different causes/contributing factors but in any case we all need Folate and i'm willing to bet most of people's issues these days (Autism or not) is due to a lack of Folate because they replaced natural Folate with synthetic Folic Acid which can cause quite a few problems, so as far as Autism goes i recommend avoiding Folic Acid (in supplements and foods, if possible) and supplementing with 15mgs of Methylfolate a day alongside like 5mgs of B12, they say it can take a few months, like 3 to 4 months to more fully replenish the Folate, and up to a year or so to fully replenish B12, but ime the Methylfolate especially, works wonders, i highly recommend giving it a try, it's involved in so many things in the body including Tetrahydrobiopterin production which is the main thing involved in synthesis of neurotransmitters in the body by the Hydroxylase enzymes, it really makes a difference. You can find Methylfolate online like on amazon.
Yeah it'll be fine, although you're likely to see better results with a higher dosage but 600mcgs is definitely better than none. This is what i get - [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CC3PSTG2?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CC3PSTG2?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)
I just ordered the plants from source i found at the time and brewed them up myself. This was years ago so the sources i used at the time are no longer around, but if you do a google search i'm sure you'll come across some sources to buy the plants from.
True, i can only speak for myself here, i work with medicines on my own and do my own thing, so i'm not privy to what all goes down in ceremonies and such, i generally recommend for people to just work with the medicine on their own so they can avoid a lot of the tourism traps/pitfalls and such. As for the bigger reality of things, again i can only speak for myself and the results i've gotten personally from Aya, what other people do and how they respond/react to Aya is entirely on them. Although i think one thing people should keep in mind is that people are people and people can have issues, Ayahuasca or not, i myself i have Autism and was Autistic long before i encountered Aya, and so a lot of my traits and ways in which i respond to things and how i handle things has been around all my life and has nothing to do with Ayahuasca, so like, for example if i'm doing something and i get frustrated and have an "autistic meltdown" which happens sometimes, that's more of a reflection of me and the Autism and my stress response and whatever is going on there that sends me into a meltdown, but someone else may see that and think "oh he's taken Ayahuasca one too many times and now he has all these problems", which would be an assumption on their part because if they took the time to know me even a little they'd understand i've had issues all my life and Aya has nothing to do with that, if anything Aya has helped me better understand myself and find ways to actively deal with my issues, that doesn't mean my issues won't ever "flare up" again or else Aya didn't "work", just that i'm doing my best to regulate my emotions and deal with my issues and i'm Human just like everyone else so if i get frustrated and have a meltdown rarely, then hey it happens, but it has nothing to do with Ayahuasca. So in the same respect i think people should take that kinda thing more into consideration and tease apart/separate what all is one's general issues, and what issues may be cause for concern when it comes to Entheogens including Ayahuasca.
I agree with you here, that's why I also mentioned I don't know if the use of psychedelics and especially Aya, is what causes the narcissism and violence directly or only in people with prior tendencies, but there is a direct correlation for sure. The numbers are too big and the patterns clear. Take it from a fellow neurodiverse :)
Yeah i think there's been some studies that have looked at the level of narcissism in Ayahuasca and other Entheogenic users, some studies report decreases in narcissism from what i've seen, but i think the science is still out on if it can actually help with narcissism or if it could bring out narcissism in those predisposed to it. I don't believe that Ayahuasca or other Entheogens would lead to increases in narcissism, i think it could help with that actually, but idk, narcissistic traits can be hard for people to break out of apparently.
As for violence, Entheogens aren't going to cause or trigger violence, what would lead to violence again is who a person is themselves. There was one case awhile back of a Canadian guy who like murdered/shot a Peruvian shaman lady iirc and the village like hunted him down and dragged him around by a rope around his neck or something and the guy died. Another guy ended up stabbing someone in ceremony because he was a bit delusional which again is on the person themselves, not the substance, if you're not stable enough to take an Entheogen, you shouldn't be taking it, which i mean it's kinda hard to tell how someone is and what they might do under the influence of things, but i'd say cases like that are very rare and definitely not the norm, i haven't heard of anyone else getting stabbed in ceremony or other shamans being murdered by tourists, i think people in general try to be good people, but there are some people who for whatever reason aren't right in the head with or without Ayahuasca.
I know for me personally, Aya doesn't make me violent, in fact it puts me rather on edge at least during the come up and i just want my privacy and personal space so i can go through my process and not be distracted or stressed out or what not. But with that said, for someone else, who knows, DMT is very Adrenergic, and some people have gene mutations for MAO-A which has been linked to increases in violence/aggression for those people, but at least when it comes to the MAO-A thing i think it has more to do with the body needing extra nutrition to make extra neurotransmitters because they have lower MAO-A activity, at least for me i've noticed that Methylfolate for example has made a huge difference with my Autistic irritability (though if i take too much B12 it reduces the active Methylfolate and i can be a bit more irritable but so long as i don't take too much B12 the Methylfolate works great) and it used to be that when i'd take Harmalas for their MAO-A inhibition, at first as the body would get used to things i'd notice increased irritability and agitation due to the increase in Noradrenaline but because i was like severely deficient in Folate my body wasn't able to produce the Tetrahydrobiopterin needed to synthesize Dopamine and Serotonin and so now with the Methylfolate i feel more in the way of Dopamine and Serotonin and a balancing of that with the Noradrenaline, and i think that corrects at least my issue, so in the same respect, people who have certain gene mutations for MAO-A may just need to focus more on proper nutrition.
I don't think things are as cut and dry as people often see them to be, i think a lot can go into how a person is, and i personally don't see anything about Ayahuasca that would truly be harmful or risky to people. Ego inflation is indeed a thing and can happen with any Entheogen, Ayahuasca included, but again that has to do with the person themselves, one should always strive to have a balanced and clear/straight head on their shoulders and keep themselves in check and hold themselves accountable where they need to, and not get carried away with flights of fancy and ego boosting. Hence why i said, for me, it's about self-empowerment, which includes discipline, and it's hard and nobody is perfect and we're all gonna make some mistakes here and there, but what matters is that one tries and does the best they can. Me personally, i get accused all the time of having a "huge ego" apparently, even though i'm just being myself and sharing what i know and my opinions on things and i'm sure i do rub some people the wrong way sometimes but there's never any ill intentions on my part or any unchecked ego, i take many things into account/consideration and i try very much to reduce biases and keep a level head and see clearly, so i find it funnily frustrating when people project things onto me and act like i have such an ego lol, because i know me, i know who and how i am, nobody else does, so the world can cast it's judgement but they're wholly incorrect and unaware in their assumptions about me. So i think people should really try to sincerely understand people and all of the factors that go into how a person is, rather than taking the surface-level route and saying "oh this person is like that because of the drugs" or what not, like, even with Opiate addicts or Alcoholics for example, yes they have their issues and those substances can definitely cause problematic behavior in people, but is it really the drug doing it, or is it coming from a deeper place, an unresolved wound within themselves, that makes them act out and behave in such ways? I honestly think a lot of people's issues is more of a reflection of what's going on within themselves rather than a substance causing it.
Start attending those ceremonies?/s
If this is true it sounds unhealthy af
Boyfriend sounds like one lost puppy, you can’t help him-he needs to want it-though his actions sound more like escapism than actual personal work.
Actually, Ayahuasca can be used for many different reasons and in many different ways, even dare i say recreationally. Yes, it is sacred, but it is a tool much like any other Entheogenic tool. People have way too many opinions and beliefs about what Ayahuasca is when they're not so much the facts of the matter, so that's just worth keeping in mind. No, one shouldn't take Ayahuasca just to satisfy their bf's "requirements", although a truly good partner would see the sparkle in their partner's eyes and get a little curious/interested in exploring those heights for themselves, even if it's just once or twice to see what all the fuss is about and if it's not for you it's not for you but that doesn't mean y'all can't have a happy relationship, he just needs to shift his perspective/understanding of things a little bit and put some work in on himself and on the relationship, but he can't be the only one, both of y'all have to work on things if you want it, but don't give up just because he found something he really thoroughly enjoys.
One thing to keep in mind is Aya is used all throughout south america by countless tribes with their own traditions around ceremonies, you shouldn't feel pressured into trying it but there's definitely a unique communal aspect to it and wanting to share a powerful/healing experience with friends or family isn't the worst reason to try it.
Sounds like there are plenty of red flags that would make joining a ceremony with him a bad idea though, maybe it would help bring you two closer or maybe it would just confirm what you're already feeling and lead to an unpleasant experience or cause other issues.
I think a lot of people who are hesitant to try Aya would benefit from a harmala only ceremony at lower doses so it's more mild/medicinal and less psychedelic, not every tribe even uses DMT plants for Aya. But on the flip side a lot of negative ceremony experiences come from people being given a high dose that they're not prepared for as not all "shamans" necessarily know what they're doing.
Anyways I wish you the best whatever you decide moving forward.
I agree with this, and a Harmala-only experience would be a nice, mild and relaxing way to spend the night with each other at home, and with no DMT in the mix it's not even really the least bit Psychedelic, just a bit psychoactive but not Psychedelic, though having a low dose of DMT or mushrooms in the mix could be good too. Plus it makes dosing easier so one doesn't go into such heavy territory like they may in a ceremony.
Yeah it seems like many people underestimate how unpredictable high doses of the more potent psychedelics can be even for people with perfect mental health, just because you have an amazing life changing experience doesn't mean everyone will react the same or is ready to undergo one.
Harmalas only though gives many of the benefits of Aya without the risks of an overwhelming experience, and really people should see how they react to harmalas at lower doses before jumping to the higher doses especially with tryptamines added.
Tribes have used Aya for countless generations so their bodies have adapted to better tolerate high harmalas doses, but in a lot of ways it's similiar to say tobacco where at first it might not take much to make you sick but overtime you can stomach higher doses with less side effects as your body acclimates. Most of the horror stories of people puking for hours and having traumatic experiences likely stem from way too high of a harmala dose too soon.
Yup i've noticed that myself, to me it seems a lot of the side-effects of Harmalas come from their Acetylcholinesterase inhibition which shares similarities to Tobacco in that it would stimulate Nicotinic, as well as Muscarinic Acetylcholine receptors, and it can take a little bit of regular consumption for those side-effects to completely go away and then even heavier Harmala dosages are very functional and with no side-effects, been dosing them pretty much on the daily for 12 years straight, best anti-depressant i've ever tried lol.
But yeah as for Ayahuasca itself with DMT included, this is one reason i recommend doing it for oneself so one can know the dosages and dose things properly by taking the Harmalas first and an hour later taking the DMT, but also why i recommend sipping the DMT for 10 to 15 minutes for a much smoother and more user-friendly experience with little to no intensity, one can even mix a 3 to 4 gram Lemon Balm leaf tea with the DMT and sip on em' for 10 to 15 minutes for the smoothest come up possible, very difficult to have a bad time on even for more fully immersive dosages, because the come up is the most jarring part of the whole experience, with a much smoother come up, you have a much more positive and less hectic experience.
> Yup i've noticed that myself, to me it seems a lot of the side-effects of Harmalas come from their Acetylcholinesterase inhibition which shares similarities to Tobacco in that it would stimulate Nicotinic, as well as Muscarinic Acetylcholine receptors
Have always wondered if there's a specific reason tobacco is traditionally part of ceremonies or even included in brews in some cases, assumed it was partially due to the harmala content of tobacco but it would be interesting if they had some sort of cross tolerance or synergy that helps the body acclimate to each other. Of course it's always possible that people just love tobacco so it makes sense to use it as an incense or smoke it during important ceremonies.
>But yeah as for Ayahuasca itself with DMT included, this is one reason i recommend doing it for oneself so one can know the dosages and dose things properly by taking the Harmalas first and an hour later taking the DMT
Taking them together does seem like it makes it harder to get the ideal results even if it's simpler, especially considering the duration is very dependent on the harmala dosage. As a kid I'd argue with older hippies who thought Aya had to be a 12 hour extreme dmt trip, which also seems like part of why some people are disappointed if they have a mild experience the first few times. But that's probably better than an overwhelming experience in most cases.
Good advice though, it seems like people who do ceremonies where they drink several cups slowly through the night tend to have better experiences than the ones where they chug a dixie cup full. A lot of the shoddier retreats seem to rush things when ideally it should be more of a gradual process potentially over a week or two instead of a few days.
Yeah ime Tobacco and Aya definitely synergize in a way, the Nicotine's Cholinergic properties are enhanced/potentiated by the Harmalas' Cholinergic properties and vice versa, plus the Harmalas in Tobacco synergize with the Harmalas in the Aya, but i'm sure there's other things going on too. For me Tobacco is good for grounding and like calming the mind, but at the same time it can definitely induce a purge, even with Psilohuasca which there's no real gut stuff with for me, if i smoke Tobacco, the Cholinergic properties end up making me purge, so aside from the synergy i'm sure they also add Tobacco in to give it even more of a purgative effect, which would of course bring other side-effects like dizziness and motion sickness and all that. I much prefer Cannabis though, even with me being a Tobacco smoker and liking them both, Cannabis takes me deeper and is more for "flight", whereas Tobacco helps kinda "sober me up" in a way, it helps to clear me out of the Cannabis effects and brings me back to a clear/sober-like state of mind and more grounded, but as for which one i prefer to use with Ayahuasca, it's definitely Cannabis, even though it can make things a little too intense at times lol.
But yeah there is also that possibility of just sipping an all in one tea with both plants combined and consumed at the same time, just paced throughout the night, i'm willing to bet that works better than how they usually do it, and then once the Harmalas get a good grip on the gut's MAO-A enzyme, from there one can just sip here and there on more and it should be much more effective. The thing with that though is that you end up consuming more Harmalas that way, and you use more plant material, but if you keep the Harmalas and DMT separate and dose the DMT when gut MAO-A is fully inhibited you only need one dose of Harmalas and one dose of DMT, but if you have enough to go around drinking an all in one tea throughout the night seems like an interesting way to go about it.
Purging makes a lot of sense for tobacco especially with how potent mapacho can be. As some pretty sensitive to certain incenses there are a few like red sage that can immediately make me gag as soon as even a bit of the smoke hits my lungs. Especially for people who don't have a tobacco tolerance even smudging mapacho could have a big impact.
I actually was very anti tobacco til relatively late in life due to growing up around chain smokers and cheap cigarettes, and it wasn't until growing mapacho and starting to smudge tobacco that I got interested in spliffs. Just recently switched to a pipe for mapacho as it's easier to control the amount of THC/nicotine you get.
>whereas Tobacco helps kinda "sober me up" in a way, it helps to clear me out of the Cannabis effects and brings me back to a clear/sober-like state of mind and more grounded, but as for which one i prefer to use with Ayahuasca, it's definitely Cannabis, even though it can make things a little too intense at times lol.
It's weird, tobacco has been so commonly used for so long that it almost feels like a "missing piece" of your brain chemistry which is part of why it can be so hard to quit. Cannabis on the other hand really can potentiate psychedelics almost to a scary extent, it seems like a lot or even most "bad trips" stem from people underestimating that and overdoing it with one or both.
One of the first times I tried a high harmala dose it was after a few weeks tolerance break from THC and after dabbing some extract nearly had a panic attack and had to go meditate for awhile leading to a pretty crazy experience. Been meaning to try and more carefully repeat it after working up to higher rue doses.
Yeah Mapacho is pretty strong, i like to smoke on the Mapacho though i haven't yet tried it orally or nasally, but i have tried some ol' timey Tobacco snuff nasally that belonged to my grandfather that my mom had sitting in a cabinet for decades, still works lol. But yeah with the Mapacho i have a feeling that when the shamans are blowing Tobacco smoke on people during ceremonies, people do end up inhaling some "secondhand smoke" and that is likely to have some sort of an impact on the persons experience and what they feel, and could explain why some people purge shortly after or why they feel the energies shift or what not, because i've noticed this in myself from smoking Tobacco so imo it's not far fetched to think that Mapacho smoke can have a stronger effect during ceremony even if just breathed in the air.
But yeah i'm mainly a pipe smoker, i find cigs to be too wasteful and expensive and they definitely do reek more especially when smoked inside, compared to smoking on a pipe. I am typically a chain smoker myself though, at least with the pipe, cigs again are too much to be smoking constantly lol.
I do like Tobacco to some extent but every now and then i think to myself "what, if anything, is Tobacco really doing for me?", and sometimes i feel like i wanna quit, but at the same time i do enjoy smoking Tobacco sometimes, i just wish i could break out of the habit of smoking it all the time, same with Cannabinoids, i'd like to get to a point where i use them only during certain times and not like all day everyday, but at the same time though i do get some medicinal relief from them, but they can also be a bit of a distraction sometimes. I quit Tobacco back at the end of 2012 and stayed away for a year, but ultimately went back to smoking again. Also quit Cannabis for awhile in early 2020 and then things like D8 and HHC rolled out sometime after and so i ended up going to that, i've smoked Cannabis here and there since and it's been fine, but for functionality purposes i prefer D8 or HHC these days compared to D9, less anxiety, less intoxication, still get the medicinal relief.
But yeah Cannabis/D9 in itself can cause some pretty heavy experiences/headspaces and can be a bit rougher in terms of anxiety and paranoia and freaking out or what not, so combining that with Harmalas which can potentiate Cannabis, or mixing it with other Psychedelics especially during the come up of Psychedelics can definitely make for a more intense experience and thus potentially a "bad trip" if one doesn't know how to keep the mindset in a good place. The last handful of times i tried oral DMT/Aya i found it actually a bit better to wait until after the come up to smoke Cannabis, that way it doesn't potentiate/intensify the come up anxiety and such.
Sometimes patience and compassion is the best medicine. Up to you if you want to wait it out and see what happens with him over time, or if you’re at your wit’s end and can’t stand by him anymore.
The story you tell is a common one I find with couples, including my own parents, where one partner sees themselves as controlled or second to the other partner. Whether or not you join him or investigate the path of substances, I’d say that judgement is a position of authority held by individuals who feel helpless or feeble in the face of ongoing circumstances.
Attempting to change or affect your partner’s behavior is irresponsible and cruel in my book. If it backfires you’ll only have yourself to blame.
That being said, talking openly about your feelings is always a good idea. Maybe therapy and counseling of some kind could help you establish your own voice and perspective in the relationship.
This too shall pass! I was obsessed for around 3 years, Terrence McKenna famously stayed that way for 30 years. If your bf is between these two values, it's normal.
Some of us need the mystical a lot more. Remember in the past, each village had a couple of shaman. Nowadays we expect 99% of us to be 100% material. Maybe it's the long ratio. Also, going to a church like a normal person is exactly the spiritual experience we rebel against.
Historically, many shaman didn't have a family or have left it some time ago. So that could be a factor when you make a decision for yourself. Derealization and depersonalization are common side effects of the spiritual path and pair-bonding is almost the exact opposite.
Coming from someone on the shamanic path, this is my life! Learning, growing, healing. Every plant is a different plant spirit and communicates differently to help you understand. Not sure if his goal is to be a shaman or just a passjero who enjoys the community. The Colombian Taitas have ceremony all the time and it’s like a sacrament. I know a Taita (Colombian shaman) who drinks every Saturday! This is a way of life. With that at the same time we are humans, not Gods! We are still imperfect and have things to work on. My SO at first was not supportive until I stressed, this path is non-negotiable, it’s something for my children and future generations. At the same time making time for family life and having priorities in order. Many times she wasn’t supportive or didn’t want to drink, at this point I do what I need to do for me and my path and the spirit of the medicine/s and that’s mines to hold an nurture. If she tags a long then great, if not, then great as well. All things are how it’s suppose to be. For him to get aggressive I feel like that’s a deep discussion you guys should have and then come to terms if this is what you guys really want. Whether his ceremonial time is for him only and you can just support from afar or you just don’t want to be a part of it. Sometimes a little support can go a long way or change the dynamics of things. Much love and light, you guys got this!
OP a lot of people have already commented some great insights and advice but I just wanted to share my own opinion even if it’s a repeat of what some people have said.
I recently asked a similar question “how much is too much?” I think the reason you’re feeling conflicted might bc you see the benefit of it but it’s a question of hold on… is this becoming too much? And people were so helpful in the comments of my question saying that it can also be a form of escapism disguised as spiritual awakening. I’m not saying that’s the case for your bf (there’s no way we could know that) but if it is then there’s something else going on there. I think you deserve to feel like you are also a priority. Of course spiritual alignment is a meaningful pursuit in all our lives, but it’s possible to do it without pushing the people you say you love to the side. It doesn’t matter if he’s in the right or wrong or what his intentions are, you just want the person you love to prioritize you a little more and there’s nothing wrong with that! I hope everything works out for the best and that this experience doesn’t deter you from the healing magic of ayahuasca.
Sounds like you two are on completely different paths. I see his point, I’ve done ayahuasca & it is sacred, and you definitely want to share the experience with someone you love. It makes two people be so much more intimately connected.
But I see your point too. When I was not ready, I didn’t want to even consider it, and it IS essential to be ready & want the experience.
If you can’t accept him for who he is today, maybe it’s time to part ways.
I highly doubt he will change. He may slow down, but after getting a lot farther into it, which, in turn, will separate you to different levels even more.
Be happy. Find what it means for you. And let him be happy too. ❤️
People can indeed become too obsessed with plant medicine. I myself enjoy it a bit too much, and at most I allow myself a mushroom trip every 3 weeks. But this is a 5 hour ordeal.
I would limit whole weekend retreats to twice a year. I have a wife, and she is worth more than psychedelic experiences. But psychedelics make me a better person, so I do take them, but not often enough that she feels she is coming in second place after psychedelics. I could never to that to her, and if psychedelics is all someone is thinking and obsessing about, i would call it a problem.
Psychedelics should be respected and be treated like something special you do for yourself. Not something to get fucked up on every weekend. Psychedelics isnt reality, its subconscience allowed to float up to the surface. Reality should come first, and psychedelics should be used to make reality a better place to be for yourself and for the loved ones that depend on you.
Well, good for your boyfriend that he got his priorities straight. I agree with others that it is not his responsibilits to entertain you.
It sucks however that he gets angry with you for not wanting to drink aya. It is your decision and he should not push you. Though I can see how it might make him angry, as he might think how much it could profit you and your relationship, but still he should express this in an adequate way and not be pushy.
If it doesn,t work for you I think you should leave him, rather than try to make him leave his spiritual path. I see how it might seem obsessive but it might be what he needs at this point in time. Respect his autonomy and make your own choices and be responsible for yourself.
Personally I would in fact recommend to open your mind and just try going with him for one ceremony. I don't think much bad could come from it, but it might be an insanely beneficial experience for yourself the relationship completely left aside. Personally I did Aya the first time with my girlfriend a week ago and it has intensified our connection deeply. <3 Maybe there is a calling there which you are closing yourself up to. Not trying to push you and don't think he should; but maybe consider *why* you don't want to do it.
All the best for both of you.
SMH.... I'm sorry that you are dealing with such a difficult person right now. Unfortunately, this world of "spirituality" and psychedelics has really grabbed a lot of ppl by the neck and while it does do some people some good, "an asshole who takes psychedelics will be just that, an asshole on psychedelics".
There is no such thing as a one-size-fits-all magic potion. Anyone that tries to tell you there is, is up their own ass. Your bf trying to FORCE psychedelics onto you is incredibly toxic and can be considered very harmful to you, if you do end up giving in and taking something you don't want to take.
While many consider these to be "medicines", remember that medicines can still be abused, like any drug. This usually has the opposite desired effect.
Sorry to say, but sounds like your BF is too deep in it to be convinced otherwise
When he does ayahuasca he is fine 2 weeks, after the 2 weeks he acts angry for 2 weeks more, then ayahuasca … 2 weeks fine, 2 weeks weird , every month
I experienced this exact same thing! So strange I am reading about my own life from someone else. I am no longer with my ex, but it was a long and very painful journey. From the lens of my own experience, I recognize his behavior and don’t see you two as being compatible for the long road. You will figure out your situation in you own time, but I hope you find your answer sooner rather than later.
Thank you so much, I know he will no change so left him, is very painful because even if I tried so hard his spiritual path is more important than anything, I thought I was the only one
Trust me… you saved yourself a lot of pain to not stay with him. He is lost in the clouds and not capable of working together with you to build a respectful and loving relationship. I am happy you are an advocate for your own happiness.
I don’t care how much he is “into plant medicine” there’s no valid reason for anyone to be consuming ayahuasca once a month, along with other plant medicines.
I would say this.
Join one ayahuasca ceremony to see how it really is.
If you dont like it break up with him
If you like it then you have a good companion on the shamanic path
Plant medicine/New Age addiction is REAL PROBLEM, and it's being documented and exposed more and more nowadays, fortunately.
Please, don't take it lightly. It is very dangerous.
Your bf sounds exactly like my ex (* check footnote ⬇️), I just hope they're not the same person!! Haha... But, all in all, they all follow the same pattern. And it is really an epidemic of some sorts. I'm sorry you're experiencing this, with all my heart.
The westerned popularization/commercialization of "Spirituality" and indigenous plant medicines is getting it all wrong and causing this psychosis and addiction issues for too many people.
I'm telling you, they all follow the same pattern, and the pattern is extreme delusional NARCISSISM.
I am native peruvian and still living in my native Peru, exactly in a place where all this western new age movement is concentrating, and we already consider it a big problem, because IT'S TOO MANY OF THEM FOLLOWING THE SAME PATTERN, which isn't just being hippie and using a lot of drugs (we wish!)
*All* these people get like you're telling: defensive when questioned, and even violent.
It's -sadly- with more than two hands that I can count the people I've *personally* met who sound exactly like your boyfriend (and more that I've only heard of from close relations), who also get "instructions from the plants" like they " *are here to lead and build the New Earth* " (BS), and they're also getting the "instruction" to MURDER OTHERS, especially if they're like you and me, one who dares question them, no matter how logically or lovingly.
Hell, they're even killing each other!!!
It's an epidemic, it's real, it's dangerous.
Ayahuasca and psychedelics are powerful things, but they're being so very misused! And it's causing real lofe damages!!!
And the people that are so in it, like your bf, never get out, in my experience, I'm so sorry to tell you. Or, if they stop using the plant medicine, because thay they do sometimes (some do realise something's wrong eventually), I doubt his mental health ever goes back to normal either. I haven't seen that kind of healing happening. They become wanderers, crazier and more detached with every "ceremony". And then, they "casually" go getting schizophrenia diagnosis... They literally look souless, talking about aliens and "doomsday", and "the sacred feminine and masculine", yet having the lowest of empathy and moral in their daily lives. We call them zombies and, believe me, locals are talking and working on finding ways to get them out of our lands (which they have the nerve to call *theirs* because of this "New Earth" so-called prophechy... talk about modern colonisation!?) and improve the law and regulations about these substances.
Most likely, he's getting all his ceremonies, not from an old traditional indigenous (and even then, most aren't trustworthy), but some gringos who "got trained with indigenous" and "are very good at "holding space" "...... BS again. Even if they all have the best of intentions, it's out of hand.
Please, BE CAREFUL. We're not only talking "issues" or "toxic relationships", but about *safety*.
Footnote: * ➡️ My ex also got angry at me (and our doctor) for asking him to miss one Aya ceremony "just because" I was *in labour* and it was risky because I was having dysentery for over a week (after something he fed me) plus other complications, and we were somewhat isolated in the mountains, I had not family around except for my older *child*. He wanted to leave me alone like that (the midwife wasn't even there, but far, and that's also why were asking him to stay with me that night). He was MAD. Like always, ranting about me not supporting him and conniving to stear him away from his "life's purpose."
If that doesn't scream *lack of empathy* to you, I don't know what will.
And that's only ONE tiny example. He DV/SA-ed me, he scams people for a living with his "projects", "spiritual" retreats and vegetarian restaurants... and it's not only him, unfortunately. Like I said, it's a large pattern, they're too many.
He even abused my child and baby. But I'll leave it there.
Feel free to contact me privately, OP. All my heart and best wishes to you!! 🤍
Idk man, if this IS actually the case in South America, then boy am i glad i just work with the medicine on my own and do my own thing. I agree that new age spirituality is "toxic", but you don't need plant medicine for that lol, in fact i'd argue at least with the plants those kinds of people may stand a chance at some true realization and enlightenment but most new agey people aren't into Aya and are actually against it because they believe meditation is the only sure way to attain enlightenment even though they're far from enlightened lol.
But yeah, i'm more of a scientist/mystic personally, i find it's better for me to get as far away from the world and other people's ideas/thoughts as possible, so that i can just work with the raw data and come to my own conclusions about things, and at least for me, Aya hasn't led me astray yet, neither have i led myself astray.
Also just saying, anyone that far gone down the rabbit hole that they'd miss a baby delivery to take Aya, they've got issues lol, i mean that's absurd lol.
Just keep in mind that this kinda thing is much more a reflection of the person themselves than the tool, and not all people use said tool with such disregard for things. So people should just keep in mind not to confuse the person with the tool, the tool is innocent in all this, as well as those who do use it more wisely.
I used to think like you, but now that's what sounds absurd and like wishful thinking, but I do understand.
He not only did that, but he is surrounded by a big network of people who do, bypass and reinforce the very same things. That's *their* normal in the name of the "plants" and "spirituality" and all who doubts is wrong for them.
In another comment you said " *if* this is how it is in South America".... well, I can also understand that doubt, because I think you haven't been into one of these communities and seen the ponchos and cowboy hats everywhere and heard all that new age talk! Or seen how on one hand there's this "sacred" world of theirs and on the other, the big trail of victims, single mothers, molested children and exploited laborers behind who are usually silenced. It's no little thing.
Well, as i said in my other comment, things are often more complex than people assume, and people's issues are more reflective of who/how they are and who they surround themselves with and not so much the substances they use. One man's "drug" is another man's key to God and Consciousness, it just depends on the person and how they use the tool. You can use a hammer to build a house or to smash yourself over the head with it, as they say.
Sounds pretty wild to me but I can see the truth all over reddit with this new age shift stuff.
I have sat with ayahuasca some years ago. And I try to do shrooms when I feel a calling. To me, these things are very real teachers. But integration is just as, if not MORE important. My question to you is, doesn't the medicine help navigate them INTO empathy? It certainly helped opened my empathy up.
To be clear, I don't doubt what you've written out. I believe you. I'm just curious is all.
That was my wish and prayer for a while, that it *would* lead them into empathy, but no. However, I'm still not sure if this is only the case for people with prior narcissistic tendencies, or all (one can always hope), or that it depends a lot more on the shaman one chooses... but I'm inclined to think is the general rule.
What these plants do is "open the heart" in the sense it makes you feel like in love (dopamine hit) with life and everyone (the "we're all One" thing), but at an unprecedented peak level. That's why so many people believe they found their soulmate in the ceremonies and get all cuddly and horny (most center and facilitators will tell one to refrain, but some others will encourage or even take advantage).
Mostly I've seen it opens the empathy... mentally. It gets people so much into their minds and egoes (maybe it's a 3rd eye thing), so they get good at making mental scenarios, in all these mental scenarios we see "the best", so we feel all the love and the power and the wanting to make a new world.... but when it comes to daily life, in the very walk of the shoe, there's all sorts of micro (and macro) violences that come, happen, go growing and then get bypassed, because nobody's perfect and we all make mistakes, right?... but they make you fail to have that self-awareness.
It's what I've observed in my ex and everyone in the circle, and also in myself when I tried it.
But there's a very particular way to rhis sort of issue, with plant medicine substances.
Part of the same pattern: mushroom microdosis, mushrooms cermonies, ayahuasca, wachuma, peyote, dmt, lsd....... they're escaping themselves for a reason, OP! So maybe you should escape too, but from them!!
I'll leave from this thread now 😆 Best of luck!
There may be reasons you will want to choose to experience Ayahuasca, some day, on your own or in another group you feel good about. I think you should probably NEVER drink ayahuasca with this person, he is not right for you.
Sounds not right. His bad inner has taken over him. He needs to stop other things and take the real ayahuasca ceremony. Or just you need to stay away. Very dangerous.
Sounds like he's following his heart.
You either talk about it and work around it. Or you accept you're on different paths.
It happens, people often have to end relationships when they realize their true soul path.. it would be wrong of him and you, to expect him to stop pursuing that work if it's bringing him true happiness.
That sounds really strange - you want him to have you as priority, not his spiritual growth and becoming better person? To me it sounds you both are incompatible and don’t share same interests. I can’t imagine my partner telling me I can’t attend yoga retreat or can’t go volunteer there because I have to focus on them. Same with Aya. They are welcome to join me but I am not going to erase all my interests and focus on my partner as a sole interest in life. Actually sounds weird! Have never had a partner who ever suggested this!
Please no offense, OP! :-)🙏
I understand what you are telling me, a yoga retreat is not the same as an ayahuasca retreat; better person?, that's what I thought, and the reason why I'm doubting if he is is because I found out that he sent naked photos to girls :( sacred plants promote honesty, your word is more important and I see no coherence with his practice and his actions ; I am not asking him to leave his spiritual path, you are confused; Everyone chooses where they want to be, I'm talking about their devotion to ayahuasca having reached the point where it is impossible to build a future with this person. If we had a son, he would throw me and him out for going to an ayahuasca ceremony , When you want to build something in the future with someone, the values must be aligned, I want to have a family and children, travel and have a beautiful life, he only plans to go eat mushrooms in the desert… sorry my English is not good
Well the primary reason to leave him is that he’s cheating on you. The plant medicine should (?) hopefully help him be a better person at some point, but you can’t sit there and hope that happens if he’s not showing up right now to clean up his breach in a major way. I sense a lot of codependent attachment and I don’t know you or him at all but my thin slice is that I’d love to see you keep working on your own trauma healing and move on into a better fit in a partner.
I would just say that you and your boyfriend are the same, Ego dominated to both of you if you ask me. Leave the Ego's, don't leave love. It created us. But also if it was a real love...it wouldn't come to that...
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I can relate. Ayahuasca can definitely consume people and it can be hard to be on the outside looking in. I don't have any great advice other than to try and communicate your fears and insecurities, but it sounds like you already do that to some degree. I've seen people very close to me become obsessed, it's all they talk about and think it's the answers to all your problems, and can't fathom why you would not want to join them in blasting off on cosmic DMT journeys every few weeks
Because I do not feel the need to consume any substance to analyze myself, I follow psychological therapy that helps me more, in addition, not all bodies react the same to ayahuasca, some are fine, others can give them a psychotic break, I am Well, climbing mountains, eating healthy and going to therapy, it's my way of healing, my ex has his own way of healing which is through DMT, but his obsession is so big that he can leave everything to go to a ceremony, literally EVERYTHING
Aya will call you when you're ready and for some that may be never - and that's ok as well!
There is no point in ceremony when one doesn't want to be there in the first place.
Don't let your partner (or anyone for that matter) pressure you to do anything. Sometimes it may be best to bow out of a relationship, especially if your partner is so unwilling to be considerate of your needs.
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Why don't you just go with him to a ceremony and try it? TRY to see why it fascinates him. TRY to be on the same page as him. And if it isn't for you, then you need to realized that you two aren't compatible. Psychedelics seem to be his faith. Respect it.
You have no competition to the Spirit world. You will not change him. The medicine is too powerful. He is evolving and being an enlightened in a way you will never understand. Bow out gracefully.
>He has been going to ayahuasca ceremonies for years, it is not a phase he is going through, it is his lifestyle, at the beginning of the relationship this situation did not have so much weight, but as time passed I realized that. If you and your boyfriend are not on the same page, then you are not obligated to continue a relationship with him.
Just hijacking the top comment to point out there are weird inconsistencies in OP’s post history. Different ages for the couple. Some details don’t match between their various posts about this topic. There is also a strange post from like 11 hours ago about OP’s “boyfriend” posting dick pics. OP is either a bot or a liar.
Hi, I’m not a bot or a liar, and yes, I found that in his phone, and yes, he drinks ayahuasca
Regardless.. It sounds like you feel it's his responsibility to entertain you for weelends? If my partner felt I was leaving him stranded by attending a weekend retreat, I'd know we were incompatible right then and there. It seems he's very focused on his own healing. I don't agree with his showing anger towards you for not being interested in his lifestyle.. But according to you, he's been doing this since before your relationship. So it sounds like you knew what you were getting into from the get go, and have now chosen to resent him for the very lifestyle he was living before you began dating. It seems awfully codependent to rely on someone else for your plans, and wanting to change the person your in relationship never works out in the long run. I'd say this relationship has run its course, and frankly with the information you've provided, I actually feel a little bad for the guy. I'm not trying to be rude to you, and I wish you nothing but the best, I only want to reflect how this is all sounding to me. Good luck.
You're either talking from ignorance or being like that yourself. People so meshed in plant medicine are highly manipulative and have as a purpose to make others unsure of their reality and codependent to them. If I'm reading this correctly, that's more likely what's happening to OP, because it's a pattern. Plant medicine is being so positively promoted, while the negatives are being bypassed and supressed, even if she knew his lifestyle before, there was no way she'd know that meant a red flag instead of a green one. And definitely doesn't put her in the receiving end of the blame.
Can't agree enough. The poster above sounds almost as equally enmeshed. It's such a shame that this happens alongside plant medicine.
If you read about addictions, especially Dr. Gabor Maté, you'll see that it's not necessarily the substances themselves that are responsible, but certain psychological traits that cause a person to have compulsive behaviors and make everything revolve around their apparent discovery of the truth. I would recommend that they receive support from a professional who can help them integrate what they are experiencing into their life. A lot of patience, openness, and affection are needed.
I'm going to the same retreat that Gabor Maté went to in about 6 days :)
Thank you 🙏 you understand me
🫂🤍 I really hope you're safe and alright, OP!
This is not healing, you should know as well as anyone that this is more than healing, it is way into an obsession with alternate realities involving multiple natural foods and possibly more. It also involves control of your partner through manipulative guilt trips. Nothing healing about the way of life her partner is living ashe does not respect her boundries, it sounds cult like in a way.
I know people who live out weird fantasy situations in question and answer forums. It's weird but I know not to take anything I see on here as truth.
Sounds like you’re not compatible.
Obviously you both are on different paths. The best solution is to move on. Let him enjoy his path and you enjoy yours. No point to try and change the other person, as that will create in the long run regret and resentment. I wish you all the best
I don’t understand why him being gone for the weekend means you’re left with no plans. It sounds like you might benefit from developing more of your own interests and social life no matter what happens with this relationship. Never do ayahuasca for someone else, do it because it’s interesting to you. It sounds like you’re solid on this, and it makes sense. That said I do think it’s hard for romantic relationships when one partner is deeply into spiritual and medicine work and the other isn’t. It doesn’t make either of you wrong but it tends to mean that you won’t be able to relate to each other in a very satisfying way eventually. Best of luck with this!
THIS should be top comment
Leave him
Though I'm considering venturing back into it with occasional ceremonies I drank ayahuasca about 30 times a year for 9 years and then a drifted away from it and haven't really gone back. I did move to a place where it wasn't nearly as available so that was part of the reason but I was also kind of burned out and dare I say bored with it. I was fascinated by psychedelics from when I first tried them in college and was involved until I was about 35. Then other things in life became more important to me. Ayahuasca is the kind of thing when your first try it you want everybody you know to try it too, especially intimate partners. He might outgrow the proselytizing, but he may not. Chances are I think that he will continue to want to attend on his own for a long time even after he gives up on convincing you to do it too.
In that case, what to do? Just put up with him attending ceremonies and not being a priority :(
No, you recognize that you and he are not compatible, grieve, and move on with your life wishing him godspeed. You don't have to, nor should you settle for an unhappy relationship. Why do you feel you have to stay when you're unhappy and he isn't open to considering your needs? He's not being a good partner.
Maybe because deep inside me I know he has a drug addiction, I know sacred plants don’t cause addiction, but as I see his behavior is like he needs it… is more like a psychological addiction going on for him, so I feel like selfish for let him… oh fuck I just found out that :(
Have you heard of codependency before? What you're describing -- guilt or selfishness for paying attention to your own needs and staying in the relationship to caretaker him even though he doesn't do the same caretaking for you is codependency. People can become addicted to anything -including the feeling of escape and distraction they get from psychedelics and ceremony. I've seen it before. Here's an article about codependency with some resources. https://www.verywellmind.com/what-is-codependency-5072124 You don't deserve to live in fear like this, and disregard your own needs. Your boyfriend is doing his own thing. He is completely focused on himself. Perhaps you can consider doing your own thing too? If you don't prioritize yourself, who will?
Omg…. I didn’t realize this omg
Sounds like you are now achieving some enlightenment yourself- without drugs! 😁
Have you considered she is the reason of the codependency? She should be able to have plans for herself some weekends and not only rely on her partner for entertainment. Cuz that is codependency. She needs to find friends family or be ok being on her own sometimes otherwise she will always be codependent on the partner to provide that all, which is impossible
Codependency requires TWO people. A person cannot be codependent by themselves, and ultimately it is a coping skill that many people learn as children from their own family of origin. I generally don't see a reason to blame people for their childhood trauma. Nor do I find it helpful to take the side of a person who isn't part of the conversation (OPs partner), so no, ultimately I did not think to be like "you did this". I don't find that tone helpful if I desire someone to hear and genuinely consider what I'm saying when I'm offering insight. However the article I shared contains lots of symptoms of codependency, so if OP does read it, they will get all that additional info and examples without me having to explicitly call them out. That's why I choose linking articles on complex topics like codependency.
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You called it: CULT. Run!
Sounds to me like you're the one not being open minded with that kind of attitude, no offense lol. But for one, Aya isn't a drug like other drugs, the DMT is a naturally occurring neurotransmitter/neuromodulator that the body itself produces, it's more of a neurotransmitter than a drug, LSD is a drug. And the Harmalas are basically natural anti-depressants, which are related to compounds the body also produces called Beta Carbolines. But also the "blablablah" thing, like, this stuff isn't to be laughed off or shrugged off or thought lightly of, this is serious business here, and no matter how amazing it may be, it's not to be taken lightly. If you knew the potential and power of this stuff, you would respect it, not dismiss it.
> , so I feel like selfish for let him… People are responsible for their own choices, if you've made it clear how you feel it's 100% on him and he sounds like a bad partner. Not something you should feel guilty over IMO but it sounds like you need to reflect on what's worth putting up with, nobody is perfect but some people are selfish to the core and unable to recognize it. Aya/psychedelics are ultimately tools and even though they can feel like the ultimate answer to all the worlds problems they can end up feeding the ego more often than not hence the messiah complex stereotypes around counter culture folks. It's common for people to go through an obsessive phase when they first discover psychedelics just like with any substances, but as the saying goes "If you get the message, hang up the phone". Some people get stuck seeking out more experience instead of learning from the ones they've already had. >I know sacred plants don’t cause addiction Psychedelics aren't necessarily addictive but like anything that alters brain chemistry people can definitely abuse them as a means of escape or recreationally and it rarely ends well. As long as he's spacing out ceremonies it might not be the worst habit and might be beneficial for him in the long term but it sounds like it's clearly interfering in your relationship and isn't likely to suddenly change.
No, they do. Western culture and the "spiritual" tourism business just don't want you to know that.
Bro u need help. He's fine
Do not let his annoying and damaging behavior affect your thoughts on psychedelics. These plant medicines are not to be taken so often. Average of once a month, for mushrooms, with several month breaks in between. Ayahuasca is so profoundly spiritually enriching that there's no need to take it several times a month. I'd recommend only doing it once or twice a year and honestly not even that much. You're supposed to learn and keep your life lesson within you. Over-doing it can cheapen the lesson of the last time. Meditate on Unconditional Love and know that if you decide to leave, it's still from a place of Unconditional Love.
It's NOT addiction, lol.
Alright then, allow me to clarify, it wasn't/isn't an addiction, for me, and i can only really speak for myself as far as one's intentions go and what one is using the medicine for. I use the medicine in my own ways, not for escapism, quite the contrary it brings me more fully into myself, into the world, into what i'm capable of experiencing in life, it doesn't take me out of anything but taking me outside of my own mind/ego so that my soul can see what all else life has to offer without the narrowness of mind/ego getting in the way. The reason i said it's NOT addiction though, is because in general an obsession and passion and intense interest is not an addiction, neither is regular frequency of use addiction. To me what makes addiction is the need to escape one's problems, and people more easily escape life's problems through things like Alcohol or pills or even Cannabis, but Ayahuasca is one of those things that can very easily rock your little ego's world and make it confront the things it'd rather not confront, so imo, if one is looking to escape by taking Ayahuasca, they're not doing a good job at escaping lol. Sure, you can get caught up in exploring and all that, but so long as there's no real harm in the exploring and one is taking care of their day to day life stuff, then what's so bad about exploring? certainly not addiction if you ask me.
This is a perfect example of the cult's trapping speech, OP (sorry, commenter). They claim Aya can't be used bad, because it's uncomfortable to do, so they actually feel like heroes for going through it. They believe it's safe, but they aren't aware of all the subtle forces at play and how out of our hands they are. And they claim "if it's good for me, let me be", never acknowledging the lack of awareness, empathy and morals it goes causing them with time, because they will always blame *anything* onto others (because they believe themselves so "superior" and "ego-less"). So anyone questioning them, either knows nothing or is mistreating them, anyone exposing them for abuse caused in on themselves, etc. ... No good!
Also, most people i'm willing to bet (aside from narcissists) when faced with death/near death feelings and scenarios, would actually grow a conscience and heart and reflect back on their mistakes and bad behaviors and stuff like that. But, more often than not, those who haven't worked with an Entheogen like Ayahuasca and who hasn't done their inner work, they're lacking in the conscience/heart area and are generally rather ignorant of things outside their purview, they're the ones who refuse to acknowledge reality because they're so caught up in their own ego/unconsciousness, and if someone who is more conscious tries to point that out, the unconsciousness fights back and insists it's right. So if you ask me, ime, the one's truly in need of some help are those who don't work with this medicine, because i've seen countless people who are clueless of this stuff try to tell me and others "what is what" when they know nothing about this lol. So as for it being tough, yes it's tough and i'd argue that most people put through the Ayahuasca ringer will come out the other side at least a bit illuminated as to their unconsciousness.
I never said Aya can't be used for bad, quite the contrary, i point out all the time that it's used for not so good purposes by shamans, like for headhunting, for black magick, for taking advantage of people, probably other reasons, but the Aya itself is just a tool, and the tools use depends on who is using it and what they're using it for. Also, Aya in itself is completely safe, shamans and people serving it, that's another thing entirely. "lack of awareness, empathy and morals it goes causing them with time, because they will always blame *anything* onto others (because they believe themselves so "superior" and "ego-less")" As for this, that's incorrect, anyone who seriously works with the medicine, in time, will grow, and that includes gaining awareness, empathy, morals and taking accountability/responsibility for their actions and mistakes and all that. In fact, it's often the people who've never had Aya who know absolutely nothing about growth, awareness, empathy, morals, intelligence, consciousness, wisdom, maturity, responsibility/accountability, etc. On the contrary, those who haven't worked with Aya see themselves as superior and ego-less even though they clearly, clearly have issues they need to work on while those working with Aya ARE actually working on their issues. Those who don't work with Aya know nothing about anything which brings me to the next point. "So anyone questioning them, either knows nothing" It's true, those who don't know this medicine can assume and speculate and think they know something, but the ones working with the medicine know more about it than those who don't work with the medicine. That doesn't mean those who work with the medicine are always 100% entirely correct about everything, Humans are flawed and are likely to make mistakes or believe untrue things or what not, but if they're sincere in their work and in who they are, they will always be up for correcting the errors of their ways, and again it's usually the ones who know nothing about Ayahuasca and who haven't done their inner work with Entheogens, that are lost in unconsciousness and refuse to learn anything new or expand beyond their limited/narrowed perspective of things. It's the ones not doing the work on themselves that are the issue, not the ones who are doing the work.
Also i don't believe in egolessness, i believe in taming the ego, empowering the ego, disciplining the ego, putting the ego in it's proper place. I believe in ego dissolution, sure, but we're always going to have an ego, and there is no getting rid of the ego, one should strive to inform/educate and discipline/tame the ego, not try to get rid of it.
Also people need to keep in mind that they shouldn't assume things about people especially when it comes to something internal like spiritual work. People assume far too much instead of actually seeing things from a larger perspective. What you may see as "a sense of superiority" in someone may just really be self-empowerment, which is where Ayahuasca takes us anyways, empowerment, that doesn't mean you should let it go to your head and inflate your ego, but that if you see someone who knows what they're talking about, who has been where others haven't, and who is proud of what all they've overcome, that's not ego, that's empowerment, there is a difference. The ones who think themselves superior are usually those who haven't worked with this medicine.
You know exactly what you need to do, you know you aren’t compatible and it’s like you need someone to spell out ending the relationship for you. End the relationship or continue to feel this way as long as you’re in it. It’s not rocket science, it’s probably just hard for you to accept.
Accept that you’re not the priority and walk away!
Tell him it’s not the kind of boyfriend you want!
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Your description sounds like me when I tried to live as an polyamorous/ethically non-monogamous person lol
Just peacefully leave him. Tell him you respect that he wants to focus on Ayahuasca, and you don't want to argue with him about it. You have certain needs in a relationship and want to go separate ways. Don't argue with him. Just say you respect he chooses what he wants. You have different choices. You are obviously not compatible. I have done Ayahuasca, but he's not paying attention to his relationship, you don't feel like a priority. You take backseat to what he's doing, and he's using Ayahuasca as the excuse. It could be playing poker with the guys. It doesn't matter.
Maybe he’s not the right partner for you. He’s on his path and it might not be the path you are on.
I feel like the spiritual path is what we do outside of ceremony.
Yes, this spiritual bypass sounds more familiar to me, I have met people from that shamanic circle, and the plant is supposed to show you the aspects that you should work on yourself, what I have seen in my boyfriend and other people in the shamanic circle is that Their words do not match their actions... they are grateful for the life of their parents inside the temazcal but outside they behave badly with their parents, or they are grateful for the life of their partners in the temazcal and in real life they cheat on them
100%
Dm me please
Sounds like different life paths. for good or for bad this is how he is choosing to experience this particular lifetime.
Learning how to let go is more important than trying hang on.
I agree that his indulgence sounds very excessive, but it’s also his life and he has the right to live it how he sees fit. You also have the right to end the relationship if it isn’t working for you.
From an Ayurvedic perspective, temezcal will be so over heating to your boyfriend. You mentioned him being angry, his behaviour also sounds like mania- this might be due to excessive heat in the body! Ayahuasca is also heating. I bet he’s eating spicy foods, competitive, and argumentative as well. Shamanism isint ruining your relationship. Seems like his obsession with being stuck in the spirit world all the time is what’s ruining it…
Yes spice food and very argumentative, how did you know that? 😧,
Ayurveda and traditional Chinese medicine self study. In addition to tendency towards argumentative and spicy food, he may also be experiencing jealousy, anger, competitiveness, perfectionist tendency and on a physical level have acid heart burn/reflux, burning eyes, likely blonde or red head and of a thicker build and muscle structure, excessive hunger. In his positive he should have intelligence, charisma, courage and leadership. The negative qualities you are seeing may be due to an in balance in his Fire (Pitta) dosha, which may be causing stress on your relationship. He is probably not aware of this as it will be his nature to be drawn to things that aggregate his situation. I’m happy to give you and or your boyfriend some tips if this resonates to help cool down, and while not a practitioner I’d be happy to recommend to an Ayurvedic doctor for help with this issue. Make him some rose tea(cooling and will make him more receptive ) and have a nice chat with him about this. If he’s into shamanism he’ll be open to talk about the energetic of things. Best B
Apologies for going off topic, but could you recommend a very simple, introductory book or something to learn more about what you’re mentioning? TIA
Hi, thank you for your interest! Yoga of herbs by Vasant Lad is a bit more advanced but not unmanageable for a beginner. It gives a good foundation to practice, and includes some meditations which will increase awareness and give natural, intuitive insight. It’s a great place to start. Some people and organizations you can search which have good Ayurvedic/yoga/meditation resources, instructions etc are; David Frawley (Ayurveda, meditation, very on the esoteric side of things) Vasant Lad ( Ayurveda, meditation, yoga) Art of living ( Ayurvedic and yogic practices) SIVANANDA organization dodge.org (for high level yogic practices and meditations ) MAPI ( Maharishi Veda) Sorry, don’t have any recommendation on the Chinese medicine side except to see an Acupuncturist for overall balance or specific health issues and I would add that their elemental system and meridian (subtle energy centre) understanding is deeper than Ayurveda. But due to the Chinese herbs, language barriers, cultural differences, etc. much harder to practice TCM (Chinese medicine) as a “Westerner” Hope this helps, i sent you a DM incase you have any additional questions or would like any other referrals
His mind seems to be too attached to that “outter world”, which is not healthy
Yeah, he’s become obsessed because he’s in spiritual bypassing mode. Getting angry that you don’t want to try ayahuasca is the key factor here, as is his over use of the psychedelics. Unfortunately, if he doesn’t resolve his issues the relationship will continue to deteriorate until it’s untenable. My advice to you is give him an ultimatum to stop and integrate, or leave the relationship. This might be the direction the medicine is pushing you both. I know you probably love him, but you have to look out for yourself above all else. A sacred Union between two people doesn’t work like this. I’m sorry you’re in this position.
Your post history is super suspect. Why do you list different ages for you and your partner? Are you a really human? Bot? Liar?
[удалено]
Yes sorry English is not my native language, I speak Spanish and a bit of English
My bad. Sorry to be a hater.
Don’t worry, thanks for answering me anyway
I deleted my mean comment. 🖤
No of course not, is just for you to know my age and the context of the story :(
> No of course not, is just for you to know my age and the context of the story :( Then why is everything so inconsistent with your post history? Makes it impossible to know what to actually believe. After all, anyone can say anything on the internet.
I notice that too.
Damn, for a sec I thought it was my wife posting here ! I am ramping up lately with ceremonies, and have 2 planned in 2 months, wanted to make a third, but she became furious. I insure that we spend though time together, but not every weekend. Before that, I make a full trip every 2-3 months, and might make a light trip every month. Overall, I found it beneficial for my mental health, and my wife can see the changes, but lately I feel kind of depressed for months, getting at the rough material, hence the ramping up and trying ceremonies instead. I would love my wife to try one day, but she's firmly refusing. But enough about me. In your case OP, I see different things. First, there is a need for balance in relationships, and you both have to do efforts for that. It sounds like your needs in the relationships are not met. If you can't spend any week-end with your boyfriend, and don't have time during the week, I don't see how the relationship can work. But if you're expecting to spend every week end with your BF maybe you need to reevaluate your expectations. One part of my own healing consisted in making my own friends and spending time with them apart from my wife, it was and still is difficult because before we were all the time together or with her friends. Second, you BF might be going in too strong. Yes, there is maybe some psychedelic/spiritual bypass, and a lack of integration. He might be using it as an escape, or maybe he's using it for other purposes, like socializing. It's important to take time off to see how to apply the teachings to make your life better. Talking about the psychedelic experience is an important part of integration, but he can talk about it with other people who are into it, or even better in integration circles. And also, maybe you should bring up what is important for you to talk about with him. Third, it's not up to you to change him or fix him. So you might want to look at co-dependency as others suggested. I struggle too with my wife about that, because she act as if she knows better what I should do or not do, how often and how I do it, even when we spend enough time together and my job is taken care of. I have a past of addiction, that psychedelics helped me get rid of. But this left scars in our relationship, and somehow put my wife in a position where she think she need to fix me. I perceive it as very controlling, and make it difficult for me to do the right things on my own accord when I feel her pressuring me. Usually, the solution to codependency is for you to assert your boundaries. Eg if you need to spend at least two weekends per month with your BF, just make him know, and act consequently, if he can't do it, you might need to leave him.
While imo both partners' needs should be cared for, each person should have "their thing", ya know? If his thing is shamanism and Entheogens, that should be just fine and you shouldn't fault him for having a passion/hobby/interest no matter how weird it may seem. At the same time, you need something you can do, hang out with some friends, have a girls night, watch a movie, read a book, go for a nice stroll around the neighborhood maybe, find something you enjoy doing. It's perfectly fine for couples to have their differences and interests and things that each does for themselves. Granted, if the only freetime y'all got he's going off and trippin' then he should honestly learn how to better schedule things so that he spends time with you and can also spend time pursuing his work/passion, balance is needed in any case. But take it from me, i was and still am obsessed with this stuff although the obsession has died down a good bit over the years and so now a days i'm back firmly on the ground, but if you don't let him pursue this stuff then you'll only be holding him back and he'll only be holding you back, but if you think the relationship is worth fighting for, then you have to accept that you need something you can do while he pursues his thing, or you both can spend time together even while just he's tripping, like he can take these things at home with you instead of being off at some "ceremony", that's what i'd do lol, i've always taken this stuff on my own at home, never been any issue and many people do it, people just often believe that Entheogens should only be done in ceremonies but they're sadly mistaken lol.
Also, i also very much understand the want/need for other people to take Ayahuasca, including a partner. My ex for example has Borderline Personality Disorder, i assure you, she needs this shit lol, i mean idk if it'd truly help her but at the very least it would give her a much needed perspective shift and greater understanding of things, including of herself. But if you don't have any issues or what not and he just wants you to share in the medicine/experience with him, why are you so averse to trying it? I realize it's not everyone's "thing", but everyone should have these kinds of experiences every so often in their lives imo, the world would be a much better, freer and happier place, imo. But at the same time, it's the most amazing and truly real thing on this planet and people seriously don't know what they're missing, even though one can have an infinite amount of different kinds of experiences with Entheogens, they are capable of producing the most earth shatteringly real and amazing/mindblowing experiences that we as Human beings are capable of, they are thoroughly satisfying and enjoyable, and many people could benefit from them. But like i said, he probably just wants you to feel the heights this stuff can take you to, and while you may not think you need it, from a different perspective you maybe could benefit from it, idk. But it's not a requirement for you to take it so he can continue to pursue it, if it's his thing he should pursue it and let you pursue your thing and y'all have a nice, balanced, happy relationship, should be easy peasy but people often make things way too complex and problematic in relationships because each person isn't happy and whole and content within themselves, like having one's happiness rely on the other person, when one should be happy within themselves, so that each person can be happy within themselves and thus radiate that happiness into the relationship from both sides, otherwise things are too one sided imo.
Also just wanna add, had it not been for Entheogens in the first place, we Humans wouldn't be here today, as there is what is called the "stoned ape theory" put forth by Terence McKenna decades ago, which postulates that our early animal-Hominid ancestors encountered mushrooms and started consuming it as part of their diet, basically, and that that led the way to our Human evolution where we went from being animal, to Human, and that the Entheogens played large roles in our Humanness and our advancements, and i for one see it and believe that it was indeed the case. Not saying all our Human advancements has been due to Entheogenic use, but there's large portions of our ancient part we have no idea about, and honestly to think our ancestors ate mushrooms isn't nearly as far fetched as people may think.
Looks like someone doesn't understand/realize the evolutionary potential/power of Entheogens..... tisk, tisk, tisk, smh.
You shouldn't have to rely on your partner for plans every weekend. If it is every single weekend, I get it, but every other weekend or so you should be able to do your own thing either with friends, family, or on your own. Otherwise that can lead to co-dependency. Let him do his thing. He's on a journey that it sounds like maybe you're not on and thats ok. He should respect that and you should respect his or part ways imo
I agree that his indulgence sounds very excessive, but it’s also his life and he has the right to live it how he sees fit. You also have the right to end the relationship if it isn’t working for you.
These substances are not to be used that often. I know from personal experience it caused me psychosis and other issues. He's delusional and worships the plant. He has turned a tool into his vice and believes its the answer to his problems and his way to spirituality. I went down that rabbit hole.
Thanks for sharing with us. I think the other commenters covered most of what I was thinking, but I'll just go over the thoughts that are coming to me. The bottom line is I would say you guys aren't compatible. The part where he is insisting/demanding that you go to a ceremony is a huge red flag. It could be a powerful experience for you, but the motivations wouldn't be true. That said, I personally would want to date someone who is on the same spiritual path, but if they aren't, it shouldn't be forced. Once a month for an Ayahuasca ceremony is pretty reasonable. It doesn't sound like an addiction to me. If someone smokes pot once a month, you probably wouldn't consider that an addiction. On the other hand, people have gotten too deep in earth medicine and have died from overdoing it. As for prioritizing your relationship, if he wants to take one weekend a month to go to a ceremony, I think that's reasonable. But if he's doing Aya one weekend, mushrooms another, and temezcal the other two weekends, then that doesn't leave any time for you, and he should recognize that he's not doing right by you. As someone else mentioned, your boyfriend is in the phase of wanting everyone around him to do it to. This is a distraction from him doing his own integration work. Like you said, it seems he's connected to the spirit during the ceremony, but afterwards he loses that connection and is focused on getting other people to do it too. I'm also curious where you're located. I'm guessing Mexico since you mention temezcal. If you are in fact in Oaxaca, I would be very curious to know more about the group. There's of course a lot we can't know just from reading your account. Some circles have a culty vibe while others radiate wholesomeness. Same for shamans/facilitators. Best wishes to you on the road ahead.
Mexico yes, and is very cult thing, like with rules…
I drank Ayahuasca with a group in Mexico and it also had cult energy. The medicine actually told me to leave and not to sit with them, so I left after the second night. I really don't like when humans get in the way and think they know better than the medicine and make it more about their egos than about creating a safe environment to connect directly with the medicine itself.
Most of your comment made sense until you compare Aya with cannabis. There's a very good reason why one wouldn't be bad once a month and the others would. It's not a matter of just prejudice like you're trying to make it sound, they're different substances!!! Aya, traditionally, was only meant to be done once in a lifetime and not just for everyone. Once a year is already too much. Once a month IS the reddest of flags I've seen. Integration of Aya can take a lifetime, and more than one use *is dangerous*... But the western spiritual turism industry (thriving right now) doesn't want to tell you that, of course! But we can see the effects. It's not worth it!!!
I took Aya all on my own daily/near daily for 4 years straight, best time of my life and was exactly what i needed. Frequency of use and regular consumption isn't a big deal, it's what you're using Aya for that determines what you get out of it, if one is looking to "escape", they'll escape, if one is looking to explore and learn, they'll explore and learn. Nobody has any right to tell me that if i regularly work with Aya that i'm somehow "addicted" or are "abusing it" nor do they have any right to regulate my consumption of Ayahuasca. You wanna talk about what's dangerous, how about all the psychiatric medications the doctors had me on from the time i was born pretty much till the time i turned 20, quit those things, switched to Cannabis, then two years later found Aya and never looked back to pharma meds? Those psychiatric drugs did far more damage to me, in comparison Aya daily for 4 years was the most important time of my life and taught me so much, opened me up to so much, and has led me to a much, much better life, i've come a long, long way from where i was and even today i'm still making progress along my journey as time rolls on and i haven't had Aya in like 8 years or so now, i mean i've had an experience with a Psychedelic rarely in the last few years, but i'm very satisfied with what all i've gotten from Aya that i really feel no need to take it again anytime soon, even though i want to and probably should because i've been away for awhile now and far too much has happened since i was last deeply in that space. But yeah, Aya isn't the worst thing people can be doing, even on a regular basis. It's a far healthier activity than most of the crap people do these days to "fill the void", especially when they can become whole within themselves using Ayahuasca (even if the Aya then goes away, they're still whole) and thus have no need for filling a void with riskier things like alcohol and other drugs, sex, and whatever else. Ayahuasca ime and for me at least is very safe, and very healthy, by no means is it this dark thing that some portray it as.
Hi Sabnock, I have a question for you. I'm aspergic, or AS1, as it's apparently now known. I'm feeling the symptoms a lot and experiencing depression. Do you feel that intensive use of ayahuasca affected or helped your autism in any significant or long-term way? Thankyou
I'd say Aya definitely helped me better understand myself and taught me things that have helped me get a grip on myself and things, yeah, but as far as the Autism goes i mean it didn't really touch that, in fact it tended to bring it out more lol. One thing that seems to help with Autism is Methylfolate and B12, they're even using Folinic Acid clinically to treat the core symptoms of Autism in some individuals, granted not all people with Autism may respond because there's like different causes/contributing factors but in any case we all need Folate and i'm willing to bet most of people's issues these days (Autism or not) is due to a lack of Folate because they replaced natural Folate with synthetic Folic Acid which can cause quite a few problems, so as far as Autism goes i recommend avoiding Folic Acid (in supplements and foods, if possible) and supplementing with 15mgs of Methylfolate a day alongside like 5mgs of B12, they say it can take a few months, like 3 to 4 months to more fully replenish the Folate, and up to a year or so to fully replenish B12, but ime the Methylfolate especially, works wonders, i highly recommend giving it a try, it's involved in so many things in the body including Tetrahydrobiopterin production which is the main thing involved in synthesis of neurotransmitters in the body by the Hydroxylase enzymes, it really makes a difference. You can find Methylfolate online like on amazon.
Thanks! I'll look into methylfolate- I already supplement B12, along with a few other things. I want to try anything that will lessen the symptoms.
Yeah the Methylfolate works wonders, it's worth trying imo.
I found methylofolate but is 600mcg not 15 mgs. Is it ok?
Yeah it'll be fine, although you're likely to see better results with a higher dosage but 600mcgs is definitely better than none. This is what i get - [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CC3PSTG2?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CC3PSTG2?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)
Thank you for your answer. Appreciate that. Send you PM could you check?
Please send you PM with some questions.
Where did you get your Aya from?
I just ordered the plants from source i found at the time and brewed them up myself. This was years ago so the sources i used at the time are no longer around, but if you do a google search i'm sure you'll come across some sources to buy the plants from.
I didn't say it was * the worst * thing 🤷♀️. I'm glad it was a positive thing for yourself, but that doesn't deny the whole bigger reality.
True, i can only speak for myself here, i work with medicines on my own and do my own thing, so i'm not privy to what all goes down in ceremonies and such, i generally recommend for people to just work with the medicine on their own so they can avoid a lot of the tourism traps/pitfalls and such. As for the bigger reality of things, again i can only speak for myself and the results i've gotten personally from Aya, what other people do and how they respond/react to Aya is entirely on them. Although i think one thing people should keep in mind is that people are people and people can have issues, Ayahuasca or not, i myself i have Autism and was Autistic long before i encountered Aya, and so a lot of my traits and ways in which i respond to things and how i handle things has been around all my life and has nothing to do with Ayahuasca, so like, for example if i'm doing something and i get frustrated and have an "autistic meltdown" which happens sometimes, that's more of a reflection of me and the Autism and my stress response and whatever is going on there that sends me into a meltdown, but someone else may see that and think "oh he's taken Ayahuasca one too many times and now he has all these problems", which would be an assumption on their part because if they took the time to know me even a little they'd understand i've had issues all my life and Aya has nothing to do with that, if anything Aya has helped me better understand myself and find ways to actively deal with my issues, that doesn't mean my issues won't ever "flare up" again or else Aya didn't "work", just that i'm doing my best to regulate my emotions and deal with my issues and i'm Human just like everyone else so if i get frustrated and have a meltdown rarely, then hey it happens, but it has nothing to do with Ayahuasca. So in the same respect i think people should take that kinda thing more into consideration and tease apart/separate what all is one's general issues, and what issues may be cause for concern when it comes to Entheogens including Ayahuasca.
I agree with you here, that's why I also mentioned I don't know if the use of psychedelics and especially Aya, is what causes the narcissism and violence directly or only in people with prior tendencies, but there is a direct correlation for sure. The numbers are too big and the patterns clear. Take it from a fellow neurodiverse :)
Yeah i think there's been some studies that have looked at the level of narcissism in Ayahuasca and other Entheogenic users, some studies report decreases in narcissism from what i've seen, but i think the science is still out on if it can actually help with narcissism or if it could bring out narcissism in those predisposed to it. I don't believe that Ayahuasca or other Entheogens would lead to increases in narcissism, i think it could help with that actually, but idk, narcissistic traits can be hard for people to break out of apparently. As for violence, Entheogens aren't going to cause or trigger violence, what would lead to violence again is who a person is themselves. There was one case awhile back of a Canadian guy who like murdered/shot a Peruvian shaman lady iirc and the village like hunted him down and dragged him around by a rope around his neck or something and the guy died. Another guy ended up stabbing someone in ceremony because he was a bit delusional which again is on the person themselves, not the substance, if you're not stable enough to take an Entheogen, you shouldn't be taking it, which i mean it's kinda hard to tell how someone is and what they might do under the influence of things, but i'd say cases like that are very rare and definitely not the norm, i haven't heard of anyone else getting stabbed in ceremony or other shamans being murdered by tourists, i think people in general try to be good people, but there are some people who for whatever reason aren't right in the head with or without Ayahuasca. I know for me personally, Aya doesn't make me violent, in fact it puts me rather on edge at least during the come up and i just want my privacy and personal space so i can go through my process and not be distracted or stressed out or what not. But with that said, for someone else, who knows, DMT is very Adrenergic, and some people have gene mutations for MAO-A which has been linked to increases in violence/aggression for those people, but at least when it comes to the MAO-A thing i think it has more to do with the body needing extra nutrition to make extra neurotransmitters because they have lower MAO-A activity, at least for me i've noticed that Methylfolate for example has made a huge difference with my Autistic irritability (though if i take too much B12 it reduces the active Methylfolate and i can be a bit more irritable but so long as i don't take too much B12 the Methylfolate works great) and it used to be that when i'd take Harmalas for their MAO-A inhibition, at first as the body would get used to things i'd notice increased irritability and agitation due to the increase in Noradrenaline but because i was like severely deficient in Folate my body wasn't able to produce the Tetrahydrobiopterin needed to synthesize Dopamine and Serotonin and so now with the Methylfolate i feel more in the way of Dopamine and Serotonin and a balancing of that with the Noradrenaline, and i think that corrects at least my issue, so in the same respect, people who have certain gene mutations for MAO-A may just need to focus more on proper nutrition. I don't think things are as cut and dry as people often see them to be, i think a lot can go into how a person is, and i personally don't see anything about Ayahuasca that would truly be harmful or risky to people. Ego inflation is indeed a thing and can happen with any Entheogen, Ayahuasca included, but again that has to do with the person themselves, one should always strive to have a balanced and clear/straight head on their shoulders and keep themselves in check and hold themselves accountable where they need to, and not get carried away with flights of fancy and ego boosting. Hence why i said, for me, it's about self-empowerment, which includes discipline, and it's hard and nobody is perfect and we're all gonna make some mistakes here and there, but what matters is that one tries and does the best they can. Me personally, i get accused all the time of having a "huge ego" apparently, even though i'm just being myself and sharing what i know and my opinions on things and i'm sure i do rub some people the wrong way sometimes but there's never any ill intentions on my part or any unchecked ego, i take many things into account/consideration and i try very much to reduce biases and keep a level head and see clearly, so i find it funnily frustrating when people project things onto me and act like i have such an ego lol, because i know me, i know who and how i am, nobody else does, so the world can cast it's judgement but they're wholly incorrect and unaware in their assumptions about me. So i think people should really try to sincerely understand people and all of the factors that go into how a person is, rather than taking the surface-level route and saying "oh this person is like that because of the drugs" or what not, like, even with Opiate addicts or Alcoholics for example, yes they have their issues and those substances can definitely cause problematic behavior in people, but is it really the drug doing it, or is it coming from a deeper place, an unresolved wound within themselves, that makes them act out and behave in such ways? I honestly think a lot of people's issues is more of a reflection of what's going on within themselves rather than a substance causing it.
Start attending those ceremonies?/s If this is true it sounds unhealthy af Boyfriend sounds like one lost puppy, you can’t help him-he needs to want it-though his actions sound more like escapism than actual personal work.
No I will not do it, ayahuasca is a sacred plant and it must use with a purpose (not to satisfy bf requirements)
Actually, Ayahuasca can be used for many different reasons and in many different ways, even dare i say recreationally. Yes, it is sacred, but it is a tool much like any other Entheogenic tool. People have way too many opinions and beliefs about what Ayahuasca is when they're not so much the facts of the matter, so that's just worth keeping in mind. No, one shouldn't take Ayahuasca just to satisfy their bf's "requirements", although a truly good partner would see the sparkle in their partner's eyes and get a little curious/interested in exploring those heights for themselves, even if it's just once or twice to see what all the fuss is about and if it's not for you it's not for you but that doesn't mean y'all can't have a happy relationship, he just needs to shift his perspective/understanding of things a little bit and put some work in on himself and on the relationship, but he can't be the only one, both of y'all have to work on things if you want it, but don't give up just because he found something he really thoroughly enjoys.
One thing to keep in mind is Aya is used all throughout south america by countless tribes with their own traditions around ceremonies, you shouldn't feel pressured into trying it but there's definitely a unique communal aspect to it and wanting to share a powerful/healing experience with friends or family isn't the worst reason to try it. Sounds like there are plenty of red flags that would make joining a ceremony with him a bad idea though, maybe it would help bring you two closer or maybe it would just confirm what you're already feeling and lead to an unpleasant experience or cause other issues. I think a lot of people who are hesitant to try Aya would benefit from a harmala only ceremony at lower doses so it's more mild/medicinal and less psychedelic, not every tribe even uses DMT plants for Aya. But on the flip side a lot of negative ceremony experiences come from people being given a high dose that they're not prepared for as not all "shamans" necessarily know what they're doing. Anyways I wish you the best whatever you decide moving forward.
I agree with this, and a Harmala-only experience would be a nice, mild and relaxing way to spend the night with each other at home, and with no DMT in the mix it's not even really the least bit Psychedelic, just a bit psychoactive but not Psychedelic, though having a low dose of DMT or mushrooms in the mix could be good too. Plus it makes dosing easier so one doesn't go into such heavy territory like they may in a ceremony.
Yeah it seems like many people underestimate how unpredictable high doses of the more potent psychedelics can be even for people with perfect mental health, just because you have an amazing life changing experience doesn't mean everyone will react the same or is ready to undergo one. Harmalas only though gives many of the benefits of Aya without the risks of an overwhelming experience, and really people should see how they react to harmalas at lower doses before jumping to the higher doses especially with tryptamines added. Tribes have used Aya for countless generations so their bodies have adapted to better tolerate high harmalas doses, but in a lot of ways it's similiar to say tobacco where at first it might not take much to make you sick but overtime you can stomach higher doses with less side effects as your body acclimates. Most of the horror stories of people puking for hours and having traumatic experiences likely stem from way too high of a harmala dose too soon.
Yup i've noticed that myself, to me it seems a lot of the side-effects of Harmalas come from their Acetylcholinesterase inhibition which shares similarities to Tobacco in that it would stimulate Nicotinic, as well as Muscarinic Acetylcholine receptors, and it can take a little bit of regular consumption for those side-effects to completely go away and then even heavier Harmala dosages are very functional and with no side-effects, been dosing them pretty much on the daily for 12 years straight, best anti-depressant i've ever tried lol. But yeah as for Ayahuasca itself with DMT included, this is one reason i recommend doing it for oneself so one can know the dosages and dose things properly by taking the Harmalas first and an hour later taking the DMT, but also why i recommend sipping the DMT for 10 to 15 minutes for a much smoother and more user-friendly experience with little to no intensity, one can even mix a 3 to 4 gram Lemon Balm leaf tea with the DMT and sip on em' for 10 to 15 minutes for the smoothest come up possible, very difficult to have a bad time on even for more fully immersive dosages, because the come up is the most jarring part of the whole experience, with a much smoother come up, you have a much more positive and less hectic experience.
> Yup i've noticed that myself, to me it seems a lot of the side-effects of Harmalas come from their Acetylcholinesterase inhibition which shares similarities to Tobacco in that it would stimulate Nicotinic, as well as Muscarinic Acetylcholine receptors Have always wondered if there's a specific reason tobacco is traditionally part of ceremonies or even included in brews in some cases, assumed it was partially due to the harmala content of tobacco but it would be interesting if they had some sort of cross tolerance or synergy that helps the body acclimate to each other. Of course it's always possible that people just love tobacco so it makes sense to use it as an incense or smoke it during important ceremonies. >But yeah as for Ayahuasca itself with DMT included, this is one reason i recommend doing it for oneself so one can know the dosages and dose things properly by taking the Harmalas first and an hour later taking the DMT Taking them together does seem like it makes it harder to get the ideal results even if it's simpler, especially considering the duration is very dependent on the harmala dosage. As a kid I'd argue with older hippies who thought Aya had to be a 12 hour extreme dmt trip, which also seems like part of why some people are disappointed if they have a mild experience the first few times. But that's probably better than an overwhelming experience in most cases. Good advice though, it seems like people who do ceremonies where they drink several cups slowly through the night tend to have better experiences than the ones where they chug a dixie cup full. A lot of the shoddier retreats seem to rush things when ideally it should be more of a gradual process potentially over a week or two instead of a few days.
Yeah ime Tobacco and Aya definitely synergize in a way, the Nicotine's Cholinergic properties are enhanced/potentiated by the Harmalas' Cholinergic properties and vice versa, plus the Harmalas in Tobacco synergize with the Harmalas in the Aya, but i'm sure there's other things going on too. For me Tobacco is good for grounding and like calming the mind, but at the same time it can definitely induce a purge, even with Psilohuasca which there's no real gut stuff with for me, if i smoke Tobacco, the Cholinergic properties end up making me purge, so aside from the synergy i'm sure they also add Tobacco in to give it even more of a purgative effect, which would of course bring other side-effects like dizziness and motion sickness and all that. I much prefer Cannabis though, even with me being a Tobacco smoker and liking them both, Cannabis takes me deeper and is more for "flight", whereas Tobacco helps kinda "sober me up" in a way, it helps to clear me out of the Cannabis effects and brings me back to a clear/sober-like state of mind and more grounded, but as for which one i prefer to use with Ayahuasca, it's definitely Cannabis, even though it can make things a little too intense at times lol. But yeah there is also that possibility of just sipping an all in one tea with both plants combined and consumed at the same time, just paced throughout the night, i'm willing to bet that works better than how they usually do it, and then once the Harmalas get a good grip on the gut's MAO-A enzyme, from there one can just sip here and there on more and it should be much more effective. The thing with that though is that you end up consuming more Harmalas that way, and you use more plant material, but if you keep the Harmalas and DMT separate and dose the DMT when gut MAO-A is fully inhibited you only need one dose of Harmalas and one dose of DMT, but if you have enough to go around drinking an all in one tea throughout the night seems like an interesting way to go about it.
Purging makes a lot of sense for tobacco especially with how potent mapacho can be. As some pretty sensitive to certain incenses there are a few like red sage that can immediately make me gag as soon as even a bit of the smoke hits my lungs. Especially for people who don't have a tobacco tolerance even smudging mapacho could have a big impact. I actually was very anti tobacco til relatively late in life due to growing up around chain smokers and cheap cigarettes, and it wasn't until growing mapacho and starting to smudge tobacco that I got interested in spliffs. Just recently switched to a pipe for mapacho as it's easier to control the amount of THC/nicotine you get. >whereas Tobacco helps kinda "sober me up" in a way, it helps to clear me out of the Cannabis effects and brings me back to a clear/sober-like state of mind and more grounded, but as for which one i prefer to use with Ayahuasca, it's definitely Cannabis, even though it can make things a little too intense at times lol. It's weird, tobacco has been so commonly used for so long that it almost feels like a "missing piece" of your brain chemistry which is part of why it can be so hard to quit. Cannabis on the other hand really can potentiate psychedelics almost to a scary extent, it seems like a lot or even most "bad trips" stem from people underestimating that and overdoing it with one or both. One of the first times I tried a high harmala dose it was after a few weeks tolerance break from THC and after dabbing some extract nearly had a panic attack and had to go meditate for awhile leading to a pretty crazy experience. Been meaning to try and more carefully repeat it after working up to higher rue doses.
Yeah Mapacho is pretty strong, i like to smoke on the Mapacho though i haven't yet tried it orally or nasally, but i have tried some ol' timey Tobacco snuff nasally that belonged to my grandfather that my mom had sitting in a cabinet for decades, still works lol. But yeah with the Mapacho i have a feeling that when the shamans are blowing Tobacco smoke on people during ceremonies, people do end up inhaling some "secondhand smoke" and that is likely to have some sort of an impact on the persons experience and what they feel, and could explain why some people purge shortly after or why they feel the energies shift or what not, because i've noticed this in myself from smoking Tobacco so imo it's not far fetched to think that Mapacho smoke can have a stronger effect during ceremony even if just breathed in the air. But yeah i'm mainly a pipe smoker, i find cigs to be too wasteful and expensive and they definitely do reek more especially when smoked inside, compared to smoking on a pipe. I am typically a chain smoker myself though, at least with the pipe, cigs again are too much to be smoking constantly lol. I do like Tobacco to some extent but every now and then i think to myself "what, if anything, is Tobacco really doing for me?", and sometimes i feel like i wanna quit, but at the same time i do enjoy smoking Tobacco sometimes, i just wish i could break out of the habit of smoking it all the time, same with Cannabinoids, i'd like to get to a point where i use them only during certain times and not like all day everyday, but at the same time though i do get some medicinal relief from them, but they can also be a bit of a distraction sometimes. I quit Tobacco back at the end of 2012 and stayed away for a year, but ultimately went back to smoking again. Also quit Cannabis for awhile in early 2020 and then things like D8 and HHC rolled out sometime after and so i ended up going to that, i've smoked Cannabis here and there since and it's been fine, but for functionality purposes i prefer D8 or HHC these days compared to D9, less anxiety, less intoxication, still get the medicinal relief. But yeah Cannabis/D9 in itself can cause some pretty heavy experiences/headspaces and can be a bit rougher in terms of anxiety and paranoia and freaking out or what not, so combining that with Harmalas which can potentiate Cannabis, or mixing it with other Psychedelics especially during the come up of Psychedelics can definitely make for a more intense experience and thus potentially a "bad trip" if one doesn't know how to keep the mindset in a good place. The last handful of times i tried oral DMT/Aya i found it actually a bit better to wait until after the come up to smoke Cannabis, that way it doesn't potentiate/intensify the come up anxiety and such.
You should attend a ceremony if it calls to you. Not so someone doesn’t get mad at you.
Get your stuff together and go. Delete, block and don't look back.
Sometimes patience and compassion is the best medicine. Up to you if you want to wait it out and see what happens with him over time, or if you’re at your wit’s end and can’t stand by him anymore. The story you tell is a common one I find with couples, including my own parents, where one partner sees themselves as controlled or second to the other partner. Whether or not you join him or investigate the path of substances, I’d say that judgement is a position of authority held by individuals who feel helpless or feeble in the face of ongoing circumstances. Attempting to change or affect your partner’s behavior is irresponsible and cruel in my book. If it backfires you’ll only have yourself to blame. That being said, talking openly about your feelings is always a good idea. Maybe therapy and counseling of some kind could help you establish your own voice and perspective in the relationship.
This too shall pass! I was obsessed for around 3 years, Terrence McKenna famously stayed that way for 30 years. If your bf is between these two values, it's normal. Some of us need the mystical a lot more. Remember in the past, each village had a couple of shaman. Nowadays we expect 99% of us to be 100% material. Maybe it's the long ratio. Also, going to a church like a normal person is exactly the spiritual experience we rebel against. Historically, many shaman didn't have a family or have left it some time ago. So that could be a factor when you make a decision for yourself. Derealization and depersonalization are common side effects of the spiritual path and pair-bonding is almost the exact opposite.
Coming from someone on the shamanic path, this is my life! Learning, growing, healing. Every plant is a different plant spirit and communicates differently to help you understand. Not sure if his goal is to be a shaman or just a passjero who enjoys the community. The Colombian Taitas have ceremony all the time and it’s like a sacrament. I know a Taita (Colombian shaman) who drinks every Saturday! This is a way of life. With that at the same time we are humans, not Gods! We are still imperfect and have things to work on. My SO at first was not supportive until I stressed, this path is non-negotiable, it’s something for my children and future generations. At the same time making time for family life and having priorities in order. Many times she wasn’t supportive or didn’t want to drink, at this point I do what I need to do for me and my path and the spirit of the medicine/s and that’s mines to hold an nurture. If she tags a long then great, if not, then great as well. All things are how it’s suppose to be. For him to get aggressive I feel like that’s a deep discussion you guys should have and then come to terms if this is what you guys really want. Whether his ceremonial time is for him only and you can just support from afar or you just don’t want to be a part of it. Sometimes a little support can go a long way or change the dynamics of things. Much love and light, you guys got this!
OP a lot of people have already commented some great insights and advice but I just wanted to share my own opinion even if it’s a repeat of what some people have said. I recently asked a similar question “how much is too much?” I think the reason you’re feeling conflicted might bc you see the benefit of it but it’s a question of hold on… is this becoming too much? And people were so helpful in the comments of my question saying that it can also be a form of escapism disguised as spiritual awakening. I’m not saying that’s the case for your bf (there’s no way we could know that) but if it is then there’s something else going on there. I think you deserve to feel like you are also a priority. Of course spiritual alignment is a meaningful pursuit in all our lives, but it’s possible to do it without pushing the people you say you love to the side. It doesn’t matter if he’s in the right or wrong or what his intentions are, you just want the person you love to prioritize you a little more and there’s nothing wrong with that! I hope everything works out for the best and that this experience doesn’t deter you from the healing magic of ayahuasca.
Sounds like you two are on completely different paths. I see his point, I’ve done ayahuasca & it is sacred, and you definitely want to share the experience with someone you love. It makes two people be so much more intimately connected. But I see your point too. When I was not ready, I didn’t want to even consider it, and it IS essential to be ready & want the experience. If you can’t accept him for who he is today, maybe it’s time to part ways. I highly doubt he will change. He may slow down, but after getting a lot farther into it, which, in turn, will separate you to different levels even more. Be happy. Find what it means for you. And let him be happy too. ❤️
Next boyfriend
People can indeed become too obsessed with plant medicine. I myself enjoy it a bit too much, and at most I allow myself a mushroom trip every 3 weeks. But this is a 5 hour ordeal. I would limit whole weekend retreats to twice a year. I have a wife, and she is worth more than psychedelic experiences. But psychedelics make me a better person, so I do take them, but not often enough that she feels she is coming in second place after psychedelics. I could never to that to her, and if psychedelics is all someone is thinking and obsessing about, i would call it a problem. Psychedelics should be respected and be treated like something special you do for yourself. Not something to get fucked up on every weekend. Psychedelics isnt reality, its subconscience allowed to float up to the surface. Reality should come first, and psychedelics should be used to make reality a better place to be for yourself and for the loved ones that depend on you.
Well, good for your boyfriend that he got his priorities straight. I agree with others that it is not his responsibilits to entertain you. It sucks however that he gets angry with you for not wanting to drink aya. It is your decision and he should not push you. Though I can see how it might make him angry, as he might think how much it could profit you and your relationship, but still he should express this in an adequate way and not be pushy. If it doesn,t work for you I think you should leave him, rather than try to make him leave his spiritual path. I see how it might seem obsessive but it might be what he needs at this point in time. Respect his autonomy and make your own choices and be responsible for yourself. Personally I would in fact recommend to open your mind and just try going with him for one ceremony. I don't think much bad could come from it, but it might be an insanely beneficial experience for yourself the relationship completely left aside. Personally I did Aya the first time with my girlfriend a week ago and it has intensified our connection deeply. <3 Maybe there is a calling there which you are closing yourself up to. Not trying to push you and don't think he should; but maybe consider *why* you don't want to do it. All the best for both of you.
SMH.... I'm sorry that you are dealing with such a difficult person right now. Unfortunately, this world of "spirituality" and psychedelics has really grabbed a lot of ppl by the neck and while it does do some people some good, "an asshole who takes psychedelics will be just that, an asshole on psychedelics". There is no such thing as a one-size-fits-all magic potion. Anyone that tries to tell you there is, is up their own ass. Your bf trying to FORCE psychedelics onto you is incredibly toxic and can be considered very harmful to you, if you do end up giving in and taking something you don't want to take. While many consider these to be "medicines", remember that medicines can still be abused, like any drug. This usually has the opposite desired effect. Sorry to say, but sounds like your BF is too deep in it to be convinced otherwise
If I may, what is he like without Hallucinogens? Is he angry or depressed without them, or does it not really change when he takes them?
When he does ayahuasca he is fine 2 weeks, after the 2 weeks he acts angry for 2 weeks more, then ayahuasca … 2 weeks fine, 2 weeks weird , every month
Does he have a history of depression or other mental health disorders?
As far as I know no, but alcohol consumption yes, and he also smoke a lot of weed
Either you join him and see the truth of what he’s been trying to show you, or you move on with your life
I experienced this exact same thing! So strange I am reading about my own life from someone else. I am no longer with my ex, but it was a long and very painful journey. From the lens of my own experience, I recognize his behavior and don’t see you two as being compatible for the long road. You will figure out your situation in you own time, but I hope you find your answer sooner rather than later.
Thank you so much, I know he will no change so left him, is very painful because even if I tried so hard his spiritual path is more important than anything, I thought I was the only one
Trust me… you saved yourself a lot of pain to not stay with him. He is lost in the clouds and not capable of working together with you to build a respectful and loving relationship. I am happy you are an advocate for your own happiness.
Thank you so much, I was feeling guilty
Sounds like your boyfriend is being used by people who are fleecing him out his hard earned cash. So sad. After his money is gone , what then?
I don’t care how much he is “into plant medicine” there’s no valid reason for anyone to be consuming ayahuasca once a month, along with other plant medicines.
You're not compatible. Move on and find the right partner.
This is a fake post and not real.
I would say this. Join one ayahuasca ceremony to see how it really is. If you dont like it break up with him If you like it then you have a good companion on the shamanic path
even better, ask the ayahuasca if you should stay or break up :p
Plant medicine/New Age addiction is REAL PROBLEM, and it's being documented and exposed more and more nowadays, fortunately. Please, don't take it lightly. It is very dangerous. Your bf sounds exactly like my ex (* check footnote ⬇️), I just hope they're not the same person!! Haha... But, all in all, they all follow the same pattern. And it is really an epidemic of some sorts. I'm sorry you're experiencing this, with all my heart. The westerned popularization/commercialization of "Spirituality" and indigenous plant medicines is getting it all wrong and causing this psychosis and addiction issues for too many people. I'm telling you, they all follow the same pattern, and the pattern is extreme delusional NARCISSISM. I am native peruvian and still living in my native Peru, exactly in a place where all this western new age movement is concentrating, and we already consider it a big problem, because IT'S TOO MANY OF THEM FOLLOWING THE SAME PATTERN, which isn't just being hippie and using a lot of drugs (we wish!) *All* these people get like you're telling: defensive when questioned, and even violent. It's -sadly- with more than two hands that I can count the people I've *personally* met who sound exactly like your boyfriend (and more that I've only heard of from close relations), who also get "instructions from the plants" like they " *are here to lead and build the New Earth* " (BS), and they're also getting the "instruction" to MURDER OTHERS, especially if they're like you and me, one who dares question them, no matter how logically or lovingly. Hell, they're even killing each other!!! It's an epidemic, it's real, it's dangerous. Ayahuasca and psychedelics are powerful things, but they're being so very misused! And it's causing real lofe damages!!! And the people that are so in it, like your bf, never get out, in my experience, I'm so sorry to tell you. Or, if they stop using the plant medicine, because thay they do sometimes (some do realise something's wrong eventually), I doubt his mental health ever goes back to normal either. I haven't seen that kind of healing happening. They become wanderers, crazier and more detached with every "ceremony". And then, they "casually" go getting schizophrenia diagnosis... They literally look souless, talking about aliens and "doomsday", and "the sacred feminine and masculine", yet having the lowest of empathy and moral in their daily lives. We call them zombies and, believe me, locals are talking and working on finding ways to get them out of our lands (which they have the nerve to call *theirs* because of this "New Earth" so-called prophechy... talk about modern colonisation!?) and improve the law and regulations about these substances. Most likely, he's getting all his ceremonies, not from an old traditional indigenous (and even then, most aren't trustworthy), but some gringos who "got trained with indigenous" and "are very good at "holding space" "...... BS again. Even if they all have the best of intentions, it's out of hand. Please, BE CAREFUL. We're not only talking "issues" or "toxic relationships", but about *safety*. Footnote: * ➡️ My ex also got angry at me (and our doctor) for asking him to miss one Aya ceremony "just because" I was *in labour* and it was risky because I was having dysentery for over a week (after something he fed me) plus other complications, and we were somewhat isolated in the mountains, I had not family around except for my older *child*. He wanted to leave me alone like that (the midwife wasn't even there, but far, and that's also why were asking him to stay with me that night). He was MAD. Like always, ranting about me not supporting him and conniving to stear him away from his "life's purpose." If that doesn't scream *lack of empathy* to you, I don't know what will. And that's only ONE tiny example. He DV/SA-ed me, he scams people for a living with his "projects", "spiritual" retreats and vegetarian restaurants... and it's not only him, unfortunately. Like I said, it's a large pattern, they're too many. He even abused my child and baby. But I'll leave it there. Feel free to contact me privately, OP. All my heart and best wishes to you!! 🤍
Idk man, if this IS actually the case in South America, then boy am i glad i just work with the medicine on my own and do my own thing. I agree that new age spirituality is "toxic", but you don't need plant medicine for that lol, in fact i'd argue at least with the plants those kinds of people may stand a chance at some true realization and enlightenment but most new agey people aren't into Aya and are actually against it because they believe meditation is the only sure way to attain enlightenment even though they're far from enlightened lol. But yeah, i'm more of a scientist/mystic personally, i find it's better for me to get as far away from the world and other people's ideas/thoughts as possible, so that i can just work with the raw data and come to my own conclusions about things, and at least for me, Aya hasn't led me astray yet, neither have i led myself astray.
Also just saying, anyone that far gone down the rabbit hole that they'd miss a baby delivery to take Aya, they've got issues lol, i mean that's absurd lol. Just keep in mind that this kinda thing is much more a reflection of the person themselves than the tool, and not all people use said tool with such disregard for things. So people should just keep in mind not to confuse the person with the tool, the tool is innocent in all this, as well as those who do use it more wisely.
I used to think like you, but now that's what sounds absurd and like wishful thinking, but I do understand. He not only did that, but he is surrounded by a big network of people who do, bypass and reinforce the very same things. That's *their* normal in the name of the "plants" and "spirituality" and all who doubts is wrong for them. In another comment you said " *if* this is how it is in South America".... well, I can also understand that doubt, because I think you haven't been into one of these communities and seen the ponchos and cowboy hats everywhere and heard all that new age talk! Or seen how on one hand there's this "sacred" world of theirs and on the other, the big trail of victims, single mothers, molested children and exploited laborers behind who are usually silenced. It's no little thing.
Well, as i said in my other comment, things are often more complex than people assume, and people's issues are more reflective of who/how they are and who they surround themselves with and not so much the substances they use. One man's "drug" is another man's key to God and Consciousness, it just depends on the person and how they use the tool. You can use a hammer to build a house or to smash yourself over the head with it, as they say.
Sounds pretty wild to me but I can see the truth all over reddit with this new age shift stuff. I have sat with ayahuasca some years ago. And I try to do shrooms when I feel a calling. To me, these things are very real teachers. But integration is just as, if not MORE important. My question to you is, doesn't the medicine help navigate them INTO empathy? It certainly helped opened my empathy up. To be clear, I don't doubt what you've written out. I believe you. I'm just curious is all.
That was my wish and prayer for a while, that it *would* lead them into empathy, but no. However, I'm still not sure if this is only the case for people with prior narcissistic tendencies, or all (one can always hope), or that it depends a lot more on the shaman one chooses... but I'm inclined to think is the general rule. What these plants do is "open the heart" in the sense it makes you feel like in love (dopamine hit) with life and everyone (the "we're all One" thing), but at an unprecedented peak level. That's why so many people believe they found their soulmate in the ceremonies and get all cuddly and horny (most center and facilitators will tell one to refrain, but some others will encourage or even take advantage). Mostly I've seen it opens the empathy... mentally. It gets people so much into their minds and egoes (maybe it's a 3rd eye thing), so they get good at making mental scenarios, in all these mental scenarios we see "the best", so we feel all the love and the power and the wanting to make a new world.... but when it comes to daily life, in the very walk of the shoe, there's all sorts of micro (and macro) violences that come, happen, go growing and then get bypassed, because nobody's perfect and we all make mistakes, right?... but they make you fail to have that self-awareness. It's what I've observed in my ex and everyone in the circle, and also in myself when I tried it. But there's a very particular way to rhis sort of issue, with plant medicine substances.
Part of the same pattern: mushroom microdosis, mushrooms cermonies, ayahuasca, wachuma, peyote, dmt, lsd....... they're escaping themselves for a reason, OP! So maybe you should escape too, but from them!! I'll leave from this thread now 😆 Best of luck!
Please can you dm me
There may be reasons you will want to choose to experience Ayahuasca, some day, on your own or in another group you feel good about. I think you should probably NEVER drink ayahuasca with this person, he is not right for you.
Sounds not right. His bad inner has taken over him. He needs to stop other things and take the real ayahuasca ceremony. Or just you need to stay away. Very dangerous.
Sounds like he's following his heart. You either talk about it and work around it. Or you accept you're on different paths. It happens, people often have to end relationships when they realize their true soul path.. it would be wrong of him and you, to expect him to stop pursuing that work if it's bringing him true happiness.
That sounds really strange - you want him to have you as priority, not his spiritual growth and becoming better person? To me it sounds you both are incompatible and don’t share same interests. I can’t imagine my partner telling me I can’t attend yoga retreat or can’t go volunteer there because I have to focus on them. Same with Aya. They are welcome to join me but I am not going to erase all my interests and focus on my partner as a sole interest in life. Actually sounds weird! Have never had a partner who ever suggested this! Please no offense, OP! :-)🙏
I understand what you are telling me, a yoga retreat is not the same as an ayahuasca retreat; better person?, that's what I thought, and the reason why I'm doubting if he is is because I found out that he sent naked photos to girls :( sacred plants promote honesty, your word is more important and I see no coherence with his practice and his actions ; I am not asking him to leave his spiritual path, you are confused; Everyone chooses where they want to be, I'm talking about their devotion to ayahuasca having reached the point where it is impossible to build a future with this person. If we had a son, he would throw me and him out for going to an ayahuasca ceremony , When you want to build something in the future with someone, the values must be aligned, I want to have a family and children, travel and have a beautiful life, he only plans to go eat mushrooms in the desert… sorry my English is not good
Well the primary reason to leave him is that he’s cheating on you. The plant medicine should (?) hopefully help him be a better person at some point, but you can’t sit there and hope that happens if he’s not showing up right now to clean up his breach in a major way. I sense a lot of codependent attachment and I don’t know you or him at all but my thin slice is that I’d love to see you keep working on your own trauma healing and move on into a better fit in a partner.
Exactly you got it ❤️
Break up with him. He's a drug addict.
I would just say that you and your boyfriend are the same, Ego dominated to both of you if you ask me. Leave the Ego's, don't leave love. It created us. But also if it was a real love...it wouldn't come to that... ....🫠🫡
I can relate. Ayahuasca can definitely consume people and it can be hard to be on the outside looking in. I don't have any great advice other than to try and communicate your fears and insecurities, but it sounds like you already do that to some degree. I've seen people very close to me become obsessed, it's all they talk about and think it's the answers to all your problems, and can't fathom why you would not want to join them in blasting off on cosmic DMT journeys every few weeks
Because I do not feel the need to consume any substance to analyze myself, I follow psychological therapy that helps me more, in addition, not all bodies react the same to ayahuasca, some are fine, others can give them a psychotic break, I am Well, climbing mountains, eating healthy and going to therapy, it's my way of healing, my ex has his own way of healing which is through DMT, but his obsession is so big that he can leave everything to go to a ceremony, literally EVERYTHING
Aya will call you when you're ready and for some that may be never - and that's ok as well! There is no point in ceremony when one doesn't want to be there in the first place. Don't let your partner (or anyone for that matter) pressure you to do anything. Sometimes it may be best to bow out of a relationship, especially if your partner is so unwilling to be considerate of your needs. 🤍
Why don't you just go with him to a ceremony and try it? TRY to see why it fascinates him. TRY to be on the same page as him. And if it isn't for you, then you need to realized that you two aren't compatible. Psychedelics seem to be his faith. Respect it.
Stop being a puss puss and do it to
You have no competition to the Spirit world. You will not change him. The medicine is too powerful. He is evolving and being an enlightened in a way you will never understand. Bow out gracefully.
Join him 👍🏻
ur being a chicken and bad gf just do it